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Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

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  #2611 (permalink)  
Old 02-07-2012, 10:46 PM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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Mark,

I am not exactly sure and I am not proficient in this field. My expertise is in another field and this is just a hobby. More like an addiction.

The one other thing I noticed about grays commutator design is that it is very similar to Tesla's designs. Tesla designed a commutator with mica adjacent to the contact plates. Grays design appears to be similar in that regard. I believe there was some mention of oil in the commutator which may also aid in the abrupt shutoff

Can you think of any other ways of achieving the abrupt shutoff

Nat
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  #2612 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 01:29 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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FFF Exploration Circuits

Dear Nat,

I don't think the transitions in this technology are all that fast when compared to modern high speed electronics.

I suspect that Marvin Cole started with an oscillation spark gap of some sort and that worked well up to a point. When Mr. Hackenberger finally figured out the technology he was able to design a power supply using slow transistors to eliminate the spark gaps. The square wave transitions are indeed fast but not super fast. As it is the original "Vibrators" operated at 100 Hz. The operation of the 2nd Generation Black Box electrostatic generator was 8 kHz. This was probably what was being applied to the "electrostatic" part of the system. There are construction details seen on the "Blue Engine" power supply where extra attention was placed on improving the shut off speed of the main parallel switching transistors. This was achieved by means of a push-pull gate driver circuit that required a negative bias voltage.

If my thoughts are correct then the oscillation spark gap or switching transistor is not the source of the anomalous energy. The action is probably taking place in the dielectric of the FFF. The sharp HV square waves are just what is required for the proper excitation. A static 90 degree magnetic field also seems to be required.

This means there is a lot we don't know about the FFF. The first thing is what kind of dielectric was being used? Polyethylene, Teflon, Delrin, Nylon, Styrene, who knows? The RG-6 is just a starting point. The next step is the removal of the shield and get something closer to what Dr. Tesla had with his Guta Percha covered wire.

Dr. Tesla constantly refers to his oscillator circuits as having two sections. The Local section includes all of the components on the primary side and the primary. The "Working" circuit is all of the components on the secondary side including the secondary. So, if we believe that the master was working with a non-classical energy in these circuits then the transition takes place between the primary and the secondary, or very close to it.

I know a lot of work has been done with various kinds of Tesla coils, however the impact of the dielectrics that Dr. Tesla used has been completely overlooked. This is where your observation of the employment of mica and liquid dielectrics comes into play.

Once Mr. Hackenberger got the production of the non-classical energy figured out and improved upon the next step was to control its release into the system of opposing electromagnet and PM magnets in the rotary device. Apparently the employment of Thyratrons/ Ignitrons finally worked well enough for this application. It remains to be seen if a large SCR can take the place of the Ignitron. I hope so, since they are much cheaper on the surplus market. But who knows what the impact of this non-classical energy will be on a PN junction. I'm not above using Ignitrons if that is what works. Mechanically operated vacuum interrupters might be an alternative but that is getting pretty $$$$

It appears that originally Mr. Cole used mechanical commentator switching to discharge the storage capacitors - at least that is what is disclosed in the patent documents. A separate switching chamber was used for this. Then there was the short lived use of the CEST. Richard then went back to direct mechanical switching in April of 1976. By 1979 direct mechanical switching was replaced with the Ignitrons. So, it appears that this technology has seen a lot of shifts. That is what makes it so hard to follow the technical progress from one photograph to the next.

For my initial tests I'm going to use the mechanical contactor. It appears this approach works for slow speed applications. - Just like Gray's open blade knife switch. Once I can fill the capacitor with anomalous energy then I shall look for some means to release it.

Side note: In examining the circuitry of the "Gold Pulse Motor" and the design of the commentator one will notice the 12 each small 1/4" round contacts. It appears that this was a means where the main storage capacitors were pre-charged in a series of 4 steps before the main discharge took place. I have no idea why this was done. It doesn't make any classical engineering sense. It must have something to do with the properties of the "Cold Electricity"

Mark McKay
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  #2613 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 02:15 AM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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Mark,

If we assume you are correct then it must be the mercury in the ignitron performing some special function. On researching this apparently it can release low level ultraviolet light. I believe I purchased some Russian mercury thyratrons so I might test them out. I haven't been successful in getting them to work. Doesn't help being a novice in this field. If this is the case then it would explain why none of us has been very successful in replicating

Grays circuit does work but not very well without the right components.

