My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[Ufopolitics]

Sending some Rain...

Hi UFO and all, just a quick update with where I am up to.

Have just finished planting the years Garlic crop, the rows are 100mt long and I have planted 28 rows this season, enclosed pic's.

All the rows are heavily mulched with material harvested, on farm, with my forage harvester, and placed by hand, the seed is also hand planted.

We are in drought here, luckily I have an endless water supply from an underground bore, and can run a small irrigator 24/7 if needed.
Only trouble is the energy cost to run it,( about $30.00 / night AUD.)

Have just planted yesterday my Wheat crop, on the back of 8mm or rain, it's very late, almost outside the planting window, so fingers crossed.

Now it's just a matter of a bit of catch up work and hopefully I will have some time to wind my all north MAG3 rotor.

Cheers Everyone, Cornboy.

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

Hello Cornboy,

Nice pictures!

I wish I could send you some Grey Clouds ...We are getting swamped here with so much rain, day and night!!...


Great, I see MAG3 coming in the show pretty soon then!!


Kind Regards Friend


Ufopolitics

[Midaztouch]

Hi DadHav

UFO wrote,

John, You have been away from this Thread for a while now...I don't know if you have been looking at it from an outsider end either...but, based on your comments about my Machines draining High Amperage...Those are "Past News" John...and I remember you did reply here when I was disclosing my New All North Winding Type...and I loaded my Comparison Video Against my own previous creation...the North-South Pairs Type on this VIDEO...

You will be surprised what amount of Amperage this Machine draws when running in this kind of set up...


Ufopolitics

Have you had a chance to analyze the NS -vs- all North video? I/We have drawn a lot of conclusions based on this testing. It's the same gauge wire and # of turns. This is why it was said that the all north winding creates a totally different machine. Do you have some ideas about the lower power consumption and the increase RPMs? Also, your thoughts on, why? would the generator action be more defined, would be greatly appreciated.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[DadHav]

Hi DadHav





Have you had a chance to analyze the NS -vs- all North video? I/We have drawn a lot of conclusions based on this testing. It's the same gauge wire and # of turns. This is why it was said that the all north winding creates a totally different machine. Do you have some ideas about the lower power consumption and the increase RPMs? Also, your thoughts on, why? would the generator action be more defined, would be greatly appreciated.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Hello Richie thanks for inviting me to offer an opinion. First of all let me answer by asking some questions again.
Is the all north wind the same as when some of us made a mistake interpreting the winding diagram at the beginning of all this? Thats interesting if it's the case. OK what did I see in the video. Please correct me anyone if I'm wrong.
1 An improved winding on the standard RS setup.
2 The test connection was putting the two coil sets in series which dropped the KV of the motor and as a result the speed decrease by about half but the torque probably almost doubled.
3 The automotive bulb was attached to the wires on one side of the motor and the jumper on the front or back end wire lugs.
We all could see what the test results where. The tests seem to show a motor that runs better with new wind.
OK because the results looked interesting I took my old RS motor with the old wind and made the same tests for myself. I didn't have a bulb as big as yours but I had a 12 volt automotive panel light. This bulb draws about 210 ma at 9 volts. Yours in the movie used about 600 ma not 60 ma as you said if I'm not wrong. I'm sure you just had a vocal typo on that though. Here's a few readings I made through the test.
At 9 volts the motor ran at 14,150 RPM with no bulb load and used 420 ma current draw.
When I attached the bulb as I think you had it in the video the current draw went up to 610 ma. Note the difference in the increase is almost the same as what is seen when the bulb is connected directly to 9 volts without the motor.
Next the RPM check almost didn't change, it measured 14,136 but there is some slight fluctuation in my motor performance because I haven't cleaned the commutator in a long time.
An amp and voltage reading at the bulb showed 8.89 volts across the filament and a current draw of 209 ma.
My conclusion to this test was I duplicated UFO's test pretty close with very similar results. Remember the motor does not have the all north wind.
I had a theory in my mind about this test before even starting so to work on my own idea of what was happening I took two radio shack motors that are unmodified and attached them together with rubber tubing. I connect the motors in series and put the same bulb in the appropriate place and the bulb lit without the motors changing speed. The bulb wasn't as bright because of the resistance in the coil of a motor having twice the copper in the winding.
Well I could be totally wrong about everything I've done and will take it like a man when you explain it. I didn't see a drawing of your experiment with the bulb but what I picture is a circuit on one side of the motor that is in series and made up of the battery, one of the two coils and the bulb. I might miss my guess but I think if you took the magnets out of the motor and it wasn't turning that the bulb would light the same as being on 9 volts, of course with the exception of the drop in voltage going across the winding. Maybe 1.3 ohms or something? I don't think the motor running has any significant effect on the bulb lighting. I'll be looking forward to your explanation.

