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vidbid 10-23-2016 05:28 PM

Bhaskara's Wheel

Bhaskara's Wheel aka Overbalanced Wheel




Originally Posted by 7KqOwJKWIAw
Bhaskara's wheel was invented in 1150 by Bhaskara, an Indian mathematician, in an attempt to create a perpetual motion machine. The Wheel consisted of curved or tilted test-tubes partially filled with mercury. Once in motion, the mercury would flow from one side of the tubes to another, thus forcing the wheel to continue motion.

Perpetual Motion - Free Energy - Home Made - YouTube

Perpetual Motion Machine - How it was made - Free energy - YouTube

Perpetual Motion Machine Update - Free Energy - Home Made - Longer Run Time - YouTube

You could call this device a Differential Density Drive.

Peter Lindemann 10-28-2016 05:39 AM

Center of Gravity Analysis
1 Attachment(s)
Hey vidbid et al,

Yes, the YouTube videos look good, but a simple "center of gravity" analysis of the device shows that the center of gravity moves in a tight, uniform oval just below the axle. It shows that the weight of the moving fluids are distributed evenly on either side of the axle, strongly suggesting that the wheel is never heavier on one side or the other. Here's an image of the simple analysis:


So, the wheel is most likely not "driven" by gravity. That leaves the possibility of the wheel being "driven" by the differential of the liquid "sloshing" to the outside on the left side of the wheel producing more force than the liquid "sloshing" backwards to the inside on the right side of the wheel. I consider this "unlikely" as well.

Considering these two realities, it strongly suggests that it "shouldn't work" because we cannot identify a non-uniform force acting more on one side of the wheel than on the other. In the absence of this force, I believe that it probably doesn't work.

If it doesn't really work, then the films are cleverly faked.


citfta 10-28-2016 10:29 AM

Actually it is pretty easy to fake. All it takes is an air hose and some simple editing of the sound track to edit out the sound of the blowing air. Simply erase the original sound track and insert a talk-over. In one of the videos showing this device you can even see the air blowing the shirt of the presenter.

vidbid 10-29-2016 02:21 AM

A Not-so-new Kid on the Block
Okay, PBR Streetgang, point taken, but here's a not-so-new video for you, showing another liquid overbalanced wheel built by a kid.

Perpetual Motion - Free Energy - YouTube



RAMSET 10-29-2016 04:42 AM

That is the one where the Boy has his shirt Blowing at 56-58

Chet K

vidbid 10-29-2016 06:27 PM


Originally Posted by RAMSET (Post 294254)
That is the one where the Boy has his shirt Blowing at 56-58

Chet K


The shirt is fluttering at that time index.

BroMikey 10-29-2016 07:06 PM

Mojo risin
I think in some cases light sensitive fluids can play a roll in these
perpetual motion tricks.

Here is a small collection of working units.


serendipitor 11-07-2016 09:06 PM

There is one problem with all the over-balanced wheels of this type. They all try to take weight from the ascending side and throw it outwards on the descending side, using centrifugal force.

Think of figure skaters. When they throw their weight outwards, they *slow down*. When they pull inwards they speed up. In such a gravity wheel, the very mechanism intended to keep the wheel moving causes it to also slow down. Overall, the momentum exchange is a wash, and energy neutral at best.

rickoff 02-28-2018 11:52 PM

Hi folks,

Just though I'd revive this thread for the simple reason that the notion of an overbalanced wheel interests me. I tend to agree with Peter's analysis, except that if the wheel is equally balanced at the left and right sides then the lines drawn should converge at the axle, yet most of the convergence points are to the right of center. That would seem to indicate that the wheel is too out-of-balance to spin for very long before coming to a stop.

There does appear to be an overbalance at the left side if one refers to either of the below images, which I have labeled and explained, though this may not be entirely accurate either. I do think it is worth looking at, though, as a point for further discussion.