Nat
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  #2614 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 02:22 AM
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In reading up on some very old books I may be able to answer your question about the round contacts in the commutator. I came across a book about the different type of discharges. It was talking about disruptive discharges requiring rounded points on spark gaps perhaps this also applies to the commutator

This makes sense to me. Might have to try that.nice observation
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  #2615 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 05:30 PM
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Basic E.V. Gray Systems Theory (Speculated)

Dear Nat,

The part of the circuit I'm working on is what I suspect was contained in the non-rotary Electrostatic Generator. This device had an impressive output at a COP of about 4.0. Which would make me jump for joy if I could achieve just half that.

But then there is the second stage process that takes the energy gain from 4.0 to 275 in the rotary designs. This is what appears to happen in the rotating arcs, the CEST, or the Ignitrons. All of these are an arc process. I have no idea what goes on there, but I firmly believe that a certain amount of the non-classical energy has to be present in order for the 2nd stage process to take place.

In my study of the EMA4 Free Energy Engine there was a specific operating cycle that took place for 120 degrees of rotation that was dedicated to energy production. The remaining 240 degrees of rotation was devoted to the conversion of this energy into torque through magnetic attraction and repulsion.

This energy cycle involved the "Major" electromagnets being fired directly opposite each other. This is the only time that connections are made to the rotor. It appears to me that a direct arc was struck between the cores of these electromagnets. This approach seems to have been abandoned when it was determined that this 2nd power process didn't have to take place in the engine. So, the EMA6 design moved the 2nd stage arc to the CEST devices - which didn't work as well. Later, Hackenberger made a new commutator and once again struck his 2nd process arcs in that device. I doubt that was going to work for long since the one photo we have that shows this system operating displays enough arc flame to erode the contact surfaces in a few hours.

The last Free Energy ever made was the "Blue Engine". It is the most compact model ever built and is triggered with Ignitrons. I would certainly like to know how Richard was able to get away from the dynamic or moving arc. The fixed distance arc in the CEST device failed - so how did the fixed arc in the Ignitron work better? Also in Richard's early engineering reports he talks about the importance of oxygen for the arc. Well, there certainly isn't any oxygen in an Ignitron so what happened to that argument? Perhaps he was wrong the first time around? I don't know. He must have come up with a work around solution. Maybe he was able to somehow modulate the arc in the Ignitron to simulate physical movement. Maybe he changed the timing or component parameters to eliminate the need for stretching. Whatever it was it appears to have greatly simplified the design of the Engine and hopefully increased its output.

He must have been pretty proud of himself in December 1979. Here he had constructed a system that was 30% the size of the original EMA4 and had only 20% of the parts. I assume at a similar power level.

Anyway, until we come up with some amount of the anomalous energy I think that exploration into the 2nd stage arc process is going to be futile. But I could be wrong so don't let me rain on you parade. I'm just presenting my working model so we can better compare notes.

I'm sure that a detailed study of various kinds of fixed and moving arc electrodes will be useful - Once we can create the initial "something" to run through them.

That "something" involves an electrostatic process that we haven't much of a clue about except some observations of the hardware employed.

Let me know if I'm beating a dead horse by going over these historical speculations time and time again.

Well, keep up the exploration.

Mark McKay
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  #2616 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 05:48 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Detail of the E-5 Pulse Motor Commutator

Dear Nat,

Concerning those 12 round contacts on the E-5 "White" Pulse Motor. Here is a recent clcose up photo of what I was refering to. There are 12 of the 0.250" brass contacts equally spaced around the inside of this commutator system. There are three of the rectangular copper contacts.

The brass contacts seem to pre-charge the main storage capacitor bank from a smaller bank. For this to work the voltage on the first bank has to be higher than the collected charge on the main bank. Perhaps this was done for isolation purposes - I don't know. However Ignitrons were employed to make this transfer.

The copper contacts are used to trigger the main power Ignitrons. This dumped the charge from the main storage capacitors through the opposing electromagnets.

Now, keep in mind that this is early technology from a Pulse Motor and not the technology that was used in the Free Energy Engines. However they are very similar.

Mark Mckay
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  #2617 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 07:17 PM
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Mark,

Thanks for the info on the commutator. Yesterday I started to build something similar to grays commutator but i will use the dielectrics that Tesla used - mica.


