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  #3001  
Old 12-15-2012, 05:22 PM
Tinmanpower Tinmanpower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lester444 View Post
Tinmanpower,

I don't know where you got your information but I assure you what I wrote above is correct. Read for your self here:
Allegro MicroSystems - Search Results

Incandescent light bulb - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia <----Scroll down to sub-topic "Current and Resistance"

No need to discuss further.

Lester444
You need to get your head out of the book's,and join the real world lester444
Or would you like me to make a video to show you that the amps will rise with the voltage when applied to an incandecant bulb?
Think about what your saying.
Lets say we had an incandecant bulb that was running on 12 volts at 1 amp-12 watts.
Now we drop the voltage to 6 volt's-and you say the amp draw will go up?-wrong,the amps will go down with the voltage.

Yes,the hotter the element become's-the higher the resistance accross that element-but you forgot one thing-heat energy also go's up right along with the resistance.

So i stand by my claim-amp's will drop when the voltage is droped accross an incandecant bulb-or do i have to make that video to show you?
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  #3002  
Old 12-15-2012, 06:03 PM
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machinealive machinealive is offline
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If you have 12 watt light, with 12 v and 1amp.

If you lower the voltage, amps will go up if there is a source to draw from, to give same 12 watts.
if you lower the volts, watts out will go down if there is no source to provide extra current,why would amps not stay the same, or decrease? therefore less then 12 watts, and light dims.

So like always, it depends. Like everyone has been saying, we need a few more measurements, or am I wrong, and if I am I apoligize, but please tell me why?

Since the beginning, i have been amazed that lights are being lite, across diodes that should be blocking current. My research will continue into this amazing effect, no matter if over unity or not. So thanks for that UFO, no matter what else. I think the radiant generator is a whole other topic.

If I am wrong in what I said above, would someone explain why.

Also, since I am going to build this, come hell or high water, I have a more technical question regarding the build.

UFO, if two parameters, rpm and torque, must not change or no volts out, Why were lights on in your last video, rmp was only 2400, or I missed something, sorry, just trying to understand.
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  #3003  
Old 12-15-2012, 06:21 PM
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Before UFO mentioned about the stage lights blowing fuses or breakers I had already been thinking these '500 watt' lights likely draw more than 500 watts. But having read his past experience with them I will bet they draw considerably more than 500 watts. I could go into the reasons for this but don't want to add more clutter here. I know some I've seen use transformers in them and may well consume 800 watts or more just to get 500 watts out. And I'm guessing those bulbs actually use more than that. I realize that's quite a bit of speculation but it's supported by the readings we saw as well as UFO's past experience with those lights. The bottom line here is I think his setup was putting out more power than it was using. I'm sure we will soon have more proof of this.
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  #3004  
Old 12-15-2012, 06:22 PM
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scratchrobot scratchrobot is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmanpower View Post
Lol-where do i sign up.
You know,i was all for this to work along with every one else.
And then came the big anouncment from UFO-Quote:We have overunity galor.
I was pumped to think that some one had finaly done it-but then i seen the first video which showed nothing but run battery voltage???

Then the second video-which showed input watts,but no output watts.

UFO then said to me and others-please be patient,as i havnt finished the setup yet.
So how dose one come to the belief that they have overunity if they havnt finished the device?

And then you get others watching the video saying-yep that's overunity for sure???
So how did they come to this conclusion with the tests that have been shown so far?

UFO-keeps on avoiding a simple watts in to watts out test? and seems to be more concerned about what a gas powered generator would do if the governor is disconected?What has that got to do with proving your overunity device as claimed?.

There is only one reason some one would keep delaying a watts in to watts out test to prove there claim of overunity.
I followed the story partially so maybe i missed something but that is exactly what i see happening also! People claiming OU and ordering stuff, maybe it's because it's almost 21-12-12? I don't think we will see proof before that date and UFO has to go to his own planet
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  #3005  
Old 12-15-2012, 06:26 PM
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minoly minoly is offline
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You GO tinman
You GO John
In my home town that means youre awesome, keep it up!
as well as M.A. - bolt1 and any others...


U.P. I was amongst the first to get the little toy up and running, Ive been rooting for you ever since. Im lazy though, nore do I have the patience for a large build this makes me a waiter/watcher LOL
Its nice to see your patience and character has stabilized since your first posts MOST IMPRESIVE! As the same cannot be said for myself. If it feels like some are unfairly holding your feet to the fire on this its because we are. This community has been through much disappointment over the years. So anyone who steps up has to be put under the spot light period

I think all that is necessary is to not make any claims at all. A little look what Ive done so far is all that is needed, no deadlines, just progress on your work. It will all come to light w/o any fuss this way.

Ive gotta say I really like your enthusiasm, light heartedness and gumshoe, you are showing a strong earnest strength of character here.
Sincerely - Patrick
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  #3006  
Old 12-15-2012, 06:54 PM
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Ufopolitics Ufopolitics is offline
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Hello Machine

Quote:
Originally Posted by machinealive View Post
If you have 12 watt light, with 12 v and 1amp.

If you lower the voltage, amps will go up if there is a source to draw from, to give same 12 watts.
if you lower the volts, watts out will go down if there is no source to provide extra current,why would amps not stay the same, or decrease? therefore less then 12 watts, and light dims.

So like always, it depends. Like everyone has been saying, we need a few more measurements, or am I wrong, and if I am I apoligize, but please tell me why?

