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  #151  
Old 09-07-2015, 01:24 AM
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Lock Up

i think this design takes advantage of attraction and repulsion and avoids lock up. But we shall see.
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  #152  
Old 09-07-2015, 02:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumage View Post
...Over the next week or so I shall be engineering a Six slot Polycarbonate rotor centred around a quality Ball Race and getting just a single pair of magnets to " play nice " with their fixed ones.
Cheers Grum.
Hey Grum or anyone,
I am having difficulty with the adjustable angle magnet mount design on the rotor. For economics sake, I am using wood for the rotor which limits my possibilities. Any help in that area would be appreciated. I would like to be able to adjust the angle. Everything that I could come up with involves a piece of steel or aluminum which would make tuning the magnet tough. Angle easy, magnetic tuning tough. I am using 1.5 x .75 x .375 ceramic rectangle magnets.
Thanks,
Randy
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  #153  
Old 09-07-2015, 03:31 AM
kenssurplus kenssurplus is offline
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Randy, if you can make a plastic or nylon carriage to hold your magnets, or if the magnets have a central mounting hole, then use nylon bolts / nuts to do your adjustments. You can find them at Ace Hardware (at least my local one carries them).

Also stainless steel, if you get the correct material, is much less magnetic than regular steel. If you can get 316L, 304 etc. or an equivalent low magnetic attraction stainless, it works well as a stator mounting hardware for my axial flux windmills that use high powered Neo-magnets. Some of the stainless steel hardware that I have tried does have a slight magnetic pull towards neo-magnets, and I have had to test each piece against a magnet to find the least affected for use in high magnetic field areas.
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  #154  
Old 09-07-2015, 03:47 AM
kenssurplus kenssurplus is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
Grumage,
You're right about what happens to the steel. But I will sacrifice some steel to develop the best shape for the ramps.

Max said the LEAST number of magnets he had on a rotor was 6. When you start adding more magnets than that, you really start to reduce the length of the ramp when you compare degrees of circumference allotted to each magnet, so the ramps need to be short. HOW short is what I want to know. I also think there is something to be said for ramps that have one end that curves way back around to get that one end away from the rotor magnet and actually put the middle of the length of the ramp at the point where the rotor first comes in contact with it. Does it even have to be a curve. Can the ramp be >shaped. Now BOTHE of the ends that the magnet wants to go to are in the same direction, and the middle is where the rotor comes into "contact" with the ramp.

If I take one of the short pieces of curved ramp like I used in my last video and I center a rotor magnet on it that rotor magnet will immediately spin the rotor so it moves to one end OR THE OTHER of the short piece of curved steel. It doesn't want to stay in the middle. SO what I want is a ramp that the middle is the first thing the magnet sees as it comes around, and it only has ONE end to go to...IF that makes any sense. Once I get the shape I want by experimenting with pieces of steel, I will use some laminate to replicate.
I have some steel magnetic keepers (I think they are high silicon steel) that exhibit no magnetization after removed from the magnets.
They are about 3 inches long by about 1/2 inch thick rods. The issue about using them in this project would be bending them, and bending them all the same. I would give these a try, but I don't have the metal-working tools and machinery to feel comfortable with the results. If any have thoughts or ideas about using these with this build speak up.
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  #155  
Old 09-07-2015, 05:28 AM
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Randy,
I would say it depends on how thick your rotor is, and what it is made of. My rotors are 1/2 inch thick. I can epoxy magnets onto a piece of plastic with holes on both ends of it. Then drill holes into the plastic rotor and thread them. Using brass machine screws form Lowes, (non magnetic) I can fasten the plastic to the rotor, and with an adjustment nut, raise one end to get the angle. I don't know if that would work for you or not.

Kensurplus,
Without metal working tools,bending those things will be a pain. Possibly a vise and a sledge hammer would do it. Unless you have a way to heat it before bending. If the straight piece before the bend is not exactly the same on each one, you could take the shortest as your guide and file or grind the others to the same length. But working with metal and NO tools is always a challenge.

