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Old 12-17-2017, 06:57 AM
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Inverter 2 Boosters

David Bowling Setup

Here is my first proper attempt with setting done correctly for the
first run. It has been an hour and a half or 1.5 hrs charge battery
voltage dropped a small amount from 12.61v to 12.58v


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Old 12-18-2017, 01:57 AM
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First Run Measurements

Here is the first set of figures recorded using an inverter in
this split positive 3 battery generator system.

Maybe someone could explain this.

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Old 12-18-2017, 10:49 PM
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Thanks on the FWBR answer

I lowered the power draw down to 13 watts.

It seems like the battery life of 10% is unchanged either way. Even
using up or shall I say wasting 10wh the usage is the same within
a margin of error.

I may go to a 40w load next or a 30watt, not sure what to do. Or use
another inverter. Maybe an inverter module might work better.

I burnt 2 small inverters already so I won't buy that kind until I build a
soft-starter circuit. It doesn't make sense how all those wh are being
recirculated with some burned up in the process and battery life is

If could get my booster efficiency up to 99% maybe I could get some
radiant going to battery 3. Well I mean collect what is being burned up
at the moment. Anyway I don't know what I mean yet, but I will.

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Old 12-19-2017, 09:51 AM
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Two 12watt bulbs and no need for a larger booster that is running
a 5 amp draw on the new inverter. The other, even newer inverter
makes the booster draw 10 amps to recharge batteries 1 and 2.

What I think that says is that the inverter I am using now is somehow
holding up the input while delivering the same power to the load which
makes it easier to charge back up the run batteries.

With twice the load and half the recirculation amps, the point count is
almost the same as with 1 bulb, well 1 point less actually per half hour.

It does look like I struck a vane.


Originally Posted by Turion View Post
What if the thing that makes this work is NOT a potential difference between the higher voltage in the source batteries and the lower voltage in the bad batteries, but a potential difference between "positive charged batteries" and "negative charged batteries." Think about that for just a minute.

After all, I know for a fact, and so do many of you, that the bad battery actually flips polarity. and WHILE IT IS FLIPPED, that is when the magic happens. Now, that means that perhaps if we could get a battery to STAY flipped, we could run this thing forever. And maybe a lower voltage bad battery has a greater potential difference than a higher voltage bad battery (when they flip polarity) in relation to the two fully charged good batteries

So lets talk about that for a minute. OBVIOUSLY there is a source of reversed or negative energy hitting that bad battery that causes it to flip, but once it does there is also a source of energy that is great enough to get it to flip BACK to the original. What if those two sources of energy could be isolated from each other and/or isolated from the bad battery? If it is the motor that causes the battery to flip, then we need a different circuit when that happens. Maybe we run it off one bad battery until it flips negative and keep it running there, but the minute it flips positive again, we switch to a second bad battery. Something like that. Alternating between the two.

I have had a battery hooked up to a motor as generator for four days now, trying to create a negative transducer. It reads just short of -12 volts, but as soon as I disconnect the motor, the negative voltage in the battery starts dropping. Why is that? What makes that battery WANT to go positive, and where does that energy go that is showing up as almost -12 volts in the battery right now? It seems to want to settle at about -7 volts, and I can't get it to go any higher than about -11.78 on the negative side.

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Old 12-19-2017, 10:11 PM
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If anyone has any experience putting these same to circuit together
to form a ganged converter let me know. I wondered if a double pot
might work or if they will burn up one another if I do that.

Thanks in advance.

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Old 12-20-2017, 12:19 AM
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new figures are in.

With the old inverter and the corn cob light bulb baseline
test I am getting a .02 per hour drop straight to the battery.

When hooked up to the split positive running 2 boosters i am getting
a .04 volt drop per hour which is double the normal inverter to battery.

This is what I would have expected in the very beginning using an
inverter as a 3 battery generator.

So here is what i have tested. I have used 4 different inverters, various
sized battery packs and all kinds of loads and in a period of weeks
conditioning batteries, at no time have I ever seen an extended runtime.

My true deep cycle batteries are nothing like the capacitor type batteries
suggested so these must be the obstacle.

All we need do is to watch Wantomake as he has been following this
thought for far longer than I have. At no time has he reported any extra
and instead we see the way to getting the excess is to run a motor
(modified) to a generator (modified) back to the batteries.

This is the only way I can see recorded as a practical setup to run some
lights in his shop.

I will continue testing by staying around a 30 min to an hour test.

My batteries will be flooded with alum on the charge battery first then
the run battery next. I also have some new gel cells so there will be no

Next we will explore the multiple inverter to multiple packs to see if I
can reuse the same energy 3x. However i did consider the higher load
tests to be better than the low powered tests.

Special inverters or modified inverters and modified boosters are talked
about concerning this subject, for instance removing the large internal
capacitors or buying that special type. Although I have not seen one.

What we learned with the battery charging technology is that each time
energy is transferring from 1 battery thru a load to another battery is
that there are plate resistance losses. To keep these losses to a minimum
elevated voltage surges were found to be the best way.

While this message does not show positive results for inverters does
not mean that this process can not exceed my findings. For example it
was shown that the wrong charge battery does not work. A bad battery
was better.

With the following tests using multiple packs to capture the same
energy thru a load would obviously not be able to use bad batteries.

With no clear path to relay on which battery or inverter to use the
average person will not be able to make one work.

Good Day

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-20-2017 at 12:58 AM.
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Old 12-20-2017, 02:31 AM
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Next test 45 watt consumption

12.08v drop to 11.94 = a 14 point drop in 90minutes.

This required a 6amp booster with fan added if 10 amps is
needed to run at 8.75amps off the charge battery over to the run
battery bank. Efficiency probably 80%.

Second booster well with in the C/20 rate at 3.25amps and this
kept the inverter hot leg fed at 14.5v, while the run packs got the
875ma at 12v transforming into 26.5v of course at a lower amperage.

As was reported for these batteries 10% of battery life = 42watt hours

So a 14 point drop = 14% battery life or 59 wh straight off the batteries
to inverter and I ended up with the same figure. or 45w times 1.5hrs
and this is a small amount more or within the margin of error is equal.