Since the beginning, i have been amazed that lights are being lite, across diodes that should be blocking current. My research will continue into this amazing effect, no matter if over unity or not. So thanks for that UFO, no matter what else. I think the radiant generator is a whole other topic.

If I am wrong in what I said above, would someone explain why.

Also, since I am going to build this, come hell or high water, I have a more technical question regarding the build.

UFO, if two parameters, rpm and torque, must not change or no volts out, Why were lights on in your last video, rmp was only 2400, or I missed something, sorry, just trying to understand.
Hello Machine,

Related to V & A...You are correct, as also Lester444.

Since the times that Ohm wrote His Laws...V/I...Meaning they are INVERSELY PROPORTIONAL in every aspect,...now, if someone does not understand that terminology...well, would have to go back to Elementary Math School.

Related to lights On when RPM's dropped on Video...

Machine, once that you have gotten the Generator rotor coils excited, from a previous correct speed/torque run...then it will take a decrease, and still outputting power.
What can not be done is trying to get it started without the required two parameters present. it will not get excited, it will not output nada...

Think about a Car Battery relation to a Gas Engine...you can not take it off and expect to start the car...however, after it has started then remove it and (if Alternator/voltage regulating systems are fine) gas engine will keep running without battery..
The battery represents (in the example above) the static exciter fields-capacitor circuit in the generator, and the Alternator/Voltage Regulating System are the rotary stator on your Meccalte...

The Brush Less Meccalte is a maintenance free unit, except for mechanical failure like bearings...or mistreatment by overload or others.

It has an Isolated (that is why brushless) Dual Independent Rotor Coils wrapped around the two poles respectively, this is the rotary stator, they are closed by a diode in different directions (same winding direction on both coils to cancel reverse magnetic polarity, rendering a steady South and North Poles...the other component it has closing out the coils (parallel to diode) is a Varistor, or Movistor ...they are in charge to prevent transients spikes and regulate voltage within coils to obtain a steady/linear voltage across, therefore a steady magnetic field/flux. Now, every time you turn off generator, this coils go empty on charge (no caps there) However, the charge is retained in a 400V AC Cap attached to the outer exciting coils wrapped around the static frame where the generating fields are.
So, every time you start the generator, there is a process of Induction from the exciter coils-cap to energize rotor coils, however, this induction starting process needs to be at those specific parameters (RPM's and Torque) otherwise rotor will not get excited...and if rotor do not get excited...it would not induce energy back in the generating fields (no output)

But once Rotor Coils are excited...RPM's could drop below spec's value (up to a point though)...as also torque...it will be dim on output...but there will be power at output

And If You discharge that capacitor... Generator will not output nothing... even at 3600 RPM's and 15 HP...till you "Jump Start it" with a 120 V AC "touch"...

Sorry, I believe I extended too long here... ...but hope you see the picture clear now.


Regards Mon Ami


Ufopolitics
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  #3007  
Old 12-15-2012, 07:14 PM
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Ufopolitics Ufopolitics is offline
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Hello Patrick

Quote:
Originally Posted by minoly View Post
You GO tinman
You GO John
In my home town that means youre awesome, keep it up!
as well as M.A. - bolt1 and any others...


U.P. I was amongst the first to get the little toy up and running, Ive been rooting for you ever since. Im lazy though, nore do I have the patience for a large build this makes me a waiter/watcher LOL
Its nice to see your patience and character has stabilized since your first posts MOST IMPRESIVE! As the same cannot be said for myself. If it feels like some are unfairly holding your feet to the fire on this its because we are. This community has been through much disappointment over the years. So anyone who steps up has to be put under the spot light period

I think all that is necessary is to not make any claims at all. A little look what Ive done so far is all that is needed, no deadlines, just progress on your work. It will all come to light w/o any fuss this way.

Ive gotta say I really like your enthusiasm, light heartedness and gumshoe, you are showing a strong earnest strength of character here.
Sincerely - Patrick
Hello Patrick,

Wow, You have been "on and off" (In-Out) here but could say every once in a "Blue Moon"...
However, every time I have seen you around here...is to "throw wood to the fires of Skepticism"...
Well...let me not be unfair here...I would say "Once" you were very enthusiastic about that little red and beautiful motor...you replicated, as also the nice video you uploaded...so, yes, have to admit that not always You have been a "solid conservative" here...lol

However, now, because of your confession about Laziness...I understand you better...

Anyways, yes, Patrick I have changed, been around already for a few months...and kind of got used to the skeptics criticism, the doubts and questions etc...

But like I said before...and you also mentioned now...yes, You are very right, I am very persistent...some may have no idea how much and how far I could go to get something DONE and Over with...

Regards and please, keep showing up a bit more often...


Ufopolitics
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  #3008  
Old 12-15-2012, 07:18 PM
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machinealive machinealive is offline
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Thank you UFO,

That cleared some things up, for me. Makes perfect sense now.

Hey, I have two motors coming, maybe I should wind two patterns to see difference. Looking forward to video.

