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John Bedini Discussion threads relating to John Bedini. Bedini SG, Bedini SSG, Crystal Batteries, etc...

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  #571  
Old 04-30-2011, 09:40 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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I've been much more careful about my readings on these petrovoltaic cells here lately. The latest test I've done was to cut off ALL power to my house. So flipped the main breaker and my house had no current flowing in it so that I could eliminate the chance that I was reading stray voltage from CFL's or from the walls. The good news is that these petrovoltaic cells still produce voltage. I even moved the cells around to different place in my yard and drove around and they still give off voltage.

I find the best test that I do is the shorting the cell out test. I never seen any battery of any type able to slowly go back to the original standing voltage after being shorted out for a day or even a week like some of the cells. Removing the short shows the cell go back up in voltage to almost the original standing voltage and over a few minutes it slowly goes back to the original standing voltage and some have even gone up above the standing voltage but I consider to be apart of the temperature and lunar effects. I do believe that these cell can't last forever, they must drain, after all everything dies eventually.

I do find that temperature is a real mixed bag. I remember working on cells that used distilled water as the dielectric and one day the hot water would raise the voltage but next week the cell wasn't affected by it. If anything temperature would raise the voltage slightly but it can be hard to say that these petrovoltaic cells are driven by temperature.

These cells also do act like a low micro farad capacitor when given a charge.

I have made some glue cells that are given power from a AA battery while its drying, as to treat like a electret. It does take the charge but I think High voltage would work better. A AA battery at 1.300 volts would have the glue electret cell at about .400 volts after 3 days of resting and fully dried out. It does hold around .400 volts but I think high voltage would align the cells up better than this low voltage method.

I'm also back at testing some rocks from my drive way again and them too when the power from the house is cut off still give off a very small voltage.
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  #572  
Old 05-02-2011, 07:38 PM
pengrove pengrove is offline
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Hey John Bedini, you have all the secrets of the Universe at your disposal. Why not slip one under the rug to the masses before we totally self destruct?

You have a lot of weight on your shoulders man. But its your own free will to take and give back as you please. These batteries can hardly be the cream of your crop.
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  #573  
Old 05-03-2011, 10:46 AM
abdlquadri abdlquadri is offline
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He has been doing that since 1984

Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
Hey John Bedini, you have all the secrets of the Universe at your disposal. Why not slip one under the rug to the masses before we totally self destruct?

You have a lot of weight on your shoulders man. But its your own free will to take and give back as you please. These batteries can hardly be the cream of your crop.
We are just lazy thats it. JB can not say much explicitly order than the battery chargers bcos of the MIB. I have been listening to open your mind with bill jenkins (1984) - the recordings http://ca.isohunt.com/download/11056...enkins.torrent. I will have to try out the Device in the FEG book - thefirst part. My believe in that device has increased after listening to those shows. Come to think out it I was 2yrs old then lol... Still no one has got the patience to replicate it except JW who disappeared bcos it is real.
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  #574  
Old 05-03-2011, 05:23 PM
pengrove pengrove is offline
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yes he does release things but gives little explanation on what his devices are doing. No one ever explains that all energy is the same. Energy from the vacuum you say? Maybe energy under vacuum, but from the vacuum? The energy is the vacuum not from it.

After this latest Obama trick. I do believe in the MIB. This world is ran by a bunch of nut cases.
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  #575  
Old 05-03-2011, 06:00 PM
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energy is not the vaccum

Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
yes he does release things but gives little explanation on what his devices are doing. No one ever explains that all energy is the same. Energy from the vacuum you say? Maybe energy under vacuum, but from the vacuum? The energy is the vacuum not from it.

After this latest Obama trick. I do believe in the MIB. This world is ran by a bunch of nut cases.
It is FROM the vaccum. The vacuum, which is really a misnomer - it should
be called the plenum has the potential. A dipole breaks the symmetry of
that potential and that potential moves to the poles on the dipole and
moves over the wires - WHEN that potential is moving and causes "electrons"
to move, that is observed as amps and that times the pressure of the
potential (voltage) is watts and that is work or energy.

The vaccum is the ocean that contains the potential, which is NOT
WORK YET - when the potential is tapped and the potential moves from
one potential to another, THAT is work and work is energy. So energy
is moving potential, potential is from the vaccum and the vaccum supplies
the potential, the vaccum is NOT energy.

