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  • Garry Stanley Pulse Motor

    Hi folks, I am just about ready to start building a true Garry Stanley pulse motor. I built one before that worked great, but I did not use the thin coils with a space in between the coil pair. Mine will be a little bit smaller than the one shown on his bike, although i read he changed the design to six magnets per rotor and 6 coil pairs making that 12 coils total and he said it worked better. Mine will have similar thin coils at 1/8" thick by 1-3/4" diameter with 1" hole since I'm using 1" diameter neo magnets. Center stator plate will be 3/8" thick hard wood and coils will sit on outside of this stator plate same as Garry's design was. I have read everything I could get my hands on regarding his comments and he said some very interesting things about his motor design that I was able to understand. Regardless of the seemingly abrupt end to his work being public, i feel his motor design is unique and worthy of further study.
    Here are a few pics of his pulse motor and a diagram.



    All comments greatly appreciated.
    peace love light
    Tyson

    Edit: I'm doing my best to recover the images, etc. in this thread, by request of darediamond.
    Last edited by SkyWatcher; 07-23-2016, 02:45 PM.

  • #2
    And here is an interesting quote from Garry.
    Hi Folks, This motor took a long time to make, but was from the design point, made in such a way that I would be able to try as many possible configurations in it as I thought possible at the time and so it has served as a very good test bed for a very long time for me. The very first thing about this is it uses both ends of the "coil" and does not waste one end as many motors do, this also brings in a factor of compression on the electro flux field between the magnets rather than the deflection and thus reduction of efficiency in a single rotor design. Further this causes the magnets by sheer proximity to have their flux fields extend into the coils and thus change the centre of the magnet pair also causing recompression on the coil flux field.
    When the coil is powered the flux field of the magnets is no longer attracted to the opposite magnet and instantly with the aid of the building electro flux field pushing it, returns to its normal position and thus the flux field is moving away from the coil while the magnet is approaching. ( The centre of the magnet flux field moves from between the coils to between the coil and the magnet, to do this it is going out of the coil as the magnet approaches.) Add to this that the magnet is only 1mm away from the coil which is 2 mm and there is an air gap which while only 4.5 mm now has been up to 9mm between the coils and you can see that the magnet flux field is in fact travelling backwards in the coil for a long period of time, relatively speaking. Inductive Lenz is removed in this setup and power on Lenz is equally reduced by the fact that each magnet is permeating both coils which as we all now know causes counter current and while the counter current isn't adequate to totally remove power on Lenz, by reducing it, more power get to be converted to shaft output. Lenz in a motor is actually desirable in some respects, its direct effect on the motor is to, minus losses to windage and friction, output a power level that eventually matches the input power and stops the motor from drawing high amps and running away until it explodes from excess centrifugal force. By reducing the Lenz during the driving pulse we move the unloaded speed of the motor higher per volt and again we all know that higher speed from the same input voltage actually results in more horse power. but in this case there is not more current flowing for this higher speed but exactly the same current flowing as if the motor had full Lenz but only went a fraction of the speed. I'm not sure I have accurately described any of this but just look at the hidden actions and reactions and see how they make it better, even if you cant get OU from this you will sure get a lesson or 2 on motors and their internal workings and this cant help but better arm you in your pursuit of bigger and better things.

    Garry Stanley
    peace love light
    Tyson

    Comment


    • #3
      Your diode is pointing the wrong way

      Regards
      "Once you've come to the conclusion that what what you know already is all you need to know, then you have a degree in disinterest." - John Dobson

      Comment


      • #4
        Hi folks, Hi Ren, those are not my pics of course since i have not started building yet and that is not my graphic schematic, however according to comments made by Garry, that is the correct diode orientation. Here is another quote from Garry and this quote is very very interesting and could help shed light on Don Smith's device #9, the interference type rotating generator. Quote:
        Hi Norman, Take a paper clip and 2 magnets and a piece of wood around 12 mm thick, use a magnet and measure the distance that the drawing pin is drawn to it from. Then place the 2 magnets on the wood so that they hold each other there, get thinner wood if you have weak magnets, and repeat the test. If I am correct that proximity changes the flux orbit toward the centre you should notice a difference in the distance that the magnet starts to pull the paper clip because in order to move the inner flux in the outer flux is pulled in as well and so the clip is closer before it is pulled to the magnet.
        When something interrupts this pull to the centre the flux returns to its normal place or a relative point and this is flux moving through the coil back to the magnet, when in fact the magnet is approaching the coil, the flux is effectively moving far faster and in the opposite direction thus causing current in line with the input power which adds to it rather than subtracts from it if it were in the other direction.