In the above photo you can see that the fluid in bottle D is poised to rush outward, while the fluid in bottle I will be rushing inward. In other words, this is where the "sloshing" effect is initiated, and the actual effect of that sloshing is seen below.
Of course the effect which bottle A has on rotation is very small at this point, when compared to bottles B or C, so shouldn't be thought of as a rotational asset, however neither is it a negative force to rotation. With A-F and D-I pairs pretty much canceling their effects, you still have two overbalanced pairs (B-G and C-H) and only one underbalanced pair (E-J) at the left side.

All this being said, it appears to me that the gaps between each bottle cap and the adjacent bottle's side are not equal, which could in fact help explain why the intersecting lines in Peter's analysis were not quite centered on the axle. This situation would set up an imbalance whether the unit is at rest or in motion, so doesn't seem helpful, and in fact makes me wonder how this could possibly run continuously. Before the unit is tested, it should be well balanced, and the only way to determine that would be to spin it and see where it comes to rest. If it always stops at the same location then the heavy point is at 6 o'clock and one would have to add a counterweight at 12 o'clock to balance the wheel. The counterweight could be a weight added to the wheel, such as a small magnet, or one could add more water to one or two bottles, but of course this second option would be more difficult in this build since the cap is pressed tightly against the perimeter of the wheel.

I noticed that none of the video links shown in the #1 post on this thread are working, so I captured the above still photos from video found at this link. The wheel does keep turning for 5 minutes, just as is claimed, however I noticed that there were two recurring chirping sounds (a higher pitched one followed by a lower pitched one 2.5 seconds later. This may have been a bird outside the garage, and it is not all that unusual for a bird to make two differing pitched chirps close together. What I did find unusual, though, was the fact that when I timed the interval starting immediately upon hearing the high pitched chirp, and ending immediately after each successive high pitched chirp, it always timed out at 19.6 seconds during this 5 minute run. This, of course, is pretty much a dead giveaway that the video was edited to loop within that 19.6 second time frame, which could have started at the chirp or anywhere in between chirps. It's funny that the editor didn't notice the chirps, though perhaps he did and simply thought no one else would notice. If balanced fairly well, it wouldn't be difficult to spin the wheel and have it rotate at a seemingly consistent rpm for just under 20 seconds. It's really too bad that some people will fake their results rather than just showing what actually happens and looking for ways to improve on those results if possible.

While this build is not a continuous runner, it does seem that the sloshing hammer effect, as shown above, does perhaps have potential, especially if a longer tapered bottle neck is used. The usefulness of such a device, if it could be made to continuously run, would probably be almost nil unless it could be constructed on a much grander scale, but one wouldn't even think of doing that unless a relatively small scale model such as this one could be made to function as desired. Certainly there are more promising projects to pursue, so there probably won't be much interest in starting with this build and somehow making it work, but then again there aren't that many projects one can work on that would cost so little.

Best regards to all,


fan1701 03-02-2018 05:37 AM

I believe that custom containers specially shaped could enhance this effect greatly.

rickoff 03-07-2018 05:24 AM


Originally Posted by fan1701 (Post 308710)
I believe that custom containers specially shaped could enhance this effect greatly.

Yes, I'm sure that the sloshing effect could be somewhat enhanced with an improved container, but how about redesigning the perimeter of the wheel itself to incorporate a tubular waterway? Containers moving counterclockwise from the bottom would be dumping their contents into the perimeter tube at position of bottle I in the below photo, thus going empty, while containers moving counterclockwise from the top position would be quickly filled by the water in the tube when at position of bottle D.

Of course, in such an arrangement, you would not want the water to freely circulate in the tube - the tube would be divided into sections with barrier walls, with enough space between barriers to hold the entire contents drained from each container at the right side of the wheel. That drained water, held at the perimeter between two barriers, would then travel up and over the top of the wheel and dump into each container vessel when the vessel reaches the D position. The design of the perimeter tube would need to be evaluated based on being either wide enough, or thick enough, to hold the full contents of a container vessel (or the desired amount for best performance) between barrier baffles. It probably wouldn't be necessary to have as many container vessels as are shown in the above photo. Perhaps six would be ideal, spaced at 60 degree intervals, and you wouldn't want to use anything other than consistent diameter container vessels (such as PVC pipe, for example) as this would allow quick filling as well as quick draining with no restriction in either direction.

