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  #1  
Old 05-27-2018, 10:26 PM
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"Your Basic Coil" As per Tesla

I would like to do the honor's in behalf of Turion and others who
near exhausted themselves giving away all of their hard work in
experimental form. To consolidate information about coils and how
they might be connected.

I will be back after everyone goes home. A special Thanks goes out to
Matt Jones who has freely given away much experimental data.

God Bless you All. BRB







Turion (Dave) QUOTE BELOW:::


Wind enough coils and experiment, and you will accumulate enough data
to understand as well as Tesla did. I attempted a while back to start a
thread dedicated to this entitled "Your Basic Coil" . I wanted to try and
get a bunch of folks to work together on this, but was jumped on
by naysayers who said it couldn't be done, and I got tired of arguing
with them and gave it up.

As I have said before, ANY COIL will perform as Tesla indicated at the
correct frequency. The trick is managing the variables.
Circumference of the rotor.

Number of magnets on the rotor RPM of the rotor
Core material of the coil
Number of wires on the coil
Length of wires on the coil.

I have six different coil configurations that will speed up under load.
It has given me lots of data to make some intelligent assumptions.
I quit investigating this when I got to the place where the coil I
WANTED to use for my generator project was doing what I wanted
it to do. I have freely SHARED that information on this forum so that
others could replicate and get the same results. Only a very FEW
have even bothered. I guess it's not important enough.
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Old 05-27-2018, 10:33 PM
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Old 05-27-2018, 11:04 PM
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Good idea

Hey Brodude,
Most are on vacation I'm sure.

I took Dave's advice on the coil replication. I'm still trying to find the ferrite to make coil cores. My experiments are few with multi-filar coils. I've tried bi and trifilar coils all the way up to 18 strand coil. What amazed me is the capacitive charge the 12 and 18 strand coils hold for long time after the rotor stops.

This is very important in the upright generator build.

Good thread idea.
Edit: Everyone interested in coil production should learn how to connect in series, in parallel, and series parallel.
wantomake
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Old 05-28-2018, 03:17 AM
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Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
Hey Brodude,
Most are on vacation I'm sure.


Good thread idea.
Edit: Everyone interested in coil production should learn how to connect in series, in parallel, and series parallel.
wantomake
Glad you like it.

First let's refresh a little on induction standards even if this is
all dealing with false currents.






https://www.electronics-tutorials.ws/inductor/inductance.html


Inductors do this by generating a self-induced emf within itself as a result of their changing magnetic field. In an electrical circuit, when the emf is induced in the same circuit in which the current is changing this effect is called Self-induction, ( L ) but it is sometimes commonly called back-emf as its polarity is in the opposite direction to the applied voltage.

When the emf is induced into an adjacent component situated within the same magnetic field, the emf is said to be induced by Mutual-induction, ( M ) and mutual induction is the basic operating principal of transformers, motors, relays etc. Self inductance is a special case of mutual inductance, and because it is produced within a single isolated circuit we generally call self-inductance simply, Inductance.

The basic unit of measurement for inductance is called the Henry, ( H ) after Joseph Henry, but it also has the units of Webers per Ampere ( 1 H = 1 Wb/A ).

Lenz’s Law tells us that an induced emf generates a current in a direction which opposes the change in flux which caused the emf in the first place, the principal of action and reaction. Then we can accurately define Inductance as being: “a coil will have an inductance value of one Henry when an emf of one volt is induced in the coil were the current flowing through the said coil changes at a rate of one ampere/second”.

In other words, a coil has an inductance, ( L ) of one Henry, ( 1H ) when the current flowing through the coil changes at a rate of one ampere/second, ( A/s ). This change induces a voltage of one volt, ( VL ) in it. Thus the mathematical representation of the rate of change of current through a wound coil per unit time is given as:
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Old 05-28-2018, 03:27 AM
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What is self Inductance and what does it mean when coils have none?


https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/joseph-henry/self-inductance/


Self Inductance

In 1832 Joseph Henry published his findings on the phenomenon of induced currents of a conductor on itself, later termed "self inductance," and presented it to be published in the October edition of the American Journal of Science (AJS). In the article, he explored phenomena where sparks were produced when a circuit of wire driven by a galvanic cell was interrupted or broken.

"When a small battery is moderately excited by diluted acid, and its poles, terminated by cups of mercury, are connected by a copper wire not more than a foot in length, no spark is perceived when the connection is either formed or broken; but if a wire thirty or forty feet long be used instead of the short wire, though no spark will be perceptible when the connection is made, yet when it is broken by drawing one end of the wire from its cup of mercury, a vivid spark is produced. If the action of the battery be very intense, a spark will be given by a short wire; in this case it is only necessary to wait a few minutes until the action partially subsides, or no more sparks are given; if the long wire be now substituted, a spark will again be obtained. The effect appears somewhat increased by coiling the wire into a helix; it seems also to depend in some measure on the length and thickness of the wire. I can account for these phenomena only by supposing the long wire to become charged with electricity, which, by its reaction on itself, projects a spark when the connection is broken." - (1)

The self inductance of a material is the response of a material to the changing magnetic field caused by either the interruption or resumption of electron flow within the conductor. The strength of this property is dependent upon various factors such as the resistance and arrangement of the conductor. He qualitatively determined the relative magnitudes of this newly discovered property in his later experiments by subjecting himself to the electric shocks as described:

"A handle of thick copper was soldered on each end of the large spiral at right angles to the ribbon, similar to those attached to the wires in Pixii's magneto-electric machine for giving shocks. When one of these was grasped by each hand and the contact broken, a shock was received which was felt at the elbows, and this was repeated as often as the contact was broken." - (2)

Using this method of measurement Joseph Henry discovered that uniformly coiled copper wire exhibits a stronger self inductance than straight wire of the same total length. Joseph Henry used numerous copper helices of varying lengths and thicknesses as described here.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:48 AM
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It takes years of study and winding to get answers so remember
that Joe Henry had some books to look at. I have always loved to
read text books.

