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Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera

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  • Details from the patents

    Distance between coils:

    Patent from 1902: " Several electromagnets are arranged opposing each other, and their opposite pole faces separated by a small distance."

    Patent from 1908:" ..there is no need to make them round, nor leave any space between one and the other."

    Placement of coils:

    Patent from 1902: "In the empty space remaining between the pole faces of the electromagnets of these two series, the induced wire passes"

    Patent from 1908: "characterized by two series of electromagnets that form the inductor circuit, between whose poles run the properly placed reels of the induced.". " ...Between their poles is located the induced circuit represented by the line “y” (small)"

    For me it is clear that, according to the patents, the inductor coils must be placed one in front of the other, and at a small distance, and between them the induced circuit should be "properly" placed, which does not resemble a transformer at all.

    I have noted that in the drawing included in the 1908 patent the induced coil (or wire) called "y" has the input and output wires drawn together as a single wire. It is a bit strange because the expected sketch for a normal coil is that the input and output wire should be in opposite sides. Could it be a different kind of wiring for this coil (or circuit as called Mr. Figuera)? Any idea? I have no idea how the correct design should be.

    Comment


    • I have a feeling that y series of electromagnets are connected in parallel for higher current, while generating coils are connected in series which is almost sure because of single wire on schematic passed from one coil to the other.
      I wonder if there is any chronicle of Canary Island where we could find a photograph of Clemente Figurea and his "generador" ? In one spanish article there was a photograph of Figuera, so expectation of more is resonable, right ?

      Comment


      • Originally posted by hanon1492 View Post
        Distance between coils:

        Patent from 1902: " Several electromagnets are arranged opposing each other, and their opposite pole faces separated by a small distance."

        Patent from 1908:" ..there is no need to make them round, nor leave any space between one and the other."

        Placement of coils:

        Patent from 1902: "In the empty space remaining between the pole faces of the electromagnets of these two series, the induced wire passes"

        Patent from 1908: "characterized by two series of electromagnets that form the inductor circuit, between whose poles run the properly placed reels of the induced.". " ...Between their poles is located the induced circuit represented by the line “y” (small)"

        For me it is clear that, according to the patents, the inductor coils must be placed one in front of the other, and at a small distance, and between them the induced circuit should be "properly" placed, which does not resemble a transformer at all.

        I have noted that in the drawing included in the 1908 patent the induced coil (or wire) called "y" has the input and output wires drawn together as a single wire. It is a bit strange because the expected sketch for a normal coil is that the input and output wire should be in opposite sides. Could it be a different kind of wiring for this coil (or circuit as called Mr. Figuera)? Any idea? I have no idea how the correct design should be.
        Run some test with magnets and wire and this is what you will find

        Flux x1.2.jpg

        You are wright THIS IS NOT A TRANSFORMER!!!!! IT IS A GENERATOR!!
        It can only be understood when you look at it as a generator.
        Last edited by rosehillworks; 11-25-2012, 08:34 PM.
        William Reed

        Comment


        • Can anyone draw actual coil that is described in patent, do we have 100% data needed to replicate coil itself.
          Yes we can use many driving methods, coil itself could be mystery?

          Only original patent image I have seen here is square shaped coils , not drawin in 3D, hmm

          Comment


          • Update 2

            I have finished building the electromagnets. The iron cores are separated with a paper thin cardboard for a minimum separation distance between the cores. The results are very encouraging. I was able to get induce voltages of 1:1 and 1:2 when using an AC voltage source. Of course, if primary cross talking occurs, the gap will have to be larger.

            Notice that I built the coils with intermediate taps. The data is

            Primary coils:
            Wire gauge: #16 AWG
            Taps: 215, 415, and 515 turns

            Secondary coil:
            Wire gauge: #12 AWG
            Taps: 115 and 219 turns

            See photo here
            Re-Inventing The Wheel-Part1-Clemente_Figuera-THE INFINITE ENERGY MACHINE


            Next, I will be working on the circuit use to drive the primary coils.

