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**adam ant** · 08-29-2007, 02:40 PM

i worked in a paint company for about five years. did you know that there are semi conductive paints out there? you could order a specific resistance paint and coat your tubes with that... then all consistency problems would be fixed. you could know exactly what voltage/amp rating you would need according to the resistive properties of the paint.

they also have conductive inks, used in the brand new "printed circuit boards". the inks take the place of wire or solder, thus allowing smaller applications to be made. these inks would probably be a lot thinner than the paints i mentioned above.

-bryan

**Aaron** · 09-07-2007, 04:15 AM

white powder coating video

Here is short vid I shot on the white powder coating and its conductivity (or lack of).

YouTube - WFC White Powder Coating from Conditioning

**hydrocars** · 09-07-2007, 02:26 PM

heres my setup, the powder has small resistance when dry..

Attached Files

**opmeyer** · 09-17-2007, 03:06 PM

wow, you have a nice even coat of white.
I dont think we have much calcium in the water here in melb. I have run this cell for days (max 4 hours at a time) usually about 2 hours at atime. No white coating.

So I added some lime to the water. I added 3 teaspoons of it to my 700ml jar.

It raised the conductivity of the water imensly. I ran the cell on about 5 volts DC. for two 4 hours session and continuing, and the white coating has appeared finally, yet it is patchy. It does not wash off but I can rub it off with my fingernail.

Is that normal or should it be electro plated on and almost a part of the metal?

**opmeyer** · 09-17-2007, 03:08 PM

I have one more question about my tubes. I cut them with a hand held grinder so they are not all the same and do not have very clean cuts, I tried my best but could have done better. How important is the acuracy of the cutting of the tubes? I have been meaning to ask this for ages.

**Aaron** · 09-19-2007, 12:32 AM

pics

These are great pics Hydrocars! Looks thicker than mine.

Originally posted by hydrocars View Post

heres my setup, the powder has small resistance when dry..

**Aaron** · 09-19-2007, 12:35 AM

lime and tube tuning

Hi Opmeyer,

Yeah, the lime (calcium hydroxide) if that is what you're using will alllow quite a bit of amperage. Someone else used it and got a lot of blotchy white coating. I would imagine that adding very very small amounts spaced over more time for the conditioning 'might' make a more even coating.

There is a lot of talk about tube tuning but noone has brought forth anything solid in my opinion.

However, the closer all the inner/outer tube sets are to each other with a common pulsing circuit, everything will be synchronized in a more optimum way I believe. So when you hit the frequency where amps is the less, it will be more true for each tube setup instead of an average best for tubes at different sizes.

**opmeyer** · 09-19-2007, 01:52 PM

Using Calcium Additive in the water

Here are some pics of my blotchy white coating from adding Calcium Hydroxide to the water and running the cell for about 4, 3 hour runs.

**opmeyer** · 09-20-2007, 02:34 AM

How often do you change the water during conditioning?

Is it nessesary to change the water during conditioning? I imagine that the calcium in the water is depleted after a certain amount of running time. Should I be replacing the water every few hours as it begins to go orange?

**Aaron** · 09-20-2007, 07:35 AM

amps for conditioning?

Ok, I see what you mean by blotchy. Someone else said they got lumpy parts. You say you were using 5 volts. How many amps?

I changed the water when the iron oxide sludge floating on top of the water was pretty thick...not because it interfered with gas production but because I also thought that if it is calcium, then lets gets fresh batch.

**opmeyer** · 09-20-2007, 02:44 PM

Amps

The cell was running at about 5 VDC at about 5 Amps with 3 teaspoons of Calcium hydroxide straight of the bridge rectifier after the variac, no coils, no added capacitors. Then one of the pipes must have shorted or something because my Bridge rectifier burnt out.

Anyway now I am trying the conditioning with 12V and about 12 Amps. Using only calicum dietry supplement pills in the water crushed to form about 1 gram of powder that disolves in water. The contents of the pills are as follow.

per tablet.
Calcium Phosphate (calcium 210mg)570mg
Calcium hydrogen phosphate (calcium 140mg) 600mg
Cholecalciferol 2.5 ug

First I put in about 6 tablets in 8 L of tap water. the brand is blackmores and they are called bio calcium. Just changed the water now and added 2 tablets in 8L. Now 12V 7 Amps.

Most of the additives have remained undisolved at the bottom of the water container after days

**opmeyer** · 09-21-2007, 01:49 PM

Hard Water - vs - Soft Water

We have soft water in Australia. (melbourne) which apparently means that we do not have the same minerals as the 'hard water' in the US and Europe.

Thats why I have such trouble getting the white coating here. I will experminent with the additives meansioned above. Any suggestions welcome.

**dek** · 09-27-2007, 09:31 PM

The impedance of calcium oxide may be different at frequencies other than DC, so beware of simple multimeter conductivity tests.

A better test would be to measure the conductivity with the tubes submerged with and without the coating at many different frequencies (e.g. the transfer function).

It appears from the youtube video that the calcium oxide may be hydrophilic, which may be an essential property of a non-conductive coating.

The coating may also play a role in reducing bubble adhesion to the side of the tube.

It's easy to identify other types of coatings that are non conductive, but the majority of them are hydrophobic- some that come to mind are ScotchGard and parylene.

**Aaron** · 09-28-2007, 06:18 AM

calcium coating

Yes, this makes a lot of sense.

As far as bubble adhesion, I think that with the force of the gas production, it will never be an issue.

I have not tested conductivity in the water vs out of water.

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WFC Tube Insulation & White Powder Coating

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