I also emailed the company johnStone linked, xcell-rt, but no reply, yet, for torque measurements. I also have a 5000 watt gas, gen. I thought I would load it untill it popped. Then see if same load would pop a breaker on the mecc alte when finished.
Does a watt meter work for pulsed? I'm sure it does.
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  #3009  
Old 12-15-2012, 07:49 PM
promt promt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
"that has been already approved by "Skeptics Country"
Did you call me?
What a show I've missed!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
"Skeptics, Conservatives and the "Tea Party" members are still in shock"
What shock you're mumbling about?
As I told you it will never work - under load it's losing rpm (you said it will increase torque and speed under load);
Of course it will drive a gen, it's still a motor even with four pairs of coils at the time; get a regular 80-90% efficient motor (not piece of crap) and you will get better performance;

"INPUT
Voltage: 33.08
Amperage:75.8
Input Watts:2507 Watts?

Output
Four Lamps at 120V
Amperage: 41 A
Output Watts: (120X41)=4920 Watts"

You must be kidding!! You can't evaluate the output by brightness of the lights!
In this case the light shines exactly on 2500w minus loses.
Congratulations - it's FULL FIASCO, amigo.
You need help, man, sorry.
And btw poor Tesla is spinning in his grave - it has nothing to do with Him.
Get proper tests (the one and only evidence of OU is a self powering) and get congs from "Skeptics Country"
Until then get approval from crowd awaiting a miracle.
Good luck in your very hard challenge.
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  #3010  
Old 12-15-2012, 08:19 PM
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machinealive machinealive is offline
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Hey promt

I'm still waiting to see your motor you claim to have built. I still think your full of s***.
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  #3011  
Old 12-15-2012, 08:36 PM
warrensk warrensk is offline
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Hello,

Yes, I am a bit confused...."out come the wolves"

Cant you see the purpose of this asymmetry? We are dealing with an electrical motor with an OUTPUT of radiant energy to add to its mechanical output. We are dealing with a new machine never yet been made before (in the open source community) and all people can talk about is how they are even more skeptical. I dont think we can even comprehend what radiant energy can provide yet. People should be enthusiastic about these findings and looking into researching them for themselves. For all those who are WATCHERS and TALKERS I would calm down a bit on the skepticism and put downs. We are dealing with an entirely new area of research UFO has GIVEN US for free. For the spread of knowledge and truth and all some people can talk about is how they are going to wait and talk about OU impossibility and put downs....this saddens me that people are putting down someone trying so hard to provide information to them for free and for the betterment of humanity. This should be an area of people with HELPFUL comments and enthusiastic remarks. If your going to be a debbie downer I would appreciate if you didnt post because I like to read new updates, not more skeptical remarks. This is only slowing down the process....

@UFO keep up your work and dont get lost in all the skeptical remarks.

Trying to prove anything in theory has gotten us NO WHERE especially in these forums where people argue how people are wrong in what they are doing according to their OWN HELD THEORY on an operation NO ONE ELSE HERE has made themselves or probably understands to the extent UFO does. SO lets be nice and happy now we are on the verge of a new time and era KNOWLEDGE INCLUDED.

I am still applauding you, UFO, for your work. Dont get too stranded on trying to prove yourself to people who do not understand entirely. It will come with time.

Warren
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  #3012  
Old 12-15-2012, 09:28 PM
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JohnStone JohnStone is offline
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Hi UFO, friend!
I could not catch up all those posts today, so bear with me if it is off topic.

1a. Please compare the readings of your meters by connecting them at the very same point. So you can detect defective ones.
1b. You may want to measure volt / amps at input and then volt / amps output with the very same meters. Even if their reading might deviate from true values - the ratio will be very very precise!

2. Those 41 Amps mesured at output are not explainable.

2a. Incandescent bulbs draw at switch on time a current up to 5 ... 10 times because of their low cold resistance - but for short time only.
This can't be applied at your test as they were quite constantly switched on.

2b. If we slowly increse the voltage they will draw few current while increasing with voltage (not linearly but no fancy graph). Carbon filament behaves quite linearly.

2c. Increasing current at decreasing voltage is a property of switched mode PSUs at input circuit. But this does not apply to your setup. Are you sure the lamps have no PSU inside?

3. As we the gen head delivers true sine and incandescent bulbs to not give a phase shift between current and voltage we can multiply A*V for power calculation. Any inductive or capacitive load will falsify the result.

4. An easy way to flash over the power output is to measure the brightness of incandescent bulbs. Any cheap solar cell i.e. out of a calculator measures quite linearly the brightness if connected to a DMM measuring A. In order to get reliable measurements the bulb needs to be protected from environmental light, refelxions and the position of the cell needs to be same for all measurements. I mount in this case the bulb in a long tube and mount the cell at the other end - well protected from heat. The setup needs to be calibrated with a variable voltage while measuring volt and amps. Then I draw a graph with A vs. Watt.
This setup will measure as well non sine wave forms pretty precise.

Watch the other thread. There you got an answer as well. I hope you like it
JohnS
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Last edited by JohnStone; 12-15-2012 at 10:39 PM.
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  #3013  
Old 12-15-2012, 09:44 PM
verpies verpies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by promt View Post
Did you call me?
You can't evaluate the output by brightness of the lights!
Actually it is a credible power measurement if the light output from incandescent bulbs is measured with a calibrated monotonic heat or light sensor.
For an example see here.

Human eyes and a video camera with auto-iris are not a monotonic light sensors and the results they produce do not constitute a credible scientific evidence.

Also multiplying average AC Amps and AC Volts to calculate Watts is not believable either. This method is credible only for pure DC (not for PDC ,though).

Those trueRMS meters are useless with non-sinusoidal waveforms or waveforms containing higher frequency components (e.g. commutator noise).

