Energetic Forum  
Facebook Twitter Google+ Pinterest LinkedIn Delicious Digg Reddit WordPress StumbleUpon Tumblr Translate Addthis Aaron Murakami YouTube 2020 ENERGY CONFERENCE - PRE-REGISTER NOW!!!!

2020 Energy Science & Technology Conference
PRE-REGISTER NOW!!!
http://energyscienceconference.com


Go Back   Energetic Forum > >
   

Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

* NEW * BEDINI RPX BOOK & DVD SET: BEDINI RPX

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #271  
Old 10-02-2019, 05:49 AM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Nope

No moving on until you post the answer here in response to the question. Don’t point to it. Don’t link to it. Just post the answer here.

So this is the 17th refusal to answer? Which force, acknowledged and accepted by physics is your Lorentz Force? One word is still all you have to post.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2019 at 05:52 AM.
Reply With Quote

Download SOLAR SECRETS by Peter Lindemann
Free - Get it now: Solar Secrets

  #272  
Old 10-02-2019, 06:55 AM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
This too is what I have observed in the HIGH-MIND, It's not that the
person actual is gifted with a higher mind than say the next person, it's
just that they think they have something that they don't.

Whenever the high-mind kicks in it will not submit. It will not be open
to any demand and it will never make peace. All you see at this point
is "stubbornness and rebellion" which according to the ancient text is
just the same as "Witchcraft"

This is the programming we see in the so called HIGHER learning outlets
controlled by socialistic govt run schools. Dave is trying to instruct bi and
bi has an open thread for discussion but won't submit to any line of
reasoning outside his sphere.

Even the smallest of children playing together submit to one another.

This is not how the HIGH MIND works, it is unreasonable.

yet we see bi calling out to Turion daily, why? HI TURION bi calls
out. HI TURION, day after day. For what purpose? Why will he call out
to Dave when he has no intention of listening to anything reasonable
Dave has to offer. Simple, bi is trying to justify his viewpoint and
nothing else matters.
__________________
 

Last edited by BroMikey; 10-02-2019 at 07:00 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #273  
Old 10-02-2019, 01:49 PM
Quantum_well Quantum_well is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 41
Reality.

Turion, the Pied Piper, and Bromikey promoting the Emperors new clothes.
A Watt balance uses Lorentz force to measure mass to an accuracy of eleven parts in a billion.
The point is, if we disregard the physical constants absolutely absolutely nothing would work. From your body to your Sat Nav everything depends on constants.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #274  
Old 10-02-2019, 03:13 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantum_well View Post
A Watt balance uses Lorentz force to measure mass to an accuracy of eleven parts in a billion.
Please explain how this statement has anything to do with what we have been talking about or how it applies to ANYTHING I have put forth about my generator or the 3 Battery system. I too can throw out meaningless lines quoted from Wikipedia. It doesn’t make me right or intelligent.

Nothing I have shown violates ANY of the physics constants. Do you even know what they are? Or just another pseudoscientist? Because this one post by you reveals everything anybody needs to know about you or your value in discussions on this forum.


Still waiting bi.
Sending your alter ego to spread garbage isn’t going to stop me. Which force, acknowledged and accepted by physics is your Lorentz Force? One word is still all you have to post. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Yoo Hoo. Can you hear me bi?
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2019 at 03:18 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #275  
Old 10-02-2019, 04:32 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Turion's game, continued

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
No moving on until you post the answer here in response to the question. Don’t point to it. Don’t link to it. Just post the answer here.

So this is the 17th refusal to answer? Which force, acknowledged and accepted by physics is your Lorentz Force? One word is still all you have to post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
What is wrong with the one word answer I posted long ago in #228?
Nothing is wrong with it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
OK. Then the answer is good. You have it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
One word is still all you have to post.
Hi Turion,

I don't have to post anything. But I did answer your question and you acknowledged that. I don't know what your game is and don't want to play. I doubt that you would have anything relevant or interesting to post anyway, just the same old BS.

17? How many questions have I asked you that go unanswered? How many times have I requested proof of your 2000/300 claim which you refuse?

Regards,

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #276  
Old 10-02-2019, 04:34 PM
Quantum_well Quantum_well is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 41
Hi.

Turion and BroMikey, I just love the way you pour scorn on the books.
Just read up Faraday, Joseph Henry and most of all Maxwell.
Tesla was a tinkerer, I don't think he understood Einstein's work at all. He didn't invent coupled inductors nor was he first with a "rotating magnetic field".
Surely getting self oxidation out of a battery has got to be a violation of something.
Likewise getting 2k plus Watts from 300 watts input has got to be a violation of something else!
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #277  
Old 10-02-2019, 06:13 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Clarification

Quantum,
I don’t disagree with anything in any of the textbooks. All the laws and rules that have been established are absolutely correct when applied to closed systems. Which is what the were FORMULATED for. But those same laws do NOT necessarily apply to open systems or systems where ground is not -0- voltage because the were not FORMULATED for those systems. That does not mean that NONE of them apply. It simply means that in some instances they CANNOT apply.

