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John Bedini Discussion threads relating to John Bedini. Bedini SG, Bedini SSG, Crystal Batteries, etc...

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  #31  
Old 08-17-2009, 09:50 PM
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ren ren is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huckmubb View Post
Holy cra* .... Now this person has done some amazing work. The best I've seen.

He says his window motor will run for HOURS on a capacitor.... Dang!

I suppose this has to be just "slightly" over-unity because tiny capacitors cannot run a motor for hours.... This video is proof positive that these motors do defy some conventional limits.

YouTube - Mini Window Motors Capacitor Demonstration.
Hi Huckmubb,

Ive been chatting with DadHav on the BM2 forums. You are right he does excellent work. The capacitors, while small are rated in the farads and thus can store a significant amount of charge at low voltages. He has also done tests using nicads and Nimhs and found that hours of running doesnt seem to drain the batteries.

I think I remember him saying he got over 100 hours run time of two aa's in series and each time he stopped the machine the batteries would stabilise back up to their original voltage. He was measuring to three decimal places @ 3v and had to wait days to see it change.

Very nice work indeed.
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  #32  
Old 09-19-2011, 03:38 PM
nkdurrett nkdurrett is offline
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has there been any updates?
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  #33  
Old 10-18-2011, 01:29 PM
Total Psychonaut Total Psychonaut is offline
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the window motor now comes as a kit! Small Window Motor Energizer Basic kit
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  #34  
Old 08-29-2012, 09:17 PM
carter carter is offline
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Cool Can anyone elaborate?

Is there any chance of posting what the results of the motor are then posting useful diagram with parts? Exact specs, exact parts. Like a drawing done in paint showing how this all goes together would be great. Then a list of the parts. Then I could try and replicate this thing.

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  #35  
Old 09-12-2012, 05:37 PM
carter carter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Total Psychonaut View Post
the window motor now comes as a kit! Small Window Motor Energizer Basic kit
I ordered this kit. They charged my card, but never sent the thing. After ten days of waiting for it to ship I had to dispute the charge with my bank. Was extremely disappointing.
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  #36  
Old 09-16-2012, 02:00 PM
wrtner wrtner is offline
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Originally Posted by carter View Post
I ordered this kit. They charged my card, but never sent the thing. After ten days of waiting for it to ship I had to dispute the charge with my bank. Was extremely disappointing.
It depends where you live. Shipping times from the States
to Europe can be extensive.
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  #37  
Old 09-16-2012, 04:49 PM
carter carter is offline
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The owner of R-Charge finally responded to me after two weeks. They were out on vacation apparently. They apologized and bumped me to overnight shipping for free. So all in all no harm done. Can't wait to get this kit.
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  #38  
Old 10-10-2012, 11:21 AM
drodenbe drodenbe is offline
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Carter: I usually don't say much on forums but I noticed your response from rcharge taking two weeks to respond because of vacations. They must take a lot of vacations because I had same response from them a while ago and it was at least two weeks before they responded. I got tired and had pay pal refund my payment because of not receiving my order. I ordered the 3 inch coil spools. I later found a company out of New York that sold me 273 spools for about 20.00 more then I was paying for 20. I am not too thrilled with there service. Just thought I would let you know. I can give you the phone number if you like. They are the same spools that they sell.
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  #39  
Old 03-26-2013, 08:11 AM
naxompax naxompax is offline
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Thumbs up Kits vs Sourcing parts

I recently built the R-Charge kit. Had no problems with shipping, items seemed in good shape. However after building my first one I quickly realized that it would be super simple and cheap to source the parts my self. My second Window motor was exactly like the kit just way bigger, all self sourced (from Ebay mostly). The latest one was the full sequential bi polar
circuit. I used Bedinis Lab notes (found on the net) and followed it exactly,
EXACTLY.....one more time for effect EXACTLY. and it worked exactly as described. But a kit is to save you time sourcing parts not to save you money. I think kits are expensive if you ask me. Most of my sourced parts came from china, macau, and thailand at a fraction of the price from ebay.

Nax
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  #40  
Old 07-06-2013, 04:21 AM
slloyd slloyd is offline
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back on the WM forumn when john b. first started posting about the window motor there was rick f. and RS(i think?) who made some fairly large aluminium rotors and shipped them out to people at cost for experiment. i have one and built the window motor using cole circuit as john described exactly. its really something to see how efficient that motor is .. could hit 5000rpm. i experimented for a short while with trying to get it to run off capacitors. i have a whole box of high quality film caps but never got a chance to finish the experiment because life caught up to me and all that. i hope to get back to it some day, it was really neat.
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  #41  
Old 07-18-2013, 05:04 AM
DIVERFUN DIVERFUN is offline
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Smile Improved Circuit

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
Hi everyone,

One of my passions is studying and building "free energy" technologies.
There are many misconceptions about this field and it is attacked by
people claiming anyone doing anything in this field are a bunch of
perpetual motion nuts.

The truth is that these technologies are very real and they also have
absolutely nothing to do with perpetual motion! I'm not getting into
the specifics in this message about the distinctions because this topic
is too important to focus on the misconceptions. Instead, lets shine some
light on an amazing recent release.