Which seems impossible.

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Any Brushed DC permanent magnet motor will work, HOWEVER, as some folks have seen, you can burn out a 12 volt DC motor if you are not careful, because some of the time you are running it off 24 volts or higher. I have been using a 110 volt DC motor and it has taken everything I have thrown at it, so I would recommend a higher voltage DC motor if you can find one. The higher the better.

Just to see if we're telling the truth and see it work? ANY PM DC motor. To build something that will eventually produce some power for you? The bigger (higher voltage) the better.

Originally Posted by Turion View Post

I'll look at adding the diodes Ufopolitics suggested to the circuit already containing the diodes Matt suggested.

But I KNOW what Matt suggested made a change in the voltages on batteries one and two.

So, if Matt's change gets it to charge and Ufopolitics gets the radiant out of the motor so it doesn't heat up, without messing up the current flow that is causing the charging.........????


Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I don't have access to my computer ..........

Matt talked about using diodes, and I just wanted to see what would happen.

I would love to hear what Matt has to say. He may say I have the diodes in the wrong place,

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Matt and Carroll,
I know I am not the sharpest guy when it comes to electronics

Originally Posted by Turion View Post

I'm sure you can expect something from Matt the first chance he gets.

We shouldn't be waiting around for Matt, we should be trying things
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I haven't gotten Matt's new schematic built yet,

Develop what Matt has given us which we KNOW works,

especially Matt for sharing what he came up with.


Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
Doesn't seem to be any difference between that patent and todays Aluminum Electrolyte capacitor.

I would first suggest learning how to properly destroy the battery you have availible.

The battery I am running the system off of is a 1100 CCA battery for a catepiller tractor. It was used for 8 years and died one winter after no activity for about 6 months.
The PH is Normal the Hydrometer does not give a reading, the battery holds about 3.5 volt standing and droips to nothing with 1 ohm resistor for a load.

The primary batts are 1500 cca Interstates tractor batteries
I'll also tell ya I am using a Razor Scooter Motor for both the motor and generator (Coming soon).
This is the 1 ohm 100 watt resistor but ceramic, but this is the equavalent
I have 1/0 wire with copper connectors to everything and real short leads to the motor/generator, and all copper connectors.

The motor free wheeling runs at 1.1 amp.

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I haven't tried it yet, but Matt certainly has, and I talked to him on the phone

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I would give Matt's circuit a try. If you can't figure it out, we'll help you. If you get the spec sheet on the MJL21194 it shows the base, collector and emitter.
The base goes to the 100 ohm 1/2 watt resistor. The emitter goes to the 1 ohm 100 watt resistor, and the collector goes to the plus on batt 3 and then over to the other end of the 100 ohm 1/2 watt resistor. On the Transistor the three prongs are B C E. Hope that helps, and that I haven't screwed those directions up.

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Matt has had his setup running for FIVE days without losses

Matt is going to make a couple more modifications and then film it for us.

Matt is using or possibly Mosfetts if we want to put big loads on the motor or battery three
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Sorry I can't be of more help. Maybe Matt has an idea.

...in Matt's original schematic he connects the two bad batteries between equal potentials (12 volts on each side) and with five batteries you have more on one side than the other.
Originally Posted by Turion View Post

Matt, I can't tell you how MUCH I appreciate the time you have put into this.
By the way, according to my calculations, 10 watts on a 12 volt system requires 1 amp per hour. If you ran 10 watts for 12 hours, that's 12 amp hours of usage. Is that correct? PLUS you ran the motor the whole time, you produced power to charge the small battery, and where did the primaries end up? And how many amp hours are they?

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
You ROCK Mr. Jones!

Can't wait to do a run tomorrow. I have it all set up and ready to go. Just have to throw the switch and cross my fingers. All three of my dead batteries are resting at less than one volt.

I'll take down my video camera and set it up on the tripod and let it run until the tape runs out.

Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
Heck for that matter a switch alone might work. You might not need any motor at all just pulse. Try a small system with a transistor driven off of the stamp chip.


Originally Posted by Turion View Post

When Matt posts his video you are all going to want to replicate, and you WILL NOT get the results from 18 amp hour or less batteries.

I know from experience.

deep cycle marine batteries for $99.00 I am investing in a bunch of those

Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
I have got all my batteries tied up at the moment. 42 of them all running something.
I gotta let this other thing run its coarse I just can't stop it right now, on top of all the other stuff I got going.

I promise I'll take a film soon.

I am going to set it up on an IC and with a Fet. I just gotta get the other stuff out of the way first.

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Hey Matt,
I've been on pins and needles waiting for you to post the video of your shorting experiment with the big resistor.

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-20-2017 at 03:30 AM.
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Old 12-20-2017, 07:05 AM
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This next run (Running now) is showing a promising improvement.

I am running 2 amps at 13.7v into the booster that feeds the inverter
and the booster charging the run batteries is pulling off 5 amps away
for the charge battery.

What is well known as shown by John Bedini is that internal
resistances in these cells drop significantly. This means less waste when
recharging or discharging.

Since these systems pump a lot of energy around in a loop charging
and discharging watt hour losses should be greatly reduced.
I have not converted the other 8 run batteries YET.

It would appear that the point count drop has slowed down but let us
see if that is true in these coming runs. We already have some baselines
and run figures using the splits with 2 boosters and all the same lights
will be used.
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Old 12-20-2017, 09:42 AM
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New test with Alum battery baseline = .03 point drop per hour
straight off the battery. 27 watt load
The splits gave a .04 point drop per hour showing booster losses of
25% approx. Same load of course.

Alum battery point count is stronger going from a 10 point 10% battery
life of acid 42wh and Alum is 55wh.

Second test underway to verify within the margin of error.

PS i am back 1 hour later with the splits showing .03 point drop same
as baseline so we can deduct that with improvements gains are possible.

Originally Posted by ehsanco1062 View Post
Hi mbrownn

here is the video for the test I did I hope it will help see the test not just read it.

2 BGS with caps part 1 - YouTube

2 BGS with caps part 2 - YouTube


Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
First thing I gotta say is I can prove what I am about to say.

