Yes that makes perfect sense, thank you for such a detailed explanation!

My solid state was running at 1.45 KHZ (highest frequency before noticeable change from square) for a few days - the charge rate and power use rate was very slow, almost slower then with the magnetic wheel. I guess I should figure out the charge time for my coil... but my LHC meter from china got messed up in airport security.

I noticed with the trifilar 2 power wires, that the oscillations are easy to stop if you change the resistance too fast or get magnets close to it, less of the collapse goes into the smaller wire so I guess the transistors base sees less.

I'm halfway toying with an idea to make a solid state musical instrument... or just playing with it near a guitar's pickups.

Thanks!

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I am wondering why increasing base resistance results in a higher frequency?
I'm thinking that the pulse to base is like a finger mashing a button, and the softer it presses the quicker the button pops back up...

The way the circuit operates is slightly different from the solid state circuit from the FEG book but the principle is the same.... basically if the resistor is of a high enough value in an SSG circuit, it makes the whole trigger circuit act like a capacitor which can store energy to trigger the transistor again after the field has collapsed.

http://www.energeticforum.com/attach...fresonance.jpg

When using the rotor for triggering, the passing magnets send just a tiny current into the base of the transistor. This activates the transistor (slightly) and so current starts flowing through the primary winding. This creates an expanding magnetic field.

Now remember the bifilar coil IS a transformer! So when current starts flowing through the primary winding, it generates current in the opposite direction in the trigger winding. (This is what really activates the transistor.) The amount of current it can generate depends on the speed which the magnetic field is forming. It starts off very fast, then as the magnetic field starts becomes saturated, slows down until there is no induced current in the trigger winding.

By increasing the base resistance, you are reducing the amount of current that can flow through the trigger winding so the transistor turns off sooner and sooner as you increase the resistance.

So you get higher frequencies with higher resistance.

If you used a very low value resistor, then the magnetic field will keep expanding until it is practically fully saturated. This obviously takes longer so you get lower frequencies.

Greetings everyone. Just popped to say hi and share my experience with ss energizer. I've been experimenting with different setups for the past few months. It has been long time since last time I work in electronic field, almost 25 years. I have been inspired by work of several people and decided to "jump back" into this fascinating field to prevent (whatever is left my brain cells from dying of starvation. My latest testing involves John Bedini Radiant Energy Charger, both - with rotor and solid state (pages 46 and 47). I'm waiting for new scope to arrive and unable to see, only read meters and hear changes in the coil (I found my phone handset coupling with coil from 20" distance). After I got it working I added LED in series with optocoupler input and diode in resonant part of circuit, between e - c. I used 100k pot between 7-2,6 of 555. I didn't have small 10uF cap and used 160uF photocap instead. I use different transistor (700Vce) and triac. I cannot tell if circuit is tuned as it should but it's charging much faster than my quad with rotor. When I tried to dump charge over cap with neon over terminals, neon fired within 1.4sec. Currently trying to reincarnate very dead lead acid.

Cheers

V-tech
(this is my first name, just spelled differently to sound right in English. Use to be my company name). I'm not affiliated with v-tech toys or phones

Attached Images

RE+Charger+with+SCR+and+optocoupler.jpg (86.1 KB, 44 views)

Hi folks, Hi blackchisel, funny you mention it, I have a couple of 6V-6AH sealed lead acids that are sitting at around 2 volts and not having the greatest of luck getting them to hold a load on much of anything, just drops to zero volts when loaded. I'm using a joule thief circuit and it can push the voltage way up on them, though it is starting to slowly show signs that it might be taking a little bit of charge, because say it gets bumped up to 20v it then slowly drops down to 11 and slowly keeps dropping as current slowly increases. Can anyone give me advice since these batteries are not damaged and hardly have had any use, so I figure from sitting too long became very sulfated. Has anyone else had luck rejuvenating sealed lead acids using the radiant flyback, by the way its using the single diode method as Bedini does. Any help appreciated.
peace love light
Tyson

