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-   John Bedini (http://www.energeticforum.com/john-bedini/)
-   -   Bedini SG (http://www.energeticforum.com/john-bedini/364-bedini-sg.html)

Chip Shorter 02-12-2008 06:07 PM

Something I'm working on is employing copper for shaping of the magnetic field by means of a piece of copper between the core and the passing magnet(s). The goal is to produce a faster window to the magnet thus a sharper gradient. Also if two wheels are employed as mentioned earlier in the thread the events can be timed and complimentary. Also considering a shottkey type circuit to minimize current.

Aaron 02-12-2008 07:22 PM

Earth Rod thread started
 
I started an Earth Rods thread, posted details and a link to a 1 minute video here: http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...arth-rods.html

For any Earth Rod discussions for applications on the SG, etc... please post in that new thread.

peper10 02-12-2008 08:13 PM

You got the jackpot!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 16172)
since we are comparing desing ideas I had here is what I had in mid for a double rotor... Attachment 386



I found that alot of energy can be captured with a window coil placed behind the coils as well so I thought I might place recovery coils on the outside of the rotors...

definatly will be my next build when I have the time and cash! lol

just saw your vid aaron! looks really interesting! I will try that tonight! will let you know the results!




The only thing with this setup,you gotta have to redone the one you have.
I just want to say you're actual setup is pretty nice and i don't want to
feel sad if you dismantle it.
:o
I was just telling you that you'r setup bring me the idea of using it as it is
and make some improuvements with it..:notworthy:
And i thank you for it.

Always glad to talk to you.
peper10

wizzle 02-12-2008 10:55 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Aaron (Post 16193)
I have always thought neos work fine as long as the gap is wide enough.

It's all in the gap. ;)
20inch rotor with 12 neos, 50 x 20 x 12mm. Draws 175Ma @ 12 volts 455 RPM.

I used a scope to set the coils gap. Interesting thing is that the 3 slaves have 32 mm gap while the master has 41 mm gap.
Just got it running last night so haven't had time to do much testing/tinkering.
Did drive it with 36 volts & got 600+ RPM at 300 Ma draw.

One thing that I found a bit odd, is that it will spin clockwise twice as fast as it will counter clockwise. :thinking:

On another note, has anyone noticed that almost all of Mr. Bedini's energizers use aluminum rotors with the magnets inset into the rotor?
Could this be because the aluminum will alter the magnetic field?
Just a thought.

Thanks!
Rod

Attachment 388

elias 02-13-2008 07:35 AM

Impulse Power
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stonewater (Post 16192)
hi everyone,

the higher your current draw, the less radiant you will be harvesting.

Hi everyone,

I think that John thought at first that pure radiant would charge the battery, but later on found out that a combination of both is required to charge the battery, and for each type of battery there must be an optimum point of current/aether ratio, no? When I adjust my pot, (increase it) to make my rotor turn faster with less torque, the battery seems to be charging slower. I personally think that actually the current charges the battery and the aether(High Potential Impulse) adds to it, and the aether cannot charge the battery by itself, because it cannot move the Heavy Ions! The main trick in Bedini's systems to use the inertia of the ions by impulsing a battery, (Like a child's swing for example).

BTW, It was in my mind thinking what is the Aether we are talking about here which is charging batteries? Aether is the essence of everything I suppose, which causes the Inertia and Gravity also, no? So in my opinion Charging batteries with impulses is no different than hitting a nail with a hammer into the wall. The nail on the wall being the battery, and the hammer hitting the nail being our impulse, and an impulse with more current means a hammer hitting the nail with more kinetic energy. If the hammer does not gain enough kinetic energy (0.5mv^2) then it is unable to get the nail into the wall. So there is needed a bare minimum of kinetic energy (electric current) to make the nail get into the wall (battery charge).

If we use this analogy, then it would be evident that how HARD it is to get the nail to the wall, by constantly pushing it!! It is almost impossible and requires so much effort! This is how we are charging the batteries, with our conventional battery chargers, which require so much electric current (pushing force).

Where does the excess energy when we hit the nail on the wall come from? It is evident that much more energy is needed to get it into the wall, by only pushing it into the wall. IT IS COMING FROM THE AETHER I SUPPOSE. Or as Aaron says from the time itself. Impulse or the DIRAC FUNCTION or the sharp gradient is a key to free energy, why? Because it has a FINITE ENERGY(One), But an INFINITE EFFECT IN ZERO TIME.