Questions, Question Questions, I'm the same way. Required reading
for every school boy or you could wind one up and think later.

https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/induction-coils/Induction_Coils.pdf


https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/joseph-henry/copper-ribbon/#comp00004fdf91120000014c8213f7


https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/induction-coils/


https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/solenoid/


https://www.princeton.edu/ssp/joseph-henry-project/transformer/The_Alternate_Current_Transformer_in_The.pdf
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Old 05-28-2018, 07:13 AM
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Understand the data

Here's some basic info for you all. I have said this MANY times. EVERY COIL will speed up under load at the correct frequency. If it doesn't speed up under load, the RPM isn't high enough, or one of the other variables I have talked about is out of whack.

If I am not mistaken, Wantomake has a coil on his machine that has 2400 feet of #23 wire on it. He is using the same size rotor as I am with the same size magnets, the same number of magnets on the rotor and spaced the same distance apart.

He was able to achieve SUUL (speed up under load) at about 2,000 rpm according to my memory (which isn't that great, but he can verify.)

So our setup is the same EXCEPT for our coils. My coil, which is the same bobbin as his, with the same core and the same 2400 feet of #23 wire on it requires 2,800 rpm to achieve SUUL. Why does my coil require 800 rpm MORE? Is he better looking than me? Is he cheating?

My coil has 3 strands each 800 feet long. His coil has 12 strands each 200 feet long with 3 groups of four wires. The four wires within the group are connected in series. Wires in parallel connected in series (as Tesla states) give you more capacitance, and lower the frequency (or rpm) needed to achieve SUUL.

From the outside both coils appear to have 3 wires in parallel coming off them, but the reality is much different, as are the results.

Could his coil achieve SUUL at an even LOWER rpm? Certainly. Wire two groups of six strands in series, or better yet, wire all 12 strands in series.

But remember, the LONGER the wire, the more voltage. The more wires in parallel, the more AMPS. It is all about coil design and what you are trying to achieve.

I told Wantomake to use 12 strands because 12 is divisible by 1,2,3,4 and12. That gives you FIVE possible combinations of wires in series and parallel to experiment with.

24 strands gives you one more option since it is also divisible by 8. (5 total options)
30 is divisible by 5, 10, and 15, but not by 8 or 12 (7 total options)

More than that, the number of strands is almost unworkable unless you have a pro coil winding machine. But you get the idea. You WANT options. I thought 12 strands was a good number for people to experiment with, and if you have to put all the strands in series to get SUUL, at least you can DO it.

If you start with 12 strands in series on a bobbin with 2400 feet of #23, and it does not speed up under load, you have a problem. Your motor is just too SLOW. Once you have seen SUUL, you can start reducing the length of the strands by running more strands in parallel.

That's about all you are going to get from me on the subject. My philosophy is that if you don't build it yourself, you get exactly what you deserve.
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Last edited by Turion; 05-28-2018 at 02:53 PM.
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Old 05-28-2018, 08:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post

He was able to achieve SUUL (speed up under load) at about 2,000 rpm according to my memory (which isn't that great, but he can verify.)

So our setup is the same EXCEPT for our coils. My coil, which is the same bobbin as his, with the same core and the same 2400 feet of #23 wire on it requires 2,800 rpm to achieve SUUL. Why does my coil require 800 rpm MORE? Is he better looking than me? Is he cheating?

My coil has 3 strands each 800 feet long. His coil has 12 strands each 200 feet long with 3 groups of four wires. The four wires within the group are connected in series. Wires in parallel connected in series (as Tesla states) give you more capacitance, and lower the frequency (or rpm) needed to achieve SUUL.

From the outside both coils appear to have 3 wires in parallel coming off them, but the reality is much different, as are the results.

Could his coil achieve SUUL at an even LOWER rpm? Certainly. Wire two groups of six strands in series, or better yet, wire all 12 strands in series.

But remember, the LONGER the wire, the more voltage. The more wires in parallel, the more AMPS. It is all about coil design and what you are trying to achieve.



That's about all you are going to get from me on the subject. My philosophy is that if you don't build it yourself, you get exactly what you deserve.
Yes i think folks will work just as hard as you and I at something, not all
teachers of course even tho the govt run schools and state offices are
about the only thing left with the jobs for actual building something have
all gone over seas. It's a shame isn't it, a nation of instructors and govt
over lords, students with a $50,000 college bill living in the basement at
mom's house.

Times sure have changes since we were kids. Back then you didn't have to
send your wife out into the cesspool of lustful men and she could be a
stay at home mom teaching her children to be respectable. Forget that
now-a-days, it ain't those days anymore. You'll go belly up without
3,4,5 incomes. And since it takes so much to get two nickels to
rub together to do research who is left? Especially with no time after
the third job?

The 3 strands of 800 feet are just not as good as 12 strands of 200'
great comparison. I will continue to comb the old threads to see if
I can compile more data for here.

Here is my take on giving away free un-worked for secrets. They wouldn't
have no clue what to do with them anyway or know what it's for. Our
nation has been dumbed down so badly that if folks can't find it in a book
from teacher with a plug and play format, they are lost.

We are among the last of our breed. People drink bad water and get
neuro damage thru vaccines, chem-trail poisoning and more coupled
with a party time/miller time addictive scheduled,
I don't see there being big numbers doing advanced research on stuff
they can't wrap their heads around. All those burnt brain cells? Yeah.

Eventually even the best minds fail. What is left over are retired persons
who have the time and money after working for 40 years to get ahead.