Hi again folks, quick update based on my last post. I am now seeing results rejuvenating my 6V-4.5AH sealed lead acid battery. I was using too low of an input too see any results, I was initially using 100 millamps at 12V for the joule thief charger and I've now increased the input to 750 milliamps and am able to hold a load at 3.5V and it is steadily increasing, whereas at the 100milliamp input i saw no load handling ability, it would just drop straight to 0 volts. So this is very encouraging and I do believe this battery can be fully recovered. By the way the joule thief is using 18 gauge wire on a laminated choke type core. let me know what ya think.
peace love light
Tyson

Hi Tyson,

On really high Z gel cells I've had success by putting a high voltage cap in parallel with the charge battery until it starts to take a charge without it (talking about a standard SSG here). Sometimes a gel cell needs water to take a charge but I don't know the specifics of adding water to a sealed gel cell.

I am currently trying to rejuvenate a 12v 7ah battery that came out of my ups. It was sitting there for 3 years with a constant electron charge of 13.8v and just died. With a sudden power dip it could not even keep the power to my pc for 1 sec.
When I took it out and shorted the terminals nothing happened. No current flow.
I connected it to a small ssg with the one diode , no caps or pulsing, spikes straight to the battery, over a weekend.
It came back to life but it did not keep the charge for long After I charged and discharged it the current way in the ups a few times It could supply a current of 5 amps for 2 minutes with a 60w 220v bulb on the ups output.
It is now back on the ssg supplied by a pc power supply with 24v (between 12v and -12v) I will report in a few days time what the results are
I know there are a lot of senior guys on this forum that has done this before and will be able to answer some questions
Some say that supplying a battery with the radiant pulses destroys it
Some say that charging the same battery the Cole way by switching destroys it
Some say with the cap pulsing method you should not exceed 23v for a 12v battery while it looks like John Bedini did it with high voltages on the Bedini/Watson generator
Which make me wonder sometimes why I still try to get that machine going?

5 A discharging for 7Ah battery is way too much. Try to keep discharging ratio at or below C20, which in this case will be 0.35A. Some batteries are dead, I mean dead, dead and there is nothing you can do about. About 70 -80% average can be rejuvenated. Lead acid need electrolyte to be on marked level. Electrolyte doesn't dry, only water. acid will remain embedded in plates and only distilled water should be added. Batteries with visible swelling or cracks are waste of time. There maybe also one shorted cell which will prevent from reaching nominal V. There maybe build up of fallen pieces on the bottom, shortening cell or cell plates plastered together. SSG is charging with negative pulses and batteries not suppose to be switched. If you use a converter - capacitor, than you can swap primary with charging. I'll still allow at least an hour between end of cycle and connecting back to the circuit. There is still some charging present after disconnecting. Ions are heavy and need time to slow down. Otherwise it would be like shifting from reverse to drive without making complete stop. I'm still experimenting with my Solid State, waiting for deep cycle solar batteries. Other good ones are golf cart (6V). Both are truly deep charge. One more thing; automotive batt. labels are misleading; 100Ah batt. may have 80 at most so you have to calculate C20 on real value. Some old batteries may seat on low V for couple of weeks before starting to climb. They may need several - 10 -30 charge/ discharge cycles.

Cheers

V-tech

I forgot to mention; gel batteries may dry with time or because the way they were treated (pushing too much current or discharging above their rate). There is no (known to me and practical) way to revive them.

V

Hi, I got about 15 sealed lead acid from local health care unit. They have to replace them every 2 years, regardless of condition. I found one dead and there is absolutely nothing in my powers to get her going. She was sitting on 4.8V. All others worked fine despite their resting V on the beginning was way too low to be healthy 10.5V - 11.7V. They don't cooperate quite as good as deep charge lead acid, at least for me.

