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  #121  
Old 02-28-2009, 10:58 PM
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Why is that 18-23KHz range significant?

To understand this correctly, Tesla made a dummy transmitter in that range with 50-100W power and then because of the specific frequency range of 18-23KHz he was collecting the Cosmic Rays.

I just thought that Cosmic Rays had a GHz/THz frequency, being high energy particles...

Did he also have a battery in that box and some kind of a step-up transformer (to drive those tubes he would've needed 200V or more)?
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  #122  
Old 02-28-2009, 11:06 PM
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Morays tubes supposdely worked something remotely like a crystal radio and crystal radios do not need an external power source. You just need a germanium diode. Moray used some special minerals to make the tubes sense the radiant event.
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  #123  
Old 02-28-2009, 11:07 PM
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Morays tubes supposdely worked something remotely like a crystal radio and crystal radios do not need an external power source. You just need a germanium diode. Moray used some special minerals to make the tubes sense the radiant event.
Yeah but they need one heck of a long antenna and solid Earth ground, and even then...
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  #124  
Old 02-28-2009, 11:38 PM
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Yes, i read a book called "free electricity from the sky" is amazing
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  #125  
Old 03-01-2009, 09:17 AM
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amigo

Quote:
Originally Posted by amigo View Post
Why is that 18-23KHz range significant?

To understand this correctly, Tesla made a dummy transmitter in that range with 50-100W power and then because of the specific frequency range of 18-23KHz he was collecting the Cosmic Rays.

I just thought that Cosmic Rays had a GHz/THz frequency, being high energy particles...

Did he also have a battery in that box and some kind of a step-up transformer (to drive those tubes he would've needed 200V or more)?
Hi amigo,
The reason I chosen the 18-23 KHz range is because of the VLF or LF Longwave transmitters, the "Marconi" station in New Brunswick, NJ with the 100 KW "spark" alternator was at 17 KHz and when they got the 200KW alternator they were at a 21.8 KHz. The "Telefunken" station in Sayville, NY with its 100 KW "spark" alternator was at 9.6 KHz with two static frequency converters for doubling at 19.2 KHz and 38.4 KHz ....... so the range of 18-23 KHz. This is because of the obvious tremendous damage over 50 years to the earth below the antenna wires that were over 100 feet above the ground, in the only two areas that these radio frequency's were used as far as I can find.

The other reason is the photograph of all the scientist in front of one of the buildings at New Brunswick, NJ ..... Albert Einstein, Nikola Tesla, Charles Proteus Steinmetz, Irving Langmuir, Saul Dushman, Richard Howland Ranger, George Ashley Campbell look at their bio's if you haven't. The fact that Nikola Tesla was 65 years old in 1921 the time of this photograph I don't think he would ever make the same mistakes he made in the past and with some of the members being half his age there, something significant was happening and not some sight seeing exhibit so to speak.

The big one for me is Albert Einstein leaving Europe and coming over to New York just to be shown a radio station or possibly something very special.


Albert Einstein - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Please note Einstein is wearing the same coat hat in hand maybe the same clothes as the "Marconi" New Brunswick, NY photograph.

As for the "Cosmic-Ray" collection maybe it's something like a bug zapper .... the cosmic-rays are attracted to the 18-23 KHz radio frequency like a magnet of sorts and the vacuum tubes of some type act as a solar cell collecting the cosmic-ray particles in a vacuum (vacuum tube) to be used in some type of circuit configuration to power a motor. The antennas at New Brunswick, NJ and Sayville, NY were over 100 feet off the ground and the soil damaged area below must be at least 20 feet wide, so if the antenna inside of the 12" x 24" x 6" box was 3" wide on 1/4" centers x 22" long to cover the 6 1/2" tall tube annode and cathode assemblies there would be about a 20 foot long antenna inside the box, 1-2 inches above the collection vacuum tubes. The other problem is the transmitter, for a 18-23 KHz frequency one Tesla made it by components available or two used a receiver signal from New Brunswick, NJ station it was in operation until 1955 or Sayville, NY station it operated until 1995 what ever works.

The good thing is if the frequencies are correct it can be duplicated easily with todays technology no problem at most any wattage. The collection of "cosmic-rays" if the only proven way to use them is in a vacuum, this would mean that vacuum tubes is possibly the way for some kind of viable usage.