Dave
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  #156  
Old 09-07-2015, 05:32 AM
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These are a bit pricey. Motor Magnets are made to form circles.Maybe good for rotors.This is what I have.

https://www.apexmagnets.com/54mm-x-4...YMgaAkdJ8P8HAQ








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  #157  
Old 09-07-2015, 06:20 AM
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Guys, do you really want to build working magnetic motor ? Or is that just a funny game here ?
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  #158  
Old 09-07-2015, 06:51 AM
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boguslaw,

You made the following posts:
1. A pure magnet motor with ratched propeller is know at least for 100 years
just to let you know

2. The secret of all magnetic mtors are additional freedom of movement. It can be a device wit mechanical switching to eliminate sticky points or a combined usage of gravity and magnetism or the contruction of device with not only one freely moving rotors but two or three. All in all it is the freedom which moves everything.Don't be angry.

And when nobody begged you to tell us the secret you come back with:
Guys, do you really want to build working magnetic motor ? Or is that just a funny game here ?

Are you so starved for attention that you have to come here and try to lure us into begging you for information? If you have something to share, get to it.

It should be obvious that there are several folks working toward this build. We don't need any more people playing games. There is enough of that already.

Dave
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  #159  
Old 09-07-2015, 07:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
boguslaw,


And when nobody begged you to tell us the secret you come back with:
Guys, do you really want to build working magnetic motor ? Or is that just a funny game here ?

Are you so starved for attention that you have to come here and try to lure us into begging you for information? If you have something to share, get to it.

It should be obvious that there are several folks working toward this build.

Dave
This is what we see around the world with the pride of men. It is

a cat and mouse game of "peek-a-boo" "My Dogs bigger than your dog"

When men grow up past this point(If they ever do) you will see

the unfettered sharing as we see with Mack. Let's hope that people

like boguslaw gets over that hump and will begin to show what they

have learned before it is obsolete. What he knows may not apply at all

to what we are doing. There are just so many ways to create a design

just like a cook does with each individual mixture.

Jealousy, hate, envy and many other aliens entities rule the human

domain till death do us part and this is a very sorrowful display.

Once someone has past the threshold of sanity pure reasoning rules

and no "good" will manifest. It is the goodness that we share among

one another that will bring a time of refreshing.

Anything short of that is starvation to the human conscientiousness

of which I can not afford. When men share they are alive.

This is our big chance.

Thanks Dave and a big thankyou to Mack, he has shown me that

his reasoning to bring us together and keep us together is much

higher than I had expected.

Still trying to cut me some stator brackets over here and while I was

player around with this all new mtr design I was able to watch

the rotor spin freely. What surprised me was that it didn't look like

the rotor was ever going to spin free and with just the slightest

change in stator magnet angle, all cogging would just go away.

Just watching these powerful magnetic forces cancel out is an

awesome sight to see as the rotor acts like it has no magnet

on it.
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  #160  
Old 09-07-2015, 10:28 AM
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Simply I have no time to read foolish comments. I can post what I know if you are serious about building it and open source it. The only requrement is that if you got it running then send me small working model. Is that too much ?
Yes, I don't have it, I have no mechanical skills and tools so I asked many times people to build it, yet nobody was interested. How is that , when somebody comes with beautiful yet not working schematic then everybody is happy while an old proved design patented before WWII is not interesting ?

Well...it's because the slick CAD or Inventor 3D model seems so easy to build and make it run, right ? No way!

No sweat,no joy.
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  #161  
Old 09-07-2015, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BroMikey View Post
These are a bit pricey. Motor Magnets are made to form circles.Maybe good for rotors.This is what I have.

https://www.apexmagnets.com/54mm-x-4...YMgaAkdJ8P8HAQ








This is nice design imho ,just add the freedom of movement.The second set of magnets on the drum freely movable, so the rotor would run in one direction while the drum in opposite and no sticky points for due to distance and/or the different amout of magnets.
Guys, this is only a toy anyway, the only real usage for it is to open mind for better possibilities ...
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  #162  
Old 09-07-2015, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by tachyoncatcher View Post
Hey Grum or anyone,
I am having difficulty with the adjustable angle magnet mount design on the rotor. For economics sake, I am using wood for the rotor which limits my possibilities. Any help in that area would be appreciated. I would like to be able to adjust the angle. Everything that I could come up with involves a piece of steel or aluminum which would make tuning the magnet tough. Angle easy, magnetic tuning tough. I am using 1.5 x .75 x .375 ceramic rectangle magnets.
Thanks,
Randy
Dear tachyoncatcher.