[Midaztouch]

Hello Richie thanks for inviting me to offer an opinion. First of all let me answer by asking some questions again.
Is the all north wind the same as when some of us made a mistake interpreting the winding diagram at the beginning of all this?

Hi Dadhav

Thank you for accepting my invitation. I hope that you & your family plus the kids(dogs) had a great time at the lake.

From what I recall, the posts and the replication videos in the past, do not apply to this all north winding. Some replicators in the past were having trouble setting the timing. That gave low motor performance/inaccurate data.

OK what did I see in the video. Please correct me anyone if I'm wrong.

1. An improved winding on the standard RS setup.

2. The test connection was putting the two coil sets in series which dropped the KV of the motor and as a result the speed decrease by about half but the torque probably almost doubled.

3. The automotive bulb was attached to the wires on one side of the motor and the jumper on the front or back end wire lugs.
We all could see what the test results where. The tests seem to show a motor that runs better with new wind.

Yes, that was established in https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=diY96XR76Fg

Also in this vid was when we first started to get smooth clear readings from the generator output. It showed what you put in is what you got out, about 1:1 ratio. This is very important because it leads us to the four stator motors/generators. The four stators will have one input and 3 outputs. By having 3 outputs do you think that the amp draw will increase or will be tripled??

OK because the results looked interesting I took my old RS motor with the old wind and made the same tests for myself. I didn't have a bulb as big as yours but I had a 12 volt automotive panel light. This bulb draws about 210 ma at 9 volts. Yours in the movie used about 600 ma not 60 ma as you said if I'm not wrong. I'm sure you just had a vocal typo on that though.

Yes about 600ma is correct

Here's a few readings I made through the test.
At 9 volts the motor ran at 14,150 RPM with no bulb load and used 420 ma current draw.
When I attached the bulb as I think you had it in the video the current draw went up to 610 ma. Note the difference in the increase is almost the same as what is seen when the bulb is connected directly to 9 volts without the motor.
Next the RPM check almost didn't change, it measured 14,136 but there is some slight fluctuation in my motor performance because I haven't cleaned the commutator in a long time.

Do you think that if you had a stronger bulb the RPMs would have increased, stayed the same or decreased?

An amp and voltage reading at the bulb showed 8.89 volts across the filament and a current draw of 209 ma.
My conclusion to this test was I duplicated UFO's test pretty close with very similar results. Remember the motor does not have the all north wind.
I had a theory in my mind about this test before even starting so to work on my own idea of what was happening I took two radio shack motors that are unmodified and attached them together with rubber tubing. I connect the motors in series and put the same bulb in the appropriate place and the bulb lit without the motors changing speed. The bulb wasn't as bright because of the resistance in the coil of a motor having twice the copper in the winding.

What I gather from this statement is that the RS NS should do similar to the all North.

Well I could be totally wrong about everything I've done and will take it like a man when you explain it.

John, I invited you here! I assure you that no one from my team will verbally abuse you and/or attack you! We are all here for the truth. We are at a serious point with our testing. You are a retired CHEIF electrical engineer. Your time is very valuable for us at this juncture.

I didn't see a drawing of your experiment with the bulb but what I picture is a circuit on one side of the motor that is in series and made up of the battery, one of the two coils and the bulb.

@Team, please provide John a diagram.