@everybody/all
But now to let the cat & horse out. You will have to trust me when i say that the mercury in the ignitron is the missing component to producing this radiant energy. I found the original source of Tesla's design for his flat pancake copper strap coils and mercury was indeed used in the design. So this leads to my next question. What modern day switches contain mercury in them? The only ones i know of a thyratrons and ignitrons. Do you know of any others that i can test?

cheers
Nat
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  #2618 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 09:13 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Mercury Contactors

Dear Nat,

Ken Hawkins was the man who gave me the 1986 Gray promotion video and lead Norm Wooten to Dodge City, KS to recover the E-4 and E-5 pulse motors in 2000. He claims that Gray used Mica in his capacitors and iron wire for the original engine electromagnets. I have no idea how he knew this, but since he had the location right for the equipment he must have had some exposure to this drama. I do know that Mr. Gray paid the high price for custom capacitors, which could have been required to get large values. I certainly keep these facts in mind and have a collection of transmitter mica capacitors, but nothing that approaches 5 uF let alone 12 uF.

For mercury switches; there are small commercial mercury pool contactors available in my local market for about $30. They take the place of mechanical contractors when a high in-rush current is expected. They have to be mounted in a vertical position and are operated by a coil that moves a contact in a sealed tube with mercury at the bottom. The advantage is that the contact surface is self cleaning. The down side is the slow repetition rate. I think you would be pushing it at 2 Hz. The current range of the ones I'm thinking of is around 30-40 amps at 240VAC 60 Hz. If your applied voltage was high enough they would probably work as arc tubes - but I don't know that for sure.

Could you share with us the source of your information about the Tesla technology that describes the use of these materials?

If a mercury pool eliminates the need for moving electrodes then I'm all for it.

Mark McKay
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  #2619 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 10:10 PM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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Mark,

Please advise your email address. I will send to you tonight when i get home from work.

Thanks
Nat
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  #2620 (permalink)  
Old 02-08-2012, 11:18 PM
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Aaron Aaron is offline
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Arrow Mark McKay presenting at the Bedini-Lindemann 2012 Conference

Here is a direct link to Mark McKay's bio and presentation topic - he will be speaking at the Bedini-Lindemann 2012 Science & Technology Conference on the Ed Gray motor technologies.

http://www.energeticforum.com/conference/#mark

The rest of the conference information is on that same page.
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  #2621 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2012, 12:03 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Contact Email

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Mark,

Please advise your email address. I will send to you tonight when i get home from work.

Thanks
Nat
Sure thing. My job email is mmckay@simplexgrinnell.com
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  #2622 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2012, 12:53 AM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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Mark,

Is that an aluminum ring on the commutator?. So we have brass & aluminum? and carbon brushes

Cheers
Nat
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  #2623 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2012, 04:55 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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"White" Pulse Motor (E-5) Commutator Details

Dear Nat,

Yep, not only one aluminum commutator ring but two (2) side by side. So there are two rotary switch systems combined into this device. However they do share the same wiper.

When Nelson Schlaft rewired this system he didn't need the 2nd common slip ring and removed the wires that were attached to it. So we have no idea as to what they were controlling. I would venture to say that one slip ring was associated with the 12 each round contacts intended to pre-charge the main storage capacitor. The other slip ring was part of the main discharge control system. Since two switching systems were involved two slip rings were needed. If isolation was an issue then by rights the wipers should have been separated as well, but they are not.

There are two more slip ring assemblies in these E series Pulse Motors. One is at the front of the motor just behind the commutator and another is at the back end of the motor. These slip ring assemblies are odd in their construction since the brush is on the rotor and the slip ring is fixed. In every other industrial motor I know of it is the other way around. This layout allows easy replacement of the contact brush. Why Mr. Cole did it this way is unknown to me. The only proposal I have heard is that this kind of arrangement works better for high voltage, but you have to completely remove the rotor shaft to get at the brushes, which would be a real pain once the engine was installed. IF this proposal is correct then the expected voltages were much higher than 5 kV. The 2500 HP DC motors used at our local aluminum rolling mill operate at 2675 DC and use the common brush to slip ring method just fine.


Aluminum is a poor choice for a slip ring surface - in my opinion. I have never seen it used in industry. Special alloys of brass are the preferred materials along with Beryllium copper - which seemed to have been used in the commutator contacts. Perhaps cost and availability were issues at the time.

These commutator systems hold a lot of hints. They point to the large number of state changes required in this technology to yield the huge COP's

Mark McKay
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  #2624 (permalink)  
Old 02-09-2012, 07:14 PM
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mark,

l will build a commutator using the same metals and see if there is some special unknown feature - it wont be exactly the same but should provide some insight - i have been wondering whether the aluminum ring is important too. I suspect there must be as Gray's circuit has way to many features of Tesla's circuits.

