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  • Clemente Figuera 1908 Basic Application Principle...

    Hello to All,

    Below I have translated -myself- directly from Figuera's Original Spanish Patent "THE PRINCIPLE OF THE INVENTION"

    PRINCIPIO DE LA INVENCIÓN

    Observando atentamente lo que sucede en una dinamo en marcha, se ve que las espiras del inducido no hacen más que acercarse y separarse de los centros magnéticos de los imanes o electroimanes inductores, y que dichas espiras, en su giro, van atravesando secciones del campo magnético de diferente poder, pues, mientras este tiene su máximo de acción en el centro del núcleo de cada electroimán, esta acción se va debilitando conforme el inducido se separa del centro del electroimán, para agrandar otra vez, cuando dicho inducido se aproxima al centro de otro electroimán de signo contrario al primero.

    Puesto que todos sabemos que los efectos que se manifiestan cuando un circuito cerrado se aproxima y se aleja de un centro magnético son los mismos que cuando, estando quieto e inmóvil este circuito, el campo magnético dentro del cual está colocado ganando y perdiendo en intensidad; y puesto que toda variación que por cualquiera causa, se produzca en el flujo que atraviese a un circuito es motivo de producción de corriente eléctrica inducida, se pensó en la posibilidad de construir una máquina que funcionara, no según el principio de movimiento, como lo hacen las actuales dinamos, sino según el principio de aumento y disminución, o sea de variación del poder del campo magnético, o de la corriente eléctrica que lo produce.

    La tensión de la corriente total de las actuales dinamos es la suma de las corrientes inducidas parciales nacidas en cada una de las espiras del inducido. Poco importa que estas corrientes parciales estén obtenidas o por el giro del inducido, o por la variación del flujo que las atraviesa; pero, en el primer caso, se necesitará para el giro del inducido una fuente mayor de la que se puede obtener transformando en trabajo mecánico la corriente total de la dinamo, y en el segundo caso la fuerza necesaria para conseguir la variación del flujo es tan insignificante que se puede derivar sin inconveniente alguno, de la total suministrada por la máquina.

    No hay hasta la presente ninguna máquina fundada en este principio que no ha sido aplicada aun a la producción de grandes corrientes eléctricas industriales, y que entre otras ventajas, tiene la de suprimir toda necesidad de movimiento y por lo tanto, de la fuerza necesaria para producirlo.

    Now in my translation below I have inserted in between parenthesis my own descriptions in blue, as completing words which are typically not used in Spanish language, in order to achieve the best translation possible from the original paper.


    PRINCIPLE OF THE INVENTION

    Closely observing what takes place in a running generator, we can notice that all induced coils do, is to approach and get further away from the magnetic centers (cores) of magnets or electromagnets that act as the inductors (exciting fields), and such coils by their constant spin are going through sections of the magnetic field of different levels of strength, since, this (magnetic field) have its maximum strength at the very center of the core of each electromagnet, this (strength) property starts weakening as the induced (generating coil) is separating (getting further away) from the center of the electromagnetic core, to then maximize again, when such induced (coil(s)) gets closer to the center of the next electromagnet's core of opposite polarity as the later one.

    Based on the fact that we all know about the effects whenever a closed circuit approaches to then get further away from a magnetic center are the same as when this circuit is being static and it is then the magnetic field the one either gaining or loosing in strength; So, based on the fact that any (flux) variation from any due cause, is produced in the flux which is going through a circuit is the meaning for the generation of an induced electrical power, we thought on the possibility about constructing a machine that would function, not based on the (mechanical) movement principle, like all generators do, but based on the principle of gain and decrease, meaning the variation of the magnetic field strength, or from the electrical currents which produce it.

    The Voltage which drives the total currents of actual generators is based on the sum from all partial induced currents taking place at each induced coil. And no matter that such partial currents would be obtained from the (mechanical) spin from the induced (generally understanding any moving part of the generator, and not necessarily only the induced end but also -like in most now days design- the rotating -inducing- field) or from the flux variation that goes through; however, in the former case, it would be required to spin the induced part with a much greater source of force than what could be obtained by transforming in mechanical work the total current produced by the generator, as in the second case the required force in order to achieve the flux variation is so extremely small that it could be derived without any inconvenient, from the total (sum of currents) obtained from the machine.