Bolt is correct to demand the use of a real Wattmeter on the OUTPUT of this device.

@UFO
No self-respecting scientist will believe your measurements of AC or PDC power with average readings of voltage and current meters, multiplied together.

If you want to convince real scientists and engineers you must either rectify and measure pure DC or use power measuring methods that first multiply volts and amps at high rate and average the results later.
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  #3014  
Old 12-15-2012, 11:10 PM
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JohnStone JohnStone is offline
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Skepticism is an important element of scientisfic work. But it is an element only and not science itself.
  • Skepticism never moved in order to do anything to the betterment of humanity
  • It never had a vision nor a dream
  • It never invented
  • .....

Wright brothers did not fly their plain because - but despite skepticism and despite several misfortunes.

Skepticism has to stay in the backyard in order to help deciding for the best way to make dreams real and there it is a very valuable tool. In this sense I am a skeptic as well in that I try to forward knowledge in order to get that proof and make the dream real.

But destilled and applied outside its goal skepticism it is a toxic fusel.

UFO's measurements are still not suffitiently devised - that's true but he shurely will forward the data required. Why crackling before?

JohnS
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  #3015  
Old 12-15-2012, 11:33 PM
grizli grizli is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lester444 View Post
Hello UFO,

Congratulations on your successful run!!! That is definitely OU!!!

I can imagine you're actually doing a juggling act with the camera, connections, etc. and could not optimize the motor's drive settings yet. One of those times you wish you have more than 2 hands!!!

Please be extra careful with your tests UFO and I'm sure you will be posting a lot more. No rush from this end.

A word about incandescent lamps: The cold resistance of the the filament is very much lower than the hot resistance. If you run these lamps
at <120v (because your rpm is <3,600) the filament will still be "cold" and so you are drawing much more current. Once you adjust the speed
to rated rpm you should be getting close to 120v and the current will go down. You did say that's coming up soon. Please wear sunglasses!
This will be a difficult adjustment because as you bring the rpm up the load consumption will go down from >4,000w to ~2,000w but I'm sure you already know that.

Take care UFO!!! In my book you are in the hero status now.

You asked: "Guess what I am planning to do??? " <--- you are going to use that charger to recharge the batteries while it's running, in other words you are going to loop it and make it run by itself, for hours. It's gonna be warm and toasty in that room!

Thank you for showing us how it's done.

Lester444


4 pcs 500W lamps cant produce more than 2000W and draw more current
More current, less resistance (colder filament), lover generator voltage (lower rpm).. and LOWER POWER.... But current here is highly wrong measured, 40A is impossible for 2000W light bulb
60W light pulbp voltage current power characteristics
http://site.devicecraft.com/Applicat...cteristics.pdf

Acording to all this there is no OU here, but I HOPE I AM WRONG
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  #3016  
Old 12-16-2012, 12:30 AM
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Michelinho Michelinho is offline
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Quote:
4 pcs 500W lamps cant produce more than 2000W and draw more current
Where did you get that fact? It is true only if it is energized at the recommended voltage, go up a bit and you are dead wrong.

I see the WolfPack is out for blood. They already are dictating the terms of the testing procedures that will satisfy them. They will hunt till they either piss off everyone or die trying.

Those really need to get a life. Somewhere else.

Set your own schedule UFO and give them time to clear the door (or lead them to) cause when they get abusive like always it is the only outcome possible or else your dream is dead. It is your thread, use whatever force needed to keep it manageable.

Take care,

Michel
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  #3017  
Old 12-16-2012, 01:09 AM
Tinmanpower Tinmanpower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warrensk View Post
Hello,

Yes, I am a bit confused...."out come the wolves"

Cant you see the purpose of this asymmetry? We are dealing with an electrical motor with an OUTPUT of radiant energy to add to its mechanical output. We are dealing with a new machine never yet been made before (in the open source community) and all people can talk about is how they are even more skeptical. I dont think we can even comprehend what radiant energy can provide yet. People should be enthusiastic about these findings and looking into researching them for themselves. For all those who are WATCHERS and TALKERS I would calm down a bit on the skepticism and put downs. We are dealing with an entirely new area of research UFO has GIVEN US for free. For the spread of knowledge and truth and all some people can talk about is how they are going to wait and talk about OU impossibility and put downs....this saddens me that people are putting down someone trying so hard to provide information to them for free and for the betterment of humanity. This should be an area of people with HELPFUL comments and enthusiastic remarks. If your going to be a debbie downer I would appreciate if you didnt post because I like to read new updates, not more skeptical remarks. This is only slowing down the process....

@UFO keep up your work and dont get lost in all the skeptical remarks.

Trying to prove anything in theory has gotten us NO WHERE especially in these forums where people argue how people are wrong in what they are doing according to their OWN HELD THEORY on an operation NO ONE ELSE HERE has made themselves or probably understands to the extent UFO does. SO lets be nice and happy now we are on the verge of a new time and era KNOWLEDGE INCLUDED.

I am still applauding you, UFO, for your work. Dont get too stranded on trying to prove yourself to people who do not understand entirely. It will come with time.

Warren
Hi Warren
When some one claims to have an overunity device,then you can be assured that many will flock to see it.
But wether that be some john doe or a hard working man like UFO makeing this claim,you need to have the proof to back it up.

