My Asymmetric Electrodynamic Machines

[sampojo]

Condolences Midaz

If something can go wrong it will. Sorry to hear the news. Second motor will go easier?

[Ufopolitics]

Sorry Midaz...

Hi Kogs & Team

Our motor has been received by Imperial. It was the end of the financial quarter. Also, they are preparing for the release for their spring line up. The head engineer said that they are extremely busy at the moment but has assured me that our motor will be tested when time permits. Remember, our motor has many configurations that need to be tested and it's very time consuming. Please be patient. I will release all information as soon as I get it.

Nessie is coming along well. I think that Nessie should be a beautiful white Swan. Thank you and keep up the good work.


Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

Sorry Midaz,

I had to tell the truth...I know it was completely MY DECISION NOT TO RELEASE THIS INFO when You consulted/asked Me...so it is NOT your fault at all.

So, if there is anyone to blame it is ME, MYSELF AND I.

Regards


Ufopolitics

[Ufopolitics]

Imperial Testing...

G'day Midaz
Any news from Imperial about the testing

Kindest Regards

Kogs still interested

Hello Kogs, Hello to ALL,

Just because it is You Kogs asking this, (As I would have done it also, if ANY OWNER of Imperial Asymmetric Conversion, would have requested this INFO) I am releasing here this Data, and that way not getting Midaz or Dana involved in the middle of this situation.

Midaz wrote to me about this testing and its results.

@ Midaz : you asked me about this testing before and I say not to release the info till other properly attached/connected testings would take place, with a new, fresh Machine...but now, I must release the truth, no matter what, and let you ALL (Owners of Imperial Asymmetric Motors MAINLY*) judge according to your own Imperials that you have already conducted several testings...

Unfortunately, the testing at Imperial Electric was NOT successful at all guys...Imperial Electric made fatal mistakes at Prime Connection Time, please judge it according to the following Data/Mails

Let's review the Mails. (Midaz and Dana, with your permission to share this info in the open)

First mailed letter from Engineer Joe Engle (in charge to conduct Imperial Asymmetric testing) to Midaz:

Hello Richard (Midaz),

We set the motor you sent David up on out dynamometer today, but quickly realized there were 5 black leads and 3 black leads. Several different colors of tape were on these as well as some marking on the end shields, but to play it safe can you get me in touch with the correct person which can tell us where to apply power. I thought these would be grouped into +/-, but that isn’t the case.

We are ready to run this as soon as we can get this question answered.


Thanks,

Joe Engle
Engineering Manager
Imperial Electric Co. / Scott DC Products

Dear Mr. Engle

This is the response from Dr. Higley:


"There are four wires with a piece of tape on them. These are positive. Each pair goes straight thru from commutator to commutator. When looking at the motor from the front end, the set on the upper right is P1. The one on the lower left is the P15 and is run or powered in series or parallel with P1. The other two sets are also powered the similar way and are called P8 ( on the upper left) and P 28>
Hopes this helps , I can sent pictures if needed."

Thank you,

Dana Higley

Hello Dr. Higley,

We connected the wires per the comments below, but the motor will not operate. We gradually increased the voltage, but halted the test when there was no rotation and the amperage continued to increase. Perhaps we misunderstood your instruction. Attached is a photo showing how we wired this. The black lead with the red tape is our positive lead from the supply.

If you could provide photos it would be very helpful.

Now Kogs, and all IMPERIAL ASYMMETRIC owners , take a look at this results running a Motor at NO LOAD...then, please COMPARE according to your own previous testing:

[IMG][/IMG]

Now, the "LOAD TESTING" with a Professional Dynamometer, of course, is expected to be a complete "disaster zone", to the point I am certain they have really messed up this machine and it would need complete rebuilding, before a second test is conducted.

The main mistake We all made here, was to send a completely new technology to a Motor Factory that have, absolutely no idea on how to hook up this type of machines without a FULL DIAGRAM attached ...on how to wire it properly.

Dana and Midaz have done a heck of a job guys...no matter what, they tried without having the means, or the budget to do this properly.

Midaz asked me if I could join them on this Imperial Testing, and I accepted...it was just a bit too late when I received this emails...and the final testing was done. Imperial said there was a lot of sparking and commutator damages.

I believe they had connected wrong -at least- ONE GATE reversed its polarity feed, that is enough to stop this beast and to get very negative results.


*When I wrote

Owners of Imperial Asymmetric Motors MAINLY*

I meant, basically, that to all of the Members on this Thread, who have spent their Money and Time making this Machines, I, mainly, owe an explanation of what is going on here...besides the point that the decision and excellent idea came originally from Midaz (Richard) and Prochiro (Dana)

One of the main reasons I did not wanted this info to be released...is because the "Fatal Attraction" it will create on all the Skeptics and Enemies of Evolution...However, my duties are primarily to any criticism towards My Machines...and I can "handle/take" them all...like I have done in more than One and a half years.