For the sake of simplicity I'm going to " fix " the rotor magnet angle to 30 deg. My reasoning behind that ? Fine adjustments can be more easily accomplished on the stator whilst the rotor is turning, also it will be much easier to ballance mechanically. I have a huge stock of Polycarbonate off cuts and a full engineering workshop so if 30 deg don't " cut it " I'll just make another one!!

As a footnote, the builders here may find that a telephone call to a local plastics company might just yield a few off cuts, Gratis, as they have to pay for the disposal of scrap.

Cheers Grum.
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  #163  
Old 09-07-2015, 12:14 PM
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Have You done this test?

Quote:
Originally Posted by shylo View Post
The poles change, When you place a magnet on a flat piece of steel at one end ,The other end is an opposite field.
When a magnet passes over a flat piece of steel , things change.(the poles move)
Shylo,

Have YOU done this test?

If You approach a North Pole* from ANY Kind Magnet to ANY kind Piece of steel, NO matter the shape, Type or whatever, let's just say A FERROMAGNETIC MATERIAL of ANY Kind...You will ONLY get a NORTH POLE there period.

No South anywhere you look, test, seek, search or whatever.

*North just as reference "color"...BUT it would do it with South as well.

Why don't You do like just Tachyoncatcher did...went to his workshop and check it out...then convince yourself before you keep spreading the wrong info here?

The Polarity INFLUENCE (North or South) spreads, expands in Space to a Ferromagnetic Material by trying to expand that 'particular' polarity type into that ferromagnetic material. No Opposite Pole will manifest anywhere in that piece of iron.

It is seen better on more sophisticated equipment, like Viewing Film, Ferrocell Lenses or even a Color CRT.

Below: A Neo Cylinder half way under Viewing Film, could see the Dielectric Plane in green separation, Bloch Wal or whatever you wanna call Neutral plane...as well as both poles defined in black.

[IMG][/IMG]

Below: A piece of Iron Cylinder, same mass weight, separated by a piece of plastic as the "Gap", attached to the same exact Neo Cylinder.

And...You can clearly see the North Magnetic Pole expanded towards the iron mass, WHILE the South Pole REMAINS exactly in the same place/space:

[IMG][/IMG]

Now, the same magnet, same iron cylinder ...same results, except different colors...this time under CRT screening:

First, the Neo Cylinder by itself:

[IMG][/IMG]

Now, the same iron cylinder attached to same magnet:

[IMG][/IMG]

Convinced?...No?...Then You do it!

If You guys keep repeating the same old school based on iron particles spread over magnets...plus all the surrounding "theories" based on its readings...then no one would be able to enlighten you BUT Your own selves and a "wish" to make it happen.

Only knowing the Real Magnetic Spectrum, behavior related to Ferromagnetics, or diamagnetics, etc,etc could ever bring you whatever the old establishment have been repeating is "impossible"...or a "Myth".

The only myth is what they have been teaching Us all for 184 years.

Quote:
To me what everybody is saying ,with this system ,is it will balance.
There has to be some form of change, or it will just balance
If not won't it just lock up?
artv
The System starts by being BALANCED FIRST...WE MAKE IT BALANCED...A VERY Perfect balancing untill No Cogging is felt...Free wheeling.

A Modular Structure consisting of Two Opposite Interactions, where each INTERACTION (Attract-Repulse) CANCELS out in a perfect ZERO.

The Ramps Angles (Rake) will either shunt one side and generate an "extra" attraction favoring rotation...Ramps create a Positive Unbalance to Our previous Balance.

If We have a Two Pole Motor and Ramps... working by showing rotor Passing Stators Bisectors towards rotation in a noticeable acceleration and in such displacement angle that would start Interacting with the Next Module we set, in the "due coming positioning angle"...then we are fine to keep going. Now, once we add more "Modules", the Ramps size, plus Adjustment Plus ANOTHER BALANCE MUST BE MADE AGAIN...and so on and on, each time we keep adding Modules.


It WILL Work.


