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I remember reading and seeing videos that Brown (of Brown Gas=HHO Gas) said that the brown gas torch could change radio active materials into inert materials. If the situation gets so desperate in Japan's nuclear reactors could this be of help?
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I don’t know anything about that but I will say this. Pumping sea water into the reactor is not a good idea, as the water boils off the salt will be concentrated eventually forming a super saturated solution, eventually crystals will form insulating the fuel rods from the water causing a melt down.
It’s just like using hard water in an electric kettle, eventually the kettle element will become insulated and burn out only it will happen much faster in a reactor.
Maybe that is what caused the meltdowns.
I am not a chemist but could the sodium in the sea water react with other compounds causing problems?
I accept that they probably had no choice but to use sea water as they had run out of all other cooling options.
Consider potassium iodide. -
Yes, I've seen this claim too (about Brown's Gas being able to neutralize radioactivity)--I suspect that if they were to do it, they would never breathe a word of it to the general public.
I'd love to see the backup to this claim, though it seems that Mr. Wiseman (who I first heard of this claim from) isn't going to say anything more about it.
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Here is a bit more from a chemist about what could have caused the explosion:
YouTube - Nuclear Reactors in Japan - Periodic Table of VideosIt's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.Comment
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About the radioactivity, I think anyone with a hho torch can verify this by taking apart a smoke detector and remove its radioactive americium button. Then get a cheap geiger counter and measure the radioactivity. Then melt that button down and measure it again.It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.Comment
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Gustav Le Bon did an experiment in which he heated up radium to over 1000c and found that for about 28 days the radium stopped being radioactive.
Browns gas may do the same thing. It may not permanently stop something from being radioactive but temporarily cause it to stop emitting for a short period of time....
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Too late
Maybe, but by the time it gets desperate enough for them to consider it, there won't be anyone left to consider it.Think of a cartoon; a group of disheveled engineers flying through the air, atop a mushroom cloud.One of them is striking the side of his head, with the palm of his hand and saying "Doh, I coulda use Brown's gas!!!"
(As in coulda had a V-8!)
Not making light, just a little "Black humor". Look at it this way, I like to think of myself as open minded, I read everything on this forum with interest, and I'm not sure what I believe about Browns gas.These are engineers indoctrinated in thinking conventional wisdom, etc.It was real 'thinking outside the box' for them, to come up with using fire trucks and ocean water.Browns gas is 'just a bridge too far', I'm afraid! Good thought, tho.JimComment
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I read today that the earthquake moved the land mass, where the 6 reactors are located, 13 feet closer to the US. With that kind of movement, it is a wonder that there wasn't even more damage. Last I heard this evening, there are only 50 people left in the direct vicinity of the nuke plants attempting to control the situation, and they have been at it 24/7 for 4 days now. Surely they have each received well above the safe level of radiation exposure, and things are getting worse now with a fire breaking out in the spent fuel rods containment area of the #4 reactor this evening. Unless some miracle occurs very soon, it looks very likely that we will see multiple failures and meltdowns."Seek wisdom by keeping an open mind to alternative realities, questioning authority, and searching for truth. Only then, when you see or hear something that has 'the ring of truth' to it, will it be as if a veil has been lifted, and suddenly you will begin to hear and see far more clearly than ever before." - RickoffComment
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Grim
Just plain grim. I beleive the 50 that are left, know they are probably done for. Kind of a "put your head between your legs, and when you see the flash, kiss your ass goodbye!" The earthquake and the tsunami, thats mother nature, and she can be fierce, when pissed.But mother Nature didn't build those reactors, thats all humans, and Hubris. So sad,....JimComment
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I think that was the dilemna; no other options. As of late I have heard they are running out of seawater too, and even for a short while considered flying water in via helicopter.Originally posted by mbrownn View Post
Things do not look good. I feel so bad for those people. Having those power generators (and even plants) at such an altitude/height... what were they thinking. So easy for us to reflect back and make such comments, but, truly... why was such a hazard issue left unaddressed. After Sanriku on the island of Honshu, The coasts of Colombia and Ecuador, The indian Ocean... SO MANY EVENTS have proven the need for safety... wow. In my mind, we cannot, (as a society of engineered experts) BE SO STUPID, we can only be so greedy, as to be fallible in these ways.----------------------------------------------------
Alberta is under attack... http://rethinkalberta.com/
Has anyone seen my Bedini Ceiling Fan that pushes the warm air down, and charges batteries as an added bonus? Me neither. 'Bout time I made one!!!!! :PComment
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Saw on TV tonite
A commentator said "American engineers are confident nothing like this could happen here.,.....But then just 2 weeks ago, Japanese engineers would have said the same thing." And that was on a 'mainstream' network, I believe.It was either NBC national (nitely) news, Or PBS Newshour, not sure which.