John gives "little" explanation of what the devices are doing? It has been
there in Bearden's books and in John's writings from the beginning. How
you happen to have missed all of this is beyond me.

Your explanation has completely twisted the facts backwards and
claiming energy IS the vaccum is claiming that energy and potential is
the same - please do your research before you misinform anyone that
may not know better.
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  #576  
Old 05-03-2011, 07:10 PM
pengrove pengrove is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
It is FROM the vaccum. The vacuum, which is really a misnomer - it should
be called the plenum has the potential. A dipole breaks the symmetry of
that potential and that potential moves to the poles on the dipole and
moves over the wires - WHEN that potential is moving and causes "electrons"
to move, that is observed as amps and that times the pressure of the
potential (voltage) is watts and that is work or energy.

The vaccum is the ocean that contains the potential, which is NOT
WORK YET - when the potential is tapped and the potential moves from
one potential to another, THAT is work and work is energy. So energy
is moving potential, potential is from the vaccum and the vaccum supplies
the potential, the vaccum is NOT energy.

John gives "little" explanation of what the devices are doing? It has been
there in Bearden's books and in John's writings from the beginning. How
you happen to have missed all of this is beyond me.

Your explanation has completely twisted the facts backwards and
claiming energy IS the vaccum is claiming that energy and potential is
the same - please do your research before you misinform anyone that
may not know better.
You are being told what energy is instead of finding out for yourself. DO you really know where this vacuum is? Can you explain that to me? The vacuum is a form of potential energy. Its a condition that energy is under. And it was created by you and its not a normal condition. How can someone make a claim that energy comes form the vacuum when its actually energy under a vacuum, Centripetal forces not centrifugal. Contracting energy not expanding. Energy does not come from anywhere, it was there in the first place.

Yes a sea of energy in which the earth floats does exist. But the ocean is not centripetal only in nature.

You can use their words if you want.

I am not twisting anyones words. You just don't know all the facts.

The monopole is an energy vacuum pump, very simply put.
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  #577  
Old 05-03-2011, 09:01 PM
John_K John_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
You are being told what energy is instead of finding out for yourself. DO you really know where this vacuum is? Can you explain that to me? The vacuum is a form of potential energy. Its a condition that energy is under. And it was created by you and its not a normal condition. How can someone make a claim that energy comes form the vacuum when its actually energy under a vacuum, Centripetal forces not centrifugal. Contracting energy not expanding. Energy does not come from anywhere, it was there in the first place.

Yes a sea of energy in which the earth floats does exist. But the ocean is not centripetal only in nature.

You can use their words if you want.

I am not twisting anyones words. You just don't know all the facts.

The monopole is an energy vacuum pump, very simply put. But not the SG.
Pengrove,

Aaron knows alot more about energy from than vaccuum than most folks around here. Do not disrespect his intelligence, he has done the experiments for years and knows what the vaccuum is and how to get the energy from it.

I am not being disrespectful to you, but your uneducated comments are making you look foolish. Especially your last one.


John K.
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  #578  
Old 05-03-2011, 10:12 PM
John_K John_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
you have got to be kidding me. You dont have a clue about energy either. Uneducated get real. John B can stick up for himself. Why does he need you?

The foolish people are the ones that believe energy is both positive and negative. That is a huge lie. Keep eating the hamburger helper your being sold.
Pengrove,

You know nothing about me, so don't try and insult me that way.

I don't eat hamburgers.


John K.
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  #579  
Old 05-03-2011, 11:23 PM
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citfta citfta is online now
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Put up or shut up

Ok pengrove,

According to you we don't have a clue so show us what you've got. Start your own thread and show us the circuits and the videos of your devices working. Explain to us what we are doing wrong. I am really getting tired of the people who keep posting about how those of us that are actually building and testing and trying to learn and saying we don't know what we are doing. If you think John B is not telling us everything then tell us this secret knowledge you say he is keeping back. Of course if you haven't actually built anything then just go away. We already have enough people that are full of theory and nothing to back it up.

Carroll
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  #580  
Old 05-03-2011, 11:48 PM
pengrove pengrove is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citfta View Post
Ok pengrove,

According to you we don't have a clue so show us what you've got. Start your own thread and show us the circuits and the videos of your devices working. Explain to us what we are doing wrong. I am really getting tired of the people who keep posting about how those of us that are actually building and testing and trying to learn and saying we don't know what we are doing. If you think John B is not telling us everything then tell us this secret knowledge you say he is keeping back. Of course if you haven't actually built anything then just go away. We already have enough people that are full of theory and nothing to back it up.