The spikes are not traditional. Tall and slim if you will. When you look at a spike on the scope your are not seeing the time in it. Time is an indicator that something is flowing, so if you have flow in time, you have current.
The current a spike, like monopole produce, are 90 degrees out of time. So this is the hard part for people to see.

You have 3 dimensions in space, XYZ, then come weight. Electricity is viewed in Vectors so it is only 2 dimensions. Y being the amplitude (Up and Down) X being the time its on. Thats all you see on a scope.
But with 3 dimensions you miss most of it in the case of spike because you are looking at the Z coordinate and this is going away from your view.

Now if you look AC, both voltage and current, running through an inductor you'll see the quarter wave effect of the inductor on the current. The current will be 90 degrees behind the voltage. Just look up "AC Quarter waves" for an example.

Same thing happens to spike when the voltage of the spike travels through Iron. The current follows it by 90 degrees. So the spike, on the scope has now turned into the X coordinate and we can see its depth, or time. Remember equals the presents of a flow.

With this behavior we can keep a constant and level flow of current coming out of a transformer with a 50/50 duty cycle or less. You make a pulse, turn off the source power, the spike shows up, turns in time and fills in the time you are off. This almost doubles your output.

Now in the past I have heard alot of nonsense about the fact that if you use too much current the spikes won't show up. The "senior people" in this community like to tell you that. This is why we can only get free energy out of a small rotory based motor generator. Nothing could be further from the truth.

This energy is always present from inductive collapse whether you can see it on a scope or not.

Here is a small scenerio, You can test it for yourself if you have the parts.

You will take 2 transformers to plug into the wall.
1 of them will take 110 vac 1 amp and turn it into 220 vac 1/2 amp.
1 of them will take 110 vac 1 amp and turn it into 5 vac 22 amp.

Now we take the output of both of those and run it into a bridge rectifier in parallel.
The rules of parallel say we should average the voltage and add up the amperage. So by this rule we should now have 112.5 volt at 22.5 amps.

Unfortunately this does not happen.

What we end up with when put a load on it is 5 volt at 22.5 amp.

This higher current side draws down the higher voltage side.

This same thing happens with the energy released from inductive collapse. If the spike is present it is drawn down to the level of the higher current on the wire, But it is still there. If you can see them it has the higher current.

So are seeing what I am trying to tell you? We get the to use the current from these spike immediately.

I have another project that has been measured very carefully with good equipment. I pass 19.7 watts through an EI core transformer. 43% of that power is caught in a good battery. we pulse on 50% percent duty cycle.
The pulse of 19.7 joules creates a transient situation that produces 24.5 joules of energy and comes out at 94% percent duty cycle.

You see the possibility. We have more than doubled our output.

Now transients only get so big. The size of the is directly related to the input voltage of the pulse that goes through the inductor. So as your voltage goes up your current can come down and you can still get the energy out of the transient that is trapped. Or you can take the current up and the gain will be slightly less than what you put in. But with any potential based system you can catch this gain. It can out way all your losses.

I hope you guys follow what I am saying. I have known this for some time and kept it to myself or within small group of people. I am not telling you this so that I have to continue to support you in your search for this effect. I am telling you so you can know whats possible when you go to look for it.
I have done the leg work this is real effect that produces real usable energy. So there is no reason to doubt it. You just need to find it and start looking for the best way to make it happen.

And don't bother me too much

Good luck
Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
The video is up. Enjoy.

The transformer is hand wound. I used one I burnt up on another experiment. I describe it in the video.

I think before its all done with, I will use caps instead of a dead battery. I can control the available voltage on the caps by the rate of switching.
I have got a few more tricks also to put the power back and if I get real digital about it I can do it in a way that makes sure you get the full brunt of the power before you lose it. Run it all around circles until entropy hits home.
I'll think about it this week a little more.

@Mbrownn, regarding your PM.
A motor by default is not capable of a transformer action, period.
You have to modify it to do anything close. Current and magnetic fields are not the same thing. Also motors are incapable of an AC current to voltage 90 deg offset which in itself will allow transients to do work immediately by allowing the current in them to be turned into forward time.
When I tell you motor is not capable of this action is not because I do not have the basic understanding of the motor versus transformer issues, Its because I know what I am talking about. I have very in depth experience with both.
Your PM should have been a HOW question and not a statement arguing a position to inform me not to misinform other people. If you have argument and proof other wise make it available. Proofs in the pudding.

Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
No. This is not like a motor as motor cannot inductively pass current to second set of winding.

Look here's what happens.
I pull 24v+- from the primary in pulse for given time.
It goes through the transformer, induces current on the secondaries, then deposits into A2. Then it is abruptly shut off.
Now the secondary windings takes the initial pulse and sends it to the multiplier, and back into the transformers primaries to replicate and deposit in A2. 2x for 1 pulse.
But we also have that spike that showed up when we first turned the thing off. So now we are up to 3x.

So now start looking at it running say a 30 percent duty cycle. Kinda like spinning a flywheel.

Then you got the induced current on the wing batteries. And what ever type of back EMF shows up and gets replicated accross the transformer.

You follow me?

Originally Posted by Matthew Jones View Post
I don't think its created, its just there. You have a full environment of electrically charged and magnetically charged particles. They are in constant process of attracting to what you have on the wire or in the component. Every time they make contact they short out a given amount and you loose.

This is why DC is so vulnerable to loss and AC isn't. No modulation, nothing to confuse the particles just straight attraction. So they come in and make heat, make resistance (Magnetically), and generally short out charges.

Thats what a Transient spike is also. Charge sucked into the system by the expansion and contraction of a magnetic field. The charge is caused from the mass of particles collected and compressed on the outside of the field. When the amount is high enough it cuts the flux of the wire on the way back in, when the field collapses. More power to create the field, or more induction, bigger spikes.

Nature doesn't do anything, the balance is set. Energy cannot be created, only changed. The amount is set.

Originally Posted by Marduk View Post
Hi, this is my first post.

My knowledge of electronics is really, really basic but I will describe what I have done to the best of my knowledge.

