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Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

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  #2731  
Old 12-19-2012, 10:08 PM
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lamare lamare is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lamare View Post

The polarization of a dielectric is a very interesting effect:

Dielectric - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Quote:
A dielectric is an electrical insulator that can be polarized by an applied electric field. When a dielectric is placed in an electric field, electric charges do not flow through the material as they do in a conductor, but only slightly shift from their average equilibrium positions causing dielectric polarization.

[...]

When the electric field is removed the atom returns to its original state. The time required to do so is the so-called relaxation time; an exponential decay.

[...]

The relationship between the electric field E and the dipole moment M gives rise to the behavior of the dielectric, which, for a given material, can be characterized by the function F defined by the equation:

M = F(E).

[...]

Dielectric relaxation is the momentary delay (or lag) in the dielectric constant of a material. This is usually caused by the delay in molecular polarization[disambiguation needed] with respect to a changing electric field in a dielectric medium (e.g. inside capacitors or between two large conducting surfaces). Dielectric relaxation in changing electric fields could be considered analogous to hysteresis in changing magnetic fields (for inductors or transformers).


So, it appears that when you apply a very strong electric field, which apparantly can be in the shape of a sharp rising pulse (large dE/dt) propagating trough your dielectric (a longitudinal shockwave), you get a very strong polarization. Because there is a relaxation effect, the polarization does not go away instantly and it appears a dielectric can remain polarized for a considerable time. Bedini reported "cold boiling" lead batteries that kept on boiling for up to half an hour after removing the charger.

To sum this up:

What you can do with a londitudinal shock wave in the shape of a sharp rising edge (large dE/dt) and a soft dropping falling edge is to super-polarize a dielectric, such that it keeps it's polarization for a considerable time, depending on the applied voltage, etc.

When you put such a polarized dielectric in between capacitor plates, you can get an effect whereby capacitors spontaneously recharge after having been shortcutted. This has been observed with electrolytic capacitors, whereby you have a very thin layer of aluminum oxide as your dielectric on one of the capacitor plates. This is a very similar construction as with a lead-acid battery, especially in the old days.

In other words: you can super-polarize a dielectric layer within both an electrolytic capacitor as well as a lead-acid battery, which would result as the cap/battery being observed as having been charged.

Just as the MIT dissectible Leyden jar, whereby the energy is "stored" in the dielectric...

Seems like a perfect idea for making long-lasting batteries for mobile phones.

So, I hereby claim to have invented a long-lasting battery principle for portable purposes and donate this to the public domain.

Namaste!

-- Arend --

Last edited by lamare; 12-20-2012 at 08:11 AM. Reason: re-added quote from WP
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  #2732  
Old 12-28-2012, 03:22 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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An Organic Dielectrric storage device for a Mobile Phone

Dear Arend,

We both might be a little late with this dielectric thing. I have a childhood friend who has developed a capacitor made from an eggplant. The active element is about 0.05" thick and 2" in diameter grown on a piece of 1/4" Plexiglas. This organic component has been 3rd party tested with some expensive analysis equipment and shown to have a capacity of 10 Farads-- Yes, that is 10 full Farads at 10 volts. The inventor claims that he can now make devices that go up to 50 WVDC at even higher capacities, but is running short of eggplants to harvest.

A component like this would certainly allow for some longer running times. I calculate that a 20 F device charged to 50 Volts would store 25K Joules. I think that a high end cell phone battery is about 3V at 1 A-hr (I could be way off on this) and that is about 11K Joules. This new component would be about 25% or less of the present volume used today which would allow for 4X more energy storage.

I hope he can get this device to market.

Mark McKay
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  #2733  
Old 01-04-2013, 02:19 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Pulse Forming Networks with Fast Fall Times

Dear All,

Does anyone have technical design information on how to build/modify a 5 kV PFN with a fall time of around 10 nS?

I have already studied the MIT Volume #5 "Pulse Generators" chapters on PFN's, but their focus is on fast rise times.

I have done a little internet research and found one article in a technical subscription service that discusses a fast fall time topology. It is interesting but it is strikingly similiar to the Gray schematic for the CEST circuit. It uses a spark gap and a delay line.

Powells Technical Book Store doesn't have a single book on the subject.

Mark McKay.

P.S. Does anybody have an idea as to what the previous post is about concerning some kind of orange Tee-Shirt?
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  #2734  
Old 01-05-2013, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Spokane1 View Post
Why did Gray make such a big deal of using Delrin as the core for his popping coil demonstrations in 1986? He certainly didn't think of this idea on his own. Marvin Cole gave him that concept. So why was Cole pulsing blocks of Delrin with magnetic coils? It certainly wan't to observe the effects of a classical mass driver idea.

