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Lockridge Device - Peter Lindemann

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  • #76
    hello from rainy New Zealand where living on a boat would make 300 watts look like heaven,,
    Back or counter emf: a normal function of the motors rotating armature
    A voltage produced within the motor itself.Works against external applied voltage.
    Results in effective voltage ,always lower than applied.
    Bemf increases with speed of rotation
    Think about it : day after day of overcast and rain solar panels yield nothing.
    Not enough breeze to interest a wind generator. No place to go,so far. but to the oil powered gen set, or forget the frig,a tiny one at that and live in the dark? not fun with technology buried for over a 100 years.
    Not nice for a fellow that thinks twice before buying green bananas.
    I am all in for this device the specific GE motor on its way along with photoi flash caps from ebay. Gentleman and Dear Peter. i m truly hopeful.
    A joyus holiday to all


    • #77
      May the Counter Force be with YOU <<<<>>>>

      Peter this is my thought on Counter E.M.F.

      Back Electromotive Force (BEMF) or Counter Electromotive Force Counter E.M.F. the latter being my preferred term, as it is what our forefathers used. Why rename it? So back to your question. What is your understanding and definition of BACK EMF?

      Let me answer as follows:

      "Joseph Kittinger" He did what so many people have tried to do, which is to go really fast with as little force as possible. In his case only gravity! He simply removed all the Counter Force! Although, he did encounter the Counter force thankfully at the end of his fall, in order to survive to tell the story. If he had done this on the moon, where there is no air density, he would not have stopped until he slammed into the surface of the moon. So in that case, the surface of the moon would have been his deadly counter force. | Ask Us - Fastest Skydiver Joseph Kittinger

      Another answer to the question is: “Space-ship-one” this rocket plane also went really fast with no effort at all by totally removing all the counter force and only having gravity do the work, free energy! That is, once they got it to its highest point in the flight and then it started to free fall, gravity did all the work. Counter force was and is experienced to this day by every pilot in terms of drag...the faster you fly the greater the drag. Effective thrust is = applied thrust – drag. This is how you determine the max speed. In the presence of a counter force in the above examples the air or the DENSITY of AIR will present a force depending on the amount of air molecules. The greater the density the greater the counter force. This is what Chuck Yeager experienced in the X-1 Now he had to PAY BIG TIME for the force to go really fast. When Kittinger paid little!

      So in the case of Counter E.M.F. the air density is the “Maxwell” and/or “Gauss”

      (Maxwell – is the unit of magnetic flux. It is the amount of magnetism which passes through every square centimeter of a field of unit density.)
      (Gauss - is the unit of intensity of a magnetic field

      So we can say that the Counter E.M.F. is the resistance encountered when passing a charged conductor through a magnetic field and the resultant opposing force in that conductor. Just like in air the slower we go the less counter action. This counter action shows up in terms of opposing voltage in the conductor, thus limiting current.
      So “Effective voltage (Effective thrust) = Applied voltage (applied thrust) – opposing voltage (Drag)” Sorry, I am a pilot...could not help my self...

      The really neat thing hear, is there are many ways to reduce the Counter E.M.F., or go faster/or get more bang for our buck. We can add more voltage (thrust) in low impedance, or reduce speed of motor. Or we can reduce the magnetic density in this case in the stator field. We can change where we apply the current on the commutator by advancing or retarding position. We can of course reduce the duty cycle of the applied power and/or a combination of all the above. We can even redirect the flux or current to avoid it or use it for our benefit. (Now that is a novel thought, why has nobody ever thought of that? LOL outside of this forum ) … the possibilities are endless … but what is MOST amazing is that after a 100+ years we are doing none of the above in most cases!

      I think most of all, this counter force, is the free energy we are looking for. We put in some effort and nature responds and pushes back!! Energy is input into the system but many only see this as negating our input. Simply run a motor between to differentials of potential! This should tell you right here!! You get two outputs. Once to charge and one to run the motor!! All we are doing is opening the door to adroitly capture and use it. That is our free input!!!!

      Now I feel that I am rambling on way more that I should. I just love this topic so much...sorry for being so long winded. This is just my thinking of Counter E.M.F. or BEMF.


      PS: What do you do when you encounter a “counter force”? You apply, “counter measures”!
      Last edited by Karl_Palsness; 12-20-2010, 06:07 AM.