John Bedini is a world famous electrical engineer and is considered a
"Mozart" with electronics and especially in the field of audio components
because he builds he highest quality most crisp sounding audio amplifiers
known to man.

Besides the audio field, he also happens to be one of leading super
geniuses in the field of electromagnetic energizers and "radiant energy"
in general.

For over 11 years, he had many plans posted on his website for many
different versions of his motors and the "School Girl" motor is probably
the most popular and there are thousands around the world building
this motor achieving very exciting results that are supposed to be
impossible.

Besides this motor, there is one version called a "Bedini-Cole Window Motor"

This is what it looks like:



The plans have been given out to the world on this website:
MOTOR DIAGRAMS AND LAB NOTES

The schematics for this motor are here:



Watch a demo video: http://www.icehouse.net/john34/bedinicolemotor.mpg this is 12MB's long
so be patient or right click on the link and SAVE TARGET AS

You can visit John's homepage here: Welcome to John Bedini

Be careful not to miss any links because they are scattered and
hidded all over his websites. There are many.

One time at John's shop, he hooked up a little battery to this motor
and it was so efficient it almost didn't register any amperage on the
meter while it was running. Also, I grabbed the shaft with my hand
and I couldn't even stop it!! It produces more torque for the least amount
of power out of any motor that I think has ever been released.

Anyway, Mike, an experimenter who did a small modification to the original
plans wound up with a more efficient Window Motor that runs itself and
keeps charging a capacitor charging up!

Here is what his looks like:



Here are the schematics / plans with the small modification:




Watch this video:

YouTube

How does it power itself???

That will be another discussion...but pass the link to this forum to your friends so we can
get the word out. I'm not just someone excited about this...I have built many, many Bedini
circuits and they all work as long as I build them according to his plans and not how I think
they should be built. I'll post a thread later with a very simple motor that beginners can get
their feet wet with..very simple stuff...a 10 year old girl built one so you can too!
I know this is an old thread

I know why Mike was blowing components - he had no discharge path for the back EMF of the Big coil.

Also the solid state relay and hall effect transistor does nothing that a diode would not do.

My simplified Circuit:



D2 was added to complete a path for Back EMF for the big coil and to protect the transistors.
D3 was added to replace the relay.
Bridge was removed and replace by D4 - third coil only conducts with BEMF from Big Coil - captures more power into the running cap.

This should work better - give it a try and let me know.
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  #42  
Old 07-18-2013, 10:57 AM
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citfta citfta is offline
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Hi DIVERFUN, You posted that this should work better. Does that mean you haven't actually built it and tried it? From your description of how you think it will work it appears you are confused about the difference between bemf and inductive spike. Inductive spike from the collapse of the magnetic field of a coil is not the same as bemf. The direction of the current in an inductive spike is in the same direction as the current that created the magnetic field to start with.

Respectfully, Carroll
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  #43  
Old 07-19-2013, 02:08 AM
DIVERFUN DIVERFUN is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by citfta View Post
Hi DIVERFUN, You posted that this should work better. Does that mean you haven't actually built it and tried it? From your description of how you think it will work it appears you are confused about the difference between bemf and inductive spike. Inductive spike from the collapse of the magnetic field of a coil is not the same as bemf. The direction of the current in an inductive spike is in the same direction as the current that created the magnetic field to start with.

Respectfully, Carroll


You are absolutely right! (Somewhat?).

School is in session:
There are two things that determine coil (and transformer) current flow - physical and electrical characteristics. Physical because you can wind a coil clockwise (CW) or counter-clockwise (CCW). Two coils - one CW + CCW hooked up the same way to power - each will produce a north pole on opposite ends.

Both coils in Bi-filer wound coils are either CW or CCW together because it very hard to wind one coil CW and the other CCW. (It can be done, but is a total waste of time). That puts them in sync - positive current flow in drive coil produces positive current flow in second coil at the same time because the magnetic field is cutting the wire the same direction as the coil producing it.

Since the coils are in sync with each other, your inductive spike on the second coil has current flowing the same direction as the drive coil - always. But if you did one coil CW and the other coil CCW, the secondary coil would have current flow the opposite direction from the drive - always. So you could have a inductive spike moving the opposite direction.

So now lets talk about the Drive coil. As the current starts flowing through the coil, it creates a expanding magnetic field. As it moves outward, it cuts the wire in the in the secondary coil and produces electricity in that wire. Once the current stabilizes at peak, the magnetic field stops moving and also stops producing electricity in the secondary. The magnet field is still there being supported by the current, but no output on secondary, it is the change in the field that produces power. What happens when you slowly turn off the current? You produce power on the secondary in equal proportion to that change.

So lets turn off the current all at once, you now have a magnetic field that is unsupported by current. The collapse of the field happens very fast, producing power on both coils in a very short period of time in sync and in the opposite direction of the drive current that produce the field. Why opposite? As the field expanded it produced current flowing in one direction, a collapsing field will produce current in the same wire going in the opposite direction.

There you have it! BEMF in the drive coil and inductive spike in the second coil at the same time and with the same current flow direction.

Does it sound like I know the difference between BEMF and inductive spike?

I also, stand by my statement "This should work better." I fixed the problems with the circuit, but I am not claiming UNITY. I can't control other peoples machines. This is your experiment to see if it does work better.

