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  #1801 (permalink)  
Old 03-21-2012, 09:33 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
John K,

Ok I had a small problem I was able to fix. It's funny we didn't catch it earlier.
The two outside coils should create a south when the Center creates a north. I reversed the wires on the outside coils and the charging has improved quite a bit. I am probably at about an 80% to 90% efficient machine. So there is still some work to do. I am pretty sure a lot of those losses are in my comparator circuit.

As concerning the what happens when we switch off I ran into this video
Magnetic Monopole - YouTube

As I think about the outer coils being south and the center north, as well as why you wanted to get into what happens when the SSG switches off, I am beginning to see something new about the streams and how they are being separated. I think this relates to the videos at coral castle JB posted as well. What do you think?

Les
Les,

Where did you read that the 2 outside coils should be a south and not a north?
I must have missed that one

Sorry I have a problem watching YouTube ATM.


John K
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  #1802 (permalink)  
Old 03-21-2012, 02:49 PM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Mmmm,

John k,
This was in my original notes on the machine construction.

I have four statements under the slave coils.
1 - "Slave coils 1/2 the impedance of the center coil"
2 - "Pulsed with south for attraction" (This circled in my notes usually means not JB)
3 - "Repulsion mode for whole machine" - This had a note saying Definitely JB
4 - "Weak south"

Maybe I interpreted that incorrectly?
I'll go change it back.
Once again...Thanks

Les
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  #1803 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2012, 06:46 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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[quote=minoly;185250]Ron,
Thanks for uploading that schematic. That's a nice compilation of the ckt and dump!


@ Patrick
@ Brent

I've been running my wheel with the Crydom SSR I mentioned earlier and it tends to run hot. Since it doesn't lend itself to heat sinking I think its better for small wheel 12V systems. I'm switching to a Magnecraft SSR, Mouser part# 528-6312AXXMDS-DC3 for my 5 foot wheel and it can be easily heatsinked. I definitely need it since I'm charging larger capacity batteries now.

Ron
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Old 03-27-2012, 07:58 PM
BrentA929 BrentA929 is offline
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Gt3

Ron,

I have yet to try your circuit, but thanks for the update!

I can tell you that I have tried the Douglas Randall K12A and it does NOT work. The breakdown voltage is around 100V. I have yet to try the HFS33 solid state relay. Is the breakdown voltage even listed for those? Also, if we are looking for the capacitor to fill up to 48V and the batteries are sitting at 36V, do we need a breakdown of 12V?


Thanks, Brent



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Chase View Post
@ Brent

I've been running my wheel with the Crydom SSR I mentioned earlier and it tends to run hot. Since it doesn't lend itself to heat sinking I think its better for small wheel 12V systems. I'm switching to a Magnecraft SSR, Mouser part# 528-6312AXXMDS-DC3 for my 5 foot wheel and it can be easily heatsinked. I definitely need it since I'm charging larger capacity batteries now.

Ron

Last edited by BrentA929 : 03-27-2012 at 08:57 PM. Reason: added
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  #1805 (permalink)  
Old 03-27-2012, 08:03 PM
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John_Bedini John_Bedini is offline
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what is charging that battery

Quote:
Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Les,

Where did you read that the 2 outside coils should be a south and not a north?
I must have missed that one

Sorry I have a problem watching YouTube ATM.


John K
That is what I have been saying all along, and that is how it works. now push two norths together, what happends. what is charging that battery?
John B
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Old 03-28-2012, 01:27 AM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BrentA929 View Post
Ron,

I have yet to try your circuit, but thanks for the update!

I can tell you that I have tried the Douglas Randall K12A and it does NOT work. The breakdown voltage is around 100V. I have yet to try the HFS33 solid state relay. Is the breakdown voltage even listed for those? Also, if we are looking for the capacitor to fill up to 48V and the batteries are sitting at 36V, do we need a breakdown of 12V?


Thanks, Brent
Brent,

I think the SSR inside the box in JB's video is a Douglas Randall K08A with a FET switch and probably rated for a load voltage around 40-50V. The FET breakdown voltage is not listed on spec. sheets just the load voltage and current carrying capacity. When that voltage is exceeded (from current flow) the FET inside begins to breakdown and dump the cap so that is probably around 48V. I wouldn't worry about trying to dump at 48V why not go for 72V for maximum charging. JB reiterated several posts back that the ideal is to dump at around twice the battery voltage but it seems his machine with that particular SSR dumped at 48V.

If you want to use just a SSR like JB did try a load voltage around 50V rather than the 100V. I prefer to switch the SSR from the low voltage side as JB mentioned.

I'll have two more dump circuits to share soon.

Ron
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  #1807 (permalink)  
Old 03-28-2012, 02:06 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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What's charging the battery?

Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Bedini View Post
That is what I have been saying all along, and that is how it works. now push two norths together, what happends. what is charging that battery?
John B
John B,

I don't get it. Are you saying that the slave coils on the Ferris wheel when energized are a south pole facing the rotor?

When you push two norths together the scalar south between the rotor magnets is 4 times bigger. It's the scalar south that charges the battery.


John K.
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  #1808 (permalink)  
Old 03-28-2012, 10:29 PM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Originally Posted by John_K View Post
John B,

I don't get it. Are you saying that the slave coils on the Ferris wheel when energized are a south pole facing the rotor?

When you push two norths together the scalar south between the rotor magnets is 4 times bigger. It's the scalar south that charges the battery.


John K.
John B. John K.
I keep thinking of some things I learned from Jim Murry's experiments where he said...

"...Pushed the lines of flux ahead of it so that they collected in a bunch and behaved like stretched rubber bands."

"...lines of flux that were most stretched would snap back..."

"...That the lines of flux that were snapping across the boundary ...... would of necessity, travel with a greater velocity..."

So are we trying to stretch the flux out and let it snap back and collect on the snap?

This machine is just so complex, It is really hard to pinpoint some of this. Since the coils are in parallel, as I understand it there is also a time differential between the coils as well a physical differential by placement of the coils themselves. But we turn off the power just at the moment the scalar south is rebounding. So as far as I can see the scalar south is what reverses the polarity of the coil. It is also slightly unstable due to the neo on the back of the ceramic.

Now it gets even harder to understand as I think about what is happening at the point when the coils are energized then it is like two north magnets squished together making a super pole north going right into the area between the coils where the scalar south would be. I would think that would be closing up the loop at that moment. I think this would mean there is not a scalar south momentarily. But as the rotor would give way the super north pole would shift it's path and remembering that the coil stays on until half way between the physical magnets it would be dragging the south around with it during that time? Or maybe I am just out in scalar left field.....!

Another thing that puzzles me is that almost nothing of this seems to show up on the scope.

so, Just to confirm; all coils when energized are north facing poles?

Les
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  #1809 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 03:21 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
John B. John K.
I keep thinking of some things I learned from Jim Murry's experiments where he said...

"...Pushed the lines of flux ahead of it so that they collected in a bunch and behaved like stretched rubber bands."

"...lines of flux that were most stretched would snap back..."

"...That the lines of flux that were snapping across the boundary ...... would of necessity, travel with a greater velocity..."

So are we trying to stretch the flux out and let it snap back and collect on the snap?

This machine is just so complex, It is really hard to pinpoint some of this. Since the coils are in parallel, as I understand it there is also a time differential between the coils as well a physical differential by placement of the coils themselves. But we turn off the power just at the moment the scalar south is rebounding. So as far as I can see the scalar south is what reverses the polarity of the coil. It is also slightly unstable due to the neo on the back of the ceramic.

Now it gets even harder to understand as I think about what is happening at the point when the coils are energized then it is like two north magnets squished together making a super pole north going right into the area between the coils where the scalar south would be. I would think that would be closing up the loop at that moment. I think this would mean there is not a scalar south momentarily. But as the rotor would give way the super north pole would shift it's path and remembering that the coil stays on until half way between the physical magnets it would be dragging the south around with it during that time? Or maybe I am just out in scalar left field.....!

Another thing that puzzles me is that almost nothing of this seems to show up on the scope.

so, Just to confirm; all coils when energized are north facing poles?

Les
Les,

The way I see it now, the machine is not that complex. There are similarities with the Monopole SSG (aside from the re-gauging hub motor).

The main differences are that JB is shaping the magnetic fields in several different areas to create a non-linear system far from equilibrium.

The neo magnets on the back of the ceramics creates an assymetrical magnetic field around the rotor magnets - the way I see it, the main purpose is to enhance the scalar south. As the north pole on the rotor is not used to trigger the circuit we don't need it to be as strong, therefore we can get away with a less intense north and a more intense south, effectively enhancing the scalar south without having to use super north poles.

The metal shield on the bottom of the master coil is also used to shape the magnetic fields of the coil, when the coil is charged the electromagnetic south at the bottom of the coil is spread and formed over a wider area and when the coil is discharged the electromagnetic north at the bottom of the coil is also spread and formed over a wider are - effectively warping the interaction with the scalar south.

The master and slave coils also have their fields shaped further by extending the cores below the level of the coils, which alters the position of the Bloch wall. Again, to throw the system furtehr out of equilibrium.

Then there is the off-set poitioning of the slave coil. This has a two-fold effect. Firstly, by negatively pre-biasing the master coil (like a mag amp) so that the coil is already non-linear when the transistors turn the coil on. Secondly, when the coils discharge there is a further interaction from the passing rotor magnet which opposes the flipping of the poles - again non-linear.

