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  #1  
Old 07-28-2010, 05:16 AM
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Karl_Palsness Karl_Palsness is offline
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GAP Power - Magnetic Neutralization

GAP Power - Magnetic Neutralization

I Came hear looking for more info on the Gap Power motor and did not find a link hear....so hear it is.

Looks very interesting, and has very similar design and operating principals to Richard Willis Magnacoster design. At lest from his patents I think.

GAP Power, Magnetic Neutralization

YouTube - FREE ENERGY # 24 Working Magnetic Overunity Device - Magnetic Neutralization

GAP Power magnetic amplification and neutralization illustrates regauging

http://www.gap-power.com/videos/Full...th%20Video.wmv

Note he is not capturing any of the energy form the coil when it is deactivated! This would be easy to do...







Have fun with this one...

Karl Palsness
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:48 AM
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Thanks man bee good if you could move all your stuff to here
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...ead.php?t=6135

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Old 07-28-2010, 11:40 AM
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That guy does some nice work. He had rotary version at one time I can't seem to find it on his website.
I have tried several times to replicate this effect on a small scale and it doesn't have the same power out ratios. But its easy to see how it can scale into something much larger with greater output.

Cheers
Matt
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Old 07-28-2010, 01:27 PM
gyula gyula is offline
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Hi Matt,

the rotary version is here:

GAP Power, Magnetic Amplification & Neutralization and the videos for it are here:

GAP Power, Magnetic Amplification & Neutralization

rgds, Gyula
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Old 07-28-2010, 02:07 PM
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Thanks alot

Matt
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:01 PM
synchro synchro is offline
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Bedini's Device and Method.

First of all, not only is Art not catching any flyback, but his Power Coil is a simple end to end solenoid wrap. The Tesla High Voltage Bifilar, with the end of one wire connected to the beginning of the other, would double the magnetic strength. the new HV coil would double the magnetic strength for the same amount of wire length and input. That simple measure alone would cut Art's power consumption in half. A fly back pulse recovery loop circuit would add another %80 to the efficency. This motor is very similar to Wesley Gary's current reversing magnet repusive and attracting linear motor of the 1800's.

Bedini's patent for his "Device and Means", uses a Flynn paralell path stator that switches flux direction on it's own, when the pulse dies. This permits rotor spin, and multiplies force. The inclusion of this feature, would allow for even more input reduction.
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by synchro View Post
First of all, not only is Art not catching any flyback, but his Power coil is a simple end to end solinoid wrap. The Tesla High Voltage bifilar, with the end of one wire connected to the beginning of the other, would double the magnetic strength. the new HV coil would double the magnetic strength for the same amount of wire length and input. That simple measure alone would cut Art's power consumption in half. A fly back pulse recovery loop circuit would add another %80 to the efficency. This motor is very similar to Wesley Gary's current reversing magnet repusive and attracting linear motor of the 1800's.
Bedini's patent for his "Device and Means", uses a Flynn paralell path stator that switches flux direction on it's own, when the pulse dies. This permits rotor spin, and multiplies force. The inclusion of this feature, would allow for even more input reduction.
How do you come across all that info? Apparently you didn't get that from the clip that is shown.
I heard him say in the clip that he was recovering BEMF which is a common term for flyback or anything else that comes out after the charge.

Matt
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Old 07-28-2010, 05:35 PM
synchro synchro is offline
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bemf

@Matthew Jones:

I'm working on the statment Karl Palsness made above that: "He is not captureing any energy from the coil when it's deactivated". Apparently there dosen't appear to be any recovery circuit in the video picture. How does the wrap look to you?
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Old 07-28-2010, 06:12 PM
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He said he was.
You can't see the circiut as it is probably in the box. All you have to do is charge the coil via a transistor or something to that nature then let it discharge back into the battery bank. So its not a big deal and most likely it would be close to the switch.
Remember that how you step up voltage. The inductor is storage device. You put the energy in then take it back out. All the while utilizing the magnetic field. It very efficient and depending on how much work your doing and how much energy recover you can go overunity easy. It not even a trick and its fits with electrical engineering standards.

You can look in my signature at the simple motor. Thats what it does. or go to WikiPedia_Boost converter . 93% of everything you take out of the bank can be transfered to the other bank. And if the apparatus generated a a charge that only adds to it. After that your only dependent on the efficiency of the battery.

Matt
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Old 07-29-2010, 07:17 PM
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Looks to be a Large improvement...

On the piston of the Bob Boyce motor. Suffers the same problem as his device, as there are times of low torque, but the way that is overcome is to offset multiple pistons turning the shaft.