Cheers

V

Hi folks, thanks for the information. I'm blasting the battery again today and it's definitely desulphating this battery today when checking resting voltage it is now at 4.6V from 1.6V, but yes probably not all dead leads can be brought back to life. It is interesting to note though that all this batt. needed was extra blasting power to start to loosen or transform the corrosion inside. Will let you all know how the revival goes.
peace love light
Tyson

"all this batt. needed was extra blasting power to start to loosen or transform the corrosion inside" Conventional chargers are pushing current into the battery often causing excessive gassing and heating. Unless circuit is meant to transform other form of energy into heat, any heat "produced" during transformation can be seen as waste of energy. In case of battery it's harmful and should be avoided. Charging with pulses and relatively small current allows the HV puls to penetrate non conductive sulfuric "coating". This coating cannot be "shaken off" or penetrated by conventional charger.

Cheers

V

Hi folks, the rejuvenation is going well, it now holds the particular bulb load I've been using at 5.84V steady and with no load is sitting at 6.25V though would probably drop some when settled. Loos like I will soon be able to put this on a normal charger, the question is why should I since it will just sulphate up again down the road. Anyway, results are looking very good so far.
peace love light
Tyson

It is a small 600 VA ups. Output 220V @2.6 A =572W.
It only takes a 7Ah battery and is probably only to protect your pc against power dips or give it time to automatic shut down.
Unfortunately to supply 572W on the output it has to draw a lot of current from the battery.
Another thing I saw was in the Hector Perez rotoverter teachings where they said that a lead acid battery should not be charged more than 12.7 V.

Hi folks, sounds like your results so far are similar to mine, nvisser. Ok, the battery has desulphated enough and its impedance low enough now to put on a normal charger, i did this and it is not taking a full charge yet, so it will need more condition cycling. Though so far I am able to run a small light bulb load for just over an hour drawing 280 milliamps starting at 6.1V and slowly dropping for 1 hour and 10 min. then dropping fast, so it is looking good so far.
peace love light
Tyson

IMO, lead acid battery should be charged to 2.40V per cell which will result in 2.25V resting and should never be discharged below 2.09V per cell. This is based on 6 cell battery. Battery manufacturers should supply data charts with recommended charging/discharging details. During charge and discharge process battery should remain cool (ambient).

Cheers

V

Hi SkyWatcher Don't rush with conventional charger. Try to format (condition) battry with radiant some more. See if charging time is decreasing each time and resting V, without load. You may have interesting observations.

Cheers

V

Hi folks, Hi blackchisel, thanks for info. yes the normal charger isn't charging the battery much anyway, its peaking after only 5 or 10 minutes so yes more conditioning needed. I wasn't timing the charge time with using the pulser, I was only timing the discharge, so I will take note of the charge time also now. Thanks.
peace love light
Tyson

Hi folks, the results are getting better and better. After the second conditioning cycle so far, I am now able to run the same bulb load as before but this time the battery powered the load for 3 hours where as the after the first cycle it only powered it for 1 hour, 10 minutes. Though with the almost 2 watt load of the small bulb the battery should last about 15 hours, so it's coming along.
peace love light
Tyson

THIS IS THE ANSWER I WAS LOOKING FOR!!
ARE THIS PULSES THE RADIANT PULSES FROM THE BEMF OR PULSES FROM A CAP THAT IS CHARGED WITH THE RADIANT AND DISCHARGED WITH INTERVALS AT A CERTAIN VOLTAGE?

Hi folks, Hi nvisser, it almost seems like your not reading my posts. I am telling you what works and it's the flyback or also called collapsing field from a coil using a single diode to capture the collapsing field flyback. Though maybe a cap at a higher voltage lower value might work, however this joule thief charger ,which is basically the same as most Bedini circuits, is working very well. If thats not clear let me know.
peace love light
Tyson

Where cap is converting into positive charge, therefore allowing to swap primary with charging. We want to utilize the pulse from sharply collapsing field.