The main point is that you must picture the magnetic fields of the rotor magnets and the coils WHEN the coils discharge, whilst focussing in the part the scalar south plays in the equation - for it is the scalar south that is "sucking" the energy out of the coils, which is then collected in the capacitor and dumped to the charge battery.

So it it fair to say that JB states it is the scalar south that is charging the battery.

Make sense?


John K.
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  #1810 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 07:34 AM
erfinder erfinder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Les,

The way I see it now, the machine is not that complex. There are similarities with the Monopole SSG (aside from the re-gauging hub motor).

The main differences are that JB is shaping the magnetic fields in several different areas to create a non-linear system far from equilibrium.

The neo magnets on the back of the ceramics creates an assymetrical magnetic field around the rotor magnets - the way I see it, the main purpose is to enhance the scalar south. As the north pole on the rotor is not used to trigger the circuit we don't need it to be as strong, therefore we can get away with a less intense north and a more intense south, effectively enhancing the scalar south without having to use super north poles.

The metal shield on the bottom of the master coil is also used to shape the magnetic fields of the coil, when the coil is charged the electromagnetic south at the bottom of the coil is spread and formed over a wider area and when the coil is discharged the electromagnetic north at the bottom of the coil is also spread and formed over a wider are - effectively warping the interaction with the scalar south.

The master and slave coils also have their fields shaped further by extending the cores below the level of the coils, which alters the position of the Bloch wall. Again, to throw the system furtehr out of equilibrium.

Then there is the off-set poitioning of the slave coil. This has a two-fold effect. Firstly, by negatively pre-biasing the master coil (like a mag amp) so that the coil is already non-linear when the transistors turn the coil on. Secondly, when the coils discharge there is a further interaction from the passing rotor magnet which opposes the flipping of the poles - again non-linear.

The main point is that you must picture the magnetic fields of the rotor magnets and the coils WHEN the coils discharge, whilst focussing in the part the scalar south plays in the equation - for it is the scalar south that is "sucking" the energy out of the coils, which is then collected in the capacitor and dumped to the charge battery.

So it it fair to say that JB states it is the scalar south that is charging the battery.

Make sense?


John K.
Well stated, however, I don't see where you answered the question....

What is charging the battery....?

In my opinion its not enough to simply state that the "scalar south" is charging the battery.....Technically the scalar south isn't there....(one of those it is and isn't situations...) and to me....thats a serious issue....

What is a scalar south? How does a scalar south differ from a conventional south? What is a conventional south? Are we absolutely certain that the pole that we identify with as being the south pole is truly the south pole (the plot thickens...)? What is happening when we push two north poles together? I have read that the result of this action yields whats called a super pole.....super in what way? Lines of force aren't concentrating....are they? I find the opposite to be true....What relation does this action have to the remaining two poles....a portrait is being presented...can anyone see it? Are we being shown what a magnet really looks like, and or how to really see the magnets nature presents us with? (hard stretch of the imagination...)

In regards to the ferris wheel; specifically, the SG portion of the ferris wheel device...Why do the two outer poles have lower impedance than the inner pole....all coils in parallel...? Very very intersting...whats its being demonstrated here? Does anyone else see the parallel between the layout of the coils and the magnet layout that yields super poles? Whats the message? Is there a relationship between impedance and polarity?

I find it curious that all know that the coils are in parallel, and yet the coils are analyzed as if the were individual? What is the shape of the entire field that these coils collectively produce? I have a feeling that something amazing is being demonstrated and no one sees it.....myself included...

When we finally comprehend whats going on here, we will be paralyzed with the thoughts of its infinite applications, mesmerized by its simplicity, and hopeful as now we truly have an understanding that can take us far into the next century. Worlds within worlds.....just imagine how much would change if we simply took a second look at those things we call magnets....all is not what it seems to be....it seems....

It might sound like I have figured something out....but let me put your minds at ease..I haven't....but I will not stop till I have! This brings me back to the question which inspired this post...

What is charging the battery.....?


Regards
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  #1811 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 08:46 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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John, you are right, it is not complicated at all...
All the correct principles apply from the SSG. I learned from our timing that capturing the scalar south as it were was the objective. Timing the bipolar to switch off at the moment of the scalar south opened a whole new world of thought about this machine I owe you a great debt of gratitude for that.

