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  #751  
Old 02-10-2018, 02:24 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Originally Posted by med.3012 View Post
[FONT="Courier New"][SIZE="3"]
Hello Dwane ;


i don't have a lot of experience in electronic but you can clarify your idea about static DC supply so maybe something will appear !
Hmmm..... I think you are having a lend of me! You underestimate your talents. However, I shall attempt to draw up what I am thinking of. Very Basic.

Perhaps a starting point for some contributor to amend or criticise or improve. The idea is to essentially remove the high voltage component, as you suggest, while retaining the output frequency, but with a higher current component. Thus creating a similar output to Don Smith without the HV controls.

Regards

Dwane
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  #752  
Old 02-10-2018, 01:02 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Correction

Typing error!

MOV in previous post should be MOT - microwave oven transformer.


Thanks for reading

Dwane
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  #753  
Old 02-10-2018, 09:29 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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simple circuit

Hi med.3012,
As requested, here is what I was thinking about. Just a simple driver without the complexity required for multiple operations of varying requirements. just for one job!

The Heaviside issue has gotten to me! It is reminiscent of another process I am interested in. Anyway I digress, as usual.



Regards

Dwane
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File Type: jpg Static HV driver.jpg (131.8 KB, 21 views)
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Last edited by Dwane; 02-10-2018 at 09:34 PM.
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  #754  
Old 02-10-2018, 09:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Hi med.3012,
As requested, here is what I was thinking about. Just a simple driver without the complexity required for multiple operations of varying requirements. just for one job!

The Heaviside issue has gotten to me! It is reminiscent of another process I am interested in. Anyway I digress, as usual.



Regards

Dwane



Hello Dwane !


thanks for the drawing; This will produce a fast DC pulse ! interesting at the moment i am trying to use the ETBC as a secondary coil ( keep your experiments using the S-ETBC ... ) something similar to the D-ETBC so it's useful to excite a partnered coils very fast , a new designed ETBC should take the power without disturbing the input..i don't know if it will work or not but the most important is put it under test ..


regards
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  #755  
Old 02-11-2018, 07:48 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Serial ETBC

Hi med.3012,

I am attaching a wiring layout for L1 as spoken on the youtube video. I have just finished winding the coils and realise that I made the mistake of thinking of the Don Smith layout you use where the L1 is positively pulsed. In this instance, looking at the attached wiring layout, to my mind this approach will not work efficiently. Looks like we need two independent pulses to drive each set of coils alternately. My original circuit will work OK for a single pulse input.

Back to the drawing board!

Regards

Dane
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File Type: jpg Serial ETBC wiring.jpg (153.7 KB, 22 views)
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  #756  
Old 02-11-2018, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Hi med.3012,

I am attaching a wiring layout for L1 as spoken on the youtube video. I have just finished winding the coils and realise that I made the mistake of thinking of the Don Smith layout you use where the L1 is positively pulsed. In this instance, looking at the attached wiring layout, to my mind this approach will not work efficiently. Looks like we need two independent pulses to drive each set of coils alternately. My original circuit will work OK for a single pulse input.

Back to the drawing board!

Regards

Dane


Hello Dwane,


as i see L0 is CW but each ETBC is CCW , you need to change the current direction for the ETBC to be like L0 , L0 is there to produce further more magnetic field strength for the benefit of ETBCs . even if you wound the ETBC in wrong direction it's easy to correct the things just changing the contact direction , as example an AB ETBC produce the same magnetic field direction as BA ETBC just look where you start the current ! from A TO B you have a direction but from B TO A you have the opposite direction ! the ETBC is a flexible coil ! i didn't tried the concept of L0 but you can start with the 4 ETBC only after that you can add the field of L0 and see what's going on , any question please ask !



regards
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  #757  
Old 02-11-2018, 08:21 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Originally Posted by med.3012 View Post
Hello Dwane,


as i see L0 is CW but each ETBC is CCW , you need to change the current direction for the ETBC to be like L0 , L0 is there to produce further more magnetic field strength for the benefit of ETBCs . even if you wound the ETBC in wrong direction it's easy to correct the things just changing the contact direction , as example an AB ETBC produce the same magnetic field direction as BA ETBC just look where you start the current ! from A TO B you have a direction but from B TO A you have the opposite direction ! the ETBC is a flexible coil ! i didn't tried the concept of L0 but you can start with the 4 ETBC only after that you can add the field of L0 and see what's going on , any question please ask !



regards
Hi med.3012,

Thank you for the reply. Without critisism, I have found it extremely difficult to follow the dialogue in the serial ETBC video, and for certain reasons: the accent and variability of the microphone use. Also, the manner of showing the coil directions and connections have, for me, been a further complication.