The power for the box is really sketchy from none at all to a 12 volt battery ..... the car would need something for lights and other power requirements, there was no 12 volt battery cars at the time so a 6 volt battery would be the size and for power connections for a 18-23 KHz transmitter or receiver ??

Regards
Glen
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  #126  
Old 03-02-2009, 04:08 AM
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Hi FuzzyTomCat,

That's a lot of interesting deducation in your post above, kudos for that.

I was right when I posted the explanation about that photo with Einstein, Steinmetz and alleged Tesla. I knew I read something about it and that it was related to RCA. Turns out that building was the first RCA Trans-Atlantic broadcasting station, in New Brunswick NJ.

As far as Tesla being there, I gather at that time Marconi was given the priorty in the radio discovery and patents (thanks to JPM pulling some strings) and Tesla was no too happy about it. Tesla would not be there, especially with Einstein, who's Theory of Relativity he openely opposed, among other things. They simply did not see eye to eye.

Plus the whole RCA thing was Marconi/JPM deal so it would only be adding insult to the injury for Tesla. He saw trough the double-play by Marconi and J.P.Morgan and refused to help them. Steinmetz ended up setting up their generators based on Tesla's patents.

Here's a bit about mistaken identity of the person in that photo being Tesla:

Quote:
Tesla has been linked to Einstein because of a famous photo which was taken on April 23, 1921 in New Brunswick, New Jersey in celebration of a new RCA transatlantic broadcasting station that was being put in operation. Present at the event were scientists and corporate heads from RCA, GE and AT&T including Charles Steinmetz, Irving Langmuir, David Sarnoff and Albert Einstein. Standing in between Steinmetz and Einstein was a man who resembled Nikola Tesla. I, myself, thought it was Tesla, and wrote an article which included this assumption for the 1986 ITS Symposium. Margaret Cheney and also R.G. Williams in their respective biographies also did the same thing.

After conferring with Leland Anderson and searching back to original sources which included the an article in the New York Herald, and the original caption for the photo, it has been determined that the man standing between Einsten and Steinmetz was one John Carson, who was an engineer for AT&T. This photo has also been doctored to air-brush out all individuals except for Einstein and Steinmetz by the GE people who use it to imply a special relationship between Steinmetz and Einstein.

From: Tesla's "Death Ray" machine
I'm still trying to understand this 18-23KHz range and how it could be utilized with modern tech.

Rather than using vacuum tubes and long stretches of wire, couldn't we excite plasma in an evacuated tube, and amplitude modulate some signal at 18-23KHz range to start the process? But then what, what should happen next, how does one collect the Cosmic Rays that would be attracted to this emission?
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  #127  
Old 03-02-2009, 07:26 AM
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amigo

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Originally Posted by amigo View Post
Hi FuzzyTomCat,

That's a lot of interesting deducation in your post above, kudos for that.

I was right when I posted the explanation about that photo with Einstein, Steinmetz and alleged Tesla. I knew I read something about it and that it was related to RCA. Turns out that building was the first RCA Trans-Atlantic broadcasting station, in New Brunswick NJ.

As far as Tesla being there, I gather at that time Marconi was given the priorty in the radio discovery and patents (thanks to JPM pulling some strings) and Tesla was no too happy about it. Tesla would not be there, especially with Einstein, who's Theory of Relativity he openely opposed, among other things. They simply did not see eye to eye.

Plus the whole RCA thing was Marconi/JPM deal so it would only be adding insult to the injury for Tesla. He saw trough the double-play by Marconi and J.P.Morgan and refused to help them. Steinmetz ended up setting up their generators based on Tesla's patents.

Here's a bit about mistaken identity of the person in that photo being Tesla:

I'm still trying to understand this 18-23KHz range and how it could be utilized with modern tech.

Rather than using vacuum tubes and long stretches of wire, couldn't we excite plasma in an evacuated tube, and amplitude modulate some signal at 18-23KHz range to start the process? But then what, what should happen next, how does one collect the Cosmic Rays that would be attracted to this emission?
Hi amigo,
Thanks for the kind comments, and I think this is sill a big work in action for us all but I think we are getting closer.