The difference between this and an SSG seems to be in the coils. The impedance is changed by way of the mag amp effects and Ron Cole's unique understanding of parallel inductors. So it looks like there is a time shift in the machine at this level where torsion fields are created developing the interferometry which then creates the upper portion of the triangle, I am guessing that nature is what creates the reverse triangle which drops below the center coil and which is captured and sent more slowly to the capacitor. My comparator circuit does not account for this. and that is where I have been having trouble. Well, that and I am using the wrong channel fets
I modified my circuit to handle higher voltage but the lower threshold to the comparator is all wrong. I am currently working on that and I have some fet's on the way. Rotating my machine (moving it to face east, north etc.) has differing effects in the surrounding environment, changes it's ability to collect energy, and sometimes sounds different, even at this level of operation. So I am going to suggest that the sun is what is fundamentally charging the battery.
I am also thinking that as the cap dumps, something is following the current and there is a lot more in that pulse than I know. I have been reviewing the thread to see if I can get a better grasp of all this but I still have a long way to go.

On my comparator circuit as I look at the dump, I see that I can look at voltage and set the comparator to switch off at some point above the battery voltage but something tells me I should be looking at current somehow. If we were using a sidactor it would be a drop in current flow that switches it off rather than that of voltage. I don't know it's late and maybe I am over thinking a bit....

Thanks John
Les



Quote:
Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Les,

The way I see it now, the machine is not that complex. There are similarities with the Monopole SSG (aside from the re-gauging hub motor).

The main differences are that JB is shaping the magnetic fields in several different areas to create a non-linear system far from equilibrium.

The neo magnets on the back of the ceramics creates an assymetrical magnetic field around the rotor magnets - the way I see it, the main purpose is to enhance the scalar south. As the north pole on the rotor is not used to trigger the circuit we don't need it to be as strong, therefore we can get away with a less intense north and a more intense south, effectively enhancing the scalar south without having to use super north poles.

The metal shield on the bottom of the master coil is also used to shape the magnetic fields of the coil, when the coil is charged the electromagnetic south at the bottom of the coil is spread and formed over a wider area and when the coil is discharged the electromagnetic north at the bottom of the coil is also spread and formed over a wider are - effectively warping the interaction with the scalar south.

The master and slave coils also have their fields shaped further by extending the cores below the level of the coils, which alters the position of the Bloch wall. Again, to throw the system furtehr out of equilibrium.

Then there is the off-set poitioning of the slave coil. This has a two-fold effect. Firstly, by negatively pre-biasing the master coil (like a mag amp) so that the coil is already non-linear when the transistors turn the coil on. Secondly, when the coils discharge there is a further interaction from the passing rotor magnet which opposes the flipping of the poles - again non-linear.

The main point is that you must picture the magnetic fields of the rotor magnets and the coils WHEN the coils discharge, whilst focussing in the part the scalar south plays in the equation - for it is the scalar south that is "sucking" the energy out of the coils, which is then collected in the capacitor and dumped to the charge battery.

So it it fair to say that JB states it is the scalar south that is charging the battery.

Make sense?


John K.
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  #1812 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 09:03 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Originally Posted by erfinder View Post
Well stated, however, I don't see where you answered the question....

What is charging the battery....?

In my opinion its not enough to simply state that the "scalar south" is charging the battery.....Technically the scalar south isn't there....(one of those it is and isn't situations...) and to me....thats a serious issue....

What is a scalar south? How does a scalar south differ from a conventional south? What is a conventional south? Are we absolutely certain that the pole that we identify with as being the south pole is truly the south pole (the plot thickens...)? What is happening when we push two north poles together? I have read that the result of this action yields whats called a super pole.....super in what way? Lines of force aren't concentrating....are they? I find the opposite to be true....What relation does this action have to the remaining two poles....a portrait is being presented...can anyone see it? Are we being shown what a magnet really looks like, and or how to really see the magnets nature presents us with? (hard stretch of the imagination...)

In regards to the ferris wheel; specifically, the SG portion of the ferris wheel device...Why do the two outer poles have lower impedance than the inner pole....all coils in parallel...? Very very intersting...whats its being demonstrated here? Does anyone else see the parallel between the layout of the coils and the magnet layout that yields super poles? Whats the message? Is there a relationship between impedance and polarity?

I find it curious that all know that the coils are in parallel, and yet the coils are analyzed as if the were individual? What is the shape of the entire field that these coils collectively produce? I have a feeling that something amazing is being demonstrated and no one sees it.....myself included...

When we finally comprehend whats going on here, we will be paralyzed with the thoughts of its infinite applications, mesmerized by its simplicity, and hopeful as now we truly have an understanding that can take us far into the next century. Worlds within worlds.....just imagine how much would change if we simply took a second look at those things we call magnets....all is not what it seems to be....it seems....

It might sound like I have figured something out....but let me put your minds at ease..I haven't....but I will not stop till I have! This brings me back to the question which inspired this post...

What is charging the battery.....?


Regards
Well erfinder, I have to say those are some thought provoking ideas.
Patent 5,487,057 might help
But I read an interesting article years ago about using this configuration to make food taste better and lots of other things. I tried to find that for you but it might be off the net now. maybe someone else might know about it.