I might miss my guess but I think if you took the magnets out of the motor and it wasn't turning that the bulb would light the same as being on 9 volts, of course with the exception of the drop in voltage going across the winding. Maybe 1.3 ohms or something? I don't think the motor running has any significant effect on the bulb lighting. I'll be looking forward to your explanation.

Dadhav, again thank you. If you have a little more time, could you expand how or why the energy consumption drops with the all north winding? ... Below, I have stated my opinion/scientific guess why the drop in energy consumption.

After the NS vs All north, testing was done adding super caps https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-Afl9m...0YnD2b5zasXXng. Any takers to have constructive dialogue with me on the super caps vid? If possible, I would like to talk to Russ.

@All, One thing that stands out the most for me is that the energy consumption versus the two motors is drastic. From my experience, the way that the coil magnetic fields and the stator fields interact are completely different from RS 5pole NS and the All North RS 5pole, A1 Mo-Gen. In the A1 Mo-Gen the electrons are not impeded in anyway. It gives you a smooth express electron flow. I believe that this is why the energy consumption drops and the RPMs are increased with the A1 Mo-Gen compared at the same wattage as an off the shelf unmodified RS motor and modified RS north/South motor. What are your thoughts?

For me, I'm all about the overall system performance, OSP. I'm looking for a system that has a lower energy consumption with and without an electrical/mechanical load = more efficient/more range less batteries... A motor that does not overheat = no need for a cooling system for the motor/no extra weight. Also, an improvement over regenerative braking = charging while driving is less weight. Less parts without compromising performance gives you better quality control, that leads to better reliability. Ultimately giving an overall higher customer satisfaction. Less over all weight and dollar$ for dollar$ are part of this equation.

OSP is the key. There is no need to bump heads about over unity. At this moment, I'm focused in on, available off the shelf technology VS an improvement, the A1 Mo-Gen... Is the torque and increased RPMs in the A1 Mo-Gen competitive? Is the A1 Mo-Gen a viable alternative over current technology? This is my current dogma.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Ps. Today was my first day at the beach this year. My family and I had a great time! Enjoy!!!

[DadHav]

Hi Dadhav

Thank you for accepting my invitation. I hope that you & your family plus the kids(dogs) had a great time at the lake.

From what I recall, the posts and the replication videos in the past, do not apply to this all north winding. Some replicators in the past were having trouble setting the timing. That gave low motor performance/inaccurate data.




Yes, that was established in https://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=...&v=diY96XR76Fg

Also in this vid was when we first started to get smooth clear readings from the generator output. It showed what you put in is what you got out, about 1:1 ratio. This is very important because it leads us to the four stator motors/generators. The four stators will have one input and 3 outputs. By having 3 outputs do you think that the amp draw will increase or will be tripled??


Yes about 600ma is correctDo you think that if you had a stronger bulb the RPMs would have increased, stayed the same or decreased?

What I gather from this statement is that the RS NS should do similar to the all North.


John, I invited you here! I assure you that no one from my team will verbally abuse you and/or attack you! We are all here for the truth. We are at a serious point with our testing. You are a retired CHEIF electrical engineer. Your time is very valuable for us at this juncture.

@Team, please provide John a diagram.



Dadhav, again thank you. If you have a little more time, could you expand how or why the energy consumption drops with the all north winding? ... Below, I have stated my opinion/scientific guess why the drop in energy consumption.

After the NS vs All north, testing was done adding super caps https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-Afl9m...0YnD2b5zasXXng. Any takers to have constructive dialogue with me on the super caps vid? If possible, I would like to talk to Russ.

@All, One thing that stands out the most for me is that the energy consumption versus the two motors is drastic. From my experience, the way that the coil magnetic fields and the stator fields interact are completely different from RS 5pole NS and the All North RS 5pole, A1 Mo-Gen. In the A1 Mo-Gen the electrons are not impeded in anyway. It gives you a smooth express electron flow. I believe that this is why the energy consumption drops and the RPMs are increased with the A1 Mo-Gen compared at the same wattage as an off the shelf unmodified RS motor and modified RS north/South motor. What are your thoughts?

