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  #241  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:16 PM
sinergicus sinergicus is offline
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More about coils design

Hi guys ;I am interested too in building an Watson Machine;or some improved variant of this


I am working on my version of Ossie Callanan radiant energy circuit, with big red switch that I made my self ....no need big fly well like in jim watson unit, no need energizer;The power coils in conjunction with red switch will oscillate
like in Ossie Callanan circuit and so, will vary the impedance very many times per second and this will bring radiant energy in circuit to be collected more efficient...also, at the shaft you can put an auxiliary energizer or lenz less generator like in totalyamped site ...this will be in the same time an flywheel
if you want. http://www.totallyamped.net/adams/ SkyWatcher had mentioned this already .
at page 10 ;simple coil design lenz less drag , with explanations... practical stuff not just theoretical ;seems this guy had tried all this and the coils design
is working...

Instead an second battery to be charged, I am using an capacitor (1000 microfarad at 200 volts to be timed and dumped back in primary battery like in Jim Watson unit,using an relay at 12 volts ...

My problem is:my relay contacts will weld when that cap is discharged across my 45 amp our 12 v car battery (the battery is disconnected from the circuit in that moment)
I am not fully charging the cap;just at around 100 volts...

My relay what I have is double pole double throw with 2 moving arms with 2 contacts each arm (like common double pole double throw relay ).So we have 4 moving contacts on 2 moving arms( 2+2).So is a many contacts relay or an DOUBLE double pole double throw so to speak...

I connected these contacts in parallel to have bigger surface area to dissipate the condenser energy (4 mm diameter each contact ,in parallel will have 8 mm diameter surface to reducing the charge on every contact .The no moving contacts are connected the same in parallel.

The relay is activated ,at every 4-5 second to dump the charge...

How I say , in spite of the bigger surface area of the contacts one or other will weld....

What Kind of relay Jim Watson was used ?

How to eliminate this problem?In what kind of industry must search to find the proper relay to be resistant and not weld...

Mike
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Last edited by sinergicus; 10-01-2010 at 08:32 PM.
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  #242  
Old 10-01-2010, 08:37 PM
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You could use an scr triggered by the relay or commutator.
Just replace the ne2 with your switch
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Last edited by nvisser; 01-24-2015 at 08:55 AM.
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  #243  
Old 10-01-2010, 09:25 PM
john_g john_g is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
That's a great idea John. I will have to look into that. I will be searching junk yards starting tomorrow!

Right now I will be using Matt Jones' simple Motor to drive the device. I built a stand alone unit and Matt has been helping me to get it running correctly, although I still have a ways to go on that score. I took it apart this afternoon and am in the process of assembling it on the shaft of my Watson device. I have two coils, but I am thinking of waiting until the wire I ordered comes in so I can wind my coils like Matt said I should have in the first place. So hopefully in the next few days I will have it running. I have the motor on the shaft already and all I have to do is bolt down the coils and it will be ready to wire up and give it a go. Probably sometime early next week depending on when my wire gets here. I may need three or more coils to move the amount of weight I have on my shaft, although once you get it going it goes great.
Turion

If your card is still itching you could go here:

VW BEETLE T1 CAMPER / TRANSPORTER 30 AMP DYNAMO (NEW) on eBay (end time 21-Oct-10 09:32:43 BST)

Regards
John
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  #244  
Old 10-02-2010, 07:38 AM
sinergicus sinergicus is offline
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SCR parameter

Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
You could use an scr triggered by the relay or commutator.
Just replace the ne2 with your switch
Thank you for your suggestion;I thought about this .I suppose the scr must be an high amp scr .The discharging the 1000 microfarad 200 v cap (at 100 V) across the battery is very powerful and the amperage going through scr will attain big value...and the high amp scr is very expensive (for me)

I don,t have too much experience in electronics;maybe you can give me some
specs about this kind of scr's and some models we can find on the market..

