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  #1801  
Old 11-26-2017, 12:03 AM
FRANKLIN FRANKLIN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence View Post
Franklin,

It seems you can not understand the English Language.
I told you it would NOT work with an Inverter. If you want to waste your time
Just go ahead and knock yourself out by all means.

I also told you I would NOT waste My time explaining how I did it!
Its not worth the effort.

Also I WILL NOT return to this thread again - way to much of my time has been wasted already!

BYE BYE ! To ALL.

Respectfully ,

Clarence
Clarence

Could you tell me how a the toroid WITHOUT the secundary, can pump the electrons from the ground? Just with the primary??
And the toroid is just conected to the mains and not connected to the ground, could you please tell me??

This is a great device so tell us a little more

Respectfuly
Frank
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  #1802  
Old 11-26-2017, 01:03 AM
FRANKLIN FRANKLIN is offline
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Somebody here could comment
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  #1803  
Old 11-26-2017, 09:05 AM
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boguslaw boguslaw is offline
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Here is how I can imagine it works: on the surface of every wire there are dormant electrons ,they are almost at the same potential so we cannot measure current. Guess what generate them ?
By applying special EMF force on the closed loop we give them a small kick time after time they move along the surface gaining speed. when there is plenty of them they find a better way to dissipate their kinetic energy through the load to ground where they become dormant again.
You should now figure out the important aspects of invention, because it is not easy to match all requirements. Mostly it is the same as TPU device but with different method of agitation of electrons.
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  #1804  
Old 11-27-2017, 02:47 AM
FRANKLIN FRANKLIN is offline
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I agree with you

but, I dont know if you saw the simple setup from clarence?
that one desnt have a secundary on the toroid.

I tried that setup but, I measured 12 ampers from the mains and 12 ampers from the ground. so I think that design did not work
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  #1805  
Old 05-08-2018, 07:17 PM
roby_035 roby_035 is offline
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PREGUNTA a CLARENCE

CLARENCE
Los primarios de ambos toroides van devanados en el mismo sentido?CW
ROBY
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  #1806  
Old 05-08-2018, 07:35 PM
roby_035 roby_035 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarence View Post
Liable,

Seems the protective covering was also torn away and damaged.
needs to be replaced by protective covering before attempting to
wind new turns.
Also between layers of new winds cover the layers as you go with 3/4 inch
wide beige color masking tape.
It makes it easier on your eyes to count the number of new turns in each new layer.

It takes 330 turns of # 20 AWG Magnetic wire. Approx 6" for each turn X 330 turns equals 1980 inches divided by 12 inches equals 165 feet of wire
needed.
Get a 200 foot small spool to work with as it will need to be small enough to pass through the center of the core for each turn.

Hope this helps.

Clarence
Clarence
The 330 winding primary windings go in both toroids in the same direction?
Or one toroid is clockwise and the other is counter-clockwise?
Thanks ROBY
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  #1807  
Old 06-25-2018, 11:52 AM
digits10 digits10 is offline
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Test #1

I finally got around to hooking up my setup. I have ~30 ground rods connected per Clarence's advice. The tests I just ran are based on the design he shows in this image.

I put the kill-a-watt meter on the A/C input side, and my amp meter on the ground wire. I had a 300 watt A/C load on the output. When running the load, the KAW never changed - it stayed at like 3 watts, while the ground line amp meter showed 3-4 amps. HOWEVER, when I moved the amp meter to the incoming A/C line, it showed the same 3-4 amps. I also disconnected the toroid to see if there was any difference. With this layout in the attached photo, there was no change if it was connected or disconnected.

Also, I used a power backup (120v APC UPS) to see what would happen if I connected the setup to it as the power source (off-grid). I got the same behavior. HOWEVER, the 3-4 amp still showed on the ground line, even when only on the power backup. I'm no expect, but I would have assumed that it would need to loop back to the APC unit. One flaw in my test is that I was using a surge strip to turn on/off power to the APC unit. I should have physically disconnected since the building ground would have still been connected.