It is simple physics. Believe it or don’t. I don’t really care. I notice you made no attempt to explain or defend how the statement you made in your last post applies. Because it DOESN’T. It was just another attempt by someone who read a book once to impress us with his knowledge. It might surprise you to know I have read a few books too.

As to a machine where 2000 watts is the output and only 300 watts is the input. “”Got to be a violation” is not very scientific now is it?

bi agreed the rotor with magnets could be turned freely with 300 watts or less. He agreed that the coils could be built to output around 340 volts (I don’t actually remember the number he agreed to, so it might have been less than that) so it really boils down to whether enough coils could be put around a rotor. He says you can’t do that because of something called Lorentz Force which he claims is some kind of interaction between the rotor and the stator. Since this type of interaction falls under the laws of PHYSICS, I asked him which of the four forces recognized and accepted by physics (It’s in the textbooks. Ever heard of those?) this Lorentz Force actually is. Because in Physics (textbooks AGAIN) there are only FOUR forces and his Lorentz Force ain’t one of them. He points to this or that and links to pages that have the word on them, but for some reason he refuses to post that word here. Because when he does...if he EVER does...we can continue our conversation and I can show that he has no idea what he is talking about. He read a book once, so he thinks he knows everything. The real learning comes from building things on the bench. Trying 10,000 things that do not work before you find one that does. If you believe that something cannot be done because the book says it cannot, simply do it in a way that the book does not understand HOW to do.

So, once again bi... Which force, acknowledged and accepted by physics is your Lorentz Force? One word is still all you have to post. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Yoo Hoo. Can you hear me bi?
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2019 at 06:33 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #278  
Old 10-02-2019, 06:42 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Physics

Just for fun, here is a PHYSICS interpretation of what happens with a generator. Shall we accept the PHYSICS TEXTBOOK VERSION or shall we listen to bystander. You notice NO MENTION is made or Lorentz Force. Wonder WHY????

https://www.physicscentral.com/exper...20080506025126
ASK A PHYSICIST ANSWERS
Why does an electric generator slow down when you begin to use the power it is generating?
An ordinary electric generator produces electric power by spinning a strong magnet inside a set of wire coils. As the magnet spins, its magnetic field sweeps across the coils and gives rise to electric fields in those coils. This effect, in which changing or moving magnetic fields produce electric fields, is a fundamental piece of electromagnetic theory, and allows the spinning magnet to push on electric charges that exist within the wire coils.


But if the generator's power isn't being used, its coils carry no electric current. The fields from the spinning magnet are pushing charges around, but those charges have nowhere to go. It isn't until you begin using the generated power that current can flow through the coils. When that happens, something new appears: magnetic fields around the coils themselves. As current flows through the coils, the coils become electromagnets.
In accordance with a property known as Lenz's law, each coil's magnetism pushes against the spinning magnet's motion, first to slow the magnet's approach and then to delay its departure. By fighting the spinning magnet's rotation, the coils are making it do work on them and extracting energy from its spinning motion. To keep the magnet spinning, something must continuously restore this rotational energy and that something is usually an engine.

There you have it. Now pay attention children. According to Tesla, increasing the capacitance of the coil inhibits the self induction, which inhibits the generation of electricity in the coil, which delays the point at which it turns into an electromagnet, which means the approaching magnet is NOT repelled as it approaches and the coil turns into a repelling electromagnet when the rotor magnet has reached top dead center, pushing it away in the direction of rotation.

It’s ALL Physics and it’s all exactly according to the ”LAWS”

And it means I can run a motor on 300 watts and rotate magnets past as MANY COILS as I can fit around it and produce 2000 watts or MORE.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2019 at 07:01 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #279  
Old 10-02-2019, 08:16 PM
NROC NROC is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Posts: 23
Signing Off

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Just for fun, here is a PHYSICS interpretation of what happens with a generator. Shall we accept the PHYSICS TEXTBOOK VERSION or shall we listen to bystander. You notice NO MENTION is made or Lorentz Force. Wonder WHY????

https://www.physicscentral.com/exper...20080506025126
ASK A PHYSICIST ANSWERS
Why does an electric generator slow down when you begin to use the power it is generating?
An ordinary electric generator produces electric power by spinning a strong magnet inside a set of wire coils. As the magnet spins, its magnetic field sweeps across the coils and gives rise to electric fields in those coils. This effect, in which changing or moving magnetic fields produce electric fields, is a fundamental piece of electromagnetic theory, and allows the spinning magnet to push on electric charges that exist within the wire coils.