Carroll
I have already built some of Johns stuff. What John is saying is correct but does not seemed to be understood correctly. Energy from the vacuum of a collapsing magnetic field. Its good stuff. Just calling it the vacuum could mean a few things. I have cluttered this thread up enough, Erase time.
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  #581  
Old 05-04-2011, 04:01 AM
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@Pengrove

Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
The vacuum is a form of potential energy. Its a condition that energy is under.
That's my point, you have to understand the difference between potential
and energy.

You state 1) vacuum is a form of potential energy.
You state 2) It is a condition energy is under.
You state 3) And it was created by you and its not a normal condition.
You state 4) Centripetal forces not centrifugal. Contracting energy not
expanding.

1 is almost correct - the vaccum is to potential as water is to the sea.
In either case, it is the source of potential - you could say vacuum is
a form of potential - just as long as you don't claim it is energy, which
you have.

2 is quite a bit off - when potential is at it's source, it is NOT energy
because it is very symmetrical with no potential differences for the
most part and is POTENTIAL, which is NOT YET ENERGY. It is only energy
when there is a separation of charges and you give a path for positive
potential to move to the negative potential and the negative potential
to move to the positive potential - when that happens, current is caused,
which is work and is the definition of energy = work.

3 - I'm not sure what is influencing you to believe this, but I can assure
you we are not creating the vacuum and that the vacuum IS the default
normal condition for the source potential when the potential is away from
any dipole, which separates the potential charges.

Moray's use of "Sea of Energy" is a misuse of the language, but his
meaning is completely understood. That
sea of energy he refers to is the vacuum filled with infinite potential - there
is only energy when the symmetry of that potential is broken and can be
moved to cause work. In a symmetrical state, it is potential which means
NO WORK. But you are right, the "sea of energy" does exist but you have
too actually know that this use of "energy" is actually a reference to
POTENTIAL and not literal work in and of itself.

It is only "energetic" because of it's flux but the overall state is very
symmetrical and homogeneous. When you look at the "snow" on a tv
screen when the station is off air, you are seeing energetic movement, but
the overall state of it is symmetrical chaos. There is no structure or form
because of that symmetry. Please don't confuse that with "energy"
because it is not. The snow on a tv screen is only a potential picture
but is not a picture or work or energy since it is just that, a potential
picture.

4 - You are almost preaching to the choir, but not quite.
Centripetal and contracting "energy" is how you define the gain or self
organization of potential. When the act of energy dissipates the potential
back to the vacuum so it is in a symmetrical state again, that is NOT
centripetal, nor is it a contraction or self organization of potential, it is
the OPPOSITE. The vacuum potential is the OPPOSITE of self organization.
If you have a system that does work, dissipates potential and the system
RE-ESTABLISHES a potential difference (dipole) that causes potential to
come from the vacuum back into your system, that re-establishment or
broken symmetry of that potential to let the potential to actually move
and do work is what the CONTRACTING or SELF ORGANIZATION is. It
comes from the vacuum when that potential is reorganized into a
broken symmetry state. Then you have a voltage, which is just VOLTAGE
POTENTIAL that could cause a certain amount of work if you give it a
path to go.

If you want to use Schauberger's terminology, you have to understand
what it means - otherwise you are simply using them out of context and
in an inappropriate way.

If you drop a rubber ball, energetic dissipation happens, ball bounces
up and establishes a NEW potential difference and NEW gravitational
potential can come back into the system to do more work with a bit of
dissipation each time. Each time the ball bounces up, that is a
self-organization (re-establishment of another dipole).

If you charge a coil, energetic dissipation happens, magnetic field
collapses and that SHARP GRADIENT is a very strong and quick potential
difference that allows NEW potential to enter the system and be sent to
a battery or capacitor and this new potential can do more work
with a bit of dissipation overall each time so that each successive
self-organization or re-establishment (contraction) will be less and less
of a potential difference - that is why all these systems are not an
infinite COP because all these over 1.0 cop systems contribute to the
overall dissipation happening in the entire universe collectively.

The bounce, inductive spike, etc... are all re-establishments of new
potential differences are ARE the analogies of the CONTRACTION or
SELF-ORGANIZATION of potential. That potential comes from the vacuum
but is NOT the vacuum itself.

When you say: "The monopole is an energy vacuum pump, very simply put."