This is what I have understood in studying and thinking about these systems.
Any comments?

Elias

riku2015 02-13-2008 07:27 PM

Hi all, i'm new user at this forum!

just question, what i never getted an answer at overunity forums, what happens if put the coils unsynchronized to motor?
here is pictures at overunity forum and more at my blog.

b.t.w. nice projects here at this topic! :)

Sephiroth 02-13-2008 07:27 PM

Quote:

The nail on the wall being the battery, and the hammer hitting the nail being our impulse, and an impulse with more current means a hammer hitting the nail with more kinetic energy. If the hammer does not gain enough kinetic energy (0.5mv^2) then it is unable to get the nail into the wall. So there is needed a bare minimum of kinetic energy (electric current) to make the nail get into the wall (battery charge).
I like the anology but I don't think more current is desirable... I think the "kinetic energy" from the hammer is the voltage.... the higher the voltage spikes..

as you said John couldn't charge the batteries on pure radiant but i have a feeling the reason why some current is neccesary is because of the lack of electrons being supplied to the batteries... from what I hear the pure radiant charge damaged batteries in the end so it sounds like the charging process is occuring but the chemical reaction inside the batteries is starved of electrons.

To use another analogy... electrons are to the batteries (when being charged) as CO2 is to a plant. The plant can grow and survive using just the ambient CO2 (in the same way electrons are always present for the batteries) but will grow at a much faster rate and will be far healthier if the CO2 level is increased. Without enough CO2 the cell walls (battery plates) will be brittle and poorly constructed.

so by supplying some current to the batteries we are increasing the electrons and allowing the chemical process to perform efficently. Feeding the batteries in a way.

basically if not enough electrons are present then the oxidation and reduction process won't be complete and will possibly result in radicals that form new chemicals that would not be normally present in the battery... this kind of damage would not be reversible even on the ssg.

Once again this is all just theory! I'd be curious about what John found when he examined the batteries from the pendulum...






anyway!!! the real reason I'm posting tonight is to ask about people's experiences with neos/rare earths....

what size neos are you using? I was just thinking today that you can get neos that are just a few millimeters (even 1mm!) across and I have little doubt that even tiny ones will be strong enough to trigger the ssg... perhaps using very thin neos we can simulate a very strong, narrow and uniform pole? perhaps better then a superpole? though, due to their size, the field may not be strong enough to permanently magnetise the core.

so, what dimensions have been tried?

Sephiroth 02-13-2008 07:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riku2015 (Post 16240)
Hi all, i'm new user at this forum!

just question, what i never getted an answer at overunity forums, what happens if put the coils unsynchronized to motor?
here is picturesoverunity forum and more at my blog.

b.t.w. nice projects here at this topic! :)

welcome to the forum!

by unsynchronised I'm guessing you mean your slave coils fire just after the magnet has passed over it?

I guess you may loose some torque but maybe not depending on how far out of sync they are...

though I wonder if it will make a difference in the charging effect? One part of the theory ehind the operation of the energiser is the sharp switching of the poles in the coil. basically, just before the coil fires the top of the coil is a south pole and the bottom of the coil is a north pole (due to the magnetic field of the rotor magnet). But then the coil briefly fires which immeadiatly swaps the poles so that the top of the coil is now north and the bottom is south.

If the coils are out of sync then the field induced by the magnet over the coil may not by uniform or be as strong as if they were in sync. This may reduce the effect but it is worth experimenting with... you will definatly learn something what ever your conclusion is.

riku2015 02-13-2008 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 16243)

by unsynchronised I'm guessing you mean your slave coils fire just after the magnet has passed over it?

- All coils is master, no slaves.
- draws only about 140-150mA without charging battery @ 12volts
- gets 4 times more ??? radiant energy (yes this is the issue? could this be true?) look pics taken from scope at overunity forum, if you people cannot see those, i can post as attachment here as well.

here is from my page (there is not yet scope pics)

i think 4 synced coils gives only 1 big spike while 4 unsynced gives 4 times more? is this true?

elias 02-13-2008 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth (Post 16241)
I like the anology but I don't think more current is desirable... I think the "kinetic energy" from the hammer is the voltage.... the higher the voltage spikes..

as you said John couldn't charge the batteries on pure radiant but i have a feeling the reason why some current is neccesary is because of the lack of electrons being supplied to the batteries... from what I hear the pure radiant charge damaged batteries in the end so it sounds like the charging process is occuring but the chemical reaction inside the batteries is starved of electrons.