But if the generator's power isn't being used, its coils carry no electric current. The fields from the spinning magnet are pushing charges around, but those charges have nowhere to go. It isn't until you begin using the generated power that current can flow through the coils. When that happens, something new appears: magnetic fields around the coils themselves. As current flows through the coils, the coils become electromagnets.
In accordance with a property known as Lenz's law, each coil's magnetism pushes against the spinning magnet's motion, first to slow the magnet's approach and then to delay its departure. By fighting the spinning magnet's rotation, the coils are making it do work on them and extracting energy from its spinning motion. To keep the magnet spinning, something must continuously restore this rotational energy and that something is usually an engine.

There you have it. Now pay attention children. According to Tesla, increasing the capacitance of the coil inhibits the self induction, which inhibits the generation of electricity in the coil, which delays the point at which it turns into an electromagnet, which means the approaching magnet is NOT repelled as it approaches and the coil turns into a repelling electromagnet when the rotor magnet has reached top dead center, pushing it away in the direction of rotation.

It’s ALL Physics and it’s all exactly according to the ”LAWS”

And it means I can run a motor on 300 watts and rotate magnets past as MANY COILS as I can fit around it and produce 2000 watts or MORE.
This is spot on. The fact is that the Lenz force does not appear instantaneously, it takes time for the currents to form in the materials, and therefore if your talented enough you can build a motor that has only frictional losses. NO LOSS DUE TO LENZ. Whether you do it by setting your impedance of the coil to avoid it like dave has, or whether you make your rotating element non circular like jim murray did in his dynaflux machine (which was patented by the way and authorised by the patent office as doing what it said it would do) is up to you. THESE DEVICES EXIST. Although they have received little attention by the main engineering body, which is an absolute afront to science in my opinion, they work.

With these motors it doesnt cost you anywhere near as much to turn you motor or generator as a conventional motor or generator. If you take it a step further like dave has then you can keep adding more coils to get more power out, you couple that with a 3bgs and your laughing. There really is no refuting these lenz free motors because they have to be demonstrated to a patent officer before approval. In the dynaflux machine even the non linear dynamics are shown in the patent just for engineers to see how it works because otherwise ot wouldnt have been accepted.

This is why i find bistanders opinion so dumb. 1) because he just quotes wikipedia and 2) because published info is already available.

I guess quantum well is the new bistander lol.

Anyway i wont waste anymore time driving traffic to biproducts thread. Dave only responds to you because he feels like it. We are doing the work behind the scenes to take these things much further than has been done already. I hope in the future people will thank Matt and Dave for how much they gave freely to people.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #280  
Old 10-02-2019, 08:23 PM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantum_well View Post
Turion and BroMikey, I just love the way you pour scorn on the books.
Just read up Faraday, Joseph Henry and most of all Maxwell.
Tesla was a tinkerer, I don't think he understood Einstein's work at all.
Books are for a controlled environment, here are the answers, say that
and you pass. This book reading bit is for beginners who can't find their
heads with both hands. Books carved in braille over laid with gold only
impress me if they make sense.

A. Einstein was a puppet/front man for the Masonic brotherhood whether
he liked it or not saying what he was told to say. The govt controlled
curriculum for the past 50 plus yrs was developed by secret societies
who are devote Satanists and don't hide it.

This is why everything you know is a lie.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #281  
Old 10-02-2019, 09:37 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Good--- back on topic

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Just for fun, here is a PHYSICS interpretation of what happens with a generator. Shall we accept the PHYSICS TEXTBOOK VERSION or shall we listen to bystander. You notice NO MENTION is made or Lorentz Force. Wonder WHY????
Why? My guess is the author's answer was fashioned towards students of high school level and he attempted to keep it simple.

As long as we're linking web articles, look at this one.

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...vU9YSgvgElZvS5

From there:
Quote:
Motor vs. Generator
Lorentz-force electro-mechanical transduction is bilateral. An electric motor uses it to convert electrical power into rotational power. An electrical generator uses it to convert rotational power into electrical power.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
https://www.physicscentral.com/exper...20080506025126
ASK A PHYSICIST ANSWERS
Why does an electric generator slow down when you begin to use the power it is generating?
An ordinary electric generator produces electric power by spinning a strong magnet inside a set of wire coils. As the magnet spins, its magnetic field sweeps across the coils and gives rise to electric fields in those coils. This effect, in which changing or moving magnetic fields produce electric fields, is a fundamental piece of electromagnetic theory, and allows the spinning magnet to push on electric charges that exist within the wire coils.