Thanks
Mike
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  #245  
Old 10-02-2010, 08:25 AM
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Try TYN612. They are very cheap.
Go google the datasheet. It will give you the pinouts. It is spec. 600V , 12A. If you pulse it , it will handle much higher current.
It is maybe not such a good idea to pulse 100V to a 12V battery.
I would rather use 24V pulses and not go more than 5 x battery voltage(60V) and pulse more frequently between drive motor pulses.
This is all speculation as I am still working on something similar but has not finished and tested it yet.
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Last edited by nvisser; 10-02-2010 at 08:27 AM.
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  #246  
Old 10-04-2010, 11:00 AM
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John,
Thanks for the link! I tried to buy it on E-Bay but the seller had something set up wrong and I was unable to. The good news is it gave me all the specs so I can find one for sale elsewhere.

Meanwhile, I will use the motor that Matt helped me build that runs on a circuit of his design. If it is not as successful as I'd like, that's ok, because I have the right size wire coming and will be building new coils for it as soon as the wire gets here. Hopefully I'll then be able to duplicate Matt's results.

I got my reed switches in the mail Saturday, so today I will be firing up my Watson device for the first time. I am not quite sure how to wire all my coils, but am going to connect them straight to the charge battery and see what happens. Hopefully nothing goes boom. I will have a gauge on the battery to monitor voltage so I don't overcharge with the sixteen coils I will have firing. If that doesn't seem to work I will hook them to a capacitor bank and then through a bridge rectifier to my charge battery. I will post video on my YouTube channel later today and post a link here. Will keep you all updated on the test results.

For those who are interested, here are a few links for parts and things.
TAP plastics here in California has nice plastic rotors already cut to a variety of different sizes.
Plastic Circles: TAP Plastics

Applied magnets has neos with countersunk holes which makes it easy to bolt them in place rather than using glue, which also means easy to get apart to use for a different project when you want to. They also carry wire in every size you might need
cPath_1_11 | products_id_605 | Neodymium Magnets 1 in x 1/4 in w/Dual Sided Countersunk Hole Disc - Applied Magnets & WindMax Wind Turbines

All electronics has almost everything else you can think of in the way of parts to build whatever it is you're trying to build
All Electronics | Electronic and Electro-Mechanical Parts and Supplies at Discount Prices

If you need aluminum brackets to support your bearings, here is a place where you can order lengths of "L" shaped bracket material as short as one foot, and then cut it into smaller pieces with your trusty hack saw.
http://www.metalsdepot.com/products/alum2.phtml?page=sangle&LimAcc=$LimAcc






You can either ask questions and look stupid or keep quiet and remain stupid.
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Last edited by Turion; 10-06-2010 at 06:49 AM. Reason: Addition
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  #247  
Old 10-05-2010, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by john_g View Post
Hi Turion
What about using say a VW beetle dynamo and run it as a motor? It has wound fields and about 1/2 shaft. I got an old one the other day but one of the brushes is missing so haven't tried it.

Regards

John

Some facts about VW beetle dynamos
Electric Vehicles

How To Test Your Generator - How to Polarize Your Generator

Polarizing Your Generator
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Last edited by nvisser; 10-05-2010 at 03:30 PM.
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  #248  
Old 10-06-2010, 03:19 AM
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Haven't been able to get my motor to power the Watson Device. Don't think I have enough coils to rotate the weight of the device. My wire has come in, so I will be winding more coils tomorrow and maybe then I can get it running. Sorry about that. Only have two coils and getting it properly "tuned" is a little tough when I can't get it running. But tomorrow is another day.
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  #249  
Old 11-08-2010, 07:23 PM
saeed saeed is offline
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Free Energy generator

Dear All
in brief , is there a really free energy or overunity generator working well ?
if yes , is it available in the market ?
best regards
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  #250  
Old 11-08-2010, 10:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nvisser View Post
You could use an scr triggered by the relay or commutator.
Just replace the ne2 with your switch
Is this a proved way to discharge for example 1uF/400V cap ? How can I discharge such cap into battery using scr ?
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  #251  
Old 11-09-2010, 07:10 AM
ourbobby ourbobby is offline
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Bedini FEG 1984

