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  • Intermission. But eyes wide open observing all "serious builders".

    Regards Arne

    Comment


    • control circuit

      To All:
      Well I guess if anyone wants to experiment with this device then the first thing you'll need is a decent circuit to control the current going to the solenoid coils.

      A circuit that:
      1.Pulses both coils in unison.
      2.One that breaks up the dc square-wave into 8 pieces or more.
      3. One that reverses itself at the end of each cycle.
      4.Be adjustable from 0 to 10 amps.
      5.Simple mini-pot adjustments that varies the bias to the 2 power fets that drive the 2 coils.
      6.Each adjustment being totally independent of all others.
      7.Able to adjust the hi and lo for the 2 coils at whatever amperage level you wish.
      8.Able to adjust frequency.
      9.And of course, no need for power hungry resistors.

      Haven't seen anyone posting a simple circuit that meets all these requirements, so I'll post you my more elaborate circuit.
      There's also a scope shot of the pulses going to the 2 mosfets.
      Hope this all helps somebody.

      Btw: open thumbnail with "paint"
      Attached Files

      Comment


      • That looks good Elcheapo. Now you have eliminated the requirement for the hard to build part G and also designed something that should do exactly what the original part G did. It will be interesting now to see how the primary and secondary coils respond to the current being controlled in the proper way. Maybe we will get some answers as to whether or not the original Figuera device was in fact able to sustain it's own operation and supply some usable power.

        Have you had a chance to try it yet? I am curious as to whether or not the mosfets get warm while only be turned on part way. Most of them like to either be full on or full off. Of course if the current is kept low it may not be a problem.

        Really looking forward to your further tests.

        Thanks for sharing that great circuit.

        By the way you might want to look into TinyCad. It is free circuit drawing software that is really easy to use.
        Just because someone disagrees with you does NOT make them your enemy. We can disagree without attacking someone. This means YOU especially BroMikey.

        Comment


        • Elcheapo

          Can you post bigger picture of schematic ?

          Comment


          • mosfet

            Originally posted by citfta View Post
            That looks good Elcheapo. Now you have eliminated the requirement for the hard to build part G and also designed something that should do exactly what the original part G did. It will be interesting now to see how the primary and secondary coils respond to the current being controlled in the proper way. Maybe we will get some answers as to whether or not the original Figuera device was in fact able to sustain it's own operation and supply some usable power.

            Have you had a chance to try it yet? I am curious as to whether or not the mosfets get warm while only be turned on part way. Most of them like to either be full on or full off. Of course if the current is kept low it may not be a problem.

            Really looking forward to your further tests.

            Thanks for sharing that great circuit.

            By the way you might want to look into TinyCad. It is free circuit drawing software that is really easy to use.
            Glad to see you taking more interest in this thing.

            Yes, I have the mosfets mounted on a large heat-sink and they do get warm.

            When the gate voltage is past 4 volts then the mosfet becomes a linear device with an increase in amperage out to a proportional increase in voltage in.
            Thanks for the "tinycad" reference.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
              To All:
              Well I guess if anyone wants to experiment with this device then the first thing you'll need is a decent circuit to control the current going to the solenoid coils.

              A circuit that:
              1.Pulses both coils in unison.
              2.One that breaks up the dc square-wave into 8 pieces or more.
              3. One that reverses itself at the end of each cycle.
              4.Be adjustable from 0 to 10 amps.
              5.Simple mini-pot adjustments that varies the bias to the 2 power fets that drive the 2 coils.
              6.Each adjustment being totally independent of all others.
              7.Able to adjust the hi and lo for the 2 coils at whatever amperage level you wish.
              8.Able to adjust frequency.
              9.And of course, no need for power hungry resistors.

              Haven't seen anyone posting a simple circuit that meets all these requirements, so I'll post you my more elaborate circuit.
              There's also a scope shot of the pulses going to the 2 mosfets.
              Hope this all helps somebody.

              Btw: open thumbnail with "paint"
              Thanks Elcheapo!

              Looks like a nice circuit, however, it is completely unreadable...

              I have tried with all software I have to enhance, zoom, contrast, etc,etc...but it is too small...

              If you send me a better image I could make it in CAD and post it here for all to see.

              It would be a huge step forward to have such a device running the Exciter System!!


              Thanks in advance


              Ufopolitics
              Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

              Comment


              • pix size

                Originally posted by boguslaw View Post
                Elcheapo

                Can you post bigger picture of schematic ?
                Ya that's a little small. Try this one.

