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 Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

#1681
08-01-2017, 10:47 PM
 moflint Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Belfast, UK Posts: 31
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion Think about the following TRUE statement and you will have your answer as to why you CANNOT use caps in the 3 battery system and get the same results. "When capacitors are connected in series, the total capacitance is less than any ONE of the series capacitors' individual capacitances. ... If two or more capacitors are connected in parallel, the overall effect is that of a single equivalent capacitor having the sum total of the plate areas of the individual capacitors." In other words, capacitors in parallel act like batteries in parallel, but capacitors in series do NOT act like batteries in series.
Yeah - my maths does not compute in that case!

EDIT:
.... but are not the total joules the same whether in series or parallel? So why are those joules in the 16.2v bank not transferred through the motor to the 2.7v bank to fill it up?
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Last edited by moflint; 08-01-2017 at 10:55 PM.
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#1682
08-02-2017, 01:35 AM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
If you have a full capacitor on the high side, you CAN run it through the motor to empty capacitors in parallel on the low side, but you CANNOT then move those capacitors from the low side back to the high side and recycle that energy. It won't work because the capacitors you charged in parallel which now have (as an example) 12 volts each, cannot be put in SERIES to give you 24 volts on the high side. It doesn't work like that with capacitors. So with a group of caps you only get to use the potential difference ONCE.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
#1683
08-02-2017, 01:57 AM
 ricards Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 115
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion If you have a full capacitor on the high side, you CAN run it through the motor to empty capacitors in parallel on the low side, but you CANNOT then move those capacitors from the low side back to the high side and recycle that energy. It won't work because the capacitors you charged in parallel which now have (as an example) 12 volts each, cannot be put in SERIES to give you 24 volts on the high side. It doesn't work like that with capacitors. So with a group of caps you only get to use the potential difference ONCE.
pardon my intrusion, but you can actually do that, that's how Marx Generator works, and you can move the energy from the low side to the high side via transformer, but I doubt that would be efficient.
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#1684
08-02-2017, 02:24 AM
 BroMikey Platinum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 4,732
Quote:
 Originally Posted by ricards pardon my intrusion, but you can actually do that, that's how Marx Generator works, and you can move the energy from the low side to the high side via transformer, but I doubt that would be efficient.
I think you are speculating. Please give an example of your proof in another
thread, this thread is for builders of the set layout. Guess work is a never
ending, going no where question mark.

Stick to protocol, build it, then change it to improve on the result.

Results first.

I am on number 14 spool, then the massive windup comes. 3.2 pound
coils and in my case if I build 12 of those, together they would weight
in at 38 pounds of copper.

@ Turion

I am looking and I don't think I can get 6 "C" cores on one side
because my wheel is small while the cores are large. Since I have an
even number of magnets (20) , using present materials I am thinking
of using an odd number of coils on each side. I am not sure but it looks
like 3 will fit easy on one side.

Since the "C" core style coil uses 1 coil with two poles the frequency
may be higher for the same RPM, I haven't got that far yet. Things like
magnetic lock could be lessened by the slightest alteration as you well
know so using a third coil might be placed to help lower lock.

The little things to experiment with excite me. Thinking all of the time
__________________

Last edited by BroMikey; 08-02-2017 at 02:30 AM.
#1685
08-02-2017, 10:20 AM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Info

ricards,
Thanks for reminding me of that. I knew about it but discounted it because I always thought of it as tech for a large pulse, which would kill a motor, but maybe there is a way to utilize it.

It probably isn't appropriate to bring this up here, as this thread was started to talk about a BASIC free energy device that is modeled after John B's original device that simply used a pulsing motor, a flywheel, and a generating section, but for those who understand how I have incorporated the 3 battery system into this to increase the efficiency and INCREASE the COP, just think about the little Matt motor. Does it HAVE to run on just 12 volts? Can it run on MORE?? The answer is "YES it CAN!"

And where could you get more voltage to run your motor? Well here's a thought. Open voltage production of a single coil pair on my machine, even WITH magnetic drag is 64 volts AC. AC voltage connected to a load is about 36 volts at 5.4 amps actual USABLE power, and D.C. Voltage is about 19 volts at the same 5.4 amps usable power. So in this case, and believe me, much MORE research is needed, and I am in the process of doing that, the DC voltage is 25% of the open voltage. By the way, the motor running the machine is running on 36.6 volts at 5 amps BEFORE speed up under load (and drop in amp draw) and WITH the magnetic drag I can significantly reduce with my newer machine.

Well, that gives me enough info to BEGIN modifying my coils for further testing. For the moment, lets assume that it takes the output of all The coils to give me enough to run my motor. So what GOOD does that do me? I run the output of the generator THROUGH the motor as if it were the "high side" on the three batter system and into storage capacitors or batteries. Then I connect an inverter to the capacitor or batteries and run a 1000 watt load. Maybe even split that output and run TWO 1000 watt loads. So the generator runs its own motor and charges a battery bank and I get to use the SAME energy TWICE because the 3 Battery circuit has shown us HOW to do that.