To use another analogy... electrons are to the batteries (when being charged) as CO2 is to a plant. The plant can grow and survive using just the ambient CO2 (in the same way electrons are always present for the batteries) but will grow at a much faster rate and will be far healthier if the CO2 level is increased. Without enough CO2 the cell walls (battery plates) will be brittle and poorly constructed.

so by supplying some current to the batteries we are increasing the electrons and allowing the chemical process to perform efficently. Feeding the batteries in a way.

basically if not enough electrons are present then the oxidation and reduction process won't be complete and will possibly result in radicals that form new chemicals that would not be normally present in the battery... this kind of damage would not be reversible even on the ssg.

Once again this is all just theory! I'd be curious about what John found when he examined the batteries from the pendulum...


anyway!!! the real reason I'm posting tonight is to ask about people's experiences with neos/rare earths....

what size neos are you using? I was just thinking today that you can get neos that are just a few millimeters (even 1mm!) across and I have little doubt that even tiny ones will be strong enough to trigger the ssg... perhaps using very thin neos we can simulate a very strong, narrow and uniform pole? perhaps better then a superpole? though, due to their size, the field may not be strong enough to permanently magnetise the core.

so, what dimensions have been tried?

Sephiroth,

Thanks for your insights, I am still wanting to figure out why? electron current and radiant both must be. I guess that the Ions, cannot start moving to buildup more charge inside the battery, with less electron flow, and it must have a minimum value for each type of battery. I have seen that large Bedini machine draw up to 10 Amps, and the little ones draw 5 and 1 Amps so I concluded that the input current must not be too low to get good battery charging. Bedini, also mentions that "By limiting the current in the input we get a better radiant output". I don't like the batteries get fluffy charge without any internal transformation as Aaron mentions.

As for the hammer, thanks for your comments, I revised my thoughts: Hammer's kinetic energy = 0.5mv^2, and potential to the battery is like the velocity of the hammer(v), and the electron current is more like the mass of the hammer(m), and the sharp gradient is what the Radiant is, and it is behind the Potential as it is behind the Inertia of the hammer. It appears when the hammer suddenly hits the nail, because the inertia of the hammer is caused by the Aether, and the Aether adds to the energy in the impact, when the hammer hits the nail suddenly. I really am getting to think that we are utilizing the Aether in any sharp gradient or impulse we are making use of.

BTW, If your hammer is so big with much mass it may bend the nail you are hitting and make it unusable, no? also if your hammer is too small, it doesn't matter how fast you move it, it would not have any much effect in getting the nail into the wall depending on the type of the nail and the wall. So a current of about an ampere would destroy a small battery, but would charge a 55AH battery pretty well, without heating and also Radiant with not enough current would not have enough force to make a larger battery start charging.

Elias

ren 02-13-2008 09:00 PM

Hi Riku, I did try to answer you @ OU, but perhaps I wasnt precise enough.

With multiple coils that fire out of sync you will definately see more torque from your wheel. As far as the charging effect however this is what I believe will happen. You may be getting more spikes per rotation into the battery due to multiple separate collapses, but I dont necessarily think this means better charging. There are some very valid comments above that talk about the need for current flowing through to the secondary (love the nail analogy Elias!). I have confirmed to that the battery will charge better/faster when more current does flow through. I am no master at this so prove me wrong if Im wrong:thumbsup:

Also the E-amplification effect you get when all coils fire in unison increases the power of each pulse going to the battery. You will still get a significant increase in speed with the master slave config, it may not have as much torque however.

One other thing to consider is that multiple trigger windings could affect current draw negatively. I think that if you are set on having multiple triggers that you should go with two, three max. Bundle two coils (or more) together to fire in unison and have two (ore more) that fire out of phase. This way you will get the benefit of both effects.