Consider the work of T.T. Browne and his discovery with the coupling of gravity with high voltage using a dielectric mass as the conversion medium. Well, the Gray technology works something like that except both HV and pulsed magnetic fields are applied (at right angles) to a dielectric to get the anomalous "something". It appears that the actual device was the "Floating Flux Field" in the early machines. Hackenberger got wise and was able to make this conversion element smaller and hide it in the cans that were held out to be "Capacitors" in the EMA6 engine. He was also able to eleminate the need of having the FFF wrapped around the engine case.

Interestingly, Stan Meyer also used delrin, according to this document:

http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Ravi%20Cell.pdf

Quote:
In one of Stan’s patents he talked about using polyoxymethylene (Delrin) which has a high dielectric constant. He used Delrin on the outside of the outer pipe and the inside of the inner pipe to contain the electron leakage. The barrier formed by the conditioning coating has a comparatively lesser dielectric constant than the Derlin material thickness used.
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  #2735  
Old 01-07-2013, 07:15 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Delrin in similiar devices

Dear arend,

Good observation.

Mark Mckay
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  #2736  
Old 01-19-2013, 04:40 AM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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pulse generator progress

Dear Mr. McKay, how is the progress of building the pulse generator ? By the way do you remember that in the book "Free Energy & Cold Electricity" Mr. Lindemann noticed the similarities of CSET & Tesla coil ? I look at EMA4 power supply schematic, and frankly it is more similar to Tesla coil circuit than CSET. What do you think of this ?

Wicaksono
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  #2737  
Old 01-20-2013, 03:56 AM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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the story of galvanized nail spark gap

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Nat keep working on that Pyrolized Carbon idea. I think the negative resistance process hold some keys in this technology development. When you get tired of carbon take a look at Zinc. This also has negative resistance properties. I myslef had a very interesting experiance when I built a Tesla Coil that used 4" galvanized nails for the spark gap - but that's another story.

Mark McKay
Dear Mr. McKay, what is the complete story of this ?

Wicaksono
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  #2738  
Old 01-22-2013, 12:05 AM
mbrownn mbrownn is offline
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I used to sell engineering plastics including Delrin. The type we sold was black and had the same claimed properties as the others but I do know the color was carbon black. To me this inclusion of carbon must change its electrical properties even if it does not show up until we reach high voltages. What Delrin did the others use?
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  #2739  
Old 01-22-2013, 07:34 AM
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There may be more to the carbon in Gray's tube. Please take a look.

The High Power VSG v4.1 by JL Naudin - February 20, 2005 Thanks.
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  #2740  
Old 01-22-2013, 09:18 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Progress

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Originally Posted by Wicaksono View Post
Dear Mr. McKay, how is the progress of building the pulse generator ? By the way do you remember that in the book "Free Energy & Cold Electricity" Mr. Lindemann noticed the similarities of CSET & Tesla coil ? I look at EMA4 power supply schematic, and frankly it is more similar to Tesla coil circuit than CSET. What do you think of this ?

Wicaksono
Dear Wicaksono,

Thanks for asking. I'm in the process of constructing test circuit #123. This evening I need to dig through the snow and ice at the barns and see if I have two more .05 uF 5000 WVDC capacitors to finish off a five stage pulse forming network. Right now I'm attempting to measure the dynamic resistance of a spark/arc under conditions similiar to what has been doisclosed from the Gray history. This parameter is important because it determines the design of the method used to provide the current pulses in the Gray technology.

I certainly remember Peter's book "The Cold Energy Secrets of Cold Electricity" I have two copies on my priority book shelf.

The similiarities of the CESET and Dr. Tesla's work has not been lost on anyone who has dug into this technology. The problem with the CESET circuit is that not all of the components used were disclosed.

I agree with you that the power supply circuit dislosed in the 1973 Pulse Engine patent is quit a bit different than the power supply described in the 1986 CSET patent. But, as John Bedini showed that same 1986 circuit was being bench tested in 1973. I really doublt that anyone who knew what was goin on (and it certainly wasn't Gray) would be wasting thier time on such a radical topology shift unless it had been well tested and contained the same "Kernal" of operation that made the EMA4 work.

It appears that the fundamental Free Energy circuit changed about three times in 10 years. This makes reverse engineering hard.

1) The first one was with the stretched arcs in the opposing magnetic fields inside the engine. It worked but was complex, hard to maintain, and bulky. The active iron/dielectric was in the FFF.

2) The second generation was the CEST approach. It worked good on the bench but failed in higher power applications.

3) The last and most refined variation was done with Thyratrons, Ignitrons, and a vacuum tube blocking oscillator. Some of this remains with the Purple Motor. The active iron/dielectric was probably hid inside a can that looked like a large capacitor.

All of this is Tesla technology, but the master himself didn't disclose all of the delaits needed to bring his equimpent to full potential.

Mark McKay
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  #2741  
Old 01-22-2013, 09:41 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Wild Tesla Coil

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Originally Posted by Wicaksono View Post
Dear Mr. McKay, what is the complete story of this ?