Regardless, this setup does fool the KAW (not sure why), but an amp meter shows current flowing through the same A/C source line. Basically utility hot to physical ground and the KAW can't see it.

I don't think this is the same result as Clarence since at least in my understanding, such a setup would still trip a breaker if amperage is exceeded.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg DSC00585.JPG (442.6 KB, 42 views)
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  #1808  
Old 06-25-2018, 12:40 PM
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With all respect

Digits10,
I speak only for my short comings and lack of knowledge with this setup.

I had limited success with this build. Could never understood "how" the unit was supposed to extract energy from the ground. I had the loop wire, which you don't have pictured, looped through the toroid. It had 70+ amps on it that I couldn't use.

Clarence said that his unit worked and powered an inverter without much input from the grid.

I believe what he said and miss his fun times e-mails. Many here dogged him and me for "misleading" others. I hope you success if you go further. I cannot help you. Sorry but that's all I know.

We all take chances here in this FE life. I moved on to the 3BGS.

Rest in peace Clarence,
wantomake
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  #1809  
Old 06-25-2018, 02:39 PM
roby_035 roby_035 is offline
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Clarence

Wantomake
Entiendo por tus palabras que Clarence ya se marcho antes que nosotros
Lamento mucho su partida
Roberto
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  #1810  
Old 06-25-2018, 02:42 PM
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Language barrier

Quote:
Originally Posted by roby_035 View Post
Wantomake
Entiendo por tus palabras que Clarence ya se marcho antes que nosotros
Lamento mucho su partida
Roberto
Sorry but English please. I speak Japanese but no Spanish.

wantomake
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  #1811  
Old 06-25-2018, 02:53 PM
roby_035 roby_035 is offline
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Clarence

Wantomake
I understand from your words that Clarence left before we did
I'm very sorry for your departure
Robert
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  #1812  
Old 06-27-2018, 12:45 PM
digits10 digits10 is offline
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More than 20 amp thoughts ?

Question -

Clarence reported he was able to run more than 20 amps on his AC unit on a 20 amp breaker. Even if it was a ground loop, the breaker should have tripped, right? It's easy enough to fool a meter, but if he had 25amp at 120v on his utility hot going to his load then to ground, it should have tripped his breaker, right? Any ideas on this?
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  #1813  
Old 06-27-2018, 02:08 PM
RAMSET RAMSET is offline
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a sincere man trying to make a difference.

I only spoke with Clarence a few times several years back

he was quite passionate and sincere and willing to look outside the box to make the world a better place.


we need more like Clarence,he did inspire .

May his life's example and his legacy bear fruit .

respectfully

Chet K
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  #1814  
Old 06-27-2018, 03:08 PM
fer123 fer123 is online now
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Question Ispire me

Rest in peace our friend, you have inspire many to keep going.
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Last edited by fer123; 06-27-2018 at 03:11 PM.
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  #1815  
Old 06-27-2018, 03:43 PM
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Clarence is a good man , may God bless his soul .

peace be upon you .

regards
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  #1816  
Old 06-27-2018, 06:03 PM
roby_035 roby_035 is offline
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Clarence

CLARENCE Rest in peace, we will follow your steps, here on earth and we will get the best out of it
ROBY
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  #1817  
Old 07-01-2018, 09:48 PM
digits10 digits10 is offline
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Patent review

I finally took some time to just read & think through the patents. I'm reading the translated ones. In patent ... 4042, a couple things stand out to me. First, the details of the earth ground aren't mentioned. (Identified as 5 in the drawings.) Second, in Fig. 5, there are two drawings. I can see by reviewing the 2nd one how it could appear to be a utility ground loop & the more ground rods (5) the better connection between loop (4) hot and the 3.2 negative side/neutral side. The same logic applies to Fig. 6 2nd diagram.

For the 1st drawing in each (figure 5, 6), I don't really understand why they have the 3.1 (hot) connected to the loop (4), because in those, it looks like a regular circuit since source + and source - go straight to the load. I'll test these setups and post my results. If anyone has insights, feel free. I'm sort of starting from scratch, but with a 30 ground rod field in what appears to be a high magnetic zone (depends on which satellite image I use), I figure I'll give it a shot.

