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  #1  
Old 04-30-2012, 02:35 AM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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Awarded machine multiply force from a motor (free energy)

A Peruvian Ingenier, have invent a machine that can multiply force from a motor and got geneva international patent award

This Invention is great cause it have been verified by swiss convention on patents, and got an award, his inventor says it can resolve energy problems

A Peruvian blind creates a system capable of “move a boat with the engine of a car”

The info is all over sudameric media, I am from Paraguay.
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Last edited by Apolopy; 04-30-2012 at 02:37 AM. Reason: Add pic
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:49 AM
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patent info

There is only the abstract - any full patent or app somewhere?





Bibliographic data: PE05342011 (A1) ― 2011-07-16


SISTEMA MULTIPLICADOR DE FUERZA


Page bookmark PE05342011 (A1) - SISTEMA MULTIPLICADOR DE FUERZA Inventor(s): RAMOS SOLANO FERNANDO SIXTO [PE] + Applicant(s): SIXTO RAMOS GRANADOS S A C [PE] + Classification: - international: F16H1/22 - European:
Application number: PE20100048920 20100805 Priority number(s): PE20100048920 20100805
Abstract of PE05342011 (A1)



Translate this text into Tooltip




QUE COMPRENDE DOS DISCOS PARALELOS UNIDOS POR UN EJE, EN EL INTERMEDIO DE ESOS DISCOS HAY UN RODAJE QUE PRESENTA UNA EXTRINCIDAD, EN LA PROLONGACION DE LOS EJES TIENEN COLOCADOS DOS RODAJES AXIALES UNIDOS POR UN SOPORTE, A SU VEZ ESTA CONECTADO POR LA FUNDA DEL RODAJE INTERIOR A UNA PIEZA IGUAL Y SIMETRICA A UNA DISTANCIA CONVENIENTE


-------


Abstract PE05342011

SIDE RECORDS COMPRISING TWO STATES FOR A SHAFT IN THE MIDDLE OF THOSE RECORDS THAT THERE IS A BREAK EXTRINCIDAD INTRODUCES AT THE EXTENSION OF THE AXES ARE PLACED TWO SHOOTING AXIAL SUPPORT BY STATES, IN TURN IS CONNECTED BY SHOOTING COVER INSIDE AN EQUAL AND SYMMETRICAL PART A CONVENIENT DISTANCE
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:57 AM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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No Aaron, actualy you fund more information than me, here in sudameric contrys is a great news and all big newspapers are covering the invention but we do not have details, maybe someone living in peru can help us.
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:51 AM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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A new video

Here a new video shows the machine working, and the inventor talking.

Conozca a Sixto Ramos, el peruano que inventó el Sistema Multiplicador de Fuerza - YouTube

At the end of the interview, the jurnalist ask him : which rule you use to creat this machine?

And he answer: the free fall of the bodys, two bodys that change the center of gravity, falls.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:45 PM
Peter Lindemann Peter Lindemann is offline
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Display at a Convention

Hi Folks,

The "Salon International des Inventions de Genève" is nothing more than a Convention for inventors to display their inventions. Inventors purchase booth space to show their work in the hope that some company will buy or license it. The "Diplome" is the equivalent of a "CERTIFICATE" of Merit and does not represent a Patent or anything of the sort.

So, the publicity around this is experiencing some difficulty in translating into English.

That said, The "Mechanical Amplifier" or "Force Multiplier" is an idea I have been working on for a long time and I consider it one of the MOST IMPORTANT ideas that can be explored. Jim Murray demonstrated a mechanical power doubler in the 1990's using "changing rotational references", which seems to be related to the bad translations we are getting about this new system

If this current device works as claimed, it is extremely important. Anything we can find out about how this invention works, including better films of it operating, a better translation of the Patent Abstract, or even diagrams of the mechanism could be very useful to broaden our understanding of the working principles.