We are few in number and as I have stated before, it is suppose to be
this way, lonely at the top.

Thanks for the nice reply full of hard data.
I'll try not to pester you to much
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Old 05-28-2018, 12:17 PM
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Special moment

Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Here's some basic info for you all. I have said this MANY times. EVERY COIL will speed up under load at the correct frequency. If it doesn't speed up under load, the RPM isn't high enough, or one of the other variables I have talked about is out of whack.

If I am not mistaken, Wantomake has a coil on his machine that has 2400 feet of #23 wire on it. He is using the same size rotor as I am with the same size magnets, the same number of magnets on the rotor and spaced the same distance apart.

He was able to achieve SUUL (speed up under load) at about 2,000 rpm according to my memory (which isn't that great, but he can verify.)

So our setup is the same EXCEPT for our coils. My coil, which is the same bobbin as his, with the same core and the same 2400 feet of #23 wire on it requires 2,800 rpm to achieve SUUL. Why does my coil require 800 rpm MORE? Is he better looking than me? Is he cheating?

My coil has 3 strands each 800 feet long. His coil has 12 strands each 200 feet long with 3 groups of four wires. The four wires within the group are connected in series. Wires in parallel connected in series (as Tesla states) give you more capacitance, and lower the frequency (or rpm) needed to achieve SUUL.

From the outside both coils appear to have 3 wires in parallel coming off them, but the reality is much different, as are the results.

Could his coil achieve SUUL at an even LOWER rpm? Certainly. Wire two groups of six strands in series, or better yet, wire all 12 strands in series.

But remember, the LONGER the wire, the more voltage. The more wires in parallel, the more AMPS. It is all about coil design and what you are trying to achieve.

I told Wantomake to use 12 strands because 24 is divisible by 1,2,3,4 and12. That gives you FIVE possible combinations of wires in series and parallel to experiment with.

24 strands gives you one more option since it is also divisible by 8. (5 total options)
30 is divisible by 5, 10, and 15, but not by 8 or 12 (7 total options)

More than that, the number of strands is almost unworkable unless you have a pro coil winding machine. But you get the idea. You WANT options. I thought 12 strands was a good number for people to experiment with, and if you have to put all the strands in series to get SUUL, at least you can DO it.

If you start with 12 strands in series on a bobbin with 2400 feet of #23, and it does not speed up under load, you have a problem. Your motor is just too SLOW. Once you have seen SUUL, you can start reducing the length of the strands by running more strands in parallel.

That's about all you are going to get from me on the subject. My philosophy is that if you don't build it yourself, you get exactly what you deserve.
Well I'll never be more handsome than another. Do they make a pro coil winding machine?

The moment I witnessed SUUL another moment of FE wonder was imprinted on my life. Not that it matters but, I followed the instructions Dave sent me to wind my coils. 12 strands 253 feet each(3036ft) with 4 series connected in parallel and 3 connection wires at each end. Around 2000 rpm it did indeed suul but most importantly the amp draw decreased slightly. The decreased amp draw isn't enough to record or video. The prime mover/generator is loud so my video audio is worthless.

Winding the coils is the hardest part.
Alberto is monsooning all over my back yard. Time to nuke the coffee.
wantomake
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Old 05-28-2018, 03:29 PM
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Wantomake is right. I did tell him 12 strands at 253 feet each. That’s what I calculated would fill up that particular bobbin to FULL. A full bobbin would give the MOST output.

Originally I just wound the coil with three strands of #23 until it was full. That was three strands, just over 1000 feet each. Actually about 1012. But the voltage output was higher than I wanted. I wanted between 120-130 AC. So I reduced the length of strands to 800 to lower the voltage to that range. I needed to maintain the rpm to get SUUL, so decreasing length was another way of bringing the voltage down.

I told Wantomake 253 feet because 250 was about right, plus 18” on each end to connect up to things. That would give him a FULL bobbin and max voltage and amps for his setup. From there you change wire connections to decrease voltage and increase amps.

My machine runs at around 3000 rpm, so my voltage output is higher than Wantomake who is running at 2000.

Why the difference in rpm? He is using an MY1016 modified Matt motor (I believe...again, he can verify) and I am using an unmodified MY1020 razor scooter motor.

You may wonder WHY, after all the bragging about the Matt motor, I am not running my system with it. Because I have been working for a long time now to figure out a way to run 12 coils on this generator. Wantomake can tell you that with just ONE coil he is drawing 10 amps. TWO coils draws enough amps to damage the motor. I burnt up probably ten MY1016 motors and three MY1020 motors before I figured out how to eliminate the magnetic lock. It’s bad enough to burn up ten motors at $30.00 each and three at $80.00 each without having taken ALL THAT TIME to rewind them as Matt motors and THEN burn them up. So in this testing phase I have been using stock motors, ever since I burnt up the FIRST one which WAS a modified motor I spent a LOT of time on to get all balanced and running perfectly. I have also NOT been running it on the 3 Battery system with battery rotation. I am using as SIMPLE a system as I can for all my testing of the generator.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:00 PM
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Testing with and extra motor is what I do also. SUUL load was reached
right away on my first coil but because I used 29awg there wasn't many
amps which represent pushing power so it was hard to measure.

170 foot strands were connected in series of 8 strands cause no drag
down to the rotor and as I went up to 12 strands to 18 strands the
machine would run while rpm's. Still have not bought a laser rpm tool.

I now have a spool of 25awg wire for this small set up which is better
amp handling than 29awg. With the really fine wire (29awg) I am easily
producing a static voltage of 500 - 1000vac at 8-18strands.

I have not measured exactly rmp's but it does sound like and increase
of over 500 rpm's when the coil is generating with the drive motor
current dropping off 20 percent. The motor runs 3000rpm's normally.

it's all good fun.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:17 PM
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Hi all, Hi mike, thanks for starting thread and sharing information and your feelings.
I'm making a test with an oscillator using the N. Tesla bifilar coil method.

