Donald Smith Devices too good to be true

[mr.clean]

Hi man, have some new videos?

well my perepiteia vids were pre-Don Smith, but they're there on my channel

I will be showing my recent changes to the Smith soon man

[Farmhand]

Hey guys, this is probably something most of you know, but I will show it anyway. This is the genuine circuit on the primary from the photo's. It does not work, you cannot spark to earth ground out of the NST. If I use a different circuit the primary will run, but not with the circuit in the pics. February 29, 2012 7:28 PM - YouTube

I think the pic is just a representation of what is really going on, although its not far off. I also think that there are a few that are successful but just have not continued because they are to focused on making the light brighter. The light is not going to be bright with 1000v @ 35MHZ.

Has anyone built the isolation transformer?

Nolan

Hi kajunkreations, Nice setup ! Very neat. I've got steel from an old 8 kW motor,
the laminae are round with pole projections for the original coils, I cut all the
little pole projections of the steel core "plates" so I end up with a neat ring,
then stack them back together to make a laminated toroidal core whatever
height I want. Each plate weighs 80 grams. That's how I plan to make my
core, each ring is 220mm outer diameter and 160mm inner diameter just over
0.5mm thick, so a 50 mm high core would weigh over 6 kilograms.

The original 8 kW motor core was about 130 mm high I estimate it would
weigh at least 40 kilograms, I don't think we would be carrying one of
those in a suitcase. Not unless your built like a gorilla. I've also got a
T650-52 iron powder core it's 6.5 inches diameter 2 inches high and it weigh a
few kilo's too, I wouldn't be able to carry it for long but I think it could work
for a few kW.

Cheers

[kajunkreations]

Hi kajunkreations, Nice setup ! Very neat. I've got steel from an old 8 kW motor,
the laminae are round with pole projections for the original coils, I cut all the
little pole projections of the steel core "plates" so I end up with a neat ring,
then stack them back together to make a laminated toroidal core whatever
height I want. Each plate weighs 80 grams. That's how I plan to make my
core, each ring is 220mm outer diameter and 160mm inner diameter just over
0.5mm thick, so a 50 mm high core would weigh over 6 kilograms.

The original 8 kW motor core was about 130 mm high I estimate it would
weigh at least 40 kilograms, I don't think we would be carrying one of
those in a suitcase. Not unless your built like a gorilla. I've also got a
T650-52 iron powder core it's 6.5 inches diameter 2 inches high and it weigh a
few kilo's too, I wouldn't be able to carry it for long but I think it could work
for a few kW.

Cheers

Thanks farm. You build some very nice stuff yourself. The device you have in the other thread is beautiful. I'm going to get started on the transformer soon.

[Jack Noskills]

Welcome on Board Jack.N !
You maybe are up to something with your way of view about the tube device.
Would you mind,please to draw a schematic as how it might be connected ?!
Thanks.

Seems that you had already drawn the schematic for the primary side, it was in page 111 or 112. I tried to get it here but page would not download anymore. Some probs with database maybe.

[Jack Noskills]

Possible Don schematic

By looking at those pictures I came up with this schematic. It makes sense atleast to me. NST spits voltage in LC tank when spark occurs where it oscillates many times as primary is of low self inductance and heavy gauge wire. Two outputs form bloch wall where the primary is so primary is unaffected by output coils as bloch wall is neutral zone. Primary is happily banging the energy around in LC tank and each cycle produces two copies at output and you can use both of them. Also when LC is ringing NST is does not see it as GDT does not conduct. To get resonance NST must deliver more charge at the correct moment, when the kid in the swing is closest to pusher. Damn, cannot be simpler than this.

There seems to be some serious builders here, maybe this is worth a shot. I think this can be debugged also with function generator using lower voltage. You can get Gas Discharge Tubes that lit as low as 230 volts, maybe even lower. Possibly output voltage of function gen could be increased with some voltage doubler circuit or even trafo with core that can handle high frequencies. I am saying that you dont need to use lethal voltages to get this thing working in resonance.

Remember how Don tuned the circuit, he lowered the voltage with Variac just enough to light the GDT. So power going through GDT is irrelevant, it is the tank circuit that makes the juice. If too much power goes though GDT it melts down making short circuit.

[philly b]

That is the most wanted piece of the puzzle as I see it now.
That`s where things will get very interesting on this thread !
Isolation transformer suggestions are precious folks.
Come on everybody give some hints so everyone gets their hands on.
cheers.

Asymetrical output transformer perhaps?