I have not used a dead battery, I am using a 24 Volt 3 Farrad car audio cap in place of the dead battery. A small dc motor (both have copper brushes instead of carbon brushes) is connected via it's shaft to another small dc motor. I have noticed sparks in the motors and I am sure that this "excites" the enviroment and that's where the "additional" energy is coming from.

I am not on-line often but will post further results when possible.

Keep on trying,like Thomas Edison!

Originally Posted by Turion View Post
My 4th battery was a good one that would take a charge.

I would use my old wires, and have drug out the # 6 wires I had in a box from back then. I'm sure that BIG wires make a difference, but wouldn't be surprised if LENGTH of wires make a difference too. Too many variables here.
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
I ran different combinations of things, but the original WORKING system ran with loads (and sometimes the fourth battery) connected directly to battery 3 in parallel.

I had a pulley and turnbuckle connected to motor (as in the PESwiki picture) and tightened the turnbuckle to put more of a load on the motor to get battery 3 to produce more power. But that original motor ran THROUGH a gearbox, so there was always SOME load on the motor.

I would watch the voltage on the primaries, and you could see them begin to drain, so I would tighten the turnbuckle and they would go back up.

It wasn't until I began to experiment more recently that I began to use a generator as the load on the motor because it gave the added advantage of ALSO producing power, but the load on the motor still has to be synched with the load on battery three.

Hope that helps.

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-22-2017 at 05:42 AM.
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Old 12-23-2017, 11:26 AM
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Hello Everyone

Did some rewinding tonight another 3 tries and each time the
last 30 turns would puncture the enamel on the wire and short out.
I could not see anything razor sharp but it was there. It took
me some time, but I finally got it up again. It really runs cool.

The motor is a modified scooter one rated at 36v. I put it on the
new system for the first time and fired it up after the charge batteries
has been sitting at 12.44v all day long. Now it is an hour later and
the resting voltage after 10 minutes is 12.42v.

All of this pumping action and I only lost .01v so this is better
than running the inverter. The motor was adjusted around again
from 2.2amps for a few minutes (about 10 min) then to 1.5amps,
then I turned it down to 1.12amps at 16v this is where I ran it for
an hour. The other booster going to the run batt's ran at 3.5amps

Of course I am going to need a lenz free generator to go over the
top to get usable power. With the boosters being able to run up
the RPM's the regenerative Tesla coils with all of the strands, tuning
is now possible for me.

I know it has always been there now but I am only just waking up
to the concept. I may make a smaller rotor and give this one to
my son, not sure yet.

But back to the pumping action before I go, the booster powering
the motor can be adjusted on the back plate so you don't need
the booster if it is done just right. It happens when you need torque
so you crank the back plate to get the extra. Next thing you know
the boost can be turned off but still letting power go thru it and it
runs faster and better. But as soon as you bypass the boosters
red legs going from the motor to the battery the magic stops
due to the elimination of the internal resistance like diodes offer.

Instead I have adjusted the back plate so the motor is at it's lowest
amp draw so when I go up in voltage the amp draw does not go way
up past 2 amps. With this adjustment the booster is a great tool to
vary RPM's. This is important when you use the motor in conjunction
with a lenz free tesla coils so tuning adjustments can be made to
get the exact frequency for rotor acceleration.

It is taking me forever to get anything done on this because I
work 12 hrs a day.

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Old 12-24-2017, 10:59 AM
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Good windings

It is amazing to watch this little modified motor
(Energizer at high speeds) run between positives with the
2 boosters so swapping the batteries is not needed.

Using the same 1.3amp load on the inverter the results show
conclusively is every run that per hour the point count drop
is .05.

Using that smae exact amount of power or amp draw between the
same positive poles my little energizer (Two north poles) consistently
takes only .02 points off the battery voltage.

The drive booster lets me dial in the desired amp draw and or
speed for the motor. This will be very effective for tuning it to
a lenz free genhead.

I hooked 2 stepper motors to the shaft one at a time and in
each case the amp draw went way up while the stepper motors
offered almost no power in return. These tiny motor have huge
cogging losses before any current is produced.

This step to verify beyond any reasonable doubt that the
Matt Modified Motor is returning power back to the source is

I used 20awg magwire 50 turns, 40 turns, 40 turns. It runs cool.

As far as I can tell it uses 2.5 times less energy as my inverter
at the same draw. Or it has a cop of 2.5

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Old 12-25-2017, 10:02 AM
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Video of Scooter Motor Energizer

This is a video board talk as well as an actual view of my split
positive, 2 booster and modified scooter motor that returns some
of it's own run energy back to the run battery.

Have a great time of the year and say GOD BLESS YOU. This is the
reason for the season. Try it, you will never be the same. It is like
saying "I LOVE YOU" which many people can not say and mean it but
go ahead anyway, you might be surprised.


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Old 12-26-2017, 07:30 AM
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Inverter VS Mod Mtr

More Data In (Still in Progress)

Test 1

Inverter using a 1.25 amp at 12.33v on the run and dropped to 12.15v
under load for a differential of 14. 35v. This means the power consumption

14.35v X 1.25amps = 18watts for 1 hour or 18watt/hrs or

18w X 3600 seconds = 64,800 Joules.

So using this as a standard in our test sequence the inverter using 18watts
took 64,800 joules in a 10 point drop on the voltage starting at 12.33v

So using these watt burning figures we can divide by 10 and say that
for each point (approx.) drop on the meters the joule count is 6,480 joules
burned up. Or

Point Count

1 = 6,480 J
2 = 6,480 J
3 = 6,480 J
4 = 6,480 J
5 = 6,480 J
6 = 6,480 J
7 = 6,480 J
8 = 6,480 J
9 = 6,480 J
10= 6,480 J

For a total Joule count per point.

Test 2

Modified Motor

8:25pm the test began with the voltage at 12.23v where we left off.
the loaded voltage was 12.05 at the start and the loaded voltage dropped
to 12.02v ending the 1 hour run. The motor pulled the 1.25 amps and
a slightly elevated differential voltage of 26.5v (run pack Volts) minus
the charge battery voltage now at (average) 12.03v or 14.47v.