Ufopolitics
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  #164  
Old 09-07-2015, 02:47 PM
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If you can get it to work with two stator and two magnets, add the rest of the magnets on the rotor and it should work. All additional stators do is increase speed and torque. If it won't work with two stator and all the magnets on the rotor, it won't work.
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  #165  
Old 09-07-2015, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
If you can get it to work with two stator and two magnets, add the rest of the magnets on the rotor and it should work. All additional stators do is increase speed and torque. If it won't work with two stator and all the magnets on the rotor, it won't work.

I agree to above Turion, it is just like a Two Pole conventional Motor will work same as a Four Pole...except more torque/speed on the later.


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  #166  
Old 09-07-2015, 03:26 PM
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Sweet

Thanks everyone! I will be using a variant of Ken's idea with some aluminum angle I have. I know, I know, eddy currents. Not perfect but maybe good enough. I do not have plastics or the machining tools for plastic/metal, only wood working tools. And lots of glue. I want to be able to adjust the angle 30-45 degrees as suggested. This will skew the center line unless I get things exact. As Mack said, easy to fail.

Ufo's post #167 above is dead-nuts-on. Easy to test yourself. I did. I still think we will have to further scrutinize the interaction between the ramp being induced by a north rotor and the south stator. This is probably where shunts will be required.

Thanks Again,

Randy
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  #167  
Old 09-07-2015, 04:07 PM
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Another Question

Which is stronger, or is there a difference between the attraction forces of a magnet and iron. Versus the same magnet/pole and the same iron biased with a attracting (opposite) pole? I really don't know nor do I have the scales to test this.

Thanks,

Randy
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  #168  
Old 09-07-2015, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tachyoncatcher View Post
Which is stronger, or is there a difference between the attraction forces of a magnet and iron. Versus the same magnet/pole and the same iron biased with a attracting (opposite) pole? I really don't know nor do I have the scales to test this.

Thanks,

Randy
Randy,

The answer to your (apparent) simple question, according to my experience is not simple.

When you approach two magnets by their opposite poles, those two poles making contact actually disappear (effect that Ken Wheeler calls "Voidance"), and what was each magnets dielectric center plane at each... actually disappear to 'merge' right at the seal between both poles surfaces.

[IMG][/IMG]

If you "sandwich" a piece of iron between the same kind of approach, the dielectric plane merges right in the center of iron piece. So the iron serves as the bonding mass between both magnets.

Getting to your question:

1- When you approach a magnet to plain iron, that contacting pole just starts taking over the whole piece of iron. By logical deduction that contacting pole weakens related to the opposite one since it is expanding to a bigger volume mass.

2- But, if you approach Magnet to an Influenced Iron by the opposite pole, it is a stronger reaction than previous example (1) just because is bonded by two attracting vectors, plus the other two exterior poles are also interacting by displacement of the Dielectric Plane.

This reality applies exactly the same way by making contact...or merely approaching by an air gap.


Anyways, that is my opinion...it may differ to other Members criteria...


Regards


Ufopolitics
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  #169  
Old 09-07-2015, 05:15 PM
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Stator Magnets

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grumage View Post
Dear tachyoncatcher.

For the sake of simplicity I'm going to " fix " the rotor magnet angle to 30 deg. My reasoning behind that ? Fine adjustments can be more easily accomplished on the stator whilst the rotor is turning, also it will be much easier to ballance mechanically. I have a huge stock of Polycarbonate off cuts and a full engineering workshop so if 30 deg don't " cut it " I'll just make another one!!

As a footnote, the builders here may find that a telephone call to a local plastics company might just yield a few off cuts, Gratis, as they have to pay for the disposal of scrap.

Cheers Grum.
Hi Grum,
Yes, the stators are easily adjusted, but I believe the rotor angle is going to be what is adjusted to maximize the torque from the ramps. To me, the stator angle will be what helps with the transition from the ramps since we know the strongest flux extends from the edge of the magnet, not the center, and the ramps on the repulsive side is going to be out of balance from the attraction side. If you use symmetrical geometry that is. I see the addition of the ramps as unbalancing the system and I think Mack may have already said that somewhere. I see a possible sticky point between the repulsing stator and the ramp leading to it. A challenge, for sure. But what do I know.