Did you receive my email?

Cheers
Nat
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  #2625 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2012, 08:47 PM
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ok so hears a photo of my very rough and ready commutator. Interesting enough when i checked the resistance when engaged i got 30 ohms. Makes me wonder if the spark is getting choked somehow in the metallic lattice.

Still untested yet. I will be happy if i get a couple of test runs out of it before it stops working.

After building it i now realise the extreme precision that has gone into it.

cheers
N.
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  #2626 (permalink)  
Old 02-10-2012, 09:39 PM
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hmmm after thinking about this some more. It seems gray is on the low voltage side generating sparks into resistance.

1. 30 ohms resistance from the combined materials...brass. aluminum & carbon
2. ignitron ....sparks into mercury...apparently the ignitron has carbon in it as well.
3. and if we believe the circuit configuration in the gray motor found video on youtube there was even more resistance.

seems to me this is described in peter lindeman books as the HV into resistance that generates the radiant spike.

More interesting the deeper i look.

cheers
N.
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  #2627 (permalink)  
Old 02-11-2012, 08:30 AM
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well guys,

I was able to perform a whole lot of testing today.

As expected the commutator didn't work very well. This needs to be precision built. But it did prove something. There is something special about it - the resistance seemed to vary dramatically depending on lots of things. I ended up ditching the commutator and added aluminum and carbon to my dual pole relay which already had brass contacts to simulate grays commutator. This also include a diode and 150K resistor as per the circuit in gray motor found on youtube.

Next I ended up reverting to my circuit to look more like grays.

Then I added brass sphere spark gaps to my copper rods. This seemed to work much better.

But the biggest difference came when i added a big russian mercury thyratron.
Mind you i couldn't tell whether it was working or not. I could not see any blue light which is meant to be coming from it. But it must have been as soon as i added it. The was a fairly significant change in the pulses on the charge receiving circuit. One pulse registered 168vdc on the capacitor connected to the grids. And i was regularly getting 20-30vdc

Yet it did seem quite hit and miss. Some times you would get something then others not. So i can only conclude from this that the intensity of the spark in CSET needs to be much much higher or the frequency needs to be just right. As small adjustments to the spark gap whilst the circuit was running seemed to get it to work but still intermitantly.


Cheers
N.
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  #2628 (permalink)  
Old 02-11-2012, 09:01 AM
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Couple of photos from todays tests
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  #2629 (permalink)  
Old 02-11-2012, 10:21 AM
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forgot to mention that my last final test of the day was to replace the mercury thyratron with a diode and i got absolutely nothing....will probably have to test out a few more diodes to say conclusively...
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  #2630 (permalink)  
Old 02-13-2012, 04:09 PM
Wicaksono Wicaksono is offline
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connection from FFF to commutator ring, again

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Mr. McKay, do you have connection diagram of FFF to commutator ring to motor electromagnets ? The commutator is made of alumunium slip ring and copper contacts, what material is the brush made of ? Thanks.

Wicaksono
Now it is known that they use carbon brush, but one thing still unknown is where does the FFF connect ? Is it the copper contacts or brass contacts ? Thanks for all information.

Wicaksono
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  #2631 (permalink)  
Old 02-13-2012, 08:49 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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The FFF and the Copper/Brass contacts

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Originally Posted by Wicaksono View Post
Now it is known that they use carbon brush, but one thing still unknown is where does the FFF connect ? Is it the copper contacts or brass contacts ? Thanks for all information.

Wicaksono
Dear Wicsksono,

The Copper and Brass contacts are part of the commutator system from the "Gold" E-5 Pulse Motor. It was not part of a Free Energy Engine.

There are two distinct epochs of development that Marvin Cole was involved in. Phase one he built 6-7 Pulse Motors from 1957 to 1961. It is assumed that in 1961 he discovered the OU process. From then on he built four 9-pole Free Energy Engines and a few partial developemental models (like the E-5A).

The "Floating Flux Field" component is only associated with the EMA4 Free Energy Engine. We have no evidence that the FFF was involved with any other machine.

So we have no idea if a FFF component was even involved with the Pulse Motor development - much less how it was connected.

So your guess is as good as any.