The photograph I have seen the same thing with the snippits from the photo here and there also about Nikola Tesla's Height being up to 6 foot 7 inches. I always go back to this other famous photograph of the Stubblefield "NBS Wireless Telephone Demonstration" in Philadelphia, Belmont Park in 1902, he is number 20 this is nineteen years earlier but it looks like the same man in both photos.



http://smart90.com/ImagesStub/Stubbl...aGroup665w.jpg
Yes90 tviNews Internet 100g Soul Find A. Frederick Collins - Nathan Stubblefield Wireless Radio Telephone / NBS100 / NBS100 TELECOM STUDY - "J" PCI Study "Crossed Lines - 2005 - Regulatory Missteps / Regulatory Seizure of Telcom Property / Smart90, s

As for the 18-23 KHz figure I'm still working on this theory if it leads me anywhere here is some of the thinks I'm looking at thanks to Rick's mentioning of "Brookhaven National Laboratory" in New York and cosmic rays the research done there is in a vacuum .... go figure

Best
Glen
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  #128  
Old 03-03-2009, 12:34 AM
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All,
I would recommend you to check patent #454622 by Tesla.
I do believe that this patent hiding more than just a simple lamp. And check recommended frequency for it.
Why did Tesla invent something that nobody could use unless he knew the way to provide energy required by this lamp in global scale?
Did anybody was able to repeat this patent?
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  #129  
Old 03-03-2009, 09:06 AM
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Mike

Quote:
Originally Posted by mlurye View Post
All,
I would recommend you to check patent #454622 by Tesla.
I do believe that this patent hiding more than just a simple lamp. And check recommended frequency for it.
Why did Tesla invent something that nobody could use unless he knew the way to provide energy required by this lamp in global scale?
Did anybody was able to repeat this patent?
Hi Mike,

That patent you found of Tesla's Is really something, excellent find. I have seen the wiring diagram at Colorado Springs Notes - Introduction but didn't pay much attention to it until now, a mistake it appears.

NIKOLA TESLA - Google Patents

"System Of Electrical Lighting" Patent No. 454,622 N. Tesla
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lines 44-49
As an instance of what I regard as the lowest practicable limits I would state that I have obtained fairly good results by a frequency as low as fifteen thousand to twenty thousand per second and a potential of about twenty thousand volts.

Lines 62-71
The carrying out of this invention and the full realization of the conditions necessary to the attainment of the desired results involve, first, a novel method of and apparatus for producing the currents or electrical effects of the character described; second, a novel method of utilizing and applying the same for the production of light, and, third, a new form of translating device or light-giving appliance.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

The patent is complex in nature hard to read in a scene but significant to say the least the above two excerpts are only a few of many in this curious document of a "multi" use vacuum tube.

Humm ..... ether, cosmic-rays, vacuum tubes and KHz frequencies sounds like a very interesting mix .....

Regards,
Glen
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  #130  
Old 03-03-2009, 02:21 PM
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Glen,
Truly speaking it is not complex at all. And anybody can build it reasonably cheap. I did put it together quickly.
And here are a couple of observations:
It's safe to touch output wires.
Neon light connected to the output glowing bright.
But I was unable to light incandescent bulb And I do believe I can do some more tune ups to try to make it work.
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  #131  
Old 03-03-2009, 04:29 PM
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Hello mlurye,

Can you show a shematic diagram and photo of your experiment? Sounds very interesting.

Rick
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  #132  
Old 03-03-2009, 04:40 PM
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In order to put a incandescent lamp maybe you should put a capacitor in the output in parallel with the lamp.
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  #133  
Old 03-03-2009, 05:37 PM
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Here Tesla is talking about the harnessing of cosmic rays and powering a motor that delivers more energy than the input

Nikola Tesla : Tesla Cosmic Ray Motor May Transmit Power 'Round Earth

Here is in the news from 2006
A building lighted by cosmic rays | News Blog - CNET News
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  #134  
Old 03-03-2009, 07:55 PM
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Reply to darkwizard:

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkwizard View Post
Here Tesla is talking about the harnessing of cosmic rays and powering a motor that delivers more energy than the input

Nikola Tesla : Tesla Cosmic Ray Motor May Transmit Power 'Round Earth

Here is in the news from 2006
A building lighted by cosmic rays | News Blog - CNET News
Yes, that is Tesla's announcement that I was referring to back in post #112.

