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  #361  
Old 08-31-2011, 02:21 AM
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Web000x Web000x is offline
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Originally Posted by drak View Post
I'm just struggling here on a time table to save the thousands of the 6.9 billion family members I have that are dying everyday because of lack of food, water, heat, and cool air.
I know how you feel.



Dave
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  #362  
Old 08-31-2011, 02:46 AM
drak drak is offline
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Originally Posted by zilano View Post
Hi Drak!

view this and follow. for u and others too.
According to that picture, it looks like your primary has a lot less turns then your secondary. Reverse tesla coil not at work here?
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  #363  
Old 08-31-2011, 04:27 AM
jharmon jharmon is offline
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OMG. U R Good!

That's an awesome circuit.
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  #364  
Old 08-31-2011, 04:36 AM
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I'm trying to catch up here. Wish I could contribute.

When you "crack it", Drak, pls let us know. A solid replication would be most welcomed! and appreciated.

@Zilano, Drak, all -- is there some kind of motion here that is itself part of the resonance? perhaps motion between the core and the output coils?

Very interesting stuff. Great to have a woman researching also! reminds me of the very talented electronics gal Jeri Ellsworth.
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  #365  
Old 08-31-2011, 05:06 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Mike,

Im my previous tests here and here I was using a series spark gap. According to zilano you can't get OU with a series spark gap. I'm still trying to get my parallel spark gap to fire. Those pictures are of a parallel gap setup and I got no results with them yet. I'm still having trouble matching between NST and primary. I don't remember the inductance of those coils right off hand. Matching resonant frequencies is easy if you have a scope and a function generator. Or you can just measure the inductance and use on line calculator. I have resonance between NST and primary, but still parallel gap will not fire. Not sure whats going on.
Hi Drak,

Your 2 videos with the different coil configurations also looked interesting. Nice work and craftsmanship.

Not knowing what your circuit diagram looked like I can't help you on your spark gap questions. Zilano's is saying that parallel or series spark gap should work with the correct capacitor configurations.

Since you are just testing different setups you might also want to take a look at Dynatron's circuit design, as his is also an all air core transformer setup like your setups so far and has developed to the point with all the circuit component values given. There are already several experimenters replicating OU by following the design.

Here is todays video of one researcher powering his 2200 watt disk grinder from the circuit. (Russian)

До�ка Смита питает угловую шлиф. машину..flv - YouTube




Did you notice any step down in voltage on your 3 turns primary to the 10 turns secondary on you first video?

The sliding in of the primary coil in/out was interesting to see the difference in the wave output on your scope at different positions inside the secondary coil. It looked cleanest at the far end just before going into the secondary. With your single CW secondary that makes sense since standard Tesla Coils have the primary at the bottom of the secondary.

In bipolar Tesla coils with center tap, the primary is in the middle of the secondary coil and is what is the standard configuration. With Zilano & Dynatron's setups the secondary is wound half CW and the other half CCW with center tap so their primary coil works best at the center of the secondary bifilar coil.

In the photo above there are 16 CW and 16 CCW secondary winding over a 4 turn primary winding to get the 1 to 4 windings ratio. Zilano's latests design also incorporates this windings ratio.

Also notice the tall tower coils that are the secondary output "choke" coils that Zilano incorporates in the latest design. I liked how the output diodes are in water (probably distilled) to cool them down.

Cheers Mike

ps forgot to link the circuit

http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...ranslation.pdf
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  #366  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:20 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Originally Posted by zilano View Post
Hi Mike!


there is no choke here. choke can be put across output. here r 4 coils
1 primary.
2 secondary bifilar
3 output1
4 output 2

output 1 and output 2 are joined parallel for final output.

coils wound over ferrite rings and if u cant find ferrite rings u can use cu coated welding rods in pvc tube and wind bifilar first then secondaries at ends and finally primary in centre. mark leads of each coils coz later they will confuse u if same wire is used. use different colored wire. so identificable.
bifilar is shunted and earthed. lengths must be exact 246/freq in mhz=Z
divide z by suitable number so u get 1 feet or so adn make each bifilar 4 ft. if the division is not exact then use fractional part also else coil will be needing caps to match pri n sec resonance.

rgds
zzz
Hi Zilano

Your design by adding the "shunted coils" looks VERY promising.

