2014 Energy Science & Technology Conference


Energetic Forum  

Go Back   Energetic Forum > Energetic Forum Discussion > Renewable Energy > John Bedini
Homepage Energetic Science Ministries Register FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

John Bedini Discussion threads relating to John Bedini. Bedini SG, Bedini SSG, Crystal Batteries, etc...

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #31 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 06:35 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Lol Im a goose

Fixed.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #32 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 08:16 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Congratulatios, Ren!

This was well worth waiting for, and you have done a great job, Ren.

Nice build, nice pdf, and I loved the video of the window motor running, and also the "dancing magnet" one. That's a really cool effect!

From what you understand about window motors, would the non-steel rotor, fast rotation model simply not have nearly the torque of the steel rotor model that you built? And what rpm's are you actually running at now?

Have you driven anything with the shaft yet? If you were to plug an induction motor into an AC outlet, and then use the Window motor's shaft torque to turn the induction motor shaft at a higher speed than it normally operates at (using perhaps a 1:4 WM:IM drive ratio), the overdrive speed will turn the induction motor into a generator that will reduce kwh that you purchase from the electric company. And at night, when you are sound asleep and hardly using any power at all, the generator will feed that unused power to the electric grid, actually making your electric meter run backwards.

Happy motoring, Rick
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #33 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 08:49 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Thanks Rickoff, I took my time but I am glad I did, made the finish much better imo.


My basic understanding is that a steel rotor will go a little slower, but have more torque DUE TO WEIGHT ALONE. I cant confirm this, this is just what I have heard. It should work better with the same weight rotor but of a non magnetic material.

I havent the equipment to measure rpm, I hope to get a tach soon. Its real fast on 36 volts though. Ill do a high speed run vid soon. I can get the amp draw down to about 100ma on 12v. On a disposable 9v battery the 1-5 ampere gauge I use barely even budges. @ 24v it can draw as little as 500ma, probably less if resistances are changed. 36 v is up around the 1 amp level. Even at minimum amp draw there is still reasonable rpm and torque.

Load wise I am still working on that. I want it to be something special, not just a PMM with cogging and friction to over come.

Stay tuned
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #34 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 08:55 AM
Stephen Brown's Avatar
Stephen Brown Stephen Brown is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 95
Window Motor, Thanks!

Ren:
Great work on the window-tute.
Helped me gain a lot more insight into the Win-Motor Build.
For all of you playing with large Neos there is this guy on youtube with a bunch of great tutorials, demos and experiments with those beasts. (They really can be finger-snappin dangerous)
YouTube - SuperMagnetMan's Channel
In good health.
Stephen
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #35 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 09:21 AM
ashtweth's Avatar
ashtweth ashtweth is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 2,493
Send a message via Skype™ to ashtweth
Doc is up thanks to Ren

Here you go guys, Ren has kindly let us put this up for all, now the world can See energetic forums progress and Ren's too
check it out under
Panacea University

Window Motor Replication Tutorial (PDF)
Based on the ideas of John Bedini. Supplied by Ren from the Energetic Forum.
This can be used for both a motor and a generator and has the capacity as a self runner.
Panacea-BOCAF reference page.

More to come.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #36 (permalink)  
Old 07-27-2008, 01:57 PM
Sephiroth's Avatar
Sephiroth Sephiroth is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 971
Very nice Ren

Really impressive!
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #37 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 05:14 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Shaft drive engagement idea

