Hi Sephiroth. Yeah I have been doing some reading and thinking and was thinking of maybe winding the bedini triphilar in a step arrangement. Aswell i was thinking of making the coil which charges the battery a cadeceus.
Mainly I want the properties given by the ssg which are the magnetic fields are switched abruptly and at peak. As well i want to utilize the back emf to drive the gray tube.

I bought the Bedini kit with PCB from courtiestown in UK. It came with BD243 and 2n3440. Assembled it all as described on p46 and noticed that the BD243 was getting hot very quickly even w/o a load on it. So, I replaced it with a MJL21194G. Now, I don't get any output from the board at all How do I go about troubleshooting the problem? Do I have to change some other components to match with the new MJL21194G?

@ cowboy Have you checked your current draw with an amp meter or digital multi meter? if you aren't drawing any current make sure your wiring is correct then try kick starting it with a magnet.

It's not drawing any current and there is no voltage coming out on the output. It's using 450 turn air cored trifilars. It's SSG, how can I kick start it with a magnet?

get a stack of magnets that fits inside the core and pull it out rapidly. Check the resistance on the pot with an ohm meter to make sure it isn't burnt out. Also make sure that the charging battery is always hooked up.

cowboy,

hi. isn't the circuit on page 46 supposed to be an iron core with welding rods, and not air core? maybe that is the reason for malfunction. just my .02.

have a good day.
pat.

Hi All,

I am trying to assemble the circuit given on page 46 of FEG books along with the corrections like swiping of pin 4 & 5 on H11D1 etc. The schematic as per pin diagram is as given below:

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC


Based on this schematic I have assembled three circuit. The details are as given below:

Circuit - 1:

This circuit I have assemblem using the wire as connector between components. The pictures of the same are as given below:

circuit 1 front.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

circuit 1 back.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

In this circuit I have observed 12 volts and 0.25 amps at input and 200 - 220 volts and 0.08 amps at output. So the ratio of output to input was 5.33.

Circuit - 2:

For further improve on the circuit, I have assembled another circuit and this time I have made the tracks through solder wire. The picture of the circuit is as given below:

circuit2 front.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

circuit 2 back.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

In this circuit i have observed 12 volts and 0.35 amps at input and 120 volts and 0.08 amps at output. So the ratio of output to input was around 2. In this circuit I have observed Ghhhheeeee gheeee type sound on the coil.

Circuit - 3:

Further i tried to improve on the circuit so decided to use the copper clad PCB and made the schematic using itching poweder. The details as given below:

circuit 3 front.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

circuit 3 back.jpg

Picasa Web Albums - Praveen - SS SCHEMATIC

But the performance was not upto the mark. At inout side i have recorded 12 volts and 0.29 amps and at output it was 110 volts and 0.11 amps. So ratio to output to input was around 3.4. In this circuit I have observed Ghhhheeeee gheeee type sound on the coil.

I have gone through all the old post of TEEP, overunity and this forum. During my reading I found that one member got the success replacing 1/2 watt to 1/4 watt resistor, so i have tried that but no improvement.

However I have 3 coils with me i.e. one wound by me (very rough), second is wonded by me but comparitively better then first one and third was through professional winder. All the windings have 450 turns of 23 gauge copper laminated wires. Also these coils are iron core using welding electrodes. But with all the three coils on all the circuit, the results were more or less same.

In fact in the present condition, I have tried all the circuits on the 35 Ah, 12 volt lead acid battery but there was no improvement on the battery i.e. battery was not got charged even after 24 hours.

Although I dont have the Oscilloscope with me but I have asked one of my friends to check the wave form. With the wave form it is clear that the circuit is switing but the frequency observed was only 19 - 21 Hz. This test was conducted only on circuit 1.

As of today I am feeling myself out of idea to compelete this project, so requesting all the members to throw some light on this.

With regards

Praveen varma

Those who study oscillators know of a style of oscillator
called "push-pull".
My thinking re: Bedini is that a circuit that is "push-pull"
in nature, with two power transistors, one PNP, one NPN,
might be a good way to go. I'm not a competent enough
circuit designer to do that. Anyone want to rise to the challenge
and show it to us?