For me, I'm all about the overall system performance, OSP. I'm looking for a system that has a lower energy consumption with and without an electrical/mechanical load = more efficient/more range less batteries... A motor that does not overheat = no need for a cooling system for the motor/no extra weight. Also, an improvement over regenerative braking = charging while driving is less weight. Less parts without compromising performance gives you better quality control, that leads to better reliability. Ultimately giving an overall higher customer satisfaction. Less over all weight and dollar$ for dollar$ are part of this equation.

OSP is the key. There is no need to bump heads about over unity. At this moment, I'm focused in on, available off the shelf technology VS an improvement, the A1 Mo-Gen... Is the torque and increased RPMs in the A1 Mo-Gen competitive? Is the A1 Mo-Gen a viable alternative over current technology? This is my current dogma.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Ps. Today was my first day at the beach this year. My family and I had a great time! Enjoy!!!

Richie, there's a lot of information to go through. You have to give me some time to test a few things. Remember anything I said above may not apply if assessed the connections wrong. It would have been easier it UFO would have had a drawing on the video but that's not a complaint. I looked at the other cap charge video and have a few things to say about very basic things to expect when charging batteries and capacitors but I will also try a few tests first. Glad you had a good time at the beach. My family is in their 40's now. Our time at the lake is nothing but work. The deer have eaten everything that was standing just about and it's an acre lot. I'll bet Cornboy knows what it's like to loose things to predators and weather.
Take care
John

[Midaztouch]

Richie, there's a lot of information to go through. You have to give me some time to test a few things. Remember anything I said above may not apply if assessed the connections wrong. It would have been easier it UFO would have had a drawing on the video but that's not a complaint. I looked at the other cap charge video and have a few things to say about very basic things to expect when charging batteries and capacitors but I will also try a few tests first. Glad you had a good time at the beach. My family is in their 40's now. Our time at the lake is nothing but work. The deer have eaten everything that was standing just about and it's an acre lot. I'll bet Cornboy knows what it's like to loose things to predators and weather.
Take care
John

John,

Yes, there has been a lot of information disclosed over the last 4months about the A1 Mo-Gen. Take your time with your testing. It looks like people's kits will start to arrive in a few weeks. I'm here if you need me....

@ Team, a diagram for John please.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[DadHav]

John,

Yes, there has been a lot of information disclosed over the last 4months about the A1 Mo-Gen. Take your time with your testing. It looks like people's kits will start to arrive in a few weeks. I'm here if you need me....

@ Team, a diagram for John please.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Richie, I would just like to address a few things that pertain to the last three videos before anything else. I think one was resolved and for my own experience I'd like to try some things regarding the other two. You don't have to bother anyone to much about a diagram just a simple yes or no to my interpretation is OK. My observation is the bulb was lit with a path from the battery through one of the coils through the filament and then back to the battery. That leaves me with not knowing how anything else is effecting the demonstration as it pertains to just the bulb. I think lighting the bulb is not as important as the motor increase in speed. I have a theory but will hold off until I know I saw the connections right. Of course if people think the bulb is being lit from the generator of the motor then that's a different story. By the way I did use 600 ma of light bulbs and tested the ns rs motor. I had instances that the voltage went above base line and most below. I have to look at what UFO's video looked like at that time of test, but I might have had similar.
John

[Midaztouch]

Richie, I would just like to address a few things that pertain to the last three videos before anything else. I think one was resolved and for my own experience I'd like to try some things regarding the other two. You don't have to bother anyone to much about a diagram just a simple yes or no to my interpretation is OK. My observation is the bulb was lit with a path from the battery through one of the coils through the filament and then back to the battery. That leaves me with not knowing how anything else is effecting the demonstration as it pertains to just the bulb. I think lighting the bulb is not as important as the motor increase in speed. I have a theory but will hold off until I know I saw the connections right. Of course if people think the bulb is being lit from the generator of the motor then that's a different story. By the way I did use 600 ma of light bulbs and tested the ns rs motor. I had instances that the voltage went above base line and most below. I have to look at what UFO's video looked like at that time of test, but I might have had similar.
John

John,

The RS 5pole was just a gimme, it's a precursor for what's in store for future testing. *Personally, I think there is some more meat on that bone for testing...

