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  #391  
Old 08-31-2017, 09:08 PM
Allen Burgess Allen Burgess is offline
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GAP commutator.

The DC fan, latching Reed switch commutator I just finished designing could run any of Joe's motors. It's much easier to relocate the trigger magnets on the tube then it would be to tailor a copper strip. Every individual Newman motor is unique and needs it's own personalized commutator timing arrangement.
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Last edited by Allen Burgess; 08-31-2017 at 11:52 PM.
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  #392  
Old 09-01-2017, 12:08 PM
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wantomake wantomake is online now
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Progress

Vidbid,
Still working on commutator. I picked up good tip from email friend on replication methods. To build parts so that changes can be made if possible. So my disc commutator can be changed to add shorting segments. The bad thing is I'll never get that Newman effect with this desktop size unit. So any tests results may not be helpful to anyone here.

Hope to finish today with that part and move on to wiring the coil to complete the setup.

wantomake
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  #393  
Old 09-01-2017, 07:06 PM
Allen Burgess Allen Burgess is offline
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Split positive

Here's a split positive test:

Newman's "Short" contact on his commutator feeds his source batteries the same way you see me charging batteries below: Aaron states that "It's the voltage differential between the positives", not the power to ground that completes this self charging circuit".

My reverse charging effect neutralization pulse alternator works the same way. One contact short back to to source.

Here's a link to the video: Just fast forward through the dead space:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NzQtyFp_Ghk
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File Type: jpg IMG_20170901_124757.jpg (54.4 KB, 25 views)
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  #394  
Old 09-04-2017, 12:08 PM
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wantomake wantomake is online now
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Test will tell

To All,
Happy Labor Day to everyone.

It will be that for myself. Very laborious to get this "desk top" size Newman Machine to a testing stage.

Finished the commutator disc and now mounting on platform next to coil. It looks very "steam punkish" with the copper and white cutting board plastic. I built one barrel shaped and disc shaped so could see which is easier to build, use, and maintain. No not a production engineer, but think it wise to try both.

Not sure yet the wiring/connecting of coil to get motoring and generator production without adding generator coils. Harvesting the "shorted" spikes may not help with this size coil. The coil is 18 strands in parallel. I will test different wiring schemes to see what the "test will tell".

Hey look a delightful cup of coffee in front of me needing a warm up and sipping cause it's cool outside.

wantomake
Edit: The barrel commutator will be used with two coil scheme, while the disc comm will be used with single coil scheme. As per the Geoffrey Miller pdf. The flyback controlled by capacitors.
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Last edited by wantomake; 09-04-2017 at 07:57 PM.
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  #395  
Old 09-04-2017, 03:51 PM
Allen Burgess Allen Burgess is offline
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Superposition; Two Loop Problem:

http://www.energeticforum.com/redire...%2Fsuppos.html

The power that travels back to the battery from my oscillator is summed algebraically; Therefore, we subtract the source power from the power that's generated in the electro-magnet from the regauging, and the remainder is the charge that replenishes the battery. No power ever reaches the coil from the battery after the first pulse. The second pulse is generated by the magnet coil itself, and the excess passed back to source.

The same relationship applies to the "Newman Motor" commutator short.

The Neutralization Pulse Oscillator is a "Newman Motor" short circuit hybrid. I have reached infinity with that simple a design! The Reverse Charging Effect video is posted above in comment #393.
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Last edited by Allen Burgess; 09-04-2017 at 04:21 PM.
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  #396  
Old 09-05-2017, 01:03 PM
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wantomake wantomake is online now
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Assembly

The assembly has gone ok. And did get to try a basic machine run.

The multi-strand coil wrap is hard to clean, connect and measure but can be done.

I only used 5 strands of wire to try a machine run. The disc works good. I used brass strips from Lowes as comm brushes. Some small sparks but believe more 9 volt batteries is needed. Don't own a variac so can't use ac then FWBR to dc power source. Like vidbid stated, want to be a purist and use battery power just as Newman did. Back to Lowes for more batts.

wantomake
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  #397  
Old 09-05-2017, 02:48 PM
Allen Burgess Allen Burgess is offline
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Newman Batteries.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
The assembly has gone ok. And did get to try a basic machine run.