            Wonju
            Last edited by wonju; 11-25-2012, 11:21 PM.

            Comment


            • @Wonju.

              Looks pretty solid, nice work!
              Try my simple arduino/2 mosfet/2 shottky, PWM driver it won't hurt, I promise
              “ THE PERSON WHO SAYS IT CANNOT BE DONE SHOULD NOT INTERRUPT THE PERSON DOING IT ! ”

              Comment


              • Originally posted by grizli View Post
                Can anyone draw actual coil that is described in patent, do we have 100% data needed to replicate coil itself.
                Yes we can use many driving methods, coil itself could be mystery?

                Only original patent image I have seen here is square shaped coils , not drawin in 3D, hmm
                This is in reference to the 1902 patent. This is just the way I see it.
                I hope this helps.

                Genenrator 1.jpg
                William Reed

                Comment


                • Originally posted by rosehillworks View Post
                  This is in reference to the 1902 patent. This is just the way I see it.
                  I hope this helps.

                  [ATTACH]12504[/ATTACH]
                  This is something completely diffeent from for example Kelly pdf .

                  Comment


                  • Originally posted by grizli View Post
                    This is something completely diffeent from for example Kelly pdf .
                    There are two options: or try to replicate Mr. Figuera´s patents; or try to replicate the variation of the patent applying the supposed analogy to a transformer.

                    Why don´t we all try to start just by replicating the patents word by word? Let´s see the results and, maybe, later on we could try different experiments. I´m afraid that some people are going to step 2 without completing step 1.

                    Regards

                    Comment


                    • A very different ... twist

                      Originally posted by wonju View Post
                      Garrettm4,

                      I visited the following page
                      http://www.energeticforum.com/renewa...dollard-8.html

                      of the “Eric Dollard” thread and read the document with title “Macroscopic Limitations on the applicability of Lenz’s Law in Ferromagnetic Media.” It is an interesting concept but we need to be careful with the results. Have anyone tested this concept? I do have my concerns with this paper. I will list them from least to most important.

                      First, If B is the external magnetic field, the current i shall flow in the opposite direction than the one shown in the paper. Remember that the current i must generate a magnetic field that opposes the external magnetic field B.

                      Second, the paper states the following:
                      “2) If the external magnetic field is pointing in the z-axis as before, but is now decreasing in magnitude, the induced current will produce a magnetic field in the positive z-direction, thus trying to add to the external flux and preventing its decrease in magnitude.”
                      I do not agree with this statement. Just refer to figures 3, 5, and 7 of the paper that I wrote. Figure 5 corresponds to an increasing magnetic field Bp caused by an increasing primary voltage Vp and current Ip for the interval 0 < θ < 90° shown in figure 3. Figure 7 corresponds to a decreasing magnetic field Bp caused by a decreasing primary voltage Vp and current Ip for the interval 90° < θ < 180° shown in figure 3. When the secondary coil is added, the voltage induced Vs will have the same waveform as the voltage Vp and current Ip. There is no sudden change in polarity of the voltage Vs at 90° when the primary magnetic field B starts to decrease.

                      And third, we have to be very careful when we manipulate formulas and obtain weird results. They must be verified with experiments. Tesla once stated that the scientists of his time used mathematical manupulations to put toghether structures that had no relation to reality. In practice, I do not see how a change in permeability can alter the effects of the Lenz’s law. The polarity of the induced voltage in the secondary coil is not a function of the permeability or magnetic characteristics of the core being used. The polarity of the induced votage Vs - and corrent Is - is the same either if you use an iron core or air core. The difference is that the intensity of the magnetic field is much higher for the iron core application.

                      If we do not use common sense, we may end up wasting considerable time and resources.

