Motor Generators

[alexelectric]

The work continues and improving the prototype, thanks for the videos that illustrate us better, Mr. Dave, effort and tenacity will have its reward

[Turion]

Still have wires to strip and holes to drill and tap to bolt the coil holders in place, but I will get the RPM meter set up tonight or tomorrow and can start loading coils into the machine and adjusting it. I was incredibly happy to see 26 volts and 4.4 amps as the unloaded input of the machine. All my calculations have been based on 7 or 8 amps input. I don’t know if it was at 2800 RPM so it may cost me more than that. But it was exciting for me to finally have it (the NEW version) running on the bench.

https://youtu.be/f-AuRDqQecA

Hey bi, you ready to make that bet yet?

[Turion]

I tried all kinds of stuff today, and I MAY have figured it out. In the attached photo you can see a large countersunk hole that the circular metal plate on the rotor would recess into, allowing the rotor to be closer to the coil holder. For WHATEVER reason, when the rotor turned, the plate on the rotor would rub against the wall of this circular opening during about half of its rotation. I have no idea why. Also, there are four Allen wrench bolts shown in the picture. They secure the two halves of one side of the the coil holders together in the middle, and "clamp" the bearing in place that fits in a compartment between the two halves. I didn't realize that if I tightened those four bolts TOO tight, it would clamp the bearing and not allow it to turn, even though the center race on the bearing is not being clamped.

Unfortunately, I took the rotor off the shaft yesterday, believing I would need to have the shaft checked for straightness. Doesn't look like it needs to be, but since I put it together with lock tight, I need to let the bolts soak in acetone for a while before wire brushing them and reapplying lock tight to reassemble it. So, tomorrow is another day.

Edit: I DID get the light board rewired today. I still need to strip all the ends of all the wires on all the coils in order to connect them up to the loads, so I have some work left to do besides assembling the machine. But it gives me something to do while I wait on the acetone, if it isn't done with its work in the morning.
PROBLEM.jpg

[Memphis]

Hi Turion, it could be that the shaft is straight and the bearing housing is aligned, but when you tighten the rotor or stator walls they touch on the outer circle of the bearings, you have tried to insert thin washers on the shaft from both sides bearings?

[Turion]

The motor was pulling well over 15 amps to turn the rotor, and when I disconnected the belt drive, the shaft was hard to turn by hand. With all the bolts loosened, the shaft turns with MINIMAL effort, but with everything tightened down, it does not turn properly, so somewhere something is in a bind. The coils came this morning and we spent a couple hours trying to figure out what is binding where. No luck. So this evening I disassembled EVERYTHING and just clamped all the pieces of the coil holders together with the bearings in place to make sure the center hole was in alignment all the way through. It is as far as I can tell. At least it the rotor shaft slid all the way through and fits into both bearings, and turns. Not as freely as when everything was loose, but not as tight as when everything was bolted together, so I need to look for where the shaft is rubbing on plastic and see if there is anything I can do to solve that problem. I have a few more things to try before I just give up and take it to a local machinist to see if they can solve it. If one of the two bearings isn't sitting flat against the case like it should be, that could be the problem. Almost impossible for me to tell. Tomorrow is another day.

[Turion]

The last of my coils will be here between 10-11:00 today. After that it’s all on me. So far my rotor is not turning as freely as I would like. Will run the machine for the first time today and see if I can figure out what the problem is. It may be nothing but the heavier rotor, or it may require I tear it all apart to see if I can adjust something. The amp draw of the motor will tell me. I know what my friend was able to achieve with the same setup (but different motor)

https://youtu.be/9XnhiWuc3oE

Since my buddy was able to run his DC motor on 100 volts at 2 amps or 200 watts to achieve 1100 rpm, if I am in the ballpark for those results, I will call it good and move forward. If not, it may take some time to figure this out. Anyone unhappy with the progress I have made on this project and wants to whine about it can always build it themselves. But they won’t. Still working on rewiring my light board too.

[Turion]

Bro,
That would probably work, but I would have to have one for each coil pair, which is 6 x $25.00 to do something that I think moving the meters to the other side of the switch will take care of. I'll try that first. Luckily, it is the first of the month, and I have a monthly budget to spend on this stuff, but unfortunately, I am in the hole after spending so much on 6 spools of wire, and I need a couple months to catch back up to zero. It seems no matter how hard I try there is always SOMETHING I need that I can't do without. And the independent testing is another $700.00. I can't win.