I remember seeing this building shown recently on TV, and I think it was in a public broadcasting science documentary. It showed a randomly pulsating effect of blue lighting. While the person who designed this novel illumination system uses it purely as an art form, it certainly does does demonstrate that cosmic ray showers can be effectively utilized. When a cosmic ray particle enters Earth's atmospere, it collides with oxygen and nitrogen molecules and bursts into billions of smaller particles which result in a "shower." The separation angle of these smaller particles from the original particle is said to be only about 1% from the point of impact to the Earth's surface. That isn't much, but of course it still covers a fairly wide area due to the distance of travel. Thus far, smaller passive collectors at individual sites, such as used in the California Schools Project [ CHICOS - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ] and elsewhere, appear to capture a very limited number of particles. As I see it, in order to utilize the cosmic rays effectively for a useful purpose at any one pinpointed given geographic location - either stationary or mobile - it seems that you would somehow either have to use a massive collector or a means of attracting and reconcentrating the diffused cosmic particles - a kind of cosmic ray particle lightning rod, so to speak.

Rick
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  #135  
Old 03-03-2009, 11:57 PM
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Here is schema, it is similar to one that I was using to drive motor Gray Tube Replication.
Capacitance and spark gap should be tuned in order to achieve desired frequency.
Capacitor next to the bulb actually is aluminum foil on top of plastic wrap around bulb base.
Metal plate at the bottom, need to think about that (Tesla was covering walls with special paint or metal sheets) may be variable capacitance.
Second coil - disassemble ignition coil and remove core. Separate coils by cutting HV wire connected with LV wire.
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  #136  
Old 03-04-2009, 02:34 AM
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Quote:
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But I was unable to light incandescent bulb And I do believe I can do some more tune ups to try to make it work.
Incandescent and fluorescent, eh?

YouTube - Spatial Energy Coherence, Cool White #6
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  #137  
Old 03-04-2009, 05:18 AM
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Nikola Tesla - Patent No. 454,622

Hi All,
After reading the "System of Electric Lighting" Patent No. 454.622 the wiring diagram Fig.1 appears to be several wiring diagrams into one, reading closely the specifications, using these constants.

a = spark gap
C = capacitor
W = antenna, wall, box enclosure, frame
G = power providing source or power consuming load
Ground = earth or chassis

Figure 2 = lamp RF or HV
Figure 3 = collector RF or ether "cosmic-ray"

Figure 2 and 3 =
15-20 KHz frequency
20,000 volts

I'm not sure but these are the five wiring diagrams I came up with for each of the device usages in the specifications in the patent, depending on how they are connected and to what.







Anyone have any comments or want to mark-up one of the wiring diagram figures go ahead ....please do.

Glen
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  #138  
Old 03-04-2009, 10:39 AM
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amigo

Quote:
Originally Posted by amigo View Post
Here's a bit about mistaken identity of the person in that photo being Tesla:

Quote:

Tesla has been linked to Einstein because of a famous photo which was taken on April 23, 1921 in New Brunswick, New Jersey in celebration of a new RCA transatlantic broadcasting station that was being put in operation. Present at the event were scientists and corporate heads from RCA, GE and AT&T including Charles Steinmetz, Irving Langmuir, David Sarnoff and Albert Einstein. Standing in between Steinmetz and Einstein was a man who resembled Nikola Tesla. I, myself, thought it was Tesla, and wrote an article which included this assumption for the 1986 ITS Symposium. Margaret Cheney and also R.G. Williams in their respective biographies also did the same thing.

After conferring with Leland Anderson and searching back to original sources which included the an article in the New York Herald, and the original caption for the photo, it has been determined that the man standing between Einsten and Steinmetz was one John Carson, who was an engineer for AT&T. This photo has also been doctored to air-brush out all individuals except for Einstein and Steinmetz by the GE people who use it to imply a special relationship between Steinmetz and Einstein.
Hey amigo,

The first thing is to remember that the Marconi "New Brunswick, NJ" radio station "Somerset" was

built in 1913
Feb 9, 1917 seized by the US Government and operated by the US Navy until 1921 (Nikola Tesla worked for the US Navy 1917-1921)
1921 station went to RCA a subsiderary of General Electric (PHOTO)
1952 13 antennas demolished
2004 all but one building left on the 160 acre parcel with a 100 foot Raritan River frontage

There are some other items that may dispute writer and publisher Leland Andersons searching and using a referred "undated" article from the New York Herald and not the New York Times or using any other sources. There are several other web sites including "Wikipedia" Marconi Station - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia photograph that has not been changed or updated with this information from Leland Anderson.

Tesla biography - Man Out of Time

PLASMA INTERNATIONAL - NIKOLA TESLA - MASTER OF LIGHTING

Nikola Tesla - the man who electrified the world!!