Peter
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Old 04-30-2012, 03:30 PM
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Michael John Nunnerley Michael John Nunnerley is offline
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How this is set up

Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Lindemann View Post
Hi Folks,

The "Salon International des Inventions de Genève" is nothing more than a Convention for inventors to display their inventions. Inventors purchase booth space to show their work in the hope that some company will buy or license it. The "Diplome" is the equivalent of a "CERTIFICATE" of Merit and does not represent a Patent or anything of the sort.

So, the publicity around this is experiencing some difficulty in translating into English.

That said, The "Mechanical Amplifier" or "Force Multiplier" is an idea I have been working on for a long time and I consider it one of the MOST IMPORTANT ideas that can be explored. Jim Murray demonstrated a mechanical power doubler in the 1990's using "changing rotational references", which seems to be related to the bad translations we are getting about this new system

If this current device works as claimed, it is extremely important. Anything we can find out about how this invention works, including better films of it operating, a better translation of the Patent Abstract, or even diagrams of the mechanism could be very useful to broaden our understanding of the working principles.

Peter
Hi Peter and All

I have broken down how this is set up, as many know I speak Spanish, but that apart i will try and explain what it is made of.

There are two crank shafts in parallel, a connecting bar is connected 180 degrees out of phase "this is difficult to get exactly right and can be seen in the video by the jerking when running". The two pullies are different in size and as connected are increasing revolutions "gearing up", normally you would get a power loss for that increase in revolutions, but in this case I do not think so. Above the center line of the first crank bearing is another bar at 90 degrees and this has a weight on the top of it and when running "as can be seen" creates an oscillation, this oscillation can be seen as "in an electrical circuit" a flyback. The two crank shafts move in oposite directions due to the 180 degree phase shift. On the ends of the crank shafts there are fly wheels which help to smooth out any possible out of phase of the two shafts "like a smoothing cap".

The gain comes from the gearing up "higher rev's" without a drop in POWER, that drop in power "normally" seen is counteracted by the "flyback" oscillation produced by the 90 degree weight above the first bearing. That oscillation is produced by the 180 degree phase shift causing rotation in two directions of the two crank shafts.

By changing the height of the crank I think more power can be achieved "speculation by me" and so gearing up higher also can be achieved. The oscillation in the system gains power from gravitational pull as it falls either side and aids the rotational movement of the crank shafts.

By using very low friction bearings the system would be improved a lot.

My two cents worth as I see it from what is available.

Mike
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Old 04-30-2012, 03:55 PM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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Better translation of the Abstrac

Peter and friends:

Here there is a better human translation of the Abstrac;

"That involves two paralel discs united by a shaft, in the middle of those discs there is a bearing that shows Eccentricity, in the prolongation of the shafts there are two axial bearings united by a support, and conected by de cover of the internal bearing to a equal piece and simetric to a convinient distance."

Here there is the translated page of the anual inventions contest in Peru, which Mr. Fernando won with his "Multiplier force system", this prize give him the opportunity to show his work at Geneva.

The most important part is that the Peruvian Contest is a goverment act, so his invention was verified by goverment engineers.

in an interview he says that they check his invention by conecting a 1 hp electric motor, to a 17 hp generator, and worked fine.

I consider that if a goverment give the number one award to this person by the verification of his claims this could be a very serius thing.

I have not found schematics, and i believe that someone living in Peru is our only chance to get more info.


Resultados de traducción para http://www.concursodeinvenciones.pe/
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:34 PM
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Drawing

Attachment 10938

This is a quick drawing, missing are the other two fly wheels

Mike
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Old 04-30-2012, 04:57 PM
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Looks like it has some similarity to the Chas Campbell system (as seen in P.J. Kelly's Free Energy guide) and a couple others I've read about.

This is translated from the web site listed in the video above:
"If we were to summarize in one sentence at Don Sixto, we can say that disability does not mean inability. He has lost his sight but did not stop to invent a Force Multiplier System is capable of moving a boat with a car engine.