But if the generator's power isn't being used, its coils carry no electric current. The fields from the spinning magnet are pushing charges around, but those charges have nowhere to go. It isn't until you begin using the generated power that current can flow through the coils. When that happens, something new appears: magnetic fields around the coils themselves. As current flows through the coils, the coils become electromagnets.
In accordance with a property known as Lenz's law, each coil's magnetism pushes against the spinning magnet's motion, first to slow the magnet's approach and then to delay its departure. By fighting the spinning magnet's rotation, the coils are making it do work on them and extracting energy from its spinning motion. To keep the magnet spinning, something must continuously restore this rotational energy and that something is usually an engine.
My comment inserted below in blue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
There you have it. Now pay attention children. According to Tesla, increasing the capacitance of the coil inhibits the self induction,
{Tesla says neutralize opposed to "inhibits", but that's minor. However what follows is written by Turion and nowhere reads nor is inferred or implied by Tesla's patent.}


which inhibits the generation of electricity in the coil, which delays the point at which it turns into an electromagnet, which means the approaching magnet is NOT repelled as it approaches and the coil turns into a repelling electromagnet when the rotor magnet has reached top dead center, pushing it away in the direction of rotation.
There are two separate sources of voltage in a generator coil when the armature is moving in the field. One is due to the self induction which would be present for a changing current even without armature motion. Second is the generated voltage due to the motion. The added capacitance in the coil can neutralize the self inductance but not the generated voltage due to motion. Coil current will develop due to this generated voltage when a load is connected. This current (moving charge) is responsible for Lorentz force which opposes the motion.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
It’s ALL Physics and it’s all exactly according to the ”LAWS”

And it means I can run a motor on 300 watts and rotate magnets past as MANY COILS as I can fit around it and produce 2000 watts or MORE.
Sorry. You don't get to choose which laws apply and which don't.

Regards,

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #282  
Old 10-02-2019, 09:49 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Yes, I hear (read, actually) you

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Quantum,
I don’t disagree with anything in any of the textbooks. All the laws and rules that have been established are absolutely correct when applied to closed systems. Which is what the were FORMULATED for. But those same laws do NOT necessarily apply to open systems or systems where ground is not -0- voltage because the were not FORMULATED for those systems. That does not mean that NONE of them apply. It simply means that in some instances they CANNOT apply.

It is simple physics. Believe it or don’t. I don’t really care. I notice you made no attempt to explain or defend how the statement you made in your last post applies. Because it DOESN’T. It was just another attempt by someone who read a book once to impress us with his knowledge. It might surprise you to know I have read a few books too.

As to a machine where 2000 watts is the output and only 300 watts is the input. “”Got to be a violation” is not very scientific now is it?

bi agreed the rotor with magnets could be turned freely with 300 watts or less. He agreed that the coils could be built to output around 340 volts (I don’t actually remember the number he agreed to, so it might have been less than that) so it really boils down to whether enough coils could be put around a rotor. He says you can’t do that because of something called Lorentz Force which he claims is some kind of interaction between the rotor and the stator. Since this type of interaction falls under the laws of PHYSICS, I asked him which of the four forces recognized and accepted by physics (It’s in the textbooks. Ever heard of those?) this Lorentz Force actually is. Because in Physics (textbooks AGAIN) there are only FOUR forces and his Lorentz Force ain’t one of them. He points to this or that and links to pages that have the word on them, but for some reason he refuses to post that word here. Because when he does...if he EVER does...we can continue our conversation and I can show that he has no idea what he is talking about. He read a book once, so he thinks he knows everything. The real learning comes from building things on the bench. Trying 10,000 things that do not work before you find one that does. If you believe that something cannot be done because the book says it cannot, simply do it in a way that the book does not understand HOW to do.

So, once again bi... Which force, acknowledged and accepted by physics is your Lorentz Force? One word is still all you have to post. Waiting. Waiting. Waiting. Yoo Hoo. Can you hear me bi?
Why is it so important to you that I post a certain word, again?

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #283  
Old 10-02-2019, 09:50 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Step TWO

You can build the machine I described above with 12 coils on it and ATTEMPT to get 2000 watts out of it. You WILL, but only for a minute or two until your motor BURNS up. I should know. I built it and I burnt up SEVERAL motors. My coils were neutral, meaning they caused the motor to neither speed up nor slow down. With only a couple coils on the machine it output as expected and input does not seem affected. But with 12 coils on the machine there is a drag that causes thr motor to draw high amps. I TRIED to explain this to bistander, that there was magnetic drag because of the attraction of the magnets to the iron cores of the coils. And that I had used magnets to offset or neutralize this attraction. His response was to babble on about how there is no clogging at speed so my magnetic neutralization was an unnecessary waste. What he HASN’T gotten through his head is that clogging has NOTHING to do with what I am talking about. Magnetic drag is REAL, and you have to compensate for it or pay the price in high amp draw and burnt up motors.