To be over unity you need to produce more than what the unit requires to power the device. If the output from the torque of the motor ( run another generator ) and the back EMF combined is greater than what is consumed in the battery then you have OU.

Very interesting device.
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Old 07-29-2010, 07:25 PM
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As I think about it...

You could take a SSG and put neos on the back side of the coils and have the same setup as you suggest.
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Old 07-29-2010, 08:40 PM
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Current reversal.

@Theremart

Art's motor amplifys the attraction, 2.9 times what the electro magnet would give along with the neutraliztion. The current goes in the other direction to accomplish that. You need to add an DPDT switch to do that. Bit more complex than just the SSG and a magnet.
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Old 07-29-2010, 09:21 PM
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RE: setup

Quote:
Originally Posted by synchro View Post
@Theremart

Art's motor amplifys the attraction, 2.9 times what the electro magnet would give along with the neutraliztion. The current goes in the other direction too to accomplish that. You need to add an DPDT switch to do that. Bit more complex than just the SSG and a magnet.
Ok you are saying he is flipping the polarity of the coil. ( went to the web site, and it appears that is what is being done.

I thought about that with the SSG. if you could flip the polarity at the right time ( say with the bearingless Bedini ) you could obtain better results.

Still would like to see how much amps it takes to run this device.
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Old 07-30-2010, 01:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theremart View Post
Ok you are saying he is flipping the polarity of the coil. ( went to the web site, and it appears that is what is being done.

I thought about that with the SSG. if you could flip the polarity at the right time ( say with the bearingless Bedini ) you could obtain better results.

Still would like to see how much amps it takes to run this device.
There no AC on the coil so no XL to calculate, the coil act like a resistor with a constant DC apply to it, when the coil energize, the max power it can consume is 45/10.5 = 4.285A so 45 * 4.285 = 192.825 W when activated. http://www.gap-power.com/photos/Schematic-1.jpg

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Old 07-30-2010, 02:00 AM
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What scare me a bit is the size of the battery , its oversized if the information he gave is true and the fact that he use a cold roll steel core on his coil , the Remanence can be a real problem with that core to get a good switching time.

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Old 07-30-2010, 03:27 AM
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Got the DVD to support him and have found some one to start building it Real nice guy BTW
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:26 AM
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@Ash

You going to try one to scale?

Matt
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:50 AM
Ted Ewert Ted Ewert is offline
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All he has to do is to measure his input current to calculate his total power draw. Why is this not done? Why do people say that they have an "over unity
" device when it's so easy to take a few accurate measurements and dispel all doubt?
I've built a very similar device and they can be quite efficient. However, they are very difficult to get a lot of rotational torque from. They also have a slow rate of fire, which makes it hard to keep the coil efficient.
You'll probably have to build about ten of them to drive one shaft in order to get a smooth torque curve. Of course, if you use big honking magnets like this guy does, you may only have to build a couple of 'em. I wouldn't touch neos that big.
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Old 07-30-2010, 08:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Ewert View Post
All he has to do is to measure his input current to calculate his total power draw. Why is this not done? Why do people say that they have an "over unity
" device when it's so easy to take a few accurate measurements and dispel all doubt?
Ted, you are more senior member in this field than me.. and it should be evident to you by now that people who refuse to take any accurate measurments do so becuase that they are gonning to be disapointed by their meters readings..

Science or even a serious tinkering is not progressing with eye judgments. Especially the marginal ones.

Personally: I hate those people who are eager to say "free energy" yet they do not make any appropriate measurment and have a stack of batteries for power supply!
pfff... great noobness
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Old 07-30-2010, 10:54 AM
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Thumbs up

Ash,

Does the CD contain the circuit diagram that he is using?

Hopes and Dreams....

Tj
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Old 07-30-2010, 03:03 PM
everwiser everwiser is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EgmQC View Post
There no AC on the coil so no XL to calculate, the coil act like a resistor with a constant DC apply to it, when the coil energize, the max power it can consume is 45/10.5 = 4.285A so 45 * 4.285 = 192.825 W when activated. http://www.gap-power.com/photos/Schematic-1.jpg

Best Regards,
EgmQC
While he's using DC on the coil, he's cycling the DC on and off which ends up being a changing/alternating signal. The magnetic field will vary with voltage transients impeding/assisting the current flow depending on those transients, therefore his simplistic calculations using Ohm's law for resistance is not a valid representation of power. Further mathematics using his measured voltage, current, and timing are needed to calculate the impedance to accurately derive input/output power.
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Old 07-30-2010, 04:16 PM
synchro synchro is offline
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Input.