It would be nice to be able to take some one for there word,but this is not the case in the free energy movment-and i think you would know that.
How many time's have you heard this claim of overunity befor? only to find out it was not to be.

I am not a skeptic,but a realist.
I also spend my spare time serching for that device that will set us free,as you can clearly see on my youtube channel.
I have even just started on my lockridge device right here at energetic along with my forum IAEC

I love UFO's setup,but not once have i seen any of his motor's or anyones replications achieve overunity.
And then you must ask-why after 3 days since the claim of overunity galore has there been no test results shown to proove this?
I mean UFO would had to have made these measurments in the first place to make the claim of overunity-would he not?
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Old 12-16-2012, 01:46 AM
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My Fault...

Hello to All,

First I want to say that all this discussions, arguments and noises here are all MY FAULT/Mea Culpa...Ladies and Gentlemen.

I should have never rush this tests to accomplish a deadline date...

This was completely my own idea, and as I wrote before, I wanted to set a date to force myself to finish this...no matter if I would be lacking off my personal duties...and else...but again, my complete fault, my error...and I assume it on its entirety.

This very wrong testing because of running against time have delivered not only arguments here...but also accidents here and there...not good.

Just today making the Energy Meter test, I realize the brand new AGM Werker Battery I got two-three days ago, was shorted in a weird way...even when I took it back the owner told me it was rare readings...Battery will not raise one Milli volt after several hours charging it at a safely 2.0 amps...however the tester showed a CCA of @ 300 Amps...I got another Battery just now...as also a dedicated charger that uses "AGM Mode"...nice new switching chargers...

Accidentally (because of rush, long hours of work...no sleep...etc)...I made contact with Motor without the switch ...to one terminal (Positive)...and melted off a chunk out of the lead pole...the guy exchanged it because I have bought a lot of Batteries and chargers there...for a long time...but any other new customer...would have lost $70.00..

I had originally purchased a nice switching charger but only reaches 24 Volts Max...at 6.0 Amps charge rate...so I was using trickle type chargers for this new battery at the positive end side...This contributed killing it I believe...

Second, I ran all this tests with an unfinished Motor...no output brushes on, Output side is still not connected in series like it is supposed to.

Third: Generator Head had been running with the bad burnt front bearing from High Temp welding while it was on,...even though I have bought its replacement...

So it has been all my fault guys, cause of making it happen on the 12-12-12 (And still I did NOT make it til the morning of the 13th, ...adding to all this a lot of procrastination during the process...

So please do not blame the skeptics, or anyone else who is against this wrong testing...they are completely right to have doubts and disbelief...and heavily criticize the tests as Myself...

I opened this doors completely ...

Besides lousy video quality, causing dizziness and blurry vision...to top it off!

But everything here has solutions...except death....there is absolutely nothing we can 't do about that...but being alive...and breathing?...of course everything have solutions...and they will. .

I am gathering ALL required testing equipment ,the proper Motor finishing as reading its out gates in A & V and Hertz also...I have even forgotten about frequency with so much winding and Motors...

I need to read the Pulsed DC at Motor Input and Output...

But I do not want to get into tech details here...but to apologize to all about this error on testing on such investment of time and money...just because of rushing it...for a date that I did not come up in time...

But we All learn from our mistakes...


Regards to all


Ufopolitics
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Old 12-16-2012, 02:58 AM
RAMSET RAMSET is offline
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A man of Character to Boot.....

Sir
Your "brutal honesty" Raises your Stock IMO!
It is not possible to throw any stones from My house [its glass ].


I pray you stay the course.........

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Old 12-16-2012, 05:50 AM
promt promt is offline
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Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
But we All learn from our mistakes...
Ufopolitics

My respect for honesty!!!
(Unlike to zilano-cosmo-stipvep-etc with theirs 5-10kW working OU claims)

Just one thing - even if it's not OU (yet), you still can prove the advantage of this kind of winding by comparison with the Original motor (I mean to run the same gen and the load with Original and Modified motor; with the same amount and guage of wire, preferably).
It will give you a clear picture what's going on even without precision and expensive measurements.



"If you want to convince real scientists and engineers you must either rectify and measure pure DC or use power measuring methods that first multiply volts and amps at high rate and average the results later".
Can't agree more
Input and output has to be on the same scale of readings, say, if an input is DC, we have to bring output to DC level;
even this will solve almost all doubts in OU realm.
When it gets even 90% it's already very good achievement and promising direction.
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Old 12-16-2012, 06:32 AM
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Cornboy 555 Cornboy 555 is online now
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Put your feet up, have a beer.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
Hello to All,

I am not back "full time" yet, but I had to display this design...

It is a Typical Armature based on the Sequence of P(Pairs)-# of Total Poles, just like the P-5, P-12, P-16, P-20, P-28...
Except that here we are using a 36 poles based Armature because of being multiple of three...and the disposition it offers.

[IMG][/IMG]

What mainly changes here is the Stator-Brush Structure, we are dividing the 360 Quadrant into Three Pairs of Input Brushes, set exactly at the Three Stator Bisector Lines being 'fired' pairs, apart by 120 (Magenta intermittent three lines) and the Brushes shown within the green intermittent three lines (Output) . Therefore, In this Diagram I am only showing the "Pairs at work", meaning being energized ( P-1, P-13, P-25) and the ones outputting through brush gates at the Three Pairs of Output Gates, (P-7, P-19 and P-31) .