Does that begin to give you guys some idea about what is possible here once you figure out how to get the speed up under load out of your generator? The only REAL question is,can you get MORE out of your generator than you put into your motor. On a small scale, with only a couple coils, the answer is "Maybe" because there is a baseline of power required to turn the rotor on the generator, and unless your coils are putting out at LEAST that much power, it has to come from somewhere, and that means draining your batteries. But IF you can add more coils to the generator without increasing the amp draw of the motor (or reduce it through speed up under load) You begin to see a relationship between the increase in production vs COST in amp draw due to magneticdrag. There is one ( as Trump would say) "Believe me." But it is worth it.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda

Last edited by Turion; 08-02-2017 at 12:06 PM.
#1686
09-14-2017, 12:49 PM
 Satyam108 Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 15
Slide On By

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Matthew Jones So here is my plan to move forward. I attached 2 images to this message. Look at the first one. Slide one . . . . Look at slide2. Again ignore the switch. Matt
Hey Matt,
Still slogging thru old posts - playing catchup. No Slide one or 2 - no attachments or links. Will you please attach them again? Or insert?

Thanks
Jim
__________________

#1687
09-27-2017, 02:49 PM
 joe_born_again Banned Join Date: Aug 2012 Posts: 15
using pulleys to multiply AC cycles of electricity

Free Energy from a GEM perpetual power supply is so simple, https://free-energy.yolasite.com/ that it can be
generate with a large 100 cm circumference pulley attached to a DC motor, + at least one mini-pulley of 1 cm
circumference, connected to an AC generator of the same voltage, 4 diodes - to build a full wave bridge rectifier,
some wire to connect your electrical components together, and a belt to connect the two pulleys together.
-
The way this works, is that you are using the 100 cm of moving belt off of one rotation of your large 100 cm
circumference pulley, which does not cost 100 times more power to rotate than a 1 cm circumference pulley,
yet if you run this 100 cm of moving belt past a 1 cm circumference pulley, you would gain a multiple of 100
cycles of AC electricity,,,,,,,,,,,, all from one spark of DC current..
-
The best part about this is, you can get a return of 100 cycles of AC electricity for as many mini-pulleys that
choose to attach to the same belt. So if you added 10 mini-pulleys, you could gain a multiple of 1000 cycles of
free AC electricity. These mini-pulleys + AC generators would truly run extremely freely, because although
you are winding up massive voltage with them, (exactly what you need to crank over your large 100 cm pulley)
you only need to generate the one spark of DC current, to rotate your DC drive motor. Torque is caused when
generating power, and power is calculated by multiplying voltage times current, so even though you are winding
up massive voltage, it is multiplied by practically zero current, so in the end you are generating practically zero
power, costing practically zero torque.
-
You are seemingly cheating the laws of thermodynamics by using pulley mechanics to multiply the # of
rotations, and then by adding an AC generator to your mini-pulley, you are actually multiplying AC cycles
of electricity. The AC generator is running very free, as it is only winding up massive voltage, as it only
needs to generate one mere spark of DC current, just enough to rotate your DC drive motor + large 100
cm pulley the one single time.
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#1688
09-27-2017, 04:44 PM
 wrtner Silver Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 902
Quote:
.
.
You got shut down by Stefan and l have moved here to post your drivel.
For Heavens sake, take the advice of experts.
.
.

.
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#1689
09-28-2017, 02:39 AM
 Aaron Co-Founder & Moderator Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Washington State Posts: 10,561
he's banned

same pulley spam for years
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Sincerely,
Aaron Murakami

#1690
09-29-2017, 01:53 AM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Final thoughts

Life is a series of choices we all have to make. Some are easy and some are hard. Lately I have not been on the forum much, mostly because I have realized that there are so few builders here and the forum is filled with lurkers waiting to see something of interest that they can run off and sell, making money off the hard work of others, as was done with the modified motor Matt Jones designed and was generous enough to share here.

I will be the FIRST to admit that I have taken everything shared by Matt, Tesla, John B. and others who have contributed a WEALTH of information to the cause in order to put together the devices I have working NOW and those I know how to build and will build in the future. But I will NOT forget those who have shared with me, and if and when I am successful at marketing anything, they will be remembered in other ways.

Because beating dead horses is my favorite pastime, I am going to repeat myself one final time before I fade into the woodwork. This thread has died, and you can bury it. I have shared what I felt was enough information for anyone to build an over-unity machine. That most folks choose to ignore it is their problem, not mine.

Most efficient pulse motor you can find
Run on the proper circuit
Turning a generator that speeds up under load

The Matt motor
Running on a modified 3 Battery circuit
With a generator that has two things
1. Coils that allow it to speed up under load
2. Elimination of "cogging" or the attraction of the magnets on the rotor to the iron core

The Patents of Benitez
Tesla Patent 512,340
The attached file. Understand that in the attached file, the coil that is directly under the magnet must be fired as the motor coil in THIS design to eliminate cogging. That means the motor and generator would be ONE machine. There are other ways to do it when the motor is SEPARATE from the generator.

I may be around from time to time, and you can always PM me, but I don't have the time to spend here anymore.

