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  #1  
Old 03-08-2019, 02:44 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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The bistander thread

Hello all,

Aaron has asked me to start my own thread so I do so here. I'll post my opinions and comments here with links to the source material. Feel at ease to use this thread if you desire.

Regards,

bi

Ref:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
...
You and iamnuts have until the end of next week to post a link to a linkedin profile, or something else showing your background in these matters because otherwise, you're both anonymous cowards shouting nonsense from the peanut gallery with your bullhorns - if you have one iota of confidence about the cynical drivel that you're so proudly ooze all over this thread, stop hiding behind a username. Deadline is March 16. The only exception is to start your own thread and post your nonsense there. You cannot state your point of what you want to see any more than you already have and no further post from either of you will add to that. 300 watts in and 2kw out? Not one more post will add to or emphasize that any more so post a new thread or leave.
Obviously I want to remain anonymous. I believe one should be judged by the content of their posts, not by reputation or popularity. Please respect this. As always, I encourage fact checking and research opposed to acceptance at face value.

Thanks.
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  #2  
Old 03-08-2019, 06:40 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Note to Turion

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Originally Posted by Turion View Post
...
Want a cheap metal cylinder as a heat sink? Dimes, pennies, nickles and quarters are all non-magnetic. I donít know which would make the BEST heat sink. Iím hoping for pennies stacked together since they would be cheapest.
That will give Eddy currents a place to flow and produce heat and counter torque.
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Old 03-08-2019, 07:43 PM
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Heat sink

You may be absolutely right. I tried it one time with a stack of pennies on ONE coil, and it seemed to help, but I havenít had time to test it. Time will tell. I donít take anybodyís word for anything. I test everything. I believe what I see on the bench.
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Old 03-08-2019, 09:43 PM
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Hi bistander.

Do you think Purcell gives a reasonable description of electro magnetic induction?
To my mind,if thatís the case,there is no way in which any combination of
magnets and wire can yield more out than in.
It surely then must follow that action-reaction is always going to hold true.
I looked at Eric Dollardís piece on capacitors (when I was a lad they were
called condensers) and I donít really understand what dielectric lines of force
are. Can you point me to an authoritative link to same?
Iím quite happy with science as it is,so much of the stuff we use these days
has got its roots in the basic principles and it all seems to work so well.
Of course thereís a whole heap more to be discovered, just a pity I wonít
be around to see it.
John.
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Old 03-09-2019, 12:43 AM
bistander bistander is online now
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Looks like it

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnuts View Post
Do you think Purcell gives a reasonable description of electro magnetic induction?
To my mind,if thatís the case,there is no way in which any combination of
magnets and wire can yield more out than in.
It surely then must follow that action-reaction is always going to hold true.
I looked at Eric Dollardís piece on capacitors (when I was a lad they were
called condensers) and I donít really understand what dielectric lines of force
are. Can you point me to an authoritative link to same?
Iím quite happy with science as it is,so much of the stuff we use these days
has got its roots in the basic principles and it all seems to work so well.
Of course thereís a whole heap more to be discovered, just a pity I wonít
be around to see it.
John.
Hi John,

I haven't been able to study either document near as much as I intend. What I've read and see so far, neither negate conventional theory. In fact, Eric talks about iron filings and the magnetic lines of force. I've not studied Eric's stuff much, but I gather he is his own authority.

A lot of talk here on this forum about dielectric fields. To me, a dielectric is an electric insulator which can be polarized by an electric field. Electric fields or electric lines of force can arrange light wheat shaft along those lines. Lines of force in electric or magnetic fields just help us visualize that which is invisible yet interacts with charges, materials and other fields.

Just my opinions.

bi
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Old 03-09-2019, 02:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
Hi John,

I haven't been able to study either document near as much as I intend. What I've read and see so far, neither negate conventional theory. In fact, Eric talks about iron filings and the magnetic lines of force. I've not studied Eric's stuff much, but I gather he is his own authority.