Just picture it while looking at the above photo. With the contents of container vessels D, C, and B providing the counterclockwise rotational force, and E,F,G, H, and I emptied to the perimeter tube between their respective barrier baffles, only containers A and J would be resisting rotation as they move towards the container I position, where each is quickly drained to the perimeter tube. Thus, it seems that you would have a relatively strong overbalance condition at the left half of the wheel which would ensure continuous rotation. It's past my usual bedtime, and perhaps I'm too tired to be thinking straight, but at this time it all seems logical.

Here's a suggestion as to how the container vessels could be made from PVC pipe and attached to either or both sides of a rectangular cross section perimeter tube. This is of course a very crude and simplified drawing, and is only offered to illustrate the basic idea, without anything being drawn to an exacting scale. I don't know if I can find the time to make a better drawing, so if anyone would like to give that a shot then feel welcome to do so.

rickoff 03-20-2018 02:42 AM

A basic understanding of my water wheel concept
I finally found enough time to make some improved drawings to further explain my concept for an improved overbalanced water wheel. From a visual aspect, I believe this is workable, and that my design concept should solve all the problems which made the soda bottle water wheel incapable of continuous rotation. Actually, the only two factors that had any positive effect in the soda bottle water wheel were as follows:
1. The angling of the soda bottles allowed for outflow of the liquid to proceed soon after each bottle passed over the top, and at a position between bottles E and D in the top photo of my previous post. As rotation continued past the bottom of the wheel, this same angling allowed the liquid to flow inward towards the wheel's rim much sooner than if the bottle had been oriented 90 degrees to the wheel rim. Thus, we want to make use of similar but improved angling.
2. The sloshing effect, as shown in bottle D of that same photo, was stronger in bottle D with the liquid moving outward than in bottle I (D's counterpart) and shows the potential for positive use of this sloshing hammer effect. Thus an improved design should make even better use of this effect by maintaining a strong hammer effect at the left side of the wheel while eradicating (or at least minimizing) the hammer effect at the right side.

In looking at the bottom diagram of my previous post, you see a very basic drawing of my idea for incorporating a circular waterway at the perimeter of the wheel which is divided, by barriers, into as many sections as the number of tubes that would be incorporated. One tube is shown at the left side of that drawing, for simplicity's sake, as I didn't have enough time to show a fully decked out wheel. I didn't give the waterway enough height in that drawing, and didn't have enough time to alter it, but the figure at the right side of that illustration shows the rectangular shaped waterway at a more realistic height. This waterway section, or containment/feeder vessel, with a length of tubing (or pipe) attached to the side of the vessel by means of a 90 degree elbow is very important for taking full advantage of the sloshing hammer effect during feeder vessel outflow to the tube, as well as avoiding that effect during flow back into the containment vessel. To better understand how this will work quite well in my concept, I'll show the containment vessel feeding the tube on the left side of the below drawing, and then show, at the right side, what happens when the vessel and tube are inverted. What you will readily notice is that the liquid from the feeder vessel is able to fall rapidly to the bottom of the tube, creating a nice hammer effect which aids rotation, while there is practically no counter-productive hammer effect created by the water which is being sent back to the vessel from the inverted tube. That's because the 90 degree elbow, which is of course curved on the inside, smoothly redirects the flow of incoming water against the side of the vessel, rather than it's bottom (which is actually the inverted vessel's top).


Now of course the above figures are drawn as simply as possible for the purposes of illustrating the hammer and non-hammer effects of the design, and this is why I have shown these effects in a straight-on view. In reality, the hammer effect shown above occurs at the angular position occupied by soda bottle D in the photo shown at top of my previous post, while the non-hammer effect shown above can be related to the position of bottle I.

I believe that this validates the usefulness of these design features, and tomorrow I will offer an illustration of the concept wheel showing all the containment/feeder vessels and their related tube mount borings.

Best to all,


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