And the FINAL step is to learn to run the motor on the 3 battery system where you can recover at LEAST 70% of the input energy and recycle it. Or don’t I have shared as much as we are willing to share. We are now working behind the scenes with folks like NROC who, because of his Physics background, can look at some things most Electrical Engineers simply dismiss and say “maybe” there is something to that. I know has built some things that work based on what we have told him. We shared it all here. People just don’t listen. They aren’t willing to spend the time to build something and learn for themselves. We spent thousands of hours and thousands of dollars on this stuff. Nobody handed us anything. We owe nobody anything. Build it or don’t. Learn, or keep feeling your way in the dark. It’s all up to you. We left a path to follow. What you do is your choice.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2019 at 09:53 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #284  
Old 10-02-2019, 10:00 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Tesla’s patent

bi,
You are right that Tesla only actually stated that increased capacitance neutralizes self induction. The rest of what happens is a result of limiting self induction. But once again you resort to nit picking.

It should also be made cleartgatTeslawas talking about his concept as it applied to MOTORS. I doubt he mentioned generators.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist
Reply With Quote
  #285  
Old 10-02-2019, 11:15 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Reading

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
bi,
You are right that Tesla only actually stated that increased capacitance neutralizes self induction. The rest of what happens is a result of limiting self induction. But once again you resort to nit picking.

It should also be made cleartgatTeslawas talking about his concept as it applied to MOTORS. I doubt he mentioned generators.
Hi Turion,

In patent #512,340, Tesla never mentioned motor, or generator. You will no doubt say I am nit-picking, but this really demonstrates how you comprehend what you read or observe. Big differences between what you report and fact.

Regards,

bi
__________________
 

Last edited by bistander; 10-03-2019 at 02:26 AM. Reason: Fixed busted quote
Reply With Quote
  #286  
Old 10-02-2019, 11:35 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Drag?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
You can build the machine I described above with 12 coils on it and ATTEMPT to get 2000 watts out of it. You WILL, but only for a minute or two until your motor BURNS up. I should know. I built it and I burnt up SEVERAL motors. My coils were neutral, meaning they caused the motor to neither speed up nor slow down. With only a couple coils on the machine it output as expected and input does not seem affected. But with 12 coils on the machine there is a drag that causes thr motor to draw high amps. I TRIED to explain this to bistander, that there was magnetic drag because of the attraction of the magnets to the iron cores of the coils. And that I had used magnets to offset or neutralize this attraction. His response was to babble on about how there is no clogging at speed so my magnetic neutralization was an unnecessary waste. What he HASN’T gotten through his head is that clogging has NOTHING to do with what I am talking about. Magnetic drag is REAL, and you have to compensate for it or pay the price in high amp draw and burnt up motors.

And the FINAL step is to learn to run the motor on the 3 battery system where you can recover at LEAST 70% of the input energy and recycle it. Or don’t I have shared as much as we are willing to share. We are now working behind the scenes with folks like NROC who, because of his Physics background, can look at some things most Electrical Engineers simply dismiss and say “maybe” there is something to that. I know has built some things that work based on what we have told him. We shared it all here. People just don’t listen. They aren’t willing to spend the time to build something and learn for themselves. We spent thousands of hours and thousands of dollars on this stuff. Nobody handed us anything. We owe nobody anything. Build it or don’t. Learn, or keep feeling your way in the dark. It’s all up to you. We left a path to follow. What you do is your choice.
Hi Turion,

Drag is a term seldom used in the field of electric machinery. Even when prefixed as magnetic drag, it can be vague. Isn't what you describe as drag what I refer to as torque opposing rotation in a generator?

Regards,

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #287  
Old 10-03-2019, 01:35 AM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
over

bi,
You can do what you want. I brought this info to the forum to help people. That you choose to ignore the statements of support for my conclusions and position by NROC, who is both a Physicist and an Electrical Engineer who has actually INVESTIGATED many of the claims that Matt and I have made as well as the claims of others, speaks volumes about your true purpose here.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist
Reply With Quote
  #288  
Old 10-03-2019, 01:35 AM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Saved

Quote:
Originally Posted by NROC View Post
This is spot on. The fact is that the Lenz force does not appear instantaneously, it takes time for the currents to form in the materials, and therefore if your talented enough you can build a motor that has only frictional losses. NO LOSS DUE TO LENZ. Whether you do it by setting your impedance of the coil to avoid it like dave has, or whether you make your rotating element non circular like jim murray did in his dynaflux machine (which was patented by the way and authorised by the patent office as doing what it said it would do) is up to you. THESE DEVICES EXIST. Although they have received little attention by the main engineering body, which is an absolute afront to science in my opinion, they work.