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  #44  
Old 07-19-2013, 11:39 AM
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More Schooling

Hi again DIVERFUN,

You said:


Quote:
Originally Posted by DIVERFUN View Post



So now lets talk about the Drive coil. As the current starts flowing through the coil, it creates a expanding magnetic field. As it moves outward, it cuts the wire in the in the secondary coil and produces electricity in that wire. Once the current stabilizes at peak, the magnetic field stops moving and also stops producing electricity in the secondary. The magnet field is still there being supported by the current, but no output on secondary, it is the change in the field that produces power. What happens when you slowly turn off the current? You produce power on the secondary in equal proportion to that change.

So lets turn off the current all at once, you now have a magnetic field that is unsupported by current. The collapse of the field happens very fast, producing power on both coils in a very short period of time in sync and in the opposite direction of the drive current that produce the field. Why opposite? As the field expanded it produced current flowing in one direction, a collapsing field will produce current in the same wire going in the opposite direction.

There you have it! BEMF in the drive coil and inductive spike in the second coil at the same time and with the same current flow direction.

Does it sound like I know the difference between BEMF and inductive spike?



You are correct about what happens when you turn on power to a coil but you are not correct about what happens when you turn off the power. I have already had this discussion several times with others on this forum. I also have had other people verify that what I am saying is true.

Lets look at the simple Bedini School Girl circuit. Very similar to the circuit you have posted except we are only controlling power to the coil by turning on and off the return power back to ground instead of on both sides of the coil. The coil doesn't really care either way. I am going to use the conventional idea of electron flow from the most negative to the most positive. So a power source has a terminal of excess electrons (negative) and a terminal of fewer electrons (positive).

When the transistor is turned on the electrons flow from ground through the transistor and through the coil and back to the battery or power source. Of course the initial flow is restricted by the inductance of the coil just as you described. And you are also correct that if we slowly reduce the current the field slowly reduces and would in fact induce a current into another coil winding if it was there.

Turning off the current quickly does NOT cause the current flow to reverse direction. I am not sure where that idea came from but my own experiments and training have proven that idea to be false. Whether we turn off the coil slowly or quickly the current does not reverse unless we have a situation that allows the circuit to ring or reverberate. But the initial discharge of the coil is in the same direction as the initial charge of the coil.

How would this look on a scope or a meter if we had a meter that could react quickly to a spike? Lets put a scope on the coil with the ground of the scope on the bottom of the coil and the probe in the top of the coil. Staying with the SSG circuit what would we see? Before we turn on the transistor we would have 12 volts at the top and bottom of the coil. But since our scope is connected to the top and bottom of the coil it would show 0 volts.

Now turn on the transistor. Our meter is now going to show a positive signal because electrons are flowing from the negative ground to the positive post of the battery making the bottom of the coil in reference to the top more negative. So remember electrons are flowing from bottom to top.

Now turn off the coil. The definition of inductance is that it resists change in current flow. There is nothing in the definition that says inductance reverses current flow. So now the source of power is gone but our coil has not discharged but it wants to. Now we still have our scope connected to the top and bottom of the coil. Except now our coil has become the supplier of current instead of the user. Since the current is still flowing the SAME way we quickly get an excess of electrons at the TOP of the coil. So our scope or meter is going to show the top of the coil negative and the bottom of the coil positive. But that is because the coil is supplying the current instead of using the current. It does not mean the current has reversed as so many people seem to believe.

If the current reversed as you believe then the SSG could never charge the charge battery because the diode going to the charge battery would be reversed biased and also the battery would be connected backwards.

Depending on which way you connect your third coil in your circuit and the amount of turns it has it is possible your circuit will actually charge the cap. However your diodes to protect the transistors are connected correctly.

By the way the original pictures and circuit you posted of the guy who claimed it ran off the cap only was later proven to be fake by John Bedini himself. He found the guy had hidden some batteries inside the solid state switch.

School is out.

Respectfully, Carroll
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Last edited by citfta; 07-21-2013 at 04:52 PM. Reason: Corrected statement about protection diodes.
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  #45  
Old 07-23-2013, 04:20 AM
DIVERFUN DIVERFUN is offline
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Sorry - School is still in - we just had a recess.

Quote:
Originally Posted by citfta View Post
Hi again DIVERFUN,

You said:

You are correct about what happens when you turn on power to a coil but you are not correct about what happens when you turn off the power. I have already had this discussion several times with others on this forum. I also have had other people verify that what I am saying is true.
I am correct. A moving magnetic field across a wire causes electricity to flow one direction - reverse the direction of the movement of the magnetic field and the electricity will flow in the opposite direction in the same wire - Basic physics. An expanding magnetic field and collapsing magnetic field are fields moving in opposite directions - period.

Quote:
Lets look at the simple Bedini School Girl circuit. Very similar to the circuit you have posted except we are only controlling power to the coil by turning on and off the return power back to ground instead of on both sides of the coil.
There is nothing similar about the Bedini School Girl Circuit. The two circuits act very differently on how the transistor(s) are used. The SSG circuit amplifies the electricity produced from the magnet as it pulls away from from the coil. The trim pot CONTROLS how much current is allowed through the transistor (and coil) and rarely does the transistor reach saturation. The output from the transistor is half a sine wave because it is amplifying half the sine wave of the magnet induced electricity. (Other magnetic things happen to turn off the transistor, so the output is not a complete half sine wave).