Mark McKay
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  #2632 (permalink)  
Old 02-13-2012, 09:10 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Experiments with enclosed spark gaps

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Originally Posted by nat1971a View Post
Couple of photos from todays tests
Dear Nat,

I was doing some similiar things over the weekend as well. The copper enclosure surrounding my spark gap was much smaller that yours being only 1.25" in diameter. However the voltage signiture looked pretty impressive at 400 Volts peak at 1.98 MHz across a 5K resistor. That equates to 80 mA of circulation current (If it was real).

Now attempting to harvest that apparent energy into a storage capacitor proved futile with the six or so circuits I tested. As soon as a capacitor was introduced the voltage swings dissapeared and nothing could be mesured across the capacitor.

Oh well, it was an attempt. One of the many that will be done before this is all over.

Keep up the good "hands on work"

Mark McKay
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  #2633 (permalink)  
Old 02-13-2012, 09:32 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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High Speed Transitions in simple arc circuits

Dear Members,

It has been discussed from time to time how important a rapid dV/dt transition is as far as this technology is concerned. Most of this comes from comments may by Dr. Tesla in the description of parts of his work.

Well, here is a look at what can be accomplished with just a simple relaxation oscillator like the one I built a few weeks ago (see post on page #87) using my chopper NST and a spark plug (0.015" gap) in shunt with 120 pF of capacitance. This is wired just like a common hobby Tesla Coil where the primary is 10 turns of RG-6 coax cable.

Trace D004 is what the entire RF burst packet looks like. It starts its relaxation oscillations slow and then picks up speed. It will scan a range from about 3 kHz all the way up to 50 kHz in this one burst.

Trace D000 is the leading edge of the RF burst with the sweep rate at almost maximum at 2 nS/division. The voltage is going through my 1000:1 voltage divider so in theory we should be seeing 5 kV/ division on the vertical scale. The gap breaks down at around 5 kV then drops 32 kV to - 27 kV in 5 nS. That's a huge voltage change in a short span of time at around 6 kv/nS.

Right now, I don't know for sure what is responsible for the huge negative voltage swing. I suspect it has something to do with the back EMF of the inductance in the FFF, but I'm not sure. I know that dealing with observing these sudden pulses is a black-box science all its own and I admit my ignorance in this area. Never the less it is interesting to look at.

To me, this shows that with simple components we can produce some very fast voltage transitions.

Cheers,

Mark McKay
Attached Images
File Type: pdf D000.pdf (6.4 KB, 28 views)
File Type: pdf D004.pdf (7.5 KB, 19 views)
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  #2634 (permalink)  
Old 02-13-2012, 11:42 PM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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Mark,

I have a capacitor connected to the grids. This is how i am measuring if anything is happening. So that doesnt seem to be a problem in my circuit. I havent had a chance to see if it charges the batteries yet. I hope it is as soon i might be able to run my house of it. Thats all i am after for now.

As expected we have all been wasting our time testing the circuit without using a mercury thyraton or mercury ignitron. I managed to pick up the mercury thyratron for only about $40 on ebay as New Old Stock. So that isnt massively out of everyones price bracket. Maybe someone might come up with a better way but for now that is what i am sticking with. I ordered several a couple months back but have been to busy to do anything about it.

Let me know if you want me to post the link to the thyratron. Have you tested any switches with mercury in it?

I am working on some improvements to my circuit. Have had to order some more parts. The more i learn the more i realise there is no way in hell that gray/cole came up with this circuit on there own.

Sounds like you are seeing something in your circuit. Keep in mind there was no sparks in mine to the grids. I am now thinking that the light from the spark in the CSET is generating a special frequency with the introduction of the mercury thyratron. I was seeing stuff with my old argon thyratron but nothing like the mercury thyratron.

Cheers
Nat

Last edited by nat1971a : 02-14-2012 at 12:36 AM. Reason: .
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Old 02-15-2012, 02:22 PM
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boguslaw boguslaw is offline
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Greetings all. Good discussion here. I think the secret of Gray circuit finally would resolve to continously charged capacitor
and you know that if such avalanche rise of energy happen there is a problem to avoid explosion
how we could keep capacitor topped to full charge ? I guess with very fast switching to high inductance so current cannot flow but magnetic field is made on coil and collapsing produce radiant energy. The problem is always ground connection, because radiant energy is immediately gone to ground (like lightning) especially if you have coil connected to anything I saw some nice Russian fellows expaining how a weak HV spark from Tesla coil can produce large current with proper material and capacitance.
KACER - YouTube


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  #2636 (permalink)  
Old 02-15-2012, 07:37 PM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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greetings boguslaw,

i have my capacitor connected to ground for safety purposes. I may test grays exact circuit now that i understand it better.