Welcome to the forums!:cheers:

elias 02-13-2008 09:04 PM

I don't think so
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by riku2015 (Post 16247)
- All coils is master, no slaves.
- draws only about 140-150mA without charging battery @ 12volts
- gets 4 times more ??? radiant energy (yes this is the issue? could this be true?) look pics taken from scope at overunity forum, if you people cannot see those, i can post as attachment here as well.

here is from my page (there is not yet scope pics)

i think 4 synced coils gives only 1 big spike while 4 unsynced gives 4 times more? is this true?

Hi Riku, Welcome!

I don't think that you are getting more radiant energy back, because when the coils are in sync the spikes add up and cannot be seen separately.

And a question, how did you make your calculator count the turns, it is pretty nice, has it got any kind of input?

Elias

theremart 02-13-2008 09:53 PM

These are Cool! Bike generators with Neo magnets
 
I saw these on a youtube video with an SSG, so I thought why not try it.

YouTube - Batteryless Dynamo on Bedini

I have one, took it apart, and inside is a sphere Neo with a cylinder with very fine magnet wire wrapped around the tube.

Batteryless Bicycle bike safety LEDs lights, A non friction bicycle dynamo, generator, No battery, No friction, science DIY kit, invention, new product. is where I got mine...


I have ordered 8 (1) inch Neo spheres. I can't wait till they get here.

Questions and Answers

How much voltage and current does this dynamo generate?
About 7V, 25mA pulses.

peper10 02-13-2008 10:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by riku2015 (Post 16247)
- All coils is master, no slaves.
- draws only about 140-150mA without charging battery @ 12volts
- gets 4 times more ??? radiant energy (yes this is the issue? could this be true?) look pics taken from scope at overunity forum, if you people cannot see those, i can post as attachment here as well.

here is from my page (there is not yet scope pics)

i think 4 synced coils gives only 1 big spike while 4 unsynced gives 4 times more? is this true?

:cheers:
I riku!!!!
And welcome abord this ODYSEY!!!!!
I wonder if you talk about mecanical energy or spikes energy???
I can't find out any mesurements about energy,(because ,i admit, i don't
have the equipement)but,about mecanical energy,i get something about
working with car engines.
They have a lot of configurations,and,most of the best energy efficient
ares configures by having only 1 detonation per revolution.
For the energy part,there a bunch of guys on this forrum that ares pretty
qualified on this field.
And belive me,you can trust them!!!!!!!

Again welcome and enjoy the ride...
peper10

peper10 02-13-2008 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by theremart (Post 16257)
I saw these on a youtube video with an SSG, so I thought why not try it.

YouTube - Batteryless Dynamo on Bedini

I have one, took it apart, and inside is a sphere Neo with a cylinder with very fine magnet wire wrapped around the tube.

Batteryless Bicycle bike safety LEDs lights, A non friction bicycle dynamo, generator, No battery, No friction, science DIY kit, invention, new product. is where I got mine...


I have ordered 8 (1) inch Neo spheres. I can't wait till they get here.



Questions and Answers

How much voltage and current does this dynamo generate?
About 7V, 25mA pulses.

:rolleyes:
I Theremart !!!

Actually i'm in process of building a rotary attraction motor and i have found
some step motor that can produce 22dcv and 0.26ma at 1000rpm.
I have seen the vid you pointed earlyer and i wonder if compare ,they have
the same potential.

peper10

Sephiroth 02-13-2008 10:31 PM

elias,

the strange thing is the pendulum DID charge the batteries... and it charged them so convincingly that John included it in EFTV so it must have been months before he realised the negative effects of the pendulum... This is one reason I think that its the accumulation over time of new chemicals in the battery...

In the reduction process electrons must be supplied to complete the chemical reaction to get the sulphur off the lead and turn it back into sulphuric acid...

but I think what the pendulum did was force the sulphur off the lead but there wasn't enough electrons for the reaction to complete fast enough leaving empty atomic bonds that joined with just about anything they could find! This could lead to all kinds of chemical combinations of the elements building up over time that wouldn't normally exist in the battery...

These new chemicals may behave in a similar way to the chemicals in the battery (since they are very similar chemically except there may be a sulphur or hydrogen atom stuck in the wrong place or two where there should be one) but as they build up it will become evident that they do not have the same performance.

