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  #31 (permalink)  
Old 01-20-2008, 07:54 AM
chityaman chityaman is offline
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quick question

How do you get rid of the 555 timer and get the coil to self ocsillate?? I would like to see a drawing of some of the set up if that is not asking too much.

Thanks,

George
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Old 01-20-2008, 08:31 AM
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self oscillates

Hi George,

This schematic shows one variation:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa....html#post4023

The part of the schematic on the right side of the coil core self-oscillates.
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Old 01-20-2008, 09:04 AM
chityaman chityaman is offline
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Thanks again Aaron

I did see that in the post. I am just now learning to read schematics so I am a little slow on the uptake. I kept being thrown off by the 555 chip in the lower left side. I guess you were using it to make sure the caps were discharging in a timely manner. I will get up to speed soon, especially with a group of experimentors like you have hear. We are a dying bread. Most people just like to eat what they are fed. I like to see where the boundries really are. I tell people a story about a baby elephant that is chained to a tree to keep it in place at the circus. Early on he pulls and pulls on the chain and learns that he is unable to break his bonds. As years go by, and he grows into a massive beast, they are able to keep him in place with a little rope tide to a stake in the ground. It is no longer the rope that holds him in captivity. He is a prisoner of his own beliefs!

Question everything!!
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Old 01-20-2008, 04:35 PM
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simple oscillator

Hi George,

Yes the 555 is to pulse the cap bank to a battery.

The easiest way to get a SG circuit to oscillate is to keep increasing the resistance at the base of the transistor until you hear the coil buzzing like a mosquito. You might need to have a magnet just sitting on top of the coil.

This isn't the optimum tuning method to do this but is the fastest way to just have it oscillate. If you're using good size coils, just be careful that you are monitoring your caps so they don't get overcharged because they can rise pretty quick.

That is so true about the elephant analogy!
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Old 01-20-2008, 10:23 PM
chityaman chityaman is offline
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Aaron

Thank you so much for freely sharing your time and information. I truly appreciate it.

George
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Old 01-24-2008, 03:11 AM
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Im not sure this fits here but I found some interesting properties in my sg powered window motor today. I was charging the other day and the charge batt was hovering and ever so slowly increasing from 13.20 to 13.30 over two hours. I am able to trip it into self oscilliation at certain resistances for similar amp draw, but as you guess much faster switching times. When I set it to self oscillate, the charging batt jumped upwards in voltage instantly and climbed to over 14.60 volts within a couple of minutes.

I found it interesting that I could power the wheel and charge, but as soon as I kicked it into solidstate, the top end (13.5 - 15v) charged rapidly. It doesnt charge that fast when the battery is lower. It seems like a good way to top up the last 10% of the charge cycle. I have still to get a suitable pot to adust the frequencies but amp draw is very similar to its rotational state. The ssg circuit has a bridge to collect to cap and scr.
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Old 02-04-2008, 03:58 AM
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Hi all,

I notice that my battery charges faster when I adjust the frequency down to 120hz. If I increase the frequency while charging, the voltage across the battery goes down and stays there until I adjust the frequency back down.

I would have thought the more pulses would equal more radiant energy to the battery but for some reason, it charges slower this way.


Solace


.
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File Type: jpg RE spikes 7.JPG (143.9 KB, 214 views)
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Old 02-04-2008, 04:15 AM
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radiant:current ratio

At the higher frequency, I believe your voltage potential to current ratio is too high...slow it down and you increase the amount of current. You need enough current to get the battery into real charging mode. If the radiant is too pure at the higher frequencies, it will be a fluffy "static" charge.

I'm don't mean just charge with a lot of current...just enough.
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Old 02-04-2008, 06:11 AM
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A level higher

Quote:
Originally Posted by ren View Post
Im not sure this fits here but I found some interesting properties in my sg powered window motor today. I was charging the other day and the charge batt was hovering and ever so slowly increasing from 13.20 to 13.30 over two hours. I am able to trip it into self oscilliation at certain resistances for similar amp draw, but as you guess much faster switching times. When I set it to self oscillate, the charging batt jumped upwards in voltage instantly and climbed to over 14.60 volts within a couple of minutes.

I found it interesting that I could power the wheel and charge, but as soon as I kicked it into solidstate, the top end (13.5 - 15v) charged rapidly. It doesnt charge that fast when the battery is lower. It seems like a good way to top up the last 10% of the charge cycle. I have still to get a suitable pot to adust the frequencies but amp draw is very similar to its rotational state. The ssg circuit has a bridge to collect to cap and scr.
Ren,

I have seen this happen too, but, my theory is that normal batteries are dead, according to the Radiant charger, so when a normal battery is fully charged, like say it is at 12.7 volts, the radiant charger suddenly bursts it up to 14-15 volts, I think that one should leave it like that to make the battery super charged, with a standing voltage of 13.7v and double the capacity.

