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Charge Pump Circuit

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  • Charge Pump Circuit

    Hi all, i didn't want to clutter the don smith thread anymore.
    This is inspired by dragon.
    I'm working on a mechanical 3 way switch for automatic operation, here it is so far.

    And circuit from dragon.

    peace love light

  • #2
    Theory of Operation

    Hi Skywatcher,

    great thinking this topic really deserves its own thread.

    Let me just add the Theory of Operation as I think its best to have them laid out in a statement. along with picture of units and schematics.

    reattaching the PDF courtesy of dragon.
    Charge pump adv short version.pdf

    basically its like cycling the charge,
    Raising the Potential by connecting in series to charge one capacitor and connecting in parallel (C2 & C3) while the load is being powered in between C2 & C3 capacitor.

    in a way it uses the same concept of using the same energy to produce work and to charge something else (3 BGS) might be a capacitor version of it. in a way it is not (location of load). based from experiments its best to power the load between capacitor rather than at the path of the switch.

    It is unique in a sense that no closed circuit exist for continuous current to flow (always blocked by capacitor), and load is being powered by natural balancing of the capacitor,

    currently C1 is best to be replaced with a battery (Constant Voltage Source) as if it were a capacitor the circuit would produce lesser output at few switches until it stops.

    currently suggested capacitor's capacitance to be 1F or Higher Voltage capacitor configuration that can transfer around 20Joules worth of energy per switch in order to see some good output (toy capacitor's can only power small bulbs and LED's).
    Last edited by ricards; 09-25-2017, 04:23 AM. Reason: correction


    • #3
      Hi ricards, thanks for replying
      and adding the pdf and other helpful information.

      I got around to adding the copper wire pieces, which are made of 18awg. magnet wire with the coating scraped off and this forms the mechanical, switchable contacts.
      I soldered the ends, to make one solid piece of copper.
      Another identical copper wire contact area, is on the opposite side.

      Also, used zip ties to hold the copper pieces in place and the heat that was created by soldering, also caused the copper wires to embed nicely into the plastic material.
      Here is pic of mechanical switch progress.
      peace love light


      • #4
        Nice job SkyWatcher, looking forward to seeing what your 1.5 farad caps are capable of. Most of my low voltage testing was done with the 1F caps. I'll be spending more time on "pre winter" tasks so my involvement will be spotty for the next few weeks.

        Below is a picture of a 500 watt heating element being driven with 130 watts. It's still just under the 1200*F temp, still operating in the IR band which produces good heat. My current set up will only drive 3 of these.

        The reason I'm focused on the IR band is because you can achieve higher BTU output with less energy. The coils are placed inside a quartz tube so the air flowing around them cannot cool the coils allowing them to emit infrared radiation continuously. When the coils are glowing orange they produce a radiant electromagnetic frequency that interacts with a thermally conductive work piece such as copper. This produces eddy currents in the metal absorber - just like inductive heating but at ultra high frequencies. With open air coils you only see the heat produced by the electrical current flowing through them... we want to use the radiant energy produced in the IR band instead of the electric used to produce it.

        For those interested, I've included a nichrome chart which shows how much current is needed to produce a certain temp for various size wires. For instance a 12 volt system you might choose the 28 ga wire at 2.8 amps to achieve a 1200*F coil. The wire is 4 ohms per foot so 1 foot of wire would be sufficient, this would require a 33 watt input to achieve a 1200*F temp on the wire.

        Have fun...
        Attached Files
        Last edited by dragon; 09-26-2017, 02:30 PM.


        • #5
          Howdy. What does 'EWL' stand for in the diagram?


          • #6
            Originally posted by level View Post
            Howdy. What does 'EWL' stand for in the diagram?
            Hi level,

            I think 'EWL' does not mean anything significant, we only use resistive loads so far, passive resistors, bulbs, or heating elements, you can try this out real easy by manual switching, so far results are promising..


            • #7
              Thanks for the clarification ricards.


              • #8
                Hi all, Hi dragon, thanks, I also look forward to any further work you might be sharing.
                Thanks for sharing the detailed information dragon.

                I did read previously about the added efficiency of the infrared bulbs and i wondered why they used the copper sheeting in some of the heaters I've seen, now i know why.
                So is that a homemade bulb you made?
                It looks like you coiled nichrome wire and placed it inside a quartz glass tube.

                If I'm comprehending what you are saying, by encapsulating it like this, it prevents the transfer of heat to the greater surrounding air and causes the coil to become hotter and glow and emit the proper IR frequencies, to interact efficiently with copper material.