It looks like Kapanadze was also using it!

Here are some photos comparing to his famous little green and blue coil unit.




How do you calculate the number of turns needed for the output1 and output2 coils ?

Will having the output1 & 2 coils on the same ferrite core as the secondary and primary, will they interfere with the magnetic fields?

Cheers Mike
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  #367  
Old 08-31-2011, 08:10 AM
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I'm attaching translation of one Russian guy procedure to obtain working Don Smith design with NST. It's slightly different then zilano so don't be distracted too much,however it drop a little light on topic I think. Maybe zilano method is far more efficient and that's why dynatron got only 2,5 kW output ?

Note : this procedure is for NST and for step up voltage ( original Don circuit), however I think it may be easily accomodated for flyback circuit. I have even checked my very small NST and it seems to match required multiplicity of frequency to pulse duration.

I have a theory how it may work if you are interested.Lenz law violation by "natural resonance" againts normally used "forced resonance"
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  #368  
Old 08-31-2011, 08:12 AM
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Sorry, forgot to attach text.Here you are :

Spread a very useful dock from Nicholas! Merged with rialstrannika.
* 2.doc (1654 KB - downloaded 286 times.)
It is recommended to read the file immediately after "DonSmith_ru.pdf"
My comment:
1) Sampling frequency is determined by the duration of the pulses neonika neonika. In a variant of the Smith - 210 kHz. All dances by this frequency.
2) Pulse rate neonika must be a multiple of the duration of the pulses. No more requirements to it does not. In a variant of Smith's 35.1 kHz (multiplicity = 210/35 = 6).
3) The length of the wire coil L1 is chosen in the area of 27 MHz quarter wave resonance (cable length = 75.29 / frequency in MHz).
4) Mota is on the frame. Measure our inductance (attachment to the sound card + software - kick-ass thing. Going for 2 resistors). Must be for these frequencies 3 mH. If different, then change the distance between the turns or winding diameter. The length of the wires do not touch.
5) we catch in parallel Conder 0.2 uF (with a voltage greater than 1 volt).
6) measure our response (attachment to zvukovuhe + program). If the resonance is not 210 kHz - inductance change (as in 4).
7) Take the wire to 4 times longer than the first wire MUST. Mota on the large coil in a single layer from the middle to any edge. Measure our inductance. Should be 12 uH. Select inductance as in step 4.
8) We hang Conder .047 uF too low voltage. Measure our response. Catch a resonance at the same 210 kHz.
9) Replace Conder on high, add the diodes. Donastraivaem by Smith (with neonkoy).
Run and enjoy.
It is not clear yet how does the geometry of the location and connection of large output Conder, because they are connected in parallel and are charged in series of a traveling wave.
Who thinks about these Conder?

Program and the scheme:
* Zmeter.rar (479.32 KB - downloaded 207 times.)

am submitting amendments:
_8) After paragraph 8 to another reel the same coil from the middle to the other end of the pipe and set it on the same frequency.
10) Because most sound cards can not measure the frequency of more than 48 kHz, at the time of measurement Conder need to put in 5-6 times and adjust accordingly the frequency of 5-6 times lower. After adjustment for zvukovuhe replace Conder at 0.2 and 0.047 uF to naprugami 4000 and 8000, respectively. Who has the normal instrumentation, the tunes at once with these Conder 210 kHz.
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  #369  
Old 08-31-2011, 08:12 AM
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Original text in russian:

Выкладываю очень полезный док от Николая!!! Слил с риалстранника.
* 2.doc (1654 Кб - загружено 286 раз.)
Рекомендуется читать сразу после файла "DonSmith_ru.pdf"
Мои коментарии:
1) Задающая частота неоника определяется ДЛИТЕЛЬНОСТЬЮ импульсов неоника. В варианте самого Смита - 210 кГц. Все пляшет от этой частоты.
2) Частота импульсов неоника должна быть кратна длительности этих импульсов. Больше никаких требований к ней нет. В варианте Смита 35,1 кГц (кратность =210/35=6).
3) Длину провода катушки L1 выбираем в районе 27 Мгц на четверть волновом резонансе ( длина провода = 75,29/частоту в МГц).
4) Мотаем это на каркас. Меряем индуктивность (приставка к звуковой карте+программа - обалденная вещь. Собирается на 2-х резисторах). Должна быть для этих частот 3 мкГн. Если отличается, то меняем расстояния между витками или диаметр намотки. Длину провода не трогаем.
5) Цепляем в параллель кондер 0,2 мкФ (с напряжением больше 1 ВОЛЬТА).
6) Меряем АЧХ (приставка к звуковухе + программа). Если резонанс не 210 кГц - изменяем индуктивность (как в п.4).
7) Берем провод в 4 раза длиней первого провода ОБЯЗАТЕЛЬНО. Мотаем на бОльшую катушку в один слой от середины к любому краю. Меряем индуктивность. Должна быть 12 мкГн. Подбирать индуктивность как в п.4.
8) Вешаем кондер 0,047 мкФ тоже с низким напряж. Меряем АЧХ. Ловим резонанс на той же 210 кГц.
9) Заменяем кондеры на высоковольтные, Добавляем диоды. Донастраиваем по Смиту (с неонкой).
Запускаем и радуемся.
Непонятно пока как влияет геометрия расположения и подключения больших выходных кондеров, т.к. они включены параллельно, а заряжаются последовательно бегущей волной.
Кто что думает по поводу этих кондеров?

Программа и схема:
* Zmeter.rar (479.32 Кб - загружено 207 раз.)

вношу дополнения:
_8) После пункта 8 нужно намотать еще одну такую же обмотку от середины к другому концу трубы и настроить ее на ту же частоту.
10) Так как большинство звуковых карт не могут мерять частоты больше 48 кГц, то на время измерений кондеры нужно ставить в 5-6 раз больше и частоту настраивать соответственно в 5-6 раз ниже. После настройки на звуковухе заменить кондеры на 0,2 и 0,047 мкФ с напругами 4000 и 8000 В соответственно. У кого есть нормальные измерительные приборы, тот настраивает сразу с этими кондерами 210 кГц.
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  #370  
Old 08-31-2011, 10:28 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Originally Posted by boguslaw View Post
I'm attaching translation of one Russian guy procedure to obtain working Don Smith design with NST. It's slightly different then zilano so don't be distracted too much,however it drop a little light on topic I think. Maybe zilano method is far more efficient and that's why dynatron got only 2,5 kW output ?

Note : this procedure is for NST and for step up voltage ( original Don circuit), however I think it may be easily accomodated for flyback circuit. I have even checked my very small NST and it seems to match required multiplicity of frequency to pulse duration.

I have a theory how it may work if you are interested.Lenz law violation by "natural resonance" againts normally used "forced resonance"
Thanks boguslaw I am interested in your theory on how it works.

Also what was the url for the original Russian post?

Cheers Mike
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  #371  
Old 08-31-2011, 11:25 AM
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That was somewhere in this thread afaik : Donald L. Smith

Sorry, it was a couple of weeks ago.

My theory is very simple (Well , that simplified version). If we accept that resonance is the key to efficient usage of the same energy MANY TIMES then of course in HV and high frequency parallel RCL circuit it could reach mega watts. The only problem is we have to SPIKE energy into it in precise moments to not disturb it. Thats why duration of spike has to be strictly related to frequency of RCL circuit.1/4 wavelength assuming we are spiking in magnetic field (we can do it otherwise in electric field also) is to ADD energy precisely to magnetic field of coil of this HV HF RCL . Meanwhile frequency of spikes has to be also correlated to the harmonic of that RCL and also match rersonant frequency (or higher harmonic) of primary RCL circuit - that's simply to minimize primary source load or to maximize voltage on primary winding (depending on capacitor and spark gap configuration).
Forced resonance is what we use today everywhere - matching resonant frequency , it means that RCL circuit is 1/2 of time working "with power source", while next 1/2 working "against power source" by Lenz law.
Strike a bell hanging freely on small rope, then strike again when holding tight in hand - and you will know the difference.
The same problem with have with load attached to the RCL circuit - it has to be via spark or other such device which let the excess energy ONLY be used for powering load while RCL is still oscillating.