[mr.clean]

sweet

By looking at those pictures I came up with this schematic. It makes sense atleast to me. NST spits voltage in LC tank when spark occurs where it oscillates many times as primary is of low self inductance and heavy gauge wire. Two outputs form bloch wall where the primary is so primary is unaffected by output coils as bloch wall is neutral zone. Primary is happily banging the energy around in LC tank and each cycle produces two copies at output and you can use both of them. Also when LC is ringing NST is does not see it as GDT does not conduct. To get resonance NST must deliver more charge at the correct moment, when the kid in the swing is closest to pusher. Damn, cannot be simpler than this.

There seems to be some serious builders here, maybe this is worth a shot. I think this can be debugged also with function generator using lower voltage. You can get Gas Discharge Tubes that lit as low as 230 volts, maybe even lower. Possibly output voltage of function gen could be increased with some voltage doubler circuit or even trafo with core that can handle high frequencies. I am saying that you dont need to use lethal voltages to get this thing working in resonance.

Remember how Don tuned the circuit, he lowered the voltage with Variac just enough to light the GDT. So power going through GDT is irrelevant, it is the tank circuit that makes the juice. If too much power goes though GDT it melts down making short circuit.

right on man, make videos !

and one thing i regret not doing was recording all my results, its fun to do, plus i have driven myself crazy switching coils, caps, drivers..,,comparing one arrangement to another...

and after a while you lose track of past results, then gotta repeat what you did already... the driven crazy part :j

but yes its simple enough, just keep in mind a few posts earlier, the pics are very much in QUESTION :0

what i have learned is that it DOES work,,, BUT, you need to make adjustments in more than one area.

And Don said himself, "the smart ones will figure out what im leaving out"

THE BRIEFCASE is what he showed best....or most secretively... aside from the 2005 TeslaTech where he showed a large multi kilowatt framed unit.

the closest i can think of, (i believe) is the same as Mopozco has shown. the "resonant system for water" it is in most of the related pdf's, but it is so innocent and basic looking that no one pays attention to it, including myself lol. just wanted to stay on track here

[soundiceuk]

I think it is confusing with the amount of different circuit diagrams that have been posted. On some of Zilano's schematics the diodes are backwards. The spark gap has been shown in series, parallel etc too.

My own observations from two working replications are that.

a) Mr Clean's circuit has each HT going to a side of the capacitor. The spark gap is afterwards in series (does it matter which side?). The twin ignition coils wired in anti parallel act as a NST with centre tap and share the earth connected to the battery.

b) Blue Serge's circuit has no earth on primary side apart from NST. The GDT is in parallel with each HV line after the diodes.

I have been pondering whether Don's circuit is actually correct and the center tap in the NST had been disconnected from the earth ground and instead connected to the spark gap then to capacitor as in picture.

We already know the OU comes from ionization in spark gap.

The inverter is wired to a 12v battery so the NST wouldn't be able to use the earth ground of a building. Unless it uses the neutral....???

This might also explain why he used the DC to DC feedback coil for the battery.

The black lead after the capacitor bank goes to earth ground and the postive gets full wave rectified, goes through load (which can be asymmetrical 50/60hz output transformer).

There are some other variables like varistors/ voltage dividers etc that most probably should be used.

[frankidel]

By looking at those pictures I came up with this schematic. It makes sense atleast to me. NST spits voltage in LC tank when spark occurs where it oscillates many times as primary is of low self inductance and heavy gauge wire. Two outputs form bloch wall where the primary is so primary is unaffected by output coils as bloch wall is neutral zone. Primary is happily banging the energy around in LC tank and each cycle produces two copies at output and you can use both of them. Also when LC is ringing NST is does not see it as GDT does not conduct. To get resonance NST must deliver more charge at the correct moment, when the kid in the swing is closest to pusher. Damn, cannot be simpler than this.

There seems to be some serious builders here, maybe this is worth a shot. I think this can be debugged also with function generator using lower voltage. You can get Gas Discharge Tubes that lit as low as 230 volts, maybe even lower. Possibly output voltage of function gen could be increased with some voltage doubler circuit or even trafo with core that can handle high frequencies. I am saying that you dont need to use lethal voltages to get this thing working in resonance.

Remember how Don tuned the circuit, he lowered the voltage with Variac just enough to light the GDT. So power going through GDT is irrelevant, it is the tank circuit that makes the juice. If too much power goes though GDT it melts down making short circuit.

Hi in your circuit, when the gdt is connected to the gnd, is it real gnd or the gnd of a nst ????

If you put it ot real GND, does it affect something.

[kajunkreations]

working circuit

Hey guys, here is a new video.. Working circuit 1 - YouTube

The video shows a working primary and SG. The primary setup is like blue surge's setup and the output is similar to Don's. The light lights up and it sparks but this is only the first step. I will have an LCR meter tomorrow and a HV probe so hopefully I can get this thing tuned and move on to the transformer.