Les
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  #1813 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 09:04 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erfinder View Post
Well stated, however, I don't see where you answered the question....

What is charging the battery....?

In my opinion its not enough to simply state that the "scalar south" is charging the battery.....Technically the scalar south isn't there....(one of those it is and isn't situations...) and to me....thats a serious issue....

What is a scalar south? How does a scalar south differ from a conventional south? What is a conventional south? Are we absolutely certain that the pole that we identify with as being the south pole is truly the south pole (the plot thickens...)? What is happening when we push two north poles together? I have read that the result of this action yields whats called a super pole.....super in what way? Lines of force aren't concentrating....are they? I find the opposite to be true....What relation does this action have to the remaining two poles....a portrait is being presented...can anyone see it? Are we being shown what a magnet really looks like, and or how to really see the magnets nature presents us with? (hard stretch of the imagination...)

In regards to the ferris wheel; specifically, the SG portion of the ferris wheel device...Why do the two outer poles have lower impedance than the inner pole....all coils in parallel...? Very very intersting...whats its being demonstrated here? Does anyone else see the parallel between the layout of the coils and the magnet layout that yields super poles? Whats the message? Is there a relationship between impedance and polarity?

I find it curious that all know that the coils are in parallel, and yet the coils are analyzed as if the were individual? What is the shape of the entire field that these coils collectively produce? I have a feeling that something amazing is being demonstrated and no one sees it.....myself included...

When we finally comprehend whats going on here, we will be paralyzed with the thoughts of its infinite applications, mesmerized by its simplicity, and hopeful as now we truly have an understanding that can take us far into the next century. Worlds within worlds.....just imagine how much would change if we simply took a second look at those things we call magnets....all is not what it seems to be....it seems....

It might sound like I have figured something out....but let me put your minds at ease..I haven't....but I will not stop till I have! This brings me back to the question which inspired this post...

What is charging the battery.....?


Regards
Well erfinder, I have to say those are some thought provoking ideas.
Patent 5,487,057 might help
But I read an interesting article years ago about using this configuration to make food taste better and lots of other things. I tried to find that for you but it might be off the net now. maybe someone else might know about it.

Les
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  #1814 (permalink)  
Old 04-03-2012, 10:36 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
John, you are right, it is not complicated at all...


On my comparator circuit as I look at the dump, I see that I can look at voltage and set the comparator to switch off at some point above the battery voltage but something tells me I should be looking at current somehow. If we were using a sidactor it would be a drop in current flow that switches it off rather than that of voltage. I don't know it's late and maybe I am over thinking a bit....

Thanks John
Les
Hi Les,

This NE2 trigger circuit works great with a 36V system and its simple and definitely dumps current. I've tried several sidacs and they tend to stay on too long and cause problems but maybe someone will figure out how to use them.

I'm still interested in the shaft load and have been studying Ed L's 1945 publication and DadHav's video. Will keep you posted.

Ron
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  #1815 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2012, 04:46 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Chase View Post
Hi Les,

This NE2 trigger circuit works great with a 36V system and its simple and definitely dumps current. I've tried several sidacs and they tend to stay on too long and cause problems but maybe someone will figure out how to use them.

I'm still interested in the shaft load and have been studying Ed L's 1945 publication and DadHav's video. Will keep you posted.

Ron
Ok, thats what ya call simple! Good idea with the neon.

Yes, I have been reviewing the stuff on ED as well. The thing about Dadhav's little ssg is that it had an enclosed magnetic path with the bell housing around the stator the the mags were attached to. The way I see it right now is that I would like to take the motor function out of the SSG and keep the rest. That would make it the perfect generator for this. I have been playing with covering the coils with tin cans to see what that would do as well. ED said we are loosing half our magnets so we need to cover the coils. then you get all the magnets. DadHav showed he could get a spike but it was a bit anemic. The way I see it right now is that you would have to go with non-litzed SSG to make use of the mag-amp effect coming from the trigger winding and would also have to beef up the winding to generate a little power for the switch. the light bulb would need to be replaced with a proper inductor to phase shift the pulse a bit. I don't know but maybe that is a place to start.

Les
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  #1816 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2012, 05:19 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
Ok, thats what ya call simple! Good idea with the neon.

Yes, I have been reviewing the stuff on ED as well. The thing about Dadhav's little ssg is that it had an enclosed magnetic path with the bell housing around the stator the the mags were attached to. The way I see it right now is that I would like to take the motor function out of the SSG and keep the rest. That would make it the perfect generator for this. I have been playing with covering the coils with tin cans to see what that would do as well. ED said we are loosing half our magnets so we need to cover the coils. then you get all the magnets. DadHav showed he could get a spike but it was a bit anemic. The way I see it right now is that you would have to go with non-litzed SSG to make use of the mag-amp effect coming from the trigger winding and would also have to beef up the winding to generate a little power for the switch. the light bulb would need to be replaced with a proper inductor to phase shift the pulse a bit. I don't know but maybe that is a place to start.