Hi Ren,

Suppose that you were to take the induction motor idea I spoke of in my prior post, and use a magnetic coupling disc on your WM shaft to drive another disc placed on the induction motor. The induction motor could be set up on a short track mechanism so that it could be easily moved into a correct position to engage the magnetic repulsion effect, utilizing the magnetic gear concept that Elias brought to our attention some time ago. There would be no friction, as there are no belts, chains, or actual gearing involved. To determine the ratio of the magnets for the WM drive disc and the IM drive disc, you will need to determine the rpm of your WM, and the normal rpm of the induction motor, and then use a ratio that would produce an overdrive of the induction motor by about 10 percent or less. A four pole induction motor rated at 1800 rpm synchronous speed will usually develop its rated hp at about 1745 rpm, which is 55 rpm less than the rating. Here's the sweet stuff: To turn the same IM into a generator of the same hp rating, you only need to increase the rpm's to about 1855! That's just 55 rpm above the synchrounous rating, and a total rpm increase of less than 7%, so should be easily obtainable. You don't need to spin it up any faster than that, and doing so would just cause the IM to heat up. You can run it continuously at 1855 rpm, as a generator, with no heat problem. And the output is so simple. You plug the motor into any receptacle in your house that has the same voltage and frequency rating, and that's it! Of course you'd leave it switched off until the WM brings it up to operating speed. The larger the IM that you can drive in this manner, the better it will be, of course. And to give you an idea of what's possible, a 5 hp induction motor will require about 1/2 hp from the WM's shaft to drive it at synchronous speed. That should give you an idea of the motor size you might be capable of spinning. You could pick up a 2 to 5 hp induction motor really cheap for the experiment (just to show yourself that this really does work) by going to a salvage yard, appliance repair shop, or electric motor repair shop, and looking for an IM that has bad start windings and/or a burned out start switch. That's usually what goes wrong with them when they end up being discarded and replaced. You only need good "run" windings and good bearings to utilize it. As long as you figure the magnetic gearing ratio properly, you will end up at the correct overdrive speed to take full advantage of the IM generator at it's rated hp, and you will sleep so soundly while knowing that your electric meter is running backwards all night. Well, then again, maybe you will wake up the first few nights and go outside with a flashlight in hand to watch the meter in fascination. Sound good to you, Ren?

I'm just throwing this out to you as an idea for putting your WM shaft's output to good use, and it is not just theory, Ren, - it really works, and is perfectly legal too. I know you already have some preconceived ideas about what you might do with the shaft power, and those may be equally as good or better. I support you 100% in whatever direction you decide to go.

Best wishes to you,

Rick

Last edited by rickoff : 07-29-2008 at 05:23 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #38 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 05:59 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Hi Rickoff,

I have to admit I dont entirely understand the principles of the induction motor. My understanding is that the rotor has an electromagnetic field which induces/interacts with the stator. Is this the case? And if so, would power need to be supplied to energize the rotor to in turn induce current into the stator windings? Does it function similar to a car alternator?

Ive had a little setback, threw a magnet @ 36 volts. No harm done, safety precautions paid off and just need to replace the magnet. Damn this thing gets up to speed. In the mean time perhaps you can educate me as to how this induction motor could be coupled to produce useable electricity. I would most likely go with pulleys and drive belts so I can play with ratios easily etc.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #39 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 06:01 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
hmmm, could you be reffering to this sort of thing? Induction Generator
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #40 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 06:11 AM
peper10's Avatar
peper10 peper10 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Quebec Canada
Posts: 110
Send a message via MSN to peper10
Hi Ren!!

I think what Rickof want to say is,you don"t need pulleys in your setup..
Just having neodinium magnets on a wheel just beside your window motor..
And the second wheel put on an induction motor!
It's just to eliminate the need of a pulley and the friction factor...
BTW!! It's a REALY NICE MOTOR and i hope you have BIG TIME playing
with your new toy!!!

alain d
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #41 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 06:29 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
I understand the magnetic gearing concept. I just feel that it wouldnt offer as direct torque as a belt would. I could be wrong, I dont have much experience in this sort of stuff. If all the induction motor needs is rpm and it turns quite easily then perhaps a magnetic cog would work. But if it turns quite easily, I would just use a belt as this would allow for gearing and speed experiements as easily as replacing a pulley.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #42 (permalink)  
Old 07-29-2008, 09:08 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Right, Ren

Yes Ren, that's what I'm talking about, although you dont need to tap into the leads in the way they suggest to run an AC circuit. Instead, simply plug the device in to a household receptacle, and provide a motor switch to turn it on after it is driven up to the proper speed to begin generating. You may also want to provide a simple circuit that will automatically switch off the generator if for some reason its driven speed falls to the point where it becomes a motor and begins using, rather than generating power. I can provide you with a schematic for accomplishing that, if you would like.