[wantomake]

To All’
Good to see someone is still working here. Just checking in and hope it all goes well.
wantomake

[BroMikey]

As I recall, ANY load across the coil on start up gives you the lenz reaction because you have not reached the RPM to achieve neutral Lenz. It’s not a problem when you have only ONE coil, but you’re dead in the water when you try to do it with 12 coils.

True, at 77v and 1.35A using ohms law the bulb resistance is 57ohms
What do you think would happen if a 5000 ohm was placed there instead?

I don't know if you want to take the time. Use a rheostat to find a 1/4w drain

I buy 50w ones, here is a beauty

https://www.ebay.com/itm/18508280974...sAAOSwqFZgrX8v

Find a desired minimal drain start at 5000 ohms and inch downward

A 1/4 watt will not bother the motor but the meters will notice

[Turion]

Got the Beast together and the motor mounted. The bolt holes in the frame don’t quite line up so I need MORE time to deal with that and I’m not in the mood. Only have an hour to work before I am done for the day, so will see how much of my light board I can get rewired. Might get some time this evening, but not likely.

9BBAD390-CA9B-4DF2-BD5A-DDEDEA498030.jpeg

[Turion]

As I recall, ANY load across the coil on start up gives you the lenz reaction because you have not reached the RPM to achieve neutral Lenz. It’s not a problem when you have only ONE coil, but you’re dead in the water when you try to do it with 12 coils.

[BroMikey]

you better let me get you the rights ohms value first

here look at this http://physics.bu.edu/~duffy/ns543_s...nt_class07.pdf

it shows that a 100w bulb running at 120v has a resistance on the wire filament of 144ohms. so selecting a 500ohm 50w might work better

Another way is to short the coil when starting then switch to load.

So as not slow down start up the right resistor needs to be selected probably a high value to keep the delay close.

You could always start it up and see which resistor can be used to slightly load while not causing a run away condition. This is where you are. Slow down.you know how shorted coils act

[BroMikey]

I started out at age 8-9 and then 10-11 years was doing small engine racing at over 100 mph. Mid Ohio track was a long down hill run of say 10 degrees. It lasted over a mile. Things fell apart and I learned all thru the long years that becoming a master rigger took more than meets the eye. I have seen your box and I can tell you about the work involved.

Keep right on taking your time, like you did the see-ment work. You are almost home

Or use a ? ohm https://www.ebay.com/itm/40128799533...3ABFBMtumw2Zpf
we will need a high number not 1

Use a ? ohm resister (50watt) across the output on the coils. Then switch it out after it is running so as not to let peak voltage ruin all of your devices. This is what everybody does in the electronic field. This always keeps a slight load all thru start up and bang another switch for full load and then switch out the dumby load. Use the same style of switching just think it thru. In other words, one way you have the safety dumby load and the other position full load. Just like you are doing with the 2 power supplies

The magnets you will adjust I am confident will do much better than you old clunker.

[Turion]

So, I got the spacers put in the generator today and it looks pretty good. The motor mount I had made for the previous version definitely doesn't fit on top with the spacers added, and I routed out some of the plastic today so that it would fit, but not enough. Have to take more off tomorrow to get everything to go together the way I want it. Hopefully I can finish that up and get the motor mounted tomorrow so it is ready to go. Then I need to rewire some things on my light board. I have it so that the first thing voltage hits is the volt meter and then it goes through the switch to the amp meter and the light. Since the thing is putting out over 300 volts open voltage, I don't want it pegging my meters. That's not good for them, so I need to run the voltage to the switch first with the meter measuring voltage across the load when it is switched on. With five setups to rewire it will probably take me a couple hours to do that. Then I will be ready to run some tests. I may get it all done tomorrow. Who knows. I have until about 2:00 in the afternoon. After that I am tied up with other stuff.

On Monday I should be able to start putting coils in the machine, and on Tuesday the rest of the coils will arrive. So before next weekend I should have everything done and be ready to submit it to be tested at the lab next week. At least I hope so. I am still a bit concerned about how hard it is to turn the rotor. I can't see any place where it is binding up, but an issue there means amp draw. I'm not sure if there IS an issue, or if it's just that a rotor with twice the magnets is so much heavier and more difficult to rotate. Guess I will see when the motor is attached. Amp draw of the motor with no coils in place will tell me a lot, and I can go from there. I do NOT want to have to take this thing apart once it is all together. That's a pain in the rear end!

[BroMikey]

Spell out all of the processes taking place on the e-bike starting and ending with the factory battery bank and i'll see you in 72-75 yrs is what you mean. Way over you head. Remember to become fully versed on wave forms ev's use, being produced by a processor from the battery bank.

All of the conversion back.