    Up to this present (day) there is no such a machine based on this principle that has been applied to the industrial generation of electric currents, and having, but not limited to, the advantages to suppress all the need of movement, and as such, all the required forces to produce it.
    This superb reasoning from this Gentleman, way back in the year 1908...could be easily and very well understood by even a retarded person...or even the lowest IQ possible...however, by all of Us being blinded by the deformed "Classic and Modern Magnetism Sciences"...This could have never be possible...unless becoming part of the Science Fiction Theories used in Hollywood movies by Steven Spielberg, George Lucas or the Wachowski Brothers...

    Hope this post will help to open some minds out there...we all need that (and desperately)


    Regards


    Ufopolitics
    Last edited by Ufopolitics; 10-11-2016, 05:19 PM.
    Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

    Comment


    • A Sorry Man

      Quote;

      "Marathonman,

      Thanks for your profound technical answers to my two questions. I see you are really an expert into the part G design.

      Again your posts and insults defines more to you than to me. Your education is clearly stated in your post.

      Guys, you have in front of you to MM, the man who is always right and do not even admit a good technical question if it does not match his view.

      PD: The 1908 does not even mention any internal recycling energy device. It is self looped taking a fraction of the output current and using it to power the small brush motor and the electromagnets. Read below again.

      Be aware of those who want to re-write the original patent with his own ideas and design"

      You are a piss ant of a man and a ignorant one at that. every time Doug1 on OU forum posted Hanon came running to me asking what did he said and i had to break it down so a 10 year old could understand it. not once, not twice but EVERY TIME. and you actually have the balls to accuse me of trying to rewrite the patent. you unintelligent piss ant of a man, you have always acted like a woman ever since i met you on OU. it doesn't mater how many times a person try's to explain it to you, you don't have the intelligence to understand it anyways. i have broken down every detail to you on numerous occasions yet you still can't comprehend it. EVERYTHING i got from Doug was broken down to you yet you still remain ignorant to the Figuera device. i'm sorry but that is stupidity not ignorance in my book so that tells me you will NEVER understand this device and are useless to this forum adding nothing but reposts, arguments and riding off of the fame of the translation. i pitty you.
      your constant attempt to discredit me is really getting tiresome and proves you are a piss ant unintelligent man that knows absolutely NOTHING OF THE FIGUERA DEVICE.

      every one knows patents do not disclose every single detail about their devise and Figuera did the same. the power shoved out of the declining electromagnet gets shoved into part G whether your unintelligent brain can comprehend it or not. oh but i MUST BE LYING because o pea brain Hanon can't understand it. EVERYONE IS A LIER BECAUSE PEA BRAIN HANON CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT.

      I suggest you pick a device that can be built by a 10 year old because that is your mental status and leave the Figuera device to the more advanced people.

      now i suggest you quite acting like a woman on the rag and actually study the patent and understand them if you can. (i doubt it)


      Ufopolitics;

      Ever since you posted a while back a sentence from the patent that was never in hanon's translation i don't trust him. if you could squeeze a complete translation in your busy schedule i sure would appreciate it, or from anyone for that matter. a second opinion is highly welcomed.

      Quote;
      "This superb reasoning from this Gentleman, way back in the year 1908...could be easily and very well understood by even a retarded person...or even the lowest IQ possible...however, by all of Us being blinded by the deformed "Classic and Modern Magnetism Sciences"...This could have never be possible...unless becoming part of the Science Fiction Theories used in Hollywood movies by Steven Spielberg, George Lucas or the Wachowski Brothers..."

      could be why i understand it and hanon doesn't. iQ might be on the low side, just saying the truth be told.