Yes, it is a pump but when the terms energy are used in these ways,
it is a popular casual usage of it but is technically wrong. Yes, the
MAGNETS and their interaction with the magnetic field of the coil are
pumps that cause potential differences and at those points of potential
differences, the potential in the vacuum are separated into negative
and positive and move to their respective poles to enter the circuit
and get added to what is already there (minus any dissipation) so it isn't
a true recycling of the same potential or energy, it is a way to recycle
the ability to simply cause new dipoles or potential differences to allow
vacuum potential to come into the circuit over and over and over with
a bit of dissipation each time.

The very premise of this thread is about a battery, and no matter how
it is constructed, it is the fundamental basis of tapping the potential of the
vacuum - because it is a dipole, which breaks the symmetry of the
potential of the vacuum - that potential is available at those terminals
and when you give it a path to the opposite potential work happens.

It is understandable when the terms energy or vacuum energy are used
because it is understood what it means. Overunity doesn't mean anything
and is an oxymoron because you can't have more than everything you have
but for the most part, most people understand what the point is when that
word is used. But when you make outright claims as you have, I could
be wrong but you clearly seem to not know the differences or the
distinctions and your claims about what energy and potential are. And while
throwing in concepts of centripetal or contracting when those aren't
even a part of the conversation to begin with in the context of energy
and potential for the sake of discussing energy and potential, it is very
highly suspect to me and you appear to be spreading disinformation in
order to confuse people.

There is enough confusion in the world without
this so please do your research, read what Bedini and Bearden have been
saying for a long time and look at the REFERENCES that back the
explanations and you will probably learn something IF and ONLY IF you
are teachable. I've seen your posts in the other threads before and
I'm not overwhelmingly optimistic that you are truly here to give
constructive contributions to this forum.

Please start a new thread to explore your opinions there, you are clearly
confused and are giving claims that are contrary to reality and common
sense and your definitions even contradict the conventional definitions
and distinctions between energy and potential. The conventional definition
of potential is wrong because it is seen as an abstract concept but
potential is a very real thing that interacts with mass to impart a push
and therefore work. But nevertheless, energy and potential are not
the same thing.

Yes, you have twisted my words and you do so deceptively with your
denial on top of it and then you tell me I don't have the facts when you
don't even know the differences or distinctions about what you're
talking about - Please post elsewhere unless you want to post on topic
with the confusing misinformation.
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  #582  
Old 05-04-2011, 12:46 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
It is FROM the vaccum. The vacuum, which is really a misnomer - it should be called the plenum has the potential. A dipole breaks the symmetry of
that potential and that potential moves to the poles on the dipole and
moves over the wires - WHEN that potential is moving and causes "electrons"
to move, that is observed as amps and that times the pressure of the
potential (voltage) is watts and that is work or energy.
Nicely expressed. But a simple battery's two poles breaks the symmetry
of the charges. Why do the charges not rush into the battery?
Paul-R
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  #583  
Old 05-04-2011, 01:25 PM
pengrove pengrove is offline
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Aaron defends the partial model that was sold to him. Sadly all of the information that has been sold to you still has not given you energy independence. So the next obvious assumption would be that we do not know the true nature of energy as of yet.

And I dont blame that one on the MIB.
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  #584  
Old 05-04-2011, 03:48 PM
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@Paul

Quote:
Originally Posted by wrtner View Post
Nicely expressed. But a simple battery's two poles breaks the symmetry
of the charges. Why do the charges not rush into the battery?
Paul-R
Hi Paul,

What do you mean by the charges not rushing into the battery? It is a
voltage potential or a standing pressure of each respective charge at the
terminals. That pressure is based on how polarized the internal charges of
the battery are.
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  #585  
Old 05-04-2011, 05:26 PM
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@Pengrove

Quote:
Originally Posted by pengrove View Post
Aaron defends the partial model that was sold to him. Sadly all of the information that has been sold to you still has not given you energy independence. So the next obvious assumption would be that we do not know the true nature of energy as of yet.

And I dont blame that one on the MIB.
Again, you should start a new thread to discuss your opinions. What I said
is also my opinion but it is also common sense and pre-school logic that
energy and potential are not the same and you clearly have no idea what
the difference is.

If you post again on this matter you and your posts will be removed.
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  #586  
Old 05-04-2011, 06:12 PM
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Has anybody been able to get a voltage of over 2 volts per cell with these batteries???