By Marco Cabrera
@ Markitocabrera

Sixto Ramos Fernando Solano is the father of eleven children and with the support of his family fulfilled a dream that began in the classrooms of the School of Engineering: Saving energy through the application of an external force.

"It's a system out of range. I used the gravity, mass and length of the distance. This multiplication of force will lower the cost of energy is very useful in the automotive field, in aviation and also be used in hydroelectric power plants and mines, "refers Fernando Sisto.

In this struggle to reach the goal he lost his sight. I used to weld without any protection. This bad practice will destroy the optic nerve leaving him almost blind, as you can only see shadows and some colors.

Also, his brother, the economic mainstay of Ramos, brain cancer was diagnosed. All the money that was meant for the company had to spend to cover the costs of the disease.

"I once offered to create a plant for the production of cocaine in the jungle, you can imagine what they would pay us but we told them not because we are a family of principles," said Hilda Paz, wife of Sixtus.

He overcame adversity

Despite the obstacles, the former student of Don Bosco Salesian school of Callao could invent Force Multiplier System. In December last year won the 10th contest organized by Indecopi Inventions. He passed all tests.

However, this organism defense of intellectual property does not have much appreciation, it is not giving facilities to patent his invention and start generating profit in the company. Without the patent can not sell your System.

"We went to Indecopi and told us that the process of obtaining the patent takes five years. We can not wait that long because we need the money to keep working and keep our own, "says Ramos.

Heading to Switzerland

The World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO) has invited him to participate in the International Exhibition of Inventions, to be held in Geneva, Switzerland from 18 to 22 April this year.

Sixto travel with his son William, who will help to mobilize. WIPO will not bear the cost of the inventor, so the Ramos family is making strenuous efforts to raise money. They also need the Swiss Card (cost $ 65), a kind of insurance required for entry to the European country.

Savings Accounts

If you are interested in collaborating with Don Sixto, you can deposit in the following savings accounts BBVA Banco Continental.

Sol: 0011-0193-0200241461-09.
In dollars: 0011-0193-0200241418-02.

Phone: 995559464."
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:58 PM
Peter Lindemann Peter Lindemann is offline
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Your Thoughts?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael John Nunnerley View Post
Attachment 10938

This is a quick drawing, missing are the other two fly wheels

Mike
Mike,

Thanks for the drawing. From the films, I can see it is possible that what you have drawn is the basis of the machine. The movement seems right. My question would be: Is that all there is to it? If so, why does this simple process produce a force multiplication?

I assume that the simple reverse crank connection between the two shafts cannot produce any benefits that would not show up if we used a simple forward crank arrangement. If this is correct, then the "secret" of the system must lie in the unusual movements of the weight up on the rod, or some other mechanism that is not visible in the films. After all, why would moving the weight in these ways not take the same amount of energy from the prime mover as is recovered? For every motion where the weight is falling in the gravitational field, there is an equal and opposite movement where the weight must be lifted.

What could possibly be happening to produce a gain large enough for a 1HP electric motor to power a 17HP electric generator?

Clearly, the films we have seen do not run the unit up to operating speeds. Nor do they show metered test results with the generator powering a load. So, we are really only at the beginning of gathering information about the system. So far, there is no visible evidence that the machine does what is claimed.

IF this thing works, I predict that the mechanism has features to it that your drawing does not show, besides two missing flywheels.

Peter
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:20 PM
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Looks like another mechanical exploration of parametric oscillator. Like pendulum with modulated arm length changing gravity center at correct moment.
I think I heard it first from Tom Bearden and then many other found it too. There is no law of conservation of force or work, the same for momentum change in time with proper synchronization. All clasic book examples improperly assume from start that mass,centrifugal force,center of mass are not variable in time.
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:27 PM
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Peter, I need more time to think about it but the movement of that weight is interesting, think of mapping the top movement through one cycle.

I can't see any other thing except the relation of fly wheel sizes coming into the equation somehow!!!

This brings me back to what we were doing with the perpetual wheel!!!!