From the testing I did yesterday, it's very obvious that it is super easy to fool the kill-a-watt power meters by simply not running the path to ground/neutral back through them.
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  #1818  
Old 07-02-2018, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digits10 View Post
I finally took some time to just read & think through the patents. I'm reading the translated ones. In patent ... 4042, a couple things stand out to me. First, the details of the earth ground aren't mentioned. (Identified as 5 in the drawings.) Second, in Fig. 5, there are two drawings. I can see by reviewing the 2nd one how it could appear to be a utility ground loop & the more ground rods (5) the better connection between loop (4) hot and the 3.2 negative side/neutral side. The same logic applies to Fig. 6 2nd diagram.

For the 1st drawing in each (figure 5, 6), I don't really understand why they have the 3.1 (hot) connected to the loop (4), because in those, it looks like a regular circuit since source + and source - go straight to the load. I'll test these setups and post my results. If anyone has insights, feel free. I'm sort of starting from scratch, but with a 30 ground rod field in what appears to be a high magnetic zone (depends on which satellite image I use), I figure I'll give it a shot.

From the testing I did yesterday, it's very obvious that it is super easy to fool the kill-a-watt power meters by simply not running the path to ground/neutral back through them.
Where I can find the translated patents into English ?
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  #1819  
Old 07-02-2018, 01:34 PM
digits10 digits10 is offline
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patents

I got them from here:
Nilson BARBOSA, et al. -- Earth Energy Generator -- 4 patents

Additional test results:

From the patent, Fig. 5 #2 schematic:

gnd/captor loop voltage: 1.5v AC
ground wire: 1.6amp
captor loop: 60+ amps, my meter quits at 100, and it hit that - I only tested for a few seconds so as not to burn up the captor loop wire - it gets hot
Mains hot/neutral: 18 amps on the hot side (powering the transformers)

I have an electric drill hooked up as the load - it didn't do anything with this arrangement.

-----------------------------

From the patent, Fig. 5 #1 schematic:
Gnd-earth line: ~2amps
Load/output - the electric drill ran full speed
Utility hot/neutral: ~17amps (at 115v AC)
Captor/loop: 100+ amps & got hot - again only tested a few seconds
I had my volt meter connected to the hot & neutral of the load/output, and it registered around 3 volts, although the drill was running fast, so it must have been ~115volts or so AC.


I didn't try the single transformer setup in Fig. 6 yet - however, neither one of these used a "small" amount of current to power the loop.
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  #1820  
Old 07-03-2018, 10:30 AM
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Thank You. It's a good start. I feel it's strange after so many years nobody translated all those Brazilian patents.
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  #1821  
Old 09-05-2018, 06:53 AM
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Exclamation A historical account of Clarence’s replication of the B&L devices.pdf

Hi everyone - Let me start with this:

POST #1548 A pot of gold --hopefully:
Quote:
THE WHOLE SOB DOES WHAT IT WAS SAID IT COULD DO!
I have Had it pulling energy from the ground up tp 9.8AMPS.
all of this while the KAW meter only shows 0.07 amps supplied from the mains and at 5.4 watts.
At first I thought it was a faulty KAW so I dug out the others and tried Four more of them - they all read the same.
I have run a floor fan, my microwave, my smart charger charging my battery banks, all at the same time - still NO CHANGE ON THE INPUT FROM THE MAINs- 0.07 amps at 5.4 watts.
I was just standing there dumbfounded.
All this time the # 12 wraps on the toroid only showed .5 amps with never changing!.
The following is a quote from a short 10 page PDF document I put together called 'A historical account of Clarence’s replication of the B&L devices.pdf'

Quote:
Mains Performance:
#1549 08-07-2017, 11:34 PM - ‘18.8 amps out for .07 amps in is quite an increase!’
#1551 08-08-2017, 12:55 AM - ‘loaded my setup with loads equaling 26 + amps on a wall plug outlet only rated for 20 amps MAX - no breaker trip’
#1746 10-21-2017, 10:05 PM - ‘I have put up to 37 AMP LOAD on a 20 amp wall socket for the unit I am still using DAILY. The watt reading shown on the KAW meter was ALWAYS very low. Be it Known AS LUC said that even the MINIMAL system Resistance WILL drop the system voltage as more loads are added.’
Shouldn't we all be retracing Clarence's steps from HERE?
I believe the PDF is a must for anyone looking into the Clarence replication.
Not only will it serve as a map of this whole thread, it will also allow you to see what each step made by Clarence was for and the progress made.