But please remember that the best way to find theory is to experiment, got results (like zilano did) and then find theory. I wish I could have her skills ! Once I sit over my workbench I could only make an ugly not working crap which makes me horribly mad and sad...
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  #372  
Old 08-31-2011, 12:01 PM
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@Bogus Law, how do you tune a musical instrument....

It is always in relations to the previous key, and in the musical scale, the golden ratio is king

Quote:
"I consider this extremely important,. said Mr. Tesla. "Light cannot be anything else but a longitudinal disturbance in the ether, involving alternate compressions and rarefactions. In other words, light can be nothing else than a sound wave in the ether..
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  #373  
Old 08-31-2011, 12:12 PM
drak drak is offline
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Originally Posted by vrand View Post
Hi Drak,

Your 2 videos with the different coil configurations also looked interesting. Nice work and craftsmanship.

....

The sliding in of the primary coil in/out was interesting to see the difference in the wave output on your scope at different positions inside the secondary coil. It looked cleanest at the far end just before going into the secondary. With your single CW secondary that makes sense since standard Tesla Coils have the primary at the bottom of the secondary.
Thanks

Any time there is a spark, its next to impossible to measure on a scope which is why it looked clean, there was no spark. Like another forum member said, It really messes with electronics when the spark happens. My LED lighting will dim and flicker in in that room when the spark is going. I have fried the controlling part of a power supply so I had to buy another. Not to mention my computer will reset sometimes. I have measured the distance of about 300 feet away from the coils with a scanner before the clicking went away. God knows what its doing to my brain, lol. I would do what zilano suggests and turn off electronic equipment when sparking.
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  #374  
Old 08-31-2011, 02:40 PM
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Hi Muon!

Here we just try to blow a small wind of electrical and magnetic disturbance in primary coils which triggers higher disturbance in secondary and thus resonance is created and this resonance disturbs the ambient( or air) which already contains electrons yet we dont see em. they r disturbed and xcited and change their state and become ionized and they try to come back in former shape thus constitute energy we see as amperes. the core just help to make larger storm. more strong the storm more power produced. strength of storm depends on voltage frequency and the core material and amps fed to primary.

rgds
zzz
I'll use ferrite rings, 12 pieces, which I will stick (glued) together.
ferrite is a 1.8 inch outside diameter and one inch long.
I use flyback transformer with diode built inside.
What will be the value of capacitor placed between flyback transformer and spark-gap?
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  #375  
Old 08-31-2011, 05:41 PM
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Thanks Bogus, i can't see links for the attachments in your post ?
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  #376  
Old 08-31-2011, 05:51 PM
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hI Folks!

important do read and follow!


Nikola Tesla (1856-1943) among its many incredible inventions / insights, also made this curious machine capable of generating high-voltage discharge. For many a teslacoil is a transformer, but it is an inappropriate term: the Tesla coil is not based on the principle of operation of the common transformer!
There are various types of teslacoil:
-SSTC (Solid State Tesla Coil): teslacoil of this type is called "solid state" as it is controlled by an electrical circuit with no moving parts and no spark gap. The resonant frequency is generated directly by an electronic circuit.
-VTTC (Vacuum Tube Teslacoil): For fans of the genre, these works with vacuum tubes. To get really interesting discharges, you need to find huge military-type valves such as GU81M in some market places or specialized electronics distributors. The peculiarity of VTTCs is the high frequency of operation, generating harmless sparks via the skin effect, and you can tap them with your fingers!
-SGTC (Spark Gap Tesla Coil): This is the most famous and classic teslacoil, which we will explain below. Bases its operation on the appropriate size of a few components.
The aim in any case is to generate a resonant frequency on the primary winding that resonate on the secondary circuit, which must receive energy as a real antenna, but turning it to high voltages by reducing the amperage accordingly: in fact it is not free energy, since the energy output does not exceed the energy supplied.


How it works?




