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Renewable Energy Discussion on various alternative energy, renewable energy, & free energy technologies. Also any discussion about the environment, global warming, and other related topics are welcome here.

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View Poll Results: Horsepower! The only way to directly power conventional generators?
I agree & vote Thumbs up 7 58.33%
I disagree & vote Thumbs down 3 25.00%
I disagree & wrote reason(s) why 2 16.67%
I don't really care because Truth is unimportant in life and science. 0 0%
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 10-02-2013, 11:18 AM
Gen-E-Sys II Gen-E-Sys II is offline
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Horsepower!

Horsepower!
"Truth requires few words." Chief Joseph (18401904) (thx B. Peiman:<)
A one word statement is the fewest of words.

Is there any dispute against the fact that off-the-shelf conventional rotary alternators and generators require and can directly use only one thing, namely: Horsepower?
Mustermann, Max, Simon, Mark E, Bill Peiman, Asterisk, Mile High, johnBA5, Uli Kruger,............ anyone else?

The question is legitimate seeking a show of agreement or disagreement, not an argument, trick or a joke. - Civil replies will be addressed in Kind, but please stay on point, omit any/all orbiter dicta.
If you agree: simply like this thumbs up,
If you disagree: post as you see fit.
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  #2  
Old 10-04-2013, 11:49 PM
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Hrothgar Hrothgar is offline
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I'll tell you why

Only because, Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's proposed pixie power never caught on.
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  #3  
Old 10-05-2013, 12:56 AM
Ernst Ernst is offline
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Forgot about windpower? waterpower? Or even certain forms of solar power?

Strange to see that people agree so quickly with an obviously erroneous statement?

Ernst.
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Old 10-05-2013, 01:00 AM
Ernst Ernst is offline
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I voted: "I disagree & wrote reason(s) why" but that count still shows 0????


Ernst.
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  #5  
Old 10-05-2013, 04:23 AM
Gen-E-Sys II Gen-E-Sys II is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst View Post
Forgot about windpower? waterpower? Or even certain forms of solar power?

Strange to see that people agree so quickly with an obviously erroneous statement?

Ernst.
Hi Ernst,

Thanks for commenting and voting. "Erroneous statement"???
No not forgotten at all because both wind and hydro power plants do use conventional rotary alternators/generators and those power plants in fact produce horsepower to directly drive the alternators/generators.

Not being sure of what certain types of solar power you refer to, if it has a conventional rotary alternator/generator it can only directly be driven by horsepower. (as little as I know)

I.e.: a Stirling engine produces horsepower that can drive the "gen".

The Sun cannot directly drive a conventional Alt/gen. but can be used as "fuel" the same as Wind can be used as "fuel" and water can be used as "fuel"
and converted appropriately by a equipment/machine to produce horsepower for the conventional alternator/generator.

A conventional alternator or generator will not produce one watt of electricity sitting in the Sun, in a raging river, at the windiest part of the planet, nor in the most extreme radiation .......... without a machine that can use those fuels to convert them and produce the one and only direct requirement of the generator: Horsepower.

That is all factual, and consistent with reality. Supporting my statement(s) based upon the results of lowered level thinking which is a part of Gen-E-Sys II technology. I have hopes you (among others) will investigate it carefully because there is much more to it than meets the eye at first blush.

Do you know of facts or something(s) to the contrary that I don't?
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Last edited by Gen-E-Sys II; 10-05-2013 at 04:27 AM. Reason: typo
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  #6  
Old 10-05-2013, 06:55 AM
Ernst Ernst is offline
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I see...
I thought 'horse power' = power derived from horses. Much as in wind power, water power and solar power.
I believe you use the term 'horse power' when you mean angular momentum? In that case you are obviously right as most dynamo's or alternators (is there a difference?) use rotating magnets or coils. Reciprocal movement can be used but usually isn't.

Ernst.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:20 AM
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water, water everywhere yet not a drop to drink!