With these motors it doesnt cost you anywhere near as much to turn you motor or generator as a conventional motor or generator. If you take it a step further like dave has then you can keep adding more coils to get more power out, you couple that with a 3bgs and your laughing. There really is no refuting these lenz free motors because they have to be demonstrated to a patent officer before approval. In the dynaflux machine even the non linear dynamics are shown in the patent just for engineers to see how it works because otherwise ot wouldnt have been accepted.

This is why i find bistanders opinion so dumb. 1) because he just quotes wikipedia and 2) because published info is already available.

I guess quantum well is the new bistander lol.

Anyway i wont waste anymore time driving traffic to biproducts thread. Dave only responds to you because he feels like it. We are doing the work behind the scenes to take these things much further than has been done already. I hope in the future people will thank Matt and Dave for how much they gave freely to people.
Quoted for later use.
bi

First edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by NROC View Post
This is why i find bistanders opinion so dumb. 1) because he just quotes wikipedia and 2) because published info is already available.
I have over 1600 posts. I recall only a few times that I quoted Wikipedia. I do quote other references. And always indicate such when I do. I don't understand point 2. I regularly search and read already published info. But because it is published doesn't make it true. Just because I post something doesn't make it true. I strive to only post truth and fact, but being human, I can be fooled or make errors. And unlike some here, I appreciate being corrected (preferably politely) as that is a good method of learning. But the reader needs to beware and check everything they see on the interwebs.
__________________
 

Last edited by bistander; 10-03-2019 at 03:46 AM. Reason: Added comment
Reply With Quote
  #289  
Old 10-03-2019, 02:08 AM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
Hi Turion,

Drag is a term seldom used in the field of electric machinery. Even when prefixed as magnetic drag, it can be vague. Isn't what you describe as drag what I refer to as torque opposing rotation in a generator?

Regards,

bi
Bi writes " Hi Turion" /with a sigh/ his left wrist limp and
flopping over.

Here is the bi answer

bistander bistander is online now
Gold Member

Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,667
Electromagnetic
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Excuse me, which of the four forces is Lorentz Force? Repeating what you previously posted does not answer the question. That explanation did not include any of the FOUR specific forces which are part of our current physics model and you know it. There are only FOUR forces. Which one is it? What’s wrong bi, are you afraid to say the words? Come on, you can do it. We all know that as soon as you DO you will have proven me right which is why you are going to such incredible lengths to avoid it when you obviously know the answer. You’re doing everything you can to keep from saying the words, but we’re all still waiting.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
Lorentz force, as it is commonly called, is that force between an electric charge and a magnetic field as described by Lorentz's force law. ...
What part of electric and magnetic do you not understand?
__________________
 

Last edited by BroMikey; 10-03-2019 at 02:10 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #290  
Old 10-03-2019, 02:16 AM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
But no proof

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
bi,
You can do what you want. I brought this info to the forum to help people. That you choose to ignore the statements of support for my conclusions and position by NROC, who is both a Physicist and an Electrical Engineer who has actually INVESTIGATED many of the claims that Matt and I have made as well as the claims of others, speaks volumes about your true purpose here.
All this wonderful energy apparatus. Where is it? Still have it packed away Turion? Is NROC powering his University with it? Got proof of claims? No, just the same old BS. You've never have shown a valid demonstration to support claims and your arguments are weak and unconvincing.

I don't ignore NROC. I just disagree with him (or her, as the case may be). NROC is anonymous. Like me. I just deal with what he/she has written. I have no idea if credentials are true and don't much care. For all I know, NROC could be you under a different account. I'm not saying that is the case, and again I don't care.

Keep on trying. When you figure out it doesn't really work and wonder why, go back and read my posts. At least you try. Too bad you don't listen to reason. But I guess your fantasy is better than truth.

Regards,

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #291  
Old 10-03-2019, 04:08 AM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Back to School

Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
Too bad you don't listen to reason.
But I guess your fantasy is better than truth.



Bi yer such a cripple when it comes to basic book smarts


Gravity

Of the fundamental forces, gravity has the farthest reach, but it's the weakest in actual magnitude.

It is a purely attractive force which reaches through even the "empty" void of space to draw two masses toward each other. It keeps the planets in orbit around the sun and the moon in orbit around the Earth.

Gravitation is described under the theory of general relativity, which defines it as the curvature of spacetime around an object of mass. This curvature, in turn, creates a situation where the path of least energy is toward the other object of mass.


Electromagnetism

Electromagnetism is the interaction of particles with an electrical charge. Charged particles at rest interact through electrostatic forces, while in motion they interact through both electrical and magnetic forces.