Certainly you can start with a simple belt drive and pulley system, if you already have that equipment available. If you can change rotor speeds easily by simply changing the input voltage to the WM, though, then that may be your best way to adjust the IM's driven speed, and you could utilize a direct magnetic coupling. In that mode, you could use two or three neo magnets with all norths on one disc, and all souths on the other disc, and both dics being the same diameter. The rounded type with center mounting hole (see RA22CS-P at K&J Magnetics at $2.25 a pair) K&J Magnetics - Products would be ideal for this and make mounting to the discs easy and secure. I would suggest using cutoff discs for this purpose, as they are non-magnetic, strong, and inexpensive, and are available in several different sizes at hardware stores. They already have a center arbor hole placed well, as they are designed to operate at high speeds for cutting metals. If the holes for the magnets are drilled at precisely spaced intervals so that the magnets align well on both discs, then as you slowly slide the IM into position on the track, the magnets will act beautifully to gradually give you a direct coupling effect as the IM is spun up to speed.

Off to bed now. Good night, or good morning to you.

Rick

Last edited by rickoff : 07-29-2008 at 09:10 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #43 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2008, 09:47 PM
peper10's Avatar
peper10 peper10 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Quebec Canada
Posts: 110
Send a message via MSN to peper10
Hi Ren!!

Do you have tested the torque of your motor yet??
How much torque it has on 12-24-36 volts??
How is the efficiency??Do you recover more than 70%????
I would like to know that because i am verry fascinated with the vid you
gave us..
I am actually stock with a magnetic motor i'm working on, and, with a desing
like your's, it seems more effective..
Anyway!!!I'm verry happy that it work's and you seem pretty happy with
your results..
CONGRADULATION!!!!

Alain D
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #44 (permalink)  
Old 07-31-2008, 11:24 PM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Thanks Alain D,

I dont have any measurements yet, I dont really have alot of good equipment for them. I am hoping to aquire a laser tach and a few other handy items soon.

Rick F has announced on the monopole forums that my particular configuration isnt the ideal geometry and that the magnetic fields shouldnt overlap. He suggests that a larger diameter rotor with the magnets spaced further apart would be better. I dont know if he means better for torque or charging or both.

I am happy with my results so far, but if I build another I will try what he has suggested. I am only running one power winding at the moment, I am still waiting for the multifilar bipolar circuit specifics. Im uploading another vid to youtube at the moment with it running on 36v.

Ive had good results on the 12v platform with charging. The best so far was with three windings in three phase star configuration going to bridge/cap and straight to charging battery. Battery charges quite quickly but it does put a slight load on the primary. Despite this I have had identical batteries on back and front and the charging battery has gone up 0.50v to the run batteries loss of 0.10. The CEMF load in the schematic works too, but doesnt seem to charge as fast, although it doesnt appear to load the rotor as much. If the voltage on the front end is higher than the voltage on the back end, the charging battery will shoot up super fast, actually too fast if its a large difference like 24/12v.

The link to the next vid is here http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_uWyobLflcM

It may take a couple more hours to finish processing, I just uploaded it then. Ive got a nice little burn on my finger from grabbing that shaft too much

Last edited by ren : 07-31-2008 at 11:26 PM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #45 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2008, 01:03 AM
peper10's Avatar
peper10 peper10 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Quebec Canada
Posts: 110
Send a message via MSN to peper10
Verry impressive!!!!

