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Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera

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  • My Set Up...

    Hello to all,

    Below is a Diagram of my set up:

    [IMG][/IMG]

    My Rotary Switch have a 20 elements commutator installed and wired, so, I am not really going to change that because of the work it involves...so, what I would do is just "bridge" each two wires in order to have a ten (10) element comm.

    Also, I already have all wires (20) connected to elements and run through rear plate holes...not changing that either, except becoming just ten wires after bridging them, so I am wiring it according to diagram above...

    It is not that am lazy, but I am in the middle of completion of two Machines that work on similar principles...so, am saving tons of time by doing it this way...

    However, of all Machines this Figuera's Device is the simplest to put together in order to prove Concept. And that is exactly what am after.

    I will film a video about it...it is about the fourth video I am making and still not uploaded any as of now (basically Theories and tests about Magnetism)......am swamped. But I will "make" time for this, since its simplicity of Coils-Cores.

    I will make all Coils movable (in order to test repulse versus attract on primaries, plus adjust the proper gaps) along a 2 inch thick and 5 1/2 inches long solid iron rod...where I will mount them all.

    I will use 47 Ohms resistors that I have in stock like 20...from previous tests...and I have got plenty of wire...

    I will give it a try to install FIRST an "Exciting Secondary" (not the final Output one) shown at very center of diagram, at center of Main Output Secondary...like I told MM above...I will test this possibility as it works on a typical gen head.

    Next week I will be on this full time.


    Regards


    Ufopolitics
    Last edited by Ufopolitics; 09-10-2016, 08:19 PM.
    Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

    Comment


    • Originally posted by Ufopolitics View Post
      I will give it a try to install FIRST an "Exciting Secondary" (not the final Output one) shown at very center of diagram, at center of Main Output Secondary...like I told MM above...I will test this possibility as it works on a typical gen head.

      Another advantage is that in the sinus of the core of the induced electromagnets we can put another small size induced electromagnet with equal or greater core length than the large induced one. In these second group of induced an electric current will be produced, as in the first group of induced, and this produced current will be sufficient for the consumption in the continuous excitation of the machine, being completely free all the other current produced by the first induced electromagnets in order to use it in all purposes you want.
      This is spelled out in the later patents. The coils are arranged differently though, you might want to take a look https://figueragenerator.wordpress.c...orn-post-1908/

      Regards,

      CM

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Cadman View Post
        This is spelled out in the later patents. The coils are arranged differently though, you might want to take a look https://figueragenerator.wordpress.c...orn-post-1908/

        Regards,

        CM

        Thanks Cadman!


        Yeah, I am pretty sure it can be done...problem is to find the right amount of wire for currents induced versus the ones consumed by primaries...taking into acct. the resistance at diodes...

        The way MM have part G with coils-cores separated is excellent though, but it is a LOT of work friend. If this works...and if as soon as we spin that small motor at switch...it starts increasing currents without any external feed, except for cap stored...we are on the right track!

        The advantage I have with the rotary fields machine...is that "slave" inner rotor... by having a couple of magnets will start inducing right away.

        Anyways, nothing to loose by testing except time...

        Are you gonna build one?


        Regards


        Ufopolitics
        Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

        Comment


        • Modern approach...

          Switching simplified....???
          Attached Files

          Comment


          • Ok, some progress for a few hours of time. Please don't let me distract you gentlemen that want to build a larger, full replication. What I'm trying to do is build a proof of concept with parts on hand and a minimum of time and money. If the concept is valid then it's worth spending more time and some money on bigger better versions, but over my years experimenting I've gotten pretty good at figuring out how to use available and scavenged stuff to try out things without spending a lot.

            I have the drive circuit "built", in that it's all stuff I had already. A 2-channel small car audio amp and a cell phone with signal generator software, presto. Now all I have to do is finish the matching test rig hardware. Note that these little amps are internally bridged and the speaker black lead is NOT ground but just negative polarity vs. the red lead. I have the scope hooked up to one lead on each channel and the resulting waveform, if you properly measured the voltage difference on the red & black leads for each respective channel, is in fact AC with no DC offset. The displayed scope trace is misleading. To use this for the rig it will be necessary to have either a bias winding or permanent magnets.
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • That cell phone software for the dual channel signal generator is really neat. I looked it up and that company makes a lot of neat apps for Android devices. And they are all free with no ads. Thanks for that great find.
              Just because someone disagrees with you does NOT make them your enemy. We can disagree without attacking someone. This means YOU especially BroMikey.

              Comment


              • Amazing

                Adulterate as you must, i will not stop it. but both are very much wrong. good luck in your adulterative process as i will have nothing to do with it.

                good luck in your process.

                MM

                Comment


                • Ufo,
                  I do not see why you are going to use two induced coils, one shorter than the other. As a first prototype I will go for the simpler design with just one induced coil

                  In case that one of them is for the internal excitation of the machine, you should follow what is written in the patent from 1914 that Cadman referred before. The induced coil for self-consumption in the generator must be of equal or greater length that the induced coil for output power. In case not when the magnetic lines collide outside of its short coil length there wont be induction for the selfconsumptioncoil because there wont be wires in that coil cut by those lines of force. That why I think that that 1914 patent highlights that its length must be equal or larger than the main induced coil. Anyway as told before I think this second induction coil is a second step. IMHO

                  MM, I think it is always good to test slightly different designs and driving method, always that the main
                  principles of the patent are maintained. This way is easier to test many options and search for the one that works better, or the simplest one, or the most optimized one, as possiblely your magnetic resistance toroidal part G. I think many design may get it running, if the main principles are kept.