A lot of talk here on this forum about dielectric fields. To me, a dielectric is an electric insulator which can be polarized by an electric field. Electric fields or electric lines of force can arrange light wheat shaft along those lines. Lines of force in electric or magnetic fields just help us visualize that which is invisible yet interacts with charges, materials and other fields.

Just my opinions.

bi
Bi you might look a with a wider angle, as you can associate the dielectric as an insulator at a greater magnitude. For example the Earth and Sky as plates, where that inbetween is an insulator a dielectric until there is a breakdown through that insulator and you have lightning. The Earth has capacity to store energy.

What Dollard said was interesting because he saw that both the Inductor and Capacitor store energy, but they were two different facets of manipulating the geometry of force lines of a field. It's kind of interesting, I don't necessarily swallow the whole enchilada but I can chew it for a while and see if I like it. I might not be capable of understanding, but the thing is keeping an open mind.

I am entertaining the notion that a transmitting coil can be plate, and a receiving coil can be a plate. Distance is the insulator, but you can still transfer power from one to the other. We are so limited in our understanding of the nothing between everything, and it might be mechanics of dimension that we see as the tip of the iceberg.
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Old 03-09-2019, 03:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
A lot of talk here on this forum about dielectric fields. To me, a dielectric is an electric insulator which can be polarized by an electric field. Electric fields or electric lines of force can arrange light wheat shaft along those lines. Lines of force in electric or magnetic fields just help us visualize that which is invisible yet interacts with charges, materials and other fields.

Just my opinions.

bi
You are making claims that you know about these fields so I want to
see proof of your findings. Do you experiment on the bench? Or are all
of your conclusion's based off of what someone else has already found?

Please post any form of on the bench test results that proves your
statements about charge and fields.

I am watching the results with my test bed and know beyond a doubt.

More out than in is all around.
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Old 03-09-2019, 03:51 AM
bistander bistander is online now
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I do this

Quote:
Originally Posted by ilandtan View Post
Bi you might look a with a wider angle, as you can associate the dielectric as an insulator at a greater magnitude. For example the Earth and Sky as plates, where that inbetween is an insulator a dielectric until there is a breakdown through that insulator and you have lightning. The Earth has capacity to store energy.

What Dollard said was interesting because he saw that both the Inductor and Capacitor store energy, but they were two different facets of manipulating the geometry of force lines of a field. It's kind of interesting, I don't necessarily swallow the whole enchilada but I can chew it for a while and see if I like it. I might not be capable of understanding, but the thing is keeping an open mind.

I am entertaining the notion that a transmitting coil can be plate, and a receiving coil can be a plate. Distance is the insulator, but you can still transfer power from one to the other. We are so limited in our understanding of the nothing between everything, and it might be mechanics of dimension that we see as the tip of the iceberg.
Also the wide angle of the dynamos surrounding us.
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Old 03-09-2019, 03:58 AM
bistander bistander is online now
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What?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BroMikey View Post
You are making claims that you know about these fields so I want to
see proof of your findings. Do you experiment on the bench? Or are all
of your conclusion's based off of what someone else has already found?

Please post any form of on the bench test results that proves your
statements about charge and fields.

I am watching the results with my test bed and know beyond a doubt.

More out than in is all around.
I stated clearly those were "just my opinions". Not claims of fantastic unbelievable performance where one would be expected to provide proof.

Please do not post on this thread.
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Old 03-09-2019, 04:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bistander View Post
I stated clearly those were "just my opinions". Not claims of fantastic unbelievable performance where one would be expected to provide proof.

Please do not post on this thread.
All I am saying is if you are going to be making statements that seem
like you are calling fact you should be able to show them on a bench.