Thank's Ren !!
Youre video was a delight for the eyes and the mind!!!
You got so much volts from the generating coil..
Do you really think that you can get better results by having a larger
diameter of your rotor??
That THING is the Gotzilla of the experiments for me.
Imagine having bigger rotor size would have more torque??????
I really appreciate you take the time to give us details!!!
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #46 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2008, 09:47 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
The voltage on the generator coil is not what it can flow constantly and may be misunderstood. I like to think of it as the potential building up. It is also tied back into the negative leg of the circuit which increases it somewhat. I will do some load tests on the generator side of things when I get around to it. It does have the potential to charge on the back end or pop forward to the primary I believe when done correctly.

As far as a wider diameter rotor goes I cant speak from experience. Maybe I will have to build one of those too.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #47 (permalink)  
Old 08-01-2008, 11:56 PM
tjnlsn255's Avatar
tjnlsn255 tjnlsn255 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Smile

Hi Ren,

I was thinking more on the lines of using the shaft output to drive one of these wind turbine PM rotors like Windbluepower.com has....


I wonder how what would work with Rick's no friction flywheel idea... interesting......

Also Ren I just saw your video on your 4 coil SG and was wondering if you could compair the torque between that and the WM and possibly a Newman motor?

Be happy....

Todd
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #48 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2008, 06:54 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Hi,

I never built a four coil sg, the one in my videos is hall switched and is a little more like an Adams motor. Probably the only thing it has in common with the sg is a bifilar coil ( x 4). And a transistor too of course.

I think the idea of driving a conventional style generator in the conventional way kind of defeats the purpose, and will probably result in less than ideal results.

I will illustrate with a little test I did recently.

I had the motor running per spec without a CEMF load attached. On the generating side I had three windings in series to a bridge rectifier. With no load on the generating coil and driving it on 12v 500ma I saw voltages as high as 50v dc. But as soon as you try to draw off that voltage amp draw increases to 1-1.2 amps and the rotor slows down. This charges really well and rotation is sustained, though speed is reduced quite drastically. I can rotate these batteries back and forth many times if I choose. But I have gone over my C20 rating and my rotor offers little torque for input. Perhaps this would be different if the coils were separate and out of phase, perhaps not.

My understanding from studying Bedinis notes is that the generator function must be out of phase with the motor function. Study his notes from his 1984 book. Notice the comutator. 25% duty cycle motor on, 25% off 25% energizer/generator on, 25% off. I think the window is intended to function like this. It could be set up like the cap pulser is perhaps. But use a hall to fire the generator side when the motor is off. It could pulse another battery or hit the source. This is my understanding. Its application may be tricker than that, but thats the general principle I am working towards. It may not even need a cap, you could hit it with the voltage straight off the bridge much like Rick F's self runner with the big energizer coil ontop.

From what I understand the H bridge circuit isolates the power windings from the power source so that the generator function can be fully benefited from.

My 2 cents...
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #49 (permalink)  
Old 08-05-2008, 07:05 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
I cant really comment on the torque comparison as each build I have done has been drastically different in geometry and configuration. Of course this build has given me the most torque, but it also has 20kg of rotor, the biggest magnets and the most wire out of all my builds.
My 2 cents...
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #50 (permalink)  
Old 08-07-2008, 11:16 PM
tjnlsn255's Avatar
tjnlsn255 tjnlsn255 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Cool Bearings for Window Motor?

Does it matter what material the window motor bearings are?

I have a 1/2 inch stainless steel shaft but I thought that I needed stainless steel bearings as well?

I wanted to build my window motor with "good" bearings instead of something I robbed from something else.... but wow the cost....

What type of bearings are used in an alternator?

All the bearings I find on the internet are very expensive.... does anyone know where I can find some bearings for my window motor that will work well and have 1/2 inch inside diameter or would it be better to get a 12mm shaft?

Thanks for any and all help....