My machine, which incorporates the information I have gained from all these sources runs on 36 volts at 7 amps and outputs 123 volts open voltage, 60 volts AC under load at 4.5 amps or 33 volts DC under load at 4.5 amps per coil pair. There are 5 coil pairs on the machine. Do the math. Build the machine. Or don't. Life is about choices. Make the right one.
Attached Images
 Coil:rotor alignment.png (634.0 KB, 69 views)
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
#1691
09-29-2017, 02:46 AM
 BroMikey Platinum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 4,732
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion Lately I have not been on the forum much, mostly because I have realized that there are so few builders here and the forum is filled with lurkers waiting to see something of interest that they can run off and sell, making money off the hard work of others...........
Don't worry in 10 years or so when we are long gone someone will
find these messages. They will reply and like I did trying to find a
reply from Dave Lawton on his circuit to split water.

There really are that few people who are like we are. When you are a
bright light, you shine, the absence of which some seem to grovel in.

I am glad you reposted the Benitez thought, then last week was it
you suggested the same when you showed a bank of caps in series
then some in parallel.

That patent is hard to read. I am reading it again. How many Tesla's
were there? How many Matt's? How many Turion's? How many do you
think? I have lived all over the USA. Been to thousands of social
gatherings in many places meeting 10's of thousands.

What I found out was staggering. What I found out is that 99.9999
percent of the people want baseball, football, basketball or things like
racing, musical events, something where they can follow what everyone
else is doing. They are peer pressure driven and that is the way is
should be. That is the way it was meant to be.

Hello .0001 percent, welcome to the lonely lead.

You guys are my hero's, I don't care about the rest. You guys are it.

It is lonely at the top.

I know I been here since childhood. Here is the patent I am reading and
am reminded of Matt's past entries using coils in conjunction with
charge transfers. T Switch.

http://www.tuks.nl/pdf/Patents/Benitez/GB191514311A.pdf

I wondered if the double transformer in this patent might be acting
in a sort of reflection mode? What is it called? Phase conjugate mirror?

................................................
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Last edited by BroMikey; 09-29-2017 at 03:04 AM.
#1692
09-29-2017, 03:57 AM
 gsmsslsb Member Join Date: Sep 2009 Posts: 37
Benitez

Don't want to but in here and I have not built this but I did some work on it a while ago.
In case its any use to anybody I typed out the Benitez Patent attached below.
Its like a tesla switch with capacitors and he states that even though the energy is halved in step two. In step 3 it is doubled. I cant quite get my head around it but it may help you guys.
Attached Files
 Benitez cap switch 5591.doc (82.5 KB, 58 views)
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#1693
09-29-2017, 01:07 PM
 RAMSET Gold Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: NYC and Conn USA Posts: 1,282
Dave
quote
lurkers waiting to see something of interest that they can run off and sell, making money off the hard work of others, as was done with the modified motor Matt Jones designed and was generous enough to share here.

end quote

Somebody stole Matts open source work for their own personal gain??

please post their contact info [or send it to me ]?

if this is really verifiable ,it cannot go unanswered ,and I would gladly go way out of my way to stop by and visit such a person [if they are anywhere in the
NE corridor between NYC and Boston.

this should not be like taking candy from a baby, there needs to be consequences for open source thief's.

Chet
PS
I have been outa the loop a long time ,will touch base later
Thx for all you do, you truly are 1 in a million

PPS
small comment on recently banned Joe,I completely support that choice [since in this case its the only choice]
I just wanted folks to know that Joe suffered a traumatic brain injury many years ago and seems to be unable to understand,

I had spoken to him last year [similar issue at Stefan's]...he has a very ruff situation ,he is a good man with good intentions

if you are so inclined
perhaps
"say a prayer"
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Last edited by RAMSET; 09-29-2017 at 01:23 PM.
#1694
09-29-2017, 04:00 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Info

Chet,

Will PM you info
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
#1695
10-02-2017, 08:32 AM
 Satyam108 Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 15
536% cop?

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion My machine, which incorporates the information I have gained from all these sources runs on 36 volts at 7 amps and outputs 123 volts open voltage, 60 volts AC under load at 4.5 amps or 33 volts DC under load at 4.5 amps per coil pair. There are 5 coil pairs on the machine. Do the math. Build the machine. Or don't. Life is about choices. Make the right one.
Hey Dave,
Did I do the math right? Your machine has a COP of 536%? 1350 out over 252 In? Awesome! XLNT! and Congrats! I haven't given up on building a Split the Positive 3+2 ("resting") battery switch - working on another project while waiting on parts, and trying to glean some gems from this and other threads and from other sources. Takes a LOT of late night reading, and my right eye is still healing up - getting over the cloudy film from lens replacement/cataract surgery.

WRT my original post in BroMikey's Split the Positive thread here:
http://www.energeticforum.com/304278-post515.html,
I'm thinking about a return to basics on Split the Positive - with a view to discovering how the OU energy is pulled in from Tesla's Medium - from the Aether. Maybe "Bedini Cigars" for a thread title? LOL Here's something from Dr. Lindemann that I found at this link:
http://panaceatech.org/Tesla%20Switch.pdf
John has told me that his "cigar box" unit ran a small electric motor for more than 6 months without discharging the batteries AT ALL. He also told me that the original working model was smashed by a "guest" in his shop who was infuriated by its operation, while John was out of the room. At this point, he decided not to rebuild it.