Wicaksono
Dear Wicaksono,

I was building a Tesla Coil in 1980 for a carnival Fun House following the 1964Popular Electronics plans. It had a secondary 4" diameter x 48" long. I was using a sheet of 1/4" plate glass from a pin ball machine and aluminum foil as a capacitor. The NST was 15KV at 60mA. The primary was about 28 turns of neon conductor around a 5 gal plastic bucket. The spark gap was made from 4" galvanized box nailes (thin). I didn't have any Terry filter, EMS, or other filtering. The base of the secondary was connected to the case of the NST (Big Mistake). The spark gap electrodes (the nails) were set parallel to each other about 1/2" apart. The discharges were loud, intermittant and stacco like.

It operated for about 10 minutes before the NST blew. During that time every metal object in the shop was emitting blue arcs to what ever surface it could find. Tools on the shelf and on the counter were arcing to each other. Even a nail that was in the plywood wall was sending out spider web thin arcs that didn't connect to another object. In the dark there were at least 100 blue arcs taking place all at the same time at various places in the shop. Fortunatly there were no electronics at this same location.

At the time I figure this is what Tesla Coils do and decided against making repairs since I was planning to use computer chip sound sources in the Fun House as well. The Tesla Coil I thought would destroy these devices.

It was about 10 years later that I learned that this is not a common feature of Tesla Coil operation.

I still don't know what was going on there. I have been reluctant to follow up due to the high price of NST's and the dangers of repeating the faulty connection to the case of the NST which is the center tap for the NST secondary.

I have thought that the zinc electrodes had something to do with the anomalous action.

Mark McKay
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  #2742  
Old 01-22-2013, 09:50 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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The kind of Delrin that Gray Used

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I used to sell engineering plastics including Delrin. The type we sold was black and had the same claimed properties as the others but I do know the color was carbon black. To me this inclusion of carbon must change its electrical properties even if it does not show up until we reach high voltages. What Delrin did the others use?
Dear Mr. Brown,

I know there are many formulations for DuPont Delrin, what ever Gray used it was white as seen in the EMA4 stator photos and in his popping coil demonstrations.

That doesn't tells us much. I know that in other plastic formulations graphite is added for friction reduction, but that also messes up the HV resistance.

According to my "Plastics Engineering Reference Handbook" (1981) Delrin has the highest HV surface resistance of any of the polymers developed to that time.

I'm sure that there are ways to make the Delrin black for cosmetic reasons that will not impact its HV properties, but I'm not going to risk it becasue of the high price of that stuff. The natural version is plentiful and is avaliable from my local plastic dealer.

Mark McKay
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  #2743  
Old 01-22-2013, 10:09 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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There may be more to the carbon in Gray's tube. Please take a look.

The High Power VSG v4.1 by JL Naudin - February 20, 2005 Thanks.
Dear rosehillworks,

When Mr. Naudin did that experiment he overlooked the increasing voltage drop across his arc as he increased the fixed distance. Without this data consideration all of the published numbers are meaningless and most likley in error.

I was hoping that this experiment could be redone since he had all the apparatus hardware already built, but it never happened. (That I know of)

If this circuit was indeed OU, as the presentation suggested, then it would have been commercialized by 2006.

I really don't know what the real story was behind that whole well done presentation. There was no folow up that I ever ran across, but then again I don't get out often.

Never the less carbon arcs are still important, yet they don't appear directly in the Gray technology. So far the Bedini Field Notes report that the electrode material was silver. The carbon was assumed to function as a high current low value resistor. In the patent documents it is shown as a variable resistor. Why it is located inside the CEST enclosure is still a mystery.

I think the carbon resistor was intended to balance the load impedance (less than 10 Ohms) of his arc with the impedance of his Pulse Forming Network (PFN) that was hidden in his storage capacitor. In my SPICE IV simulations if the load impedance varies by 10% the energy delivered from the PFN can degrade 30%. It also really messes up the fall time badly. In my opinion, and what John Bedini has already shown, it is the fall time across the high voltage electrode in the CSET that is important. I'm still not sure just how long the current pulse needs to be before the arc resistance stabalized, but it seems to be more than 3 uS. Next I need to find out just how much current and how fast the fall time needs to be.

Mark Mckay
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  #2744  
Old 01-22-2013, 11:14 PM
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super corona dope and plastidip

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Originally Posted by Spokane1 View Post
I'm sure that there are ways to make the Delrin black for cosmetic reasons that will not impact its HV properties, but I'm not going to risk it becasue of the high price of that stuff. The natural version is plentiful and is avaliable from my local plastic dealer.
Mark,

You probably already know about corona dope, but I'll mention it anyway - good stuff.

If you want to increase the dielectric value of the plastic you're getting, you can always paint on some Super Corona Dope. It's a xylene based dielectric and is fairly inexpensive. It resists 4000v per mil. I used it on some metal plates for a Tay Hee Han electrostatic water separation experiment and I put on about 1mm per place for a total of 80,000v resistance. If you put it on something you can actually bake, it gets better.