And don't give me that "Plz don't post" stuff. Back it up is all I am
saying. Really all I have to say. If you are going to talk put some
action behind it or it's just a copy and paste nothing burger.
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  #11  
Old 03-09-2019, 03:07 PM
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Photon.

https://youtu.be/s6RAZw2ocsg

This might do some good for someone.
John
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Old 03-09-2019, 04:17 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Recent post

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimboot View Post
... extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. ...
Thank you jimboot
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Old 03-09-2019, 05:54 PM
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Claims

A coil can be made to put out 165 watts or 35 volts at 1.2 amps
not extraordinary
The attraction of a rotor magnet to the iron in a coil core can be offset by a magnet on the stator aligned to a magnet on the opposite side of the rotor in repulsion. Simple physics.
not extraordinary (which in NO WAY affects the induction caused by the passing magnetic field of the magnet) therefore when it is loaded it in NO way affects the motor turning the rotor. This has been proven by dozens of people and is the BASIS for the Tesla patent I linked to.
not extraordinary

These three FACTS add up to the ability to produce large quantities of power with minimal input and 70% of THAT can be recovered by the 3 Battery system which you ALSO ridicule even though dozens of people have seen the results and the only people who have "disproven" it did NOT use the motor we said to use, did NOT use the boost module we said to use and did NOT use large batteries like we said it would not work without.

It may be too hard for some people to wrap their heads around, but that's not MY problem. Build it or don't. It is your right not to believe just as it is your right to insist on proof for claims you believe to be extraordinary, though they are NOT.

Just as it is MY right to believe that you are a sniveling low life coward who hides in the shadows and says whatever he wants because he is "anonymous." But you have insinuated that I am a liar and a fraud without revealing your identity which is chicken sh$# as far as I am concerned. So that is my opinion of YOU and your ridiculous statement: "Obviously I want to remain anonymous. I believe one should be judged by the content of their posts, not by reputation or popularity."

What is obvious to ME is you want to remain a coward. And while YOU are free to talk about whatever you wish here on your thread, and I believe that is only fair, it is my intention to come here every time you DO reference something on MY thread and share exactly what I think of you. Time and time again. Be seeing you
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  #14  
Old 03-09-2019, 08:01 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Cogging again

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
...
The attraction of a rotor magnet to the iron in a coil core can be offset by a magnet on the stator aligned to a magnet on the opposite side of the rotor in repulsion. Simple physics.
not extraordinary (which in NO WAY affects the induction caused by the passing magnetic field of the magnet) therefore when it is loaded it in NO way affects the motor turning the rotor. This has been proven by dozens of people and is the BASIS for the Tesla patent I linked to.
not extraordinary ...
The attraction of the rotor magnet to the iron is cogging. Yes, you can offset cogging. But you, yourself, claiming assistance from Tesla's works, state "which in NO WAY affects the induction caused by the passing magnetic field of the magnet". RIGHT. At last. It (the cogging neutralization) does not affect the induction caused by the passing magnetic field of the magnet. Meaning the passing magnet still induces a voltage on the coil as it moves pass the coil (and core). That is the generated voltage. If a load is connected to the coil, then a current will flow powering the load. This current reacts with the magnetic flux and causes a force or torque in this case which opposes rotation. This opposing torque increases the load on the prime mover.

To Turion and all,

Don't take my word for it, study how generators work from an accredited source, like a textbook, University based website, even Wikipedia.

And I'm not making any incredible claims. Only stating fact from hundreds of years of science.

Regards,

bi
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Old 03-09-2019, 08:30 PM
Iamnuts Iamnuts is offline
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Advice.

Turion has dug himself into a hole. The best thing to do in that situation is
to stop digging. He ought to retract the claim until heís able to support it with robust evidence.
Generators work basically as a result of relativity and I donít see much scope
in being able to enhance the process.
There must have been billions of electrical devices built by mankind and as far
as I know they always follow the rules.
Some of the cream of physicists never went near a laboratory yet they were
able to make huge advances in their particular field of research.
I would like nothing more tha Turionís claim to be bona fide.
I donít want to hide from anything I say and if anyone is interested Iím quite
willing to reveal my identity, just send PM.
John.
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Old 03-09-2019, 08:39 PM
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Induction.