The Second reason was to avoid confusion and disappointment to new members reading this testings...but, again, My duties are first.


Thanks You


Sincerely


Ufopolitics


EDIT 1: @Kogs: I will make a complete Circuit for Nessie, according to my post before to you, just give me some time.

Thanks friend

Ufopolitics

[Midaztouch]

Hi Kogs & Team

Our motor has been received by Imperial. It was the end of the financial quarter. Also, they are preparing for the release for their spring line up. The head engineer said that they are extremely busy at the moment but has assured me that our motor will be tested when time permits. Remember, our motor has many configurations that need to be tested and it's very time consuming. Please be patient. I will release all information as soon as I get it.

Nessie is coming along well. I think that Nessie should be a beautiful white Swan. Thank you and keep up the good work.


Keep it Clean and Green
Midaz

[iankoglin]

G'day Midaz
Any news from Imperial about the testing

Kindest Regards

Kogs still interested

[iankoglin]

G'Day UFO

Yes, I will run single wires off the motor (just like you did with Imperial) and switch the connections at dashboard to get output in series...or separately excited (feed input) each one.
In your 1000W Yes I Do have the same arrangement as in Imperial, meaning four brush/four stators.

Do not forget to Install from the MAIN POSITIVE CABLE TO BATTERIES A KILL SWITCH
I was intending to have a horn button switch that needs to be pressed for the motor to run, if the button is released then the motor will switch off

Make sure that you test ON BENCH FIRST all this connections (if you want to do them, of course) BASICALLY the FIRST GEAR , in order to test your controller stress to "take it" since it will do, reverse very high spikes.

Should I have a large cap between the motor and the Fet controller

You could have different ways to run Nessie with this set up...

1- Using typical Two set of Brushes for Input and Two set for Generator (series connected) that could be sent to a Cap Bank recovery Tank...then back to batteries.
2-Accelerating or Turbo Boosting Nessie by feeding ALL Four Gates based on FOUR SWITCHES as GEARS, ADDING ONE BY ONE at a time...First Gear, Second, Third and Fourth...No Output/Generator
2a- This type of electronic switching/gears will give you different "Modes" to run Nessie, Independently from the Controller Acceleration Feeding from Batteries:

First Gear: On 1st gear you need high torque/high speed to brake inertia forces, and like in a standard vehicle, it is NOT intended to use it for too long...In your case First Gear would be ALL Four Gates at once.

Second Gear: 2nd gear would be Three Gates, while the not fed Gate would be retro-feeding back to source. I would call this Gear the "PASSING GEAR"

Third Gear: Two Gates (what is our typical connection of 2+2) meaning two on Input, Two on Output. And this Gear would be a "STANDARD CRUISING GEAR"

Fourth Gear: would run just ONE GATE...while you are getting Three Gates to feed Cap Bank/Batteries. This Mode would be like an "ECONO DRIVE" and more likely could be used down hills or flat land after reaching a fair speed with previous three gears...

It is just like driving a standard, manually shifting gear vehicle...

Only thing you will need to get...are Four nice and heavy duty High Amperage rated switches, like 50 Amps/48V...BUT Double Throw switches, having basically a Two Position from a middle input to Two connections, Up and Down...so when connecting one the other disconnects...So, when not feeding/Input from Controller, it would connect to Cap Bank.

Switches could also be with a Neutral Position at centre (Three Stages) where NO CONTACT to ANY will just disconnect Gate completely from Input or Output I will chase some up

I would like to do the above and will need help to draw a schematic first
what size cap bank would I need and how do you deliver the energy back into the batteries or perhaps they may be in parallel with the batteries

I could implement the same for my bicycle 250w motor as the original unmodified motor was not quite strong enough to start without pedalling.

AS I am still waiting for the parts for the brakes I did not clean my workshop instead yesterday I set about making the mudguards and to day I am finishing them off (another day of sanding I have no fingerprints now)
Great friend, My video director is looking forward making those videos.


Kindest regards to you my friend


Kogs chomping at the bit

[Ufopolitics]

Wiring Nessie...

G'day UFO
Today I have almost finished Nessie I am waiting for one rear Brake calliper and handbrake handles for the handle bars 1 single for the front brake and one double for the rear wheels brake and also a tensioner to keep the chain wrapped around further on the small sprocket on the motor so the chain will not jump off.