I have a can with quite a bit left in it if you want to experiment with it before buying any if it is even useful to you. Feel free to call if you want to stop by and pick it up. I'm at a new place - not too far from where I used to be - near the 5 mile shopping center.

With the Stan Meyer experiments, I was going to encase the outer tube of single tube sets in Plastidip, which is a really good dielectric and of course it will form to whatever shape you want. The company will provide dielectric info on Plastidip if requested.
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  #2745  
Old 01-23-2013, 01:49 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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The Active Dielectric

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Mark,

You probably already know about corona dope, but I'll mention it anyway - good stuff.
Dear Aaron,

The product that you recommend certainly has its place in our kind of work, but there may be a misscommunication (or oversight) on my part about the speculated purpose of the Delrin in the first place. It certainly is useful as a HV insulator that is machineable, but that is not its purpose in the Gray technology.

I maintain, from historical observation, that there was an active dielectric than when properly pulsed produced an electrostatic phenomena that could be harvested into a classical capacitor. It is speculated that this something is the Radient Energy that we have been looking for all these years.

Dr. Tesla filled his table top oscillators with an electret compount made from rosin, beeswax and carnuba wax. This material was not just for HV insulation. It served a function way beyond that, there were a number of materials that could do the insulation job a lot cheaper than this hard to work with mixture.

Mr. Hendershot used paraffin for his OU oscillators. Many would say "So What. paraffin is cheap and avaliable". It just so happens that Paraffin was the first material to prove the concept of MRI technology. It had properties that would allow the electron spin to respond to the magnetic fields that were available at the time.

Now Lamare says that the Stan Myer system used Delrin in an oscillator circuit that has some similarities to the Gray power supply circuit in that it also has a common mode reactor (the Floating Flux Field).

Dr. Patric Flannagan has a patent for an air cleaner that is esentially a capacitor being driving with 50 KHz that generates a steady electrostatic field several times greater than the output voltage of his excitation oscillator.

To me there is something about the activation of a specific kind of dielectric that has been overlooked in our field. So when I see the 1986 promotion video of Gray going bananas over Delrin I can't help but think this was the material that Marvin Cole discovered had some useful properties. Gray certainly didn't know the differance between Delrin, Nylon, Polyethylene, or any of the several other white industrial plastics available. Something stood about that material that he claimed was doing all the magic in the cores of his popping coils. Actually it was the 1500 uF capacitor bank charged to 5 kV that was doing all the magic, but he didn't know the differance. Somebody that knew something years before put this bug in his ear.

This certainly isn't much to go on. I just wanted to point out the functional differance between "The Active Dielectric" and general High voltage insulation. Both are needed in this technology.

Mark McKay
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  #2746  
Old 01-23-2013, 08:46 AM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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measurement of spark and arc

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Originally Posted by Spokane1 View Post
Dear Wicaksono,

Thanks for asking. I'm in the process of constructing test circuit #123. This evening I need to dig through the snow and ice at the barns and see if I have two more .05 uF 5000 WVDC capacitors to finish off a five stage pulse forming network. Right now I'm attempting to measure the dynamic resistance of a spark/arc under conditions similiar to what has been doisclosed from the Gray history. This parameter is important because it determines the design of the method used to provide the current pulses in the Gray technology.
Hello Mr. McKay, are you still using NST to make the spark and arc ? What is the schematic diagram look like ?

Wicaksono
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  #2747  
Old 01-23-2013, 05:05 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Experiment #123 Schematic and Power Supply

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Originally Posted by Wicaksono View Post
Hello Mr. McKay, are you still using NST to make the spark and arc ? What is the schematic diagram look like ?

Wicaksono
Dear Wicaksono,

For a power supply I'm using a 250 Watt 500 - 5000 VDC tube regulated FLuke Model 503 rack mounted power supply. Its big and bulky, but the price was right.

The individual unit power supplies in the EMA4 engine were 30 to 50 watt choppers, so I have more than enough power to duplicate the operation of one of these power supplies. If I need more than this I'm not on the right track.

The schematic is that of the 1986 CEST with some modifications. The storage capacitor is replaced with a five stage type "E" Pulse forming Network composed of 0.05 uF capacitors and 4.4 uH inductors (using #14 AWG wire). The charicteristic resistance calculates out to 9.43 Ohms. The SPICE IV simulation shows a 4.6 uS pulse of 270 Amps delivered to the HV electrode.

The thyratron is being replaced with distributed diodes in the PFN. It is my speculation that the thyratron was being used as a HV high current diode in this application. I know that the Bedini Field Notes show a reversed solid state diode (from 1973). According to John he said he was not sure what the ture polarity was. His mentor Ron Cole kept changing the polarity in an attempt to figure out the system's operation. What John provided was the way they ended up on the last draft of the noites that John Copied.