After resting for 1 hr from 9:25pm to 10:25pm
the meter showing a resting voltage of 12.21v

So resting voltage dropped .02 points and loaded voltage dropped .03
points. Using our joule count above for a .03 point drop we get

6,480 J X 3 = 19,440 Joules used up not the 64,800 J the inverter took.

Test 3

Modified Motor

10:30pm startup resting voltage picked up where we left off at 12.21v
the watts were approx the same at 18 watts. the loaded voltage at the
beginning of the test was 12.02 and went down to 11.98v one hour later.

So this test ended at 11:30pm and after resting another measurement
was taken for the resting volts of 12.16v

So a 4 point drop or a .04 drop or 6,480J X 4 = 25,920 J not the 64,800J
the inverter took.

I have to go unhook.

PS gonna run one more inverter test BRB

Last Test underway with the inverter.

Modified Motor

At 12:30am the standing voltages was 12.16v and the loaded voltage
had gone down from 11.98v to 11.93v then I stopped at 1:30am

At 2:30am which is 1 hr later my resting voltage was 12.11v so anyway
you cut it this is a .05v drop for a joule count of 6,480 J X 5 = 32,400 J
not the 64,800 J the inverter took.

At 3:30am central I will unhook the inverter and show figures.

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-26-2017 at 08:42 AM.
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Old 12-26-2017, 10:19 AM
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Okay here is the crazy deal.

My motor has been climbing up in voltage on the boost meter from 16.5v
up to 17.2v during the dang test over an hour I find the amp draw going
up with it to near 20 watts. Crazy.

Then if that is not enough the inverter test shows me an ever diminishing
amp draw in a declining curve. When i got back at the end the watts had
dropped to 15.5w crazy so not a very controlled test right? Right!!

The start up volts 12.11v the ending and after nearly an hour the voltage
stabilized and the first 30 minutes it was done climbing coming in at 12.02v
i consider it a dead battery. The loaded volts went from (actually gained
2 points doing motor runs)11.95v down to 11.86v.

This is approx the same as the start for test #1 using this inverter.

I have a long way to go learning to get an accurate joule count but even
in the face of divergence of motor and inverter the motor still blows the
inverter away.

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-26-2017 at 11:11 AM.
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Old 12-27-2017, 08:14 AM
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Fresh Charge Resting 12:90v All day

Keep an eye on this page this morning as I am updating right now.

NEW CONTROL TEST with inverter. Time Out 11:45pm

12.90v resting 6 hours after last night and this mornings bulk charging
at the C/20 rate on ALUM batteries. Second stage of charging was done
at half the C/20 rate for 5hrs then the amps were raised to top off
well under the C/20 rate holding at 16v for 10minutes and then 16.4v
for another 5 minutes. This was all done using a transformer (toroid) to
bridge rectifier and smoothing caps. RAW DC or RAW DIRECT CURRENT.

The inverter was loaded and the drive energy is as follows.
Feeding the the drive booster at 1600ma and a differential of13.64v at
the beginning portion of the 1 hour run and the ending differential 13.72v
which averaged is 13.68v.

Drive energy was 13.68v X 1600ma = 21.888w

Over the 1 hr run the battery went from 12.90v then stop to rest 1 hr
the battery was 12.77v. This is a 13 point drop. The run loaded volts
were 12.65v down to 12.55v at the end of 1 hr running. This is a 10
point drop.

The Control test was stopped at 12:45am central and at 1:45am the
final reading was took. Using the smaller of the two point drops we see
the 10 points was lost of battery voltage.

Joules are watt/seconds and for each hour we have 3600 seconds this is

21.888watts X 3600 seconds = 78,796 joules that were used up over
a 10 point drop. So we may find the amount of joules used up for each
.01v drop on the meter. This is

78,796J / 10 = 7,879.6J per point drop. or 7,880J rounded off.

Each .01v drop

.01v = 7,880J
.02v = 7,880J
.03v = 7,880J
.04v = 7,880J
.05v = 7,880J
.06v = 7,880J
.07v = 7,880J
.08v = 7,880J
.09v = 7,880J
.010v = 7,880J

The inverter drive booster was set at 14.5v while the run batt recharge
booster stayed as always at the 26.5v setting. The recharging booster
ran at 3.60amps during the entire control test.

This is only relevant when you consider efficiency losses. 2 Boosters
passing a calculable amount of power at an average of 90%. This is
another subject completely.

This is our control test standard for conventional watt burning.


Last edited by BroMikey; 12-27-2017 at 08:42 AM.
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Old 12-27-2017, 09:55 AM
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Okay New Stats are in BRB

Second Test using Modified Motor Results here.

Still entering data

At 1;45am the second test started the voltage 12.77v 3 minutes
later the run load voltage stabilized at 12.55v picking up approx where we
left off in the controlled test. The ending run load volts were 12.50v

If you all recall the drive booster was set at 14.5v during the inverter
controlled watt burning test. When connected to the motor the booster
voltage reading started at 16.3v to 16.6v right off the bat and by the
end of the one hr 17.2v so booster voltage readings were floating or
fluctuating consistently.

The drive energy fell right on the same amp draw of 1600ma over the
entire 1 hour run. The differential reading made it's way from 13.74v to
13.65v always varying in the beginning and by the end the figures had
increased slightly to 13.81v moving around down to 13.76v and back

In both cases, differential voltage and drive booster voltage danced
wildly on the meter never giving a consistent reading possibly due to
the motors ability to introduce AC into the DC, I don't know, but the
meter knows something I don't.

The second booster that runs power back to the run packs ran at
the same amp draw as in the control test at 3.6amps.

As I have pointed out the battery was measured 1 hr later and rested
at 12.70v and appeared to still be in the process of recharging which
is not the case when the inverter is run and then a rest. I checked the
the batteries ability to recharge itself when the inverter test was
done the batteries were regaining to equilibrium. I checked the battery
every 15 minutes and it was done rising after 25 minutes.

So from 12.77v to 12.70v is a 7 point drop and the loaded run voltage
went from 12.55v down to 12.50v is a 5 point drop and so as we did
last time we used the lesser of the 2 figures or the run loaded voltage.