V

Hi SkyWatcher, I'm happy you have a positive results!

Vheers

V

Hi folks, thanks for words blackchisel. For anyone that may be interested, I am now getting 5 hours and 30 minutes on only the 3rd charge/discharge condition cycle from this 6V-4.5AH SLA using the same load. That is about 35% of the rated capacity of this battery, so its coming along well. It's looking like maybe around 10 cycles may bring this battery to full capacity based on the results of the 3 cycles so far, we will see.
peace love light
Tyson

Way to go SkyWatcher!

I found SLA really not dependable to do any tests. Unfortunately, they represent 95% of my batt. testing inventory at the moment. I'm hoping to get a few Surette's from Solar/Wind company. They would be my prime choice for powering home grid. With manuf. warranty from 84 -100 months and careful treatment they could last very long time. I need to get good rotor and replace my other pulser/charger's wheel. I have couple mechanical setups running continuously (since March) in my bedroom - I feel energized all the time This time I will go with superpoles.

Cheers
Vtech

I noticed that Skywatcher has got another interesting thread on battery recovery
Desulphating batts. w/ bedini type method

Just want to share the video I made to convice some people about the difference of Bedini radiant vs HV pulsed circuit.

170 seconds charge at 2.65V made motor run 30 seconds. Should have increase the transistor base resistor value but I find it easier to use HHO cells as current limiter,
YouTube - Low voltage charging with radiant charger

Showing 19V initial voltage that climbing down:
YouTube - Behaviour of radiant charger charging 12V SLA

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	12Vcharger.jpg (18.2 KB, 38 views)

Hi Everyone,
During my experiments with different Rodin's coils I decided to give a try with my Solid State Charger. I used 2x18 AWG#26 toroid. I connected one coil in series with positive of charging battery and noticed voltage climbed 0.3V instantly. Then, I connected second coil in series with negative and voltage went up another 0.3V within seconds. Just wondering if I'm matching impedance of battery or there is something else going on. Any suggestions? Actually I found partial answer today; my DMM was connected before Rodin's Coil, not at the battery terminals. I apologize for confusion.


Cheers

Vtech

this is one of the very best and simple yet very effective and cheap solid state self triggring radiant oscillator or charger...
please give me your feed feed back and views...
i had recently desulphated 3 of my 5 years old 12v 80amp lead acid car battery...now they hold a charger quite properly....
and i had simply use a 1amp 9v pus or power supply for input...
heres the link to circuit.....
download it and enjoy---
link--- Free File Hosting & Video Downloads, Free File Sharing, Online Friends Network - Ziddu

thanks
shubh!!!!

Hi All,

Further to my post 277 on page 10 my progress is as below.

So far I have made up around 5-6 circuits and in most of the circuit I have got input / output power ratio between 1 to 4. I had a doubt on the spurious component so recently I ordered components from mouser.com but on making the circuit using those component i received the following results.

1. Input - 12 volts with 0.23 Amps i.e. 2.76 Watts
2. Output - 170-180 volts with 0.03 Amps i.e. 5.1 Watts

In my circuit i have used 3 nos 10 mfd 440 volts motor starter capacitors. The winding is done on 1/2 inch pvc pipe around 3.5-4 inch long. The iron core is being made using welding electrodes.

Earlier i had one BD243C, which has drawn around 1 amps at input side with 12 volts. But at the output side the voltage dropped to 70 volts and 0.2 amps. so again the input power is 12 watts and output power is 14 watts.

Capcitors are making good noise and I can hear the charging and discharging of the capacitor. The megnatic field generated on the coil is good, as i have checked it using neo magnet.

I dont know where i am missing in the whole concept. I request the members to let me know following

1. What should be ideal input and output power ration for Bedini SS....

2. Is there any issue in the coil winding....

3. What is the voltage and current observed by other members on input and output side of the circuit....

Regards

Praveen