We are concerned with the
1.) lighting of lights
2.) charging a capacitor banks
3.) strong mechanical output
with the 4 stator A1 Mo-Gen as separate entities, at the same time.

The 5pole A1 Mo-Gen test was just to show what it can do. Leaving you with speculations on what a 4 stator with 1 input and 3 outputs can possibly do.

We are saying that the Generator Action will assist the rotation of the A1 Mo-Gen. Creating more RPMs & torque and gives the capability of charging back the supply. Sounds impossible but this is what we are saying!

The capacitors are to receive the generator charge, just like in regenerative braking and give strong amperes under load with minimum voltage drop. They enhance performance and help optimize efficiency.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[DadHav]

John,

The RS 5pole was just a gimme, it's a precursor for what's in store for future testing. *Personally, I think there is some more meat on that bone for testing...

We are concerned with the
1.) lighting of lights
2.) charging a capacitor banks
3.) strong mechanical output
with the 4 stator A1 Mo-Gen as separate entities, at the same time.

The 5pole A1 Mo-Gen test was just to show what it can do. Leaving you with speculation with what a 4 stator with 1 input and 3 outputs can possibly do.

We are saying that the Generator Action will assist the rotation of the A1 Mo-Gen. Creating more RPMs & torque and gives the capability of charging back the supply. Sounds impossible but this is what we are saying!

The capacitors are to receive the generator charge, just like in regenerative braking and give strong amperes under load with minimum voltage drop. Giving you superior performance.

Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Richie, You invited me to look at a few videos and render an opinion on how accurately the claims matched the material in the video, at least that's what I thought was going on. What you are talking about above is way beyond that request and is still in a world of speculation and lack of testing as far as I'm concerned. I'll just take a small bite of the pie and try to finish what I started, so I have to say. UFO is very smart and just sitting back in my opinion to see what I would have to say about one particular video. The video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4fJEf_WRHg
Did get my attention. First let me tell you what looked like it could be ordinary: When you charge a battery or a capacitor for that matter the charge side experiences a heavy load until the battery or cap starts to charge and eventually toward the end of the charge the load is almost off the source. This easily explains why when you first connect the capacitor that the source voltage drops very low. As the capacitor starts to charge the load decreases and the the motor increases in speed. At this time the source battery has less of a load to support so it starts to recover and go back toward what it's resting voltage was. This all looks like everything is regenerating and recharging but it's just something that can be done, once again, without a motor at all. Now sit down UFO this is where I'll give in a little bit because I've been 100 percent honest all my life. As the capacitor reaches the end of the charge and looks like it's stabilizing the battery also should settle down to what the running requirements are for the little motor. It looked like the batteries where still recovering more than what I would have expected at that point. So could this what we are seeing as the natural recovery of the batteries is actually more like what you are trying to convince us of? Hmm, don't know for sure. Based on the amp reading from your clamp meter I would have to say something isn't right or something is worth further investigation. I tried duplicating the test with the old motor and of course there was no comparison. My battery recovery looked good but get this because I think it's important. When I put the batteries back on the charger I had used 418 ma of their capacity to do one cycle charge of the capacitor that only took about 5 minutes. OK with that being said, I wouldn't be able to dispute what you did in the test unless I rewound my motor and tried the same experiment. A few summary thoughts on this though would be none of the skeptical viewers will believe the content of the video unless you replace the clamp meter with an analog meter. Also a resting voltage is never an accurate measurement of how efficient a test is. Something more believable is to charge the batteries to full to know what the total capacity is then charge them to full again after the experiment and record how many ma it took to fill them back up. So I'm saying there is a large mismatch of readings in the video. Not saying that's bad, but good if you can validate the results. As it looks the motor is running efficiently on just one of the two coil sets, am I wrong about that? Does the effect you demonstrate require the capacitor on the generator side of the motor? If so that's actually good in my opinion. The results of this test indicates you could put this motor in a simple comparative test against a stock motor. Proof of the pudding would be to outperform the stock motor with a simple mechanical test that didn't require instruments. How about two mini Nese's, one with the stock motor and one with the north motor. let them run in a circle and see who can go further. It's just my opinion but after a test video as profound as you just posted, something just as profound as a real life demonstration should follow. The motor and setup is even simpler than a standard R/C car or plane. Show us what you can do. Maybe I can put a larger version in the confetti plane.
Hasn't anyone on the forum rewound their RS motor to confirm these findings?
John