Nolan

[Farmhand]

I have been pondering whether Don's circuit is actually correct and the center tap in the NST had been disconnected from the earth ground and instead connected to the spark gap then to capacitor as in picture.

It wouldn't matter anyway with the spark gap or GDT between the capacitor
negative and the NST the capacitor cannot be charged for two reasons, 1. is
the cap has no current source it has no negative connection to the NST, the
NST has no way of applying it's potential difference to the cap to charge it.
2. is the capacitor is shorted by the L1 coil.

The inverter is wired to a 12v battery so the NST wouldn't be able to use the earth ground of a building. Unless it uses the neutral....???

kajunkreations setup is powered from the wall "I think" and his NST was
grounded to the neutral of that, plus he tried a dedicated ground as well.

The black lead after the capacitor bank goes to earth ground and the postive gets full wave rectified, goes through load (which can be asymmetrical 50/60hz output transformer).

The picture shows the black lead (center tap) of L2 is connected to ground
as any 1/4 wave resonator should be and the outputs of L2 are half wave
rectified by two separate sets of two paralleled diodes. There is no full wave
rectification in the picture, (FWBR is shown in the drawing) but that wouldn't
work the way the drawing is shown if the L2 was made from one coil center
tapped, hence the half wave rectifiers in the picture.

The whole thing is very suspicious, obviously the pictures don't match the
drawing and neither is a workable circuit. So for me Don has given me nothing,
Tesla is what everyone should be studying if they are interested in this stuff.

The book Don recommends is good,

http://ia700302.us.archive.org/16/it...00martiala.pdf

Here are some more. I recommend downloading them and if not too much trouble make paper copy.

Nikola Tesla On His Work With Alternating Currents -- Chapter IV

Nikola Tesla Colorado Springs Notes

How would you describe an asymmetrical 50/60 hz transformer ? Is it AC ?

Cheers

[Jack Noskills]

Hi in your circuit, when the gdt is connected to the gnd, is it real gnd or the gnd of a nst ????

If you put it ot real GND, does it affect something.

I did not see the ground in the picture, it was simply a quess. With high frequencies it does not have to be earth ground, any piece of wire/metal will serve as virtual ground.

I haven't tested this, I just draw what I saw in Don's pictures when someone asked. If picture is not from a working device, then diagram is no good. I would try that tho, and poke it with ground wire when live lol.

[Utopia Now]

Adjustments where ....

Hello Mr Wonderful Clean . .

what i have learned is that it DOES work,,, BUT, you need to make adjustments in more than one area.

Where specific do you adjust so everything works in balance
I am very thankful for your answer.
I am Happy ... and als very Happy with all the people here on the forum working together , inspiring each other
Here some info for new people on the forum maybe .. and more info .
Utopia Now
Together we Create a Friendly Abundant Society

[frankidel]

I did not see the ground in the picture, it was simply a quess. With high frequencies it does not have to be earth ground, any piece of wire/metal will serve as virtual ground.

I haven't tested this, I just draw what I saw in Don's pictures when someone asked. If picture is not from a working device, then diagram is no good. I would try that tho, and poke it with ground wire when live lol.

For the metal plate, probably you know that, but i didn't, last night i used a rock ( very good conductor ) and put a oscilloscope probe on it, there was a sinus wave @ 62 Hz, is it the background or just the 60Hz from electrical stuff. not a good question hein... and the same thing with aluminium plate 10mm width.

[Magnetvortex]

Duncan thanks for the effort to show the Andreson work.

THANKS AND MAY THANKS !!! It's a shocking deal for the oil guys...
I am already working on this project !!! WOW and WOW !!

Al..

Posted by Duncan:
Let me Introduce you to Herman pleasant Anderson .. A Tesla fanatic who as a young man powered his house from Balloons a'la Plauson. This is a very aged interview taken off Tape and distributed in limited Numbers by the water Museum (before it was boshed) I have done my best to join it and Improve the sound but I cant make a silk purse out of a pigs ear!
Of Interest (perhaps to) King and T1000 is how the man overcame the “magnetic storm “ And how he overcomes the splitting of the gases ( which I see as the water equivalent of what you wish to do)
listen to the voltages he's up to 70,000 volts +. You'll hear standing wave … anyway take a look I think you'll find some big clue's exposed .. If you find it interesting copy it! AS
I'm not absolutely certain I had the rights to upload this! Untitled on Vimeo
It seems to have taken hours and hours to convert and upload this I hope it relates I'm sure it does .. Enjoy

link to the VIDEO OF Herman Anderson: Untitled on Vimeo