I know John personally, and have no reason to doubt this report. Obviously, the voltage drops in the transistors and diodes present a CONSTANT loss during operation, not to mention the energy dissipated at the load. Therefore, the system defies all standard explanations and energy use equations. The batteries apparently stay charged and run loads simultaneously for a reason that is not conventional. Since Ronald Brandt has run a car on this system, and John Bedini has run small motors on [a] miniaturized version, it seems reasonable to assume it is worthy of more study by experimenters.
I've spent considerable time - even searching with the Way Back Machine - Internet Archive - but haven't found a photo of JB's Cigar Box device (first displayed at the Tesla Birthday convention in Colorado Springs, I think. Mid to late 80's? More importantly, the only schematic/pictorial we're all familiar with (see attachment if you need to,) reveals zero "transistors and diodes."

I disassembled the LiMn battery that reversed on me. I expected it to be several cells in series, but it's not. I will post some photos when I jump back into this fray. I have removed the diode from the circuit for now, and have confirmed that the cordless drill motor I am using has 2 permanent magnets for stator and brushes to power the rotor. I got the LiMn battery (really it's just one 3.7 volt cell - not a battery) to reverse - to go back to positive on the plus terminal, and moving it into the bottom series position, I recorded that it was gradually charging - VERY gradually - mere millivolts per hour - and there wasn't enough current to turn the motor.

I found an interesting phenomena when I turned the motor clockwise with my fingers, I could get the voltage up to several hundred millivolts across it, and it is definitely a pulsing voltage, with a waveform very similar to the generators in old cars and trucks, that Peter showed from JB's first book during his final Bedini SG Advanced presentation in 2015 or 16. When I turned the motor armature CCW with fingers, I could make the voltage across the dead battery go several hundred millivolts negative. So you were correct in your intuition that perhaps I needed to reverse the motor connections. Turning the motor with fingers also reveals cogging, which I believe is the source of the pulses.

Along that line of thought - related to this quest - in Yaro Stanchak's Zero Force Motor presentation at last summer's Energy Science and Technology Conference, which presented for the first time JB's notes on the Zero Vacuum Engine, it is repeatedly emphasized that "there is no iron in the system" - no iron in the cores of the coils that attract the permanent magnets (Neo's no less) in the rotor, yet in this "teaser" video for buying Yaro's presentation, JB himself showed that current decreased, the motor sped up, and the pulse peaks were much higher, when he put what looks like a small piece of galvanized pipe into the center of the drive coil.

As David Byrne (Talking Heads) would say, "Puzzling Evidence."

In my "gleaning" I have only slogged thru about half this thread, but will finish - noting especially your and Matt's posts - the wheat from much chaff. Thanks for sharing your work and knowledge gained the Tesla way - by hands on experiment.

Regards
Jim
Attached Images
 3 battery.jpg (52.6 KB, 14 views)
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#1696
10-02-2017, 09:55 AM
 BroMikey Platinum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 4,732
Hello Satyam

My personal opinion when you name all these big names is that each
man has a completely different finding. Turion and Matt are light years
from anyone else on their machines.

You must build to gain insight so just a few posts once every couple
months with no hands on devices to show for leaves you where you
want to be. Have you built anything yet? Then you can ask a question
about what to try next. Otherwise, if you don't build it shows you are
not very serious and that is just fine. Need to know where you stand.

I see you posted stuff in my thread "SPLIT THE POSITIVE" and all of your
pictures lack a pumping action of some sort. Those 3 batteries won't
do anything to get the extra. That has been shown many times.

You must have a pump or a pulse in there to get those batteries up.

This message is another repeat and is not important that you respond.
The repeats are many, build and pulse the 3 batteries, over and again.

After all this time you don't have a pulse mechanism? Or do you?

Thanks Jim, I didn't say much over in my thread because i didn't want to
sound cruel, but facts are facts and you must start with something so

Quote:
 Originally Posted by Satyam108 Hi Dave (Turion,) Bro Mikey, and others Aaron suggested I post the question here that I sent him via e-mail WRT release of RS - Split the Positive. I have spent a good part of the last day or two reading thru a good deal of the posts on this subject, including going back to Dave's posts on OU, so pardon my intrusion here. I bought Peter's Bedini SG series over the last few years, and like RS, and you two, I was very interested in the Split the Positive concept. This year I bought Yaro's Zero Force Motor replication of JB and PL. Please see attached GIF. Rather than the AA's shown, I was using 3.7 volt, 2500 mAH, LiMn batteries and just manually switching them (I have 2 banks of 8 relays and Arduino to automate the process - also have a isolated comparator circuit from previous projects that can measure the voltage on the battery being charged and then the Arduino can change the configuration based on that, or on time, as Peter Lindemann's demo did.) The motor is just a permanent magnet DC motor from a cordless drill. It seemed to have a "kick" back into the two batteries in series, and it (or something) wrecked the one in the bottom left position - actually reversed it so the positive pole was now negative. I got it to flip back to positive is positive with Bedini 1AU charger - but it would never come back up above 1.5 volts. The diode in the negative to negative connection is similar specs to the high speed switching diode that Peter temporarily connected the same way in his Split the Positive - 3 + 1 (the "resting" battery is important) demo. Do I need a diode between the left terminal of the motor and the battery in top left position - to keep radiant or Lenz spikes from coming back into the batteries in series? Do I need to pulse the motor? w/o opening up the motor it seems that the magnets are on the rotor and the the coil(s) are the stator - I don't see any sparks from a commutator. I connected it to another PM motor as generator and was getting a solid 12 volts out of it. The initial test was very encouraging until the one battery reversed. Think I need to punt the LiMn and get a couple more 12 volt 7 AH SLA? (I have 2.) Thanks for your help, your sharing your experience, and all the huge amount of time you have put into this. Jim Morrow

Quote:
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#1697
10-02-2017, 04:31 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Opinion

As I have stated before, I believe the Zero Force motor is the greatest gift John B. gave us. I have built SEVERAL different models of the ZFM, and am hopeful that a larger version will provide the motive force to turn my generator. The version we are working with now is NOT exactly the version Peter L. built and John B. later demonstrated, but runs on the same principles. It has much more torque while still running on next to NOTHINGin input. The ZFM needs no iron in the core to work.