[Midaztouch]

Richie, You invited me to look at a few videos and render an opinion on how accurately the claims matched the material in the video, at least that's what I thought was going on. What you are talking about above is way beyond that request and is still in a world of speculation and lack of testing as far as I'm concerned. I'll just take a small bite of the pie and try to finish what I started, so I have to say. UFO is very smart and just sitting back in my opinion to see what I would have to say about one particular video.

The video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k4fJEf_WRHg
Did get my attention. First let me tell you what looked like it could be ordinary: When you charge a battery or a capacitor for that matter the charge side experiences a heavy load until the battery or cap starts to charge and eventually toward the end of the charge the load is almost off the source. This easily explains why when you first connect the capacitor that the source voltage drops very low. As the capacitor starts to charge the load decreases and the the motor increases in speed. At this time the source battery has less of a load to support so it starts to recover and go back toward what it's resting voltage was. This all looks like everything is regenerating and recharging but it's just something that can be done, once again, without a motor at all.

Now sit down UFO this is where I'll give in a little bit because I've been 100 percent honest all my life. As the capacitor reaches the end of the charge and looks like it's stabilizing the battery also should settle down to what the running requirements are for the little motor. It looked like the batteries where still recovering more than what I would have expected at that point. So could this what we are seeing as the natural recovery of the batteries is actually more like what you are trying to convince us of? Hmm, don't know for sure. Based on the amp reading from your clamp meter I would have to say something isn't right or something is worth further investigation. I tried duplicating the test with the old motor and of course there was no comparison. My battery recovery looked good but get this because I think it's important. When I put the batteries back on the charger I had used 418 ma of their capacity to do one cycle charge of the capacitor that only took about 5 minutes. OK with that being said, I wouldn't be able to dispute what you did in the test unless I rewound my motor and tried the same experiment. A few summary thoughts on this though would be none of the skeptical viewers will believe the content of the video unless you replace the clamp meter with an analog meter. Also a resting voltage is never an accurate measurement of how efficient a test is. Something more believable is to charge the batteries to full to know what the total capacity is then charge them to full again after the experiment and record how many ma it took to fill them back up. So I'm saying there is a large mismatch of readings in the video. Not saying that's bad, but good if you can validate the results. As it looks the motor is running efficiently on just one of the two coil sets, am I wrong about that? Does the effect you demonstrate require the capacitor on the generator side of the motor? If so that's actually good in my opinion. The results of this test indicates you could put this motor in a simple comparative test against a stock motor. Proof of the pudding would be to outperform the stock motor with a simple mechanical test that didn't require instruments.

How about two mini Nese's, one with the stock motor and one with the north motor. let them run in a circle and see who can go further. It's just my opinion but after a test video as profound as you just posted, something just as profound as a real life demonstration should follow. The motor and setup is even simpler than a standard R/C car or plane. Show us what you can do. Maybe I can put a larger version in the confetti plane.

Hasn't anyone on the forum rewound their RS motor to confirm these findings?
John

John,
I think your opinion is needed at this point. I personally think, you ask the tuff questions and present testing parameters that are fair.

When we had bad motor testing results on the dynamometer with the Imperial 56pole = NO GO(NG)! That was a huge blow! We had to start all over again from the 3pole. All of the original RS north/south asymmetric 5pole replicators have been silent. So, many replicators confidence must of went down the drain. So, UFO is the only one posting results... Major humble pie

For me the North/South asymmetric motor was the logical first step and was necessary. It worked but its not for Asymmetric motors! Some of the standard parameters for symmetric motors work but they're not ideal for asymmetric motors. So, the next logical and the only step left is all north. Let's keep this as simple as possible but it is just another electric motor/generator .. But it's all part of development.

UFO you owe it to the readers, past replicators and me to adhere to John's testing requests. John has some validity in his thought process. I think its fair. Plus, we have weeks before the Imperial kits start to arrive.