Here are some additional photographs of Nikola Tesla -




And here is some additional information -

Tesla's "Black Box"

Quote:

But later years turned a kindlier edge toward him. Long after his principle foe had died, other sought him out. Employed by the Rockefellers in their RCA venture, Tesla was given the task of restructuring the now failing Marconi System. David Sarnoff did not permit Tesla the dignity of working under his own name!

While working for RCA under the name "Terbo", his mother's maiden name,


And the person that Leland Anderson would like us to believe these photos are is John Carson one of the Carson twins John Renshaw Carson - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia from Princeston University John and Robb Carson Letters, 1903-1908: Finding Aid



I just don't think Leland Anderson is correct.

Regards
Glen
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  #139  
Old 03-05-2009, 02:14 AM
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Hey FuzzyTomCat,

I really can not say for sure. Besides you appear to have done far more research and contemplating about this than me, so I'll just go with what you wrote here instead of my original assumption.

Thanks.
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  #140  
Old 03-05-2009, 10:03 AM
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1920 photo of Tesla

Hey Glen, here's another photo of Tesla, taken in 1920

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  #141  
Old 03-06-2009, 09:40 AM
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Hey Glen, here's another photo of Tesla, taken in 1920

Hi Rick,
I haven't been able to see you images for some time ... ever since the Microsoft problem with a mass publication on the DNS mandatory patch several months ago. I was one of the first million computers that got infected with really good firewalls and anti virus software that didn't stop the problem and it spread to my other networked computers, and the nice people in India that are the outsource for Microsoft their help made things much worse I was a "genni pig" for them it appears. I am to receive a CD in the mail with SP3 and the patches to repair my Windows but haven't got it yet, so it's "Google Chrome" because IE, Update, Live and Download from Microsoft don't work right or at all. (I'm waiting for Windows 7 .... maybe)

I have to look at someone else's computer so please bear with me for a few days .....

Here is another photo I found not sure what time frame but it sure looks as if Nikola Tesla is not 6 foot 7 inches in this photograph also as a newspaper reports says. I think he's around six foot maybe six foot one inches at most.


By chance is your photograph one of the "portraits" circa 1920 at this site ?
Tesla appears to be graying ... it could be in the late 1920's in that photograph if it's the one your referring to.
TWP Nikola Tesla Photo Archive

The other thing I found was "Vacuum Tube" manuals from Telefunken and RCA from 1930, 1931 and 1932 with illustrations and all tubes listed that were manufactured, the problem is the Telefunken manual is in German. (Good thing there's Language Tools )

http://63.227.91.114/Common/Manuals/Tube_Manuals.php

http://63.227.91.114/Common/Manuals/...%201930-31.pdf Telefunken Tube Manual
http://63.227.91.114/Common/Manuals/...-10%201933.pdf RCA Tube Manual
http://63.227.91.114/Common/Manuals/.../WE%201933.pdf Western Electric
http://63.227.91.114/Common/Manuals/...eur%201934.pdf RCA de forest Transmitting

Glen
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  #142  
Old 03-06-2009, 10:15 AM
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1931 Pierce Arrow

Hey Rick an All,

The other thing I found out is the Pierce Arrow used 6 volt head lamps it had a 6 volt generator "Owen Dyneto" # CO 1236 with seperate voltage regulator the V8 used a Owens Dyneto #DI-1313 starter and the V12 used a Owens Dyneto #DI-1314 both 6 volt and the in dash radio is also a 6 volt. There was a report of a 12-volt Willard battery installed in the car, this would be difficult to change over the entire car to 12 volt, including the 6 volt radio and clock.



Please note the dash "no" glove box as some reports say Tesla mounted some controls in.

And controlling interest in Pierce Arrow was Studebaker from 1929 who authorized the car for the modifications and who really got the car ......

Does anyone have more information to add or change ?

Glen
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  #143  
Old 03-07-2009, 12:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FuzzyTomCat View Post
By chance is your photograph one of the "portraits" circa 1920 at this site ?
Tesla appears to be graying ... it could be in the late 1920's in that photograph if it's the one your referring to.
TWP Nikola Tesla Photo Archive
Hi Glen,

Yes, the fourth photo in the archive link is the same as the one I showed, except that my photo was quite large.

Regarding the Pierce Arrow, Tesla could have worked out just about any battery setup that he desired. There was plenty of room under the hood, and in the trunk, in those days, so he could have installed several batteries to have whatever voltage and overall capacity that he felt was necessary.