                I didn't draw out the full schematic as there are 9 sections all the same.
                The bi-directional counter that I use, only counts from 0 to 8.
                So the schematic only shows 2 of these sections to make it easier to allow for adding the next 7.
                Attached Files

                Comment


                • results

                  To all:


                  UFO:

                  Hope the bigger image I posted for boguslaw clears things up.

                  As anyone can see, there are a lot of parts in this circuit. They can all be gotten from e-bay at very low prices.
                  So for anyone ambitious enough to wire one up you will need to know how it works, lots of fine soldering skills, trouble-shooting skills and lots of patience .
                  Before going through all that trouble, I think it only fair to give you my results first.
                  My 2 solenoid coils are each wound with 212 turns of #19awg.
                  The cores are 1.5in. Dia. 2.5in. long using soft iron welding rods with flux removed.
                  The pickup coil between the 2 poles is: .75 in. long and wound with 80 turns of #19. Core is also made with same rods cut to .75 in.long.

                  Typical pulse settings in amps are as follows.

                  Coils A: 8 7.5 7 6.5 6 5.5 5 4.5 4 (9 pulses)

                  Coils B: 4 4.5 5 5.5 6 6.5 7 7.5 8

                  As coils A & B get pulsed at exactly the same time, notice that the total current sum is always 12 amps.

                  Results:nada, zilch

                  I've tried nn ss ns: I've tried turning the pickup coil 90 deg. With and without a core.

                  Still not even 1/2 a volt.

                  But the one good thing is a strongly changing magnetic field between the 2 poles.
                  I checked this with MM's paper clip on a straw method. With the solenoids spaced 1.25 in. apart
                  the clip would wobble through this 1.25 in. distance actually clicking on the metal cores in the process.
                  Maybe Figueras is hiding a few things, like using a better switching system to create a ROTATING magnetic field instead of just a static one.

                  I'm not the smartest guy in the world, so maybe I'm missing something.

                  Comment


                  • Well Elcheapo, That is disappointing. I had hopes that with your switching system we might see some evidence the Figuera device was real. But it appears there is more to it than meets the eye or maybe nothing at all.

                    I am guessing that you have tried it with other current values. I am wondering if the current was high enough to not allow the secondary to actually see any changes. Maybe a lower value like a total of 5 amps for the two primaries. Just a thought.

                    I still think your circuit is a great design and certainly worth keeping or at least knowing about. Fine job on it. Thanks for sharing.

                    Respectfully,
                    Carroll
                    Just because someone disagrees with you does NOT make them your enemy. We can disagree without attacking someone. This means YOU especially BroMikey.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                      To all:


                      UFO:

                      Hope the bigger image I posted for boguslaw clears things up.
                      Yes, thanks!...However, it would be great if you could define (with dotted lines) a "Unit"...

                      I mean, I see Unit 1 written next to the transistor 2N2222, you've said there are two units...so I do not see #2...then as it branches down...I see both FET's are combined feeding Gates from both IC's branches...

                      So, just a unit contour would do.

                      Thanks much, it indeed is a very useful circuit!!

                      Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                      As anyone can see, there are a lot of parts in this circuit. They can all be gotten from e-bay at very low prices.
                      So for anyone ambitious enough to wire one up you will need to know how it works, lots of fine soldering skills, trouble-shooting skills and lots of patience .
                      Before going through all that trouble, I think it only fair to give you my results first.
                      My 2 solenoid coils are each wound with 212 turns of #19awg.
                      The cores are 1.5in. Dia. 2.5in. long using soft iron welding rods with flux removed.
                      The pickup coil between the 2 poles is: .75 in. long and wound with 80 turns of #19. Core is also made with same rods cut to .75 in.long.

                      Typical pulse settings in amps are as follows.

                      Coils A: 8- 7.5 - 7- 6.5- 6 - 5.5- 5- 4.5- 4- (9 pulses)

                      Coils B: 4- 4.5 - 5- 5.5- 6 - 6.5- 7- 7.5- 8-

                      As coils A & B get pulsed at exactly the same time, notice that the total current sum is always 12 amps.

                      Results:nada, zilch

                      I've tried nn ss ns: I've tried turning the pickup coil 90 deg. With and without a core.

                      Still not even 1/2 a volt.

                      But the one good thing is a strongly changing magnetic field between the 2 poles.
                      I checked this with MM's paper clip on a straw method. With the solenoids spaced 1.25 in. apart
                      the clip would wobble through this 1.25 in. distance actually clicking on the metal cores in the process.
                      Maybe Figueras is hiding a few things, like using a better switching system to create a ROTATING magnetic field instead of just a static one.