Todd
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #51 (permalink)  
Old 08-07-2008, 11:34 PM
theremart's Avatar
theremart theremart is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,411
Type of bearings...

I use roller skate bearings.... cheap

Much depends on the size of your replication. But bearings are VERY important ...

Mart
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #52 (permalink)  
Old 08-08-2008, 12:48 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Re: Bearings

Hi Todd,

Mart is right, and the roller skate bearings are built for rough use, so can handle stresses fairly well.

If you do want to go for some new bearings, check out the many 1/2" inside diameter designs on the following website. They sell good bearings at very reasonable prices:

Ball Bearings:Ceramic & Miniature Bearings: 1/2" inner diameter = 0.500 inch

Check out the mounted bearings (3 types) as they greatly simplify your build, and offer excellent alignment properties.

Good luck to you on your build,

Rick

Last edited by rickoff : 08-08-2008 at 12:52 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #53 (permalink)  
Old 08-08-2008, 01:01 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Good tips guys.

Get good sealed bearings, they are the rollerskate/board type where the ball bearings arent removeable. Helps too if the center inner circle has a lip which raises it higher than the wall of the bearing. Not essential, but when it comes time to tightening it up its handy if you dont have a spacer small enough. You can clamp as much pressure as you like against the inner ring, as long as pressure isnt applied to the surface of the bearing, causing friction.


I went to a local shop called Bolts and Bearings. There would have to be a store similar around. Asked for some high speed bearings, you can specify inner and outer dimensions if you like.

Also you can get bearings and remove their seals and get all the grease out of them and lube with sewing machine oil. I used Canola....out of the deep fryer

Make sure your rotor is snug and stable before you wind your coil!

Last edited by ren : 02-21-2009 at 12:53 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #54 (permalink)  
Old 08-08-2008, 10:38 AM
tjnlsn255's Avatar
tjnlsn255 tjnlsn255 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Thumbs up

Thanks for all the info!

My main concern was that the bearings get magnetized and thus apply lots of extra friction and take away free energy... is this not an issue, the bearings do not have to be made of non-magnetic material?

Thanks again.... off to my local industrial supply store to find some bearings.....

Be happy....

Todd
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #55 (permalink)  
Old 08-10-2008, 06:52 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Reply to Todd

I don't think that magnetization of the bearings will cause any noticeable drag, but if you prefer to install non-magnetic material bearings then check the ceramic and stainless steel bearings at the link given in my last post. They are considerably more expensive, but still reasonable.

Best,

Rick

Last edited by rickoff : 08-10-2008 at 06:55 AM.
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #56 (permalink)  
Old 08-11-2008, 10:02 AM
tjnlsn255's Avatar
tjnlsn255 tjnlsn255 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 281
Thumbs up

Thanks Rick,

VXB has lots of great bearings!

I just found some locally at Grainger that I think will work....

Thanks for all the help and info!

Todd
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #57 (permalink)  
Old 08-19-2008, 10:01 PM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Interesting notes

After MANY hours of fiddling with the Beast I have learnt a few things. I originally had it wired with one wire for power and three in series for a generator coil. I tried multiple setups, cap filling, dumping straight off the bridge, return to source etc. I used a hall and a timing wheel to pulse a relay to make connections between motor pulses. If the generator coil was connected directly it would slow the rotor right down and amperage went up. But if the generator coil was only used when the motor was off the speed only dropped a little and amperage went up about 200ma (as opposed to 1 amp when directly connected.)

I had some very interesting results with back popping, which I wont go into, needless to say that this thing can run off next to nothing.


I thought it was about time for something diffferent so I stripped the generator coil and wired all 5 power windings to the circuit in parallel. WOW.

Each winding connected briefly raises amperage, a sign that more power is available, but then, due to more power, you get more accleration! So when it all settles the amp draw is the same or less if only one winding is used. It gets up to speed ALOT faster too, and best of all, it charges off the original bridge excellently!! With one power winding it would slowly creep up, now with 5 I have less amp draw and it charges great. I have been running it off 24v 500ma for 20min this morning on 7 amp hour batteries (out of C20 I know, I need bigger batteries). It is doing close to 750rpm (laser tacho says 748.2) which is quite scary with all that weight swinging around!