Its not just greed, although that surely plays a role in something like this. Its also HUBRIS.How about this genius idea of putting 5 or 6 reactors at the same site, right next to each other.Up until now, nobody thought something catastrophic could effect multiple plants, so it 'seemed like a good idea at the time'.Most nuclear plants have multiple reactors.The one outside the city where I live has 5.JimComment
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You might want to question the credibility of the people you got that information from as the plant was built right on the coast at sea level (not at altitude/height). So unless they drained the sea, they have a loooooooooooooooong way to go before running out of sea water.Originally posted by kcarring View Post
The flying in of water would have been for demineralised water, as that's what is normally used to cool/use in the reactors. Flying in sea water would have just been for total greed - to milk the disaster for all they can.
On a different note, there is a bigger problem - each reactor building also stored spent fuel rods above the reactor core as well as in large pools.
The storage tanks above the reactors are not as well protected as the cores, their also based on a General Electric design - so the American engineers are talking out of their ass.
Each reactor at the Fukushima Daiichi plant produces about 700 spent rods a year, with potentially over 600,000 being stored on the site.
The irony is that, last year construction started on a purpose built spent fuel rod storage and processing plant. However the first building will not be opened until next year. The following powerpoint covers the new construction as well as where all the fuel rods are stored and how.
See: http://www.nirs.org/reactorwatch/acc...powerpoint.pdfLast edited by Savvypro; 03-16-2011, 10:38 AM....
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Spent fuel rods
My, admittedly sketchy, undestanding is that it is these spent fuel rod ponds, which are located on the roofs of the power plants, that they were briefly talking about using helicopters for, and thats the elevation problem.i.e. how to get water up to them, hence helicopters.
Again, I'm just going from what I hear, but apperently that idea was quashed pretty quickly.These rods apperently are much 'dirtier' than the rods in the plants themselves, and much less shielded.If they can't keep them covered in water, like any fuel rods, they will melt down, spewing radioactive crap everywhere, but also; they are located on the roofs of the reactors?? If thats right, real genius of an idea; they'll melt down right thru the reactor.
Probably put there cause it was easiest just to raise the spent rods up onto the roof.Yet another "Well, it seemed like a good idea at the time,...." Jim
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I think that history will show that this is the biggest nuclear disaster ever and we all will be paying for this not only financially but in sickness and with our lives. Just wait for the spike in leukaemia and cancer to start, of course big pharma will come out with a vaccine for it that will be more sickening and deadly than the radiation sickness itself.Comment
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The disinformation is thick
Put on your waders, its that thick.As far as I'm concerned, once the first containment building blew, this surpassed 3 mile island, and started approaching Chernoble, meanwhile the experts (former 'spurt?') were still placing it 3rd, BEHIND 3 mile island.Now that we have multiple core breaches, AND spent fuel rods exposed, it has surpassed Chernoble. But not according to the spurts.
And then they go on TV and tell people NOT to take iodine.Where do they come up with this sh**, pullit outta their *ss?!!! Iodine is NOT dangerous, its an essential ingredient of life.And its not dangerous, it won't make you hypothyroid, it will prevent hypothyroidism.Hope everyone is taking some.JimComment
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