Donald Smith Devices too good to be true

[JohnStone]

My 2" Joule thief is running ok but I cannot know exactly how much it's giving out cause three MM are giving me different readings
Well on the output it's lighting two neons in series although Cfl's that I have not lighting maybe my cfl are not good.
My problem is the variable cap cause nothing is happening when trying to tune maybe I have to have a bigger vcap.

Hi Guruji,
you are right! Digital MMs do not measure correctly in this application.
One way to measure correctly is to conduct two measurements.
1. Glue a PTC or NTS on a load resistor (not wire wound because of inductance) Choose value of resistor according to your optimal load.
2. Connect this resistor to your setup as load. Leave free air around the resistor.
3. Measure the resistance of your PTC/NTC until it reads stable.
4. Connect the load resistor to a variable power supply. Do not move the resistor.
5. Adjust the voltage so that you get the same stable reading like before.
6. Measure Voltage and amperage
7. Multiply measured voltage times amperage
8. Here you are: measured TRUE power.

The charm of this method is that you can take any NTC/PTC and there is no need for any calibration. The quality of a normal DMM is suffitient.
rgds John

[nightwind]

@Zilano

only single hv cable used and it goes to diode only. no bifilars. only simple tesla type coils with ferrite.

rgds

Ok, you have a 2KV single wire connection to the cathode of a diode. Is the same cathode connected to the ground of the 350VDC circuit? It looks like it.
How does the 2kv complete its circuit loop?
Does the 2kv ac & 350V dc share a common ground?
How is the Xenon flashtube triggered?
It would probably help a lot if you step through the circuit and explain what is happening. These other guys can probably understand it better that I can.

[myenergetic]

[QUOTE=bbem;168542]This also helpfull:
Xenon Flasher
(The 2kV is connected to the striking shield, now I understand ;-)

@ Nightwind

Please see with attached reply from bbem (Xenon Flasher) about the Flasher circuits. The 2kv is there only as a striking discharge shield for the xenon tube. It is possible the two fly-backs 350 and 2kV to share the same ground. The cathode of the diode is not connected to ground as far as I can say. The flash tube triggering shall depend on the Capacitors C1C2 and L1 resonance and BEMF from L2 load if I may say so.

Regards
JJ

[Guruji]

Ptc

Hi Guruji,
you are right! Digital MMs do not measure correctly in this application.
One way to measure correctly is to conduct two measurements.
1. Glue a PTC or NTS on a load resistor (not wire wound because of inductance) Choose value of resistor according to your optimal load.
2. Connect this resistor to your setup as load. Leave free air around the resistor.
3. Measure the resistance of your PTC/NTC until it reads stable.
4. Connect the load resistor to a variable power supply. Do not move the resistor.
5. Adjust the voltage so that you get the same stable reading like before.
6. Measure Voltage and amperage
7. Multiply measured voltage times amperage
8. Here you are: measured TRUE power.

The charm of this method is that you can take any NTC/PTC and there is no need for any calibration. The quality of a normal DMM is suffitient.
rgds John

Hi John thanks for response. Sorry for my ignorance in electronics What are PTC or NTS?
Thanks

[JohnStone]

Hi John thanks for response. Sorry for my ignorance in electronics What are PTC or NTS?
Thanks

Hi Guruji,
no problem. Any of us started innocent. When we were born none of us knew anything. We begun our life intuitively only. Almost all knowledge we got from others by their friendly sharing with us. Our own addition is minute. A good reason for humbleness!

Both NTC/PTC are termistors. (termistor) = resistors with variable resistance when temperature changing. All resistors do it in a minute amount. But at termistors this is exaggerated intentionally in oder to deal with temperatures.
PTC = = resistor with positive temperature coeffitient = resistance inreases considerably with rising temperature and vice versa. (PTC often are used in order to reduce dangerous overcurrents or to heat door mirrors in order to adapt the heating power to the outer temperature.)
NTC = resistor with negative temperature coeffitient = resistrance decreses considerably with rising temperature and vice versa (often used in order to measure temperatures)

If temperature measurement is intendet it is necessary that the behaivour ist linear. Unfortunately this is diffucult to achieve and you need to study the data sheet first.

Fortunately in our special case this does not matter at all because you find a certain temperature in your setup where the temperature becomes stable. You measure the cosrresponding resistance of your termistor - whatever it reads.
Later on you find out at your viable PSU what DC-current/voltage generates the very same temperature (resistance).

If you look at the possible errors in your measurement you will find out that it is only driven by the accuracy of your voltage and current measurement at DC condition. You can look up these values in your data sheet of your meter. Add the percentage. Le's say 1% current and 0.1 % voltage = 1.1 % accuracy. This is a quite fine and outstanding value for a low budget measurement of such weird signals.

The condition is that you have exactly the same environment of the resistor at both measurements therefore do not move any parts of the setup except the wiring from the setup to the DC PSU. Omit air draft.
And the resistor is not allowed to be wire wound because this performs as inductance and will behave considerably different at AC/DC conditions.
You can use several identical resistors in series or parallel (ar an array) if you adapt them to your load and the temperature needs to be measured at one singele of them only.

This is no quick and dirty method. It is very scientific though simple.
A more sophisticated procedure is to heat a thermally good isolated can with water and measure the temperature difference after a time. But leave this to those who need to prove anything. Just now we need not to do so. It's for your reference only and to compare the gain with other setups.

rgds John

[nightwind]

[QUOTE=myenergetic;168632]

This also helpfull:
Xenon Flasher
(The 2kV is connected to the striking shield, now I understand ;-)

@ Nightwind

Please see with attached reply from bbem (Xenon Flasher) about the Flasher circuits. The 2kv is there only as a striking discharge shield for the xenon tube. It is possible the two fly-backs 350 and 2kV to share the same ground. The cathode of the diode is not connected to ground as far as I can say. The flash tube triggering shall depend on the Capacitors C1C2 and L1 resonance and BEMF from L2 load if I may say so.