Mike
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:08 PM
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Pe05342011 / Pe20100048920

The application # is:

Application number: PE20100048920 20100805 Priority number(s): PE20100048920 20100805

--------------------------

So this is not a patent # but a "certificate"?

PE05342011 (A1) ― 2011-07-16



Espacenet - Bibliographic data
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Old 04-30-2012, 08:14 PM
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Fernando Sixto Ramos

http://feelthevibe.com/free_energy/f...sixtoramos.pdf

http://feelthevibe.com/free_energy/f...sixtoramos.doc

That is a pdf - most I compiled last night of pics from different articles, etc... youtube links - whatever. Couldn't make links in pdf clickable so there is a .doc also.
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Old 05-01-2012, 01:45 AM
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I have some questions I think are valid. We all know we can increase power
while energy remains the same. Just connecting a 17 HP generator to a 1 HP
motor means little. I can spin a 28 kilo watt motor by hand, not very fast but
it doesn't require much force to accelerate the rotor.

Is the output power drawn from the generator more than the input power in real time ?

Does it do more load work than the work that drives it ?

I don't see any measurements actually shown. What is the load on the generator ?

Won't the violently shaking weight shake the setup to pieces or at the very
least destroy the bearings at an accelerated rate ?

He says "able to move a boat with a car engine", a very ambiguous
statement. What does it mean ? I can move a boat with a paddle.
People use car engines to power boats all the time, it's common practice for
recreational boats, But for ocean going vessels marine engineered power
plants are advisable for reliability.

A 1.5 kW load on the generator would be good to see. The generator has no
load that I can see. except a meter. I wouldn't like to get hit in the head by
that weight either but that's beside the point.

I'm very skeptical about this. It doesn't add up. Could be it a just media beat up ?

I always get skeptical when long lists of possible benefits are listed before any
real load down tests or stress tests are shown.

Cheers
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Old 05-01-2012, 02:37 AM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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Comments

Friends:

The reason because I post this is that, the man got the first prize for his invention in an official goverment contest in Peru, that means that it was check, and cause he present himself in front of the market in swiss, none of this could be done so easy if this was a hoax.

In Sudameric the way information is available is much less that in english speaking contrys or Europe.

And is so often that here you can find inventors that have no money at all.

So poverty and lack of info is every day coin here.

In other circunstanse I would never post this, but I repeat, his goverment awarded his claims, up in the posts you can see the translated web site of the contest he won, and by the media (also in english) en Diploma from the invention exposition.

And also I thing that only with someone in Peru we can find the complete truth about this.
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Old 05-01-2012, 04:16 AM
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I found the idea that a "wiggly weight" could increase torque interesting. However it is hard to visualize just what that weight is going aside from causing the entire unit to shake violently. So I made up a simple model to observe the movement of the weight, the path it takes is not what you might expect.

I noted the purpose of the flywheel on the output was to allow the crank to get past dead center. I then though what if the flywheels could be eliminated by adding a second set of cranks and connecting rod but 90 degree offset from the first one. That way one would always be in the center of its “power stroke” when the other was at dead center.

This seemed like a good idea but it totally locked up the system and it would not turn.
The reason for this is that the output does not turn at a constant speed. For each revolution the speed of the output will increase and then decrease in relation to the input while maintaining a 1:1 ratio between them.

This oscillation will undoubtedly put an undesirable strain on whatever is being driven.
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Old 05-01-2012, 04:37 AM
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Hi Mad Scientist, Do you think it does increase power for part of the cycle and
reduce for another part ? Like magnifying the power or concentrating it ?

Because that was my impression as well, I just couldn't tell how by the video.

Maybe the power is increased but also reduced. So the total energy of the system
remains the same including losses over time. 1=1

Not sure where I heard this but I think when we jump in the air it moves both
the jumper and the Earth, the Earth only moves a minute amount. Makes sense.

Oh well maybe it has it's uses.

Cheers
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Old 05-01-2012, 01:34 PM
Mad Scientist Mad Scientist is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmhand View Post
Do you think it does increase power for part of the cycle and
reduce for another part ? Like magnifying the power or concentrating it ?