Hi guys,
Someone seems to have forgotten one of the important features of the FEG. That is, energy from the flywheel. As the battery is switched out, momentum allows the flywheel to continue pulsing through the coils. Charging the capacitor and then allowing this discharge to recharge the battery. John Bedini states that it required approximately five times the voltage of the battery fr this to work. The output from the FEG was Electrostatic. From the enegry contained in the momentum of the flywheel. This Electrostatic pulsing enables the capacitor to charge without current from the coils. Perhaps minimum current. Pulsing on the original FEG was at about 33%. Energy from thge flywheel was about 66%. This is the equation that demands some attention.

On a different note the Watson crib looks to have 12 coils and 13 magnets. IMHO, contrary to previous comments about magnets and coils opposing one another. Both methods will produce an output. Watsons will provide a more seamless output with a ripple The Bedini output will provide a definite pulsing action. IMHO, more suited to the task at hand - that is radiant charging of the capacitors.

Also important is the statement by John Bedini that Electrostaic charging of a Lead Acid battery is not harmful. This implies that the battery is being given a voltage potential with a limited amount of current. Too much current with the higher voltage will create heating problems within the battery - to be avoided.

The critical feature for the FEG, IMHO is matching of the switching and pulsing frequency, whether using one battery or two batteries switched. The power inherent in the FEG apparatus comes from tuning the flywheel rotation to the pulse oscillations. You then get the classic high Q minimum Z applicable to a resonant circuit. Remember too, That John Bedini believes that the power available through this techniques does not rely upon classical charge discharge methods generally thought to be the only way to use a battery.

Hope this helps

Rob
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  #252  
Old 11-20-2010, 09:53 AM
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A post by John Bedini himself

I want to re post this post from John Bedini here.
Lotsw of us tried different ways to make this machine working and i think the answer lies in the post below.
Non Linearity!!!
I do want to apply that to my old machine. Using 8 coils and 7 magnets.
He specificly spoke about that at the conference.

The watson Machine
Bit's,
I find nothing wrong in your work as I watched it work. I plan on making the machine that Watson did as Rick has said he is going to do this again.
Your good at your work as you have learned to take your time with things, excellent work in my book.

Also the lawnmower Rick had was a killer but nobody noticed the torque from that window motor running on one coil. I know you saw the coil that was equivalent to 5 gauge wire. The new Bedini/Cole switch is a killer as Rick pulled the front wheels right off the ground. Also the rotor in the machine was equivalent to ED's machine at the coral castle as I spoke of that machine in my talk. What is hidden to everybody is right in front of the eyes looking.Excellent work Jeff.

But this time we have 7 months to do it. I think I will make the whole Watson machine out of wood and change the geometry around. We will hook your battery swapper to it. Watson did not do anything special except use my 555 timer circuit and a starter button. Three things Controller switching and a non liner generator. Thanks Jeff for all your hard work and it did pay off.
John B
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  #253  
Old 12-09-2010, 07:24 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Choosing a motor.

Should we avoid brushed DC motors? For some reason, i wonder
if the pulses will not be happy with them.

Are scooter motors a good starting point? (24v, 300watt, 20 delivered UK)
watt scooter motor items - Get great deals on Sporting Goods, Vehicle Parts Accessories items on eBay UK!
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  #254  
Old 12-09-2010, 11:05 PM
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As Peter has said, the motor should be one with a wound rotor and stator, so during off time there is no attraction between the rotor and stator to slow it down. A permanent magnet motor is NOT a good choice for this device.
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  #255  
Old 12-10-2010, 11:14 AM
Zooty Zooty is offline
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A Hall driven Window motor would be good for this
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  #256  
Old 12-10-2010, 03:28 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turion View Post
As Peter has said, the motor should be one with a wound rotor and stator, so during off time there is no attraction between the rotor and stator to slow it down. A permanent magnet motor is NOT a good choice for this device.
The motor needs to be DC, doesn't it? would you make some suggestions?
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  #257  
Old 12-11-2010, 09:38 AM
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Zooty is right. A hall driven window motor would be perfect. Anything that gives you the torque you need without consuming power, and a window motor that supplies the torque while also charging a second battery is probably an excellent choice.