Batteries charge best when there is a pulse. That's why a pulse motor on the 3 Battery system is better than an off the shelf motor. The higher the frequency of the pulse, and the sharper the gradient, the better result you will get. Period. It is NOT magic. It is fact. I am not the first one to say this and I hope I am not the last. It is ALL in the old patents for those who read and research.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda

Last edited by Turion; 10-02-2017 at 07:49 PM.
#1698
10-02-2017, 04:41 PM
 Hotdog Junior Member Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Georgia USA Posts: 8
Turion,

Sir, would you correct the sentence, "...needs to iron to work.." please? Thanks!
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#1699
10-02-2017, 06:02 PM
 boguslaw Gold Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 2,395
May I ask if somebody here know the experimental method of measuring the magnetic field intensity required to saturate given core (with unknown properties like cut yoke core from old TV) and to choose the amps and voltage of applied DC to do that ? I have such own made core cut from tv yoke and I want to know how much power I can squeeze from it at chosen frequency of DC-DC converter.
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#1700
10-02-2017, 07:37 PM
 bistander Silver Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 912
saturation curve

Quote:
 Originally Posted by boguslaw May I ask if somebody here know the experimental method of measuring the magnetic field intensity required to saturate given core (with unknown properties like cut yoke core from old TV) and to choose the amps and voltage of applied DC to do that ? I have such own made core cut from tv yoke and I want to know how much power I can squeeze from it at chosen frequency of DC-DC converter.
Hi,

What I'd do, and have done, is use a variac or variable voltage fixed frequency AC power supply and apply a steadily increasing current to a coil (around the subject core) and record the voltage as a function of the current. The result, when plotted, will be the saturation curve, or perhaps more correctly, the magnetization curve. If you have enough power supply and turns on the coil, you will see the shape of the B - H curve or close to it, depending on the geometry of the core. Reference: https://www.duramag.com/techtalk/tec...-in-workpiece/

If your core has a large air gap, you may not be able to supply enough mmf (ampere turns) to saturate. So your graph will be linear. Otherwise saturation is just past the knee of the curve where increased current yields little or no increase in voltage.

Let me (us) know if that works for you.

bi
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#1701
10-02-2017, 07:52 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Correction

Spelling error

NO iron for the ZFM to work. The rotor magnet follows the movement of the current through the wire and rotates.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
#1702
10-02-2017, 11:00 PM
 gyula Silver Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 808
Quote:
 Originally Posted by BroMikey I'de like to build a ZFM if i knew what that material was shaped in a toroidal. I just assumed it was some form of Ferrite or metglas. I guess I haven't found the details or forgot where they were. So is that toroidal shaped piece made out of wood? ....
Hi Bro,

Here is a link where Peter Lindemann shared further details on his prototype that was on display last year at the conference:
Zero Force Motor Replication Project - Page 9

So the coil holder was made from a "4" diameter black ABS sewer pipe". You need to log in to be able to see the drawings.

Gyula
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#1703
Yesterday, 05:49 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Review

I started this thread with the idea that we have been given EVERYTHING we need to know to build a Basic Free Energy Device. That position has not changed. In fact, I am more certain of it now than I was when I began this thread just over THREE YEARS ago.

At that time I had a small working prototype that was producing "free energy" and PROVED the concept. It was a replication of something Matt Jones built and shared with me. I had scaled it up, but was still having problems with the larger version because it had many more coils and magnets on the rotor, which increased magnetic attraction and the amp draw of the motor. I had ideas for solving all those problems and I could see the potential, so I wanted to bring it here to share with others. The output was THERE. The mechanics were THERE. It was just a matter of controlling (reducing) the input. Something all of you will struggle with if you attempt to replicate this device.

I was immediately jumped on by naysayers and all kinds of efforts were made to steer this thread down alternate paths. Only I keep returning to that basic concept.
1. Circuit
2. Motor
3. Generator
4. Flywheel (Not currently using one, but don't need it for prototypes)
That's it. Simple. Only not so simple, as I will lay out here.

I want to review a few things, and then I will be on my merry way. You should know that I am MORE than satisfied with the results of my work, and I would not be where I am without the ideas of folks like Matt Jones, John B. and Citfta (Carroll) and others. I have incorporated so much of what they have showed me into my designs that it isn't funny. Most of what is actually MY idea has to do with the physical construction of the device. I have applied the info I got from others to build a working unit. I have applied things I learned from DIFFERENT THREADS on this forum to make this machine, but I can tell you right now that every single thing on my machine came from information I obtained on this forum, only I may have used it in a different way than it was presented.