This is a .05v point drop rather than double the inverter amount.

So for exactly the same energy input, the mod mtr ran and sent back
some of it's energy back to the run pack as well as putting energy in the
charge pack plus offering an abundant amount of mechanical.


Last edited by BroMikey; 12-27-2017 at 10:26 AM.
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Old 12-29-2017, 11:16 AM
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You would have to be sitting in my chair for weeks to make one alteration
to see how huge the change is. Battery leads equal length. The
measurable differential is swinging more wildly than ever before. The
meter batteries are fine, I have moved the meter away from everything
still the wild crazy swings.

Before the installed lead this did not go wild.

Time after time after time the mod mtr drops 4 points per hour
while the inverter set at the same power input takes twice as much.


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Old 12-30-2017, 11:00 AM
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For those of you following my data points I went away from the
mod mtr to regular one of the same frame. As you may know the
battery curve relationship to power density is the greatest
delivery of energy in the middle range like 12.40v to 12.20v
so when I ran the inverter in this area the data point drop was
right around 8 points and hr and the Mod Mtr was 4. So I tried
a conventionally wound 24v MY1016 frame like the scooters
use today.

I set the amp draw the same as the other tests at 1.5amps
and ran it from 2:00am to 4:00am and got a 24 point drop or
or a 12 point drop per hour. The Mod Mtr only drops 4 points.

The differential did not fluctuate at all whatsoever as does the
mod mtr. The diff was rock solid never moving any data points
while the mod mtr swings wildly.

There is such a big difference. Of course the charge battery
voltages were way higher to get the amp draw within range so
there is just no way to compare the two motors at all with the
set up.

I see little hope running a conventionally wound motor between
the positives in this arrangement. However I heard that a regular
motor could be pulsed using an adjustable PWM that could change
the duty cycle, frequency and so on.

These normal motors eat lots of power.


Last edited by BroMikey; 12-31-2017 at 12:35 PM.
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Old 12-31-2017, 08:20 AM
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I see Turion Man is out tonight beatin the trolls.

At his request i did away with the clip leads, all 6 of them and now
no more bouncing needles when clips are misaligned. there are none.

I have gained something as I am sitting on a meter like a mother hen
waiting for each data point to hatch out. Just to generalize the top
portion of the battery voltage at 12.90v is a bit fluffy and will go down
about 5 or 6 data points using the mod mtr but the inverter eats 12-13
points in this upper voltage of the battery. This is not the highest density
part of a battery curve and is no surprise to the accomplished.

After taking off 6 clips as shown and one bad wire (Green wire copper was
black inside) from wire I grabbed. All wires are now high amp wire with
silver tin and Teflon. That 1 wire was really bad, anyway
my data point drop has decreased to 3.5 points per hour even in this
low density region of the battery.

There is a difference that i would have never known unless i ran with
clips for a few weeks and cut them all off connecting everything with a
bolt. Or lug which ever you prefer.

The boosters vibrate and pulsate at HF and it is clear clipy's will shake
rattle and bounce. I looked up and the amp meter was bouncing gently
up and down, seemed like all connections were good. Nope the black
lead had to be consistently adjusted to get the shaky nettle to settle
out. Clip leads are a sin against your system. Better get a change of heart.

Look at all the clipy's right? When your clipy jumps and vibrates your
spikes go out the window instead of back to the battery. Clear?

PS stats real quick

after 4 hrs from 1 am to 5 am the point drop is 12.61 run load ending
12.40 run load. So it is more consistent. resting voltage starting at
12.90v and later the ending. This mod mtr took 5 points off the
battery every hr. ending volts 12.60v which is considered fully

At the 2 hr mark the drive booster ran up from 16v to 17v a point
at a time raising the amp draw to 1.65 so was turned back down to 16v where it stayed pulling the 1.5amps.

Last edited by BroMikey; 12-31-2017 at 12:34 PM.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:33 AM
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Modified Motor runs 20 watts then 2 generator coils relieve the this
20 watts slightly each time a properly wound gen coil is engaged.

To keep the system charging battery #3 the run batteries are connected
to 2 generator coils that keeps the booster off. The batteries are no
longer needed at this point, the charge battery continues to rise.

More and more lenz free coils populate the rotor that deliver excess far
beyond the expectation of our present day science could every bring
itself to see.

30v at 1.5 amps keeps the booster off and eliminates it's losses. The rotor
with speed up slightly with each added coil. I am seeing a minimum of
20-30 watts per coil if not more when speed up is almost zero.

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Old 01-11-2018, 01:59 PM
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If this is working like you hoped, you gotta post some video. The more people who show this working, the more that will try it. And post on the 3 Battery thread too. You also need to give folks specs on rotor size, magnet size, coil size, so they can see what is working. My dream was that everyone would build the same machine, but I can see that was just a dream. People are ALWAYS going to take what they have and build and just hope it works. And probably ***** and moan when it doesn’t and say we’re liars.
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
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Old 01-11-2018, 10:41 PM
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Turion-Man strikes again

I will post it, all over the place. But especial in the 3BGS thread of
which you should be the proud owner. As you well know I first saw
Thane Heins talking about Tesla Coils that offer current and voltage
while at the same time helping the Modified Motor out a small amount.

Not that it needed much help. This modifed energizer scooter motor
Matt made is rockin my socks off. Like DESA said it is a motor that just
keeps on giving.

Then you guys all saw me using a different motor last year to test
Turion style /Tesla coils. The coil when engaged would take a 2200 ma at 80v
input and lower it to 1700ma at 80v. The coil would have given me more
than 20-30 watts if I could change the high voltage of 800v down
without so many losses.

If everyone remembers I used what I had at the time pulling 24 pump
motor spools off of washing machine parts and rewound them all onto
one spool at 170 feet each 24 strands.

Some speeds I only needed 6-8 strands to reach the null point or the rpm
that gave the most power out of the coil without effecting or slowing
the rotor driven by the motor.

I want to use this little motor without having to go up to the big motor
frame that I saw on ebay for $60. I have this one so I want to make it
work so others who have this one will use their's and follow.