      • #78
        Back EMF

        Hi, two on this team
        1) MARK RIZKALLA <> Back emf or counter emf, it is the electromotive force or voltage in the coils being produced when the armature coils cut the magnetic field, that induced voltage always opposes the applied terminal voltage. The stronger the field the faster the rotating speed, the larger will be the back emf. However the back emf will always be less than the applied voltage because of the voltage drop due to the resistance of the armature coils. so the back emf acts as a battery oppoing the applied voltage.

        2) Reggie (back emf) The collapse of the magnetic field

        The oscilloscope pictures below, show the signal generated by a moving magnet :

        - The left picture is the voltage generated across the coil when a magnet axis crosses the coil axis, this is a conventional setup for a magnetic generator.
        - The right picture is the voltage generated across the coil when a magnet axis crosses the middle of the tangent coil (orthogonal component of the magnetic field), this is the case of the Mini-Romag generator.

        • In the left case (conventional generator), you can notice that the signal induced across the coil is symetrical Vs the zero line, the voltage value induced during the approach phase is equal to the voltage induced during the exit phase. During the approach phase of the North pole of the magnet (from the left to the coil axis), a North pole is created on the bottom surface of the coil (according to the Lenz law), this creates the negative voltage shown. When the North pole of the magnet leaves the axis of the coil, a South pole is created on the bottom surface of the coil (according to the Lenz law), this creates the positive voltage shown in the scope picture. The flux in the coil has been reversed in this case. In this case there is always a magnetic coupling between the rotor (magnets) and the stator (coil).

        • In the right case (orthogonal field (Mini-Romag Setup)), you may notice that the voltage induced is more positive than negative (asymmetrical) when the magnet crosses the middle of the tangent coil. During the approach phase of the North pole of the magnet (from the left to the middle of the coil), a North pole is created on the left surface of the coil (according to the Lenz law), this creates the negative voltage shown. During the exit phase of the North pole of the magnet (from the middle of the coil to the right), a South pole is created on the right surface of the coil (according to the Lenz law), this creates the negative voltage shown. The coil flux has never been reversed in this case. Now, look at the middle position (when the magnet crosses the middle of the coil). In this case, the orthogonal magnetic flux density drops to zero (this has been checked with a gauss meter). So the positive pulse induced in the coil is not due to the moving magnet, but it is generated by the collapse of the magnetic field (Back EMF)....In this case there is no magnetic coupling between the rotor (magnets) and the stator (coil) during the positive phase of the signal generated.
        Last edited by goreggie; 04-03-2011, 11:07 AM.


        • #79
          Back emf

          2) Reggie (back emf) is the collapse of the magnetic field or negative energy which can be redirected to a battery or capacitor as another form of energy them used as a supply energy

          "The Min-Romag Generator by Jean-Louis Naudin JLN Labs created on 04-08-99"


          • #80
            Back Emf

            Originally posted by Peter Lindemann View Post
            Mark, and everyone else,
            So we can all get going on the SAME PAGE, I would like everyone who wants to participate in this thread to write down on a piece of paper what your understanding and definition of BACK EMF is.

            DO NOT POST YOUR ANSWER. Just write it down as best you can. I told the answer in the lecture, but I don't want early "posters" to influence others, for better or for worse. Then on Sunday night, everyone can post their answer without looking at anyone else's answer. That should give me a pretty clear idea of how people are thinking about this and what they have learned from my lecture so far.

            The kind of machine discussed in the lecture can operate as either a motor or a generator. Whenever the motor shaft is turning or generator is supplying current, motor and generator effects are both occurring in the machine simultaneously.

            In motor operation, when external electrical power (voltage and current) is applied to the machine, current in the armature produces torque which turns the shaft providing a mechanical output (motor effect). As a result of the shaft turning, voltage is produced (generator effect). However, this generated voltage opposes the input voltage. The strength of the generated voltage is directly proportional to the rotational speed of the shaft. The generated voltage is 0 when the shaft is stalled and maximum when the RPM is maximum.

            "generated voltage" (the generator output of the motor) = BACK EMF


            • #81

              Do you know of a working model of mini-romag, or romag?