Les
Thats a good start. I will also try covering coils with a metallic sleeve as Ed L. showed (soft iron, I think would be best). My SSG has one coil with seven power windings and one trigger wire all non-litzed so it will be a good coil to experiment with as a generator.

At this point, I'm convinced that for maximum battery charge from the Ferris Wheel (and best tuning) there needs to be a generator load on the shaft that feeds energy into the dump cap along with the energy from the master and slave coils. The ideal of course is the re-gauging motor in generator mode but until rsources allow, I will have to use as efficient a generator as I can build.

Right now I need help in tuning my wheel for optimum performance without additional energy coming from a generator. I only get 1:1 so there must be some fine adjustment of coil position, magnetic shield angle, etc. that I need to pursue. Any help will be greatly apprciated.

Ron
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  #1817 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2012, 06:54 PM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Originally Posted by Ron Chase View Post
Thats a good start. I will also try covering coils with a metallic sleeve as Ed L. showed (soft iron, I think would be best). My SSG has one coil with seven power windings and one trigger wire all non-litzed so it will be a good coil to experiment with as a generator.

At this point, I'm convinced that for maximum battery charge from the Ferris Wheel (and best tuning) there needs to be a generator load on the shaft that feeds energy into the dump cap along with the energy from the master and slave coils. The ideal of course is the re-gauging motor in generator mode but until rsources allow, I will have to use as efficient a generator as I can build.

Right now I need help in tuning my wheel for optimum performance without additional energy coming from a generator. I only get 1:1 so there must be some fine adjustment of coil position, magnetic shield angle, etc. that I need to pursue. Any help will be greatly apprciated.

Ron
yours is doing quite a bit better than mine. so far I am no where near 1:1 On this new build.
I got my Fet's in and man that made a ton of difference. Got the circuit fairly well tuned in as well. Unlike the solid state stuff, I am seeing only a small surface charge and getting real juice.

I am wondering about some of the tuning as well. ED had all those chains collecting magnets and I think that was what all the jars were hanging around as well. Iron wire to get more magnets. I also never realized that the PMH is a stream splitter. I see the vortex or torsion fields just like the Hamel spinner. I think these are the streams being split and rotating counter clockwise to the rotation of the wheel both front and back. As I understand it this is why in ED's picture showed the chains kinda bunched and reaching towards the handle he was turning. It was pulling in all those extra magnets. If I could find some small iron chain to hang around the room I wonder what that would do?

Les
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  #1818 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2012, 07:17 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
yours is doing quite a bit better than mine. so far I am no where near 1:1 On this new build.
I got my Fet's in and man that made a ton of difference. Got the circuit fairly well tuned in as well. Unlike the solid state stuff, I am seeing only a small surface charge and getting real juice.

I am wondering about some of the tuning as well. ED had all those chains collecting magnets and I think that was what all the jars were hanging around as well. Iron wire to get more magnets. I also never realized that the PMH is a stream splitter. I see the vortex or torsion fields just like the Hamel spinner. I think these are the streams being split and rotating counter clockwise to the rotation of the wheel both front and back. As I understand it this is why in ED's picture showed the chains kinda bunched and reaching towards the handle he was turning. It was pulling in all those extra magnets. If I could find some small iron chain to hang around the room I wonder what that would do?

Les
Les,

Excellent! What circuit are you using and what is your cap dump rate?

Awhile back there was talk of using an air coil for tuning that some saw at the last conference. Anyone know how that works?

Watch out for those chains they might start moving around. I'll try to find some iron chain also.

Ron
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  #1819 (permalink)  
Old 04-04-2012, 08:10 PM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Chase View Post
Les,

Excellent! What circuit are you using and what is your cap dump rate?

Awhile back there was talk of using an air coil for tuning that some saw at the last conference. Anyone know how that works?

Watch out for those chains they might start moving around. I'll try to find some iron chain also.

Ron
I am using the one I came up with. It dumps about 1 pulse per second. Well, it did.
The Bridge just went out for some reason. Very weird. no smole no smell no nothing. Just quit passing power to the cap. I was looking at it because I realized I may not have the right impedance match between the cap and coil. If that is not right then it won't perform either. I am pretty sure that is my last hurdle to start getting into any real fine tuning.

looks like I am down for a while as I am all out of anything big enough for it. That's not an area to play with either. the power right there coming out of those coils can be very dangerous.

Les
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  #1820 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2012, 01:07 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Time to run

John, Is it time? are we there yet?


