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  #1  
Old 03-18-2009, 04:15 AM
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Perpetual Motion Holder | Edward Leedskalnin

This thread is about the Perpetual Motion Holder that allows for the circulation of current through coils that causes magnetism even when power is disconnected and it appears to hold indefinitely until the circuit is broken.

Here is one replica attempt: Emery Version - Leedskalnin Perpetual Motion Holder - KeelyNet 06/05/03

Perpetual Motion Holder Google Search
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  #2  
Old 03-19-2009, 06:42 PM
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During 2006 I had some interest in PMH so I made exact replica of it. So today I uploaded about 50 commented photos of the measurements I took by the end of the 2006. I also uploaded video of experiments I made. It's in Croatian because I never intended to publish them but I think it's all understandable just by watching it. I would have put subtitles in but I didn't find any simple subtitling freeware software and I don't have time to do it anyway.

The reason why I uploaded everything to my website instead on imageshack and youtube is because in the past I got my files deleted and I won't let that happen again. I like to have control over the stuff I share. I think most people would agree on that one. There will be some more alternative science stuff I'll upload in the near future so stay tuned.

Anyway links are

Nequaquam Vacuum (under the EN Section/ Alternative Science)

or direct link

PMH (Perpetual Motion Holder) Measurements (2006)


Also, there are some further experiments with PMH that I did during that time and although they are quite intriguing I still have to verify the results before I publicly share them. That will have to wait though since I'm currently in the process of engineering some other commercial stuff.


P.S.
I also uploaded some previously unpublished articles about Prof. Felix Ehrenhaft's "magnetic current".

Magnetic Current - Radio Craft Articles 1944

Last edited by lighty; 03-28-2009 at 11:55 PM.
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Old 03-19-2009, 10:30 PM
ABCStore ABCStore is offline
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Nice video, lighty!

Having Russian as my first language I didn't even need subtitles

ABC
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Old 03-19-2009, 10:35 PM
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Quote:
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Having Russian as my first language I didn't even need subtitles
LOL, slavic languages are like that. Russian is my third language so I could have done video in Russian.
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Old 03-19-2009, 11:12 PM
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Thank you lighty
I also did understand part of that
I found interesting that the number 4 in your language is pronounced exactly like in my language
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Old 03-19-2009, 11:16 PM
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I just realized I have SolidWorks model of PMH (exact dimensions of course). If you're interested I could upload it to my site in the next few days.
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  #7  
Old 03-19-2009, 11:33 PM
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Sure, why not
Thanks
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Old 03-20-2009, 02:45 AM
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Ed's Cool

I built a little demo to show how easy you can put one of these together. Its a very interesting device to match an interesting man.
YouTube - Ed Leedskalnin Magnet
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Old 03-20-2009, 04:07 AM
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Cody is back! Wb : )

The weird thing is, i could demagnetize the Bar with an other Magnet too, without take it away.
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Old 03-20-2009, 05:06 AM
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Now that is seriously cool. Thanks Lightly and Cody for your demonstrations. This is a very interesting phenomenon which I would love to see my physics teachers explain :P

Raui
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Old 03-20-2009, 01:32 PM
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thanks guys