              • #82
                Originally posted by radiant1 View Post
                Do you know of a working model of mini-romag, or romag?
                Hi Allen I can get you the site to review for your question OK
                just give me till tonight to post ok Thanks Reggie


                • #83

                  BEMF is generated in a circuit as the supply energy charges the circuit. It is in opposition to the supply, or operating energy. Depending on the design of the machine the BEMF may be almost as large as the supply energy or it may only be a small fraction of the supply energy. As the BEMF decreased compared to the supply energy, the COP, or the efficiency of the machine increases.


                  • #84
                    BEMF is the equal and opposite reaction to a changed magnetic field. It works to cancel the created (disturbed) field thereby returning the area/device to a balanced/neutral state.


                    • #85
                      Originally posted by everwiser View Post
                      BEMF is the equal and opposite reaction to a changed magnetic field. It works to cancel the created (disturbed) field thereby returning the area/device to a balanced/neutral state.
                      Simple question, if equal and opposite.....HOW CAN A MOTOR SPIN. the initial impetus will be negated by its reaction.

                      What separates the two?



                      • #86
                        Time, geometry, and the application of excess energy to force the magnetic fields to remain in motion.

                        It's time because BEMF is a reaction which implies the action it's reacting to took place earlier in time.

                        It's geometry because all "typical" motors are built to inhibit/weaken the BEMF so that the operation requires less applied energy to sustain the running speed.

                        Without the constant application of extra energy the BEMF will balance the field and cancel its movement.


                        • #87
                          Hi Peter,

                          My best understanding is that every motor has a counteracting generater effect in voltage and every generator has a counteracting motor effect in voltage.

                          So if +12V are applied to a motor and the counter generating effect is -3V then the motor only gets to run on +9V and is only 75% efficient.

                          If a generator is spun to +12V output and is only 75% efficient than you have a counter motoring effect of -4V from the generated +16V.

                          This is my understanding.

                          Fantastic DVD Peter, so concise and easy to understand.
                          I also found the Basic Electricity 5 volume series first edition from 1954 that you recommended at the conference.

                          Thank you Peter for your time on this forum and all you do this brew's for you!



                          • #88
                            Back EMF

                            Hi all

                            I Just couldn't keep lurking on this one so here goes:

                            Thank you Peter for posing the question.

                            IMHO it seems that Back EMF is about the most misused term on the forum. I know I have had some fuzzy thinking about it, So after reading a bunch of Wikipedia pages and watching the last part of the video for the eighth time (even Peter stumbles with it @ 1:14:22 in the video) I think I got it.

                            Back EMF is the voltage that opposes the applied voltage in conventional motor topologies. It is generated by the coils moving through the magnetic field, and it is the inverse of the "back" torque in conventional generator topologies.

                            Back EMF is often confused with flyback voltage. In fact is actually flyback's opposite because Back EMF is what limits the initial current in an inductor. (Help me out here, have I got this right? ) The expanding magnetic field generates a voltage opposing the applied voltage limiting the current, just like in a motor. Even Wikipedia's flyback diode article misuses it. (scope shot)

                            HTML Code:
                            Unlike the M&M equations in the Lockridge video the flyback is a forward voltage not back.

                            Maybe we can all agree on something unambiguous to call it like flyback voltage or inductive collapse energy ?

                            Deepest Thanks to All Who Make This Forum Rock
                            Last edited by poii; 12-21-2010, 09:31 AM.


                            • #89
                              Hey Guys

                              I'm ready to get to work here and wondering how many others have purchased the starter suggested by Peter. I've partially torn my apart to understand how it operates and have run some power through it. In its stock form its not very efficient and I think were going to have to make a lot of modification in oder to have a decent drive motor.

                              The first thing we'll need is to replace both end plates with ones that have bearings in them (Goreggie we need your help here).

                              Looking at the stator winding I think we need many more turns on them to increase the magnetic field. It also looks like the stator windings are wraped around a big piece of iron that srewed to the side of the case. Wouldn't it be beneficial to remove this piece of iron?

                              I also have been thinking of ways to collect the spike off the rotor. So far I can only come up with an extra set of brushes behind the powering ones but this maybe very tricky.

                              Just some of my thoughts so far



                              • #90
                                Back EMF

                                Originally posted by radiant1 View Post
                                Do you know of a working model of mini-romag, or romag?
                                The Mini-Romag explanation ? Here is the link Reggie