Hello my dear friend Kogs,

Sounds great, you are getting to the final stage...

Now as regards to the testing you have suggested
The motor connections to the 4 brushes is as from the factory 2x 2 parallel with this setup the amps draw is only 0.2 amps and under load is less than 6 amps.
I made a new 6 Mosfet controller the same as I used in my coil pulsing circuit to light the 5 CLF bulbs it was drawing 0.2A @ nominal 36v no load speed was around 1800RPM? (the meter I could not adjust exactly)under load using the 2 sticks of wood was 5A the motor was very hard to slow down.
I have wired up just temporary connection#1 as you suggested so I made sure I understood what you are saying the amps draw was 1 amp and the output was fluctuating between 50v 78v I did not measure the revs
When I put a load by jamming the shaft with 2 sticks of wood the amps jumped off the 10 amp scale the Mosfets were cool still and the motor was cool

That was great test, the point here is that you observe the Voltage out, even using the brushes in parallel at output, it is understood that if you would have them in series, voltages would add even more than that.

Input=36V
Output=50-78 Volts

When you put a mechanical load the amps jumped above 10 amps, that is normal, since you are slowing down by force keeping same feed, and also the amperage would increase for output as well.

You have suggested that I have the generator brushes wired so the 2 generator windings are in series.

Yes, I did suggested that...BUT, You could run single wires off the motor (just like we did with Imperial) and switch the connections at dashboard to get output in series...or separately excited (feed input) each one. Meaning, You DO NOT need to make the series connection INTERNALLY inside Motor.

In your 1000W you have the same arrangement as in Imperial, meaning four brush/four stators.

You could have different ways to run Nessie with this set up...

1- Using typical Two set of Brushes for Input and Two set for Generator (series connected) that could be sent to a Cap Bank recovery Tank...then back to batteries.
2-Accelerating or Turbo Boosting Nessie by feeding ALL Four Gates based on FOUR SWITCHES as GEARS, ADDING ONE BY ONE at a time...First Gear, Second, Third and Fourth...No Output/Generator
2a- This type of electronic switching/gears will give you different "Modes" to run Nessie, Independently from the Controller Acceleration Feeding from Batteries:

First Gear: On 1st gear you need high torque/high speed to brake inertia forces, and like in a standard vehicle, it is NOT intended to use it for too long...In your case First Gear would be ALL Four Gates at once.

Second Gear: 2nd gear would be Three Gates, while the not fed Gate would be retro-feeding back to source. I would call this Gear the "PASSING GEAR"

Third Gear: Two Gates (what is our typical connection of 2+2) meaning two on Input, Two on Output. And this Gear would be a "STANDARD CRUISING GEAR"

Fourth Gear: would run just ONE GATE...while you are getting Three Gates to feed Cap Bank/Batteries. This Mode would be like an "ECONO DRIVE" and more likely could be used down hills or flat land after reaching a fair speed with previous three gears...

It is just like driving a standard, manually shifting gear vehicle...

Only thing you will need to get...are Four nice and heavy duty High Amperage rated switches, like 50 Amps/48V...BUT Double Throw switches, having basically a Two Position from a middle input to Two connections, Up and Down...so when connecting one the other disconnects...So, when not feeding/Input from Controller, it would connect to Cap Bank.

Switches could also be with a Neutral Position at center (Three Stages) where NO CONTACT to ANY will just disconnect Gate completely from Input or Output

ONE MAIN THING KOGS, PLEASE!!

Do not forget to Install from the MAIN POSITIVE CABLE TO BATTERIES A KILL SWITCH...AND make sure you would have VERY EASY access from your driver seat...Remember, when FET's go bad...they normally do it by shorting out Source to Drain...meaning "RUNAWAY DRIVING"...You have N-Channels...so killing must be done by cutting off POSITIVE from Batteries...NOT Negative!

Do not want to hear that Nessie crashed, because of just one faulty FET!!

SECOND: Make sure that you test ON BENCH FIRST all this connections (if you want to do them, of course) BASICALLY the FIRST GEAR , in order to test your controller stress to "take it" since it will do, reverse very high spikes.

I will now clean up my workshop so I can have room for my video producer can get some more practice when she takes some videos of my testing.

Please UFO if you have any comments with regarding the testing please let me know ASAP outlining what testing you would like me to do as I intend to do the serial mod to the motor and then test it I would like to do all the testing in one video perhaps starting before the serial Generator mod if you desire for me to do so.

There is at Cavendish a local town probably 150k away on the 30th of March a "SHOW US YOUR WHEELS & TOYS DAY" its like a Trash and Treasure Swap meet If I have it finished by then I may take Nessie there and show her off.