I plan to look at single pulses. I'm using a 100A motor contactor to take the place of the commutator switch. The load resistor is the combination of a 500 Amp meter shunt (about .0001 Ohm) and a variable 50 Watt 15 Ohm resistor.

The CEST is 1-1/8" copper water pipe 8" long with a 1/4" HV electrode. This is much smaller that what John disclosed in his field notes, however this seems to be more along the lines of the CSET used in the EMA6 and in the patent documents. About all I can do here is see if any classical charge can be collected into a low loss capacitor using a lead-acid battery as a vitural ground (a Tesla technique)

I'm using a second 50 Amp contactor to charge the PFN prior to test firing. I'm placing a 20 H reactor (wasted spark ignition coil secondary) in series with the PFN so that the capacitors don't appear to be a short circuit to the power supply.

Data will be primarly collected from the 500 amp meter shunt resistor. The PIV of my diodes is limited to 3200 VDC, so I don't plan to go beyond 3000 volts for this series of tests. As it is the first diode has to pass 138 Amps of current while the others need only pass 58 Amps. If the response time of the diodes is quick enough I shouldn't get any reverse flow with this setup.

The purpose of this test is to establish just what the dynamic arc/spark resistance is with various 1/4" electrodes. I suspect that there was a viable reason why silver/silver was used.

The PFN will have to be reconfigured to match the effective aprk/arc resistance at the time of cut-off in order to provide the fastest fall time from maximum current. The simulation for this circuit shows it to be around 100 Amps/ uS. Who knows if this window of operation is what is needed to stimulate the dielectric? But at least it is a place to start.

Once I start taking data I shall draft the actual test circuit. You know how these things go. There is always last minute changes to the circuit when you have to use what is at hand.

Mark McKay
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Old 01-23-2013, 07:50 PM
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Meyer & Delrin

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Originally Posted by Spokane1 View Post
Now Lamare says that the Stan Myer system used Delrin in an oscillator circuit that has some similarities to the Gray power supply circuit in that it also has a common mode reactor (the Floating Flux Field).
Hi Mark,

I posted this way back:



Virtually every reference with Meyer and Delrin is simply using
the Delrin as an encasement to isolate the tubes from the
other tube sets. Otherwise, they're all short circuited to each
other. Without something like this, the tube sets are very
"leaky" and is hard to get the voltage up but with this type of
insulating case, the voltage can climb much higher as the idea
is to turn this into a "water capacitor." So instead of Delrin,
I was going to coat the outer tube in Plastidip. But later,
I found some pvc tube that my outer tubes slipped in perfectly
but I wasn't able to finish those experiments. Even with the pvc,
the ends of the tubes are exposed and are still shorted to
each other through the water so the ends still should have
Super Corona Dope or Plastidip.

Anyway, that's not really related to the Cole-Gray concepts -
just saw the Meyer reference to Delrin and thought I'd bring up
the Corona Dope and Plastidip - because those actually would
serve the purpose of what Meyer was using the Delrin for.

I don't think Meyer was actually looking for any special properties
of the Delrin other than a good insulator for the outer tube.
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Old 01-23-2013, 08:53 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Meyer and Delrin

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Hi Mark,

I don't think Meyer was actually looking for any special properties
of the Delrin other than a good insulator for the outer tube.
Dear Aaron,

Interesting drawing, thanks for reposting it.

Wouldn't it be crual irony if the sucess of Mr. Myer's systems were the result of a process he wasn't even aware of. If his chamber actually did excite the Delrin to produce an anomalous energy how would he have known? Stranger things have happened in history. If he continued using the Delrin liner he would have continued to get good results.

Who knows? There is a good chance that Gray and company stumbled across the OU aspects of an excited dielectric while in the pursuit of an industrial pulse motor.

Mark McKay
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Old 01-24-2013, 03:15 AM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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high voltage rack mounted power supply

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Dear Wicaksono,

For a power supply I'm using a 250 Watt 500 - 5000 VDC tube regulated FLuke Model 503 rack mounted power supply. Its big and bulky, but the price was right.
Hey this is a great item Mr. McKay, is this power suppy has programmable input to regulate voltage output or current output ?

Wicaksono
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Old 01-24-2013, 04:36 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Power Supply

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Hey this is a great item Mr. McKay, is this power suppy has programmable input to regulate voltage output or current output ?

Wicaksono
Dear Wicaksono,

The Fluke 503 is from the 50's so there is no programmable computer circuits associalted with it. The voltage is set from four (4) rotary switches and one potentiometer. Even so the output shown on the analog meter is 5% lower than what the switches show.

I got it at the WSU (Washington State University) mounthly auction outlet for about $20.00.

Internally it is composed of vaccum tube diodes and triodes (but still works). It has a front end voltage doubler that boosts the initial internal voltage to 10 KV. Then a triode regulates the current to maintian the output voltage setting.