Les



Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Bedini View Post
@all,
Yes the inductance does change when the magnets pass the pole. The one thing that you can not do in the machine is twist the wires. Now each wire in the main coil has it's own resistance so this is offset a little when it turns on sort of like a mag amp but pulsed DC or more like PWM because of the switching so I had to sit and tune it for maximum power low RPM.

This is a very tedious to do as if I did not get just right I could not self start the machine. No one posted a Video of me showing it at the convention yet but someone out there has it. When I would start it from a dead stop it would accelerate backwards and slam agents three magnetic fields and dead stop then leap forward right up to 16RPM's that is how I knew I had the timing right. You all have done excellent work on this group. But now I'm going to do something I always wanted to do with a new machine just like this we must make it run with no input. Great group glad I could be here.
John B
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  #1821 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2012, 05:22 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Just an update...

Just wanted to show some of the timing I have for the little wheel.

John K,
Did you ever finish your experiments with the Mag-Amp? I built the bipolar switch JB has posted on his site with the 3lb rotor.
http://www.icehouse.net/john1/mot1.jpg
I used a hall switch and tried several different coils that had one extra strand to add a small dc current. I also tested with just a resistor across the strand. and in one test I had one strand with Iron wire the rest copper. I never tried a coil with all Iron though.
The last test is still running, I made a four strand coil similar to the ferris wheel center coil.
then encased it in a tin can, (A magnet would stick to the can so there must be some iron in there...) and have been running for weeks now. but the batteries have gone kinda weird. Anyway just wanted to know if you had anything interesting happen?

Thanks
Les
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  #1822 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2012, 08:27 PM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Bedini View Post
Right now, my figures show...

61ohms for the Main Base Coil and
30.5ohms for the conjugate asymmetrical side coils.
This will equal the 12.2 ohm total in parallel.

The side coils are opposed pulsing a weaker south pole to create attraction, while the Main center coil is creating a huge repulsed north field when switch goes on. Very interesting non-linear arrangement to say the least. I do know there is more to learn here.
POST #20
At this point I see the half bipolar bedini/cole circuit as the switch across conjugate coils in parallel. The switch sees this as a resistive load and non-inductive when on, but yet you are able to collect the collapsing magnet reactive impulse after disengaged.

I was looking at your Adams motor arrangement. Using the concept of your half bipolar bedini/cole circuit, I made some slight adjustments. Again, I am only learning here, but I see this as a method for switching the non-linear fields. Schematic parts will of course change accordingly.

We are all very inspired to test and learn here. Thank you so much!

Jeremy Burnum

Yes I see that, Thank you is this where you got the information?

John K.
Wow! I found it! post 807 sorry it took so long but I am reading with all new eyes!
Read my posts and feel like a dumb A.......
Man John B. has given us so much! So very much!

I am just now understanding. JB asked; press two north poles together. What is charging the battery? Man what an eye opener! I now understand it really is a lifetime of research!
JB answered his own question on the page with post 807! I am definitely wearing different Glasses today....

Les
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  #1823 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2012, 10:40 PM
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minoly minoly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
John K.
Wow! I found it! post 807 sorry it took so long but I am reading with all new eyes!

Les
I always wondered about that post. it never read to me as though John B. wrote it. and it is not signed by John B. I've heard John refer to himself in the 3rd person before - except he uses the name John. in this post he refers to himself in the 3rd person as "you"
and the ohms are different than what he posts elsewhere, and he does not seem so sure of things, and he thanks himself and signs Jeremy Burnum????
I think I assumed at the time, that someone else hopped on his computer the way Rick has done in the past.
so I discarded the post as I did not know what was what....

It would be nice to know what was what with that post.

Patrick
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  #1824 (permalink)  
Old 04-08-2012, 12:40 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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I agree, JB did not write that. Jeremy was involved in this thread early on.

Sorry to rain on your parade Les.


John K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by minoly View Post
I always wondered about that post. it never read to me as though John B. wrote it. and it is not signed by John B. I've heard John refer to himself in the 3rd person before - except he uses the name John. in this post he refers to himself in the 3rd person as "you"
and the ohms are different than what he posts elsewhere, and he does not seem so sure of things, and he thanks himself and signs Jeremy Burnum????
I think I assumed at the time, that someone else hopped on his computer the way Rick has done in the past.
so I discarded the post as I did not know what was what....

It would be nice to know what was what with that post.

Patrick
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  #1825 (permalink)  
Old 04-08-2012, 12:43 AM
John_K John_K is offline
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Les,

I don't remember but it doesn't matter. What matters is that JB said it was "like" a mag-amp, not actually one.

IMO, the offest coils are just pre-biasing the main coil - "like" a mag-amp.