I thank you for all your time spent to showing what you have discovered and have disclosed to us.
I am anxious to see what you have in store for us in the future I know my self that I would like to build one of the latest designs you have put up for all to see but unfortunately I am quickly running out of $$ I need some paying work to continue these projects.

Kindest Regards to you my friend


Kogs progressing Slowly

Great friend, looking forward to see those videos.


Kind regards


Ufopolitics

[iankoglin]

Hey Kogs,

Beautiful Tricycle!!...A work of Art!...I can tell you do can MASTER wood crafting!

On the TEST#1, I suggested to just do direct/straight feeding from batteries (no pulsing) as shown on Diagram 1, based on a simple switch ON/OFF.

You already did #2 on your Motors.

One question, what controller are you using to run Nessie, and how is your circuit of Input/Generator connected ?

Reason is...I want to help you on this...that is why asking/insisting about Test#1...

I believe you should lay down a whole circuit with switches and all to be in your dashboard or center console...


Regards Dear Friend


Ufopolitics

G'day UFO
Today I have almost finished Nessie I am waiting for one rear Brake calliper and handbrake handles for the handle bars 1 single for the front brake and one double for the rear wheels brake and also a tensioner to keep the chain wrapped around further on the small sprocket on the motor so the chain will not jump off.

Now as regards to the testing you have suggested
The motor connections to the 4 brushes is as from the factory 2x 2 parallel with this setup the amps draw is only 0.2 amps and under load is less than 6 amps.
I made a new 6 Mosfet controller the same as I used in my coil pulsing circuit to light the 5 CLF bulbs it was drawing 0.2A @ nominal 36v no load speed was around 1800RPM? (the meter I could not adjust exactly)under load using the 2 sticks of wood was 5A the motor was very hard to slow down.
I have wired up just temporary connection#1 as you suggested so I made sure I understood what you are saying the amps draw was 1 amp and the output was fluctuating between 50v 78v I did not measure the revs
When I put a load by jamming the shaft with 2 sticks of wood the amps jumped off the 10 amp scale the Mosfets were cool still and the motor was cool

You have suggested that I have the generator brushes wired so the 2 generator windings are in series.

I will now clean up my workshop so I can have room for my video producer can get some more practice when she takes some videos of my testing.

Please UFO if you have any comments with regarding the testing please let me know ASAP outlining what testing you would like me to do as I intend to do the serial mod to the motor and then test it I would like to do all the testing in one video perhaps starting before the serial Generator mod if you desire for me to do so.

There is at Cavendish a local town probably 150k away on the 30th of March a "SHOW US YOUR WHEELS & TOYS DAY" its like a Trash and Treasure Swap meet If I have it finished by then I may take Nessie there and show her off.

I thank you for all your time spent to showing what you have discovered and have disclosed to us.
I am anxious to see what you have in store for us in the future I know my self that I would like to build one of the latest designs you have put up for all to see but unfortunately I am quickly running out of $$ I need some paying work to continue these projects.

Kindest Regards to you my friend


Kogs progressing Slowly

[Ufopolitics]

Great friend!

G'day UFO
I have been Busy nearly finished Nessie. I have finished painting it and now I have to fit the Fan to cool the electronics and take it to the Bike shop for Vanessa the bicycle mechanic to fit and adjust the brakes.

I have to finish making a new 555 6 Mosfet UFO driver to do the tests as you have asked. I still have to set up the Voltage reducer and oscillator to make sure they work properly then fit them into Nessie's Neck.

I am anxious to see it running but I still have to make the Mudguards fit the lights front rear and indicators before I can take it on the road to test. As Yesay the Police chased a say 12 year old kid who was speeding up and down my road with his OFF Road 150cc ? motor bike they did not go fast as there is really no where for him to go but he jumped off his bike and fled through the houses on foot they could not find him

I still have to modify the motor to do these tests I have to connect in series the Gen output. as they are still as they came from the factory.
I will do these tests this coming week and do another Video.

I have also purchased a small unit that gives me the speed and Volts of battery and Klms done here it is here

4 in1 Battery Voltage Speed Pulse Frequency Odometer Voltmeter for Scooter Bike | eBay

I am pleased to spend this money doing this project as after doing the first Tandy motor I could see the advantages of these motors and am so sure that they will work as you have suggested.

Kindest regards and thank you My friend

Kogs almost there

Excellent my friend Kogs!


Glad you are almost finished with Nessie!!...

Looking forward to see all those beauties running fast, as well as the rest of testings to come!!

On the Computerized Digital processor you are getting from EBAY...make sure it comes with the speed sensors as well...I saw quite a few cables there...