      Bistander;

      who ever did that graph it is wrong. for one all primaries are wound exactly the same, in the same direction. one is not cw and the other ccw. they were wound that way for simplicity and exact dimensions to be exactly the same. two, at NO TIME is polarities reversed, the positive and negative never gets reversed, arrows are wrong.

      if both electromagnets were powered up their spin direction would be opposing but in the Figuera device they are not. one is increasing while the other is decreasing allowing there spin directions to compliment each other. this very action allows the duel E fields to be in the same direction if unison is not kept induction falls to the peak of the rising electromagnet.

      real currant flow is from negative to positive so the front of coil gets connected to negative side and positive side gets connected to part G.

      i hope this clears things a little.






      MM
      Last edited by marathonman; 10-11-2016, 06:36 PM.

      Comment


      • Originally posted by hanon1492 View Post
        Ufo,

        I do not understand most of the physical principles you use. They are quite different to the ones I use
        Hanon,

        You, simply do not understand it because you are still very deep inside "the Box"...

        Like I wrote before...you have to either take the blue or the red pill, friend...am sorry but you can not have the cake and eat it all too...Translating...you have to "let go" all those stupid theories about "imaginary lines of force" "cutting" the wires...and all the Lorentz BS...

        Figuera's Patent is based on an advanced thinking and reasoning that even up to right now, today (108 years ago from the day he wrote it), is still not "accepted" by the Modern Scientific Community...which is -supposedly- very advanced in magnetism concepts...¿really? ¿?...


        Originally posted by hanon1492 View Post
        In short: Below there are two zoomed details of your sketches. Between the first image and the second image there is pole reversal in each electromagnet because current is flowing in different directions in each sketch whether you like it or not.





        Even I continue watching a North-South, or South-North, in each sketch: CW+CW and CCW+CCW.
        It is not about me liking it or not...

        It is about You opening your mind just a bit to understand this without the need of all the BS of Reference Methods and Classic Laws...just you and your own common sense.

        No pole reversal at all, it is just the Higher Influence Spin from the Stronger Field Projected into the Weaker Field.

        And this was just a couple of frames Hanon...what if I upload an animated full video of both constant reciprocating fields?!

        Oh, then we may loose you...


        This is really fun...and it is just the beginning...

        Fasten your seats belts for a very close "Shift"...if you could stand the "gravity forces" involved...


        Take care


        Ufopolitics
        Last edited by Ufopolitics; 10-11-2016, 05:56 PM.
        Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

        Comment


        • Originally posted by marathonman View Post

          Ufopolitics;

          Ever since you posted a while back a sentence from the patent that was never in hanon's translation i don't trust him. if you could squeeze a complete translation in your busy schedule i sure would appreciate it.
          Hey MM,

          Yes I know about the translation issue...I will try friend to get the whole thing when I have a chance...

          Originally posted by marathonman View Post
          "This superb reasoning from this Gentleman, way back in the year 1908...could be easily and very well understood by even a retarded person...or even the lowest IQ possible...however, by all of Us being blinded by the deformed "Classic and Modern Magnetism Sciences"...This could have never be possible...unless becoming part of the Science Fiction Theories used in Hollywood movies by Steven Spielberg, George Lucas or the Wachowski Brothers..."

          could be why i understand it and hanon doesn't, just saying the truth be told.


          MM
          Marathonman,

          When I read one of your first post here that I've quoted previously...I understood your complete view of THE WHOLE PICTURE FROM A COMPLETELY OUTSIDE THE BOX VIEWING POINT...

          Therefore, You could be able to understand (and build) beyond what the common people could even start grasping, basically if they are very tight within their own created boxes...

          Cheers friend, and believe me, it is better to get some work done and finished it rather than waste any more time here...arguing and trying to convince closed minds...

          After you are done with your beautiful machine...film it...upload it here and then let them -try- to understand it...while you just watch the show enjoying a nice cold beer...


          Regards



          Ufopolitics
          Last edited by Ufopolitics; 10-11-2016, 06:06 PM.
          Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

          Comment


          • Originally posted by marathonman View Post

            Bistander;

            who ever did that graph it is wrong. for one all primaries are wound exactly the same, in the same direction. one is not cw and the other ccw. they were wound that way for simplicity and exact dimensions to be exactly the same. two, at NO TIME is polarities reversed, the positive and negative never gets reversed, arrows are wrong.

            if both electromagnets were powered up their spin direction would be opposing but in the Figuera device they are not. one is increasing while the other is decreasing allowing there spin directions to compliment each other. this very action allows the duel E fields to be in the same direction if unison is not kept induction falls to the peak of the rising electromagnet.

            real currant flow is from negative to positive so the front of coil gets connected to negative side and positive side gets connected to part G.

            i hope this clears things a little.