I am making some more cement beach-sand batteries, as they have worked for me. I did not have much luck with Gelatin batteries, although I did not include Alum in the mix. They turned into liquid mush in a hot climate, while the cement batteries with an inverted copper spiral 30 degree coil and baking powder inside seam to work best for me, so far.

My take on these types of batteries, or better yet called Cells, is that they are absorbing Aether from the atmosphere. Just like a capacitor does, and separating the + and - into a usable although very small amount of voltage. With hardly no current (under load).
They seam to be limited to producing less than 2 volts. Or Not? That is my question...
Hopefully these cells can be connected in series or parallel and made to produce a USEFUL output, with some current too. The smaller in size, the better. By comparison, a calculator solar cell 1/2" by 2" in size, can still output more power than two or three of these earth batteries combined, but not at night.
NickZ
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Old 05-04-2011, 06:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickZ View Post
Has anybody been able to get a voltage of over 2 volts per cell with these batteries???

I am making some more cement beach-sand batteries, as they have worked for me. I did not have much luck with Gelatin batteries, although I did not include Alum in the mix. They turned into liquid mush in a hot climate, while the cement batteries with an inverted copper spiral 30 degree coil and baking powder inside seam to work best for me, so far.

My take on these types of batteries, or better yet called Cells, is that they are absorbing Aether from the atmosphere. Just like a capacitor does, and separating the + and - into a usable although very small amount of voltage. With hardly no current (under load).
They seam to be limited to producing less than 2 volts. Or Not? That is my question...
Hopefully these cells can be connected in series or parallel and made to produce a USEFUL output, with some current too. The smaller in size, the better. By comparison, a calculator solar cell 1/2" by 2" in size, can still output more power than two or three of these earth batteries combined, but not at night.
NickZ

Hi NickZ
Nice to see you're having more luck with them I never got over 2V from single cell. Highest was 1.6V but each cell in car battery has slightly over 2V too. What would be nice to see is the ability to sustain over infinite period of time and some more current. I did check my cement cells and they show over 1.3 -1.5V. The strongest ones are still capable of powering LED while in series. Bertha can power LED through an oscillator for more than 5hrs. This was a cell with copper oxide/copper spiral and large Al tubing (flex air hose).
I did prepare couple copper pieces as John showed us (semiconducting valve) but still lacking other components. I wish I have a kiln or something allowing to bake components (rocks).


Vtech
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  #588  
Old 05-04-2011, 09:43 PM
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@ Blackchisel: Good to hear from you.
Did JB ever tell us how many volts his current cells are able to produce, as well as mAs.
I have a couple of ideas for some new cells, but first I want to make sure I have enough of the cement cells to see if connecting them in either series or parallel is going to work, as planned.
When the cement cells were newly made 3 of them in series produced almost 6 volts. All the cells have to be the same, or the weakest one will limit the current to that level. Mine have since dropped to about 1.2 volts each, but under load they'll drop to about 0.7 volts, or less. So, their best WORKING level under load (one to three leds) is 0.7 volts and about 3 mA. per cell.
I've been making several types of Jtc or inverse Jt type circuits for these batteries, but I think that the best bet is to have enough cells to obtain a decent and STEADY voltage output, and to connect them directly to the leds bulbs.
So, I'm making more cells to see how it goes. I'll upload more pictures as soon as I can figure out how to attach them, as I don't see the normal attachment icon button, that was there before.
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Old 05-05-2011, 06:48 PM
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@ all - need help
I just purchased a brand new dry battery - no acid - supposedly never been charged. I was going to go purchase some acid, when I thought to myself, this could be a good opportunity to test something else.

If it were you, would you just plop the acid in and charge up or what would you put in there instead?

I have a nice SSG build that puts the life back into many dead batteries so I was hoping to give it a go from scratch so to speak.
what should we put in it?

thanks,
Patrick
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Old 05-06-2011, 12:28 AM
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Over 2 Volts

I took a carbon water filter and magnesium water heater anode and put them together with alum and paper towel in between. Right after you wet it with distilled water it cranks out 2.02 Volts and over 50 milli amp. Once you load it with a load, the amps drop pretty quick. If I let it dry for 48 hours voltage rests at about 1.56Volts without a load and amperage is pretty much none.

Carbon water filter is 9.5" long. (split in half)
magnesium .675" dia

When we figure out how to increase the amps I will be really happy
Attached Images
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File Type: jpg 100_1076.JPG (1.37 MB, 29 views)
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Old 05-06-2011, 04:21 PM
b_rads b_rads is offline
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New test gel cells

@all
Last night I constructed three cells I think will be worth observing.