Mike's circuit (I do not claim it.) uses a Darlington Switch setup that turns the transistors full on or full off as fast a possible - there is no in between. This produces a square wave output. It also produces a high current drain on the Cap (or Battery) because the only thing that slows the current is the inductance of the coil and the resistance of the wire - the transistor does not control the current, just on or off. The PNP transistor also helps shut off the current faster than the two NPN pair alone.

Quote:
I am going to use the conventional idea of electron flow from the most negative to the most positive. So a power source has a terminal of excess electrons (negative) and a terminal of fewer electrons (positive).
I am with you there. That's the way I was taught.

Quote:
When the transistor is turned on the electrons flow from ground through the transistor and through the coil and back to the battery or power source. Of course the initial flow is restricted by the inductance of the coil just as you described. And you are also correct that if we slowly reduce the current the field slowly reduces and would in fact induce a current into another coil winding if it was there.
I still agree. This is what you are talking about.



Quote:
Turning off the current quickly does NOT cause the current flow to reverse direction. I am not sure where that idea came from but my own experiments and training have proven that idea to be false. Whether we turn off the coil slowly or quickly the current does not reverse unless we have a situation that allows the circuit to ring or reverberate. But the initial discharge of the coil is in the same direction as the initial charge of the coil.
The current does reverse direction (if it is given a path) because the magnetic field in the coil is collapsing. Back to basic Physics. That is why we put a diode across the transistor - to give BEMF a current path to protect the transistor and to recharge the Cap (or Battery).



If the current was still going the same direction, where is it's path? - it can not go through the transistor (it is off) and it can not go through the diode (it is reversed biased) and it would be discharging the cap further.

Quote:
How would this look on a scope or a meter if we had a meter that could react quickly to a spike? Lets put a scope on the coil with the ground of the scope on the bottom of the coil and the probe in the top of the coil. Staying with the SSG circuit what would we see? Before we turn on the transistor we would have 12 volts at the top and bottom of the coil. But since our scope is connected to the top and bottom of the coil it would show 0 volts.
Agreed.

Quote:
Now turn on the transistor. Our meter is now going to show a positive signal because electrons are flowing from the negative ground to the positive post of the battery making the bottom of the coil in reference to the top more negative. So remember electrons are flowing from bottom to top.
At first because of the inductance - the scope will show a 12 volt peak and then drop back to 0 volts over a short time because the inductance gets less as the magnetic field saturates the coil. Still with you.

Quote:
The definition of inductance is that it resists change in current flow. There is nothing in the definition that says inductance reverses current flow.
Correct - Inductance is the coils ability to resist the change in current - it likes a steady flow - no abrupt changes. It has nothing to do with current direction. Same effect both ways.

Quote:
Now turn off the coil. So now the source of power is gone but our coil has not discharged but it wants to. Now we still have our scope connected to the top and bottom of the coil. Except now our coil has become the supplier of current instead of the user.
Still with you.

Quote:
Since the current is still flowing the SAME way.
Now you lost me - if it is off at the transistor, it is off in the coil. There is a difference in how the coil reacts to a square wave vs a sine wave. A sign wave does not turn off instantly. It's voltage is reduced and the coil adds voltage to keep the current at the same amperage until it no longer can, but it still flows in the same direction and the magnet field is still expanded, just not as strong as at peak. As long as the current is flowing from the power source, the coil will continue to to try to maintain the same current flow. If the current is off instantly, there is no current flow to sustain the magnetic field, so the magnetic field collapses - inducing current in the opposite direction per the laws of physics. (Not Induction)

Quote:
we quickly get an excess of electrons at the TOP of the coil. So our scope or meter is going to show the top of the coil negative and the bottom of the coil positive. But that is because the coil is supplying the current instead of using the current. It does not mean the current has reversed as so many people seem to believe.
I found my old Electronic Basics book from when I went to school and they even show that the coil does reverse current flow.



Notice the + and - signs for each schematic.

Quote:
If the current reversed as you believe then the SSG could never charge the charge battery because the diode going to the charge battery would be reversed biased and also the battery would be connected backwards.
Answer this - If the current still flows the same direction from the coil, what is the current path to charge the Cap or battery?

Quote:
Depending on which way you connect your third coil in your circuit and the amount of turns it has it is possible your circuit will actually charge the cap. However your diodes to protect the transistors are connected correctly.
The diode for the third coil is correct. Since the two coils are in sync, it captures the spike energy the same time as the Drive coil. (As per the transistor off picture.)

Quote:
By the way the original pictures and circuit you posted of the guy who claimed it ran off the cap only was later proven to be fake by John Bedini himself. He found the guy had hidden some batteries inside the solid state switch.
I can see how that can be done. Or maybe the guy doesn't know enough about electronics to get the circuit right. (which is a proven fact just in this thread alone.)

Quote:
School is out.
No, it is not. I am sure you will have something more to say.