I feel your pain mike, though as I'm sure you know, our bodies are in this world, though we are not of this world, well some of us are not of this world.
And to be truthful with you, the ones that are of this world, are the main ones cooking up all these fake problems.
We have all the solutions and ways of doing things to make life a piece of cake for everyone, though for whatever the reasons, certain ones seem to be operating from a script at this time, to do the opposite.
All things shall pass.
peace love light my brothers and sisters
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Old 05-28-2018, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SkyWatcher View Post
Hi all, Hi mike, thanks for starting thread and sharing information and your feelings.
I'm making a test with an oscillator using the N. Tesla bifilar coil method.

I feel your pain mike, though as I'm sure you know, our bodies are in this world, though we are not of this world, well some of us are not of this world.
And to be truthful with you, the ones that are of this world, are the main ones cooking up all these fake problems.
We have all the solutions and ways of doing things to make life a piece of cake for everyone, though for whatever the reasons, certain ones seem to be operating from a script at this time, to do the opposite.
All things shall pass.
peace love light my brothers and sisters

Well let's hope for a more meaningful input from the science guys out
here. Tesla was gifted and never based his work on philosophical
viewpoints yet had a great personality that we can not attribute to
good upbringing. Tesla was demonized by the goodie goodies, well
they really weren't but the news media painted themselves as
all knowing good boys(By what standard?) and made Tesla out to be
a freak. In fact just this weekend I met with members of the older
generation in the family and asked them about Tesla.

They all said he was full of demons and when I told them that Tesla's
demons produced the electric appilances we all use today they didn't
have an answer. Humm........... see it's because the business
run media is in bed with organized relig.... and THEY use THEIR power
of lies to control the minds of the masses.

And knowing that causes everyone to rebel. Rebelling against lies
is a good thing. People have given up on what they believe, especially
that trash coming out of the 1 eyed Cyclops.

What I say is that we need not stay in confusion by trying or
experimenting. Let us know about your coil circuits and how they
operate that fascinates you. Coils that generate AC power that at
the proper frequency where inductive reactance give a null or assists
the armature.

I was shocked at how people in the family of good up standing folks
looked at Tesla's gift. How blind are the people? How blinded are their
minds from looking at MSM?

We have to do better gentlemen, and I am expecting it.
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Old 05-29-2018, 01:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Wantomake is right. I did tell him 12 strands at 253 feet each. That’s what I calculated would fill up that particular bobbin to FULL. A full bobbin would give the MOST output.

Originally I just wound the coil with three strands of #23 until it was full. That was three strands, just over 1000 feet each. Actually about 1012. But the voltage output was higher than I wanted. I wanted between 120-130 AC. So I reduced the length of strands to 800 to lower the voltage to that range. I needed to maintain the rpm to get SUUL, so decreasing length was another way of bringing the voltage down.

I told Wantomake 253 feet because 250 was about right, plus 18” on each end to connect up to things. That would give him a FULL bobbin and max voltage and amps for his setup. From there you change wire connections to decrease voltage and increase amps.

My machine runs at around 3000 rpm, so my voltage output is higher than Wantomake who is running at 2000.

Why the difference in rpm? He is using an MY1016 modified Matt motor (I believe...again, he can verify) and I am using an unmodified MY1020 razor scooter motor.

You may wonder WHY, after all the bragging about the Matt motor, I am not running my system with it. Because I have been working for a long time now to figure out a way to run 12 coils on this generator. Wantomake can tell you that with just ONE coil he is drawing 10 amps. TWO coils draws enough amps to damage the motor. I burnt up probably ten MY1016 motors and three MY1020 motors before I figured out how to eliminate the magnetic lock. It’s bad enough to burn up ten motors at $30.00 each and three at $80.00 each without having taken ALL THAT TIME to rewind them as Matt motors and THEN burn them up. So in this testing phase I have been using stock motors, ever since I burnt up the FIRST one which WAS a modified motor I spent a LOT of time on to get all balanced and running perfectly. I have also NOT been running it on the 3 Battery system with battery rotation. I am using as SIMPLE a system as I can for all my testing of the generator.
Yes you are right. I'm using the modified Matt motor my1016 size. With just the one coil at 2000 rpms it does heat up over a few minutes run. That's why I remain with one coil. Trying to not burn up motors.

Yes the 12 strands at 253 feet filled the spool to the top. Also left 18-24 inches on the leads for connecting purposes. After the coil was corrected the output was 130-160 volts ac. But for the SUUL test the coil ran through a fwbr with a 300 volt capacitor across it.

After seeing and proving to myself the SUUL, the entire generator has been taken apart and is being redesigned.

wantomake
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Old 05-29-2018, 04:51 AM
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Turion said a while back well quite a long time ago that iron welding
rods withe black sand is the way to make cores or that he makes
cores that way. He said transformer iron cores would get hot.

I think wanto..... has these Turion type cores from what I remember and
still heat is a problem? Is that right? Still got heat issues? Humm
I'll have to go back and see what's up with that.

I know Thane uses Permalloy film cores and we need to keep in mind
that Permalloy film comes is ratings all across the board. The idea of
selecting a proper core material is to use something that will respond
to a higher frequency than 60hz. There are cores and core materials
available for aircraft in the 400hz range that might be better suited for
these generator heads so heat is not being wasted due to friction.

Duty cycle will play a part as well as other factors when considerations
are being made. The space between the magnets will show us the
characteristics of the wave form. Large magnets with little space
between them make the pulsing intervals a greater dutycycle as high
as 75% duty. Large gaps between magnets that are very small
could offer a dutycycle as low as 20%.