This System is stronger (Torque, Power, HP, Speed) as more stabilized and balanced Forces than a Four Brush/Four Stator, since Input energizes every 120(Three Times) instead of every 180 (Two Times) at Input. And so on every 60 Coils feed at Output gates reaching next Input empty/clean (if load steadily applied)

BN1=Bisector North 1 (Pair One)
BS2=Bisector South 1 (Pair One)

I have set this Bisectors at P-1 so you know is a reference to adjust the timing here...as also the direction of rotation that could also be reversed if passing this Pairs of Bisectors CCW to Stators Bisectors 'other side'...by moving brushes to be energized at that position.

However, finding this type of System in an already existing Symmetric Machine would be very odd...if not impossible, I would say...so the draw back here...is that it will have to be made this one from scratch.

The main idea here is to use this arrangement as a powerful prime mover...since reaching 3600 RPM's and very High Torque/HP would be a "breeze" for this type of Machine.


Regards to all


Ufopolitics


Hello UFO, glad you decided to step back a bit, please take your time, a thing called Life will always keep you grounded.

Please friend when you have some spare time, i have a couple of questions.

On the MAG3 above just following one pair of coils through rotation, (understanding all the pairs of coils that have preceded, and are following waiting in line, and also that three coil pairs are being energised at once 120 apart).

Taking P1 is in repulsion mode from N1 and S1,when energised, rotating clockwise, when imput brush breaks contact after approx 14 deegres of rotation, BS1 would then change polarity to N and be attracted to S1 and be repelled from N2 well before the 60 deegres travel needed to be repelled again.

Sorry UFO, but am i missing something, i can't seem to get my head around it.

Of course, i am looking at this with PM stators, and will be using pulsed electromagnet stators, with the pulse being directly coupled to rotor shaft for timing. (post on your other thread)

Any light you can shed for me would be greatly appreciated, as in first stages i need to understand correctly.

Many Thanks Friend.

Cornboy.
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Old 12-16-2012, 06:42 AM
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Postpone and disappoint, we are not paying customers

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
Hello to All,
I should have never rush this tests to accomplish a deadline date...
Hi Ufopolitics. I felt that immediately, kind of rushing to please the masses, but it was still impressive to see that motor put together and running, even without the generator coil hooked up. Also I felt that you were too cramped and that could be hazardous. That is some heavy duty machinery in reality. But the elegance of the 2 commutators, switching the geometry of the emf forces, appeals to my sense of genius (in other people, not me ). With the additional difficulties, it seems you still need several more days. You must postpone and disappoint the audience when scheduling does not meet its milestones. I would recommend some in-line ammeters. And please be safe, switches no plugging. Not running the generator output? Do you have an estimate of power it can generate back? volt and ammeter readings there please. Ideally power charts for these types of motors are shown in the thumbnails. You can see the effects of CEMF on power. I got this from QM Power, the company who bought Flynn Research, discussed in PJ Kelly's Free Energy book. It makes you wonder, are they doing a little bit of witch-hunting? We definitely need to do some torque measuring. If the CEMF even permits a conventional motor to do some useful work, the return from a tamed witch will be fractional to actual power out, and cannot be expected to recover all energy expended. Do you have a mechanism in mind to recharge the batteries during real time operations? Maybe a smaller asymmetric generator also in line combining its generator and motor output just to essentially energize the motor coil on the prime mover? Or is it efficient to plug a rectified AC power charging source into the system?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg ConvPMMotorPowerChart.JPG (30.2 KB, 54 views)
File Type: jpg QMPwrPMMotorPowerChart.JPG (32.5 KB, 44 views)
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmanpower View Post
I see much celebration going on here,and many people spending there hard earned cash on kits.
I am more than happy to let UFO take his break,but as he has clearly claimed an overunity device-i need to ask again
Can some body(anybody) please direct me to the video that clearly shows an overunity device.

To make such a significant claim as an overunity device,surly there would have to have been accurate measurments taken to proove this?
But from what i have seen in the last video that UFO showed,no such measurments were made.
The best i and others could make out was 36 volts at 40amp's plus(as it peged his meter)and 1000 watts out-thats if the full voltage was accross the incandecent bulb's?
So 1440= watts in and 1000 watts or less out???

If UFO has made these accurate measurment's,then why wernt they presented in the video?

It just seems that every one here is celebrating on the word of 1 person,with no accurate measurment that as yet have been seen.

I do congradulate and comend UFO on his endevor,but when you make a claim like this(overunity)you need to be able to clearly and accuratly show it.

Has anyone asked UFO if the kit's they are buying are an overunity device?

Many of us have seen all to often the cry of overunity,only later to be disapointed.

Many may think i am out of line with what i say,but please know that i am hopeing as much as anyone else that UFO has succeded in bringing to us an overunity device.