So lets start with the Circuit. Why is that important. Until you have worked with the 3 Battery system to see what can be accomplished with big deep cycle batteries running loads between the positives, you really do NOT understand what an incredible thing that simple circuit is. I spent 7 years of my life, and CONTINUE to work with that circuit. Benitez CLEARLY explains in his patent (17.811) what the secret is to getting that circuit to work up to its potential. And he has other patents that show HOW to accomplish what he says is necessary. Read the patents and it is all THERE. Then build it, test it, and USE it to run the motor for your system between the positives and recover the energy that you used to run the motor. How much of that energy can you recover? That's up to you. It depends on the system you build, how well you understand what Benitez says to do, and how well you implement that design. I'll give you a hint though. When he says you can run your load for "free" he means it, provided it is the CORRECT kind of load.

On to the motor. Matt's razor scooter motor was a HELL of an idea. You all know that when you turn a motor it also generates voltage. Matt's motor is no exception. But when connected between the positives according to the correct CIRCUIT, it outputs more voltage than went into the motor, and acts as a charger to the third battery. I LOVE that motor. It does however consume some amps. The BEAUTY of the circuit is that it doesn't MATTER how many amps it consumes, because you get them all back. So you can be satisfied with that motor, or you can build the Zero Force Motor of John Bedini. The ZFM motors I have seen John, Peter and others build do NOT have the torque necessary to start and run a generator, but may be able to do so with a clutch arrangement of some kind because of the HIGH RPM that motor can reach. Bob French and I have been working with our OWN modification of the ZFM that has far more torque while still running on the same watts as the original. I think it is the PERFECT motor to run the Lenz free generator, but like I said, if you recover everything Matt's motor uses to run by using the right circuit, do you really NEED the ZFM.

Finally we have the generator. A rotor with magnets on it turning past coils of wire wound around a core. First of all, ANY coil will cause the motor turning the rotor to speed up when the coil is under load at the right frequency, so you have two choices. Increase the frequency by adding more magnets to the rotor or running it at a higher speed, OR build coils that will speed up at a lower frequency. The choice is yours. Tesla's patent (512,340) on the coil tells you WHY you need to wind coils in a specific way and HOW to do it. There are only TWO issues you have to overcome in the construction of a "free wheeling" generator that will put out SIGNIFICANT power while costing you NOTHING to run it. The first is LENZ, and the Tesla patent shows how to get around that. The second is the attraction of the magnets to the iron cores of your coils. There are ways of reducing this, by going with ferrite or met glass cores. There are also ways of neutralizing this. I spent the last three years figuring out how to do exactly that, and it is the reason I have a working machine putting out around 1800-2000 watts (It speeds up under load, so the output goes up because the frequency changes) for an input of about 250 watts, and can recover (with that circuit, remember?) almost ALL of the input. And it is the ONE thing I will not share here. WE have shared EVERYTHING else, and no one believed us anyway. Nobody is following the threads I started. Nobody is building things the way Matt and I told you to build them or running them the way Matt and I told you to run them. But it's all here. Million dollar ideas we could have kept quiet about and exploited for our own gain that we chose to share publicly.

So there you are. A Basic Free Energy Device. You CAN build a proof of concept machine that will demonstrate to you that you get more out than you put in. It is NOT rocket science. If you figure out the magnetic attraction issue, you will see everything I am seeing. Good luck all

I only bother to come back here and summarize all this because it breaks my heart to see this thread fall off the front page of this forum. I don't just BELIEVE these things work, I KNOW they work. I have had independent tests run on my generator, and they verified EVERYTHING I say about it EXCEPT for two things. They couldn't understand that when connected to a 12 volt load, the coils put out 12 volts and when connected to a 30 volt load the coils put out 30 volts according to THEIR test equipment. They had never seen a machine where the voltage would rise to meet the load while the current stayed the same.
Each coil pair appeared to produce 33 volts at 4.5 amps with a 300 watt load in place and the 300 watt bulb attached to each coil pair lit up.
The motor speeds up when the generator is under load.
The amp draw of the motor goes down when the generator is under load.
The motor is running on 250 watts under load
The secondary batteries do not appear to charge, but neither do the primary batteries appear to discharge during the period of the testing. They could not verify that this was a long term effect, a lasting effect or some anomaly with the unusual wiring configuration that was showing a charge to the batteries that was not real, and had not run battery analyzers on the batteries before the test runs nor did they analyze them after test runs.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda

Last edited by Turion; Yesterday at 06:17 PM.
#1704
Yesterday, 06:16 PM
 gotoluc Gold Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,132
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion I have a working machine putting out around 1800-2000 watts (It speeds up under load, so the output goes up because the frequency changes) for an input of about 250 watts

Regards

Luc
__________________

#1705
Yesterday, 08:57 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Response

Luc,
I have already shared the videos I am willing to share over the years. Those videos are already posted, although I may have taken some of them down. As it became clear to me that this was actually going to work, I became much more selective in what I posted on the forum. What is it you want to see? Watts in vs Watts out? I have already stated that. Either I am telling the truth or I am not. Simple. It would be easy to fake that anyway. I will not show videos of my current machine running under load, or running at all. I have plans for that machine that do not involve giving away the ONE thing I have learned that makes it work. Sorry that's where I draw the line. Especially since so many folks have worked so hard to discredit the important things I have ALREADY shared that are ESSENTIAL components to a working system. Whether you know it or not, YOU are one of those people.