Bedini talks about this in the video and states: "A 33 Ah battery may look like a 65 Ah battery".

So, When the voltage of the battery jumps up suddenly to 15 volts, it means that the battery is charged one step and is going to be super charged, if you let it there.

Anyway, only thoughts

Elias
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Old 02-04-2008, 03:19 PM
Solace Solace is offline
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Here is the thing though. When I do the 1 ohm test, it is obvious that there is little if any current going to the battery. It is my understanding that the radiant energy causes the battery to charge itself.

I am not using the cap discharge method, only the SG solid state set up with bifiler coil. I don't get a static charge at either low (120 hz) or higher (450hz) frequency. The only difference is the charge time seems to be slower at the higher frequency. The frequency doesn't go very high even with 10k ohms of resistance in the trigger circuit. 450hz is what I get with 10k.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
At the higher frequency, I believe your voltage potential to current ratio is too high...slow it down and you increase the amount of current. You need enough current to get the battery into real charging mode. If the radiant is too pure at the higher frequencies, it will be a fluffy "static" charge.

I'm don't mean just charge with a lot of current...just enough.
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  #41 (permalink)  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:10 AM
Solace Solace is offline
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Hmmmmm....

I found that my cap also charges much faster at low frequency 115hz as opposed to even 180hz. I was charging an uncooperative 9.6v NiCad and decided to put a large non-polarized 600uf 250v cap in parallel and break the connection to the negative of the battery leaving only the cap connected.

At high frequency 200 hz, the cap took 3 or 4 seconds to charge and the neon didn't even light up. At 115hz, the cap charged as soon as the battery was disconnected and the neon light right up. The connection to the battery sparked pretty good when reconnecting.

At first the NiCad would only charge to about 5volts but after shocking it with the cap blast a few times, it has decided to be more cooperative and is now up to 7.5volts and charging.

Last edited by Solace : 02-05-2008 at 03:19 AM.
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  #42 (permalink)  
Old 02-05-2008, 05:23 AM
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Soloid state oscillator diagram

Hi,

About solid state oscillators, you can have a look here also:

http://radiant.100free.com/zpe_bedini_solid.html

(of course you may find other info in the all website, 300 pages html)
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Old 04-06-2008, 04:59 AM
llynch llynch is offline
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Hi everyone,

I have built the solid state circuit according to the schematic in the book. Have noted that my draw from the run battery is 25ma. This circuit sounds like my ssg but has the additional whine from the coil. I checked the frequency of both the positive and negative output and they seem to be hovering around 2khz.

One question that I haven't been able to find an answer for is, should my cap be making the clicking noise? It is not warm to the touch. But it makes the same sound as my ssg did. It's a dc cap 600v 3.3uf poly I believe. I thought I might have had it backwards but there are no markings on it to indicate polarity.
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  #44 (permalink)  
Old 04-06-2008, 07:09 AM
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does your back end have an scr?
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Old 04-06-2008, 05:52 PM
llynch llynch is offline
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It does have an SCR on the back end. I can watch the cap go a little over 70 volts and then drop to 60 then back up again.

I actually made a typo in reference to my ma draw. It's actually 250ma.

Last edited by llynch : 04-06-2008 at 07:47 PM.
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Old 04-07-2008, 01:32 AM
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I only ask because I have read about someone elses experiences with solid state and they were under the impression the scr was making the audible clicking noise.
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Old 04-07-2008, 03:16 AM
llynch llynch is offline
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It was the polarity of the cap being hooked up in reverse causing the clicking. It was also keeping the voltage from climbing past 72v. I swapped both of them around and now the clicking is gone and I get a steady 2.203 khz on both negative and positive output. The cap also is moving up quickly beyond 300v when I checked. It only puts out a single gnat noise now.

Now we'll see how the radiant night treats it.
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Old 04-07-2008, 04:44 AM
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nice
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 04-07-2008, 10:52 PM
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For 555 timers I use this online calculator:555 Timer Calculator

It figures on time and off time as well as frequency and duty cycle. You cant get 50 percent duty cycle but you can get close with a 555.
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Old 04-10-2008, 11:57 PM
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Hi all,

i just loaded the solid state charger with a conditioned 7aH battery. On
the input was a TINY 1.3aH battery.