Wouldn't it be much simpler to just run the motor from a charged capacitor and measure the output against the depleted charge?
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Old 07-30-2010, 05:48 PM
Ted Ewert Ted Ewert is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by baroutologos View Post
Ted, you are more senior member in this field than me.. and it should be evident to you by now that people who refuse to take any accurate measurments do so becuase that they are gonning to be disapointed by their meters readings..

Science or even a serious tinkering is not progressing with eye judgments. Especially the marginal ones.

Personally: I hate those people who are eager to say "free energy" yet they do not make any appropriate measurment and have a stack of batteries for power supply!
pfff... great noobness
You're right, I doesn't surprise me, I just want people to be aware of this. Anybody with the level of skill to build a device as well constructed as this one is certainly capable of figuring out how to take a simple input power measurement. Failing to provide that information and then claiming over unity is disingenuous.
This guy and Chalkalis have pulled the same stunt. I'm just getting a little tired of it.
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Old 07-30-2010, 05:58 PM
Ted Ewert Ted Ewert is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by everwiser View Post
While he's using DC on the coil, he's cycling the DC on and off which ends up being a changing/alternating signal. The magnetic field will vary with voltage transients impeding/assisting the current flow depending on those transients, therefore his simplistic calculations using Ohm's law for resistance is not a valid representation of power. Further mathematics using his measured voltage, current, and timing are needed to calculate the impedance to accurately derive input/output power.
All he has to do is to put a current meter right after his power source. Then stick a couple of big old capacitors between the meter and the motor, maybe even a choke if there's any ripple left. The caps and the choke will average the pulse draws out and give a very steady and accurate reading on the meter. This isn't rocket science.
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Old 07-31-2010, 04:50 AM
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i love it when after the Certificate of Calibration is displayed @ 06:45 into the video
FREE ENERGY # 24 Working Magnetic Overunity Device - Magnetic Neutralization he
states:
Quote:
"i tend to think that most people are under the impression that an
over unity device must some how break the laws of physics.
This device doesn't even bend the laws of physics, let alone break any."
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Old 07-31-2010, 04:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vortex View Post
i love it when after the Certificate of Calibration is displayed @ 06:45 into the video
FREE ENERGY # 24 Working Magnetic Overunity Device - Magnetic Neutralization he
states:
Thats the Dogma academics practice. A near cult practice of setting unobtainable goals they themselves can't imagine reaching.
But thats another subject.

Matt
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Old 07-31-2010, 04:18 PM
everwiser everwiser is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ted Ewert View Post
All he has to do is to put a current meter right after his power source. Then stick a couple of big old capacitors between the meter and the motor, maybe even a choke if there's any ripple left. The caps and the choke will average the pulse draws out and give a very steady and accurate reading on the meter. This isn't rocket science.
I didn't intend to make it sound like rocket science. I was merely pointing out that his calculation methods were flawed making the claims he made in the video(s) likewise flawed and therefore unsubstantiated pending further analysis/replication by persons willing to "do it right". I'm on the side of anyone willing to open source and also know that claims that aren't backed up by accurate measurement/calculation are no no real value. I'm not throwing the baby out with the bathwater but his "bathwater" as presented is murky.

I'm sure someone will get to the root of it all with proper measurements; his, as presented, weren't completely valid.
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Old 07-31-2010, 07:35 PM
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Wow... so much negativity..... ouch...

If I was Art (the inventor) I sure would not be motivated to come in hear and work with you all ......

How about some positive words of encouragement and possibly HELP!

You all sound a lot like the scientists that you are always putting down.....

Lets get constructive literally... please......

Hopes and Dreams...

Tj
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Old 07-31-2010, 09:32 PM
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I'm not intending or meaning to be negative...Just making an observation about the evidence as presented.

As stated, I'm all for this being proven and turned into a viable motor/method. Like it or not, however, the documentation has to be in order to prove more work out than in. His methodology of having the apparatus lifting the certified/calibrated weight and equating this to watts is a step in the right direction but using Ohm's law in a purely resistive context is inaccurate. That's all I was saying. If the truth equates to negativity then so be it.
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Old 08-01-2010, 05:02 PM
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Earlier I stated that there is no recovery circuit in this...I saw in his pictures his circuit and you can clearly see that that is so.



If you look at Magnacoster's patent you will see that the two ideas are very similar just that one is capturing electrical energy an the other is capturing mechanical energy. You will see on Maganacoster's earlier pictures from his old web page that he also was moving one magnet on the end but then discovered when he pout energy recovery on the circuit that he was getting way more energy from that side. You can clearly see that this device will act as an generator. If you look at this link you can see how it does.

YouTube - Faradays Law of Induction



Hope this helps you understand.

Karl
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