Time and time again I have posted information about how to successfully run loads between the positives on the 3 or 4 battery system, and the most important point I have made is that it will NOT work with toy batteries because they just flat have too much impedance. It will only work if done properly with large, deep cycle batteries and a PULSE motor. There are a couple other specific things you have to make sure happen, and DOING THOSE THINGS is the ONLY way to assure that the third battery (or batteries in parallel) is charged at a rate GREATER than what the primaries are discharged.

You say you are familiar with the work I have done, yet you posted a series of videos on you tube.

basically discrediting what I worked on for SEVEN YEARS using EXACTLY the kind of batteries I stated a thousand times would not work. You said at the time it was in response to the videos Rick came out with where HE uses little batteries, but you didn't JUST discredit him with your videos. You also discredited ANYONE who is trying to show what can be done with that system, because the people who saw those videos may have NEVER seen the work done on these threads.

I am familiar with your work also. I have watched MOST of your videos, and you have posted a LOT of them. You have done some great stuff, but you have missed the boat on this one. So why would I give up something to the public domain that could make me (and people I am close to) a LOT of money to show something that will be built incorrectly and then that incorrect build will be used to discredit all the work I have put in for so many years? Not going to happen. People can wait until they can buy it at Walmart. And that may be sooner than you think. I understand why John B. became so frustrated with folks that he just didn't want to deal with them. I have given away all the specifics of the coils I am using and the rotor dimensions and everything someone needs to build a working machine with a couple of coils and see that the output is greater than the input, but that's the limit they will reach. Just a few coils. Until they figure out how to eliminate the magnetic attraction of the rotor magnets to the iron cores that will cause the amp draw of the motor to go through the roof on a machine with very many coils. That's the secret to success.
Everything else has all been shared on these threads before. I have listed the patents and talked about how things work and why. You can have a (dang near) FREE WHEELING rotor that will go by coils and generate as much power as the coil is capable of generating for the size of magnet and number of magnets you put on the rotor. Whatever the coil is you have built that puts out the most power, that's the coil you can have on your generator, and you can have as many of them as you like...well, up to a point. The motor can only handle a load so big. You are limited by the weight of the rotor , Magnets, shaft, and the friction of the bearings, plus a little magnetic drag. Say 10% of what it SHOULD be but probably less.
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda

Last edited by Turion; Yesterday at 09:41 PM.
#1706
Yesterday, 10:05 PM
 gotoluc Gold Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 1,132
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion I will not show videos of my current machine running under load, or running at all. I have plans for that machine that do not involve giving away why would I give up something to the public domain that could make me (and people I am close to) a LOT of money
Because this mindset is what perpetuates the plague of greed in this world!

but it's good to know where you stand.
Hope you know you're not going to get praises from open source Free Energy members by continuing to post about a OU device you don't share?... that wouldn't be sensible.

I didn't think you were in it for the money... thought your earlier posts said something that you wanted to help the world.

I must be wrong

Luc
__________________

#1707
Yesterday, 10:41 PM
 Allen Burgess Gold Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 1,378
BS.

Quote:
 Originally Posted by gotoluc Because this mindset is what perpetuates the plague of greed in this world! but it's good to know where you stand. Hope you know you're not going to get praises from open source Free Energy members by continuing to post about a OU device you don't share?... that wouldn't be sensible. I didn't think you were in it for the money... thought your earlier posts said something that you wanted to help the world. I must be wrong Luc
This is the same guy who stated that he built an "Oscillating Reed Switch Motor" that he couldn't show us because I was mentally ill.
__________________

#1708
Yesterday, 11:14 PM
 Turion Gold Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 2,287
Lol

Luc,
We gave away the design of the pulse motor. A few people built it, but mostly we were ignored.

We gave away the circuit and how to improve it for free. We were almost COMPLETELY ignored on that count. In fact we were decried as fakes and frauds. Oh by YOU as well.

I have showed the TWO patents time and again that should be the BASIS for ALL free energy research, yet there is hardly ANY discussion of them here.

We have given you the meat and potatoes of a WORKING free energy system, and now, because I refuse to ladle the gravy on top, you question my motives? LOL.

Build a Matt modified motor. Build a REAL version of the 3/4 battery system as we shared it. Add on the improvements we showed. Then tell me HOW MUCH you are paying in energy costs to run your load (motor, etc.) and what THAT is worth.

You CAN'T help people that won't help themselves. We gave you the meat and potatoes and it is rotting on your plate because you are too stubborn or stupid to eat it. And that's my fault? My final suggestion would be this: EAT IT. ;-)
__________________
"I aim to misbehave" Malcolm Reynolds
"Try Not! Do or do not. There is no 'Try' ". Yoda
#1709
Today, 02:37 AM
 BroMikey Platinum Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Posts: 4,732
I did just what I was told. I built the Matt Modified Motor (3M) and
watched the batteries stay up while it offers real mechanical power.

Good enough for me. There is no one anywhere in the world on the
web who is a final authority on these subjects than Matt, Dave and
a few others who want to remind silent.