                I finished the mechanical switch, though i have not made any tests yet, will do this tomorrow sometime, hopefully.
                peace love light


                • #9
                  Nice job Sky!
                  I will also give it a try. I have 2x 1,5f audio cap ordered.
                  Thank you Dragon for the circuit!
                  Last edited by Wistiti; 09-29-2017, 12:57 PM. Reason: Thank's to Dragon


                  • #10
                    Hi wistiti, thanks and it's nice to hear from you.
                    I just tested the setup with the mechanical switch.

                    I had it wired wrong and one of the wires insulation started to barbecue.
                    Checked the wiring and realized what was wrong.

                    It seems to work well and i have 20 watts worth of ceramic power resistors, these reached maximum temperature in a couple minutes.

                    Also, if you or anyone builds a mechanical switch, make sure the contacts don't switch on at the same time, because that will cause a short circuit across the battery and will fry wires just the same as my incorrect wiring.

                    Also, the load is placed across the positives of the capacitors, that was not shown in the circuit drawing.
                    peace love light

                    Here is circuit with polarity shown, from dragon.

                    Last edited by SkyWatcher; 09-30-2017, 03:25 AM.


                    • #11

                      Hi Sky and all!
                      I have a great surprise when I arrive at home after the work!
                      The 2 cap are arrived! Just in time for the weekends.

                      Thanks for the info about the polarity of the cap vs load. Maybe a new schematic is needed to avoid confusion... if you do that I thank you in advence.

                      Will let you know about my progress...

                      Attached Files


                      • #12
                        My apologies SkyWatcher, I shouldn't make assumptions that people understand my drawings. The lack of polarity markers could lead to confusion.

                        Nice work on the switch, very clever !

                        I spent a little time this afternoon putting the 12v unit back together again to experiment with some low voltage quartz halogen bulbs. Also, so I can match some of the experiments others might do.

                        Edit....Yes, that is one of the many coils I made up for testing.

                        Edited drawing for polarity clarification...
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by dragon; 09-30-2017, 01:28 AM.


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by dragon View Post
                          My apologies SkyWatcher, I shouldn't make assumptions that people understand my drawings. The lack of polarity markers could lead to confusion.

                          Nice work on the switch, very clever !

                          I spent a little time this afternoon putting the 12v unit back together again to experiment with some low voltage quartz halogen bulbs. Also, so I can match some of the experiments others might do.

                          Edit....Yes, that is one of the many coils I made up for testing.

                          Edited drawing for polarity clarification...
                          It is clear for everyone that have play with the 3bgs share by Turion and the one who take the time to read your PDF Dragon, but I think it's a good thing to have clarify the schematic for all the others...

                          Thank you for that Dragon!


                          • #14
                            Hi wistiti, nice capacitors.
                            i removed all the circuitry from mine some time ago, though it shouldn't be a problem leaving it on, though it will draw down the energy in the caps some.
                            Look forward to any results you share wistiti.

                            Hi dragon, thanks for the compliments.
                            The next step will probably be a different or bigger load and i can also adjust the switching speed a little.

                            I'm wondering if the voltage will be high enough and stable enough to power my dc/dc boost converter, it's a 400 watt version.

                            If the voltage is not high and steady enough for it, there are other lower voltage boost converters i can try.
                            Just realized, it would need a bridge rectifier, hmm, will think about it.
                            peace love light
                            Last edited by SkyWatcher; 09-30-2017, 03:38 AM.


                            • #15
                              I'm quite interested in how those 1.5F caps are going to work out you and Wistiti have. I realize it's not that big of difference from my 1F's but there is a reasonable increase in storage.

                              I've run regular resistive loads in parallel with a bridge rectifier to drive a motor and it works well. Unfortunately the voltage drop across the diodes reduces the average working voltage considerably.

                              My focus has been primarily on the peak amperage for driving heavy resistive loads while attempting to reduce input requirements as much as possible. The basic charge pump circuit as presented is a simple example of moving and balancing charges, a small part to a larger end.

                              Edit: As additional "food for thought" look at the Carl Betz hand drawing at the bottom of the Rexresearch page Thomas Henry Moray: The Sea of Energy ~ Excerpts of technical factoids & illustrations of the Moray Radiant Energy Receiver. Note that there is only a static charge between antenna and ground. At no point is there any method to discharge any of the capacitors.... only methods to manipulate the charge. Isn't that interesting....
                              Last edited by dragon; 09-30-2017, 03:18 PM.