Rick
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  #144  
Old 03-07-2009, 01:16 AM
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Rick

Quote:
Originally Posted by rickoff View Post
Hi Glen,

Yes, the fourth photo in the archive link is the same as the one I showed, except that my photo was quite large.

Regarding the Pierce Arrow, Tesla could have worked out just about any battery setup that he desired. There was plenty of room under the hood, and in the trunk, in those days, so he could have installed several batteries to have whatever voltage and overall capacity that he felt was necessary.

Rick
Hi Rick,
I thought that may be the photograph you were thinking about here is a match for it in the Tesla "look".



On the Pierce Arrow your correct he could have had anything he wanted made I guess my point being, to change over the lights, gauges, clock and radio from a 6 volt standard car to a 12 volt not been made model would be quit an expense over and above. This is a time when as you know Tesla was not rich and getting older, Pierce Arrow was loosing money and had sold controlling interest to Studebaker and Westinghouse was still recovering from the depression ..... just makes me wonder what happened.

Best Regards,
Glen
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Old 03-07-2009, 07:48 AM
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Right, Glen. There would have been no point in changing out all the 6 volt system accessories in the 1933 Pierce Arrow. The power supply to the electric motor (or cosmic ray motor), however, could have been whatever was needed. It seems that, to us, this will remain a mystery. Tesla did allude to collecting highly charged particles from the atmospere in a condenser, so perhaps a bank of large condensers was used in the Pierce Arrow. I think that he also learned that the high energy ultraviolet ionization path that he projected from the top of the Wardenclyffe tower was very useful for collecting and concentrating cosmic rays. Of course the tower was demolished in 1917, so it did not play a part in the Pierce Arrow experiment. Perhaps Tesla, sensing an impending end to his Wardenclyffe project, secretly removed the ultraviolet beam apparatus, and other essential parts from the installation, and reinstalled them elsewhere. And Lee Deforest, who is said to have worked on the Pierce Arrow project with Tesla, probably had some fairly good resources of his own.
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Old 03-07-2009, 01:25 PM
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Aromaz Aromaz is offline
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Did anyone ever consider that those two rods might not be for collecting from atmosphere, but that they might in fact have been Radium charged/coated/alloy? Ah, yes - but Tesla had a meeting with Marie Curie and he has been quite interested in the element called Radium since.

TESLA " .....to produce radium in unlimited quantity for $1 a pound were announced by Dr. Nikola Tesla yesterday at a luncheon on his eighty-first birthday ......" or something similar?

See 1936 here:
HISTORY OF THE RADIUM LEAGUE

In this one search "RADIUM"
Tesla Technology Series

and Tesla on 76th birthday:
"All of my investigations seem to point to the conclusion that they are small particles (Cosmic radiation), each carrying so small a charge that we are justified in calling them neutrons. They move with great velocity, exceeding that of light. More than 25 years ago I began my efforts to harness the cosmic rays and I can now state that I have succeeded in operating a motive device by means of them."

I was able to prevail upon Dr. Tesla to give me some idea of the principle upon which his cosmic ray motor works.

"I will tell you in the most general way," he said. "The cosmic ray ionizes the air, setting free many charges - ions and electrons. These charges are captured in a condenser which is made to discharge through the circuit of the motor."

For those that does not see the relevance of this last statement: It is basically the effect of a neutron absorbed by a atom - change of isotope - Beta+ and also relevant for formation of Radium E from Bismuth.
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Old 03-07-2009, 10:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aromaz View Post
Did anyone ever consider that those two rods might not be for collecting from atmosphere.....,
What two rods are you referring to, Aromaz?
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Old 03-08-2009, 03:08 PM
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What two rods are you referring to, Aromaz?
It was written that when Tesla did that electric car test, he brought a "black box" with him, wired it up to the car, then inserted two rods into the box.

I think it has always been assumed that those rods could've been ferrite, or perhaps served as some antenna. But I do not ever recall reading about the idea that rods might be radioactive source and that the "black box" was a nuclear battery...which then raises more questions. (as if we did not have many already )
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Old 03-08-2009, 08:06 PM
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amigo

Quote:
Originally Posted by amigo View Post
It was written that when Tesla did that electric car test, he brought a "black box" with him, wired it up to the car, then inserted two rods into the box.