Judging character is not a measure of anyone's claims. This man, regardless of his ways and attitudes has labored for years towards this single goal. Even in his old age was undoubtedly a very capable man in all he did.

Clarence may have been fooled by B&L for 2 years but he was meticulous and adamant to get there. He may have done just what he set out to do in the end!
So the way I see it, the claim still stands as stated above and it is very clear to me.

Download the pdf below and let me know what you think:
Oh! and have a GREAT day!
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  #1822  
Old 09-05-2018, 08:20 PM
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Highest respect

I understand what you are saying and respect that.

You do know that Clarence passed away not long ago. I got an email from his family.

He was my coffee sipping long distance friend. I do miss his input here.

Highest respect Clarence ol friend,
wantomake
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  #1823  
Old 09-06-2018, 04:11 AM
conandrum conandrum is offline
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I realised

Hi Wantomake,

I realized it.
I spent the better part of this summer (24/7) reading DS and B&L threads here and at OU, so I became very familiar with his posts, his work and personality, but I never had any other contact with him obviously.

I would love for everyone that had any sort of success with his replication to come forward and post as much as they can with photos or any thing that might help newcomers!
I feel that new blood should pick up where he left off.
I feel that the smoke has to be cleared completely.
As Clarence said... time should NOT be wasted
...so please help others pick up and not waste their time in the maze.

I hope that my previous post will serve as a Clarence Episode II.

My condolences to all who knew him and to his family.
He certainly was a special kind of person.
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  #1824  
Old 09-06-2018, 04:55 PM
conandrum conandrum is offline
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Exclamation

Dear All,

My modest contribution to this thread continues with the following schematics of the latest 2 builds and their minor modifications by Clarence.

Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 1of4 #1570
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 2of4 #1581 (slight improvement)
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 3of4 #1728 (Beefier Cables)
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 4of4 #1788 (single toroid - Last public photo)


This should help any newcomers get straight down to business.


PS. If any veteran here wants to point out corrections or omissions please do so.
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Last edited by conandrum; 09-06-2018 at 07:11 PM. Reason: Attachment corrections
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  #1825  
Old 09-07-2018, 07:25 AM
conandrum conandrum is offline
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Dear All,

The mystery with Clarence's build boils down to the following 2 schematics.

(single toroid with Beefier Cables - Last public photo)
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 4of4 #1788 - sch1
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 4of4 #1788 - sch2


This should help any newcomers get straight down to business.


PS. If any veteran here wants to point out corrections or omissions please do so.
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  #1826  
Old 09-08-2018, 09:13 AM
conandrum conandrum is offline
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Dear All,

The mystery with Clarence's build boils down ALSO to the following 2 schematics.

Clarence B&L Schematic #1491 - Ariovaldo - Fool the meter layout
vs
Clarence B&L Latest Schematics 4of4 #1788 - sch2


Why did Clarence call the first one as clearly being a 'Fool the meter layout', but with the second one he was adamant that it was NOT?
What's up with that? Was he trying to get US to waste our time? Was he pure and simple a malicious deceiver?


PS. If any veteran here wants to point out corrections or omissions please do so.
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  #1827  
Old 09-08-2018, 11:33 AM
conandrum conandrum is offline
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Exclamation

Let's compare 2 quotes:

#1 VRAND #1708 10-11-2017, 10:05 AM
Quote:
Current setup for 120 Vac. using 5 watts input from utility, (0.04 amps) and getting 2000 watts output, (24.5 amps) from the device, then the input plug circuit breaker trips open. To go over +20 amps output will need a higher rated circuit breaker.
What this tells me simply is that the a ground loop was formed, the earth acted as a neutral wire back to the utility neutral/ground and the circuit was completed. The KWM was fooled, but the 20A breaker was not fooled.