Everyone put your egos to the side and Let's get back to the basics and have some fun, together.

In the sprit of fun, I propose a bet....

If the symmetric motor wins, my team will post " Dadhav/John is the best CHEIF Electrical Engineer in the World!" for all to see on this thread.

If we win, John, you have to replicate all of our experiments and post your results here... And all credit goes to UFO on your YouTube channel!

Rule question for the bet:
1.)Since the A1 Mo-Gen can recycle energy, can we use that power also?
2.)Can we use super caps?
3.)Other rules to be added???
4.)Amendments to the bet?
5.)Anyone else wants part of this bet?

John and UFO Engineering/UFO, do we have a bet!?

The stakes are high! Will the A1 Mo-Gen win or do Symmetric motors still reigns supreme!?


Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[Zardox]

For John

I did wind a 5 pole Goldmine motor. However I used heavier gage wire than UFO suggested. Even though I never finished getting the timing set right the motor ran very good and I connected a stock motor from a cordless weed wacker to it as a load and a second generator output. The way I contructed the motor was not very good and the rotor caught and is now locked up. Because of circumstances at this time I have not been able to get back to it yet. What I can say is that compared to the RS motor I had built earlier (dual pentagon) this motor seemed to run a lot cooler and also had a higher return voltage from the output coils. Because of my poor build quality I don't feel this was a good comparison. I do have a few more of these motors and I hope to make a better one when I can get back to it.
Probably not much help but I do feel that that all north winding does have a great potential.

[iankoglin]

I did wind a 5 pole Goldmine motor. However I used heavier gage wire than UFO suggested. Even though I never finished getting the timing set right the motor ran very good and I connected a stock motor from a cordless weed wacker to it as a load and a second generator output. The way I contructed the motor was not very good and the rotor caught and is now locked up. Because of circumstances at this time I have not been able to get back to it yet. What I can say is that compared to the RS motor I had built earlier (dual pentagon) this motor seemed to run a lot cooler and also had a higher return voltage from the output coils. Because of my poor build quality I don't feel this was a good comparison. I do have a few more of these motors and I hope to make a better one when I can get back to it.
Probably not much help but I do feel that that all north winding does have a great potential.

G'day Zardox
Why did it lock up?
Even if you have the wire wound very tight if you do not have hedges secured the wire can move even just a little bit out of the slot and jam the rotor
This is the reason to take time and wind each wind very tight you need to pull tight at every half turn

I hope this is of some help
Kindest Regards

[DadHav]

John,
I think your opinion is needed at this point. I personally think, you ask the tuff questions and present testing parameters that are fair.

When we had bad motor testing results on the dynamometer with the Imperial 56pole = NO GO(NG)! That was a huge blow! We had to start all over again from the 3pole. All of the original RS north/south asymmetric 5pole replicators have been silent. So, many replicators confidence must of went down the drain. So, UFO is the only one posting results... Major humble pie

For me the North/South asymmetric motor was the logical first step and was necessary. It worked but its not for Asymmetric motors! Some of the standard parameters for symmetric motors work but they're not ideal for asymmetric motors. So, the next logical and the only step left is all north. Let's keep this as simple as possible but it is just another electric motor/generator .. But it's all part of development.

UFO you owe it to the readers, past replicators and me to adhere to John's testing requests. John has some validity in his thought process. I think its fair. Plus, we have weeks before the Imperial kits start to arrive.

Everyone put your egos to the side and Let's get back to the basics and have some fun, together.

In the sprit of fun, I propose a bet....

If the symmetric motor wins, my team will post " Dadhav/John is the best CHEIF Electrical Engineer in the World!" for all to see on this thread.

If we win, John, you have to replicate all of our experiments and post your results here... And all credit goes to UFO on your YouTube channel!

Rule question for the bet:
1.)Since the A1 Mo-Gen can recycle energy, can we use that power also?
2.)Can we use super caps?
3.)Other rules to be added???
4.)Amendments to the bet?
5.)Anyone else wants part of this bet?

John and UFO Engineering/UFO, do we have a bet!?