So is the "Simple Motor" that Matt Jones has the schematic for on YouTube. Either the mechanical switching version or the solid state. I have built several of them and I am going to try the simple motor first. Just have to wind more coils as one coil was not enough to get the thing running... not enough torque. A standard Bedini motor probably doesn't have enough torque. It is designed to be an energizer, not a motor. But it too would use little or NO power.

At the conference Peter showed us that the Lockridge device and the Watson device are the same cat skinned two different, but essentially the same, ways. I have ordered his DVD because I just couldn't take notes fast enough at the conference. I feel like he gave most, if not ALL, of the information needed to build the device and as soon as my DVDs get here, I will try to replicate.

Too many builds going on at the same time. But at least it keeps me off the street.
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  #258  
Old 12-12-2010, 03:14 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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But if you had to go out tomorrow and buy a commonly
available motor, Turion, what would you choose? Would
you avoid brush motors? would you get a car starter motor?
Or another type?
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  #259  
Old 12-13-2010, 03:24 AM
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There are two important requirement. First, that it has enough power to turn the weight of your machine, so pay attention to the torque it is capable of producing because it has to turn a lot of weight from a standing start. The other important consideration is that it have the wound rotor and wound stator so that it will "free wheel" with no attraction to anything when it is in the off mode between pulses. THAT IS THE MOST ESSENTIAL PIECE. A Chevy starter would be a good choice because it is DESIGNED to turn over engines from a dead start. It would probably BURN UP if used as a standard motor, but remember in our configuration it will be pulsed. On/Off. Most of the time it will be off, so I would say that is a perfect solution. Get an old one with a wound rotor and wound stator. New ones may have that configuration also, but I'm not sure.

Here's what I am building. I am building my OWN motor to run it.
YouTube - 11Turion's Channel
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  #260  
Old 02-06-2011, 02:04 AM
sunboy sunboy is offline
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Window motor driver is really the best choice, then: What is the best type of generator should choose it? efficient generator is also very important.
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  #261  
Old 09-27-2015, 03:56 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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FEG Replication

Hi guys
this is my first post, so be kind to me.

I have built a FEG. I seem to be missing something because although it runs not very smoothly - it is hunting, waiting for the next battery pulse - it does run but slowly drains the battery. I am uploading a few pics of the scope output and the actual machine.

I have built the magnets into the flywheel. Machining costs are not cheap. My first attempt kept bouncing off the bench because it was running unbalanced. With the machined parts my FEG runs smoothly. I have used N35 40x20x5 neodymium magnets. My first attempt with older ceramic magnets did not give a very strong output. The scope is showing about 60 volts (20 volt scale) through the diode into the capacitor. Two photos, after discharge - lower voltage and charging 50 volts. However, my caps only charge up to 32 volts over a period of about 1 second. I am limited to the size of capacitance. 10000uf is about the maximum at the moment. My run capacitors are a total 13uf

I am using the basic circuit of John Bedini, which I think is supposed to theoretically charge the battery with positive BEMF pulses. That said I have used a Hall sensor to define the changeover of flux through the coil but cannot seem to locate the actual point of pivoting to selectively collect the peak BEMF which should maximise the output to the cap. So I am thinking that I am maybe introducing some negative influence into the capacitor charge that is reducing the effectiveness of the charge prior to discharge into the battery.