Faraday's law and relativity
Edit
Faraday's law describes two different phenomena: the motional EMF generated by a magnetic force on a moving wire (see Lorentz force), and the transformer EMF this is generated by an electric force due to a changing magnetic field (due to the differential form of the MaxwellĖFaraday equation). James Clerk Maxwell drew attention to the separate physical phenomena in 1861.[21][22] This is believed to be a unique example in physics of where such a fundamental law is invoked to explain two such different phenomena.[23]

Einstein noticed that the two situations both corresponded to a relative movement between a conductor and a magnet, and the outcome was unaffected by which one was moving. This was one of the principal paths that led him to develop special relativity.[24]

Applications
Edit
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Old 03-10-2019, 12:05 AM
Iamnuts Iamnuts is offline
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You ought to watch this.

https://youtu.be/P_jGMD304N8

Enjoy!
John.
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Old 03-10-2019, 04:08 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Thanks John

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnuts View Post
Faraday's law and relativity
Edit
Faraday's law describes two different phenomena: the motional EMF generated by a magnetic force on a moving wire (see Lorentz force), and the transformer EMF this is generated by an electric force due to a changing magnetic field (due to the differential form of the MaxwellĖFaraday equation). James Clerk Maxwell drew attention to the separate physical phenomena in 1861.[21][22] This is believed to be a unique example in physics of where such a fundamental law is invoked to explain two such different phenomena.[23]

Einstein noticed that the two situations both corresponded to a relative movement between a conductor and a magnet, and the outcome was unaffected by which one was moving. This was one of the principal paths that led him to develop special relativity.[24]

Applications
Edit
Not many realize this "oddity" about EMF. I'm glad you posted it.

Here is something I find interesting.

https://www.studocu.com/en/document/...21/444339/view

At 1034 slides it is a quiet thorough treatment or outline.

Regards,

bi
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:43 PM
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@youarenuts

@youarenuts

Don't bother discussing Faraday without discussing the Faraday Disc generator that violates everything you believe - read this published paper from Princeton since you believe the academic world is an authority - it's shameful to be selective of what part of Faraday you want to mention while discarding what doesn't serve your narrative. https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph...aday_motor.pdf

What's that on page 6?

"Furthermore, the generated tension (Volt) is not affected by the amount of current(Ampere) which is drained from the generator, contrary to any other power source, and the power generation process is not reflected back to the prime mover as an additional work load."



That is a violation of your coveted and misunderstood Newton's 3rd Law of Motion, which doesn't apply to electricity anyway and there is NO LENZ'S LAW. While drawing a load from the Faraday Disc generator - there is ZERO back torque going back to the prime mover.

Some have claimed they measure back torque between 10-20% of what is "supposed to be there" but even if it is as high as 20%, it would still be a reduction of 80% of the drag - again, in complete violation of everything you are claiming.

This is the case with Bruce DePalma's N-Machine variation, Adam Trombly's closed magnetic path version and this is the case with Tewari's Space Power Generator version. That is also the case with my world's record highest voltage output N Machine.

All of these are generators that have no drag - the prime mover doesn't even know when a load is being drawn from the generator.

I mentioned the homopolar generator in response to your posts in Dave's thread and you ignored it. Why? Because it doesn't jive with your claims or belief system. I did mention the Evasion of the Essential - it's very strong with you for some reason.

That is but one of many low to no drag generator concepts. Without even mentioning a single other low to no drag generator such as Dave's or any other, the very existence of the Faraday Disc Generator defeats everything you have argued since your argument denies the possibility of its very existence. The only one who has dug themselves a hole is you.



Drag free generator and the scientific world is not up in turmoil over it while it violates your equal and opposite nonsense and it does not have the same associated Lenz effect.


Also, you bring up Faraday and you admit you don't even know what dielectric lines of force are!! The hole gets deeper for you.

bistander mentions dielectric material that is an "insulator".