The multi-strand coil wrap is hard to clean, connect and measure but can be done.

I only used 5 strands of wire to try a machine run. The disc works good. I used brass strips from Lowes as comm brushes. Some small sparks but believe more 9 volt batteries is needed. Don't own a variac so can't use ac then FWBR to dc power source. Like vidbid stated, want to be a purist and use battery power just as Newman did. Back to Lowes for more batts.

wantomake
@wantomake,

Remember, Newman's batteries were deader than door nails. The voltage on my 12 volt was down to 8.52 when I performed my oscillator test.

The commutator short "Superposition" charging can't happen if the battery source is higher in power then the output from the coil.
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  #398  
Old 09-05-2017, 04:56 PM
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????

Quote:
Originally Posted by Allen Burgess View Post
@wantomake,

Remember, Newman's batteries were deader than door nails. The voltage on my 12 volt was down to 8.52 when I performed my oscillator test.

The commutator short "Superposition" charging can't happen if the battery source is higher in power then the output from the coil.
AB,
Sorry I'm not familiar with "superposition" charging. Also I'm not using a "short" on my comms yet. As I've posted, this is only a basic machine build to help me to better understand the design and operation of this machine. I'm replicating solely from Geoffrey Miller presentation pdf.

As my knowledge base is low in electronics, electrical, and FE. I can build and still gain understanding in all the above. What I'd give for an engineering background. Like Popeye said, I yam what I yam.

Thanks anyway, I'll try to keep up,
wantomake
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  #399  
Old 09-05-2017, 09:09 PM
Allen Burgess Allen Burgess is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
AB,
Sorry I'm not familiar with "superposition" charging. Also I'm not using a "short" on my comms yet. As I've posted, this is only a basic machine build to help me to better understand the design and operation of this machine. I'm replicating solely from Geoffrey Miller presentation pdf.

As my knowledge base is low in electronics, electrical, and FE. I can build and still gain understanding in all the above. What I'd give for an engineering background. Like Popeye said, I yam what I yam.

Thanks anyway, I'll try to keep up,
wantomake
Superposition merely means higher charge level; Current always travels downhill from the higher charge source to the lower charge destination.
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Last edited by Allen Burgess; 09-05-2017 at 09:13 PM.
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  #400  
Old 09-06-2017, 12:34 AM
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Vidbid,
How is your build going? I know your commutator is including the "shorting" segment. Any results would be good to read.

Mine aren't encouraging so far. I wound my coil as two separate coils. Top and bottom of the pvc 4" union piece. I wanted to use one coil as motor and the other as generator. But no motoring yet. Using 17 9 volt batteries in series to power the machine. The timing is set. Good contacts on commutator. Only thing can figure is the coil needs to be re-wound.

wantomake
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  #401  
Old 09-06-2017, 04:09 AM
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Exclamation Progress Report

Quote:
Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
Vidbid,
How is your build going? I know your commutator is including the "shorting" segment. Any results would be good to read.

Mine aren't encouraging so far. I wound my coil as two separate coils. Top and bottom of the pvc 4" union piece. I wanted to use one coil as motor and the other as generator. But no motoring yet. Using 17 9 volt batteries in series to power the machine. The timing is set. Good contacts on commutator. Only thing can figure is the coil needs to be re-wound.

wantomake
Hi wantomake,

Not too much to report.

I think that I'm going to use a flat copper disk as the commutator.

For example: 3" Dia x 1" Thick Copper Round Disk Disc Rod Bar Stock 99.9% Cu

3" Dia x 1" Thick Copper Round Disk Disc Rod Bar Stock 99.9% Cu | eBay

I could center-tap it. Then, slot out the places for the contacts with epoxy holding the contacts and also providing the non-conductive material for the spaces.

I'm still working on my design.

Coils will be provided by microwave oven transformer high voltage coils.

Not sure as to what to make the armature shaft out of. I was thinking fiberglass for its nonmagnetic properties; however, Newman said to use steel hex bar.



For the slip rings, I'm still considering my options. Maybe I can find some off an old motor.