Joit, you are correct. You can make the bar fall off on its own by placing a magnet with the correct polarity over one of the poles. It still lights the bulb doing that, it just lets you pull the bar off without the resistance of it attracting to the other bar. Thank you for showing me that Joit
So i guess we should be discussing what is going on here to give us these effects and what it is that Ed wanted us to know. The part where it holds the bar after the power is removed is baffling to me. The other part i think this group is already familiar with where we are collecting a collapsing magnetic field to light the light bulb. I see many similarities there with other of our technology's, such as our pulse motors collecting the collapsing magnetic field. To me, i think that is the main purpose of this device. Ed figured out how to collect the collapsing magntic field a long time ago and he wanted others to figure it out to. But is there more? Is there a use for the curious permanent electro magnet effect or some lesson to take from it Since "the books" are not even aware of this effect, im betting there is a little more to it.
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Old 03-20-2009, 02:38 PM
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The man was intelligent but couldn't hold a candle to Tesla. He was still a total weasel. From my readings on some of his statements and life,he had an Inferiority complex in the first degree. He had the Attitude of "Look what I can do and you cant" His writings were cryptic intentionally to make you wonder what he did. He had no intention of giving this information up because he wanted the attention to stay on him. As a scientist Ill give him a 8 out of 10.
As a fellow human being Ill give him a 2! His work with magnetics was notable, but eventually it would have come about anyway.
Thanks for nothing Ed!!
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Old 03-20-2009, 03:27 PM
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@Iotayodi
There is no Reason to judge about the Scientists and its Offtopic.
If you wanna do that, please make a new Topic.
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Old 03-20-2009, 03:36 PM
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@Iotayodi: We are diverting from the focus of this discussion.

@cody: what is next after our experiments. I been going crazy to make something useful, I believe one member here said it had some kind of utility.

Theorictically speaking, if there is circulation of magnets in the bar and we put coils around the U bar, we should be able to retrieve some energy, right?

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Originally Posted by Iotayodi View Post
The man was intelligent but couldn't hold a candle to Tesla. He was still a total weasel. From my readings on some of his statements and life,he had an Inferiority complex in the first degree. He had the Attitude of "Look what I can do and you cant" His writings were cryptic intentionally to make you wonder what he did. He had no intention of giving this information up because he wanted the attention to stay on him. As a scientist Ill give him a 8 out of 10.
As a fellow human being Ill give him a 2! His work with magnetics was notable, but eventually it would have come about anyway.
Thanks for nothing Ed!!
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Last edited by uusedman; 03-20-2009 at 03:39 PM.
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Old 03-20-2009, 04:08 PM
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uusedman,
Thanks for your interest, i saw that you have some nice demo videos as well. In response to your question, here is my thoughts: Im not sure it would be possible to pull energy off the bar while its in its "perpetual state". I think it would only be possible to extract energy when the bar is in disequilibrium, that is, when the bar charges (power to coils)and discharges(pull bar off top). But not when its just sitting there in its "perpetual state". So you should be able to use a coil to collect energy when you power it up(touch wire to battery)as well as when you pull the bar off (like i show in my video) So is that a 2 out for 1 in deal? Unfortunately I dont think i have the equipment to calculate the efficiency's, there would be a certian time period of max charging after which you are just wasting power to charge your specific coil. Also the speed of which you pull the bar off might play some role here. Maybe im wrong, maybe there is some way to extract energy while its in its "perpetual state" but i have not seen it yet. Thank you for bringing up some good things to think about.
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Old 03-20-2009, 04:22 PM
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hmmm. How on earth did yo u bend that steel rod?

how strong is the magnet state when the U bar is energized? if we apply more volts would that increase the magnet flux?

I am thinking out load.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cody View Post
uusedman,
Thanks for your interest, i saw that you have some nice demo videos as well. In response to your question, here is my thoughts: Im not sure it would be possible to pull energy off the bar while its in its "perpetual state". I think it would only be possible to extract energy when the bar is in disequilibrium, that is, when the bar charges (power to coils)and discharges(pull bar off top). But not when its just sitting there in its "perpetual state". So you should be able to use a coil to collect energy when you power it up(touch wire to battery)as well as when you pull the bar off (like i show in my video) So is that a 2 out for 1 in deal? Unfortunately I dont think i have the equipment to calculate the efficiency's, there would be a certian time period of max charging after which you are just wasting power to charge your specific coil. Also the speed of which you pull the bar off might play some role here. Maybe im wrong, maybe there is some way to extract energy while its in its "perpetual state" but i have not seen it yet. Thank you for bringing up some good things to think about.
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Old 03-20-2009, 04:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uusedman View Post
Theorictically speaking, if there is circulation of magnets in the bar and we put coils around the U bar, we should be able to retrieve some energy, right?
Did you look at results of my measurements? When in energized state PMH is completely inert to the surrounding space (magnetically speaking).
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Old 03-20-2009, 04:46 PM
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Lighty, I overlooked it, on your site now reading.