Actually, conductors and insulators could switch names and it would more accurately describe their function. Conductors REFLECT - that is why 1/11 trillionths or so of the electromotive force moving over the wire actually penetrates the copper to get the electrons to move in the opposite direction. Virtually all of it for all practical purposes is REFLECTED - not conducted. And insulators such as dielectric materials don't insulate, they STORE and soak up dielectricity.




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Old 03-10-2019, 11:17 PM
Iamnuts Iamnuts is offline
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Engineers arenít that daft?

Engineers surely look for efficiency when designing motors etc.
I know that somewhere there is a group working on homopolar motors
using superconducting magnets and all the rest. I think theyíre getting
in the high eighty % efficiency bracket.
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Old 03-10-2019, 11:47 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Faraday's Paradox

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Faraday_paradox

Wikipedia isn't necessarily the ultimate authority, but it does give a good discussion on the topic and provides a number of references which can lead the interested reader to great resources.

And, if you don't believe things you can't touch, small homopolar dynamos are not terribly difficult to construct.

bi

{edit}

An Investigation of the Homopolar Generator:
Determining the Impact of System Characteristics on Efficiency

by Jared Kirschner, Shane Moon

I did, and you should be able to find a PDF and download this paper. It goes through the characteristic equations including torque.
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Old 03-11-2019, 12:04 AM
Iamnuts Iamnuts is offline
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Who knows?

I'm not on one side or the other.
If Tewari's generator was any good we'd all have one by now.
If the laws of induction don't hold true the present definition of
mass is down the pan.
Anything that is an open system doesn't really cut it in the context
of true overunity. Let's call that one an energy management system.
John
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Old 03-11-2019, 12:09 AM
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Afterthought.

Would love to know how to plot diectric lines of force.
Wikipedia seems lacking on that one.
John.
Let's have some dialectic on the dielectric!!
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Old 03-11-2019, 01:14 AM
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efficiency vs coefficient of performance

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnuts View Post
Engineers surely look for efficiency when designing motors etc.
I know that somewhere there is a group working on homopolar motors
using superconducting magnets and all the rest. I think they’re getting
in the high eighty % efficiency bracket.

You have no idea of the difference between efficiency and coefficient of performance. All free energy machines are 100% efficient or less. You don't even have the fundamentals correct nor do you know the distinctions. A homopolar generator can be 80% efficient while producing 250% more on the output than you provide on the input. You seem completely unaware of why this is true or how it can be.



My refrigerator is 90% something efficient but moves heat in the amount of about 200% more than the electrical equivalent of what the electric compressor uses. Over TWICE as much work is done than what I pay for to run the refrigerator.



There you are again, incapable of acknowledging your ignorance in these matters when pointed out. Your comments blatantly ignores the FACT that it is acknowledged in the conventional academic world, Princeton, etc. that UNLIKE normal generators, there is no back-torque produced when electricity is drawn from the generator completely flushing your nonsensical propaganda down the drain.
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Old 03-11-2019, 01:59 AM
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Princeton, homopolar and torque

From a quick search I do not find a lot of literature from Princeton on the subject but several I was able to view did in fact mention back torque of the homopolar generator. Here's one.

https://aapt.scitation.org/doi/abs/1...ournalCode=ajp

Quote:
Published Online: 22 December 2014
Accepted: August 2014
Energy conservation and Poynting's theorem in the homopolar generator
American Journal of Physics 83, 72 (2015); https://doi.org/10.1119/1.4895389
Christopher F. Chybaa)
Department of Astrophysical Sciences and Woodrow Wilson School of Public and International Affairs, Princeton University, Princeton, New Jersey 08544
Kevin P. Handb)
Jet Propulsion Laboratory, California Institute of Technology, Pasadena, California 91109
Paul J. Thomasc)
Department of Physics and Astronomy, University of Wisconsin, Eau Claire, Wisconsin 54702
more...
Hide Affiliations
a)Electronic mail: cchyba@princeton.edu

b)Electronic mail: Kevin.P.Hand@jpl.nasa.gov

c)Electronic mail: thomaspj@uwec.edu

Topics
ABSTRACT
Most familiar applications of Poynting's theorem concern stationary circuits or circuit elements. Here, we apply Poynting's theorem to the homopolar generator, a conductor moving in a background magnetic field. We show that the electrical power produced by the homopolar generator equals the power lost from the deceleration of the rotating Faraday disk due to magnetic braking and review the way that magnetic braking arises within Poynting's theorem.
Highlighted passage (which I did) in the abstract confirms generator torque.