Gen ... soooo just to kick your kick your proposition around a bit .. what are you going to make of the operation of the water cycle and evaporation .. for instance ? Horse power? that continues in freezing conditions ... not an I2R componet (or at least not in any conventional sense) unless you know different ? I think I could make a case for that huge engine working on something other than horse power as you describe.
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Old 10-05-2013, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Duncan View Post
Gen ... soooo just to kick your kick your proposition around a bit .. what are you going to make of the operation of the water cycle and evaporation .. for instance ? Horse power? that continues in freezing conditions ... not an I2R componet (or at least not in any conventional sense) unless you know different ? I think I could make a case for that huge engine working on something other than horse power as you describe.
PS I could likewise make a case for the prime mover of dowsing rods
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Old 10-05-2013, 12:41 PM
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Allcanadian Allcanadian is offline
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@Gen
Quote:
Is there any dispute against the fact that off-the-shelf conventional rotary alternators and generators require and can directly use only one thing, namely: horsepower?
Good question however it makes no sense. First Horsepower is a measure of something indicating power, does a generator directly use or somehow consume power?. Well no that is silly because when we refer to the act of generation we are speaking of a process of conversion of Energy, not power.

Does a generator directly use Energy?, well no it converts one form of Energy into another form of energy in every case. This is true because Energy like matter cannot be created or destroyed, it is conserved.

So to answer your question, Yes I dispute your statement. It like asking if a water turbine requires and can directly use only one thing namely, meter feet per seconds

AC.
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Old 10-05-2013, 01:35 PM
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Quite right AC succinctly put .. the question seems to be put in terms of horse power . when the point in question is (I guess) "energy" . In short watts (or horse power) do nothing .
It is only when time is introduced there is relevance, I opted to ignore that .. I stand corrected ! you may have a big 746 watt horse . If it won't pull the plough its of no use to man nor beast.
Viewed in that light the question is meaningless.
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Old 10-05-2013, 02:21 PM
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@Duncan
Quote:
the question seems to be put in terms of horse power . when the point in question is (I guess) "energy" . In short watts (or horse power) do nothing .
It is only when time is introduced there is relevance, I opted to ignore that .. I stand corrected ! you may have a big 746 watt horse . If it won't pull the plough its of no use to man nor beast.
Viewed in that light the question is meaningless.
The problem I see is that many people seem to be approaching the problem from completely the wrong angle, the wrong way of thinking. So when I hear someone say a generator must use horsepower I start thinking of cavemen running around in animal skins with clubs. It is absurd and quite frankly we are better than that and this archaic way of thinking will get us nowhere.

Energy is universal, it is ever present everywhere in everything, we know this as a fact and yet we still deny it ... why?. Part of the problem may be that we have been taught to be "consumers" and everything revolves around consumption. We speak of the conservation of Energy from the perspective that we can never "gain" anything yet completely ignore the fact we can never "lose" anything by the same rule.

I understand physics very well however people ... that's another story. They seem determined to be a beast of burden despite their intelligence and scoff at hearsay in one instance then swallow it hook, line ans sinker in another. Selective hearing has been replaced by one sided selective thinking and they claim to be open-minded but only until they don't agree with someone.

In any case I have heard all the standard arguments against FE before and have no issue with tearing their flawed logic apart limb from limb in a matter of minutes.

AC
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Last edited by Allcanadian; 10-05-2013 at 02:38 PM.
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Old 10-05-2013, 03:10 PM
Gen-E-Sys II Gen-E-Sys II is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst View Post
I see...
I thought 'horse power' = power derived from horses.
I think you're thought is 100% correct although "we" have already almost entirely destroyed those powerful creatures, along with any real chance of using them to make our lives easier, at this late stage in our so-called techno-logic advanced civilization. . . . (IMHO better described all high tek-NO-logic.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst View Post
Much as in wind power, water power and solar power.
I believe you use the term 'horse power' when you mean angular momentum?
I used the word "horsepower" because more people can and will relate to that one word rather than writing Torque in ft. lbs. times RPM, divided by 5252, divided by 550 equals Horsepower per second. Of which on a deeper level angular momentum is considered.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst View Post
In that case you are obviously right as most dynamo's or alternators (is there a difference?) use rotating magnets or coils.
Thank you for thinking and seeing the validity of it. Having learned of how picky people like to be; alternator/generator is used to reduce attacks from word Nazis. Since you and I both can grasp in ordinary everyday talk there is no real difference in what both require to push or drag those magnets through space past a conductor, or vice versa.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ernst View Post
Reciprocal movement can be used but usually isn't.
Right again and precisely why I specified "rotary". I'm pretty sure you get the picture.
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Old 10-06-2013, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Allcanadian View Post
@Duncan