#2 CLARENCE #1746 10-21-2017, 10:05 PM
Quote:
I have put up to 37 AMP LOAD on a 20 amp wall
socket for the unit I am still using DAILY. The watt reading shown on the KAW meter
was ALWAYS very low.
VRAND says the breaker trips. Clarence says, breaker will not trip!
Clarence though never said anything more to clarify what load this was and how it was calculated/measured.

To Clarence's defense, this was not his first rodeo on maximizing the loads:
Quote:
#1549 08-07-2017, 11:34 PM - ‘18.8 amps out for .07 amps in is quite an increase!’
#1551 08-08-2017, 12:55 AM - ‘loaded my setup with loads equaling 26 + amps on a
wall plug outlet only rated for 20 amps MAX - no breaker trip’
#1559 08-08-2017, 06:41 AM 'this thing will blow your mind away! I had even considered going to my sons shop and dragging his small AC welder over to my house and adding it to the loads I was running. I wanted to get to 30 amps or more to push the limit but I only reached 26 + amps from the Ground.'
What is going on here?

The only thing that Clarence had, that noone else had were the 60 grounding rods.
Quote:
#1584 08-09-2017, 06:37 PM
My ground grid is only 4 grounding rods which I'm hoping is the problem. In the past(as a test) I've used 14" galvanised nails to add to the grid (with alligator leads) to see if energy increases with more rods. Well it does add more energy as I added more nails.
So my ole friend help me out here. Should I add more grounding rods to my grid? That's the only difference in our setups. I remember you had 60 or so rods. Are you using that many now?
Quote:
#1585 08-09-2017, 08:20 PM
Yes, that probably is the problem ole friend. After all this is an energy from the ground devise.
Also, I am using the 60 ground rods.
Here is an important note for all members , ... Barbosa and Cleriston Leal ... about the ground rods ... answered by sayingthe the minimum shoudbe somewhere around 26 rods
What is certain is that Clarence was using 60 rods although they may not all be necessary in other regions, because his ground was kind of a swamp area.
Is this it? Is this why he was seeing more amps (37A) than the 20A coming through his breaker? Is this why his breaker wasn't tripping?

That is almost 2x the power, even though it did involve a fool the meter routine and I think he knew this but could not avoid it as can be deduced from the following:
Quote:
#1570 08-08-2017, 06:43 PM
First, it is an (Almost) exact duplicate of Ariovaldo's schematic. I even followed the color code on the wires as close as possible.
Second, most people would just say that's only a damn ground loop to avoid the meter. In a way it is and in a way it ISN"T.
...Any way, each member can look at it the way they want and make their own decision.


Clarence in #1491 07-25-2017, 11:33 AM called the Ariovaldo schematic 'Basically a Fool the Meter layout'. Here in #1570, he is calling his new setup with dual toroids an exact DUPLICATE ALMOST!
He basically admits that it does involve a 'fool the meter routine', but he sees a PLUS in the whole affair.

Then he comes out with something like this:
Quote:
#1610 08-10-2017, 11:07 PM
Yeah, the only thing the Utility grid powers is the Two toroids, and that only amounts to .07 Amps. Every thing else does come from the ground.
#1728 10-20-2017, 04:25 AM
The load Amperage comes via ground - It is NOT provided by the
HOT connection through the 20 amp rated wall socket - that is why
HIGH AMP loads can be achieved WITHOUT going through the Mains
METER.
The above statements may not be 100% correct, and it may have been the way HE looked at it.
On the other hand, could it be that power was flowing IN REVERSE, from the ground into the circuit?

There may be a lot of truth in his statements, but one would need to start with the 26 ground rods FIRST, before one can find out.

I hope this will be a true help to someone. I certainly do not have the ground space for something like this, but many of you may do.
So good luck and please let me know your findings.
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