The advantage to push-pull for amplifiers is you get a more
PURE sine-wave. Same is true of oscillators using a push-pull
amp.
Some coils respond better to sine waves.
Others, like fly-back, want saw-tooth.

A bedini bifilar coil likely wants a nice sine wave
so that the SNAP as the magnets go by occur
on a nice stable place each cycle ... or if using
only b-fields (no magnets whirling by), again you probably
want a predictable time each cycle for the
radiant spike to occur.

Also, the coils inductance likely plays a role.
If you can get your electro-magnet to oscillate
at the coils resonant frequency (and not the SLOW
bycle-wheel SSG speeds), XL will approach infinity,
voltage drop across coil will approach infinity,
watts will go way down to drive coil,
current will flow to batteries from the radiant spike w/o
having some of it wasted in the coil (or as heat).
The machine will run colder.
So the coil winding and geometry is important relative to the
frequency you hope to run it at.

-- morpher44

MWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!

I'm allowed to use evil-mad-scientist-laughter since I do now actually have a secret underground laboratory!

Though the reason for the laughter is my recent project! It is the biggest solid state oscillator I have built.

I call it "Flat Boy"





SPECIFICATIONS

Coil
4cm high, 12cm diameter, the core is 4cm diameter made from atomized iron mixed with epoxy resin.




24 strands of 22 gauge copper wire. Litzed first in groups of four, then all litzed together.

12 strands used as the primary - 60 turns - 108 milliohms. (EDIT : looks like my multimeter can't give me accurate readings in milliohms... just calculated the true wire resistance is 40 milliohms)
12 strands used for secondary - 120 turns - 80 milliohms.

Primary and secondary have their mass matched, though not their resistance... may change it to a 1 to 1 transformer, though still weighing up between the extra energy gained by the larger number of windings against the extra energy dissipated by the higher resistance...

Primary is estimated to be approximately 0.3 henrys based on the dimensions of the coil. (thought it was one henry but got the maths wrong!)

Circuit
Currently 6 x MJL21194 transistors though I will buy 6 more soon to make a total of 12.

24 x UF4007 diodes in parallel going to a 500,000uf capacitor that is discharged into the charging battery periodically via a relay with a 555 timer circuit. (FWBR is NOT used)



Wire
6 AWG audio grade copper wire for connections to the batteries, capacitor and wherever else possible.

Operation
With a 1k ohm pot, I have a range between 400ma to over 1 amp. Draws 800ma when resonating at 9khz.

Cap is dumped into the charging battery at approximately 2 volts above the charging battery voltage every 4 seconds.

Switches included to turn the oscillator on and off, as well as bypassing the amp meter during normal operation. Another switch used to swap between charging the battery and loading the battery for easy testing.


I think that is all the interesting stuff... Now to see how it performs

Hi Sephiroth,

It was long time mate since our last topic exchange
You surpassed yourself on this one. nice setup. I hope performance follows as good.

By the way the circuit is Bedini SSG solid state (resistors instead of diode) ?

Anyway, GOOD JOB!

Regards,
Baroutologos

Thanks Baroutologos

The circuit I'm using is based on figure 3 from patent 11592633...

been running for a while now and the transistors are getting surprisingly warm... not hot, but noticeable and the transistors should have no problem with this kind of current, though with the lower duty cycle the peak current will be higher than normal .

Considering one of the other circuits from the patent so i guess it is still in the design stages

hmmm... no, on second thought I think I'll stick to this circuit... the extra transistors should solve the heat problem anyway...

Nice setup Seph! May should call it Fat Boy - it is one big coil!

With the big cap dumps with a relay, please let us know how the contacts hold up with 500,000 uf. Also, When charging a batt for a few hours and then turning it off, you should be able to see the battery continue to charge up for a while.