For the magnets, maybe center-hole type Neodymium magnets could be attached to a hex bar shaft.



Anyhow, that's where I'm at.
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VIDBID
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  #402  
Old 09-06-2017, 04:11 AM
pjotterkjen pjotterkjen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vidbid View Post
The book is a good starting place, no doubt.

I think a good finishing place is building a Newman motor based on Big Eureka, specifically, the Big Eureka commutator.

There's only two rotating contacts, though, they are segmented. I think that there are about four segments per contact, but then there is the copper shorting band (so-termed by me,) and I see not mention of that in his book, and that would be because it came later, I believe.

So, there's my two cents on it.

vidbid,
You may want to review the presentation of Geoffrey.

Geoffrey states clearly that only 12-3 and 6-9 o'clock are interconnected with the small commutator rings, And that's all, he said. So, you may be right about the Big Eureka not having an internal commutator, but if Geoffrey is right (and I'll assume he is) then you need to adjust your drawing.
The two pairs of copper segments were connected through the bridges you draw, but not all four. Something like this: A1-A2 and B1-B2.

The voltage applied by the batteries when the rotor is in one of the FIRE segments will generate a big electromagnetic field which interacts with the magnetic field of the magnets on the rotor and create a torque, hence it starts turning.

So, we would have four FIRE segments and four BLANK segments.
The absence of SHORT segments is because Newman used capacitors that were helpful in suppressing the sparks. No need for complicated commutator design anymore. The capacitors are charged when the coil discharges its stored energy during the BLANK segments. Actually, the coil with the capacitors and the inductive reactance (or resistance when the rotor is not turning) represent a simple RLC circuit.

pjotterkjen
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Last edited by pjotterkjen; 09-06-2017 at 04:13 AM. Reason: correction
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  #403  
Old 09-06-2017, 05:58 AM
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vidbid vidbid is offline
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Lightbulb

Quote:
Originally Posted by pjotterkjen View Post
vidbid,
You may want to review the presentation of Geoffrey.

Geoffrey states clearly that only 12-3 and 6-9 o'clock are interconnected with the small commutator rings, And that's all, he said. So, you may be right about the Big Eureka not having an internal commutator, but if Geoffrey is right (and I'll assume he is) then you need to adjust your drawing.
The two pairs of copper segments were connected through the bridges you draw, but not all four. Something like this: A1-A2 and B1-B2.

The voltage applied by the batteries when the rotor is in one of the FIRE segments will generate a big electromagnetic field which interacts with the magnetic field of the magnets on the rotor and create a torque, hence it starts turning.

So, we would have four FIRE segments and four BLANK segments.
The absence of SHORT segments is because Newman used capacitors that were helpful in suppressing the sparks. No need for complicated commutator design anymore. The capacitors are charged when the coil discharges its stored energy during the BLANK segments. Actually, the coil with the capacitors and the inductive reactance (or resistance when the rotor is not turning) represent a simple RLC circuit.

pjotterkjen
I shall give your statements consideration.
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VIDBID
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  #404  
Old 09-06-2017, 02:20 PM
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wantomake wantomake is online now
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Long motor

Vidbid,
Thanks for reply.

So you're planning the long motor build. That's were I got the idea to use two coil setup on top and bottom. Also from the videos posted here. That guy was using one MOT coil on the bottom of his unit. I see you must follow the established setups for this machine. The round "upright" machine must be built certain way different from the long or horizontal machine.

Anyway just thinking while typing,
wantomake
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  #405  
Old 09-06-2017, 02:57 PM
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Turion Turion is online now
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Copper

Maybe an alternative choice for the copper if you want rings inside of rings is to use flat copper gaskets of different sizes. They can be mounted on a rotor on one end of the machine, and because they come in so many different sizes, you can have rings within rings within rings. I have used them many times with brushes, and they work extremely well. If you are sure you want simply a copper disk, there may be alternatives for that too...