Quote:
Respectfully, Carroll
Thank you!
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Last edited by DIVERFUN; 07-23-2013 at 05:04 AM. Reason: Grammer errors
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  #46  
Old 07-23-2013, 11:00 AM
gyula gyula is offline
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Dear DIVERFUN ,

Sorry to chime in, I think the problem with understanding Fig. 24-3 from your old Electronics Basics book is that the + and - signs shown in it indicate voltage polarities and not current polarities, right? Just consider the coil as a generator with the indicated output voltage polarities as shown in Figure b (when the 8V battery is off).

If you accept this, then the understanding of the current flow direction will be clear in any coil: when the input current is switched off, field collapses but tries to maintain the original current but due to losses it is not able to (the amplitude of the spike starts decreasing) so the original current starts decreasing in value towards zero (it might change direction after reaching the zero value but this depends on the load across the coil (damping) whether it allows ringing as member citfta referred to).

This also means that in your very first schematic (in your Reply #41) the big coil (L1) still has no discharge path via diodes D2 and D3, UNLESS the winding sense of L3 (the third coil) which is inductively coupled to L1 allowes current flow into capacitor C1 via D4 from the induced spike, okay?

I notice this because the voltage spike across coil L1 (when Q2 and Q3 are just switched OFF) will have a positive polarity at the collector of Q3 and a negative polarity at the collector of Q2. Your diodes D2 and D3 will block both these voltage polarities as they are drawn, preventing any current flow out of the coil L1. (One more notice: you would have to have a voltage difference first to cause any current flow in a closed circuit.)

Putting all this otherwise: when you connect a battery across a coil with a given polarity and then you disconnect it, the coil will behave also as a kind of 'battery' (giving out the voltage spike for a short amount of time) but would have an opposite polarity across its terminals with respect to what the battery forced onto it first. When you understand this, all the current flow directions (after the switch-off) will fall in place correctly.

rgds, Gyula
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Old 07-23-2013, 11:31 AM
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citfta citfta is offline
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Simple Circuit

Hi DIVERFUN,

Let me propose a simple circuit for you to try. I'll try to describe it as I don't have time right now to draw it up. Take a coil and connect a neon bulb in parallel to the coil. An NE2 will work fine. Now connect a diode at the top with the cathode connected to the top of the coil and the anode connected to a 10uf 100 volt cap at the negative terminal of the cap. Now connect a diode at the bottom of the coil with the cathode connected to the positive terminal of the cap and the anode to the bottom of the coil. Now pulse the coil with 12 volts by any method you want whether a relay or by hand just touching the battery leads to the coil. You can even use the Darlington pair transistor circuit.

You will see the cap charging up. And the neon will not be lighting up. Why? If the current reversed as you have said the diodes should be blocking the current flow to the cap and the neon should be firing because of the higher voltage.

Now reverse the diodes and the cap and start pulsing the coil again. You will see the cap charging very little and the neon lighting with each discharge of the coil. The cap is only charging because of the ringing of the circuit not from the main discharge as the neon has allowed that to be discharged through it. The diodes are now blocking the initial discharge of the coil.

Please build this and study the effects and you will see what I mean.

Recess time!!

Respectfully, Carroll
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Old 07-25-2013, 01:25 PM
gyula gyula is offline
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Hi DIVERFUN,

I would like to show you this link where the operation of a flyback inductor or transformer is explained. How does a flyback transformer ( or inductor ) work?
I qoute from the link:

"Discharge Stage: The current (which creates the magnetic field) from the source is then interrupted by opening a switch, thereby causing the magnetic field to collapse or decrease, hence a reversal in the direction of the magnetic field flux change (negative flux change over time). The negative flux change induces a voltage in the opposite direction from that induced during the charging stage. The terms ďflybackĒ or ďkickbackĒ originate from the induced voltage reversal that occurs when the supply current is interrupted. The reversed induced voltage(s) tries to create (induce) a current flow. The open switch prevents current from flowing through the power supply. With the voltage reversed, the diode now permits current flow through it, hence current flows into the capacitor and the load across the capacitor. If current can flow, then the resulting flow of current is in the direction, which tries to maintain the existing magnetic field. The induced current cannot maintain this field but does slow down the decline of the magnetic field. A slower decline translates to a lower induced flyback voltage. If current cannot flow, the magnetic field will decline very rapidly and consequently create a much higher induced voltage. In effect, the flyback action will create the necessary voltage needed to discharge the energy stored in the flyback transformer or inductor."

I hope this also helps.

rgds, Gyula

PS On general working of such transformers: Flyback Transformers - Custom Built transformers with schematics including flyback circuit topology, inductor transformer
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Old 07-20-2015, 05:26 AM
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May Have found it

Ok, sometimes you must walk away from things for a long time and just let things fester in your head. If you look at the circuit diagram Mike posted you will see something that I may have overlooked. I donít know why I missed it, could have been thinking about something else. When I hooked a small battery in place of mikes ss circuit the motor ran as normal. That is why I came to the conclusion that mike hid a battery in the ss relay. So now back to the circuit, if you look you will see that when the switch is on the two coils make up an Autoformer, this type of device builds voltage without changing the impedance of the driving coil so the driving coil does not see the load of the capacitor the Autoformer works like a basic car spark coil. The only reason I say this is I had a job with some radio circuits
where I had to make this type of transformer to supply the load of the antenna without effecting the transmitter. Amplifiers in the 70ís used these transformers (Mcintosh) you could short the amp out and nothing would happen. I have experimented with this type of transformer and it is possible to build a Window Motor to run like this but you cannot take any power from it, Unity. I know this is late timing but at least I have posted it.
John B
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Old 07-20-2015, 01:52 PM
mbrownn mbrownn is offline
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Thankyou for the update, any information is good information, even when late
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Old 07-20-2015, 06:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Bedini View Post
I have experimented with this type of transformer and it is possible to build a Window Motor to run like this but you cannot take any power from it, Unity. I know this is late timing but at least I have posted it.
John B

Hi John

Good to see you back diggin in the posts. Unity is good for me.