DON SMITH COIL IS TESLA COIL WITH A COMBO OF SINGLE PRIMARY AND 2 SECONDARIES BACK TO BACK. RESONATING AT 1/4


An SGTC teslacoil is based on two circuits oscillating at the same frequency:


Primary oscillating circuit Secondary oscillating circuit
A generator produces a frequency of 50Hz at high voltage, typically between 4 and 12kv describing a wave that repeats itself over time 50 times per second:



When the half-wave is rising up, the primary capacitor is charged and the spark gap, which acts as an automatic switch, is opened to allow charging of the capacitor. The circuit must be designed so that the spark gap closes when the half-wave reaches its peak and the primary capacitor is at maximum charge!




When the spark gap closes, the high voltage generator is electrically separated from the circuit formed by the capacitor and the primary winding. In this condition, the capacitor start oscillating with the primary, and acts as a transmitter at a frequency that is the resonance frequency of the LC circuit:



The oscillation of the LC circuit is repeated until the charge is dissipated.

When the capacitor charge is completely dissipated during the oscillation, the spark gap no longer has enough energy to stay active, then it opens again, and begins a new cycle of charging the primary capacitor, thus repeating the above steps. This circuit without the secondary, it's just a powerful radio frequency transmitter.

The secondary circuit is a circuit that oscillates at the same frequency of the primary, but the value of the secondary inductance is much larger but still have the same frequency because C2 is a smaller capacitor compared to the primary C1 (the torus). This is the difference that introduce the big voltage amplification!

For optimum configuration of the secondary, you should adjust it to 1 / 4 of its natural frequency of oscillation, this allows for the highest point of the coil, a maximum voltage (this says the legend, and the experiments confirms...) To obtain this frequency is used just to add on top of the secondary coil a toroid or a sphere of the correct capacitance. If you imagine the wave of charge that develops on the side of the coil, you drop the peak point at the summit, the last loop: So here we have the maximum voltage at the minimum current, with discharges less dangerous and more longer! If the circuit is not sized correctly and the voltage peak point was lower, along the winding, this can lead to surface discharges over the coil with the consequent failure of the insulation and winding damage...

Imagine being on the swing, you swing your legs back and forth: the swing is initially barely fluctuates, but insisted the oscillation will increase even more. In this example, your legs are the primary winding and the secondary coil are the swing. If you continue swinging the legs (the primary using the capacitor charge) that will increase more and more and the oscillation of the swing will follow exactly the motion of your legs, but still further increases, is getting higher and higher. This is the voltage increase! The primary continues transmitting its energy to the secondary that is already oscillating, adding the two waves with each new oscillation, just like a swing. This is why it is important that the two circuits can oscillate at the same frequency!


The main components of a Teslacoil:

Determine the primary capacitor:

Consider a high-voltage generator which provides 6 kV and 100 mA at 50 Hz.

Z impedance of the generator:

Z = V / I = 6000(v) / 0.1(A) = 60Kohm

C1 capacitance to obtain a similar impedance :

C1 = 1 / (2 * Pi * f * Z) = 1 / (2 * Pi * 50(hz) * 60000(ohm)) = 53.87nF

Toroid - top load capacitance: (CALCULATION OF SEC CAPACITOR C2)



As L2 inductance of the secondary coil and Fq the frequency at quarter-wave of the coil:



C2 = 1 / (4*P2*Fq2*L2)


Primary winding inductance:
As Fq the frequency at a quarter-wave, and C1 as the primary capacitor:
L1 = 1 / (4P2*Fq2*C1)




REGARDS



ZILANO ZEIS ZANE

IN SENSE N SANE!
Thank you, that is what i need.
I belive i need a strong driver for flyback transformer not 2n3055 , like is in my attach filles.
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Last edited by nico; 08-31-2011 at 06:09 PM.
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  #377  
Old 08-31-2011, 06:04 PM
nico nico is offline
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Hi Nico!

u can still use ur flyback if u r using ferrite core. if u want aircore then go for NST. FIRST TRY WITH FERRITE CORE AND UR FLYBACK WITH ORDINARY HOME COPPER WIRE PVC COATED.