Cell #1 – DAP 100% silicone sealant/glycerin/distilled water/Alum/sand/copper foil/1/2” dia. Magnesium in a small prescription bottle. This cell was heated in oven at 250 for 45 minutes.
After 12 hours to cure at room temp it measures 1.42V and 7.40ma.

Cell #2 – Knox Gelatin/glycerin/distilled water/Alum/sand/copper foil/1/2” dia. Magnesium in a small prescription bottle. This cell was not heated.
After 12 hours to cure in refrigerator it measures 1.30V and 3.64ma.

Cell #3 – Titebond original wood glue/glycerin/distilled water/Alum/sand/copper foil/1/2” dia. Magnesium in a small prescription bottle. This cell was heated in oven at 250 for 45 minutes.
After 12 hours to cure at room temp it measures 1.62V and 28.0ma.

Initial observations:
Cell #1 – when checking voltage and current - The voltage and current are fairly stable regardless which is being checked.
Cell #2 – the voltage and current both drop when checking amperage.
Cell #3 – the voltage drops and the current increases when checking amperage. The cell will start at 14.2ma and 1.62V and move to 28.0ma and 1.05V. When first removed from oven this cell registered 1.64V and 52.8ma. I will try reheating the cell to see if current increases again.

Hypothesis:
The gel must be conductive. The gel must shrink or expand to stress the sand into a piezoelectric state. The cell must be heated for best results. The gel should suspend the sand and contain many air pockets for best result. I will conduct further tests on these 3 cells and construct additional cells to test this hypothesis.

@lidmotor
Did you test your gelatin cells at room temperature? I tested mine cold from the refrigerator.

Brad
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Last edited by b_rads; 05-06-2011 at 04:30 PM. Reason: Forgot to add Alum
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Old 05-06-2011, 06:41 PM
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NickZ NickZ is offline
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Brad and All:
Thanks for your report on your new cells.
I made some gelatin beach sand cells, using aluminum cans, but I found that the sand all goes to the bottom. So, the mix needs to be thick enough to avoid that. A mix that solidifies with expandable gummy like ability would be good, as the cement cells in time will shrink away from the aluminum cans, which can reduce their efficiency.
The gelatin cells turn to liquid mush in my climate of 86 degrees.
A consistency like that of semi-dry silicone glue would work well for a cell, and hold the mixture in suspension until it firms up a bit. Bees wax would also be good to try.

To obtain more accurate readings of the capacity of these batteries, they need to be put under a load, and allowed to run for an hour or two, even if it's just using one led bulb as the load. Then when readings are taken, they will reflect a better idea of what these cells can do.
NickZ
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Old 05-06-2011, 08:43 PM
b_rads b_rads is offline
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This is such a wonderful project and everyone here has been so helpful, even if you don’t realize it. Your opinions and experiences (good or bad) are a tremendous resource for a newbie such as myself. My learning curve is very steep to catch up with the knowledge that most of you already know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by NickZ View Post
Brad and All:
Thanks for your report on your new cells.
I made some gelatin beach sand cells, using aluminum cans, but I found that the sand all goes to the bottom. So, the mix needs to be thick enough to avoid that. A mix that solidifies with expandable gummy like ability would be good, as the cement cells in time will shrink away from the aluminum cans, which can reduce their efficiency.
The gelatin cells turn to liquid mush in my climate of 86 degrees.
A consistency like that of semi-dry silicone glue would work well for a cell, and hold the mixture in suspension until it firms up a bit. Bees wax would also be good to try.

To obtain more accurate readings of the capacity of these batteries, they need to be put under a load, and allowed to run for an hour or two, even if it's just using one led bulb as the load. Then when readings are taken, they will reflect a better idea of what these cells can do.
NickZ
My objective in using the three different gels and trying to keep the other variables similar was to see if I could pick up any noticeable difference. The wood glue gel certainly showed an improvement over the other two cells. While I think the sand probably settled to the bottom like yours did with the gelatin, I think enough glue surrounds the quartz sand to cause pressure. The glycerin is in the mix to absorb water from the ambient air as well as keeping the glue from setting up rock hard. After 12 hours the glue is sort of a “silly putty” consistency. The Alum will eventually grow crystals and create additional pressure on the quartz sand I hope.
Side note: I have a cell that I made with Alum/Carbon/Copper/Magnesium that powered a solar accent light for 4 months that quit working this week. The Alum crystals created so much pressure on the container that it split and without pressure the cell stopped working. I did have to add water occasionally – but that was all that was required to keep it working.