Have you seen that yet?

not yet... I've had it charging a battery for the last hour or so while I discharge another battery to a decent load voltage to get an initial COP measurement from it... not too optimistic at the moment considering the heat from the transistors but you never know

didn't think about the relay contacts it's just a small single throw relay so will have to keep an eye on it... perhaps I could use a big automotive relay and solder all the throws in parallel that should reduce the impedance as well

lol, I thought of calling it fat boy but it didn't feel right naming it after a bomb Ash also had a solid state circuit he called "Big Boy" so "Flat Boy" goes nicely with that

Still no one recognized the dimensions of the coil? If no one figures it out by tomorrow I'll have to tell you

well I didn't expect much but I have to say I am very disappointed with the first test... I'll try again when I get the new transistors... the cap charged great and from calculating the energy charging the cap it looked like it was going to do well.

Sorry aaron, but I didn't see the self charging effect this time round... though I'll keep at it.

Hey Seph,

I had disappointing results with my SS replica from the FEG book. But then I realized that I was trying to charge a negative energy conditioned battery with it. So it has me thinking that since a cap allegedly transduces negative energy to positive that maybe an unconditioned battery would work better. At any rate I'm going to try it with a new garden battery I bought recently.

Good luck with yours Shamus

I just realized that I had mine set up to dump the cap on the positive side so I've swapped it over to the negative... also increased dump frequency to every 2 seconds instead of 4.

Still debating with myself whether to take it back down to a 1:1 transformer configuration though at the moment the low charge rate seems to be related to the cap pulser and not the coil.

God damn poverty! I want those extra transistors as well!

I was using figure 3 from this patent though with a cap pulser added.

Circuits and related methods for ... - Google Patent Search

Coincidentally in the last hour I have rewired it to the way shown in your file and I am much happier with the results (also took the coil back to a 1:1 configuration)

I'm using 25K and 12.5k resistors to bias the base with a 1kohm pot in series with the trigger coil and 100ohm base resistors on each transistor.

the transistors no longer heat up and the charge rate has gone up considerably

interesting thing though... with the figure 3 schematic the scope showed a fairly boring square wave, as you would expect...

though with this layout I get an h-wave... never seen that in solid state before... basically there is a pause of around 15% of the duty cycle between the flyback and the next power pulse. Interesting, though I don't think it is significant. I think the advantage of this schematic is that it provides more suitable bias to the base of the transistor than with one end of the trigger connected directly to the positive.

Bipolar transistor biasing - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I think any circuit is allowed in this thread as long as it is a solid state oscillator...

that's more like it

First COP measurement for the new circuit is 0.78

Not the best COP I've ever had but it is the best I've had with a cap pulser so I'm optimistic!

now... where to find an extra 22% of my input?

Hey guys. I did the unspeakable!

I built a hybrid circuit, using "some" of the Bedini schematic and excluding 3/4 of it. It works great. After 3 charge and discharge cycles on 2 (12 volt) gel cell batteries, I got the gel cell batteries boiling at 15.00 volts!

I am NOT using a bridge rectifier or a capacitor anywhere on the charging circuit. It makes it a lot easier, since you don't need a 555 timer or anything like that. I am not using 3 windings either, just 2.

I am using iron dust, and fiberglass resin for the core. Pretty funny looking!!

What I've noticed is that you don't want to use a bridge rectifier, unless you are charging a capacitor as a collector. If you are discharging directly into a battery, then you should remove the bridge rectifier to prevent "conventional current" from charging your batteries.

There is a simple way to build an "impedance sensing" circuit. You just copy the Alexander Meisner circuit. It does the same thing, but uses a slightly different variation. I am currently using the Bedini circuit, but both behave similarly. Both of these auto-start and auto adjusting "self resonating" circuits seem to work excellent, with NO heat or excessive power consumption and really good charging.

# 19 gauge (6.0 ohms) main coil - about 400 feet.
# 30 gauge trigger coil - same length.

The thing about this type of a circuit, the coil charges and discharges at the correct frequency to consume the LEAST amount of power possible, so the transistor doesn't even get remotely warm... However, if you just have a FIXED duty cycle circuit, the coil tends to overcharge with too much current and everything heats up.

The Bedini "partial" circuit - works great!

Can't knock it if it works Some of my first solid state devices used a cap on the trigger circuit...

Is that a toroid?

Hi Huckmubb,

That "partial" Bedini circuit is pretty much identical to the SSG circuit. The one in the FEG book is basically based upon the trifilar cap pulser build, so there isn't any deviation as far as I can see.