I think it has always been assumed that those rods could've been ferrite, or perhaps served as some antenna. But I do not ever recall reading about the idea that rods might be radioactive source and that the "black box" was a nuclear battery...which then raises more questions. (as if we did not have many already )
Hi amigo,
I always assumed that these rods were part of the circuit, if you look at my post #137 discussing patent 454,622 Fig. 1 A thru E that Tesla on most all of his "tesla coil" type devices had a "Spark Gap" this is the component I'm sure your aware of "a" on the schematic. I think the reason for the exposure was a way for clearing the ionized air inside of the black box and to turn the device off safely.

I personally like Fig. 1B schematic for the possible powering of the 1931 Pierce Arrow -

Patent Details (page 3) -

21 In Fig. 3, & is a rarefied or exhausted glass globe or receiver, in which is a body of carbon or other suitable conductor e. To this body is connected a metallic conductor/,

25 which passes through and is sealed in the glass wall of the globe, outside of which it is united to a copper or other wire g, by means of which it is to be electrically connected to one pole or terminal of the source of current.

30 Outside of the globe the conducting-wires are protected by a coating of insulation 7?, of any suitable kind, and inside tlie globe the supporting-wire is inclosed in and insulated by a tube or coating k of a refractory insulating

35 substance, such as pipe-clay or the like. A reflecting-plate I is shown applied to the outside of the globe &. This form of lamp is a type of those designed for direct electrical connection with one terminal of the source

40 of current; but, as above stated, there need not be a direct connection, for the carbon or other illuminating body may be rendered luminous by inductive action of the current thereon, and this may be brought about in several ways.

60 Fig. 3, which is. coated in like manner with a refractory insulating material 7c. The neck of the globe fits into a socket composed of an insulating tube or cylinder^, with a more or less complete metallic lining s, electrically

65 connected by a metallic head or plate r with a conductor g, that is to be attached -to one pole of the source of current. The metallic lining s and the sheet m thus compose the plates or armatures of a condenser.

----------------------------------------------------------------------

The preferred form of lamp for this purpose, however, is shown in Fig, 2. In this figure the globe b is formed with a cylindrical neck, within which is a tube or sheet in of conducting material on the side and

50 over the end of a cylinder or plug n of any suitable insulating material. The lower edges of this tube are in electrical contact with a metallic plate o, secured to the cylinder n, all the exposed surfaces of such plate and of the

55 other conductors being carefully coated and protected by insulation. The light-giving body e, in this case a straight-stem of carbon, is electrically connected with the said plate.. by a wire or conductor similar to the wire/,

----------------------------------------------------------------------

70 This invention is not limited to the special means described for producing the results hereinabove set forth, for it will be seen that various plans and means of producing currents of very high frequency are known, and also means for producing very high potentials; but I have only described herein certain ways in which I have practically carried out the invention.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

As you may be able to tell there is a huge difference between Fig. 2 and Fig. 3 descriptions, construction and usages, "IF" using Fig. 3 to supply power to "G" a 2-phase tesla poly-phase motor using "W" as the black box inside as a 15-20KHz frequency resonator for possible "cosmic ray" collections. I'm still in thought mode here ...... most of the devices and information prior to March 1895 were destroyed in the questionable fire Nikola Tesla had, this would be one of them.

Your or anyones thoughts ???

Best regards,
Glen
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Old 03-08-2009, 10:26 PM
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amigo amigo is offline
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Hi FuzzyTomCat,

To be honest I never considered those rods to be anything but part of the circuit either. But also I never considered them to potentially be radioactive either, and if they were, that brings more interesting questions to mind.

I am not too convinced that they were used as a spark gap, especailly that he inserted them after the fact (once wiring the box). Tesla spent decades pefecting spark gaps of all kinds and had long surpassed the air gap as an ideal source of circuit interruptions.

Because this anecdotal story was from the '30s, he had tubes available to him and so could've devised a specialized spark gap in one of those tubes inside the "black box", voiding the need for an external spark gap.

But, if the rods were radioactive(-ly coated) in some way (and we also know several of his contemporaries at that time were experimenting with radioactive excitations) - perhaps as a source of beta particles - he could've just inserted them into air coils and draw some initial power from that circuit, just as modern nuclear batteries do.

Let's not forget that radioactive elements and ores were not controlled substances back then and could be procured easily (as if Tesla ever had issues procuring even exotic stuff).

Just thinkin' outloud here...
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