I am learning. I use to think UNITY? So what, but now I see that

UNITY shows that all of the models in science are lacking because

the system teaches under unity. Maybe somebody could throw

a set of Howards gates on one and go overUNITY

I see your part 22 16 pole Ferris wheel, she really takes the cake.

Michael Rowland (Central Kansas USA)
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Old 07-20-2015, 07:39 PM
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John_Bedini John_Bedini is offline
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Yes, Unity is good, I just donít know how I could have missed this, itís really bugging me. I have done a test with the original motor and if you hook a bridge and a capacitor to the window coil and spin the motor up it charges the cap fast. Now if you pulse the motor with S1 it keeps running for a very long time. The key to it is the transformer as I stated. I could not find a diagram
To post what I mean so I must draw it. It is important on how the second part of the coil is hooked up. The polarity must be correct and the timing of the switch. Be back later with drawing
John B
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Old 07-21-2015, 02:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by John_Bedini View Post
Yes, Unity is good, I just donít know how I could have missed this, itís really bugging me. I have done a test with the original motor and if you hook a bridge and a capacitor to the window coil and spin the motor up it charges the cap fast. Now if you pulse the motor with S1 it keeps running for a very long time. The key to it is the transformer as I stated. I could not find a diagram
To post what I mean so I must draw it. It is important on how the second part of the coil is hooked up. The polarity must be correct and the timing of the switch. Be back later with drawing
John B
Good man John I knew I could count on you.

I would rather have a souped up window motor than

those other imitations. Maybe if we keep it going those guys

will see this post and find out what you have to say.

You know I look at this simple circuit and really it is

not a hard one to build. And yes I heard you the first time

on the transformers and how your job way back took you

in that direction. I will have to play catch up and love

every minute of it. I just don't know much about it yet.

To me UNITY means a step up from this University dogma.

Then it proves that we can go beyond that. I hear ya on the

way you feel about thinking he had a battery in there.

So many try to pull the wool over my head I understand.


We will be looking forward to your help John.
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Old 07-22-2015, 08:45 AM
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JB welcome back.
Hope everyone had a great time this year at Coeur d' Alene.
The project with unity might really be a doable interesting hands on project.

"The Motor that runs without draining the batteries"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1xZJYKpVf4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...pPLQBls#t=1108

Great progress on the solar system solar tracker, Rcharger, nickel hydrate cells,
Alum conversion has been great advancement for off grid systems, Nice work and to
John, Chuck and everyone at Energenx, great job this year !
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Old 07-27-2015, 07:13 AM
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John never left here he is with his window motor. And

I heard Yaro say John showed it at the ENERGY POW WOW!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3QHsoyGH5I

I saw someone use hall effects and MOT coils to make quick

work of the window motor.



Take your time John, I know you are probably wiped out from

all the traffic up there in Idaho. As crude as I often sound I

really do enjoy your down to earth performances.
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Old 07-27-2015, 10:57 PM
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Self Running Window Motor

Duplicated here: Building a window motor
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Old 07-28-2015, 12:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron View Post
Duplicated here: Building a window motor

Thanks Aaron

for the heads up. I went over there and looked at the posts

and I could not find a window motor video by anyone of the

replicators. Maybe I missed it? Also unless you sign in as a member

that information in picture form is confidential.

I am glad for the text.

I will go back and look to see if I can open a picture or find

a video presentation showing how their particular replication

of the JOHN BEDINI WINDOW MOTOR working, because that is

what it takes.

BRB


Okay I found a DADHAV video from 2010?
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Old 07-28-2015, 03:16 AM
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There is no better information than what John Bedini has.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F3QHsoyGH5I

When John approves the next video for a replication he

deems comparable, then I will take note.

John bedini has said many times when he pulled out of forums

and groups that the stuff on the internet is not what he is doing.

Or in other words, if I don't hear it from John Bedini then I

think it is not completely a certified replicator.


Unless I get it right from the horses mouth I won't know.


It looks like I need to get my lathe warmed up cause John

is in full swing again. As usual new things on the horizon.

I am getting excited about this new design.


And also a special thx to Aaron and all of the people

who work with John to make these learning experiences

possible.