The more I work with this tech the more I see that John Bedini, Rick Friedrich and others are quite correct when they talk about impedance matching on the charging battery. Yesterday I was trying to charge an old, beat up gel cell that was sitting around 8V on my rebuilt quintfilar (the thing is scary quiet now--I have to look at it to see that it's running ) and the bulb on the trigger lit up fairly well while the RPM stayed lower than normal and the current draw was higher than normal. A quick check on the voltage of the charge battery showed it up around 15V; this battery had high Z! Eventually, over time the bulb started to dim while the RPMs climbed and the amp draw went down. Spot checks on the charge battery voltage showed going down from 15V to 14, 13.2, and eventually down to 12.4. The battery was starting to take a charge, it had lowered it's internal Z to where the quintfilar could actually deliver some power to it.

TL; DR: It's all about the impedance. Learn it, love it.

Hi Sep,

Nice Solid state. Looks very neat inside its little housing.

The best solidstate I ever fiddled around with was an air core "donut" wound coil. Funnily enough I remember seeing a picture of the innards of a Rennasiance charger where I saw the same thing. Of course I cant be sure that its intended purpose was specifically for power windings.

Interesting to note the different configurations in that patent you posted above, you can see the one I am referring to in there.

Mine was wound around a 15cm form, three wires all 2mm gauge. Pulled some current but dang, it charged well.

Ive been experimenting with large cap pulsing lately too, of course my caps are filled via rotor triggerings, not solid state. I noted that my charging rate was pitiful if I left it too long between pulses. 2 seconds is about the maximum amount of time I use. This gives my 160,000 uF caps a chance to get up to 16v before they are dumped into the charging battery.

I am surprised your relay hasnt packed it in. I welded the contacts shut almost every discharge from caps a 1/4 of that size.

Keep it up.

Regards

Hi Ren,

I quite pleased with how well the relay is holding up I'm sure alot of it has to do with the lower voltage and short pulse duration (estimated 30 millisecond dumps every two seconds... might take it to 1 second intervals)

But I don't want to take any risks if the relay was to pack in then there are two scenarios:

1. the contacts will be welded together so the output of the oscillator will be going directly to the battery... this isn't a problem.

2. the contacts fail completely and the cap is left to charge and charge until it explodes this will take less than 30 seconds on my set up

Considered putting a zener across the terminals but not sure how that would interact with the spikes.

So I'm not letting it run unattended until I get a bulkier relay to replace the little one.

I know the type of coil your talking about... how many turns did it have? and do you know the frequency compared to amp draw?

I thought of using speaker wire to make a big low resistance coil, but later learned about the skin effect and how the resistance of a wire increases at higher frequencies, so opted for litz windings which increases the surface area.

I'm trying to get the highest possible Q value from the coils by aiming for the Brooks Coil configuration. I actually got it wrong but it's close so I'm still happy wouldn't have believed a 60 turn coil could work so well!

still tweaking at the moment... I'm happy with the circuit as a whole, but still more study needed before I settle on a design.

Any thoughts on the purpose of using a bridge rectifier? Logically it shouldn't be needed since there won't be any current generated by the expanding magnetic field if the load voltage is higher than the input voltage, though these circuits aren't meant to work logically so i don't know still alot of question marks

I have a standard SSG circuit that can oscillate when the resistance is set higher then 1.5 K, and I was wondering if that is healthy for the charging battery? Would this be a solid state charger?

Thanks.

Yes, that counts as a solid state charger

shouldn't harm your battery as long as you stay within the C20 rate

I made a SS Bedini SSG, Trifilar, bottom of power lead 1 hooked to top of power lead 2, other wise normal with MJL21194, and cranked with a 100k ohm potentiometer. VERY TOUCHY. Just getting NEAR the potentiometer changes the frequency. Also grabbing wires affects frequency too. Must be bio-magnetism or capacitive coupling. I have to start the Solid State with a NEO magnet in the audible range, and slowly crank up the resistance and frequency.