70% duty cycle and up is forcing the issue and heat could be used
as a gauge to find the right material. Dave has talked about a piece
a tubing where welding rods doped with blacksand/epoxy then at the
end pounding a few more rods into the pipe to make it very tight.

If heat is still a problem new rods or maybe smaller rods of the right
soft iron should be experimented with. Beyond that I would say that
Permalloy films are a much more controlled substrate over random
mixtures of iron rods Vs. black sand packed tubes when sand wetness
will vary and thus alter the value of each core.

I can see that generator heads need to output as much as possible
without waste to make a cost effective build for practical use.




.................................................. ......
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Old 05-29-2018, 05:20 AM
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I regards to Turion's recent story about his so called friend of a friend..
The so called friend is like so many, they only look up to people
who burn up amps like the school book EE is taught. Any teacher
will tell you in science class that all the answers are predetermined
ones and the only scientific method permitted in universities is the
one the books printed by Govt agencies say it is.

There is no love for limitless energy projects as high level intellectuals
are so mind warps that they can not go beyond what teacher says.
Men are no longer men at this point, told what they can think, often
very effeminate in their mannerisms a sort of socially castrated fellow.

He can't help it, he was raised by his mom and she paid for the schooling.
She was the only roll model he had. He is not an inventor, he is a social
yuppy (I call them) who could care less about a scientific trick, well that
is what scares him the most that he is being duped.

He is not an adventurer, he has no desire to understand the unlimited.

Yes he is pathetic but he can't help it. He is a product of social engineering
MK Ultra mental programming from the cradle and would rather die
then to admit that new findings show all the college books to be a lie.

He is fearful. He is a prisoner, he is without hope. It is like taking a
criminal to court to prove he was wrong, he will fight to stay out of his
man made jail cell waiting for him when his friends find out that he
is having a mental breakdown. So and so is losing it, first he loses
credibility, then his license, next his job. His wife after that.

He is a fearful mess.

Ever here that tick many teachers have while teaching class? At the end
of each sentence a noise is made as if to say "ARE YOU BELOW ME" it
comes with a pause and then a new sentence with the exclamation tick.

Demi gods? No delusional.

here are all the answers and you will pass, intellectual dishonesty with
themselves first. However not all men are overcome mentally but the
ones that are will get the highest position because he is the best puppet.


Who cares about the truth? They are swamp creatures found in
universities, Churches, Gov't it's all the same. people mistaken think
these men are somehow mentally superior because of the office they hold.

The world is much different than you think.


.................................................. .....


.................................................. ...
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Old 05-29-2018, 02:44 PM
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core material

Brodude,
I'm still using the 1/16" welding rods alone and not mixed with black sand. I plan to change over to what Dave is using but can't say what it is because not sure that's something Dave wants to disclose here. I leave that to him. But no heat issues in my coil. Or at least not yet.

I've got heat in prime mover my1016 motor not the (1) coil on the generator. Thus far I'm testing on a "safety" level to keep what I have. Social Security retiree's don't have many monies to use on these builds. Not poor mouthing as we say here in South Carolina. Just want to be factual. I did have a investor in the previous years. But because I didn't produce results fast enough the cash flow stopped.

Just wanted to keep the information correct here. As far as my replicating goes.

wantomake
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Old 05-29-2018, 03:37 PM
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Cores

I have cores in my coils made from 1/16 rod. I have three machines total right now. All previous machines have been disassembled as I do not have room. All three have the same cores.

I never talked about doping the rods with anything. I have a coil testing machine that I have set up with the same motor, the same rotor, the same number of magnets with the same spacing. It is connected to a power supply so that the voltage can be adjusted and the rpm controlled. It has a small light board so the coil output can be tested. I have tried the iron rods, #12 shot, and black sand, and have test data on those cores. I know from experience that ferrite does NOT have as much magnetic attraction as the iron and SHOULD make a better core, but I have NOT run the numbers yet. It will ALSO put out less power and switch quicker, so THAT can affect your SUUL. Possibly change the required frequency SO MUCH that you have to have 9000 rpm or something ridiculous to reach it. In other words, ferrite MAY NOT work. I think it will though. I had a lot of OTHER things to get worked out on this machine, like the magnetic lock issue. That was the OTHER reason I started the “your basic coil” thread. So some OTHER people could get involved in testing coil cores and I wouldn’t have to do it all myself. I have a core that works for solving all my other issues, so core material was my LAST project with this generator. I have ferrite and metglass and a couple less well known things to test. Then I can compare results.

But here is the thing. The only data I can trust and really USE in my investigation is that put on this forum by Wantomake or myself. Why? Because we are using the SAME sized rotor with the SAME sized magnets spaced the SAME distance apart, running the SAME core on our coils with the SAME number of wires the SAME length.

That’s the problem with this forum and why it is really a waste of my time. Everyone builds their machines out of whatever they have lying around, so their data is NO GOOD when you try to compare it to yours. Not their fault. They are doing the best that they can. But it is not contributing to MY research. As far as MY research goes, it is just throwing crap against a wall to see what sticks.

Not to say their efforts are worthless, because it ALL comes down to watts in vs watts out. Whoever is producing the most power for the least input and can maintain it without melting their motor or their coils is the MAN. I would gladly scrap this design for something that puts out MORE.

Just remember, nless something is replicated EXACTLY, it is not a replication. I know this drove John B nuts!!!!! People made Bedini energizers out of everything under the sun and whined when they didn’t work.
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Old 05-29-2018, 05:50 PM
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Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
Brodude,
I'm still using the 1/16" welding rods alone and not mixed with black sand.

Just wanted to keep the information correct here. As far as my replicating goes.

wantomake
okay I didn't get that part thought your cores were getting hot.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I have cores in my coils made from 1/16 rod. I have three machines total right now. All previous machines have been disassembled as I do not have room. All three have the same cores.