The problem I see is that many people seem to be approaching the problem from completely the wrong angle, the wrong way of thinking. So when I hear someone say a generator must use horsepower I start thinking of cavemen running around in animal skins with clubs. It is absurd and quite frankly we are better than that and this archaic way of thinking will get us nowhere.

Energy is universal, it is ever present everywhere in everything, we know this as a fact and yet we still deny it ... why?. Part of the problem may be that we have been taught to be "consumers" and everything revolves around consumption. We speak of the conservation of Energy from the perspective that we can never "gain" anything yet completely ignore the fact we can never "lose" anything by the same rule.

I understand physics very well however people ... that's another story. They seem determined to be a beast of burden despite their intelligence and scoff at hearsay in one instance then swallow it hook, line ans sinker in another. Selective hearing has been replaced by one sided selective thinking and they claim to be open-minded but only until they don't agree with someone.

In any case I have heard all the standard arguments against FE before and have no issue with tearing their flawed logic apart limb from limb in a matter of minutes.

AC
I personally didn't take Gen-E-Sys literally when he said horsepower. I took it to mean that his 'off the shelf' generator/alternators do indeed take something to turn them and that's most often measured in horsepower and usually from a gas engine or another force that can turn a generator like wind, eletric motor etc. What I am taking from your last statement about 'standard arguments against FE' leads me to think that you believe Gen-E-Sys does not believe in FE. I may be wrong but just to clarify any possible confusion I am sure that Gen-E-Sys is not by any means saying that FE is not possible. QUITE THE OPPOSITE. From what I have seen on his web site it would appear he has found the way to obtain Free Energy using a motor generator setup in a special configuration. I'm saying this on the assumption you may have missed some discussion of his info elsewhere. Have you looked at any of his web site info? If not take a look here:
Gen-E-Sys II

Hopefully using the term 'Free Energy' doesn't get into a debate of semantics as I'm sure everyone knows what I mean. IMO wind and solar are 'free energy' but the wind doesn't always blow and the sun doesn't always shine so having a motor gen that creates power 24/7 without buying gas or paying for grid power to run it is something I'm sure everyone would like to have.
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Last edited by ewizard; 10-09-2013 at 05:03 PM.
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Old 10-06-2013, 07:03 PM
Tenaus Tenaus is offline
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I disagree, because I prefer the metric system, and therefore, only output in kilowatts matter.

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Old 10-07-2013, 03:35 AM
Gen-E-Sys II Gen-E-Sys II is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tenaus View Post
I disagree, because I prefer the metric system, and therefore, only output in kilowatts matter.

That's funny!

Just so you know I know - formulas explained on the website are in metric. As well as providing conversions for "imperial".
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Old 10-07-2013, 04:15 AM
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Originally Posted by ewizard View Post
From what I have seen on his web site it would appear he has found the way to obtain Free Energy using a motor generator setup in a special configuration. I'm saying this on the assumption you may have missed some discussion of his info elsewhere. Have you looked at any of his web site info? If not take a look here:
Tec-Line / ASAP gauging systems
The link seems starange it goes to a CNC site which although interesting seems to have no mention of FE or OU
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Old 10-07-2013, 07:41 PM
Gen-E-Sys II Gen-E-Sys II is offline
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Wrong address

Quote:
Originally Posted by gsmsslsb View Post
The link seems starange it goes to a CNC site which although interesting seems to have no mention of FE or OU
Free energy stuff = backgauges.com/Gen-E-Sys II/
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Old 10-09-2013, 05:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsmsslsb View Post
The link seems starange it goes to a CNC site which although interesting seems to have no mention of FE or OU
Yes for some reason it didn't paste correctly but it's been fixed now. It's hidden behind the main web site here: backgauges.com
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