I hope to transition from single pulse operation to continuous operation in a few weeks. Right now it taks 40 mS to charge the PFN. At that rate I can only generate 24 pulses per second (pps).

IF the EMA6 turned at 1700 rpm that would be 28 pps, so I'm in the ball park.

Mark McKay
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Old 01-25-2013, 08:29 AM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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vacuum tube power supply !?

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Originally Posted by Spokane1 View Post
Dear Wicaksono,

The Fluke 503 is from the 50's so there is no programmable computer circuits associalted with it. The voltage is set from four (4) rotary switches and one potentiometer. Even so the output shown on the analog meter is 5% lower than what the switches show.

I got it at the WSU (Washington State University) mounthly auction outlet for about $20.00.

Internally it is composed of vaccum tube diodes and triodes (but still works). It has a front end voltage doubler that boosts the initial internal voltage to 10 KV. Then a triode regulates the current to maintian the output voltage setting.
From 1950's ? Vacuum tube is definitely a diehard technology, still works well after 60 years. Instead of GPIB bus input, does it have any analog input to modulate the output ?. I hope they sell it complete with the manual, the electronic manuals from early years usually contains complete schematic diagram of the internal circuits.

Wicaksono
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Old 01-25-2013, 05:18 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Power Supply

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Originally Posted by Wicaksono View Post
From 1950's ? Vacuum tube is definitely a diehard technology, still works well after 60 years. Instead of GPIB bus input, does it have any analog input to modulate the output ?. I hope they sell it complete with the manual, the electronic manuals from early years usually contains complete schematic diagram of the internal circuits.

Wicaksono
No such luck. Auction sales are "As Is Where Is". I was fortunate to have all the tubes in it and that it functions. Manuals??? Are you kidding. Nothing at a recycling/surplus auction is complete. This stuff is one steap away from the scrap metal bin. In fact most of my compeatings bids are from metal recyclers and eBay resellers.

An analog input? That would make it a high voltage amplifier of some sort but the response time is much to slow to bother with.

When you are self funded, like most of us are, you have to take what you can get and do your best with it.

There are many things in this world that money will not buy, but modern calibrated test instruments are not among them.

Mark McKay
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Old 01-31-2013, 03:53 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Gray Motor For Sale (again)

Dear E.V. Gray Technology Researchers,

If you have lots of liquid $$$ and want a real collectors item to put in your living room check out this notice from the Sterling site:

Classifieds:Original EV Gray Motor Available for Right Lab - PESWiki

Apparently Al Francouer is willing to part with one of his Gray Motors, most likley the "Black" version, for an acceptable bid. The intent is to get money to fund his continuing reverse engineering research efforts.

The last two motors that John Riley sold are rumored to have gone for between $25,000and $42,000 each. That is certainly outside of my funding capacity. With that kind of money I could buy some pulse current transformers that wouldn't saturate at 50 Amps.

It will be interesting to see what kind of offers are tendered.

Mark McKay
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Old 02-04-2013, 04:33 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Gray Motor for Sale - Correction

The Gray motor that Al is offering is the "Gold" Motor with the cart and some new replacement parts (capacitors). He doesn't plan to sell the "Black" or "White" Motors.

Mark McKay
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Old 02-13-2013, 01:50 PM
thx1138 thx1138 is offline
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Charged Particles

Does anyone have any knowledge of Geiger counter readings taken around the known Gray equipment?

The story of the confiscation and destruction of the equipment seems a bit overboard for some spurious emissions. They would, however, be perfectly understandable in the 70's if some kind of radioactive material were detected.

Go back and look at Tesla's quotes about radium. Why would it be important to him that radium could be produced for $1 a pound?

Keep in mind that this was in the 30's before nuclear detonations, radioactive materials were not well understood, and probably not regulated by the government at all at that time.

What would a disruptive discharge inside a Gray tube filled with radon gas produce?

Today there are self powered light bulbs filled with tritium gas that light up a phosphor coating inside the tube with no electrical supply. They are similar to the emergency exit signs in building stairwells that require no power source.

If I remember correctly, back in the 50's and 60's the markings on a watch dial and hands were made with radium so they would glow in the dark.
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Old 02-13-2013, 10:03 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Gray Technology & Radiation

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Originally Posted by thx1138 View Post
Does anyone have any knowledge of Geiger counter readings taken around the known Gray equipment?

The story of the confiscation and destruction of the equipment seems a bit overboard for some spurious emissions. They would, however, be perfectly understandable in the 70's if some kind of radioactive material were detected.

Go back and look at Tesla's quotes about radium. Why would it be important to him that radium could be produced for $1 a pound?

Keep in mind that this was in the 30's before nuclear detonations, radioactive materials were not well understood, and probably not regulated by the government at all at that time.

What would a disruptive discharge inside a Gray tube filled with radon gas produce?

Today there are self powered light bulbs filled with tritium gas that light up a phosphor coating inside the tube with no electrical supply. They are similar to the emergency exit signs in building stairwells that require no power source.