            MM
            Hi MM,

            I wish it did clear things but afraid not. I'm unsure of the graph or diagram to which you refer. I really wish you'd learn to use the quote function in your replies. But anything in the way of graphics to which I posted on the past page or two has been drawn by Ufo.

            Thanks for the reply,

            bi

            Edit: perhaps you were referring to post#1265 by member seaad.
            Last edited by bistander; 10-11-2016, 07:03 PM. Reason: Addition

            Comment


            • Originally posted by bistander View Post
              Hi hanon,

              It appears Ufo doesn't actually write or draw exactly what he means and relies on the reader to know more than is shown or told. Case in point: I had the same concern as you so asked him. He said:



              So we (the readers) must know that there are other currents not shown. It does make it difficult to understand.

              bi
              Bistander,

              I simply did not even bother to "paint" such small arrows (yes smaller than all the rest shown, since whatever returns back to that "momentary" source is just a very minimal amount) returning to negative, therefore I considered it may bring confusion to the explanation to Hanon, which basically was referring -and framing- to the strict relation between Part G and Primaries which is where majority (higher percentage) of currents are traveling.

              I am sorry, I will not keep posting here anymore untill I have a completed machine...all I did was try to explain to Hanon my point of view about Part G and Primaries, since He was asking to anyone who could do it...so I offered voluntarily...and unfortunately my view just brought some heavy shooting

              It is ok...there will not be anymore "points of views explanations" no matter how much anyone begs for just an explanation.

              I have a lot of work to do, so I need tons of time...and this is just wasting it.


              Good bye


              Ufopolitics
              Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

              Comment


              • Out Side The Box

                Originally posted by Ufopolitics View Post
                Hey MM,

                Yes I know about the translation issue...I will try friend to get the whole thing when I have a chance...



                Marathonman,

                When I read one of your first post here that I've quoted previously...I understood your complete view of THE WHOLE PICTURE FROM A COMPLETELY OUTSIDE THE BOX VIEWING POINT...

                Therefore, You could be able to understand (and build) beyond what the common people could even start grasping, basically if they are very tight within their own created boxes...

                Cheers friend, and believe me, it is better to get some work done and finished it rather than waste any more time here...arguing and trying to convince closed minds...

                After you are done with your beautiful machine...film it...upload it here and then let them -try- to understand it...while you just watch the show enjoying a nice cold beer...


                Regards



                Ufopolitics
                I thank you my friend, arguing with a simple minded person that has no grasp on real reality or any capability to is draining and a waist of time. reminds me of OU all over. simple minds in a closed box. the only decently intelligent person on that forum thread was Doug in which i wish he was here.

                Bistander;

                i sometimes don't like to use that function (sorry for confusion). as for the graphs, the arrows in n1 are wrong and the bottom graph n2 arrows are wrong as is the cw, ccw wiring. just how i see it sorry UFOP.
                part G controls everything allowed through the primaries all in the same direction just raising or lowering according to the inductive reactance of part G's winding's as the brush or transistor contacts rotate.

                Seaad;

                sorry friend, you can't get bucking fields with NS no matter how hard you try unless of course you are referring to set N and set S in bucking N/N then you would be correct.

                i am assuming that where the letter G is there is a core that those inductive winding's are wound on. if not it will never be self sustaining, just sayin.


                MM
                Last edited by marathonman; 10-11-2016, 07:40 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Ufopolitics View Post
                  Bistander,

                  I simply did not even bother to "paint" such small arrows (yes smaller than all the rest shown, since whatever returns back to that "momentary" source is just a very minimal amount) returning to negative, therefore I considered it may bring confusion to the explanation to Hanon, which basically was referring -and framing- to the strict relation between Part G and Primaries which is where majority (higher percentage) of currents are traveling.