                  Regards
                  Last edited by hanon1492; 09-11-2016, 01:15 AM.

                  Comment


                  • I guess I'm not understanding then. I thought I understood that the physics happening was:

                    -two opposing magnetic fields, so that their B-fields cancel in a planar region between then
                    -a pickup coil in the cancellation region.
                    -a way to modulate the intensity of the fields alternately, so that one is increasing while the other is decreasing, causing an apparent back and forth motion of the null plane

                    The B fields sum to zero but the VxB component of the "motional E-field" does not as the null plane moves back and forth, leading to a net voltage in the turns of the pickup coil but no direct Lenz's law back-coupling to the primary driving coils, leading to overunity output. What about this arrangement I'm proposing would fail to produce this effect, or am I understanding the physics incorrectly? I think after rereading your previous explanations about the size of the secondary cross-section needing to be smaller, could be an issue with regard to using the ferrite cores, plus the magnetic fields wouldn't be uniform since they are hollow cylinders not solid cylinders. I really don't want to be a distraction to the good work that's happening in this thread, maybe I should just experiment on my own and report if I have any interesting results.

                    @cifta- yes, I have a real function generator but the two channel output with controllable phase shift is pretty useful for some applications....

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by tswift View Post
                      I guess I'm not understanding then. I thought I understood that the physics happening was:

                      -two opposing magnetic fields, so that their B-fields cancel in a planar region between then
                      -a pickup coil in the cancellation region.
                      -a way to modulate the intensity of the fields alternately, so that one is increasing while the other is decreasing, causing an apparent back and forth motion of the null plane
                      Exactly.

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Wistiti View Post
                        Some try for proof of concept...
                        Thanks MM for the reply.
                        I just take the lazy way cause i have some of these pump under hand and they are alredy have bucking coil on it...

                        But after i wound it, i realise with 2 of them, it may be possible to have 4output coil instead of only 2! (See the image) what do you think of it..?

                        For now i have hard time with the g part... But am still on it!

                        Ciao!
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                        • No comment.
                          Last edited by marathonman; 09-11-2016, 11:35 AM.

                          Comment


                          • MM,

                            Post like yours are not good for the long term and just spoil the good mood in the thread. Threre is an spanish proverb saying : you will win more with honey than that with bile ( Se gana mas con miel que con hiel ) proverb done because in spanish honey and bile rhyme (miel-hiel). And it is very true.

                            I said that while the principles are mantained I think that some other options may work also, and I already commented the only thing that I do not see (the two induced coils). For me the rest is fine (at first sight). Or using 10 resistor arrays instead of 7. Or wheter other user want to create the two driving signals with two amplifiers. Please tell us which are those features that you do not see as the one claimed in the patent.

                            Let's do it simple and start by the simplest design. The toroidal core is difficult to built and people just understand better resistors (Ohm law) than rotating fields into a variable impedance toroid. As you did, your first prototype was with resistors. If you had 100 w input and 300 watt output with two sets and the resistors array you would even have more than 1 KW output with the 7 sets for almost the same input. Not bad for a demo device!!!!

                            I hope to see you posting again for the betterment of this thread and this project. Let's keep on tracking the patent design.

                            I have one question about you design: while your future device is designed for selfsustained I do not understand why you are using such a powerful Mosfets which may deal with up to 1000 watts as input. I supposed that your design was wasting very few energy and most of it was coming from your part G. Would not it be possible to use smaller Mosfets?

                            Regards
                            Last edited by hanon1492; 09-11-2016, 09:27 AM.

                            Comment


                            • Guys, MM,

                              tolerance is the word.

                              I understand very well that you're a purist when it comes to the Figuera device and I understand and respect that, since you've put so much time and effort in your years of research. I am very grateful for the info you are sharing and the time you are taking to explain.

                              I am of the opinion that we should also remain open to other methods of accomplishing the same effect the CF device does. So what is that?
                              The main ingredient is the modulated (back and forth) centre of the two opposing fields. By just using energy to do this without recycling anything, and if Lenz really doesn't work against the primaries, we should be in the "close to COP 2" area.
                              If we add a method to recycle the energy used to modulate the opposing fields the COP should be way higher, depending on methods and materials used.

                              The CF device seems to do both well. Now, there are other and also more modern ways to recycle the energy, I'm not saying this to diminish Figuera's method at all, it's just that years have passed and technology has improved, so why not take advantage of that.

                              So what I propose is this, if MM wants to keep this thread dedicated to Figuera's method only (part G), ok. We can open a new thread, maybe called something like "The Figuera device with alternative recycling methods" or "Modulating the "zero" of opposing magnetic fields".

                              Or, we try and stay tolerant and open to other ways of accomplishing the same thing the CF device did with similar methods.

                              edit: MM, you have been talking about using mosfets yourself, why get upset if others also see ways of simplifying the process and obtain the same result?

                              Mario
                              Last edited by Mario; 09-11-2016, 09:34 AM.

                              Comment


                              • Tswift,

                                you don't even need two separate signals out of phase for that. You can use only one channel, feed that to the coils, one connected out of phase.

                                Don't know if you'll be able to achieve anything with hollow cores though.

                                Mario

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