If I remember correctly, back in the 50's and 60's the markings on a watch dial and hands were made with radium so they would glow in the dark.
Dear tx1138,

All the relatives and ex-employees that I had the opportunity to speak with never once mentoined radioactive substances or insturmentation to measure any sort of classical ionizing radiation.

There were two confiscation events. The first in 1973 was for alledged business fruad and had nothing to do with energy emmissions of any sort.

The second was in 1977. It is believed that this was done by the FCC for RF emissions. If you don't believe this sort of thing can't happen - then you have no viable field experiance in this area. The FCC in this country has the undisputed power of Natzi strom troopers. Operating a high power (say 20 KW) wide spectrum EMI source will (and did) get an immediate response.

There are a number of OU devices that are based upon radioactive substances. Most notably the Hubbard Device. No doubt there are several methods to harness the latent energy in unstable isotopes, but it doesn't appear (at the moment) that this approach was used by the Gray team.

Mark McKay
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Old 03-28-2013, 01:42 PM
zolgar zolgar is offline
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Tube Burst Technology

Hello all,

I'd like to ask if anyone could explain how much energy is being produced from mixing the positive potential of the running battery with positive potential of a high voltage capacitive discharge in the primary of a pickup transformer by comparison with pulsing it with just the battery by itself.

Would a pair of miniature enclosed spark gaps work for the first gap to 12V and the second gap to (-)Ground?

When resonance is acheived by the primary burst rate in the transformer, how then will this change the output?
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Old 05-26-2013, 10:43 PM
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antigraviticsystems1 antigraviticsystems1 is offline
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Perdonenme pero es que los traductores de español a ingles no traducen correctamente así es que me voy a expresar en mi lengua..

Desde mi punto de vista la energía fria es flujo etherico, ese flujo va cogido de la mano con los electrones, es muy dificil desacoplar el flujo etherico de los electrones pero hay trucos..

Tesla descubrió en la inaguración de una central electrica basada en corriente continua que al cerrar el seccionador general que cerraba el circuito entre una dinamo entregando unos 30.000 voltios y el tendido electrico de decenas de km hasta una subestacion reductora de tensión se crearon momentaneamente unos filamentos blancos que partian perpendicularmente de los cables hacia tierra o masa, el efecto desapareció instantaneamente y generó una "picadura" o escozor en manos y cara, Tesla pensó que el efecto desapareció cuando los electrones "empezaron a correr a través del cable"

¿por que los electrones eran perezosos a mover en los primeros instantes?.. muy sencillo, por la inductancia o XL de la línea de alta tensión sumada a la del motor final ¿por que un motor al final de la linea de alta tensión en la subestación de transformación de tensión? muy sencillo, al tratarse de corriente continua esta no puede ser transformada a baja tensión mediante transformadores convencionales, supongo que se necesitarian 2 motores, uno de ellos alimentado a 30.000 voltios y el eje mecánico del mismo conectado al eje de una dinamo de 110 voltios de corriente continua, es la única forma de reducir la tensión y ampliar la intensidad para uso en ciudad y alumbrado público..

si observamos todo el circuito tenemos un generador de 30.000 voltios, un seccionador de 2 cuchillas que cierra rápidamente, 2 hilos paralelos a lo largo de decenas de km que forman un condensador electrico y al final tenemos un motor de corriente continua consistente en grandes bobinados con una gran impedancia inductiva, el motivo por el cual los electrones eran perezosos en los primeros instantes de tiempo es porque las bobinas o inductancias retrasan 90 grados la intensidad, una vez creado el campo magnético en las inductancias parasitas y en el bobinado final los electrones comienzan a correr, mientras tanto se producen las serpentinas blanquecinas que derivan a masa y que producen picor, Tesla en un principio pensó que se trataban de ondas mecanicas de sonido pero vió que era imposible apantallar esas manifestaciones energéticas ni con cristal ni con ningún metal..

Resumiendo:

1) esa manifestación energética se manifiesta tan solo durante un breve instante de tiempo cuando los electrones son perezosos a la hora de ponerse en marcha

2) esa manifestación energética solo se manifiesta cuando la tensión es de un solo sentido, es decir hay que descartar la corriente alterna.

3) Para producir ese efecto necesitamos poder entregar una elevadisima presión electrica de golpe del orden de varios miles de voltios mediante un boquete de chispa (spark gap)

4) Necesitamos poder abrir el circuito electrico de forma inmediata pues de lo contrario los electrones empezarian a correr y la energia se transformaria en calor (perdidas) la electrónica de potencia tales como transistores, tiristores, triacs etc,etc no valen, tenemos que soplar magneticamente el flujo de electrones e iones mediante un potente campo magnético (magnetic kenched)

5) se debe de evitar oscilaciones en el circuito, es decir corriente alterna de alta frecuencia generada por circuitos oscilantes LC

6) La manifestación energética o energia radiante se desacopla del conductor de forma perpendicular y deriva a masa o a tierra, por lo tanto si colocamos una carga resistiva entre tierra y el cilindro axial al conductor la manifestación podria ser aprovechada es por eso que el tubo de Gray utiliza conductores concentricos.

