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Back EMF vs. Collapsing Magnetic Field Spike

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  • #46
    The best explication of these phenomenon are explained very well by the Evans-Cartan-Einstein theory of zero point energy field

    http://aias.us/documents/mwe/origina...firstdraft.pdf

    This paper explains all

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    • #47
      Originally posted by darkwizard View Post
      The best explication of these phenomenon are explained very well by the Evans-Cartan-Einstein theory of zero point energy field

      http://aias.us/documents/mwe/origina...firstdraft.pdf

      This paper explains all
      I'm really trying to demystify this and give it a simple explanation, not make it harder than it already is!!!
      I'm sorry, I just can't read that stuff. Doh!

      Please tell me that a simplification of the document would be that the energy E in the spike generated by a coil with inductance L and current I before shutoff is (L*I^2)/2 minus losses?
      Last edited by nilrehob; 02-27-2009, 05:27 PM. Reason: changed impedance to inductance
      Hob Nilre
      http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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      • #48
        No, that is the classical formula, the spike energy can be bigger than the input energy, and it depends on inductance and not impedance/resistance.

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        • #49
          Maybe that spike has something to do with a E field generated from iron atoms ? nuclear magnetic resonance ? Is that a cause of magnetic delay in iron ?
          Just a blind guess

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          • #50
            Originally posted by darkwizard View Post
            No, that is the classical formula, the spike energy can be bigger than the input energy, and it depends on inductance and not impedance/resistance.
            Oops, I meant inductance, not impedance. I changed it in the post. Sorry.
            Hob Nilre
            http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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            • #51
              Originally posted by darkwizard View Post
              No, that is the classical formula, the spike energy can be bigger than the input energy, and it depends on inductance and not impedance/resistance.
              Can You give an example of an circumstance when E.out > E.in?
              Maybe how to produce it and how to measure it?

              When does E=(LI^2)/2 not work?
              Hob Nilre
              http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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              • #52
                Originally posted by boguslaw View Post
                Maybe that spike has something to do with a E field generated from iron atoms ? nuclear magnetic resonance ? Is that a cause of magnetic delay in iron ?
                Just a blind guess
                While a non-air core gives You more inductance than if You had an air-core, You will also get other characteristics of the coil as well.
                Isn't the "delay" called "hysteresis"?
                Hob Nilre
                http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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                • #53
                  Try yourself

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by darkwizard View Post
                    Try yourself
                    I am!

                    But since there are so many that has done so much before me I was hoping for some sharing of knowledge. Thats all.
                    Hob Nilre
                    http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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                    • #55
                      nilrehob,
                      here are some Bedini solid state oscillator circuits that you can try:


                      It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Jetijs View Post
                        nilrehob,
                        here are some Bedini solid state oscillator circuits that you can try:
                        Thank You Jetijs, and yes I will!
                        Hob Nilre
                        http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

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                        • #57
                          You are welcome
                          If you have any questions about those circuits, have a look at this thread:
                          http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...idstate+Bedini
                          I am sure that most of the questions will be answered by going through that thread
                          It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            nilrehob - please look at the labeled image I posted earlier. All I can do is repeat myself by saying that what you are showing is the flyback and NOT the transient spike.
                            "Theory guides. Experiment decides."

                            I do not think there is any thrill that can go through the human heart like that felt by the inventor as he sees some creation of the brain unfolding to success... Such emotions make a man forget food, sleep, friends, love, everything.
                            Nikola Tesla

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Sephiroth View Post
                              nilrehob - please look at the labeled image I posted earlier. All I can do is repeat myself by saying that what you are showing is the flyback and NOT the transient spike.
                              Bear with me if I I'm not clear in my posts.
                              I still think the spike and the flyback is the same:
                              maybe the part You call the spike is generated by the wire in the coil and the part You call the flyback is generated by the core in the coil?

                              If You could just make me another shot and I will try to stop posting in this thread for a few days, maybe a week :
                              Given that You're using a SSG of some sort, can You make youre scope 20V/cm * 0.1ms/cm and measure over the coil while charging a capacitor and just after You have shortened the capacitor?
                              I would really appreciate it.

                              What core/coil and transistor do You use?
                              Last edited by nilrehob; 02-28-2009, 08:52 AM.
                              Hob Nilre
                              http://www.youtube.com/nilrehob

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Hi.
                                Here are some scope shots from my rotary attraction motor recovery:





                                But remember, those scope shots show the CURRENT and NOT the voltage. The measurements were taken across a low resistance resistor. There is the big spike and then we start to get some real current back. You can see the on the second picture, we get much more usable current out, that is because the first scope shot was taken from a setup with ordinary, thick iron plates, they did not demagnetize completely and there were losses by eddycurrents. Here is the setup:



                                Other scope shot shows improved results and I guess that this is because the shot was taken from the second motor setup which had a core made out of good quality silicon steel laminations. This is the second setup:



                                The operation of these motors is simple, we have bifilar coils on each pole. We let current to flow through one winding to build up magnetic field an attract the iron rotor poles. When the rotor poles are aligned, we cut off the current flow and capture the inductive spike in a capacitor via a high speed diode using the second strand of the bifilar coil.
                                Hope this helps.
                                It's better to wear off by working than to rust by doing nothing.

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