It has taken a bit of time to put this FEG together so I am hopeful of getting it to run with the excess output as suggested by John Bedini in his book.

cheers

Dwane

Edit: the time base for the scope is 2ms. The voltage scale is 20 volts. Without a tachometer I am roughing the speed at around 620 RPM. The diameter of the flywheel is 295mm. I have eight coils and eight magnets.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_7007A.jpg (155.5 KB, 14 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7010A.jpg (164.9 KB, 12 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7011A.jpg (160.1 KB, 24 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7013A.jpg (159.9 KB, 19 views)
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Last edited by Dwane; 09-27-2015 at 04:25 AM.
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  #262  
Old 09-27-2015, 02:34 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Dear Dwane,

Welcome aboard.

I am pretty sure that ferrite magnets, for some reason, are essential. This is certainly true of the Bedini SG. i.e. Neo magnets won't do.

Also, the motor needs to be a field wound motor - i.e. no resistance when there is no current.

Also, the pulse going to the motor MUST be out of step with the pulse coming from the energiser. I think this is where the flywheel comes in - trying to get a lag. There may be other reasons why keeping the magnets separate from the flywheel might be a good idea - for swapping andf exchanging if needed.

Is your scope a 2 channel one? If so, why not scope up the pulse to the motor on one and the pulse from the energiser on the other so we can all check that they are out of step?

All the best

Paul-R

p.s. Have you seen Patrick's mega-work?

http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk
.
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  #263  
Old 09-27-2015, 02:38 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Dear Dwane,

Welcome aboard.

What document are you following? There is a small A4 pamphlet called the Free energy Generator, 1984 or thereabouts and there is a book.

i am pretty sure that ferrite magnets, for some reason, are essential. This is certainly true of the Bedini SG. i.e. Neo magnets won't do.

Also, the motor needs to be a field wound motor. no resistance when there is no current.

Also, the pulse going to the motor MUST be out of step with the pulse coming from the energiser. I think this is where the flywheel comes in - trying to get a lag. There may be other reasons why keeping the magnets separate from the flywheel might be a good idea - for swapping andf exchanging if needed.

Since your scope is a 2 channel one, why not scope up the pulse to the motor on one and the pulse from the energiser on the other so we can all check that they are out of step?

All the best

Paul-R

p.s. Have you seen Patrick's mega-work?
http://www.free-energy-info.co.uk
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  #264  
Old 09-27-2015, 11:02 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Hello wrtner,
Thanks for the comments. I am using the document titled "Bearden Bedini Free Energy Generation".

Mr Bedini states that permanent magnet motors are best. And having this running I would also add that any dc wound motor would work! From my reading of the various similar appliances I agree that the neodymium might be too strong as with the SG motor where I have read that the magnetic flux will saturate the fields surrounding the transistor, thus interfering with its operation. I am using a Hall sensor to capture the switching moment which is my problem for some reason. This switches perfectly but I am not getting the response I am expecting.

I did make the mistake of using N50 neodymium magnets. The forced needed to drive the rotor was far greater than the returns. I know what you are saying about the magnet strength and the neodymium magnets might be affecting the "hunting" effect I am getting. Actually I think my FEG it is running at closer to 1100 RPM than 620 RPM. I'll have to build a tacho.

I have the correct pulse sync I think. However when this is running it makes little difference either way. Strange to say. I have also found that alternating the phases when correlated to the actual main cap discharge is the important concept. Its either back to the battery or its a substitute for the battery pulse. It seems that like the SG there has to be a repulsion action as the magnet traverses the coil so as to enhance the low drag effect to enable the increased efficiency of the flywheel. And this is where the peaks are to be chopped.

This is a very clever design by Mr Bedini. He has not fully explained the principle in his book. He wants us to work it out I think. I am thinking that there must be something I am not doing properly or that I have not included in the setup. Also my literal circuit might be a bit too simplistic!!

Your comments make me think which is good. Sometimes we do not see the trees for the wood or vice versa!