Regards
JJ

JJ, thanks for your response. I understand how a "typical" xenon flashtube setup works, but her drawing confused me with the diode & ground connection (its easy to confuse me).

Since Zilano's circuit is so similar to a camera flash setup, maybe you can cannibalize a cheap throw away camera and build a micro-OU device? Just size an output & collector coil and oscillate the xenon trigger.

[bbem]

@nightwind
I am still puzzled too regarding the earth link.
Guess the MOV alone is attached to earth and not the negative lead.

[hello_all]

free energy

confirmed Fake: free energy 27 Watts in 460 Watts out - YouTube

i am more interested in generating free energy from common parts like this one has a psu from computer and spark plug from autoshop and a coil like kapandaze .. and a microwave capacitor.. 6v battery..

zilano do you have a circuit for this.. or is this fake ?? i don't know.. no earth wire .??

[JohnStone]

Hi all,
in oder to make the questions more clear I attach a schamatic of Z's last proposal. So Z please help us on how to complete the schematic. I will update it later on so we have one confirmed from you in version v2.

1. The flash tube has a gate electrode than it can be triggered this way.
2. The flash tube does not trigger by 350V and the ignition pulse is applied by the diodes so it triggers the tube by a short extra negative pulse.

The question is if the 2KV pulsing is for the tube trigger only or is there another important action using this.



BTW: Still studying Utkin and prepare some tests.
rgds John

[JohnStone]

confirmed Fake: free energy 27 Watts in 460 Watts out - YouTube

i am more interested in generating free energy from common parts like this one has a psu from computer and spark plug from autoshop and a coil like kapandaze .. and a microwave capacitor.. 6v battery..

zilano do you have a circuit for this.. or is this fake ?? i don't know.. no earth wire .??

Hi,
independent of the question if this is a fake or not it is obviously no genuin computer PSU. Such a PSU has no means internally in order to generate high voltage from low voltage.The only common with such a PSU is the metal case and perhaps some parts reused. The case contains the signal generation for the coil.
In so far it is nothing exceptional apart from the basics explained by Vladimir Utkin and others. Of course that matter is exceptional by itself but not the example linked to.(My notion) Sorry for this bad news!
rgds John

[nightwind]

Hi all,
in oder to make the questions more clear I attach a schamatic of Z's last proposal. So Z please help us on how to complete the schematic. I will update it later on so we have one confirmed from you in version v2.

1. The flash tube has a gate electrode than it can be triggered this way.
2. The flash tube does not trigger by 350V and the ifnition pule is applied by the diodes so t trigger the tube by a short extra negative pulse.

[ATTACH]9653[/ATTACH]

rgds John

Thanks John well done, I have a few comments:
In Zilano's diagram we start w/ 4.5VDC and based on her description this is fed into a function generator which drives a 2kv flyback xnsfr with a 350V tap off of it (or use 2 flybacks). You need to show the function generator. After thinking about it, the 2kv feed is probably being half-wave rectified to trigger the xenon tube (is that you meant above?). The Xenon tube has to be connected to ground or common in order to work

[JohnStone]

Thanks John well done, I have a few comments:
In Zilano's diagram we start w/ 4.5VDC and based on her description this is fed into a function generator which drives a 2kv flyback xnsfr with a 350V tap off of it (or use 2 flybacks). You need to show the function generator. After thinking about it, the 2kv feed is probably being half-wave rectified to trigger the xenon tube (is that you meant above?). The Xenon tube has to be connected to ground or common in order to work

Here my proposal regarding the connection of the 2KV PSU (given that the 2KV have only trigger function)

Z please comment!

The PSUs FB1 and FB2 are drawn here as modules only. There are a lot of ways to build them. Both can be built i.e. like Royer Oscillator (please google) but the 350V one needs to have a higher frequency. For 2KV a trigger transformer out of a disposable camera might do well.

Of course the FB schematic is important for building a replication but initially we need to know the right side of the schematic.
But please wait until Z clarifies the right side of the schematic - especially if the 2KV are reqired for more as to trigger the flash tube.

rgds John

[bbem]

@JohnStone
Great job!
My theory:
- I think Z build an Avramenko pump/plug like this setup:
The AFEP v1.2, Single-Wire Energy transmission test by Jean-Louis Naudin
- The touch button on the circuit will temporary switch on the 350 V DC over the bulb, and the 2kV kickstarts the lamp.
- When the button is released, the 350V DC will drop, but the hv keeps kicking the lamp and the LC circuit
keeps resonating and generating power over the spark/condenser/coils.
(The Xenon lamp is the spark plug)

But then the question still remains about the earth link.
I hope Z will comment on this :-)

[Peculian]

Nice circuit ! Thanks Zelina Zilano zz.
Kind of reminds me this basic Plauson circuit >

They are almost similar.
Hmm... have seen this type of exciting with xenon lamp in a pdf file
who the "autors" supposed to mimic the T.H Moray radiant circuit

[bbem]

@Zilano
Very kind of you, appreciate it
This is with usage of the striking shield I see.
Nice!

ps. Need to buy some sunglasses before I start testing

@Zilano:
Should we keep triggering the Xenon lamp, or only at startup?