You guys are awesome folks, well worth the money.
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Old 07-28-2015, 05:14 AM
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Window Motor TidBits

Hello Jeff
There's been many different kinds of window motors built through the years. There have been some pretty good threads about them as well. I'm sorry to say I don't remember where they where to help you out with that. You will have some digging to do. I'll share a few of my experiences with you if it will help. There are pictures of a jig for winding coils. A rectangle coil is not the only coil to wind for a motor. If you are using three coils it is beneficial to use a wooden jig like is pictured in some of JB's literature. Again, I don't have instant reference to it but is is there. The issue of using an iron core or rotor is a mater of preference. I have used both iron and Delrin. I personally prefer a mild steel rotor. I do not use a hex shape and prefer to mill slots for the magnets. I'm not sure what you mean by a compound configuration but you should use six magnets with alternating poles outward on the faces. This is the best way to start but experimenting with what is known as a notch rotor also has some interesting results. Your windings can vary dramatically depending on what you are trying to accomplish. Higher turns ratios say in the 400 turns or more will give you a slower but stronger motor that is easy to trigger and has low current draw. Less turns say in the 200-300 turns area will give higher RPM's with less torque but higher current draw. The WM can run from an SSG, half wave, full wave or Single Coil Motor Circuit. In all cases you are not likely to have charging results that would be better than a monopole motor. I would suggest winding two triggers and one power coil or better yet add an additional power coil to experiment with a generator circuit. If you haven't been there yet, you are welcome to visit my channel where I have some videos of a small and very efficient motors. The first one shows how I constructed mine. Here are a few links:
Window Motor Assembly And Capacitor Test - YouTube
Window Motor Running On Capacitors - YouTube
Window Motor On Water Battery & Solar + (Notch Rotor) - YouTube
There is other videos that pertain to the window motors there as well. I hope something here might be of some use to you since you are just starting to learn about these fun motors. I will be posting some other videos soon with a different style motors running from a circuit that doesn't require a standard trigger source so you may want to check back later as well.
Take care.
John Hav

Quote:
So the first stage would be the SSG circuit (probably in GEN MODE), then the output of the ssg circuit would go to the cap that will power the bedini-cole circuit (that will give a really strong extra punch to the rotor if the cap is high in voltage and capacity), then I can use the output of the bedini-cole again, maybe to feed the bedini-cole cap or a second cap powering another bedini-cole.

I know that the output of the SSG and the bedini cole is always less than what I put in, but let's say that with the ssg I get 3000 rpm, then with the output of the ssg into the bedini-cole I could get another 1500 rpm, and then another 750 rpm more, etc, etc. in 3 stages I could get 5000++ RPM using the same power.

Then I am going to have regular generator coils to charge a 2nd battery. GEN COILS -> COMPARATOR CAP DUMP -> 2nd BATTERY.

And I can probably also include some tesla nodes all over the place.

I made a bedini-cole circuit the other day, and used the one in the image called 1GT, like the ferris wheel but with just power coil (ferris wheel used 3 parallel coils),

basicly instead of the trigger winding it uses a hall sensor.

that one is: 404 (Page Not Found) Error - Ever feel like you're in the wrong place?

if you google "bedini-cole circuit" you will get a looooot of variants of the same circuit,

I have an issue with the idea about running a ssg circuit, and send the recovery to a cap that would be the source for a bedini-cole circuit in the same rotor.

The SSG circuit in radiant mode tuned to 1 pulse per magnet would give me a RPM of aprox 3200. but with the secondary circuit in place (bedini-cole) the RPM went down to 2000+ , so I started to try things to see what was causing the RPM loss... After some tests, it seems that the bedini-cole circuit is causing drag even if it is not triggered, is that normal???

I connected the SSG circuit to run the rotor and the output of the ssg was sent to a comparator. Then I placed again the bedini-cole circuit with an empty cap as power source and the drag started again, there is power been sent to the primary of the bedini-cole when the rotor is spinning, by normal induction (the output of the bedini-cole was not connected to anything) I don't know why this is happening since the power coil is isolated from the power source (empty cap) by the 2 transistors. Could this be happening because of the reverse breakdown of the transistors???

Any advice?


best,

Alvaro
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gary

Here you go.

http://www.icehouse.net/john1/dsw1.jpg

This is found under "Motor diagrams and lab Notes" on John's old "icehouse" web site JOHN BEDINI'S COLLECTION OF FREE ENERGY MACHINES

Sequential Bipolar Switch - Commutator.jpg

SequentialBipolarCircuit.jpg










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Old 07-28-2015, 05:42 AM
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Collection of facts.






Quote:
Originally Posted by Aaron
Analysis by John Bedini PART 1

Analysis by John Bedini PART 1

I'm posting some deductive reasoning by John Bedini that he posted
online. These are the keys to making it work properly and his comments
are an analysis on what Mike said about his modification of John's circuit.

----------------

Everbody read Mike's story it will help.

Everone just read mikes story
John


Hi Dom,

wind your coil yet?, look for about 6-8 ohms on the main winding this gives a large back EMF wich charges the cap quick at first.
I will try to attach the video of my window type motor now follow the first cct and yes trigger is smaller wire. The hall effect transistor is to activate sw1 I use a solid state relay for sw1 wind as much turns as possible try to get above 6 ohm. The circuit will need a battery for power source.. Their are some modifications needed for acheiving unity, then you can get rid of the battery. Dont worry about that for now just get it to run with a battery.Also I made a mistake the main winding on my motor is 46 ohms
so 40-60 ohms sorry about that .No in the video the motor was powered by capicitance only. no battery. Trifiler wound I must warn you though if you are thinking this is some sort of overunity it is not. If you add a load the motor will slowly come to a stop.