But wether it is UFO,you or myself that has a device that is overunity,we had better be able to back up our claim's-even more so when people are paying hard earned cash based on your word.
Hello @Tin, in this forum most us researchers know pretty well the work here is at an R&D level. UFOPOLITICS has asked no one to buy anything. It is our desire to follow UFOPOLITICS Asymmetric-Electrodynamic-Machines R&D. The word KIT here was just to consolidate parts together for us experienced researchers. Please understand, we pretty well know what we are doing and the word kit here does not imply some kind of KIDS RadioShack Kit for the hobbyists. Talking about hard earned money? Yes I have happily spent every penny since the knowledge gained is taking my understanding beyond heights I have never imagined. These machines also tap into the energy of the vacuum (on going R&D). By the way talking about money wasted, I do not drink or smoke which means money saved. Yes I too have been working on other free energy projects but this one is unique. In my life, I have been a professional physicist and materials scientist but here just a humble apprentice under UFOPOLITICS just same as some other members here. I hope you get the picture. Please have patience, wait and see how things unfold. Let UFOPOLITICS concentrate on his work. This is scientific R&D and NOT some magician's magic show for the evening.
Warmest regards
lightworker
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Old 12-16-2012, 08:44 AM
Tinmanpower Tinmanpower is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lightworker1 View Post
Hello @Tin, in this forum most us researchers know pretty well the work here is at an R&D level. UFOPOLITICS has asked no one to buy anything. It is our desire to follow UFOPOLITICS Asymmetric-Electrodynamic-Machines R&D. The word KIT here was just to consolidate parts together for us experienced researchers. Please understand, we pretty well know what we are doing and the word kit here does not imply some kind of KIDS RadioShack Kit for the hobbyists. Talking about hard earned money? Yes I have happily spent every penny since the knowledge gained is taking my understanding beyond heights I have never imagined. These machines also tap into the energy of the vacuum (on going R&D). By the way talking about money wasted, I do not drink or smoke which means money saved. Yes I too have been working on other free energy projects but this one is unique. In my life, I have been a professional physicist and materials scientist but here just a humble apprentice under UFOPOLITICS just same as some other members here. I hope you get the picture. Please have patience, wait and see how things unfold. Let UFOPOLITICS concentrate on his work. This is scientific R&D and NOT some magician's magic show for the evening.
Warmest regards
lightworker
Well i do think that UFO is entitled to a little something for all the work and development he has done.So if he make's a little extra change on kit's-it was well earned.
I think a good couple of days off for UFO has been well earn'd.
Maybe he set the deadline(12/12/12)to soon?,and applied way to much preasure on him self.

So now we all will wait and see what he has-when he is ready to show it.
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Old 12-16-2012, 10:08 AM
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Cornboy 555 Cornboy 555 is online now
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Thanks . Not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tinmanpower View Post
Well i do think that UFO is entitled to a little something for all the work and development he has done.So if he make's a little extra change on kit's-it was well earned.
I think a good couple of days off for UFO has been well earn'd.
Maybe he set the deadline(12/12/12)to soon?,and applied way to much preasure on him self.

So now we all will wait and see what he has-when he is ready to show it.



Well Thanks Tinny, you are so kind hearted.

Best regards,

Cornboy,
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:17 PM
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Sorry but I can't let this go

Quote:
No-no, thank you, it's empty talk, I already said what I wanted to say, and your followers very upset about it, even mumbling something about booting of some sort; like i care

I built your motor, 5 poles one, the same wire, it works worse than original;
I've made a sketch here how modern motors winded, it has nothing to do with what you drew;

And you can follow lines on Alexander's motor and see similarity, it does not matter where you draw the brushes, even on side, it's the same approach;

And what pissed me off most, that your followers know it already (new comes but they're not in the picture yet), and so quiet now.

But anyway, I wish you luck with this project (of course I might be wrong), promise do not disturb you anymore.
Over and out.
an't let this go, it really bothers me,
I want to see your motor, you made a claim.


Quote:
And what pissed me off most, that your followers know it already
I feel like you called me out and made another claim, where i come from, those are fighting words. you built a 10 dollar toy motor, you say, It didn't give you what you hoped, and your pissed at me. Promt, if your pissed cause you wasted 10 bucks, you need to stop playing on the internet and get a job, you poor lazy, whatever. But, I never told you, nor any followers here, to do anything. I've posted everything i've done.
I think you need to apoligize to me, or i will be picking a fight with you until the end of days.

Quote:
promise do not disturb you anymore.
Your word means nothing, you speak with forked tongue.

@ Tinman,

Quote:
So if he make's a little extra change on kit's-it was well earned.
I helped set this up, the kit. I am making no money, nor UFO. Please stop talking loose, or I'll start on you. I wouldn't mind seeing your vid, that defies Ohm's law, by the way.
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Old 12-16-2012, 01:24 PM
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Someone stated Overunity. This is not overunity. Its just more efficient and consuming less power.
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Old 12-16-2012, 01:40 PM
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No S*** Sherlock?

Actually, that hasn't been proved yet, either. Unless you've taken some measurements and havn't posted yet, like others, who know.
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Old 12-16-2012, 02:06 PM
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Hello Cornboy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cornboy 555 View Post




Hello UFO, glad you decided to step back a bit, please take your time, a thing called Life will always keep you grounded.

Please friend when you have some spare time, i have a couple of questions.

On the MAG3 above just following one pair of coils through rotation, (understanding all the pairs of coils that have preceded, and are following waiting in line, and also that three coil pairs are being energised at once 120 apart).

Taking P1 is in repulsion mode from N1 and S1,when energised, rotating clockwise, when imput brush breaks contact after approx 14 deegres of rotation, BS1 would then change polarity to N and be attracted to S1 and be repelled from N2 well before the 60 deegres travel needed to be repelled again.

Sorry UFO, but am i missing something, i can't seem to get my head around it.