                      I'm not the smartest guy in the world, so maybe I'm missing something.
                      Honestly, sorry to read that Elcheapo...

                      I have tested Figuera's Device with my rotary switch-resistors and a similar set up as you have (related to coils-cores arrangement/spec's)...and I did get voltage and amperage out based on the Fields Fluctuations.

                      I read amperage settings above...but not voltage...what is the Operating Voltage with those 12 Amps total?

                      Now, the things that I believe could be a "probable cause" why you are getting zero at output:

                      1- The Amps fluctuations being only by 0.5 decay-gain between stages, maybe too small which does NOT generate the required Field pressures changes through Space/Time...At operating speed/Frequency this 0.5 would be almost not noticeable...

                      I would try increasing it to one (1) amp difference.

                      The fact that a "very thin" paper clip shows a field displacement does not mean it can tell you if there is enough pressure (repulse field formed by the two fluctuations).

                      Try getting a Neo Cylinder (so you could grab it strongly with your hands by its South) aiming at the center solenoid (secondary) with its North facing towards the Invisible Changing NORTHS (N<>N)...then you would be able to feel its pressure PLUS Displacement.

                      2- Depending on your Voltage...You may not be building the required strong fields.

                      In my opinion, there is not that much Amperage required for such small cores and wire gauges...currently I am only using 1 to 2 amps Max...and up to 36 Volts, but then again...it is a different configuration. BUT, based on same principle.


                      Regards


                      Ufopolitics
                      Last edited by Ufopolitics; 07-06-2017, 11:19 PM.
                      Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                      Comment


                      • opinions

                        TO

                        UFO:

                        one unit consists of 6 components.

                        1 2n222 transistor
                        3 pc817 opto-couplers
                        2 500 ohm mini-pots

                        I have only 2 units drawn out to show how all the rest are connected to the mosfet gates.
                        It's only the transistors that have different connections to the 9 different
                        points of ic cd4028.
                        `The total 12 amps uses only 12 volts.

                        Ok on getting some output on your switching resistor device.
                        You have to consider the accuracy of all those resistors. You can't get the
                        same accuracy as you can by just adjusting a small pot.
                        I can get some output by just mis-adjusting the pots.

                        But I think that's because total amperage will then vary up & down and
                        and it's working as a xformer.

                        For anyone who wants my honest opinion on this, here it is.
                        I think the fact that I'm getting zero output means the circuit is working the way it should.

                        Why?
                        Because the circuit is designed to have zero change in total amperage to the coils, meaning
                        zero change in output voltage as well.
                        You can't get an induced voltage when nothing changes.
                        But because of figueras unique TWO coil configuration, the 2 solenoids still make ample flux.
                        The problem we are now faced with is 'How do we make use of all this flux?'
                        It's quite obvious that just placing a single coil within a changing magnetic field does nothing
                        when there's no change in amperage or voltage.
                        Figueras left much out of the picture, so let's see if we can remedy the situation.

                        Just my opinion and nothing more.


                        Regards

                        Elcheapo

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                          TO

                          UFO:

                          one unit consists of 6 components.

                          1 2n222 transistor
                          3 pc817 opto-couplers
                          2 500 ohm mini-pots

                          I have only 2 units drawn out to show how all the rest are connected to the mosfet gates.
                          It's only the transistors that have different connections to the 9 different
                          points of ic cd4028.
                          Thanks Elcheapo,

                          That makes it clear the Unit config.


                          Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                          `The total 12 amps uses only 12 volts.
                          IMHO, I believe 12 Volts is too small pressure to fully drive such amp value. And what happens here is you get a very strong field(s), but incapable to move/displace around iron cores with enough spatial pressure(s).

                          I have written before about this scenario...if your resistance at coils is too low, amps got no problem to flow, BUT, Voltage remains also too low, field becomes almost static, because of no voltage pressure movement, due to almost no voltage difference between coils nodes or terminals.

                          Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                          Ok on getting some output on your switching resistor device.
                          You have to consider the accuracy of all those resistors. You can't get the
                          same accuracy as you can by just adjusting a small pot.
                          I can get some output by just mis-adjusting the pots.

                          But I think that's because total amperage will then vary up & down and
                          and it's working as a xformer.
                          If we alter resistance during operation, NOT only amps will fluctuate, but also voltage, tension...we could resume that as wattage (AmpsXVolts) at coil.