RGDS

ZZZ
for ferrite core , the spark gap is in series with the primary and capacitor in paralel, the calculation will be the same?
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:25 PM
qvision qvision is offline
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If using an NST do we have to remove the ground break thing (what's it called ?) that is a safety feature, and is this easy ?

I am looking at this NST :

Ever light Neon Power Supply 5kv 25ma


Thanks,

QV.
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Old 08-31-2011, 07:54 PM
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Thanks Zilano.

For all you people spending a lot of time indoors with HF spark gaps, please read this :

"Exposure to an arc-producing device can pose health hazards. In a closed space such as a classroom or home, the continuous arc formation of an open-air Jacob's Ladder will ionize oxygen and nitrogen, which then re-form into reactive molecules such as ozone and nitric oxide. These free radicals can be damaging to the mucous membranes of people near the spark gap. Plants are also susceptible to ozone poisoning.

These hazards are not present when the arc is formed outdoors since the heated ionized gases will rise up into the air and dissipate into the atmosphere. Spark gaps which only intermittently produce short spark bursts are also minimally hazardous because the volume of ions generated is very small.

Arcs can also produce a broad spectrum of wavelengths spanning the visible light and the invisible ultraviolet and infrared spectrum. Very intense arcs generated by means such as arc welding can produce significant amounts of ultraviolet which is damaging to the retina of the observer. These arcs should only be observed through special dark filters which reduce the arc intensity and shield the observer's eyes from the ultraviolet rays."

From :

Spark gap - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


QV.
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Old 08-31-2011, 08:01 PM
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Just found this info about NST's :

"The power supply is a step up transformer used to charge the primary capacitor. You should choose a transformer that puts out at least 5kV, otherwise you may have problems with the spark gap not firing.

Neon sign transformers (NSTs) are the preferred power supplies. Recently manufactured NSTs include a GFCI (ground fault circuit interrupter) also known as a GFI (ground fault interrupter) circuit that will "trip" or automatically shut off a NST when it detects an unusual current in the output of the NST. Unfortunately Tesla coils produce current spikes that frequently cause the GFCI circuit to shut off the NST, making NSTs with GFCI unreliable in a Tesla coil. NSTs with a GFCI circuit will usually have a GFCI reset button somewhere on the case or possibly under the top cover. It may be possible to rewire and bypass the GFCI circuit in the NST, although it may be a very difficult process depending on the complexity and location of the GFCI wiring. Newer, small NSTs are actually solid state power supplies that are unsuitable for Tesla coils. I strongly recommend using an older NST to power your Tesla coil. A good NST should be very heavy and only contain a primary winding, secondary winding and metal core. The output frequency should be the same as the input frequency (50 or 60 Hz)."

From :

Tesla Coil Design, Construction and Operation Guide


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  #381  
Old 08-31-2011, 08:08 PM
sinergicus sinergicus is offline
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More about tuning tesla coils

Quote:
Originally Posted by zilano View Post
Hi folks!

for those who want to find out whether the coil is in resonance or not. either primary or secondary. here is cheap little circuit. it will light up to show coils is ringing or not!

pic attached

rgds

zzz
Hi guys;I found this circuit used for tuning primary and secondary;I Don't know if works I did,t tried ...
RMCybernetics - DIY Homemade Tesla Coil Tuner
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  #382  
Old 08-31-2011, 08:31 PM
drak drak is offline
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Ozone is only dangerous in large amounts. I have been using ozone for years to freshen the air in my house and to filter water. Nitric oxide on the other hand is a different story.
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  #383  
Old 08-31-2011, 11:01 PM
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deggers deggers is offline
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Electrostatic Induction

I do not believe that any Don Smith Thread would be complete without an educational video. You know, the kind you fell asleep to in Science Class.

electrostatic induction - YouTube

Duane
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  #384  
Old 08-31-2011, 11:30 PM
qvision qvision is offline
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LOL deggers
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  #385  
Old 09-01-2011, 01:28 AM
spark2 spark2 is offline
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natural resonance