I have tried the iron rods, #12 shot, and black sand, and have test data on those cores. I know from experience that ferrite does NOT have as much magnetic attraction as the iron and SHOULD make a better core, but I have NOT run the numbers yet. It will ALSO put out less power and switch quicker, so THAT can affect your SUUL.

Just remember, nless something is replicated EXACTLY, it is not a replication. I know this drove John B nuts!!!!! People made Bedini energizers out of everything under the sun and whined when they didn’t work.
Yes my replication is way different and I except the responsibility. I
was getting confused with you and the SG data. Did you see this?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rFFo7F-EcX8

It just seems like 2" cores would be to large.

He calls out Lindemann's name.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dI4883OfLeU




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Old 05-29-2018, 06:14 PM
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Also if anyone is interested here are some notes from a great inventor
on making ferrite stick together. Black sand being etched just before
the epoxy. Ed Leedskalnin's notes

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ttVgUlCHoI


.................................................. .....................................






http://pubs.rsc.org/services/images/RSCpubs.ePlatform.Service.FreeContent.ImageService .svc/ImageService/Articleimage/2014/NR/c4nr04694c/c4nr04694c-f2_hi-res.gif



.................................................. .....................................
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Old 05-29-2018, 08:03 PM
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Learn the different values of BLACK SAND before getting some.

Mainly this video shows how to recover sand on the beach.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ueu11EMddc


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xA8HalLJ92c
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Old 05-29-2018, 08:21 PM
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How To Epoxy Sand and maybe some shot together

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnY1Zbi7sgM





http://www.goldmine-elec-products.com/prodinfo.asp?number=G19561A




........................
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Old 05-30-2018, 12:44 AM
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Ferrite is used in a wide variety of motors and generators today.
I think making 1 large batch to pour all cores for one machine is
a good idea so the material would be all the same. The machines
we are working on have better coils and need a bigger space to
put them.





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3WYq_AxdyUw







http://citeseerx.ist.psu.edu/viewdoc/download?doi=10.1.1.886.2617&rep=rep1&type=pdf


http://www.tscinternational.com/tech11.pdf

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Old 05-30-2018, 10:09 PM
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Nickel Oxide is cheap and Iron Oxide is cheap in most cases
a large percentage of nickel oxide mixing with iron oxide and you
may play with light sprinkles of copper and aluminum dust but
not much of that. Cores are mostly nickel Oxide and Iron Oxide.

I have been reviewing scholarly articles on composites for a number
of years. HT Epoxy composites. If you have time and wish to learn
go thru some of my recent posts. After this post I will not continue
to add much in the way of making homemade Ferrite core material.
This gives us a more advanced method of making Ferrite cores over
room temp molded epoxied dust..

The 3 listed acids in previous articles show their ability to clean the
exterior of each particle called etching then light heat and vacuum in
a cup to extract moisture after etching is done.

Any old refrigerator pump will work for this while gently warming.

Next resins are added for a number of hours then vacuum if you wish
next hardener and mixing, quick vacuum and into the mold.

High Temp Epoxy will now be exposed to light amounts of heat for
2 hours say around 275f or 300f. A pressing and heating needs to
take place. The temp's you run are based on the HT epoxy and type
you select.

This is called SINTERING.

Sintering is when you press together under heat. All of the vacuum
steps are optional as heat and pressure will expel the air bubbles
anyway. It really depends on what you are doing but these are the
simple steps to work with HT Expoxies and how to get it to stick.

OKAY?? Heat and pressure not such a big deal. Just enough etching
acid to scratch up the outside surface of each dust particle. Dry it out
good add epoxy resins and pour it into a vice or clamp to press all of
the material close together of course while roasting.

Below is an epoxy press, pressing out all the excess epoxy


https://symbiosisonlinepublishing.com/nanoscience-technology/nanoscience-technology37.php






.................................................. .........................................
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Old 05-31-2018, 01:30 AM
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Hello Bro !


very interesting share ! thanks so much )


regards
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Old 05-31-2018, 02:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by med.3012 View Post



Hello Bro !


very interesting share ! thanks so much )


regards
Thx, the 3 types of acids used in etching these oxides are

Oxalic Acid

Surfuric Acid

Nitric Acid

Use whatever you want. Still better than nothing.

I have some old batteries and the acid in them will work. One time
I bought some nitric to put drops on silver to see if it was really silver.

I have not decided yet how much acid for how long but as long as you
keep the amounts consistent it should prove strong at any concentration
than none at all. Etching cleans the surface and heated resins can now
reach into the particulate and grab on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IZBtx0DqGM

Glad you like this MED. I started my quest in the area back
years ago when i thought I might build a 100 foot wind turbine. At that
time I began reading about composite epoxies, that was over 10 years
ago.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vpC_tJv0ymk

The compound in the video is not for Ferrite dust but shows us the
basic idea about what etching does. Draining off etching solution
with excessive amounts of byproducts from the reaction of course
would be a common sense action just before using heat to dry up the
material. The cleaner the better. In chemistry these reactionary
produces are called "Precipitants"

I also found good fillers to produce a non shrink plastic but in this case
the object is to have the Ferrite be the filler so a porous surface must
be created. Only tiny amounts of binder. However if you know that your
particulate will end up with gaps after pressing there is always something
you might be considering to fill it in. The goal is to press the 2 or more
oxides together under heat so hard that the tiny pieces of dust all touch
one another.

No large fillers would work because they would stop the metals from
connecting to each other, such as the fibers everywhere on the market.
Conductive par-magnetic.