To start out the waves look square wave ish (first photo)
Then as I go up, one side begins to separate into a M, leading to a double stair step or heart beat style wave.
Then as I go up further, I hit a sweet spot where I am unable to separate the waveform, as it looks like the last pulse is still bouncing around inside the coil when the next one comes. One stair step wave on top of a double M wave, ontop of noise wave...

Unfortunately when I found this last waveform the magnet I used to start it was in my pocket, and by me leaving the room (7 ft away atleast!) I changed the magnetic environment of the sensitive coil enough to change the frequency and loose it, and was un-able to get it again.

(Ben Stein voice) wow. YouTube - Woooow

Stair step waves anyone?

hi Cosmicfarmer,

i recognise those waves... I am guessing your amp draw will be very low with the last two though your charge rate will be very poor.

the first scope shot is what you are looking for.

The other two show the charge bouncing around the coil but rarely going over the charging voltage so you will loose alot more to parasitic resistance.

Also, (in my opinion) the main problem with using very high frequencies is the losses in the transistors. When a transistor is fully "on" then they are quite efficient and have a very low impedance.

however, in the time between the on and off state the impedance of the transistor gets relatively high and this is when the most energy is being "burnt" by the transistor as heat. When operating at higher frequencies more energy is burnt in the switching.

I think you should be aiming for a nice square wave like in the first shot

to solve the sensitivity issue, when you know what the lowest resitance you need the trigger to be stick in a higher base resistor and a lower value pot Even just using a higher base resistor should make a difference.

Excellent. Thanks for that info. I was about to do an all day test run on the stairstep wave charging. Makes sense about the charging voltage, but aren't inductive collapses much higher then 12v? I only see the radiant waveform if I replace charging battery with scope, so I'm not sure. I thought that the collapse dives into the battery and the scope dosn't get a chance to see it.

Any reason why you would want the stairstep waveform? Something about tesla's time wave? I guess this would make a good transmitter for nearby resonant circuits, but nothing beats the SEC for wireless. One day I'll make that, but I gotta learn how to resonate (walk) before I can cohere (run) ;-)

Anyway, sorry if this is been-there-done-that. Thank you for your time and I am honored.

there are a few things happening that charges the battery... the conventional and the "non" conventional.

In a coil a voltage is generated when exposed to a changing magnetic field. The faster the magnetic field is changing, the greater the votlage generated. What bedini's devices do is create a magnetic field, then the current is cut off very sharply, and the magnetic field then collapses at an incredible rate. This generates voltage spike in the coil that is sent to the charging battery. This is what we refer to as the radiant, or transient spike.

However. after a very brief time, current is induced in the coil by the voltage it has generated. We know that when current is flowing through a coil it forms a magnetic field. So once the current starts flowing in the coil it actually SUSTAINS the collapsing field and slows down the rate at which it's collapsing so the voltage generated by the coil drops to just above the charging battery's voltage.

So... two things are happening. The first event (the transient spike) is what we are most interested in. However, by conventional physics this very brief spike has very little energy and does little, if anything, to charge the batteries. Conventionally, what charges batteries is current and the current that is generated by the collapsing field can theoretically produce the same amount of energy as the energy required to create it (in reality it is usually several times less).

The transient spike is what causes the unusual charing effect of the batteries. We have to use energy to create this spike.

However, alot of the energy that was used in creating the spike can be recovered through the current generated from the collapsing field. So we want to recover as much of the energy that was used as possible.

Most of the charging in a solid state device will be directly from the energy we've recovered from what we put into the system.

Then on top of that, we have the anomalous charging effect of the spike.

Things that reduce the amount of energy we can recover from the system are things like resistance that generate (useless?) heat.

In the stepped waveform, what is happening is that the energy that is left in your coil after it has sent a charging pulse to the battery is generating tiny currents that slosh back and forth within the coil because the field isn't collasping fast enough to generate a voltage higher than the charging battery, so all that energy that is left over is being burnt up by the resistance of the coil.

It is only after you input a good strong pulse of energy, does a good strong pulse of energy come back, as well as a strong spike. With a good square wave, the energy that is left over can be used to form the magnetic field when the next input pulse is applied so it isn't wasted sloshing about in your coil.

Does that make sense? I haven't tried writing it up before so it is probably gibberish