So, like john says, we have to work at the speed nature intends. I think the pendulum DID charge the batteries but faster then they could fully make use of the electrons available in their enviroment.

Using the plant analogy again, providing a current is like providing air flow for a plant.

Or I'm just plain wrong... this is just the conclusion I have come to with the facts we have available. :D

Aaron 02-13-2008 10:35 PM

battery conditioning effect
 
When charging the batteries with the SG circuits, a white powder coating builds on the plates in the battery just like on the cathodes of the water fuel cell tubes or plates. It restricts current.

theremart 02-14-2008 02:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peper10 (Post 16260)
:rolleyes:
I Theremart !!!

Actually i'm in process of building a rotary attraction motor and i have found
some step motor that can produce 22dcv and 0.26ma at 1000rpm.

peper10

I am trying to find this out myself.... what can be generated with various coils/configurations. I tried this with my faster wheel ( 8 ceramics spinning at 2500 RPM ) I could get it to generate with the coils but it seemed not to be as effective as with my 300 RPM Neo set. ( mind you the 300 RPM is turning a wind generator which is now up to 5.5 V ) But the thing that got me was it did not slow down the speed of the turnning of the wheel. I could easily hook up 12 of these around the wheel and get 7V * 12 with out slowing down the wheel and I am sure charging the batteries at the same rate. As I said, I can't wait till my larger sphere neos get here. :-)

I am hoping the fine magnet wire is not a factor.... and i can use my 20 gauge wire.

peper10 02-14-2008 04:20 AM

Hey theremart!!!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by theremart (Post 16275)
I am trying to find this out myself.... what can be generated with various coils/configurations. I tried this with my faster wheel ( 8 ceramics spinning at 2500 RPM ) I could get it to generate with the coils but it seemed not to be as effective as with my 300 RPM Neo set. ( mind you the 300 RPM is turning a wind generator which is now up to 5.5 V ) But the thing that got me was it did not slow down the speed of the turnning of the wheel. I could easily hook up 12 of these around the wheel and get 7V * 12 with out slowing down the wheel and I am sure charging the batteries at the same rate. As I said, I can't wait till my larger sphere neos get here. :-)

I am hoping the fine magnet wire is not a factor.... and i can use my 20 gauge wire.


Do you want to a bridge rectifier at each coils???
If your rotor as the MASS,it may be efficient.I don't know you're actual
setup. How many coils do you want to hook to your rotor???

By the way i found an old printer since my last post and have the time to test
it.Here are the results:

NMB stepping motor from minebea no:pm35L-048-ccbo 1000 RPM=31dcv
0.29amp
Mitsumi stepping motor M42SP-6T with a resistance of 61homs @1000 RPM
13.1dcv and 0.56amp

Wem you got some developpements let me know

Thank's to sharing that with me.!!!
peper10

riku2015 02-14-2008 04:53 AM

2 Attachment(s)
here is the spikes what im talking (as attach)

Aaron 02-14-2008 05:12 AM

needs tuning?
 
If it is what I think it is, it might be because the circuit isn't tuned. For each time you trigger it, there should be one spike at normal running speed. That may mean you have to reduce the resistance at the base of the transistor until you see 1 spike.

riku2015 02-14-2008 09:18 AM

hi Aron,
By Bedini_SG : Exploring Tesla type technologies instructions (pdf files Starters Guide 2) there is saying at START should be 3 spikes, but im unable to make it.

i have 3-5 spikes one coil, others have 2 spikes, i have tuned it for purpose, it takes less current draw, if i tune for one spike, then current draw is more and of course also it spins faster, but im not intrested the speed or torque.

my testing purpose is first of all, conditioning batteries, then make two banks, like at startes guide says. i have already 2x5 7Ah batteries (10pcs) im at start point, at discarging c20 the first time this moment.

peper10 02-14-2008 09:51 AM

WOW that's even IMPRESSIVE!!!
 
http//youtube.com/watch?v=onxFDkeYNfk&feature
Quote:

Originally Posted by theremart (Post 16257)
I saw these on a youtube video with an SSG, so I thought why not try it.

YouTube - Batteryless Dynamo on Bedini

I have one, took it apart, and inside is a sphere Neo with a cylinder with very fine magnet wire wrapped around the tube.