Cheers and thanks

Dwane
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Old 09-27-2015, 11:26 PM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Update

Here are a few shots of the relays I am using. Its a bit messy a work in progress. The relays are 85amp with silver/copper contacts. They have about a 5ms switch time. I got them from Ebay. They are not cheap! They work though.

cheers

Dwane
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_7017A.jpg (252.2 KB, 16 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7018A.jpg (253.7 KB, 15 views)
File Type: jpg IMG_7020A.jpg (276.2 KB, 15 views)
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  #266  
Old 09-28-2015, 02:38 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Quote:
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Mr Bedini states that permanent magnet motors are best.

I have the correct pulse sync I think. However when this is running it makes little difference either way.
The document is a 33 page A4 booklet, isn't it? (If a pdf, Adobe Reader thinks it is a 30 page doc). Just checking that we are using the same paper.

Where does he say this about PM motors?

The pulse sync issue may not necessarily be noticed. I believe that one type is regular electricity and the other is cold electricity. Therefore, they need to hit the battery separately.

It would be very useful if you were to put one channel on the pulse going to the motor and the other on the pulse coming from the energiser.
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Old 09-29-2015, 03:38 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrtner View Post
The document is a 33 page A4 booklet, isn't it? (If a pdf, Adobe Reader thinks it is a 30 page doc). Just checking that we are using the same paper.

Where does he say this about PM motors?

The pulse sync issue may not necessarily be noticed. I believe that one type is regular electricity and the other is cold electricity. Therefore, they need to hit the battery separately.

It would be very useful if you were to put one channel on the pulse going to the motor and the other on the pulse coming from the energiser.
The book I am referring to is 191 pages long I have it's name as "Bearden Bedini Free Energy Generation.pdf". The reference to the Permanent Magnet motor is on page 30 under construction notes. "Permanent magnet motors are suggested based on good efficiency".

Interesting comment about the separating the two types of electricity regarding the pulse sync. I have read the instructions as a simultaneous striking of the battery terminal with a high frequency pulse. Perhaps you mean the BEMF pulse - electric charge only - does not go to the capacitor? and would go directly to the battery terminal? So what would charge the capacitors? Once the magnet has traversed the coil there would be no action until the arrival of the next magnet. My reading is that this starts a flux build up in the coil core. Like the SG everything happens as the magnet passes the peak flux density and the magnetic field collapses creating the BEMF. Do we collect the current from that field energising into the Capacitor? giving us two sources of electricity?

I have the flywheel stripped down at the moment while I set up another sync point for the Hall switch. I should be able to get a couple of photos tomorrow.
Though with a 1 second half cycle it will be difficult to show clearly on my old scope what you are looking at.

Perhaps you could give me the name of the booklet that you are using as a reference.

Cheers

Dwane
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  #268  
Old 09-29-2015, 07:05 AM
Dwane Dwane is offline
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Hello wrtner,
I have seen the problem. I am running the energiser too slowly. I think I was influenced by the Watson machine with the relays. This Energiser needs to be pulsed faster to get the benefit of the low drag design. I have been pulsing it slowly. The loss of momentum is causing the batteries to run down. I need to either switch the relays and fast pulse within the longer pulse or treat the unit as a PWM motor.

I'll post again in a week or so when I have finished rebuilding the controller.

Thanks for your insights.

Cheers

Dwane
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Old 09-29-2015, 12:46 PM
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Dear Dwane,

Surely, your machine is a Watson machine, isn't it?

30 page pamphlet is here:
http://radiant-powered.com/downloads...yGenerator.pdf

I haven't seen the book, and so we may be at crossed purposes. I am thinking in terms of the pamphlet which shows a relatively simple set up. Seeing the pulses on the two channels would be very useful.

Paul
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Old 09-29-2015, 04:02 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrtner View Post
Dear Dwane,

Surely, your machine is a Watson machine, isn't it?
It is worth remembering that there is no real difference between Bedini's device and that of Watson. It's just that Watson built the mother of all Bedini machines of that type.
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