        Garry Stanley
        peace love light
        Tyson

        Comment


        • #5
          His configuration is great for a "motorized" generator, which is undoubtedly what he's after.
          Does he use air core coils? Otherwise the magnets would have a problem releasing the coil. I assume he was using ferrite magnets?
          The circuit is screwy. If you use that circuit with neo's you'll blow your transistor. I'd be surprised if the collapse pulse wouldn't blow it too. Note: if you use a mosfet you'll want to have a path to ground for the base or it won't shut off.
          Using both sides of the coil is an excellent idea. You can get a much higher flux density through the coil that way. This increases both torque and BEMF.
          The diode across the transistor is for protection. Many MOSFETs and IGBTs have one built right into to them. It's called the "freewheeling diode".
          This looks like an excellent project to dive into. I firmly believe that a motorized generator can be built and this could be a likely candidate for just that. I look forward to your test results.

          Ted

          Comment


          • #6
            Hi Ted, thanks for the reply. You would have to describe what you mean by motorized generator. It uses air-core coils one each side of a center stator plate with 2 rotors sandwiching the stator plate. I have built a model except without the air gap between coils and the flyback did not affect the transistor probably because it oscillates within the parallel series coil circuit and is less dangerous to the transistor. If you read one of the quotes posted you will see he postulated that a brief forward emf condition may result as the attraction power pulse is applied helping to increase efficiency. He was using neo magnets and so am I. Making coils right now, I'll need 12 total.
            peace love light
            Tyson

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by SkyWatcher View Post
              You would have to describe what you mean by motorized generator.
              Pardon my presumption. I figured since you're not going to get a whole lot of torque out of that motor that it was being used primarily for it's generative properties. The coil / magnet arrangement is ideal for a generator.
              He's probably using that diode across the transistor then as a ground for generating current back towards the battery. That's also what must be neutralizing the pulse. I would imagine the direction of rotation is important too.
              I like the concept. There's a lot of different ways to configure it too.

              Ted

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by SkyWatcher View Post
                Hi folks, Hi Ren, those are not my pics of course since i have not started building yet and that is not my graphic schematic, however according to comments made by Garry, that is the correct diode orientation. Here is another quote from Garry and this quote is very very interesting and could help shed light on Don Smith's device #9, the interference type rotating generator. Quote:

                peace love light
                Tyson
                Hi Tyson,

                Im aware that the schematic is not yours, and as Ted states the diode is implemented to serve a purpose, and is in the right orientation for protection of the switching devices.

                Its just my opinion that it could be better served directing the inductive kick elsewhere....


                Regards
                "Once you've come to the conclusion that what what you know already is all you need to know, then you have a degree in disinterest." - John Dobson

                Comment


                • #9
                  Hi Ren, thanks for the reply. I just posted that to show what he was doing i assume. My circuit will be somewhat different and will be collecting flyback Bedini style as I did in the previous model of Garry's motor. In my previous motor the flyback was somewhat subdued maybe cause the parallel series circuit and/or because air-core. I cut the stator plate and end plates, it is actually high density fiberboard.
                  peace love light
                  Tyson

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Hi Ted, thanks for reply. Yes it's a good generator also as the axial windmill generator shows. Though with the geometry described, possible lentz aiding occurs, we will see. As i said, i did build a motor like this, just without the exact geometry and coil placements and it had a lot of shaft power. That motor shown on his bike pulled him (around 250 pounds), mountain bike, 8-12volt lead acid batts. and motor to 12.5 mph. for around 100 watts. So this pulse motor design does not look weak to me, what do you think. Making more coils now.
                    peace love light
                    Tyson