As I said the rotor I have took 80v at 3000ma to get it up to speed or
240watts then dropped back to sometimes to 1700 ma or 140watts but
my tiny Modified motor is only set up for 30v max at 3 amps max. It might
be a strain on it so I will use a tiny rotor. My son has an even smaller
one we want to get working so he can show it off.

I am gaining in experience now little by little thanks to getting my foot
in the door of ground breaking technology because of guys like you and
others who talk tough but deep down are sweet peeps.

Just to even get a clue on how this all might be possible keeps me
encouraged and thankful. Before now I had a rotten feeling I would
never be able to make enough excess energy that would be practical
for poor boys like me.

My time is short (still tied to the whipping pole) so let me say all good
things and hope that everyone will see this and understand. My vision
is to see several 14 foot rotors powering a city.

I am a dreamer, thanks to all, I am forever in your debt.

Last edited by BroMikey; 01-12-2018 at 01:10 AM.
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Old 01-14-2018, 10:20 PM
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Hello Everyone

Today I would like to show each of you my parts list. These are the parts
that my son and I are using. These parts can only be easy to find if
you use the key words listed when searching on EBAY. I looked last
year and could not find anything I wanted.

This year I accidentally found what we need. If you have gone to the
trouble of taking one of your old scooter motors apart to modify it as
suggested, in the 3BGS (3 battery generating System) thread, stick with
me because you can use this small motor and not to big of battery
pack if you follow the proper sizing for the Generator Head.

We have been given much by David Bowling in terms of proportions.
Many of you have a modified scooter motor that you would like to use
as a self runner. To do that we can work in reverse.

Dave went to a larger motor that he can run at 200watts all day long.
For us we will be glad to get 50watts all day long. I can turn mine up
from 15v to 20v plus and run at 2.2amps all day long so you can see
as compared to Dave's big machine we are at 70% to 75% size reduction.

Since Dave has shown his 24" Genhead plans for the bigger stuff we can
approximate that we need an 11" box with a 6" rotor. Have fun and stay
tuned. Jordy and I will be back with our smaller self runners that use the
modified scooter motor that many of you already have.

This parts list does not rack up into the thousands of dollars which most
of us can not afford including Jordy and I. The goal is to complete the
build based on the original Modified Motor so a youth may be able to
achieve the self looped systems.


Last edited by BroMikey; 01-15-2018 at 06:30 AM.
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Old 01-15-2018, 02:29 AM
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Here is my conceptional view for motor sizing to generator head.
This is based on my testing last year. I don't need Turion to tell me
anything, anymore, he has put us on track many times.

Based on my tests.
My tests used the small modified motor with a 10" rotor which was to
large. The amp draw went up well over 2.5 amps and could not achieve
the needed rmp's for coils that I wound to get much from.

Here is me using a dishwasher motor at 200watts 3000rpm's getting
free energy from 1 coil.


Tesla coil video proves university math all wrong, as the rotor is
assisted by an amount easily calculated or
2300ma drops to 1900ma at 88 volts or a 400ma reduction at 88v=

.400 X 88 = 35watt reduction in prime mover power while lighting a
corn cob bulb at 66v 40ma so all you brains out there tell me what is
going on. A 35 watt savings only if I draw 2.6watts off of my Tesla

We need RPM's class. 3000RPM's minimum or 3500 RPM's which is well
within our grasp. For those of you who did not see Matt's video
demonstrating his Modified Motor, he showed that the small motor
will run right on up to 5000rpm's on only 24v. Now in his demo he did not
have anything connected to it so we need to target 3000rpm's or just

Once we have the spindle hub and rotor mounted to bearings we can
wind coils maybe 12 strand 200 feet 25 awg. The goal is to place 2 coils
around a 6" rotor using 1/2" magnets to feed the run batteries enough
energy so they are no longer needed. This gives us a COP of a little over 1.

Naturally the 6" rotor will be able to handle as many coils as we can
physically place around it deriving even more excess energy as demonstrated
by Thane Heins in video form. Also yours truly. That is I have also
shown in video that coils can be long enough that are connected in series
so that all the energy coming from these coils is extracted free of charge.

At this point the goal will be to build for placing large numbers of coils
all around so COP will rise to infinite. Or shall we say self sustaining with
huge amounts of excess that proves everything you know about electricity
is wrong.

I am unwilling to abandon my smaller MY1016 motor. First things first, I
am in no hurry and as I have stated before, if I can not pass this project
down to my son so he can do the hands on then I will have failed.

The rest of you young guys are welcome to tag along. Glad to have you.

If you are trying to get 2000watts excess energy better follow Turion
in the 3BGS thread. Turion is a genius and worked his butt
end off for the last 10 years so we could have a free lunch. Let's build.


Last edited by BroMikey; 01-15-2018 at 06:26 AM.
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Old 01-15-2018, 07:45 AM
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Three Battery system results

Originally Posted by BroMikey View Post
Modified Motor runs 20 watts then 2 generator coils relieve the this
20 watts slightly each time a properly wound gen coil is engaged.

To keep the system charging battery #3 the run batteries are connected
to 2 generator coils that keeps the booster off. The batteries are no
longer needed at this point, the charge battery continues to rise.

More and more lenz free coils populate the rotor that deliver excess far
beyond the expectation of our present day science could every bring
itself to see.

30v at 1.5 amps keeps the booster off and eliminates it's losses. The rotor
with speed up slightly with each added coil. I am seeing a minimum of
20-30 watts per coil if not more when speed up is almost zero.


Congratulations if these are the results you're getting.

When you say "with each added coil" on the generator - your diagram shows 2 coils in series. So if you added another coil, would you put a third coil in series with those two or would you add some in parallel? Just for clarification. I would imagine in series if you're more interested in the voltage or perhaps 3 sets of 2 in series paralleled up to boost voltage and current.

Will you be posting some pictures and videos of your experiment as well as sharing your results in the Three Battery thread as Turion mentioned?
Aaron Murakami

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Old 01-15-2018, 07:47 AM
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cache glitch

Ok Firefox, going down the drain in the last few months!