I think copper and aluminum are good choices.
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Old 05-31-2018, 03:38 AM
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ETCHING

Here is too much and shows us that we need very little.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3kX32vRHdDc




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Old 05-31-2018, 07:11 AM
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Turion Posts

desa,
Thaine Heinz used high impedance coils to negate Lenz. Angus Wangus used two coils on a U shaped core of iron with the magnet passing between the two pieces of steel, as Leedskalnin did much earlier. Wendell Ray Walker used the freely rotating magnet that passes by the coil. Those are three VERY DIFFERENT approaches to dealing with Lenz.

I believe there is a fourth way. What I THINK we have figured out is that there is a specific frequency that each coil has. I THINK it is based on the mass of the core, the core material, the size and number of strands of wire and their length, and the RPM of the rotor with respect to its size, the number of magnets and their size and strength. Do you see how many variables there are and how changing just ONE could impact performance?I f you turn YOUR specific rotor at the right speed for YOUR coil, it will speed up under load at a SPECIFIC rpm or above. You have to find the frequency for your coil. THAT is what I would experiment with because as you try to scale this thing up to a BIG machine, that is the kind of thing you will need to understand.

Unless you have the EXACT same rotor as I do with the same strength, size and number of magnets spaced the same distance apart. And unless you have the same size core in your coil, made from the same material with the same number of the same sized wires the same length, your machine will NOT speed up under load at the same RPM as mine, and you may spend MONTHS trying to get it to speed up under load if at all. That is another reason I haven't given specifics on my generator. Unless a replication is built EXACTLY the same as mine, it won't work, and then people will say mine doesn't work. Been there, done that. People build replications out of whatever crap they happen to have lying around and then complain when it doesn't work the same as the original.

I happen to know that the coil I have works with a specific rotor at 2800 RPM. Anything below that, when it is loaded, it will slow my motor down. One of the problems I had early on is that the magnets are so powerful they would flex the rotor and it would hit the coils. I had to engineer around that. It would also suck the magnets right out of the rotor even though we kept having new rotors machined with smaller and smaller holes to have the magnets pressed into with a hydraulic press. I have several sets of really nice rotors that the magnets wouldn't stay in. To replicate that generator would cost about $1,500.00, as just the wire alone is $475 and the magnets are over $300. Because I am using such big strong magnets, the coil holders and rotors are special and had to be machined. I have been looking at ways of getting the price down before I disclosed anything, and have found a way to knock several hundred off what it cost me to build it, but that design hasn't been tested. I am working on that NOW. So I have no intention of sharing it until I see whether it works or not. This will be my fifth build of this particular generator, so I have a lot of time and money invested in this project. It is too big to run with the razor scooter motor. Or let's put it this way....you can't START it with a razor scooter motor, but once up to speed, you CAN run it with the larger modified motor.

What Matt is doing with his prototype is a smaller version of my generator, based on ALL THE SAME principles, since he is the one who came up with the idea in the first place. It will use smaller, MUCH LESS expensive coils. I think I got all my coils wound for the prototype for about $30 worth of wire. It won't put out anywhere near as much power, but it WILL prove to EVERYBODY that this will work, and you can get way more out than you put in. THEN you can scale it up.

My advice to you, if you want to experiment with a generator while you wait for Matt to share this little generator prototype is to think about what you will do once you have a working model and understand everything you need to know to scale the thing up and make a big machine. Take what you have in the way of a rotor with magnets on it and figure out what coil will speed up under load with YOUR rotor. Use what you have in the way of wire and EXPERIMENT. Don't spend money because you will need it to build the prototype.

I will share this much about my big generator. I have a standard bobbin with a 3/4 core filled with welding rods. It is wound with 3 strands of #23. Now that coil was DESIGNED (by Matt) to put out 120-130 volts at 2800 RPM using MY SPECIFIC rotor. At that RPM with MY SPECIFIC rotor, it will speed up under load. Even if you had the right sized rotor with the correct number of magnets and the right spacing between them, you probably would have the same problem of the rotor hitting the coil and sucking the magnets out of the rotor unless you have engineered around those two fundamental problems. And I can tell you right now, when a magnet comes out of the rotor and hits that iron core of the coil at 2800 RPM, it is like a bomb going off and you are likely to lose an eye or sustain other serious damage. When you get to this level, it becomes very dangerous to experiment with.


The rotor I am using on my big gen is split magnet rotor with magnets at both ends of the coil for max saturation. I have two sets of coils so it is set up:

S(magnet)N Coil S(magnet)N Coil S(Magnet)N with room on the shaft to add more stacks of coils and rotors. I could put 20 coils on this particular setup. Of course I would have to have a bigger motor to turn it, but there is no reason not to use some of the coils as motor coils at least SOME of the time if it is done correctly and eliminate the need for a motor.

I will be interested to see what you mean by magnetic suspension.



Oh, and I almost forgot. 100% of the time two of the motors are acting as generators. Now add a flywheel to smooth out the pulses.

If you don't want to screw around with three off the shelf motors, build yourself a few rotors and some coils, and do it all with one unit. I have a 12 coil setup which allows 3 coils to run as motor coils while 9 coils generate, but it ALSO has a 12 volt DC motor that can run it when it gets up to speed. And that motor is run off the potential difference between a high voltage source and a low one. We are moving power around without using it up to get it to do work, with only losses to friction/heat and switching. I am NOT going to show you video of that setup running because YOU are not going to build that setup anyway. It is way too expensive and all machine work. You MIGHT, however, build what I have described here with some inexpensive motors, or maybe build yourself a rotor and wind your own coils. You can get results with only a few coils. I had a little two coil unit, but I have cannibalized it to use the rotors to build my coil testing device.