Quote:
Originally Posted by zilano View Post
go through my posts and download handbook of electronic tables and go to page 38

zzz





Hi dllabarre, Hi Zilano too

I am pleased that we reached the same conclusion as in my previous post 6

Zilano work with natural frequency of wire. This is where we're all wrong with
NST 35khz frequency. already built my coil l1 in this way and I easily found the resonance. I am now building L2 coil .
my rule of thumb is that I try to understand before you do anything.
will keep you posted
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Last edited by spark2; 09-01-2011 at 01:33 AM.
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  #386  
Old 09-01-2011, 06:51 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drak View Post
Thanks

Any time there is a spark, its next to impossible to measure on a scope which is why it looked clean, there was no spark. Like another forum member said, It really messes with electronics when the spark happens. My LED lighting will dim and flicker in in that room when the spark is going. I have fried the controlling part of a power supply so I had to buy another. Not to mention my computer will reset sometimes. I have measured the distance of about 300 feet away from the coils with a scanner before the clicking went away. God knows what its doing to my brain, lol. I would do what zilano suggests and turn off electronic equipment when sparking.
Strange that your electronic equip is having problems around your spark gap. The Russians on their Youtube videos show their scopes working and other electronics working ok and taking measurements like yours without problems. Strange indeed.

CHeers Mike
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  #387  
Old 09-01-2011, 06:53 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zilano View Post
Hi Mike!

this is not water. its linseed oil. it helps to supress streamers or blue voltage streaks! at high voltage!

regards

zzz
Thanks Zilano.

The Russian experimenters are getting over 2.5kw output! What do you think they need to do to get 5kw or 10kw?

Cheers Mike
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  #388  
Old 09-01-2011, 07:05 AM
vrand vrand is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boguslaw View Post
That was somewhere in this thread afaik : Donald L. Smith

Sorry, it was a couple of weeks ago.

My theory is very simple (Well , that simplified version). If we accept that resonance is the key to efficient usage of the same energy MANY TIMES then of course in HV and high frequency parallel RCL circuit it could reach mega watts. The only problem is we have to SPIKE energy into it in precise moments to not disturb it. Thats why duration of spike has to be strictly related to frequency of RCL circuit.1/4 wavelength assuming we are spiking in magnetic field (we can do it otherwise in electric field also) is to ADD energy precisely to magnetic field of coil of this HV HF RCL . Meanwhile frequency of spikes has to be also correlated to the harmonic of that RCL and also match rersonant frequency (or higher harmonic) of primary RCL circuit - that's simply to minimize primary source load or to maximize voltage on primary winding (depending on capacitor and spark gap configuration).
Forced resonance is what we use today everywhere - matching resonant frequency , it means that RCL circuit is 1/2 of time working "with power source", while next 1/2 working "against power source" by Lenz law.
Strike a bell hanging freely on small rope, then strike again when holding tight in hand - and you will know the difference.
The same problem with have with load attached to the RCL circuit - it has to be via spark or other such device which let the excess energy ONLY be used for powering load while RCL is still oscillating.

But please remember that the best way to find theory is to experiment, got results (like zilano did) and then find theory. I wish I could have her skills ! Once I sit over my workbench I could only make an ugly not working crap which makes me horribly mad and sad...
Thanks for your theory. Yeah I found that post over at 001Labs from back on 3/21/11.

Yes, I agree, more experiments are needed. The Russian Don Smith experimenters are getting over 2.5kw and they are shooting for 5kw min.

Cheers Mike
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  #389  
Old 09-01-2011, 11:17 AM
qvision qvision is offline
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Has anyone here ever removed the GFI from a modern NST like this one :

Ever light Neon Power Supply 5kv 25ma
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  #390  
Old 09-01-2011, 03:30 PM
spark2 spark2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zilano View Post
Hi Dllabarre!

that is wrong calculation
frequency will remain same. if u r using 1 feet of wire then frequency is 246 mhz its same for primary and secondary 4 feet also. and if u r using 10 feet of wire then freuency will be 24.6mhz same for primary 10 feet and secondary 20 feet of wire.

zzz
Hi Zilano

I do not understand
You speak of the natural frequency of the cable which is like a 123mhz dllabarre as the calculated or that of the nst ???
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Last edited by spark2; 09-01-2011 at 03:32 PM.
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