Yes feedback, and play with sw1 timing I must tell you I use the third winding on my stator coil as a generator winding to charge the cap up from 0v, then when the transistors begin to pulse the back emf through sw1 brings the voltage on the cap even higher till it levels and the motor is then runing at unity (this is just what I think is hapening and I could be missing somthing here)


I don't Know how long the motor can run for, but I always stop it after a few hours or so. I am scared to leave it running unattended (a fire or explosion would not be good)the running voltage is higher when I give it a big spin by hand. so far every time I ran it the voltage has always leveled off some where bellow 12v or so my cap is good up to 25v
glad to here that you have started construction allright after tracing all the wires I have come up with a diagram of the modification. and a close call, I had found the motor would not run after a couple wires were swiched around by accident. coil polarity is very important. yes same as Bedini/Cole.All components are the same except for the added parts a hall IC and a ss relay and also third winding.

Main winding is connected at the collectors. follow Bedini/Cole cct great work.
you must get your window motor running,then we can talk about charge timing and unity.study the scope shots I posted and you will get an idea of timing. Two EMF spikes per cycle
I go back to work one more thing before I go, When you go to run your motor have a AM radio close to the stator coil you should here two cracks brodcasted for every magnet pair passing. a quick way to tell if you are hooked up correctly. This link is very good Schematics Illustrated must check it out

I learned alot from these illustrations, look at the commutator to see the timing , the bad news, I left my window motor running last night. Now it does not run at all. I will check all components after work.I feel very disapointed. OK back from work now I check the motor. I did a quick visual inspection and it looks OK and the cap holds a charge but when I turn the shaft it does not run, more checks.


I think the third winding is allways charging the cap the ss relay puts the main winding in series with the third winding at the correct time, take into account the rectifier diode in between them.
ps: looks like the hall ic is not working and also the PNP, the ss relay is fine, I have no more hall ic's and only a few PNP's.This suxs .

anyway I figured I would take some pictures of the stator and post soon This is not overunity, just a motor that can charge a cap and run off it for a wile.
Scope shots were taken dirrectly off the coil. I will post more detail when I have my motor running again.I will scavenge up a hall ic from something.

I don't know if all is needed for the circuit.I just know that this is how I got it to run longer. how long I dont know so far maby a couple hours. I belive it is working at or near unity. i will swap the bad parts now and try to get it running again. As for the posistion of my flywheel magnets I will give that info later after I have finished my testing.
Oh and the scope shots, the third winding shot scope is set to diffrent scope timing. yes the original circuit will charge the cap my modification charged the cap from 0v faster
yes somthing is wrong with the cap. If I charge it with 12v it will not hold long and spark from discharge is week.Still looking for a hall ic any ideas where to find one 3030 also did anyone find this paticular cap I have only one and the place where I got it, BG Micro no longer has any.

maby another big cap will take its place. can run the motor now but only with battery power. back to where I started.

I will get a hall sw at the local IC Supply store in the morning. any body have a running motor yet I know Dom looked realy close to finished.


OK Stefan, on second look your circuit is correct. the ss relay on your circuit looked wrong but I see it now

I know that the third winding charges the cap. and I think somthing coming through the ss relay helps this charge.
still trying to get my motor to work correctly, It has prooven to be harder than I thought.
I will post new scope shots soon

I just want to say that I have never claimed this to be overunity I think it is near unity the third winding charges the cap quickly and the motor runs of this charge for a long time not forever.
It makes me happy to see another window motor running.now what I did after getting my motor to run without any mods.
I would use it to charge a second battery hopeing I could switch the batteries over and over and it would run for ever, this was not the case, then I found out that if I charged a large cap up with it the motor drew less current from the battery. this was with sw1 between cap+ and bat+,,monitor your input current with diffrent caps to see what works best. I get 2.8v ac spinning by hand try it with just the main coil to the bridge to the cap and see how fast you can charge the cap to 6v by hand and let me know your results
4.5v ac main winding
2.2v ac trigger winding
2.8 v ac third winding
stefan please show me were to place scope leeds on the diagram I posted Stefan please slow down the questions here are the scope shots you wanted

Main is top trace on both 1st shot is the main and trigger windings 2nd shot is the main and third windings I will do more tomorrow I am waiting for a hall ic so please be patient

OK guys I got the hall ic and the motor is working again here are the scope shots taken across cap neg. and ss relay output before diode.

scope set at 2v per div. at 10 ms per div. first shot is with hall sensor hooked up and the second is without it hooked up
I have posted my full circuit diagram allready. but here it is again. i found this to work best for my setup.

please follow it exactly making no changes so we can compare results taken across cap neg. and ss relay output before diode.
scope neg to cap neg no it will not run long without hall sensing. I pulled the hall output to ss relay, I spun it by hand for the scope shot (without hall ss relay)
Lets build and then compare results I am going to build another to the same specs and see if it performes the same.

When you get your motor to run on a battery, charge a cap off the bridge dc then time the ss relay to dump this charge back on the battery. when you get the correct timing the motor will draw little to no current from the battery. this will be the same timing for the moddified circuit. use three magnets in triangle formation.
Hope this helps

cheers mike


Aaron Murakami
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