For a long time, the electric and magnetic forces were considered to be different forces, but they were finally unified by James Clerk Maxwell in 1864, under Maxwell's equations. In the 1940s, quantum electrodynamics consolidated electromagnetism with quantum physics.

Electromagnetism is perhaps the most prevalent force in our world, as it can affect things at a reasonable distance and with a fair amount of force.

Weak Interaction

The weak interaction is a very powerful force that acts on the scale of the atomic nucleus. It causes phenomena such as beta decay. It has been consolidated with electromagnetism as a single interaction called the "electroweak interaction." The weak interaction is mediated by the W boson (there are two types, the W+ and W- bosons) and also the Z boson.

Strong Interaction

The strongest of the forces is the aptly-named strong interaction, which is the force that, among other things, keeps nucleons (protons and neutrons) bound together. In the helium atom, for example, it is strong enough to bind two protons together even though their positive electrical charges cause them to repulse each other.

In essence, the strong interaction allows particles called gluons to bind together quarks to create the nucleons in the first place. Gluons can also interact with other gluons, which gives the strong interaction a theoretically infinite distance, although it's major manifestations are all at the subatomic level.


Unifying the Fundamental Forces

Many physicists believe that all four of the fundamental forces are, in fact, the manifestations of a single underlying (or unified) force which has yet to be discovered. Just as electricity, magnetism, and the weak force were unified into the electroweak interaction, they work to unify all of the fundamental forces.

The current quantum mechanical interpretation of these forces is that the particles do not interact directly, but rather manifest virtual particles that mediate the actual interactions. All of the forces except for gravity have been consolidated into this "Standard Model" of interaction.

The effort to unify gravity with the other three fundamental forces is called quantum gravity. It postulates the existence of a virtual particle called the graviton, which would be the mediating element in gravity interactions. To date, gravitons have not been detected, and no theories of quantum gravity have been successful or universally adopted.
__________________
 

Last edited by BroMikey; 10-03-2019 at 04:15 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #292  
Old 10-03-2019, 04:30 AM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Sorry

sorry bi, but it works exactly as I stated. I’ve had different versions of the generator up and running many, many, MANY times over the years. Each version I built was an improvement over the prior version in both mechanical operation and electrical output. Each version, and there have been several, as I have documented in pictures and video on the forum, cost well over $1,000.00. I’m quite happy with the performance I’ve seen.

And no, it is not packed away. My big generator with 12 coils and 12 magnets on the rotor is down in Santa Clara at my machinists place. That’s a 7 hour minimum round trip.

I have two other versions here. Both are in pieces. One has places for 12 coils and a rotor with six magnets. That machine I only use for testing a couple coils at a time since it was built before I figured out magnetic neutralization and can’t run with all the coils in place. The other has places for 10 coils and has a rotor with 12 magnets. Unfortunately all the coils for both machines are SLAG, as overheating has been a problem from day one and the insulation melts off the coils destroying their output performance, as will as their ability to run “neutral.” It overheated the last time I ran the 10 coil machine so I cannibalizes coils from the 12 coil machine and it happened AGAIN. That’s several hundred dollars down the toilet in wire each time it happens. It is only recently that I figured out a solution, which I have tried with ONE coil and my coil tester and it seems to work. Extend the core out the back of the coil and into a piece of pvc filled with water. The water is heated and so is the pvc, but it dissipates the heat into the air enough to keep the core for overheating and melting the wire.

I have since wound eight more coils to put into the 10 coil machine, and as soon as I have time to wind a couple more coils, I will have enough to put the 10 coil machine back together. It may or may not put out 2000 watts, but will be enough to prove the machine works and those with a brain will understand that the 12 coil machine puts out MORE. Somehow the base plate for the whole machine went missing in the move and I had to get a new one, so putting it back together will be a process. But I’ll get there eventually.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist
Reply With Quote
  #293  
Old 10-03-2019, 09:30 AM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
..........It is only recently that I figured out a solution, which I have tried with ONE coil and my coil tester and it seems to work.
Extend the core out the back of the coil and into a piece of pvc filled with water. The water is heated and so is the pvc, but it dissipates the heat into the air enough to keep the core for overheating and melting the wire.

I have since wound eight more coils to put into the 10 coil machine, and as soon as I have time to wind a couple more coils, I will have enough to put the 10 coil machine back together. It may or may not put out 2000 watts, but will be enough to prove the machine works ..........so putting it back together will be a process. But I’ll get there eventually.

That's so awesome Dave. Glad so glad to hear you are moving along
really fast. You don't let any moss grow under your feet. You have got
me thinking about cooling again so when the time comes I won't burn
any coils. That's a lot of payola.