                          Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                          For anyone who wants my honest opinion on this, here it is.
                          I think the fact that I'm getting zero output means the circuit is working the way it should.

                          Why?
                          Because the circuit is designed to have zero change in total amperage to the coils, meaning
                          zero change in output voltage as well.
                          You can't get an induced voltage when nothing changes.
                          No matter what you do...If Magnetic Fields Changes...there would be induction EMF at Output.


                          Originally posted by Elcheapo View Post
                          But because of figueras unique TWO coil configuration, the 2 solenoids still make ample flux.
                          The problem we are now faced with is 'How do we make use of all this flux?'
                          It's quite obvious that just placing a single coil within a changing magnetic field does nothing
                          when there's no change in amperage or voltage.
                          Figueras left much out of the picture, so let's see if we can remedy the situation.

                          Just my opinion and nothing more.


                          Regards

                          Elcheapo
                          Right now I have BOTH Coils for the Exciter built into one core, and they are Bifilar Wound (meaning no two separate facing coils/cores)...I am driving just ONE Field with just one square pulse to ONE of the Coil Circuits, while the second Field comes from a looped LC Tank with AC Caps...this mirrors the main exciting Field PLUS a Reversed Polarity Field...for the "price of one"...

                          I have also written that it is a must to have transient (spikes) currents from either one of the two Fields...and if I get protecting diodes...no induction -at all- takes place at output coils.

                          Even if you do not collapse field(s) by keeping positive feed at all time...whenever currents RAMPS DOWN ABRUPTLY, there would be a coil-field response-reaction of some sort of transient reversed spike.

                          Actually, these transient currents are the ones who actually reduce when output is loaded, on my set up, while almost no change at input from source, and that goes to V & A (Watts)

                          An interesting thing I have noticed on this tests...is that while no load, the exciting fields keep vibrating strongly according to frequency, and even with just ONE PULSE, I get sparks here...and as soon as I add a load...or short output circuit with amp meter to measure full amps at max surge...the whole thing stops vibrating and becomes almost a SOLID Magnetized assembly...no more vibrations....and Sparks reduce to almost zero.

                          Figuera did not have any Solid State electronics at his time...but a commutated brush between resistors...and that MUST HAVE DONE HIGH SPARKING...in between transitions...Sparks mean Spikes, reversed flows, and transient currents...it is simple...no sparks, no transients...no output.

                          Again, and as you wrote...This is my opinion and nothing more...and so I could be wrong...


                          Regards


                          Ufopolitics
                          Last edited by Ufopolitics; 07-07-2017, 12:42 PM.
                          Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                          Comment


                          • aether

                            Originally posted by citfta View Post
                            Well Elcheapo, That is disappointing. I had hopes that with your switching system we might see some evidence the Figuera device was real. But it appears there is more to it than meets the eye or maybe nothing at all.

                            I am guessing that you have tried it with other current values. I am wondering if the current was high enough to not allow the secondary to actually see any changes. Maybe a lower value like a total of 5 amps for the two primaries. Just a thought.

                            I still think your circuit is a great design and certainly worth keeping or at least knowing about. Fine job on it. Thanks for sharing.

                            Respectfully,
                            Carroll
                            Sorry to disappoint you carroll , but just look at it from the positive side.
                            With this circuit I have proven to myself (no one else) that I can get a strongly changing magnetic field without any lenz effect.
                            We all have to change our way of thinking as sometimes conventional
                            electronics just don't fit in with these new concepts.
                            We should be asking ourselves "where is this free energy coming from?"
                            Well in my humble opinion ALL electricity comes from the aether.
                            So now we just have to figure out a way for this magnetic field to induce
                            itself into the coil which will automatically access the aether like all electric generators do.
                            I am also working on another project called "vortexing the aether" where
                            they use 4 coils set up in a circle and pulse them individually clockwise
                            to get a rotating magnetic field.
                            Maybe this is all we need for this Figueras device.

                            Regards

                            Elcheapo

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by Ufopolitics View Post
                              Thanks Elcheapo,

                              That makes it clear the Unit config.




                              IMHO, I believe 12 Volts is too small pressure to fully drive such amp value. And what happens here is you get a very strong field(s), but incapable to move/displace around iron cores with enough spatial pressure(s).

                              I have written before about this scenario...if your resistance at coils is too low, amps got no problem to flow, BUT, Voltage remains also too low, field becomes almost static, because of no voltage pressure movement, due to almost no voltage difference between coils nodes or terminals.