bi
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Old 03-11-2019, 02:54 AM
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Homopolar generator = low to no drag generator

Any backtorque is a fraction of what Lenz's law would predict. I'm a builder and have built a handful of small scale versions. You can measure the rpm with the spinning magnet unloaded then and then load the generator and you can see there is virtually no difference in rpm exactly as the Princeton paper states.



When I say unloaded, it WILL have the brush contact to the magnet, which should be there and in an unloaded condition compared to loaded, nothing changes. The changes that are reported by many people who have experience claim up to a max of about 20% - still meaning there is a 80% reduction.



I really could care less what Princeton says, but being that such heavy value is placed on credentialed academics by you and nutso, that is why I referenced it and there are a lot of references in conventional academics that agree 100% with what I'm saying as well as references that disagree. What that actually means is that there is no inherent value in what any of them say because everyone may be saying something different. You and nutso will simply accept that which agrees with what you already agree while discarding what does not even if it does come from published papers in the academic world.



The homopolar generator concept is a low drag to no drag generator that violates Lenz's Law to a significant and indisputable degree and it doesn't matter what references you point to that disagree because I have hands on experience, which you do not have with regards to these generators, that tells me different.



This fact is so established that even the Pentagon put a gag order on Adam Tromly's homopolar generator patent because they were actually working on the same generator demonstrating the same "overunity" but what they did not know was that the patent applications in Europe were already in circulation thereby defeating their gag order. The bottom line is that there are homopolar type generators that produce hundreds of percent more work than it takes the prime mover to turn them and when drawing electricity from the generator portion, it is not reflected back to the prime mover defeating everything you and nutjob believe about drag free generators.



"It takes one white crow to prove that all crows are not black."
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Old 03-11-2019, 10:52 AM
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Black and White

Perhaps your white bird is a ghost.
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Old 03-11-2019, 11:52 AM
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Defeat.

Well bistander I have to admit defeat,Aaron clearly shows what an idiot I am.
Sincerely John.
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Old 03-11-2019, 11:53 AM
bistander bistander is online now
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Dielectric

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iamnuts View Post
Would love to know how to plot diectric lines of force.
Wikipedia seems lacking on that one.
John.
Let's have some dialectic on the dielectric!!
Perhaps Eric can explain that for you here.
https://borderlandsciences.org/journ...pacitance.html
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Old 03-11-2019, 01:32 PM
bistander bistander is online now
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Took a look

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
...https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph...aday_motor.pdf

What's that on page 6?[/FONT]
"Furthermore, the generated tension (Volt) is not affected by the amount of current(Ampere) which is drained from the generator, contrary to any other power source, and the power generation process is not reflected back to the prime mover as an additional work load."
...
I took a closer look into the reference. Here is the sentence prior to the one you quote. "Since the electrical energy produced by the homopolar generator is a pure direct current (DC) such as with a battery, the power is constant and always optimum."

So looking at a wider context and considering the two words which I highlighted in green, one sees it is a special situation of constant power and therefore no additional work load is reflected back to the prime mover. But the prime mover is supplying the base work load.

It is a strange statement in my opinion. But the rest of that paper and others I find all refer to generator torque. Just at the top of page 8 in the same paper: "Whereas the homopolar motor converts electrical energy (supplied by the cell) into mechanical energy, the homopolar generator does the reverse: providing mechanical energy to turn the disk and obtain an electromagnetic force (emf) and (if a current path exists) an electric current."

Regards,

bi
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