Most people are skeptics and will never get the extra. John Bedini could
not share everything he was aware of so he offered teaching video's
that showed us the way.

Game over. However it is my understanding that Matt and Dave found
out many things way beyond the Bedini teachings all by their lonesome.

True invention. The gift is here, stop kicking and build it. I built it.
It works far better than a simple amp burning motor and it is done
using an amp burning cage to wind for the extra.

Simple and easy, it is a 2 pole and for some strange reason creates
energy. Game over.

Split the positive and it is "Game Over" Game Over" meaning multiples
on top of multiples of COP increases.

Have a nice day skeptics.

I am Johnny come lately and I do what I am told.

Matt and Dave have shown us the courtesy of giving away a gift
now be a good little Indian and follow the chief's road map.

What's the hold up? It is all free, waiting to be had, let's rock and roll.

The only problem is you will have to acknowledge that someone else
figured it out because you are not able to do that type of work.

Once you have built it the new idea you get can be yours. We all must
start somewhere.
__________________

Last edited by BroMikey; Today at 03:26 AM.
#1710
Today, 10:09 AM
 Satyam108 Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Posts: 15
Quote:
 Originally Posted by Turion As I have stated before, I believe the Zero Force motor is the greatest gift John B. gave us. I have built SEVERAL different models of the ZFM, and am hopeful that a larger version will provide the motive force to turn my generator. The version we are working with now is NOT exactly the version Peter L. built and John B. later demonstrated, but runs on the same principles. It has much more torque while still running on next to NOTHINGin input. The ZFM needs no iron in the core to work. Batteries charge best when there is a pulse. That's why a pulse motor on the 3 Battery system is better than an off the shelf motor. The higher the frequency of the pulse, and the sharper the gradient, the better result you will get. Period. It is NOT magic. It is fact. I am not the first one to say this and I hope I am not the last. It is ALL in the old patents for those who read and research.
Thanks Dave/Turion,
Working on two other (one related) project(s) - so pardon my absence from here. I'm not trying to be contrary - genuinely seeking knowledge - but in this post I'd like to revisit the "no iron" statement.

Zero Force Motor Demo 1 by John Bedini - posted by Aaron on 7-21-17 at this link:
We can sort of hear John over the noise of the running motor, explaining what he's doing - what he's showing us. What I see is this:

* The timing wheel on the right makes it clear that this is a pulse motor, as does the scope display of those pulses;
*Rather than two curved coils on opposite sides of the rotor as in Yaro and Peter's replications, John only has a single coil of magnet wire on a spool at the bottom.
* It's clear that there is no iron in the coil.
* Appreciable spikes of what John calls "The Radiant" appear on the waveform of the scope. He states that he is not capturing these spikes but that they can be captured and put to use.
* At the 1:17 mark or so, he shows the current at .2 Amps
* At about 1:47, he inserts what appears to be a short piece of 1/2" ID galvanized steel pipe into the coil.
* It sounds like the motor turns faster (maybe just my poor hearing)
*The spikes are more pronounced; AND
* The input current drops to 0 on the 5 amp meter.
*He removes the pipe section and (maybe) the motor slows a bit (judging by sound - with admittedly poor hearing in my "good" ear.)
*The current goes back up to .2 amps
* The spike amplitude decreases.
* He repeats the above sequence again with the same results.

I realize that your, Yaro and Peter's replications have no iron in the cores and I understand the diagrams in John's notes in the Zero Force Motor - Full Disclosure video/PDF's about the flow of magnetic current (Leedskalnin) and how the magnets on the rotor are attracted to the coils.

From my bit of work and experimentation on the 3 (Plus 1 or 2 "resting") battery configuration switching system, I can also see how a ZFM (or version like the one John showed in the video) could be powered, and how, as Peter Lindemann did in his final Bedini SSG "Beyond Advanced" presentation, DID capture the radiant and used it to charge the charging battery. He had also incorporated "resting" the just charged battery for a period of time - to let it's chemistry settle. (I noted your and/or Matt's remark that both the just charged and just discharged batteries need to rest before being connected into the rotation again. That's why I'm going for 3 + 2 system - 3 batteries working and 2 resting at any given moment.)

SO
If you'd be so kind, I'd like your thoughts on this video - why putting the pipe section in the coil core increased the radiant and decreased the current being drawn from the battery. If the radiant spikes come from "the medium" (space/Aether/Akasha/Primordial Sound,) supply current to the coil to move the rotor and reduce the draw on the battery to zero, then how does the piece of iron in the core facilitate that and why?
I also found his, Yaro's and Peter's use of Neodymium magnets very interesting, as on the Bedini "Motors" (SSG) - John was very adamant that Neo's couldn't be used because they would saturate the cores in the coils. I guess with no iron in the cores of the ZFM's - that is not the obstacle it was. But then the above questions seem to increase in importance.

Thanks for your help, and for creating and working on this thread for these years, Dave, I for one appreciate it and I wish you all success in profiting from your efforts. Most of us are in league to vanquish the REAL greedy bastards of the world - the trillion dollar energy sector, with their lies about "fossil fuels," "peak oil," and "global warming," er "climate change," er uh "climate disruption." All designed to keep us (mankind) enslaved and funding our own enslavement.

Hail Victory!
Peace and Love
Jim
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