3 Inch Copper Circles, Laser Cut, Clean Edge: Apx 25 Circles 1lb , Wind Chimes | eBay


Conflat Flange Copper Gasket 2" Inner Diameter 2.3" Outer Diameter Lot of 3
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Last edited by Turion; 09-06-2017 at 03:00 PM.
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  #406  
Old 09-07-2017, 12:13 AM
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Lightbulb Desktop Newman Motor

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Originally Posted by wantomake View Post
Vidbid,
Thanks for reply.

So you're planning the long motor build. That's were I got the idea to use two coil setup on top and bottom. Also from the videos posted here. That guy was using one MOT coil on the bottom of his unit. I see you must follow the established setups for this machine. The round "upright" machine must be built certain way different from the long or horizontal machine.

Anyway just thinking while typing,
wantomake


Correct. My design is base on Newman's Big Eureka, only mine will be a desktop model. Initially, the HV-MOT will be lower and then an additional HV-MOT for upper level later.

I thought about using an old monitor fly-back yoke HV transformer to produce the HVDC, but I'm not certain if there will be enough current to do that. We'll see.
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Last edited by vidbid; 09-07-2017 at 02:40 AM.
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  #407  
Old 09-07-2017, 12:24 PM
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wantomake wantomake is online now
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Looks good

Quote:
Originally Posted by vidbid View Post


Correct. My design is base on Newman's Big Eureka, only mine will be a desktop model. Initially, the HV-MOT will be lower and then an additional HV-MOT for upper level later.

I thought about using an old monitor fly-back yoke HV transformer to produce the HVDC, but I'm not certain if there will be enough current to do that. We'll see.
Vidbid,
Good picture with diagram. Hope all goes well as you build.

I will be making adjustments to get better results. The first machine I replicated long ago ran with just a single reed switch. One 9 volt battery. The coil was single wire winding of 38 awg from a MOT primary coil.

It was a very crude build but very interesting as well,
Back to coffee and thinking.
wantomake
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  #408  
Old 09-08-2017, 02:07 AM
pjotterkjen pjotterkjen is offline
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Other info on Newman

All,

for those that have interest in reading more about Joseph Newman, here are two additional links:

1. RexResearch page Newman
Joseph W. Newman: South African Patent Application #831296, "Energy Generation System Having Higher Energy Output Than Input"

2. Patrick J. Kelly eBook edition 2017 Chapter 11, Joseph Newman's Motor.
http://www.free-energy-info.tuks.nl/PJKbook.pdf

pjotterkjen
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  #409  
Old 09-12-2017, 02:07 AM
pjotterkjen pjotterkjen is offline
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More Info and an interesting observation

All,

I was just reading a document that Patrick Kelly has on his website:
http://www.free-energy-info.tuks.nl/DonKelly.pdf

In this document on page 49, the following is written:
"The project work in this area, to date, has already found that off-the-shelf -tinned-copper buss conductor wire produces approximately
three times the magnetic field level compared to plain copper conductor wire." [emphasis added]

The above would mean that, if true, instead of having to create a coil with N windings, we could achieve the same results using the mentioned type of wire but N/3 windings.
Or, when having such a coil with N windings, we'd be able to increase the magnetic field by a factor three. (!)

The same occurs to me with the magnets used by Newman. The first models used circular ceramic magnets, but the he changed to the long models with the hexagonal placed magnets along the ax which were neodymium type magnets.

Then, thinking ahead of my redesign, the commutator was used to obtain two requirements:
1. each half revolution the input voltage over the coil should flip polarity to keep the push or pull on the magnet such that it would keep rotating;
2. create an amount of DC pulsed inputs to the coil by the FIRE segment.
The SHORT segment was eliminated by the use of the capacitors over the coil which suppressed the Back EMF.
So, it is obvious this commutator could be improved on too.
Sharp high voltage and supershort DC pulses should improve the alignment of copper atoms in the main coil.

Also, the energy that goes from the coil into the capacitor when the magnetic field collapses could be used to be fed back to the input source using Bedini SG circuitry. Or, when using two battery sources, one would be the input battery and the other would be recharged, and after a while these two batteries could be swapped so that the system becomes a self-running device.

Interesting facts and thoughts I think, while progressing.

pjotterkjen
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Last edited by pjotterkjen; 10-12-2017 at 02:34 PM. Reason: name correction
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