Maybe the power is increased but also reduced. So the total energy of the system
remains the same including losses over time. 1=1

Oh well maybe it has it's uses.

Cheers
That would be my guess although I did not try to prove it. My goal was to first observe its actual movement and then go from there.
But upon finding these oscillation unless your intention is to build a mechanical oscillator I don't see any value in this. As over time these oscillation will probably cause it or what it is driving to self destruct.
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Old 05-03-2012, 12:39 PM
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Variant of the Milkovic 2 stage pendulum?

See the ltseung888 bench on the Milkovic 2-stage pendulum improvement.
United Nations Seminar/Workshop


In particular, look at the design page of the attached xls file.

This device is more clever. But gravitational energy was led-out in both cases.

The new proposed design with two unbalanced wheels at the ends of the lever may be even simpler and better.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Peru force multiplier.jpg (88.8 KB, 214 views)
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Old 05-24-2012, 05:00 AM
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Any More News

Quote:
Originally Posted by Apolopy View Post
Friends:

The reason because I post this is that, the man got the first prize for his invention in an official goverment contest in Peru, that means that it was check, and cause he present himself in front of the market in swiss, none of this could be done so easy if this was a hoax.

In Sudameric the way information is available is much less that in english speaking contrys or Europe.

And is so often that here you can find inventors that have no money at all.

So poverty and lack of info is every day coin here.

In other circunstanse I would never post this, but I repeat, his goverment awarded his claims, up in the posts you can see the translated web site of the contest he won, and by the media (also in english) en Diploma from the invention exposition.

And also I thing that only with someone in Peru we can find the complete truth about this.
Dear Apolopy,

Anymore news of this invention? I remain extremely interested in this technology and if possible, would like to know how it works!

Peter
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Old 06-01-2012, 12:48 AM
Apolopy Apolopy is offline
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News on the Peruvian Invention

Apriciate Peter and Friends:

The only, but intresting info that I have is this link

CONSULTAS PUBLICAS DE EXPEDIENTES - INDECOPI

it shows the path that the patent aplication has follow in the Patent ofice in Peru (INDECOPI), in the last record just 30 may 2012 it say "Resolution" "Granted" in spanish of corse, this 99% confirms that ther have granted the patent to Fernando Sixto, and in some point it have to appear in international index, I hope so.


Peter, only some one in Peru can give us more data.


Apolopy
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Old 06-01-2012, 01:22 AM
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Hi all,

Other information:
http://www.cacharreo.com.es/foro/dow...=147&mode=view

In a TV interview said that since the institution (Indecopi) were to expedite processing of the patent. Seems that this has been.

Some extra info in Spanish:
Cacharreo • Ver Tema - Sixto Ramos inventa un Sistema Multiplicador de Fuerza

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Old 06-01-2012, 02:11 PM
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invention

Hi all!!

I will try to find something in Spanish since I am from Uruguay and my nature language is Spanish.

at the end of the video the man answers the question of how does it work and he said: "The free fall of the bodies, all bodies that change their gravity center... fall"

about the car engine running a boat he said that, "a car engine can run a truck, and a truck engine can run a boat".

He also said that he can apply his force multiplier with another one in series to multiply even more the force.

I will see if I can get something more.

best,

Alvaro H
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Old 06-06-2012, 04:04 PM
MarioSandez MarioSandez is offline
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Power cannot be increased

Hi! Best wishes to all. Whatever you do, you cannot increase power indefinitely, because power ist rate of energy in time. You can, as in an electrical condensor, store some energy and deliver it faster than it was originally received. But when the condensor is empty, the proccess stops and in the end the total amount of energy received by the condensor equals the energy delivered by the condensor (in an imaginary perfect condensor).
It is claimed everywhere that this device will solve the energy problems multiplicating energy, but that cannot be done. There is an Energy conservation law that cannot be avoided. You can multiply force, yes, it is well known since Aristotle and before that simple levers do that, or if you will gears, but energy and power (that is flow of energy) cannot be multiplied.