The start voltage on the 7ah was 12.57 volts
The start voltage on the 1.3ah was 12.96 Volts

I put the 1.3 aH battery as the input on the solid state, and tuned
the pot right down i could tell the draw, i heard the ringing on the
tri filla coil., so i know some thing was going in.

I put the 7aH battery on charge and left to it on to see what happened.

The 7Ah battery charged to nearly 13.30 volts, the 1.3ah lost it after
nearly 40 minutes to zero.

I loaded the 7ah on a fixed resistor at the c20 rate, the battery held
charge from 12.89 to 12.69 Volts (original was 12.57).

There you go, a 1.3aH battery can charge a 7aH CONDITIONED battery.
Here is the snap more to come.
http://img521.imageshack.us/img521/3491/41821419mg4.jpg

At the front you can see the Tiny 1.3ah hour 12 volt battery, in the
middle is Clives solid state i posted a while back, at the end is the
7aH battery showing the charge.

video coming , ill do the test again.

Ash


My Q for Peter is, can a 1.7aH battery charge a 7aH battery conventionally COLD?
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Old 04-10-2008, 11:59 PM
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Dam i am working to hard sorry guys i forgot to post the SCG
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 06-16-2008, 07:07 PM
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Moved here from the SSG thread.

Some early results with solid state charger with solar panel.

first I'll say a bit about the batteries I'm using.

they are 12v 1.3ah sealed lead acid batteries that I use for small experiments.

One is completely dead... I have been using it for about 5 months on a replication of Plengo's "Running and LED forever" and lit an LED at about half brightness for that time. The batttery is completely dead (reads less than a volt under load) though it still lit the led.

anyway... I was using another battery for the experiment before that and left it running for several days until the battery dropped below 6 volts and I chickened out cos I didn't want to kill the battery

about a week later I restarted the experiment with the other battery and left it running. The battery that had dropped below 6 volts has been sitting doing nothing (hadn't been recharged) for almost 6 months. This is the battery I am charging in the following set up.

I first began experimenting with solid state by comparing how high the coil could charge a capacitor with various resistor values. as bench marks I recorded:

1000ohm : 225v charge while drawing 100ma
3000ohm : 204v charge while drawing 75ma

I then thought to give my trusty choke coil a try! I had already soldered the rest of the circuit together so couldn't take out the 3000 ohm resistor but when I added the choke in series the results were as follows:

232v charge while drawing 50ma!

These amp draws were from an analogue meter.

So I left the choke in and hooked up the setup to my little solar panel to see how well it could charge the old battery.

Dissappointingly, the solar panel would only charge the 1000uf capacitor to 1 volt and drew less than 5ma (it doesn't recieve direct sun light).

The neon won't light with the charging battery detached but I can confirm it is oscillating using an am radio. Suprisingly high frequency.

I hooked up the old battery and left it going all day yesterday. and you can imagine my suprise when it went from 6.35volts resting to 7.84volts resting in less than 6 hours!

I have to admit, that I still don't know how much energy is actually in the battery because it could be in poor condition though this seems to be an incredible leap in voltage with such a tiny input!

Dont get too excited yet because this is all very recent so I need to do more tests, but first I want to see if it can fully charge this battery.

Will let you know!

solidstate.jpg
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 06-16-2008, 09:00 PM
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Some very interesting results from a little solidstate number I built here. It is a self oscillating SG circuit with the full cap pulser on the back end. It will charge a 7 amp hour battery from 12.2 to 15v in 2 hours off 24 volts input. I charged one up the other day, let it rest and then load tested it. It ended up coming to rest at 12.73 volts. Funny thing was, as soon as I loaded it with the 300ma globe it only dropped to 12.71 volts and CRAWLED down slowly after that. Usually it would drop a good .10 of a volt before it stabilised!

By the way Sep I think I figured out dump frequency, see my post on the 24v cap pulser. Build the SS guys its awesome!

Last edited by ren : 07-27-2008 at 06:12 AM.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 06-16-2008, 09:04 PM
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Re: Ssg

Quote:
Originally Posted by ren View Post
Some very interesting results from a little solidstate number I built here. It is a self oscillating SG circuit with the full cap pulser on the back end. It will charge a 7 amp hour battery from 12.2 to 15v in 2 hours off 24 volts input. I charged one up the other day, let it rest and then load tested it. It ended up coming to rest at 12.73 volts. Funny thing was, as soon as I loaded it with the 300ma globe it only dropped to 12.71 volts and CRAWLED down slowly after that. Usually it would drop a good .10 of a volt before it stabilised!

By the way Sep I think I figured out dump frequency, see my post on the 24v cap pulser. Build the SS guys its awesome!
-----------------------------
Ok, what is your schematic?
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Old 06-16-2008, 09:46 PM
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More advice I have recieved...