Thanks Ufo for the iron attraction info. I was wondering if anyone had actually measured the pull between the two scenarios. It makes sense that the added energies of biasing the iron would increase the pull. Don't prosecute me for just calling magnetism energy. Its just easier that way.
Take Care,
Randy
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  #170  
Old 09-07-2015, 07:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boguslaw View Post

Guys, this is only a toy anyway, the only real usage for it is to open mind for better possibilities ...

Hey Bog..........

I am all ears but the problem is sometimes your English makes no sense.

UFO has shown how the design does work and that it is more than a toy

so go ahead with your magnet motor theory. What college? After all of

years of speculating what your thoughts might be, I guess we can

wait a few more decades?


Either way it has become very clear time and time again that the

models for just about every principle taught in schools are inaccurate.

As shown in post #167 as Randy has pointed out, UFO's run down of

the obvious facts in the experiment takes presidence.

Presidence meaning, taking first place and does supersede the dern

dogma force fed the yuppies looking only for the money trail.


On the other hand their are those of us who have "had it" "UP THE HERE"

with following the phony leadership who have been shown to be unable

to find their heads with both hands on a good day.


We have done our bid for THEIR version of GOD and Country. To break

free from the systems clutches we must do the investigation first hand.


As UFO has shown in pictures, just like Howard Johnson tried to do, the

bloch wall moves and many other advanced interactions take place.


Most of what Howard J. has shown is not excepted by mainstream

science, only the portions of his work that compliment mainstream

philosophy/dogma/deadends.


Always with just a "HINT" that it might work. Or that nobody knows

for sure. The facts have been in for years. Some of the first powerful

magnet motors were bought up in the 1950's with their inventors

having long since expired. These inventors were silenced with money

and or threats til such time as their passing would cause their inventions

to be "out of sight out of mind".


Think about it.


Great going to all of the guys for holding the investigation data above

the dogma/peer pressure driven robots with their intimadating

non-sense.

Yours Truly
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  #171  
Old 09-07-2015, 08:44 PM
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If some of you guys are having trouble finding suitable material to build a rotor and or stator out of, there is an available solution. You can purchase a nylon or plastic disk used for cutting boards. They come in different shapes from round to square to rectangular. And they are not that expensive. Good Luck. stealth
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  #172  
Old 09-08-2015, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stealth View Post
If some of you guys are having trouble finding suitable material to build a rotor and or stator out of, there is an available solution. You can purchase a nylon or plastic disk used for cutting boards. They come in different shapes from round to square to rectangular. And they are not that expensive. Good Luck. stealth
Hi Stealth

There are a lot of things we can all share with one another such

as our practical experiences for material handling. Many do not have

the one thing or they have the other thing and they get stuck so

it is good to make up for one's weakness by giving practical application.


It is easier said than done. Good to see you are going to keep an eye

on this new thread. I couldn't think of any better material this time

for a one shot deal where a test or two will be the end of this machine

except for demonstration purposes, so I chose wood. And wow wee that

8X locktite Pro series is the kitty cats meow when it comes to bonding

to just about anything.

For those of you who want a good solid piece of wood that doesn't

cost you one hundred dollars go to your local furniture/appliance dealer

where a steady stream of cast away master bed head boards are

thrown out to the rain and snow.

I have enclosed an updated diagram that is showing my stator magnet

assembly for anyone who wants their way paved.

Look to the left of the diagram for the stator magnet mount.


The hole is made

oversize with a large flat fender washer that is 2" away from the magnet.

I might change that to a SS washer but maybe being 2" away won't

throw it off. This arrangement can be snugged up with the 1/4-20 ss bolt

and still be moved with a good strong hand in all directions.

As soon as I get what I want (The first Stage) I will show this in a video.

The next step will of course be to redirect the the machines balanced

lines of force to make it run all by it's lonesome. Well not quite til I

add a few more sets.



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  #173  
Old 09-08-2015, 09:57 AM
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Okay I have realized something very important tonight. I have

been unsure of the direction of rotation and have changed my

rotation direction 3 times. First time after Dave's video I figured

maybe he was going in the right direction but wasn't real sure

because no ramp is shown yet for the first stage. But, when

UFO posted all of his awesome design graphics, I had to wonder

if his rotation direction was right or was Dave's video right.

I didn't know which way to go at first till I looked at the effect

the ramps have that will come later.