7) El proceso de cerrar el circuito y abrirlo debe de operar en el rango de los mili segundos, la calidad de los efectos varia en función del tiempo de conducción y otros parametros.

8) La puesta en juego de energía electrica puede ser en parte recuperada gracias a la F.E.M devuelta por la bobina, es decir que el pequeño gasto de electrones necesarios para desacoplar el flujo de particulas virtuales de los electrones puede ser en parte recuperado gracias a la energía devuelta por la bobina que puede ser reutilizada de nuevo en la bateria mediante una trampa de diodos.

9) la prueba definitiva para saber si un receptor está trabajando con energía radiante es que no debe de calentarse en absoluto, es mas debe de bajar la temperatura del mismo, el Señor tesla ideo un gran cortocircuito de cobre grueso en forma de "U" para extinguir toda posibilidad de que los electrones fueran los causantes de la extraña luminosidad de sus lamparas hechas funcionar con esta nueva energía.
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Old 05-28-2013, 09:35 PM
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antigraviticsystems1 antigraviticsystems1 is offline
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From my point of view is cold FLOW Energy etheric, that FLOW is holding hands with electrons, IT IS VERY DIFFICULT TO FLOW etheric decouple electron hay però tricks ..

Tesla discovered in the inauguration Of A Power Plant Based on Direct Current That closing the main switch, which closed the circuit delivering dynamo Nail Between 30,000 Volt ONE The Power Lines Tens of kilometers UNTIL tension reducing substation itself momentarily created UNOS white filaments that left TOWARDS cable perpendicularly earth or ground, the effect disappeared instantly and Gender nail "bite" or burning in hands and face, Tesla Penso That disappeared effect electrons WHEN "started running cable Through"

Why Does the electrons were lazy an engine Moments FIRST? .. simple, or XL For The inductance of the high-voltage motor Added to the final engine Why Does not the end, of the Line of High Voltage Transformer Substation voltage? very simple, being DC Power Can Be Transformed This is NOT a low california TENSION BY conventional transformers, suppose It would need two motors, one of Them Fed to 30,000 Volts and the mechanical axis of the shaft Online Self A dynamo of 110 volts Continuous Power is the only way to reduce tension and expand paragraph USO intensity lighting city audience ..

if you look at all the circuit generator WE HAVE A 30,000 Volts without disconnecting the 2 blades That closes quickly, 2 Parallel threads along Forming Tens of kilometers without electrical condenser and finally, WE HAVE A continuous current motor windings consisting Great with a high impedance inductive Reason For Whom The electrons were lazy in First Moments of Time is BECAUSE delay coils or inductors 90 Degrees intensity, Once Created the magnetic field inductance and winding Parasitas final electrons begin to run, yes WHILE Both coils produce whitish That And That ARISING mass produce itching, Tesla at first thought I was trying to sound mechanical waves That was impossible but saw Manifestations AEE Energy shield or with any glass or metal ..

In short:

1) The ESA itself Expresses Energy Demonstration During UN only brief instant of time the electrons WHEN lazy son when Catch-up

2) Energy Demonstration solo ESA itself is Tension WHEN Is Single-SENSE is Hay Say That Discard AC.

3) Produce effect NEED THAT able to deliver a very high pressure electric hit order of several thousand volts spark gap THROUGH (sparks)

4) Power NEED open the electrical circuit immediately For otherwise the electrons would begin to run and the other would transform into heat energy (losses) Power Electronics LÃ tales as transistors, thyristors, triacs etc, etc are worth, WE May magnetically blow the electron and ion FLOW THROUGH A Powerful magnetic field (magnetic kenched)

5) Avoid self must oscillations in the circuit, AC Say Generated High Frequency LC resonant circuits

6) The Manifestation Energy or other radiant energy decouples perpendicular conductor and earth or drift, so if we put a resistive load between land and axial cylinder driver could Manifestation services utilized's Why the tube Gray uses concentric conductors.

7) The process of closing and opening the circuit must operate in the range of milli seconds, the quality varies Effects Lead Time function and other parameters.

8) Start Electric Power Game Can Be Recovered in parte by the EMF returned By The coil is Saying That The Small Expense decouple electrons needed FLOW para virtual particles of electrons can be recovered at instance part by the Energy returned by Coil You Can be reused again on drums BY A trap diodes.

9) the ultimate test para saber if no receiver is not working with Radiant Energy is That should not be heated in Absolute, is more down to the temperature of Himself, the Lord tesla Short ideo no great thick copper in a "U "paragraph extinguish any possibility that electrons were the cause of the strange brightness of His lamps Made operate with This new Energia.
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