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hi folks, here is a cad pic of the design I'm building. The end plates shown are 7" wide by 8" high and the dual rotors are 7" diameter with 6 neo magnet stacks per rotor. I'll have a pic soon of the structure put together.

                      peace love light
                      Tyson
                      Last edited by SkyWatcher; 07-23-2016, 03:25 PM.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by SkyWatcher View Post
                        Hi Ren, thanks for the reply. I just posted that to show what he was doing i assume. My circuit will be somewhat different and will be collecting flyback Bedini style as I did in the previous model of Garry's motor. In my previous motor the flyback was somewhat subdued maybe cause the parallel series circuit and/or because air-core. I cut the stator plate and end plates, it is actually high density fiberboard.
                        peace love light
                        Tyson
                        You actually won't get the torque out of the motor if you do and there are some dangers involved in collecting the fly back from a 96 volt system (if your using that). Take into account you have 12 coils and say 200 turns. Start out with 96 volt your gonna get somewhere in the range of 300 to 400 volts on the step up. (Thats not exact math).
                        If you discharge that back to your batteries they won't be long for running. Especially the first one it hits.

                        The reason he points the diode back is a very good one. If say you fire the coils to push the magnet away in one direction. Then you reload the coil with the fly back in reverse direction, to attract the next set of magnets at the same time your stepping the voltage up to a point it probably has no "umph" and redepositing the energy into the positive side of the battery for recollection.

                        I think its rather novel approach, and I love how simple it is. I am going to give it a test and see on one of mine. I don't think I have ever tried that configuration.

                        Matt

                        Ma
                        ADD BROMIKEY TO YOUR IGNORE LIST He is a saboteur bent on the systematic distraction of every good topic on this forum and since he has been here most working threads have shut down. He is the enemy. If you have blocked him already add this to your signature and encourage others to block him as well. His onslaught of rambling in large text and his constant attempts to misinform at the excuse of being stupid should no longer be tolerated.

                        USER CP/Ignore list.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi Matt, thanks for the reply. As far as the diode, testing will see what happens and I can assure you there is plenty of torque in these motors. The main reason I am building another one of these is because the first model of the motor ran awesome and since i was experimenting with Don Smith's device #9, I see possible similarities here. In both, we have 2 magnets extending there fields through coils to connect with each other at a bloch wall in space and in both we are interrupting this connection. In the case of Garry's pulse motor, it is claimed that with the help of the space between the coils, when coil attraction pulse is applied, the neo magnet bloch wall is interrupted and the coil flux moves faster in opposite direction to magnet movement. There is a theme going on here between these 2 devices. Also, the flyback output with the parallel/series wiring is not at the level you think, it is far less than normal Bedini type setups, though with complicated switching could be. I am drilling holes in stator and end plates today and making more coils.
                          peace love light
                          Tyson

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I'll be interested to see how much torque can be generated by an air core coil. Torque is a direct result of flux density (B field, magnetic current flow...). I'm wondering how much of a conduit those air cores will actually make for current flow between the magnets, or will the flow go straight into the coil? My guess would be into the coil, as air has very low permeability, which gets worse exponentially with distance.
                            Nevertheless, I hope it works better than expectations and we all learn something from it. Thanks for sharing.

                            Cheers,

                            Ted

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Hi Ted, thanks for reply. It's the dual rotor magnets facing each other in attraction that does the trick. As Garry pointed out, the field is compressed there, so no deflection occurs and the flux is dense that way. Believe me Ted, I tried using cores with my old motor and it ran worse and drew more current as a result, so i went back to air core and it flew and used less current doing so and if i grabbed the shaft it burned my hand in short time. Maybe using ferromagnetic cores might be ok if used in something like the Kawai motor, but in a typical motor it seems to detract. I would recommend building a small pulse motor like Garry's design with the dual rotors and thin air-cores and see for yourself, what is what. I'll post a pic later of my progress on my motor. I have the structure almost done, working on winding the thin coils.
                              peace love light
                              Tyson

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