Thank you for your suggestion to put the cells under a load. My experience with water batteries and other true galvanic batteries is that they usually settle down after about 12 to 24 hours. At this point I am still chasing rabbits, trying to figure out where this energy is coming from. The amount of output at this time is less concerning than identifying what makes them work – I think as we identify the “how”, optimizing these cells should be a much simpler task.

Again, thanks to everyone here for their patience with me and I hope that my reports here can be a contributing factor to some (hopefully) very successful results.

Brad
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Old 05-06-2011, 11:45 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by b_rads View Post
This is such a wonderful project and everyone here has been so helpful, even if you don’t realize it. Your opinions and experiences (good or bad) are a tremendous resource for a newbie such as myself. My learning curve is very steep to catch up with the knowledge that most of you already know.



My objective in using the three different gels and trying to keep the other variables similar was to see if I could pick up any noticeable difference. The wood glue gel certainly showed an improvement over the other two cells. While I think the sand probably settled to the bottom like yours did with the gelatin, I think enough glue surrounds the quartz sand to cause pressure. The glycerin is in the mix to absorb water from the ambient air as well as keeping the glue from setting up rock hard. After 12 hours the glue is sort of a “silly putty” consistency. The Alum will eventually grow crystals and create additional pressure on the quartz sand I hope.
Side note: I have a cell that I made with Alum/Carbon/Copper/Magnesium that powered a solar accent light for 4 months that quit working this week. The Alum crystals created so much pressure on the container that it split and without pressure the cell stopped working. I did have to add water occasionally – but that was all that was required to keep it working.

Thank you for your suggestion to put the cells under a load. My experience with water batteries and other true galvanic batteries is that they usually settle down after about 12 to 24 hours. At this point I am still chasing rabbits, trying to figure out where this energy is coming from. The amount of output at this time is less concerning than identifying what makes them work – I think as we identify the “how”, optimizing these cells should be a much simpler task.

Again, thanks to everyone here for their patience with me and I hope that my reports here can be a contributing factor to some (hopefully) very successful results.

Brad
Hi, I've been studying these cell for some time now and I don't think their Galvanic either. When they're dried the water is gone and it looses its power but some of the power that is left is not Galvanic, it is actually called Petrovoltaic. Thomas Townsend Brown was the one to really kick start this study of dielectric material will have a self-potential.

I've been doing some test on a cement cell that was created a month ago, the electrodes are both aluminum and this cell being hooked to a meter and has output the same voltage all day. Whats amazing is this cell was shorted out for a week before the test started and is at a higher voltage then when the short was applied. It seems these cells don't die easy when given a load or short, they just bounce back.

If you want to see something really crazy take one of the glue cells and hook it to a low micro-farad capacitor for a day. I did this with a cell that would output 100mV at the most and by the next day the capacitor had over 500mV in it. What ever energy this is the capacitor can convert to normal electricity.
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Old 05-07-2011, 08:32 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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What happen to Marcus Reid? Is he still making crystal batteries?
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Old 05-08-2011, 02:55 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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What happen to people working on the earth light/crystal cell/ concrete batteries? Is anyone still working on them? Is John Bedini ok or is he really busy, he hasn't posted anything since page 16.

I'm still playing with my cells, glue and concrete ones and I'm seeing some great stuff.

I have one concrete cell that is quite unique. This cell will only drain at night, it will hold steady during the day but when night roles around it likes to drain. This cell is in a box so no light can get to it and its sealed off from the humidity too. Temperature has been constant.
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Old 05-08-2011, 04:04 PM
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NickZ NickZ is offline
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@ Ib and All:
I am still working on these cells. The problem is that they are not really strong enough to do any real work, except to power an led weakly. Even if several cells are connected together they all drop both in voltage as well as in current. Connecting them to a regular Joule Thief circuit works, but it still drains the cells, as the Jtc is still taking too much current from them to run for long. The cells are working just like a charged capacitor, but one that just doesn't last very long.