Now to the next part of the mystery of grays circuit. So now that we have determined that the combination of the metals (brass, aluminum, carbon & copper) used in the commutator have a special function (i.e point of resistance and choking) it occured to me to look elsewhere for it too. (i.e dumping HV into resistance)


Now have a look at the ignitron picture. We have all of the same metals present. We have a brass base & aluminum heat sink connected to a stainless steel cathode. Inside we have mercury and apparently a carbon rod which is connected to the copper anode. Then finally we have the brass plate that connects all 3 ignitrons.

So it looks like gray is choking the spark once at the commutator and then again at the ignitron. I am going to modify my circuit again to include this arrangement on my mercury thyratron.

Cheers
Nat
Attached Images
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File Type: pdf datasheetignitrongl7171.pdf (238.7 KB, 28 views)

Last edited by nat1971a : 02-15-2012 at 07:48 PM. Reason: .
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Old 02-16-2012, 01:21 AM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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Contacts in the EMA4

Dear Nat,

If you are looking for contacts - then keep in mind that the commutators of the "Gold", Black, White, and "Purple" motors were Pulse Motors and not Free Energy Engines - or so I think.

If you want to dig into contacts then go to the source and analyze the EMA4 Free Energy Engine. That machine had all kinds of contacts

18 Power Stroke Contacts (Stator)
18 Energy Generation contacts (Stator)
27 Unknown Contacts (Stator)
9 Energy Generation Contacts (Rotor)
2 High Voltage Front End Slip Ring Contacts
4 Low voltage Controller contacts
9 Sets of Core to Core discharge electrodes (assumed to be laminated iron)

and these are just the ones I know about.

There is probably just about every kind of metal to metal combination in that machine - somewhere.

Best of luck with your experiments. I shall be out of town the rest of the week.

Mark Mckay
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  #2638 (permalink)  
Old 02-18-2012, 10:19 AM
telemachus telemachus is offline
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Does it emit scalar waves?

Also, I'm wondering if a functioning Gray Tube could also produce gravitational anomalies (weight changes of nearby objects) or even time anomalies such as a change in the rate that time flows.
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Old 02-18-2012, 09:39 PM
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nat1971a nat1971a is offline
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no idea if it emits scalar waves.

@mark

A massive spark has damaged some of my components. I am out of commission for at least 2 weeks till spares arrive.

Cheers

Nat
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Old 02-20-2012, 05:15 PM
Spokane1 Spokane1 is offline
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The CEST and Scalar Waves

Quote:
Originally Posted by telemachus View Post
Does it emit scalar waves?

Also, I'm wondering if a functioning Gray Tube could also produce gravitational anomalies (weight changes of nearby objects) or even time anomalies such as a change in the rate that time flows.
Dear telemachus,

No one has of yet publically disclosed that they have ever seen a working Gray Tube (let alone build one that works). John Bedini probably came the closest in 1973. The equipment was set-up on a bench in a bread-board fashion, but it was not demonstrated for him.

The 1986 promotion video shows a replication CEST arching with 5 kV sparks from the "Trigger Cart", but it was not connected to anything else. This is hardly an example of actual operation. This appears to have been a fabricated sales presentation using a bogus device.

Of the dozens of researchers who have built their versions of CETS the only novel effects that have been reported are:

Tad Johnson 2002: anomalous heating of the load resistor - follow up experiments were never done - or at least not reported.

Aaron 2010: Green arcs as the result of an added inductor to the "grid" circuit. The cause for this has been debated and some reproduction experiments have been done, however no anomalous energy has been observed.

Despite the lack of performance of the CEST as disclosed in the 1986 patent there is some indication that some kind of "gravitational anomaly" might have been observed in the original exploration of this technology in the early '70's. One speculated reason why the original inventor Mr. Marvin Cole left the project was the discovery of this "anti-gravity" aspect of the technology. This rumor has not been verified, but it is interesting.

Now, concerning the "time anomalies such as a change in the rate that time flows". Nothing of this kind of activity has been mentioned so far. However, it is not much of a stretch of the imagination to consider that if there is a Free energy process that displays an anti-gravity process then energy modifying fields could very well be associated with it as well.

The early developers of this technology were defiantly not looking for these kinds of phenomena and therefore were not equipped with the instruments to make meaningful measurements of these kinds of changes.

In the future, if this technology is reversed engineered, I'm sure every effort will be invoked to search for these very same non-classical effects (and others).

Mark McKay
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