Yes friend, They do run very well...and take you much faster than the original symmetric ones...that I guarantee...plus the normal running time they render exceeds expectations...and that is without connecting any "retro-fit" energy output circuitry back into batteries...


Regards Friend


Ufopolitics

[SkyWatcher]

a say 12 year old kid who was speeding up and down my road with his OFF Road 150cc ? motor bike they did not go fast as there is really no where for him to go but he jumped off his bike and fled through the houses on foot they could not find him

now that's the SPIRIT we need more of.
The people own the roads, not these self proclaimed false authority figures.
No harm to anothers body or stuff, then they should all stay at home or go eat some more doughnuts, or actually do something to help others, instead of pretending to be of help and stealing peoples money.
God be with us.
peace love light

[iankoglin]

Kogs Trike Update

Hey Kogs,

Beautiful Tricycle!!...A work of Art!...I can tell you do can MASTER wood crafting!

On the TEST#1, I suggested to just do direct/straight feeding from batteries (no pulsing) as shown on Diagram 1, based on a simple switch ON/OFF.

You already did #2 on your Motors.

One question, what controller are you using to run Nessie, and how is your circuit of Input/Generator connected ?

Reason is...I want to help you on this...that is why asking/insisting about Test#1...

I believe you should lay down a whole circuit with switches and all to be in your dashboard or center console...

Regards Dear Friend

Ufopolitics

G'day UFO
I have been Busy nearly finished Nessie. I have finished painting it and now I have to fit the Fan to cool the electronics and take it to the Bike shop for Vanessa the bicycle mechanic to fit and adjust the brakes.

I have to finish making a new 555 6 Mosfet UFO driver to do the tests as you have asked. I still have to set up the Voltage reducer and oscillator to make sure they work properly then fit them into Nessie's Neck.

I am anxious to see it running but I still have to make the Mudguards fit the lights front rear and indicators before I can take it on the road to test. As Yesterday the Police chased a say 12 year old kid who was speeding up and down my road with his OFF Road 150cc ? motor bike they did not go fast as there is really no where for him to go but he jumped off his bike and fled through the houses on foot they could not find him

I still have to modify the motor to do these tests I have to connect in series the Gen output. as they are still as they came from the factory.
I will do these tests this coming week and do another Video.

I have also purchased a small unit that gives me the speed and Volts of battery and Klms done here it is here

4 in1 Battery Voltage Speed Pulse Frequency Odometer Voltmeter for Scooter Bike | eBay

I am pleased to spend this money doing this project as after doing the first Tandy motor I could see the advantages of these motors and am so sure that they will work as you have suggested.

Kindest regards and thank you My friend

Kogs almost there

[Cornboy 555]

Yep Garry, just don't try getting a suntan in front of your motor.

Cornboy.

[GChilders]

radiant energy

@all
I went through a number of possibilities in my mind and tried to eliminate them one by one. First I thought that the cause could be that the motor was vibrating the stand and causing there to be a break in the beam due to the vibrations. This is why I removed the motor from the stand and then I noticed that when I started the motor the beam was being broken. So then I thought that maybe the cause was the brushes and that I could use the brushes to break the signal in the same way that we use the fan blades. I have a five pole rotor so I divided the rpm formula by five and disconnected the infrared led. This actually worked pretty well until the batteries got a little weak. I have recharged the batteries and will try the experiment again tomorrow. I suspect that radiant energy releases energy in the infrared range and that the photo transistor is picking up these signals when the electromagnetic field is collapsing or it could be rf interference.

Well more tomorrow. Thanks for the input everyone.

Cheers,

Garry

[sampojo]

RE: Childers post 6283

Garry, sounds like some strong RF interference, from the coil BEMF I do imagine, and the Radiant Energy too, but I do think the optocoupler should well isolate the arduino from that in the Monster driver. Better ask for John Stone's opinion. Maybe any unshielded wires on signal pickup are acting like antennas.

[Cornboy 555]

@ Kogs, thanks for those words, i too, have found someone very special, with amazing qualities,ie Kind, Generous etc, she even loves to help with the electrical stuff.

@ Garry, , i fried my Harley's alarm system, 10 ft away, from some early high powered spark gap experiments.

Just remember we are dealing with energy release and multiplication, with brushes as mechanical switches, they always give off noise that will upset, sensitive chip technology, and in the worst case, radio frequencies, that are detectable.

Tachoncatcher, on the 3BGS thread said a good way to absorb these emmisions, is to wind some large flat Tesla bifilar coils and place them around you experiments.

I am not sure how commercial high powered EV brushed motors are dampened, or if they need to be.

Maybe someone else here could enlighten us.

Regards Cornboy.