I would be interested to hear what you were going to say if only bi
would have answered the questions in chronological order. Maybe we
could all have learned something one more time. I guess bi doesn't
want to learn about how science connects to the process.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #294  
Old 10-03-2019, 05:05 PM
Turion's Avatar
Turion Turion is online now
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,449
Coil cores

A different core material, like ferrite, may ALSO solve the heating problem. Haven’t had TIME to test it yet.
__________________
“Advances are made by answering questions. Discoveries are made by questioning answers.”
—Bernhard Haisch, Astrophysicist
Reply With Quote
  #295  
Old 10-03-2019, 10:24 PM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
A different core material, like ferrite, may
ALSO solve the heating problem. Haven’t had TIME to test it yet.


I noticed that your current setup mechanically requires that your coils
be closed in from all sides. This means no air vents on either side while
plastic can be a pretty good insulator. So heat builds up normally and
has nowhere to go. I will assume you removed a couple of panels and
tried to blow heat off and it didn't work.

Your idea to use water cooling is compact allowing you to keep the present
format or layout for your generator head. With water cooling you can
drill one small hole to introduce a pipe so in this way no changes to your
setup are needed.


The make your system into an OPEN CAGE


Making your system into an open cage style generator might use air to
be pumped in and out of the box. A fan installed right on the drive shaft
wilth paddle blades 1/2" wide should be plenty to move some air without
much loss. Composite materials that are non magnetic can be used to
heatsink to the 1" extension of core material.

You can try them both and not change much which is good.

Normally if one of my motors gets a broke cage air paddle the motor
will begin to heat up within minutes or even seconds it will build up enough
to hurt my fingers when it is touched. The amount of air pumped seems
so small you wouldn't think that small paddle was doing much of anything.

You can barely feel the air moving yet it consistently removes tiny amounts
of heat which is keeping it warm only to the touch.
__________________
 

Last edited by BroMikey; 10-04-2019 at 06:26 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #296  
Old 10-04-2019, 01:33 PM
Quantum_well Quantum_well is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Posts: 41
Honesty.

Throughout this debate there's one thing I don't doubt and that's Turion's sincerity.
Turion believes in his findings and I think his dedication is admirable.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #297  
Old 10-04-2019, 03:28 PM
aljhoa aljhoa is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,264
One Day

Al
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #298  
Old 10-05-2019, 01:08 AM
BroMikey's Avatar
BroMikey BroMikey is online now
Platinum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 6,133
Quote:
Originally Posted by Quantum_well View Post
Throughout this debate there's one thing I don't doubt and that's Turion's sincerity.
Turion believes in his findings and I think his dedication is admirable.
The guy has 3 friggin masters degrees, he not as stupid as so many
insist. School teaches us that we were twisted, perverted from a young
age when we are most susceptible. Even thru all of that Dave got past
all the programming and found the truth.

He is not a fool. He is catching up to me.
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #299  
Old 10-28-2019, 05:01 AM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
Conflow Power

Hi all,

I'm not sure if this deserves a thread unto itself, so figured I'd throw it up here. I just stumbled across it today and in no way endorse it, nor do I have any connection to anybody connected to this. This is posted here as information only, and a place to start discussion. I am interested if anybody can supply additional information, and all opinions welcome.

ConFlow

From that link:

Quote:
ConFlow Power has developed a renewable generator using a combination of Nano technology and Nano film, coupled with natural gases in the atmosphere, to create a totally self-renewing power source, hence the name ConFlow for a ‘Continuous Flow’. ConFlow Power looks like a battery and acts like a battery, but is in fact a combination of an on-board generator and a capacitor, performing similarly to a battery or electric power source. The ConFlow Device can be used in a multitude of sectors, including electronics, automobiles, computing and mobile communications. It also has heavy industrial capabilities and applications that stretch into many, if not all, landscapes.
Who knows? Maybe this is Turion's new device.

Regards,

bi
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
  #300  
Old 10-28-2019, 05:42 PM
bistander bistander is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,682
ConFlow

Looks like someone thinks it deserves a separate thread. So let's use:

Conflow power.... unlimited harvesting from Nano tech and atmosphere
__________________
 
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
thread, post, nonsense, start, anonymous, add, exception, march, point, state, leave, respect, popularity, posts, reputation, face, checking, opposed, fact, acceptance, encourage, content, research, emphasize, 2kw

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



Please consider supporting Energetic Forum with a voluntary monthly subscription.

Choose your voluntary subscription

For one-time donations, please use the below button.


All times are GMT. The time now is 02:00 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v1.4.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Shoutbox provided by vBShout v6.2.8 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
2007-2015 Copyright - Energetic Forum - All Rights Reserved

Bedini RPX Sideband Generator

Tesla Chargers