For more details you can send me a message to my e-mail

All the best to you all
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Old 06-06-2012, 05:10 PM
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no conservation of energy

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarioSandez View Post
Hi! Best wishes to all. Whatever you do, you cannot increase power indefinitely, because power ist rate of energy in time. You can, as in an electrical condensor, store some energy and deliver it faster than it was originally received. But when the condensor is empty, the proccess stops and in the end the total amount of energy received by the condensor equals the energy delivered by the condensor (in an imaginary perfect condensor).
It is claimed everywhere that this device will solve the energy problems multiplicating energy, but that cannot be done. There is an Energy conservation law that cannot be avoided. You can multiply force, yes, it is well known since Aristotle and before that simple levers do that, or if you will gears, but energy and power (that is flow of energy) cannot be multiplied.

For more details you can send me a message to my e-mail

All the best to you all
There is no such thing as conservation of energy.

Second, you say power is rate of energy in time but it is not. Power is energy dissipated divided by time so you take the time out of it to see what the power is. If you have 1 watt second or 1 joule over 1 second, that is the real energy dissipated. If you take 1 watt second and divide it by 1 second, you have 1 watt. 1 watt by itself is POWER - there is no time in a power reading so your statement that power is energy in time is incorrect.

Yes, energy and not just power CAN be multiplied by using environmental input (gravity for example) as a source of potential that can do work on each successive cycle. The free input from the environment delays the time the system comes into equilibrium so that the amount of ENERGY dissipated by our own input is MULTIPLIED bit by bit by bit.

It is not more out than in. It is more out that we put in - obviously implying there is other free input from somewhere else.
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Old 06-06-2012, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
There is no such thing as conservation of energy.

Second, you say power is rate of energy in time but it is not. Power is energy dissipated divided by time so you take the time out of it to see what the power is. If you have 1 watt second or 1 joule over 1 second, that is the real energy dissipated. If you take 1 watt second and divide it by 1 second, you have 1 watt. 1 watt by itself is POWER - there is no time in a power reading so your statement that power is energy in time is incorrect.

Yes, energy and not just power CAN be multiplied by using environmental input (gravity for example) as a source of potential that can do work on each successive cycle. The free input from the environment delays the time the system comes into equilibrium so that the amount of ENERGY dissipated by our own input is MULTIPLIED bit by bit by bit.

It is not more out than in. It is more out that we put in - obviously implying there is other free input from somewhere else.
That's not multiplying the energy, that is just adding more. If you enable the
environment to input energy to your device then that input energy is a result
of your actions and therefore it's your input, just like with a solar panel. It's
all just word soup. But the reality is.

An amount of energy in itself cannot be increased or multiplied.

If you want more energy then you need to make more energy available.

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  #28  
Old 06-06-2012, 11:11 PM
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Hi all

The inventor speaks of "multiply forces" without losing speed, is supposed to be an engineer, It may be a way to talk to who understands people, or he speaks about various forces in conjunction.
He says he can multiply Nx20, and again Nx20. One 1 hp engine becomes a 20 hp.

His wife speaks of energy production.


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  #29  
Old 06-07-2012, 04:37 AM
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multiplying energy

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmhand View Post
That's not multiplying the energy, that is just adding more. If you enable the
environment to input energy to your device then that input energy is a result
of your actions and therefore it's your input, just like with a solar panel. It's
all just word soup. But the reality is.

An amount of energy in itself cannot be increased or multiplied.

If you want more energy then you need to make more energy available.

When total ENERGY DISSIPATED is increasing above and beyond the energy dissipated that you had to put into the system, you are INCREASING the amount of energy dissipated in the system, which is multiplying the amount of energy you had to dissipate in the system to get it leveraging free potential from the environment.

I'm not engaging in semantics - these are simple facts.

The bottom line is we have input and output in a system and it is irrelevant whether or not some of the input comes from the environment when we calculate what WE put in compared to total energy dissipated in the system.