Since Turion's post, this wasn't updating for me and I just saw your new posts, will check them out. Kept feeding me a cached view of the thread for some reason.
Aaron Murakami

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Old 01-15-2018, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Aaron View Post

Congratulations if these are the results you're getting.

When you say "with each added coil" on the generator - your diagram shows 2 coils in series. So if you added another coil, would you put a third coil in series with those two or would you add some in parallel? Just for clarification. I would imagine in series if you're more interested in the voltage or perhaps 3 sets of 2 in series paralleled up to boost voltage and current.

Will you be posting some pictures and videos of your experiment as well as sharing your results in the Three Battery thread as Turion mentioned?
Hey Aaron

thanks for the pat.

Not a problem on this end, as far as I am concerned you are like Turion
to me, just had to get that clear. You are the best of the best and smartest
young man I have met in a long long time. You know what I have said
about you.

Anyway it will be my pleasure to answer any questions you or others may
have about what I know first hand about these systems. The people are
going to catch up.

Now listen I am unsure about the way your coil will be wound so until we
go to that part of the build you won't know either. But let me put it
another way so you are on board where I live.

When you get enough strands in series the rotor will speed up amost
crazy uncontrollably it will seem like as you saw in the video, however at
this place above the null which in my case was 15 to 18 strands, you get
less generated power out of your coil. So in my case, at my rotor size
and speed using my 4200 foot series 24 strand fine wire coil producing
1000volts....................... see what I mean? It is a run on sentence.

Let me say this, when I was at 8-10 strands at certain speeds with more
than one air gap, here we go again, on and on. It depends. But let me say
this about the null, I got way more generated power out of my coils
when the rotor did not speed up or slow down.

For drama I am showing the effect that makes it perfectly clear that
each time I add a coil the rotor speeds up and lessens the input power
to the prime mover. It was stated that Matt used a small rotor maybe
similar to what I am using to go over the top so I am following the music.

If Matt did it, maybe I can. This is the way I got started by thinking I
might be able to get the extra. Then I read the 3bgs thread and you are
hearing what has already been done. So let's make that clear first, I am
not the author.

I could not wait so I hooked up a 3400rpm dishwasher motor to my rotor
so I could get some experience and you are seeing what I found. I was
lost about how to follow Thane Heins in winding a coil that would speed
up under a load so I wandered. Then Turion told me some of the tests
he had done and I freaked. 24 strands? I never would have thought
that this was needed but I did what I was told.

My strands broke they were reused wire and so thin but the plan was
to use 8 strands in series at the right rpm's and I could have 3 sets of
8. Well I kept having breakage and have abandoned this fine wire coil
even tho I learned a bunch. It is 29awg producing high voltage way
above what I need.

This is what I had and was unwilling to wait so I rigged up a winder for
24 strands as shown on my youtube. It worked, that is all I needed.


When me and Jordy get everything ordered that we still do not have
and get it running I will of course be posting everything.

I don't care what they say about you Aaron, you are the best of the best.
People should buy all your books and get a reality check for extra energy
systems, it was your site that makes this all possible. You will be rewarded
richly. You are John Bedini to me, or someone who has properly
and is keeping this dream alive.

Last edited by BroMikey; 01-15-2018 at 11:51 PM.
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Old 04-11-2018, 08:27 PM
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Here is an article for fun reading about electrical steel.


Got more hardware in the mail today.

Last edited by BroMikey; 04-11-2018 at 11:26 PM.
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Old 04-12-2018, 11:42 PM
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Got my 10mm pillow blocks (4) today. Waiting for hub, SOON!!

Thanks Matt and Dave on the updates I needed that reminder.

One thing I could do is break out my MAD MACK wheel and explore
possible cancellation methods. My counter has been installed and I
will be winding soon doing video of course.
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Old 04-30-2018, 10:55 PM
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Did some core work this week and got my 3rd batch of hubs in the
mail today. like $2 a piece. I looked last years many hours on ebay for
hubs and found nothing cheap, something like $100 each crazy. Then
I typed in the word FLANGE when I was looking for 10mm bearings and
bang that is where the hubs were all hiding. It's that crazy chinese
non English confusion.

Anyway Chinese people are great people, I just don't speak the language.

Going away May 1st and will be home working again mid month.

Got my rotor pilot holes done (HSS DRILLS ONLY) got my pipe nuts
that are 1/4" thread and the 1/4" pipe also. Pulled out my winder,
the weather is so nice, counter installed ready for use.

Dad is 84yrs and is going downhill so gonna visit hoping to perk him up.
He is 1000 miles from here. I would love to do some video but am running
out of time today.

The project is a done did deal. I am making parts to assemble for Son
Jordan 14yrs. I will make it like a snap together model for him so he can
become familiar with these systems at a young tender age. Thanks to
Dave and Matt who have worked tirelessly for years and passed the idea
along. Also a special thanks to Thane Heins who shows his coils speeding
up a rotor when loaded instead of dragging the rotor down when drawing
power just like the TESLA patent reports.

Got to try that commutator alteration soon using 4 teeth not 3 leaving
no gaps when using the Matt Mod Motor as a LENZ FREE GENNY. Sweet.

Me and Jordan are going to have a blast with all of these experiments.
Jordan has already witnessed the regenerative effect my Turion based coils
produced when drawing power out of them which other coils slow the
rotor down.

As I had stated somewhere (so many threads I forgot) that my specific
coil winding had 170 feet of wire 24 times or 24 strands as it is called.
As I began running the rotor using a Modified scooter motor I connected
one single strand to a bridge or a single diode or just a resistor the rotor
speed dropped right away. Same with a series connection all the way up
to about 6 series connect 170 foot strands.

It is at this place we call a NULL. The Null point (and I am repeating Dave)
that the coil does not slow down the rotor and gives or puts out the most
power in the generation process. As i continue connecting more strands
the rotor will go faster. And Faster drawing far less power to drive at
the PMM modified scooter motor. However the coil energy output is low.

Never give up and never give in, someone has already done what you
want to do so once you show interest someone will rescue the drowning.
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