I have not been able to get a Hartley type oscillator or inverse Joule thief to work on these cell yet. I've tried using a KN2222A trans, 1k resistor and small 102 cap on the negative rail. I've tried several small coils, But can't make a Hartley circuit work. Without a trim pot, to hold the voltage down, the led starts nice and bright but within 10 minutes or so will start to get dim.
Does anybody have any idea what regular resistor to use instead of a pot, to keep the voltage from dropping, as I can't find a pot here, yet?
Ib I have not tried your glue cells yet, but I plan on it. I think that a gummy type of material like Silicone glue and beach sand may work better than regular cement, as it won't shrink away from the can.
My cement cell were putting out almost 2 volts, and 50 mAs when they were made, but have since dropped down to about 1.2 volts (without a load), and less than 1/2 volt if run overnight lighting an led. They bounce back just like a capacitor, but it's practically a useless voltage, without connecting them to a Hartley, or inverse Jtc. Although the beach sand cells will take a charge, the charge does not last very long, maybe for an hour or so.
Has anyone tried to daisy chain the cells to get a STEADY 12 volts???
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Old 05-08-2011, 05:58 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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I have a theory on why these cells don't output much power. What I understand from studying Townsend Brown and others is that these cells are antenna's that pick up a full wave of energy. This energy contains a small portion of the energy that our meters and circuits can use, and this is where we have gone wrong. Our meters and circuits are running directly from the cells and only able to pick up a small faction of the full wave that the cell gets from it surroundings. What we need to do is convert the full wave of energy into usable electricity that we can run our circuits and motors on.

To convert the energy is very simple, just hook the cell to a capacitor or battery and they will convert it for you. I know this sounds crazy and all but its working for me. I took one glue cell that only outputs 100mV at the max and connected it to a low micro-farad capacitor and let them sit over night. (of course the capacitor was shorted out for a week before connecting it) By the next day the 100mV cell had this capacitor charged above 500mV. So My meter was only picking up a 1/5 of the usable energy. I even have one cell connected to a dead 9 volt battery and the battery has climbed .03 and its still going.

The energy we're seeing now is not very useful unless you convert it. So its not the best to run a circuit off the cell directly but have the cells connected to capacitors and the circuit run off the capacitor. This technique was used by Townsend Brown, he also used a diode so that the energy could be brought back to the cell so that the cell could stay alive longer.

just a theory.
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Old 05-08-2011, 08:56 PM
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I think that the cells are working as a capacitor already, and I have connected them to regular capacitors, which does seam to charge them as well, but, the charge is small and running an led off of that charged cap doesn't last long...
I'll continue to play with charging caps off of these cells, and see how long the charge last.
I just made some more cement beach-sand cells but using the taller aluminum cans, as well as more gel cells. They are still drying now. One interesting point is that the beach sand does have a lot of iron in it, as is shown in the picture of the egg magnet attached with the iron fillings all pointing out. The other picture is of the spiral copper wire that I placed inside the aluminum cans.
I'm using the spiral shaped copper coil beach-sand, cement, and baking powder for the new cement cells. The point is to see if they can be made to produce a higher usable voltage and current, and also to see if these can be connected in parallel or series to produce enough electricity to make this worth the effort. I still think that connecting these cells to a solar panel may be the best way to go. The use of extra caps to hold the charge or take better advantage of the charge, may also help.
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Last edited by NickZ; 07-23-2011 at 03:43 PM.
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Old 05-08-2011, 08:59 PM
ibpointless2 ibpointless2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickZ View Post
I think that the cells are working as a capacitor already, and I have connected them to regular capacitors, which does seam to charge them as well, but, the charge is small and running an led off of that charged cap doesn't last long...
I'll continue to play with charging caps off of these cells, and see how long the charge last.
I just made some more cement beach-sand cells but using the taller aluminum cans, as well as more gel cells. They are still drying now. One interesting point is that the beach sand does have a lot of iron in it, as is shown in the picture of the egg magnet attached with the iron fillings all pointing out. The other picture is of the spiral copper wire that I placed inside the aluminum cans.
I'm using the spiral shaped copper coil beach-sand, cement, and baking powder for the new cement cells. The point is to see if they can be made to produce a higher usable voltage and current, and also to see if these can be connected in parallel or series to produce enough electricity to make this worth the effort. I still think that connecting these cells to a solar panel may be the best way to go. The use of extra caps to hold the charge or take better advantage of the charge, may also help.
Try not to use the aluminum from and can such as a soda can, its not pure aluminum. The food industry doesn't use pure aluminum because it has been shown to lead to Alzheimer.
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