HI Mart , Jacqui here , this just an idea , If you take an SSG cct remove the trigger cct and put your own solidstate signal generator in place of the SSG cct , you should have solidstate energizer . I like to use the TL494 chip and add a variable pulse width and frequency control . The trigger winding could be utilzed or you could just use a 300-500 ohm base resistor and run it directly from your PWM cct . Just multiply the cct ( multi fila ) if you feel so inclined .The coils I wind are 140 foot in length , .6-.8 mill wire . I'm about to put capacitor discharge on a new unit , sort of a Tesla idea . If you beat me to it I say jolly good luck to you .

Bi and good tinkering , Jacqui .

------------

Jacqui , Mart just to clarify , all windings are the same guage and the power transistor / transistors are located between the coil and neg. the other end of the coil winding is the pos. supply or run battery , it's just a coil in series with a DC chopper the output is a tap with diode just between the coil and the transistor collector . This idea is a JB cct without the spining magnet trigger etc. Jacqui .
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Old 06-17-2008, 01:59 AM
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So basically

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sephiroth View Post
Moved here from the SSG thread.

Some early results with solid state charger with solar panel.

first I'll say a bit about the batteries I'm using.

they are 12v 1.3ah sealed lead acid batteries that I use for small experiments.

One is completely dead... I have been using it for about 5 months on a replication of Plengo's "Running and LED forever" and lit an LED at about half brightness for that time. The batttery is completely dead (reads less than a volt under load) though it still lit the led.

anyway... I was using another battery for the experiment before that and left it running for several days until the battery dropped below 6 volts and I chickened out cos I didn't want to kill the battery

about a week later I restarted the experiment with the other battery and left it running. The battery that had dropped below 6 volts has been sitting doing nothing (hadn't been recharged) for almost 6 months. This is the battery I am charging in the following set up.

I first began experimenting with solid state by comparing how high the coil could charge a capacitor with various resistor values. as bench marks I recorded:

1000ohm : 225v charge while drawing 100ma
3000ohm : 204v charge while drawing 75ma

I then thought to give my trusty choke coil a try! I had already soldered the rest of the circuit together so couldn't take out the 3000 ohm resistor but when I added the choke in series the results were as follows:

232v charge while drawing 50ma!

These amp draws were from an analogue meter.

So I left the choke in and hooked up the setup to my little solar panel to see how well it could charge the old battery.

Dissappointingly, the solar panel would only charge the 1000uf capacitor to 1 volt and drew less than 5ma (it doesn't recieve direct sun light).

The neon won't light with the charging battery detached but I can confirm it is oscillating using an am radio. Suprisingly high frequency.

I hooked up the old battery and left it going all day yesterday. and you can imagine my suprise when it went from 6.35volts resting to 7.84volts resting in less than 6 hours!

I have to admit, that I still don't know how much energy is actually in the battery because it could be in poor condition though this seems to be an incredible leap in voltage with such a tiny input!

Dont get too excited yet because this is all very recent so I need to do more tests, but first I want to see if it can fully charge this battery.

Will let you know!

Attachment 637
What you are doing is adding a couple of caps and I higher resistor in the trigger coil section... to the SSG. I did this for a while with a 5K pot. With low voltages it did great but it did seem to heat up my resistor, But I did not have caps in the circuit as you do...
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Old 06-17-2008, 06:23 AM
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lol... I did notice the caps

There isn't any heat even with the 12v supply, though that will be because it has such a low draw. I'm just suprised it ocsillates at all with only 1/200 watt input! Let alone charge a 12v battery.

Edit : did I say 1/20 of a watt? I meant 1/200 of a watt!

Last edited by Sephiroth : 06-18-2008 at 05:58 AM.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 06-17-2008, 08:08 AM
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Are SS better than SSG in result?

Hi,

Are SS better than SSG in result?

regards,
Selamatg
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Old 06-18-2008, 02:22 AM
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Solid State benefits

Quote:
Originally Posted by selamatg View Post
Hi,

Are SS better than SSG in result?

regards,
Selamatg

It takes less energy, charges the battery faster ( more on time typically ) and you don't have to start it like the SSG so a blessing for solar panels. Many pluses to a SS. Also it will charge at lower voltage.

Downside is you don't get any mechanical energy.

I am willing to give that up myself I am tired of fighting bearings and alignments... And another benefit. I will keep doing the SSG's but looking forward to set it - forget it type charging.

Quiet. ( unless you make your coils sing )
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Old 06-18-2008, 05:19 AM
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Hey Mart do you still need a simple schematic for SS build?
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