John K.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Les_K View Post
John K,
Did you ever finish your experiments with the Mag-Amp?
Thanks Les
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  #1826 (permalink)  
Old 04-08-2012, 04:14 AM
Les_K Les_K is offline
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Originally Posted by John_K View Post
Les,

I don't remember but it doesn't matter. What matters is that JB said it was "like" a mag-amp, not actually one.

IMO, the offest coils are just pre-biasing the main coil - "like" a mag-amp.


John K.
The post was a response to Jeremy and apparently the quote field did not show up.
Sorry about that, a little later on JB makes it very clear that it is a good experiment for him to try making the outside coils south facing. But JB runs his in repulsion mode.

The mag amp effects are something much more than I have thought. It's not so important to understand to make the machine run because if you have the impedances correct then it takes care of it all itself, yes "like a mag Amp". But having an understanding of what is going on is worth gold! And that page is full of key information. In fact I had my outside coils wrong. but once I have that fixed I can't wait to use the sniffer on it. Maybe I better get a tricorder.... Science version would probably be better than the medical
the Tricorder project - Science Tricorder Mark 2


Well, I have a lot more study to do. There was a lot of JB's comments on using several strands on one transistor vs a single strand per tranny....

Have a great day!
Les
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  #1827 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2012, 05:46 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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SSR Cap Dump

Well after all the messing around with different cap dump circuits it turns out that John Bedini's SSR cap dump works the best (for my wheel anyway). Is anyone surprised? He did say it was simple and thats usually the most effective. The cap dumps through the amp meter to the negative pole of the charge battery at each trigger of the coils.

All thats needed now is the re-guaging motor load that inputs its energy into the cap and, I'll be at > 1:1.

Thanks John B for generously sharing all the information on your Ferris Wheel Technical Information DVD and on this forum.

Ron Chase
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  #1828 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2012, 06:32 PM
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nvisser nvisser is offline
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Wow! Neat work!
Dumping after each trigger. Not reflecting to the source.
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  #1829 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2012, 06:46 PM
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minoly minoly is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ron Chase View Post
Well after all the messing around with different cap dump circuits it turns out that John Bedini's SSR cap dump works the best (for my wheel anyway). Is anyone surprised? He did say it was simple and thats usually the most effective. The cap dumps through the amp meter to the negative pole of the charge battery at each trigger of the coils.

All thats needed now is the re-guaging motor load that inputs its energy into the cap and, I'll be at > 1:1.

Thanks John B for generously sharing all the information on your Ferris Wheel Technical Information DVD and on this forum.

Ron Chase
Ron,
nice wheel! can we have a vid tour? :-)
are you using this Magnecraft SSR, Mouser part# 528-6312AXXMDS-DC3
and are you using your earlier schematic from here Bedini Ferris Wheel Regauging Motor to switch it?
or is it working straight up as John B says with the breakdown voltage?
or some other way?
shouldn't we be over 1:1 w/o the center hub generator?
Thanks,
Patrick
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  #1830 (permalink)  
Old 04-09-2012, 10:28 PM
Ron Chase Ron Chase is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minoly View Post
Ron,
nice wheel! can we have a vid tour? :-)
are you using this Magnecraft SSR, Mouser part# 528-6312AXXMDS-DC3
and are you using your earlier schematic from here Bedini Ferris Wheel Regauging Motor to switch it?
or is it working straight up as John B says with the breakdown voltage?
or some other way?
shouldn't we be over 1:1 w/o the center hub generator?
Thanks,
Patrick
Thanks Vissey.

Patrick,

I think I will have to get a video camera soon! Any one want to trade a video camera for a 3-pole kit fully assembled and a NS window motor kit also fully assembled?

I've attached a pdf showing the circuit using a Magnecraft 6312XXMDS-DC3 but as I note on the schematic almost any DC load SSR will work. You just need to get the polarity hooked up right. I've tried 2 different SSR's and they both work great and it also works with IRFP260 FET's. It does work just the way John B says but I think you'll be surprised when you hook it up and start looking for large increments of cap dump voltage. I won't spoil it for you right now you'll just have to give it a try. When will your wheel be completed? Its going to be awesome.

Yes, I think we should be > 1:1 with just the monopole coils, thats been proven many times. I have several issues with my wheel not the least being my coils are undersized (to little impedance is not good) so, I will be working to improve its performance.

After looking at the Ferris Wheel technical information DVD about 10 times over the weekend, I've come to realize the important role the re-gauging motor plays when the monopole is running. It provides a load on the shaft to keep the monopole from running wild (huge torque) and at the same time its also putting additional energy into the cap so we can get 2:1 performance or better. One can detune the monopole to run without a load but I'm going for as much charging as possible so it looks like I'll be building a re-gauging motor in the near future.

Ron
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