It is starting to make more sense now Mack, why you pointed out

that I needed to be more sure which direction was right for my build.

My magnets are angled opposite the UFO drawing.


What I see clear now is that which ever way we angle the magnets

the leading edge should be the side that is the weakest as it makes

it's approach toward the ramps first and then afterward the closest

portion of the rotor magnet to follow.

Maybe I am not able to explain this to others very well but I see it

clearly now.


I just makes the most sense to have the rotor magnets weak side

to induce a field into the ramp first instead of the other way around.


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  #174  
Old 09-08-2015, 09:42 PM
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Hi UFO, I think your right , I went back and redid my test.
I was bringing a magnet towards a piece of rectangular steel, that had the opposite pole magnet on it at one end. When the rotor magnet was close enough( to the opposite end) the piece of steel moved away.
But with a longer length of steel , it didn't happen until it got close enough to the attached magnet.
Not trying to misinform ,just trying to explain what I see.
I still think it will balance without something changing.
Sorry about that folks.
artv
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  #175  
Old 09-09-2015, 04:25 AM
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BroMikey BroMikey is offline
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This is what I found out by trial and error here in this diagram.

The dimensions are not perfect on the ramp yet. What happens

is that the entire length of ramp attracts the rotor magnet except

for a tiny portion right up where the ramp sits next to the stator

magnet.

This is the repulsion side and as always the repulsion area on both sides

of the magnets center has an ever increasing or diminishing amount of force

on either side of the maximum center of the repulsive forces.


I had the rotor spinning tonight very freely with the new stator

mounts working perfectly. Then I accidentally bumped the rotor

magnet and it cracked, dug it out and reglued a new one in about

4 hours ago.

Also I am putting a white dot on the rotor magnets closest to the

stator magnets and a dot on the stator magnet where the center

of the forces are at there strongest point.

This way makes it much easier to find the optimum cancellation

position.

I also found out by experimentation, just as has been pointed out, that

the repulsion side gap between rotor and stator magnet must be set

closer together to increase the field strength in order to keep up

with the attraction side. So the attraction side must be a tiny bit

stronger as evidenced by the need to close the gap on the repuslion

side to acquire more field lines.

It is a very small difference but none the less.

Happy experimenting



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Last edited by BroMikey; 09-09-2015 at 04:29 AM.
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  #176  
Old 09-09-2015, 04:38 AM
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Turion Turion is offline
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When faced with an issue, go back to what Mack said:

"What is needed is less magnetic drag than the torque the ramps can provide. Anyway, get the neutral balance first.

A shunt on the repelling stator magnet similar to the Bedini drawing will kill some of this neutralization and add to the torque. You only need the neutralizing action of the repelling magnets after they pass their center lines. Any neutralizing affect you can eliminate before that point is beneficial. Likewise reducing back drag attraction on the attracting set, with a shunt on the other side of this magnet from its ramp, can also benefit. I can not provide details on the shape of the shunts or any spacings they may have. Look at the Bedini picture for ideas. Too big of a shunt will make things worse."

Dave
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  #177  
Old 09-09-2015, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
When faced with an issue, go back to what Mack said:

"What is needed is less magnetic drag than the torque the ramps can provide. Anyway, get the neutral balance first.

A shunt on the repelling stator magnet similar to the Bedini drawing will kill some of this neutralization and add to the torque. You only need the neutralizing action of the repelling magnets after they pass their center lines. Any neutralizing affect you can eliminate before that point is beneficial. Likewise reducing back drag attraction on the attracting set, with a shunt on the other side of this magnet from its ramp, can also benefit. I can not provide details on the shape of the shunts or any spacings they may have. Look at the Bedini picture for ideas. Too big of a shunt will make things worse."

Dave

Wow that is a statement that had not sunk in yet I didn't get

that til now, well i don't know what a shunt is yet either.

Thanks - A -Million Dave, right when i needed to hear more, I'll give

it top priority. Here is my progress report.


Below is FIG.A and FIG.B they show the influence that a single ramp

has on the repulsion side using a thin piece of PC power supply metal

1.25" wide @ approx 6" long. I see that my magnets are weak when

it come to induction forces so it became imperative to arc some of the

ramp to keep a .120" gap all long the travel area between rotor and

that half of the ramp. The angle plays an important role in induced

field strength that effects the distance the rotor travels.