Let me see if I now understand how the connection have to made. L0 are two independly wound coils to provide flux to the ETBC. The ETBC is essentially one continuous coil around the toroid. The ETBC input and output are where?

Thanks

Dwane
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  #758  
Old 02-11-2018, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Hi med.3012,

Thank you for the reply. Without critisism, I have found it extremely difficult to follow the dialogue in the serial ETBC video, and for certain reasons: the accent and variability of the microphone use. Also, the manner of showing the coil directions and connections have, for me, been a further complication.

Let me see if I now understand how the connection have to made. L0 are two independly wound coils to provide flux to the ETBC. The ETBC is essentially one continuous coil around the toroid. The ETBC input and output are where?

Thanks

Dwane


Hello Dwane,


no problem at all , as my native language isn't English it's not easy for me to make such presentation but i try my best , if you try just one ETBC you can see the concept.. adding a ferrite core will enhance the oscillation of ETBC , the ETBC is just an oscillator circuit that can combine voltage and current, the IN is where the current enter the ETBC the OUT is where the current leave the ETBC this is important since we need the same magnetic field direction.. it's essentially one continuous coil around the toroid ..

the magnetic field in the ETBC is another subject that need a separate study .. to solve this issue follow one direction :








you start the ETBC 1 after that you move the core in one direction to make an exact copy another ETBC 2 , keep the same direction to put the third ETBC 3 and so on !

i don't know why this is so complicated !


i hope you understand the concept , good luck


regards
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  #759  
Old 02-12-2018, 12:03 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Connections

Hi med.3012,

Thank you for the prompt answer to my confusion. However, I would like to direct you to the part of the youtube serial ETBC video at 36minutes. It clearly shows a connection from a L0 coil to an opposite ETBC coil. You can see my confusion here. Later, you join the ETBC coils together to form a continuous loop. However, this loop does not terminate anywhere. It is possible that you have stated the correct wind pattern, but, I have missed it. The wiring diagram I posted was a solution to my misunderstanding of your presentation. Whether it worked efficiently or not would remain to be seen as the ETBC's would get the direct input. So L2 is a single wind with an appropriate inductance?

Regards

Dwane
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  #760  
Old 02-12-2018, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Hi med.3012,

Thank you for the prompt answer to my confusion. However, I would like to direct you to the part of the youtube serial ETBC video at 36minutes. It clearly shows a connection from a L0 coil to an opposite ETBC coil. You can see my confusion here. Later, you join the ETBC coils together to form a continuous loop. However, this loop does not terminate anywhere. It is possible that you have stated the correct wind pattern, but, I have missed it. The wiring diagram I posted was a solution to my misunderstanding of your presentation. Whether it worked efficiently or not would remain to be seen as the ETBC's would get the direct input. So L2 is a single wind with an appropriate inductance?

Regards

Dwane

Hello Dwane,


i watched the video at 36 minute, yes i made it fast in that point since it was just an idea : this is the correction , just a continuous loop





L2 is also a two separate coils , cw + ccw ! but a single separate coil should work .. , in my case it was very difficult to work in such small space , good test should be in a good magnetic core with adequate dimension.


regards
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File Type: jpg Serial ETBC wiring.jpg (17.7 KB, 43 views)
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  #761  
Old 02-12-2018, 11:23 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Hi med.3012,
That's what I was thinking but was unsure. So we are still looking at a dual input pulse? or a single pulse?

Interestingly, you are getting a small number of views. Maybe like myself, working it out, but, cautious to commit to the discussion!

Getting there, waiting option on power supply for the build of higher energy output.

Many thanks for letting us into your experiment!

Regards

Dwane
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  #762  
Old 02-13-2018, 09:39 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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1st test

Well here is a picture of the basic unit - L1. I have been using a small NST to see what happens. I have mixed results, which I think are mostly related to the cheap NST output 30Khz. I drive this via a variac.

AC input gives the best results. If I half wave pulse the two inputs I get an expected distorted output - i.e. mixed frequencies. L0 shows only a major output on one half of the loop. I attribute this to the issues of the NST. I have had this before when looking at the Don Smith set up; the NST will not give a uniform AC output when loaded in the manner I am using it. The coupling through the ETBC coils is pathetic. There is almost no signal registering on the scope. And that is at the lowest sensitivity. I therefore read that as the ETBC acting as a straight wire! If the ETBC is to give excess power, how many would be required?

I have not attempted to tune this unit, simply because I do not understand what will be the best method of driving the coils. One would expect that there would be some cumulative effect of cross coupling given the manner of the sequence of connecting the coils. Perhaps, the ETBC number would assist here. Especially when, in my opinion, the object of this design is to increase the incidence of magnetic flux.