Batteryless Bicycle bike safety LEDs lights, A non friction bicycle dynamo, generator, No battery, No friction, science DIY kit, invention, new product. is where I got mine...


I have ordered 8 (1) inch Neo spheres. I can't wait till they get here.

Questions and Answers

How much voltage and current does this dynamo generate?
About 7V, 25mA pulses.


HI Theremart!!!
Do you have seen this vid!!!

Let me know what you think.
:eek: :eek:
peper10

elias 02-14-2008 12:04 PM

Digging up any generator
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by theremart (Post 16257)
I saw these on a youtube video with an SSG, so I thought why not try it.

YouTube - Batteryless Dynamo on Bedini

I have one, took it apart, and inside is a sphere Neo with a cylinder with very fine magnet wire wrapped around the tube.

Batteryless Bicycle bike safety LEDs lights, A non friction bicycle dynamo, generator, No battery, No friction, science DIY kit, invention, new product. is where I got mine...


I have ordered 8 (1) inch Neo spheres. I can't wait till they get here.

Questions and Answers

How much voltage and current does this dynamo generate?
About 7V, 25mA pulses.

Theremart,

As I observed this generator, It appeared to me that this generator is over-unity. I am pretty sure that this generator utilizes the push pull force of the magnets, and causing very little drag on the wheel, while causing the generator magnet to rotate pretty fast. Also LEDs, don't drag generators very much, and it doesn't matter how many LEDs one uses, and this is pretty interesting, As I have noticed this in my other experiments.

BTW, this for powering LEDs on a bicycle is not a very good idea, because batteries are already negative resistors and can power the LEDs, indefinitely, if you charge them with SSG.

The idea for generator design is magnetic coupling, which we have discussed thoroughly on the thread for extracting mechanical energy from SSG. One can use a long NEO magnet and place it near the SSG wheel and it would start rotating pretty fast and with good torque, without dragging the rotor so much. Why is this so, because the rotor a single Neo magnet makes is so small compared to your SSG wheel and would create ASYMMETRY and would cause more energy generated in the rotating Neo magnet. The free energy comes form utilizing the free push-pull force of the Neo magnets.

The device they are selling for bicycle lighting is over-unity but they don't dare to confess!! ;)

Edit:
For now I am sure that another small monopole rotor, with good magnets and smaller ones would generate more mechanical, but for other setups I am not so sure.

Elias

Matthew Jones 02-14-2008 05:41 PM

I have been trying to get an SSG circuit running using a pipe between 2 coils and 2 neo dymiam's with the South back to back. I am not sure if it will have any advantages this way or not. What I was hope for was faster HIT rate on the coils. The wheel is good but to get a rapid hit rate you have to use a small wheel and a very stable surface. This isn't somthing I have been able to come by easily. The best RPM rate I got is with a wheel I made from plastic and skateboard bearings. It goes about 420 RPMS (Normal SSG). Thats 4200 magnetic hits a minute on the one coil.

I figure If I bounce the magnet back and forth within a 8 inch tube, the magnets set being about 1 1/4 of an inch, 10k - 12k hits per minute, on 2 COILS.

I have had some problems though with a wound trigger firing. The only way I could make it work was add a little iron outside the pipe, wrap the pipe and iron with wire. This gave to much resistance once the magnet got towards the trigger. I got some reed switches coming and I am going to give them a try for a trigger.

My end goal is to try to overcome a load on the extra wire I have in the coils. I have 2 POWER wires for the SSG circuit than I have 4 extra wires. Each wire is actually 2 18 awg wire twisted for about 6 ohms of resistance.

Anybody who has played with the extra wire and dumping them into Caps, if you have just powered (No Bridge) out to a capacitor you'll notice it puts a load on the machine. Hopefully If it works out I can dump the extra wires into a Cap bank backwards then slowly discharge the last cap back into the run side of the circuit. Self runner. I hope.

Then I gotta come up with a way to make it stop, LOL

Matt

Sephiroth 02-15-2008 07:52 PM

ok guys... this might be a tough one...

:D but what do you think would happen if you hooked a relay's coil in series with the trigger coil on the ssg? ie between the top of the trigger coil and the base resistor...