The stakes are high! Will the A1 Mo-Gen win or do Symmetric motors still reigns supreme!?


Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Hello Richie, You're a really funny guy but I like your light hearted approach to things. My time is very limited these days. Maybe I'll let you know personally what's going on but I don't actually know how deep I can get into this. I certainly don't want to be the one overlooking tests here and I'm really not familiar with the more sophisticated motors and windings you are working with so I don't really know. Yes, I can understand the disappointment that many must of had on the forum. It's been a long journey and I'm impressed at the fortitude that some have to continue on. It doesn't bring satisfaction to me when I question a test result, there's nothing I'd rather do than have something exciting to agree with. I would be very happy if I could post a refreshing video with a new technology that actually has a real life application. I'd give every bit of credit to UFO because that's where it belongs. My channel has near 7 million views now and the UFO Motor test is actually a very popular video. It would do both of us good if I could do a part 2 with a new look at the motor and some promising results. I feel a need to pursue and understand why there was a 3 amp current reading and low battery drain in UFO's video. If someone want's to remind me of where the most accurate drawing is that represents the motor tested in the video, I might rewind my motor and do some tests. What tests? First I'd test the batteries and cycle them a few times to determine their maximum capacity. If I had the same results as UFO I'd be very happy and surprised. What I was interested in was the way the cap charged for one. The cap was much smaller than the super cap so it charged to near the output rather quickly but then it climbed slowly after that. Here's a test old Bedini guys, why is that? You know. The cap charges from the standard generator effect of the coils but then continues to climb because there is radiant present right? Hmm, well if the batteries are actually accepting a back charge the results might be the same also. What's missing? Some scope shots. I'd try an analog meter in the circuit instead of the clamp meter. If tests where still the same I would take the amp meter out and put a 1 ohm precision resistor in it's place. If there really some sort of energy, voltage or current going in both directions there we would need to see it if we could. Without knowing what it is it's really hard to improve on the effect. With a scope over the 1 ohm resistor you can easily check the current, voltage and possibly get a look at the characteristics of the run / charge cycle. The scope might just show what you would expect to see regarding the energy required to drive the motor but maybe there just might be a spike or something in the opposite polarity. Another good test would be to put a very sensitive sniffer coil on the battery pack itself. Maybe there's a ringing or something else to take note of. Of course, as I mentioned, the test in the video looks like it would be easy to compare some sort of practical results against the stock motor. Is the KV. Strike that is the RPM about the same as the stock motor when ran at the same voltage? or is it still a much higher RPM motor?
Whoa, a contest? Are you crazy? You want to put UFO and Old DadHav in that position? Remember Dad can demonstrate a motor that goes down in current draw when you connect a bulb to the parallel generator coil that's in the same motor. Just saying. I'll tell you though, comparing the watts from the 3 amp current draw against the watts, if you had the number, of the drain at the source might show heavy overunity no? I don't know if I'd take a bet if I felt confident everything was exactly as shown in the video. I'm not sure what you're talking about on the new motors but do you have several, say 4, sets of generator coils on the same armature? Won't each of these coils also run the motor like the little RS motor with two windings? Do you expect you can get the same result as in UFO's video from each of these coil sets?
You give me too much credit Richie, especially as it pertains to my career. Maybe I'll give you the whole story some time. My experience was mostly related to the manufacturing of injection molds, molded parts and downstream automation. You know mold design, CNC programing, designing computerized parts handling machines etc. and really doesn't apply much here.

[DadHav]

Hi, never mind about RS wind information, it's all right at the beginning of UFO's video right? 8 turns of #26 per leg set, both leg sets wound in the same direction this time. I would sure like more turns but will do the same.
J

[Ufopolitics]

No time right now...

Hi, never mind about RS wind information, it's all right at the beginning of UFO's video right? 8 turns of #26 per leg set, both leg sets wound in the same direction this time. I would sure like more turns but will do the same.
J

Hello John,

Don't have much time now to join in this chat...but the latest videos are based on 12Turns, same gauge (26 awg), same config. as shown on video below:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RSs2beNfAP8

I have made them in many different gauge spec's...same config as shown though.

Cheers


Ufopolitics