I show a photo of my basic unit! Similar to that of the unit of Mohammed on the youtube serial ETBC video, My build is "Tight". Very large toroids might be better. As it is, for this to work efficiently a minimum of three things need to occur. 1) tuning the input with L1, and 2) a different "Forme" for the purpose of winding the coils. 3) A dedicated power supply!

Regards

Dwane
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File Type: jpg My ETBC_1.jpg (377.0 KB, 10 views)
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  #763  
Old 02-14-2018, 09:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Well here is a picture of the basic unit - L1. I have been using a small NST to see what happens. I have mixed results, which I think are mostly related to the cheap NST output 30Khz. I drive this via a variac.

AC input gives the best results. If I half wave pulse the two inputs I get an expected distorted output - i.e. mixed frequencies. L0 shows only a major output on one half of the loop. I attribute this to the issues of the NST. I have had this before when looking at the Don Smith set up; the NST will not give a uniform AC output when loaded in the manner I am using it. The coupling through the ETBC coils is pathetic. There is almost no signal registering on the scope. And that is at the lowest sensitivity. I therefore read that as the ETBC acting as a straight wire! If the ETBC is to give excess power, how many would be required?

I have not attempted to tune this unit, simply because I do not understand what will be the best method of driving the coils. One would expect that there would be some cumulative effect of cross coupling given the manner of the sequence of connecting the coils. Perhaps, the ETBC number would assist here. Especially when, in my opinion, the object of this design is to increase the incidence of magnetic flux.

I show a photo of my basic unit! Similar to that of the unit of Mohammed on the youtube serial ETBC video, My build is "Tight". Very large toroids might be better. As it is, for this to work efficiently a minimum of three things need to occur. 1) tuning the input with L1, and 2) a different "Forme" for the purpose of winding the coils. 3) A dedicated power supply!

Regards

Dwane

Hello Dwane!


there's some mistakes in your design that i can't explain at the moment .. i told you to wind L2 after that you put the ETBC , the ETBC outside L2 but i am wrong ! the reversed position is the best , later i will explain this when possible because work in progress , the latest Model explain this but i need more corrections ...

regards
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  #764  
Old 02-15-2018, 02:33 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Strange screenshots

Quote:
Originally Posted by med.3012 View Post
Hello Dwane!


there's some mistakes in your design that i can't explain at the moment .. i told you to wind L2 after that you put the ETBC , the ETBC outside L2 but i am wrong ! the reversed position is the best , later i will explain this when possible because work in progress , the latest Model explain this but i need more corrections ...

regards
Hi med.3012,

Looking at frequencies in the L1 coils with no L2, got some strange screen shots which have since disappeared!! I have switched the Func Gen off thinking the ETBC is saturated.

I start the FG at around 30Khz and plenty os screen fuzziness. It is only by adjusting the frequency sensitivity that I see an unusual pattern emerging. From the attached screen shots it can be seen that the two wave forms are slowly merging. I must admit my scope is very old, very very old.

Now all I get is a clean sinewave on the screen. What I am thinking is the merging of the two coils L0+ETBC coils. When they are sufficiently matched they hold the energy and I get the perfect sine wave output. Feasible?

I would be interested in your observations!

Regards

Dwane
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 32khz.jpg (114.8 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg 42khz.jpg (134.9 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg 60khz.jpg (132.3 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg 100khz.jpg (142.2 KB, 4 views)
File Type: jpg 160khz.jpg (165.0 KB, 4 views)
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  #765  
Old 02-15-2018, 09:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwane View Post
Hi med.3012,

Looking at frequencies in the L1 coils with no L2, got some strange screen shots which have since disappeared!! I have switched the Func Gen off thinking the ETBC is saturated.

I start the FG at around 30Khz and plenty os screen fuzziness. It is only by adjusting the frequency sensitivity that I see an unusual pattern emerging. From the attached screen shots it can be seen that the two wave forms are slowly merging. I must admit my scope is very old, very very old.

Now all I get is a clean sinewave on the screen. What I am thinking is the merging of the two coils L0+ETBC coils. When they are sufficiently matched they hold the energy and I get the perfect sine wave output. Feasible?

I would be interested in your observations!

Regards

Dwane




Hello Dwane,


the ETBC take the magnetic field after that build a static charge to start the oscillation on its own resonance frequency , if you want another way you can make the current go in different direction across L0 , each 1/2 L0 will be connected to the other end like having a parallel inductance .. the 4 ETBC should work in serial , i can't go further in this explanation because i never tried this coil L0

good work



regards
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