Run battery 24.5, charge battery 24.5, after 20min, run battery 24.3, charge battery 26.2. This is without the back popping to the front end.

Tweaking the resistance on the trigger once it is up to speed can result in an increase in speed and a loss of amp draw (about 100ma per trigger). I think Rick has a setup where he hasn a simple switch to change between low and high resistance, that would be better than the two pots I currently have now.

I can only imagine what this thing would be capable of if it was multicoil, multifilar. There is no doubt in my mind that this thing could turn a decent energizer or more off the torque. All in good time.

Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #58 (permalink)  
Old 08-20-2008, 07:13 AM
rickoff's Avatar
rickoff rickoff is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Maine, USA
Posts: 3,079
Re: Interesting Notes

Hi Ren,

This is indeed interesting! Running this from just 100ma is super efficient. Just gets better and better! Do you have any idea of the actual torque involved? Any new pics or video?

Best regards,

Rickoff
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #59 (permalink)  
Old 08-20-2008, 08:10 AM
ren's Avatar
ren ren is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,094
Hi mate,

Im not sure if I confused you, I can get it to run off pretty much nothing (doesnt register on the gauge, its well below 100ma) but it doesnt have max torque at this setting. However, the best torque/speed isnt far from this. Currently the best results I have got is 36v 500-600ma @ 1100rpm and charging 36v battery bank on the back end. Something interesting to note is that if the front end is higher in voltage than the back end the charging goes through the roof. I have only tried this on 24/12v which is a big difference I know, I reckon it would be ideal for the front end to be 1 or 2v higher than the backend. Regardless, it charges good as is, with no cap or SCR, I'll try those soon.

I still cant offer any comments on actual torque figures. I havent been able to make any scientific measurements. I am happy with the circuit now, and I will just be cleaning it up a little and adding some switches etc. And maybe some extra extra safety precautions for the rotor.

I will say this. 20kg of rotor spinning over 1000rpm is kinda scary No other mechanical difficulties so far with the new strapping, but I still get scared. Just to note. The video of it running on 36v 1amp was around 750rpm. With the tweaks and extra power windings it is over 1000rpm for 5/600ma. Amp draw @ startup is over 7 amps, and it rockets back to under an amp as it speeds up.

I still have some cleaning up to do, but Id love to try the induction motor/generator connected that you suggested. What sort of motor would you suggest? Is a fan the right type of motor? Or perhaps like the motor out of a bench grinder? The rpms for this may be a little hard to match however.


I'll make a new video soon.


S
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
  #60 (permalink)  
Old 08-20-2008, 05:16 PM
Tecstatic Tecstatic is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 452
Make the motor more safe

Quote:
Originally Posted by ren View Post
I will say this. 20kg of rotor spinning over 1000rpm is kinda scary
S
I have seen servo motors with the same principle build-up of the rotor.

In the servo motor the rotor "cylinder" surface had a tight pre-tensioned "coil winding" of glass fiber "wire" along the length of the cylinder, and was secured and fortified with epoxy.

If you want to be able to disassemble the rotor, you could wrap a layer of some foil and then the fiber glass wire upon it. This way it is still strong, and it is possible to dismantle the magnets for a new experiment, if desired.

Eric
Digg this Post!Add Post to del.icio.usBookmark Post in TechnoratiFurl this Post!Live Bookmark this Post!Google Bookmark this Post!Yahoo Bookmark this Post! share on MyspaceShare on FacebookTweet this thread
Reply With Quote
Reply



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On



All times are GMT. The time now is 10:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.0.0 RC8
2007 Copyright ? Energetic Forum? A Non Profit Corporation - All Rights Reserved