Quote:
Originally Posted by lighty View Post
Did you look at results of my measurements? When in energized state PMH is completely inert to the surrounding space (magnetically speaking).
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Old 03-20-2009, 06:07 PM
uusedman uusedman is offline
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Yes i have seen these pictures. Is that meter set to DC Volts and AMP?

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Lighty, I overlooked it, on your site now reading.
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Old 03-20-2009, 07:25 PM
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It's not voltmeter nor ampermeter.
It's gaussmeter and it says so on every page. It's used to measure magnetic flux density in Gauss or Tesla (1T = 10kG).


This particular model is F.W. Bell 5180 and it that particular measurement I used transverse probe. You can take a look at the datasheet here http://www.sypris.com/filemanager/li...0datasheet.pdf

Last edited by lighty; 03-20-2009 at 07:31 PM.
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Old 03-20-2009, 09:34 PM
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uusdman,
A vice, leverage, and some "hit it with a hammer" bent that bar
Yes i do believe a higher voltage would increase the field strength but to a certain point, basically because you can only fill your specific coil and bar up so much until you are just overpowering it and wasting energy. I think someone else would know more and be able to explain that better than me.

lightly,
i did see your video, nice setup man! Yes i believe you are correct, it dosnt behave in any way like a magnet other than the fact that it is attracting the bar, but the outside world sees nothing. Im glad you have some actual gauss meter measurements to prove that. But we do know its holding some kind of magnetic field because it behaves like one in every other sense, and as Joit points out it can be effected by externally applied magnetic fields. Ill be posting some results shortly on a method to extract power and to give us some visuals on where and what direction the energy is flowing in this device.
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Old 03-20-2009, 09:46 PM
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Thank you for making it clear to me.
I have not background in electronics, only recently i began studying electronics.

@cody, let's say for instance we inject the PMH with about 10,000 volts. It would be very interesting to see if the PMH has any imploding effects.



Quote:
Originally Posted by lighty View Post
It's not voltmeter nor ampermeter.
It's gaussmeter and it says so on every page. It's used to measure magnetic flux density in Gauss or Tesla (1T = 10kG).


This particular model is F.W. Bell 5180 and it that particular measurement I used transverse probe. You can take a look at the datasheet here http://www.sypris.com/filemanager/li...0datasheet.pdf
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Old 03-20-2009, 09:59 PM
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@cody
@uusedman

Voltage has nothing to do with magnetic field produced in coils. Only the current and number of windings are what is producing magnetic flux.

Also when any core is fully saturated you can do whatever you want with your coils but it cannot saturate any further.
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Old 03-20-2009, 10:14 PM
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Video 2

Lightly you are corect. Voltage is however going to effect how much current you can get through your coil due to the resistance of the long wire. Im sure you are aware of this, but just to help clear thing up a little more for others. But yes its current and windings and core that determins the field strength. Thank you for the info on the saturation point. I would be interested to see how it would preform if we discharged a higher voltage capacitor into it(like a rail gun). Ok so here is my second video, it gets into the stuff i was talking to uusedman about earlier
YouTube - Ed Leedskalnin Magnet 2
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Old 03-20-2009, 11:50 PM
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Crap!!!

It looks like the video didnt pick up all the LED flashes Maybe its just my computer.
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Old 03-21-2009, 12:14 AM
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Very Nice video Cody.