One of the very first tests I ran was with only TWO coils in place. I wanted to show that a single coil was putting out about 130 volts at .5 amps UNDER LOAD, and I HAD 2 of those coils on the generator. I compared the output of one coil under load to the same load running off the wall plug. For those of you with a calculator, that's at LEAST 130 watts output from the two coils on the generator, and it was running on 12 volts at .4 amps after it got up to speed. So running it produced 2.7 times the input power. COP>2.7, and that was with some pretty small loads. As I said, it speeds up under load, which means BETTER performance, less amp draw and MORE OUTPUT. It does pull some amps on startup to break magnetic lock, but it does way better than that now with 12 coils, and magnetic lock is not an issue above 1200 rpm. I think on the video I measured the RPMS while it was running the load and with the other coil shorted out, and then unshorted the coil and you could see the immediate change on the tach as it slowed down.

So it WILL speed up under RESISTIVE loads. If you don't believe it does, you are just mistaken, and if you choose to argue the point, you are an idiot. Now WHY it speeds up under load , I won't argue. But if you say it doesn't you are just WRONG.


http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/19774-basic-free-energy-device-9.html?highlight=basic+free+energy


I have seen an output of 1.7 amps per coil at 130 volts per coil x 12 coils or 2,652 watts. My generator does this right now with iron core coils. And the generator speeds up under load. That is my output. I also know what I am inputting into the system and how much of that I am able to recover. Now speeding up under load may not be of BENEFIT with a mo/gen combination, and may in fact be harmful, but when you have two separate and distinct devices, and you can get more generated energy (more rpm means higher output) then I can work with that, as long as it does not INCREASE the front end "used by the system" cost. There is all kind of debate about How or Why a generator will speed up under load, but in the final analysis, when I have a coil of a specific size with a specific core, and by changing the wiring configuration on that coil I can get my generator to produce MORE rpm when loaded rather than bogging down the motor that is turning it, THAT is of benefit to me as long as the watts produced by that coil do not decrease. If someone has a coil that produces more power from the system for less overall cost, I would be interested in that for sure. I have had discussions with at least ONE individual on how to build such a coil and am looking into how to do it without it making me insane.

There's a bunch of stuff I am not yet in a position to share, but there is at least one thing I will throw out there even though I started a WHOLE THREAD on "Your Basic Coil" just to talk about this stuff and couldn't wade through the idiots to make the kind of progress I wanted. As usual, I just got together with a few folks I trust and we did the testing ourselves.

We tested welding rod, coat hanger, #12 shot, ferrite and Metglass as a generator coil core on a generator running under 4,000 RPM. While different wire configurations, higher rpm or other variables might change the results, for our purposes the ferrite was the clear winner. At higher RPM's it might not be, and I doubt we will spend the time to determine that since we are running at the lower frequencies. There are lots of kinds of ferrite and some may be better than others. We found one we like. You find yours. We wound a lot of coils to be able to put out that information, and it would have been much easier if ten different people had wound the same sized coil and tested it on the same sized rotor with the same magnets on it. But I have given up expecting that there will EVER be that level of cooperation and teamwork on this forum. The stuff we know is because we are building and testing stuff every single day. Some of it we will share.

I redid my big generator. This is the 5th time I have rebuilt it and it costs a couple hundred dollars each time to modify the parts and have them machined to new specs or replaced. Right now it is running on a razor scooter motor at 1800 RPM. It is running on 12 volts at 6 amps or 72 watts. It is outputting 170 volts DC after the bridge at 1.5 amps per coil, and there are 12 coils. YOU do the math. With the windings I have on the coils it requires 24 volts to get it up to 2800 RPM, at which point it speeds up under load. I have not done any output testing at the higher RPM because I haven't had TIME. Trying to figure out the best way to convert high voltage DC to lower voltage higher amps has been my priority.

.................................................. ..................
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Old 05-31-2018, 02:27 PM
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Seems extreme

What you are posting seems very hard with the acid and such. Is all that necessary? Can the core not be just magnetite powder mixed with expoxy or rosin or something to harden it?

Just asking,
wantomake
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Old 05-31-2018, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
What you are posting seems very hard with the acid and such. Is all that necessary? Can the core not be just magnetite powder mixed with expoxy or rosin or something to harden it?

Just asking,
wantomake
Think conductivity, think concrete, jello with chopped fruit in a bowl.
The air space or epoxy plastic space is a no no. You must heat and
press your magnetite together and Nickel oxide as well.

Did you ever look into a bowl of jello and see all of the spaces in between
mixed fruit? That is how random a suspension of a lump of resins with
iron dust is going to be. You must PRESS your particulate together and
to get the resins to stick you need to clean your dust particle surfaces.

We are talking low watered down concentrations for an old battery, swish
or stir it around till it smokes a little and gives of some black tea water.
Dump it off and dry it out. Ready to add resins, no heat yet, no hardener
either just resins. Let set 4 hours then gentle heat, I vacuum mine with
an old frig pump to extract bubbles in some pours.

You are reviewing the procedure for near state of the art mixing and
preparation instructions. Think concrete. Picture a room at your home
20' X 20' X 10'. The room is empty. Now add beach balls til the room
is filled up. Each ball touches the other one. That is what you want.

Now if you want your concrete stronger you look at the gaps in between
the beach balls and think of something to put in there. Whether plastic
composite of lump of saggy dirt, if you want your part to be strong, not
crumbling apart you want to fill in the gaps.

In our case we probably don't want to go to the extreme. What we want
is dust connected to each other with very little resin binder so you
must heat the resins with the hardener already in it. Heating cause
the needed viscosity change of makes the resin real running like water.

That way when you press the batch (Think semi-dry mud packs) together
the resins run out and dust connects to dust.

From dust thou art and to dust thou shalt return. Be back.


The Lord Bless

.................................................. ..............

Sign the original rebel, ex-Detroit party dog head banger now yielding
to the King.
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