No where in the Bedini diagram is there a mention of a shunt.

Also Mack talks about "rake of the ramp" and i don't understand

those terms or what they mean.

here it is again.
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Last edited by BroMikey; 09-09-2015 at 09:09 AM.
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  #178  
Old 09-09-2015, 10:39 AM
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In Bedini's drawing the the shunt is the part of the ramp where the iron connects part of one pole to the other pole of the stator magnet.

Rake means inclination.

Mario
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  #179  
Old 09-09-2015, 11:45 AM
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Rake and Shunts...

Hello to All,

@Mikey, the Rake is as Mario said, an inclination of the ramp. The Angle of adjustment.

Shunt is a deviation: "push or pull (a train or part of a train) from the main line to a siding or from one track to another..."

In this case the Bedini's iron ramp creates a "shunt" by attraction to the approaching North Pole from Rotor.

I am certain the "Key" here is to start by having a perfectly balanced system, just between magnets (not including ramps)...Now, the Gap is also important...since we may obtain a great balance BUT with too wide gaps...which is definitively not good! (we are cheating...lol) . Meaning, the Two opposite Forces (Repulse-Attract) MUST be there (Exist) AND with a lot of strength...except they are cancelling out in a straight vector at 180º. However, both forces are there.

The point to understand here is that cancellation of forces ONLY take place EXACTLY in the 180º ALIGNMENT LINE between Rotor-Stators for EACH Module...so, after that particular line-point, they are no longer cancelled, meaning they are there in FULL STRENGTH EACH...to interact with ramps...

I also believe the acceleration Ramps which generates the "Positive Unbalance" to our Balanced System should be equalized as well, in order that those unbalancing forces are distributed equally across the 180º. This way two acceleration vectors of the same magnitude would take place at each Module of Two Rotors and Two Stators.

I see many possibilities of designing the ramps shape for each module...and not necessarily ramps need to be "Symmetrical" or identical, since we are dealing with two different type of forces....but, only testing each one would give us the better ones.


Regards


Ufopolitics
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Last edited by Ufopolitics; 09-09-2015 at 12:06 PM.
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  #180  
Old 09-09-2015, 12:23 PM
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Terms

Let me add to what was said so we can be very, very specific.

Rake: In the case of this motor, the rake of the ramp is not only the angle of the ramp, but the distance of each end from the rotor. Mack said that the rake can not only contribute to the acceleration, but it can act as a BRAKE.

When the rotor magnet first approaches the ramp, if the opening is WIDE and becomes narrow, the rotor magnet accelerates. If the opening goes from narrow to wide, it DEcelerates. So if one side is overpowering the other, you can use the "rake" to give the other side an advantage and still have the magnets balanced with each other. Or you can GIVE one side an advantage by adjusting the rake.

I hope that makes sense.

shunt: As it is used here, and in reference to the drawing of the Bedini setup, the "shunt" is the piece of metal on the ramp or PART of the ramp that comes between the magnet attached to the ramp and the rotor magnet. It diverts the flux so there is NOT as much attraction between the stator magnet and the rotor magnet at a specific point. Instead, that flux goes into the iron. If you look at the drawing of the Bedini setup you will see that the ramp actually curves AROUD the magnet on the rotor side blocking or "shunting"the magnetic flux.

Max said there was NO shunt on the acceleration side. He said to look to the Bedini drawing for how to do the shunt on the repulsion side and that TOO LARGE of a shunt would do more harm than good. Those are all the statements he made about the shunt.

That means we are UNBALANCING the device to give the attraction side the advantage. Once the rotor magnet on the attraction side has accelerated (because of the attraction to the ramp of BOTH rotor magnets) and gotten past the sticky point and past the stator magnets, the rotor magnets cannot be attracted BACKWARDS because the two "attraction" magnets tend to push each other away at this point because of the angle of their relationship. They are no longer in attraction, but REPULSION.

This is OUT OF BALANCE with the other side because of the shunt on the repulsion side. The repulsion side is now in attraction because of the angle of the relationship between the magnets, but that attraction is SHUNTED.

Hope this makes sense.

Dave
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Last edited by Turion; 09-09-2015 at 12:25 PM.
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