I could see the flashes very good in the video.
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Old 03-21-2009, 12:56 AM
uusedman uusedman is offline
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@ cody i can see the LED fine and great demonstration

@ lightly, i have to bring up a fact with you on the magnetic field is produce by current and number of windings. Yes, windings is a factor of magnetic field but in a newman and adam motor it is voltage that are producing the magnetic field.
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Old 03-21-2009, 02:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uusedman View Post
@ lightly, i have to bring up a fact with you on the magnetic field is produce by current and number of windings. Yes, windings is a factor of magnetic field but in a newman and adam motor it is voltage that are producing the magnetic field.

You are mistaken. Newman motor uses so much windings that even with the small current he achieves the same Ampere/Turns ratio as he would achieve with less turns and higher current. Of course coils with so much turns have enormous resistance- that's why he needs higher voltage. Ratio of Ampere/Turns and Ohm's law still apply. Of course which so high inductivity he cannot achieve any high frequency operation and I suspect that's why he has that big wheel turning so slowly (that and for the inertia buildup which is great for showing he cannot stop it with his hand).

As for the Adams motor I must admit I haven't give it much attention but based on years of experience I very much doubt magnetic field in any kind of coils are produced by breaking simple rules of induction and normal Ampere/Turns ratio.
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Old 03-21-2009, 04:05 AM
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Great thread

This thread is turning out really nice. Thanks for opening it, Aaron. Fascinating to hear some other takes on Ed and his PMH.

Iotayodi -- You have probably read more of Ed's works than me, but, in his defense, I would just add that we should consider that he was clearly a Freemason. That could throw this thread far off topic, but I just wanted to note two things about that: 1) The world only throws stones at heretics while heresy has always moved science forward, and so some of the greatest and most persecuted and propagandized against scientists took refuge in Masonry as brothers and knights of a common doctrine and world view. Masonry does not recruit, but rather demonstrates and entices through secrecy. Secrecy is both virtue and structure which causes it many problems, but was explained to me best by a friend: Without secrecy, there is no sexy nature; No seduction. No mystique. Ed was more magician than scientist, certainly. Tesla was a scientist and great modern magician; The best of both worlds. 2) Many of the cryptic aspects of Ed's writings -- or times when he seems to convey a superiority tone -- sometimes that is often from hostility against the skeptics of his time; Also cryptic in teaching with preference to brothers of his Masonry world. Speaking in their own language. This whole "Sweet 16", for example. I seriously doubt that is just an ex-girlfriend. Two magnetic forces underpinning everything? Sixteen rays of the sun? Astronomical observatory at the site? Circles squared. Compass. So many things. Cryptic is part of the tradition and allure.

Anyhow, just a couple notes tonight:

1) Study the Tom Bearden MEG.
2) Study the Floyd Sweet VTA.

....Observe the transformer loops there. Same kind of magnetic current loop as with Leedskalnin's PMH. Note also the air gaps present in the MEG, the VTA, and Leedskalnin's PMH between the U core and the bar. The gap is a place of Casimir Effect, in my view. As you go along and perhaps find some over-unity to the rig in regard to electricity....keep in mind energy drawn from the vacuum through the Casimir plates. In this case, magnetic waves more so than electric. The MEG and VTA are also PMH's if you look at it from a different perspective!

Outside of battery possibilities, there's also a whole new direction you can go with utility. Juice the things up enough and wildly enough like the VTA and you should start to even lose some weight!

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Old 03-21-2009, 04:11 AM
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Thats not right lighty.
When i put higher Voltage at my Newman with lower Amp i get faster Speed, then a higher Amp Batt with lower Volts.
Seems you didnt build a Newman or you didnt build it proper.
The half from the Torque at his Motor comes from the EM Field beside the Field, when the Motor has Contact, not the Inertia of the Armature.

What is your Problem with this Setup from the PM Holder.
Because you didnt get out Current, you think, it is impossible?
Did you ever put 1 or 2 Coils additional at the Bar, and tried to put more or less or pulsed Voltage for magnetize, and changed the position of the additional Coils?
Only, because there is a steady Field, it doesnt mean, it dont oscillate or cant be made to oscillate.
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Last edited by Joit; 03-21-2009 at 04:14 AM.
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