If we have COP 5.0, then we have multiplied the amount of energy dissipated WE put into the system 5 times. This isn't semantics, this is a fact. Our input X (times) 5 = cop 5.0. That is multiplication.

That is the entire point to an open dissipative system - we dissipate energy into it by supplying potential that reduces by moving to a lower potential difference encountering resistance on the way and we are leveraging free environmental potential that can do more WORK OVER TIME by establishing new potential differences over and over, which is real energy dissipated and that is multiplying energy done in the system.

It is impossible to "add more energy" as you mention - you can only add more potential by establishing potential differences within the system, which will then become energetic when it (potential) is dissipated by moving from a high potential to a lower potential through whatever mechanism the system is designed for.

You are using energy as a noun, when in fact there is no such THING as energy - energy is the word to describe the dissipation of potential, which is an ACTION - that isn't a thing, that is a verb. The only noun in energy and potential is potential as potential is what is actually a "tangible" thing even though conventionally, potential is described as the intangible concept, which of course is a fallacy. The word energy is misleading because it is always used as a thing but dissipation of potential is an activity and not a thing.

The aether, virtual photons, gravitational potential, neutrinos, quantum flux, whatever you want to call it, that is the SOURCE of potential and that potential is the source of work and work over time only happens when it (potential) dissipates.

So we aren't enabling the environment to input more energy, we enable the environment to input more POTENTIAL (from the separation of potential differences), which can then become energetic (work over time) and therefore, we are absolutely increasing or multiplying the total amount of real ENERGY DISSIPATED compared to what we put in.

Not only can we have power gains, which is simply doing x work in less time (impulse), we also have energy gains. Just add up the energy dissipated (which has a time component to it). That is the whole point to a COP measurement, it isn't a power increase measurement, COP is an absolute direct indication of ENERGY DISSIPATED compared to what we put in - that is a fact intrinsic within the very existence of over 1.0 COP to begin with.

If there is no energy increase, then there is no such thing as over 1.0 COP.

So my refrigerator operating at a COP of about 2.5 is a direct measurement showing that the energy dissipated from the wall (watt hours - work x time) is being MULTIPLIED 2.5 times when you look at how much real Energy Dissipation is happening in that system as a whole. Energy in the system has MULTIPLIED.

You say to have more energy you have to make more available. What do you think happens each time a system "regauges" itself. You're establishing a new potential difference where potential comes in and this is what makes more "energy" available when that newly input potential starts to move to another potential through various resistances. That is how every non-equilibrium system works.

Look at Veljko's oscillator. Look at energy dissipated to lift the pendulum. Then calculate total energy dissipated just int he big hammer alone each time it goes up to each height, with each successive lift decreasing if you lift the pendulum just once. The calculated amount of energy dissipated in just the big hammer alone is multiplied above the energy dissipated by lifting the pendulum once - that is directly multiplying the input energy dissipated on the input. And that doesn't even include energy dissipated on the pivot, losses when it strikes the "anvil" and it doesn't even include further work done on the pendulum after the initial lift.

Every single over 1.0 COP system is multiplying energy in the system - it is the entire point.
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  #30  
Old 06-07-2012, 04:45 AM
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increase force but also energy if over 1.0 cop

Quote:
Originally Posted by torpex View Post
The inventor speaks of "multiply forces"
We can increase forces in a system but if it is over 1.0 cop, we also multiply the energy in the system, which is the entire premise of what COP over 1.0 means.

It (over 1.0 COP) is a measurement of joules X time and if the total amount of work over time (energy dissipated) is more than what was input, there is a multiplication of energy. And of course COP doesn't include REAL ENERGY DISSIPATED in losses, which is still further energy done in the system, just UNINTENDED (losses) work done.

It is possible to increase forces in a system and still be under 1.0 cop and in that case there is no multiplication of energy.

But if it is over 1.0 COP, energy is multiplied in the system - an ENERGY GAIN.
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