                  I am sorry, I will not keep posting here anymore untill I have a completed machine...all I did was try to explain to Hanon my point of view about Part G and Primaries, since He was asking to anyone who could do it...so I offered voluntarily...and unfortunately my view just brought some heavy shooting

                  It is ok...there will not be anymore "points of views explanations" no matter how much anyone begs for just an explanation.

                  I have a lot of work to do, so I need tons of time...and this is just wasting it.


                  Good bye


                  Ufopolitics
                  Ufo,

                  The excitation source ( - & + on your diagram), whether an external power supply or tapped off the secondary, is in series with Part G and the primaries. It is an integral part of the circuit and cannot simply be ignored. I do not see how you came to your stated conclusion: "(yes smaller than all the rest shown, since whatever returns back to that "momentary" source is just a very minimal amount) returning to negative". I suspect that has hanon confused also.

                  But nevermind. Go back to your lab or shop and hammer out that prototype. That's what we all really want to see.

                  Regards,

                  bi

                  Comment


                  • Quote;
                    "The excitation source ( - & + on your diagram), whether an external power supply or tapped off the secondary, is in series with Part G and the primaries."

                    Absolutely correct, to a point.


                    MM
                    Last edited by marathonman; 10-11-2016, 08:24 PM.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by marathonman View Post

                      You are a piss ant of a man and a ignorant one at that. every time Doug1 on OU forum posted Hanon came running to me asking what did he said and i had to break it down so a 10 year old could understand it. not once, not twice but EVERY TIME. and you actually have the balls to accuse me of trying to rewrite the patent. you unintelligent piss ant of a man, you have always acted like a woman ever since i met you on OU. it doesn't mater how many times a person try's to explain it to you, you don't have the intelligence to understand it anyways. i have broken down every detail to you on numerous occasions yet you still can't comprehend it. EVERYTHING i got from Doug was broken down to you yet you still remain ignorant to the Figuera device. i'm sorry but that is stupidity not ignorance in my book so that tells me you will NEVER understand this device and are useless to this forum adding nothing but reposts, arguments and riding off of the fame of the translation. i pitty you.
                      your constant attempt to discredit me is really getting tiresome and proves you are a piss ant unintelligent man that knows absolutely NOTHING OF THE FIGUERA DEVICE.

                      every one knows patents do not disclose every single detail about their devise and Figuera did the same. the power shoved out of the declining electromagnet gets shoved into part G whether your unintelligent brain can comprehend it or not. oh but i MUST BE LYING because o pea brain Hanon can't understand it. EVERYONE IS A LIER BECAUSE PEA BRAIN HANON CAN'T UNDERSTAND IT.

                      I suggest you pick a device that can be built by a 10 year old because that is your mental status and leave the Figuera device to the more advanced people.

                      now i suggest you quite acting like a woman on the rag and actually study the patent and understand them if you can. (i doubt it)

                      Right Hand Rule






                      __________________________________________________


                      Last edited by hanon1492; 10-11-2016, 08:51 PM.

                      Comment


                      • Circuit Posibilities

                        Here are a few circuits that may help the people pursuing electronic driven part G.

                        at no time does anything come between part G and the declining electromagnet otherwise self sustainment will not be achieved.

                        opposing fields in Tesla's AC to DC patent will not let reverse currant happen. flow in one direction only.








                        MM
                        Last edited by marathonman; 10-11-2016, 08:10 PM.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by marathonman View Post





                          MM
                          What is part A ?

                          Comment


                          • Self explanatory

                            correct winding and currant flow of primaries in relation to part G.












                            MM

                            Comment


                            • AC connection/ splitter and or step down transformer to what ever your drive capabilities are along with currant blocking in one direction. the second secondary can be used with proper winding to achieve your desired voltage or a small step down, which ever you prefer.
                              Nikola Tesla U.S. Patent 413,353 - Method of Obtaining Direct from Alternating Currents | Tesla Universe

                              MM
                              Last edited by marathonman; 10-11-2016, 09:42 PM.

                              Comment


                              • ->MM, Hanon
                                Notice the different (mH) G taps to achieve "sinewave" in my post #1265
                                Arne

                                Comment

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