Of course, i am looking at this with PM stators, and will be using pulsed electromagnet stators, with the pulse being directly coupled to rotor shaft for timing. (post on your other thread)

Any light you can shed for me would be greatly appreciated, as in first stages i need to understand correctly.

Many Thanks Friend.

Cornboy.
Hello Cornboy,

Your analysis of P1 is correct, however, you are not considering correctly some facts:

1-Sweep Angle NOT Point.

The sweeping angle from brush/element contact gets amplified at outer radius (concept of Arcs within same Angle at different Radius) where Bisectors are, meaning, it is NOT just one point of interaction (repulsion-attract) but a whole angle.

The Magnetic Polarity shifting does not occurs like a switch either, but it is a gradual change where the original generated magnetic field predominates even after it has been disconnected.

So here you must have clear a main fact, BN1 have a whole area that is being repelled by N1 from its stator bisector (not just a point),as also occurs at BS1 to S1 Bisector. This travel range normally ends when BN1 meets S1 Bisector, as it works same for BS1 traveling towards N2 Bisector...This is what I call the "Throw Out Forces"...and they are predominant over the natural shifting of magnetism after disconnection.

2-Ignoring Pre and Post Coils in Play

You are following P1 single behavior-performance but not looking at what is happening with the Pre and Post Pairs related to the one you are observing/analyzing...that fact gets you lost...Remember this is a continuous sequence, therefore MUST consider who is behind and who is ahead...and what is their performance.
P1 is followed by P36 (right after P1 gets disconnected), then here you have to consider which one is stronger and dominating, P1 or P36?...of course it is P36, getting energized directly from source...while P1 is in "decay mode", that means weaker....therefore, P36 practically pushes P1.
P2 has been disconnected longer than P1... therefore, it is ahead in the process of shifting magnetic poles related to time and further positioning related to following stators...so it will be assisting P1 in the "after shift" processes of attract-repel.

The rest you have it right and clear...that this same process occurs at the other angles 120 apart.

Now, off this explanation, but related to MAG3, I received an email from a Member here, very interesting, and I believe it could be carefully observed if it will work on our benefit or not...I believe it will, but only the real testing will tell Us...

He was suggesting to consider "GROUPS OF THREE" instead of Isolated Pairs...Spaced apart at 120...meaning that P1,P13 and P25 be One Connected Group, either in series or parallel between them...whichever would be more convenient depending on our application....Parallel connect will have more advantage from the Motoring side, more Impact Power...and Series would favor the Generation side...will add resistance that would lower the Amperage...also beneficiary for Motor Consumption...less Magnetic Impact though...

So it will be [G1 (P1+P13+P25)], [G2 (P2+P14+P26)], [G3 (P3+P15+P27)]....so on to last one...or G12* (P12+P24+P36) Closing the loop...
*Twelve Total Groups containing Three Pairs, on a total of 36 Pairs/72 Coils...(I particularly like the Mathematical Distribution here)

It could be done and very Interesting Uh?

In your Model to be made, you could add like a fiberglass board type between commutators and coils, so all terminals gather there, numbered, and the connections would be easier to be wired in the different ways to see advantages of each at lab test time...

Now, for the pulsed stators you have to realize you will be consuming more energy to power those six stator coils (requirement of very strong/robust pulsing FET's, plus a good capacity from source batteries)...but the pulsing would be more synchronized and stronger, as you will also get massive Radiant back at the off times from Stator Coils.


Regards


Ufopolitics
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  #3030  
Old 12-16-2012, 03:45 PM
zapzap zapzap is offline
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Goal setting...

To All: An aggressive goal was self-set and in spite of various challenges, was in large part achieved. What is happening here is this, the doers here are aware that in the real world, human set deadlines like the one set by U.P. are not written in stone and the fact that the unit was up and running but not optimized was no big deal to most of us. Over Unity stated but not proved yet? Most of us are patiently waiting, some acquiring parts, etc. I have seen only one over unity device here that was self-looped and ran (for over a week until intentionally "turned off"). Anybody here remember Bizzy? Remember how long it took for him to optimize his device? I don't recall anyone complaining - or replicating. You know why? If I recall, right or wrong, Bizzy intentionally chose not to open source all of his information.

Then you have the... others. The type that apparently haven't noticed that it takes a 10 - 13 h.p. gasoline motor to drive (under load) a generator of that size at required rpm. Hello? No one here is asking you all for anything other than patience; the stated goal of useful O.U. is already tantalizing close. Consider that, for those of you that have little or no real world experience, a partially filled "portable" gasoline generator (without a battery and starter) weighs in at roughly 200 lbs! Here the prime mover, generator, and coupling's total weight is roughly 100 lbs. Add a wheeled frame, batteries, electrical components and NO GAS TANK! A 6 gallon tank filled with fuel weighs about 40 lbs. The initial cost? At current non mass produced mode, not much more than a mass produced quality gas generator of similar specs.

So in spite of U.Ps magnanimous take on what some of you consider his failure, a small reminder: while youre pointing a finger at him for his shortcomings (actually, remarkable achievements), your 3 other fingers are pointing back at you!

Partial quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ufopolitics View Post
Hello to All, First I want to say that all this discussions, arguments and noises here are all MY FAULT/Mea Culpa...Ladies and Gentlemen...

So please do not blame the skeptics, or anyone else who is against this wrong testing...they are completely right to have doubts and disbelief...and heavily criticize the tests as Myself... Regards to all Ufopolitics
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