                      Wonju
                      Wow .. Eric Dollard probably one of the greatest exponents of Tesla alive if not the greatest. I suspect this device is operating in a very Tesla-ish fashion, and Indeed I was going to say across a time Dimension. I now see the term should be “counter space”
                      I tried as best I could to draw your attention to the Magnetic and electrostatic wireless dimension.,
                      added to the current voltage and flux density you are viewing this machine with standard one dimensional dogma in space and time, … Normal
                      I have done my best to write a crude description of the power acceptance aspect of this device
                      but I'm not a boffin type and I don't really have any techie language to press the issues home.
                      Or really explain them properly, I found it excruciatingly difficult to write this pdf and now as I read it I would seem to contradict almost everything each of you is doing for... various reasons.
                      All that being said I have composed this pdf with good intent, I hope you can all read and digest it with the same good humour.
                      https://docs.google.com/file/d/0ByWW...FpaXluREE/edit



                      .
                      Whatever you can do,or dream you can,begin it.Boldness has genius,power and magic in it.Begin it now.

                      Comment


                      • Revision 5

                        I Have Made A Revision To The Document. I Revised The Patent Figure In Accordance With The Comments Made In This Forum. I Also Revised Some Of The Write Up And Figures To Indicate That The Flux And The Voltage Should Be 90 Degrees Out Of Phase. The Fundamental Concept Explained In The Document Is Still The Same.

                        It still is a work in progress.

                        Thanks!
                        Wonju
                        Attached Files
                        Last edited by wonju; 11-27-2012, 01:18 AM.

                        Comment


                        • @Wonju

                          I think that you are wrong in your assumptions of '90 degree' phase shift between Vps,Ips of North/South primaries! (As stated earlier in my posts).

                          In your 'revised' document on Fig.21, at the 'M' mark, magnetic fields of both primaries are equal as they should be but their magnitudes at this point should be exactly HALF of their maximum magnitudes but they are not! They are both more like 2/3 of their Bmax!

                          Respectfully

                          kEhYo
                          Last edited by kEhYo77; 11-27-2012, 06:30 AM.
                          “ THE PERSON WHO SAYS IT CANNOT BE DONE SHOULD NOT INTERRUPT THE PERSON DOING IT ! ”

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by rosehillworks View Post
                            This is in reference to the 1902 patent. This is just the way I see it.
                            I hope this helps.

                            [ATTACH]12504[/ATTACH]
                            @rosehillworks, Your sketch is very useful and enlightening, but I have slightly corrected it with the configuration I think it is used in the 1902 patent. I don´t see why you drawn two induced coils wired in opposite directions. I have just put both coils wired in the same direction. If there is any reason to invert the polarity please explain it because I haven´t got your idea
                            Attached Files

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by kEhYo77 View Post
                              @Wonju

                              I think that you are wrong in your assumptions of '90 degree' phase shift between Vps,Ips of North/South primaries! (As stated earlier in my posts).

                              In your 'revised' document on Fig.21, at the 'M' mark, magnetic fields of both primaries are equal as they should be but their magnitudes at this point should be exactly HALF of their maximum magnitudes but they are not! They are both more like 2/3 of their Bmax!

                              Respectfully

                              kEhYo
                              I respect your opinion, but I still think the primary voltages are shifted 90 degrees. As I said before, just trace the voltage of the variable resistor device shown in figure 15. You will see that the voltage waveforms shown in figure 21 are correct. If instead of a linear resistor you use the Figuera's mechanical commutator with lump resistors, you still should get step half sinusoidal voltages shifted 90 degrees. The 90 degree shift is determined by observing that when one primary voltage is maximum, the other is zero or close to zero, which is the definition for a sine-cosine relationship.

                              Thanks,
                              Wonju

                              Comment


                              • @ Wonju

                                Than answer me this:

                                Why in the middle crossing point M, where the commutator is half way on the resistor ladder your current trace does not equal HALF of the maximum current???

                                It is so obvious! Are You a disinfo agent or what?

                                kEhYo
                                Last edited by kEhYo77; 11-27-2012, 12:22 PM.
                                “ THE PERSON WHO SAYS IT CANNOT BE DONE SHOULD NOT INTERRUPT THE PERSON DOING IT ! ”

                                Comment

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