:confused: I'm getting a really wierd result...

is it possible it can have some kind of tuning effect?

ren 02-15-2008 08:35 PM

you would be changing the inductional qualitites of your trigger circuit Sep. I see it acting like a choke of sorts. Its actually a cool little experiment. Good work! If you want to play around with your trigger circuit I suggest winding a single trigger coil and using it as a pickup coil. You could wind a small one to see if it gives a faster switching time, and you can play around with the angles of pickup.


I was also thinking of a way you could use a pickup coil in place of a hall device.

ren 02-15-2008 08:48 PM

Oh and Elias I dont think the bicycle generator is overunity. It is an excellent example of an easy way to capture/show the energy moving in the coil though. Excess energy isnt created (ever) it is harvested/transformed into a form which we can utilize. Led's are such a great device. You could make a whole coil out of leds, imagine that! Every time your coil fires your room lights up!

I would like to see some inside shots of one of these generators. If its as simple as a floating magnetic sphere which is aggitated to induce voltage into a surrounding coil then we should experiment with this and Elias' magnetic coupling.

elias 02-15-2008 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ren (Post 16343)
Oh and Elias I dont think the bicycle generator is overunity. It is an excellent example of an easy way to capture/show the energy moving in the coil though. Excess energy isnt created (ever) it is harvested/transformed into a form which we can utilize. Led's are such a great device. You could make a whole coil out of leds, imagine that! Every time your coil fires your room lights up!

I would like to see some inside shots of one of these generators. If its as simple as a floating magnetic sphere which is aggitated to induce voltage into a surrounding coil then we should experiment with this and Elias' magnetic coupling.

Ren,

I agree that energy is never created, but this does not mean that energy never flows in a system, which do flow in a simple magnet. But the trick is build some device to utilize the flow of energy in magnets.
Magnets are already steady state flows, and can put out more energy, if we learn to capture the flow of it, as we do with a turbine to capture waterfall energy.
The only drag the bicycle generator would have on the wheel is the tangential force of magnets, which is at maximum at two points of rotation and decrease as the magnet inside the coil turns. The repulsion and attraction of the magnets are responsible for the rotation of the magnet inside the coil also, which are the free part added from the free energy delivered by the magnets and do not drag the wheel at all. This is why I strongly think that this device is over-unity.

In the small rotor coupled to the larger SSG wheel, the free energy appears only when one loads the small rotor, because the repulsive force of the magnets gets into action and enables us to utilize the "waterfall" flowing in the magnets.

Elias

Sephiroth 02-16-2008 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ren (Post 16342)
you would be changing the inductional qualitites of your trigger circuit Sep. I see it acting like a choke of sorts. Its actually a cool little experiment. Good work! If you want to play around with your trigger circuit I suggest winding a single trigger coil and using it as a pickup coil. You could wind a small one to see if it gives a faster switching time, and you can play around with the angles of pickup.


I was also thinking of a way you could use a pickup coil in place of a hall device.

thanks ren! After reading up on chokes it appears that is excatly what it is doing!


What I was trying to do was see if the trigger coil could generate enough electricity to power the relay (it cant!) but i noticed the motor behaved in a much different way with the relay in the circuit...

first I thought it was just the added resistance of the coil (which is about 67 ohms) so I took it out and increased my pot 67 ohms higher but it didn't behave the same way...

with the relay in, I have to turn my pot down (not all the way down) to get it to fire the coils but here are the wierd effects:

No self resonance

Reduced amp draw - you might remember this motor used to draw almost an amp at one point. Then rewired it to the "ring circuit" and that dropped to 470ma. But now (with the choke) it is drawing 300ma. Which is insanly low thinking about how much it used to draw!!! I can get it to operate at less then 200ma but not as high rpm.

very very slow acceleration - takes a few minutes to reach top speed.

RPM - RPM is at least equal to the top speed without the choke. possibly faster but can't be sure. I have a Tach in the post so I can confirm speed in the next week or two.

Just as a note I am using a standard superpole at the moment. I don't think my magnets are strong enough to get Aaron's superpole to work.

I also tried hooking another relay in series so that there were two relays in series but it didn't perform as well.

I also tried bridging the relay with a diode (tried it in both directions) amp draw increased (nearly doubled) but not rpm.

Will have to read a bit more about chokes and try out a few of different values on the trigger to see if there is an optimal one...


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