                              If we alter resistance during operation, NOT only amps will fluctuate, but also voltage, tension...we could resume that as wattage (AmpsXVolts) at coil.



                              No matter what you do...If Magnetic Fields Changes...there would be induction EMF at Output.




                              Right now I have BOTH Coils for the Exciter built into one core, and they are Bifilar Wound (meaning no two separate facing coils/cores)...I am driving just ONE Field with just one square pulse to ONE of the Coil Circuits, while the second Field comes from a looped LC Tank with AC Caps...this mirrors the main exciting Field PLUS a Reversed Polarity Field...for the "price of one"...

                              I have also written that it is a must to have transient (spikes) currents from either one of the two Fields...and if I get protecting diodes...no induction -at all- takes place at output coils.

                              Even if you do not collapse field(s) by keeping positive feed at all time...whenever currents RAMPS DOWN ABRUPTLY, there would be a coil-field response-reaction of some sort of transient reversed spike.

                              Actually, these transient currents are the ones who actually reduce when output is loaded, on my set up, while almost no change at input from source, and that goes to V & A (Watts)

                              An interesting thing I have noticed on this tests...is that while no load, the exciting fields keep vibrating strongly according to frequency, and even with just ONE PULSE, I get sparks here...and as soon as I add a load...or short output circuit with amp meter to measure full amps at max surge...the whole thing stops vibrating and becomes almost a SOLID Magnetized assembly...no more vibrations....and Sparks reduce to almost zero.

                              Figuera did not have any Solid State electronics at his time...but a commutated brush between resistors...and that MUST HAVE DONE HIGH SPARKING...in between transitions...Sparks mean Spikes, reversed flows, and transient currents...it is simple...no sparks, no transients...no output.

                              Again, and as you wrote...This is my opinion and nothing more...and so I could be wrong...


                              Regards


                              Ufopolitics
                              You say my 12 volt is too small. So if I jack it up to your 36volt level
                              total power consumption would go up also, from 144 watts to 432 watts.
                              What we're trying to do here is to increase our output power and not increase the input power.
                              So maybe what you mean is I should jack up my voltage to 36volts and cut my maximum amperage down to 4 amps to give me the same input power. So goodbye to a strongly changing magnetic field.
                              You are saying the voltage is too low to be able to move the magnetic field around. Well wherever did you read that a higher voltage will move a magnetic field. I'd like to see that article.

                              Your concept of voltage is out of kilter. Voltage is a pressure, as you say
                              but it only serves to get amperage up to your required level, no more.
                              There are circuits of course that require HV operation, but this is not one of them.
                              A strong magnetic field is totally dependent on higher amperage only. The voltage is there only to get that higher amperage and no more.

                              And yes you're right when saying that varying the resistance on your setup
                              will vary the voltage as well as the amps.
                              You say "If magnetic fields change there would be induction emf at output."

                              No, you're wrong on that as I've already tried it on my circuit.
                              I have a 20 amp meter in series with the main 12 volt line and when set up for 12 amps there is no variation whatsoever on the meter. A volt-meter
                              shows no variation as well. Tried 60hz and 400hz: same thing.
                              And that is why my output coil shows zero volts.

                              A couple of questions:
                              Do you believe that the total amperage between the 2 coils should always
                              remain the same?
                              Where do YOU think the extra energy is coming from.

                              Regards
                              Elcheapo

                              Comment


                              • good find

                                To all:

                                Well I think maybe I've found a solution to my problem.
                                While going through some old postings, I found this #818 one by hanon saying:

                                "Basically this user is proposing to use also like poles facing each other (in repulsion) in the motionless 1902 patent. As the magnetic field crash in the central zone between electromagnets he suggests to place TWO induced coils. One at each side in order to capture all the magnetic lines which go to one and to the other side.

                                If you just use one induced coil the resulting induction will be NULL because one part of the coil is induced in the opposed direction to the other part."

                                That sounds exactly like my situation. Thanks to hanon as a very good find.
                                Unfortunately, I blew a couple of my mosfets by wrongly setting up the circuit, so I have to wait while I order some more to continue on and try using Two induced coils.

                                At my age of 84 my only real concern for energy is to be able to walk the 2 blocks to the post office and back.

                                But for all you young fellows and lurkers out there who want free energy, get busy and build a decent control circuit to try out the many dozens of ways to experiment with this thing.

                                Good luck to all.

                                Elcheapo

                                Comment

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