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  • UFO,

    I set the brushes at the middle of the magnets, not between the magnet ends. I will re-do the tests to check again. I check continuity with an ohmmeter for shorts in the coils to the rotor...nada. The bifilar 30AWG wires give pretty low ohms (.9 ohms). Could that make the heat?

    Thanks for your kind help. I hope everything with you is working out (of course, it always does...)

    Bob

    Comment


    • UFO,

      I almost forgot.

      I blackened the 1/8" rotor shaft and put stripe along it w..ith WhiteOut. NO REFLECTIVE TAPE. Read my lips...NO REFLECTIVE TAPE. Ha, ha, ah. Maybe they'll get it. (?)

      Bob

      Comment


      • Balance Coils?

        Originally posted by bobfrench@fastmail.fm View Post
        UFO,

        I set the brushes at the middle of the magnets, not between the magnet ends. I will re-do the tests to check again. I check continuity with an ohmmeter for shorts in the coils to the rotor...nada. The bifilar 30AWG wires give pretty low ohms (.9 ohms). Could that make the heat?

        Thanks for your kind help. I hope everything with you is working out (of course, it always does...)

        Bob
        Hey Bob,

        Don't think 0.1 is going to make that much difference...to get them hot...
        Did you BALANCE them like I asked you? 8.25' per coil?

        Regards


        Ufopolitics
        Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

        Comment


        • Hello Ufo et all
          Im trying to replicate the dual penta motor from a couple small dc motors I got from discarded hair dryers (dryer fed with AC 220V, but rectified).
          Related to a previus post 1618, I have always been wondering if there is an image of the flux lines in those curved magnets (with/ without the rotor), and also how are these compared to the timeless stator ones.
          Have anyone of you such an image or drawing of it ?
          Another question for UFO is if a cicular halbach array culd be used instead of the usual magnets.
          It would be of much help to better understand., many thanks.
          I am not able to replicate big motors (as Turion or others) because of my critical economic situation, so I have to go as far I can with salvaged parts from trash. therefore I hope this post will not disturb the flow here.
          cheers
          Alvaro

          Comment


          • Bob's motor tests

            Bob did you put more turns on the generator coils than on the motor coils? You need more
            volts out than in so that the battery can be charged.

            Any idea what the watts in/out are?

            Norman

            Comment


            • Originally posted by bobfrench@fastmail.fm View Post
              UFO,

              I almost forgot.

              I blackened the 1/8" rotor shaft and put stripe along it w..ith WhiteOut. NO REFLECTIVE TAPE. Read my lips...NO REFLECTIVE TAPE. Ha, ha, ah. Maybe they'll get it. (?)

              Bob
              ...................

              Comment


              • Halbach Arrays

                Originally posted by interdesign21 View Post
                Hello Ufo et all
                Im trying to replicate the dual penta motor from a couple small dc motors I got from discarded hair dryers (dryer fed with AC 220V, but rectified).
                Related to a previus post 1618, I have always been wondering if there is an image of the flux lines in those curved magnets (with/ without the rotor), and also how are these compared to the timeless stator ones.
                Have anyone of you such an image or drawing of it ?
                Another question for UFO is if a cicular halbach array culd be used instead of the usual magnets.
                It would be of much help to better understand., many thanks.
                I am not able to replicate big motors (as Turion or others) because of my critical economic situation, so I have to go as far I can with salvaged parts from trash. therefore I hope this post will not disturb the flow here.
                cheers
                Alvaro
                Hello Interdesign,

                Ok, lot of questions for a "Debut"...But great questions...

                Im trying to replicate the dual penta motor from a couple small dc motors I got from discarded hair dryers (dryer fed with AC 220V, but rectified).
                Normally Hair Dryers have Universal Motors...yours have permanent magnets at stators?

                Related to a previus post 1618, I have always been wondering if there is an image of the flux lines in those curved magnets (with/ without the rotor), and also how are these compared to the timeless stator ones.
                There should be images of curved magnets...the Pattern just gets more compacted towards the imaginary center that would configure the whole circumference of the complementary other curved magnetic structures...than in a flat magnet pattern...with rotor the lines just get "distorted" based on rotation...
                In the Timeless Stator Wound, the Magnetic Pattern will manifest inside the cylindrical area, dividing it like I described on video...

                Another question for UFO is if a cicular halbach array culd be used instead of the usual magnets.
                [IMG][/IMG]

                Where the arrows are flowing outwards will render a North Pole...and when they are flowing Inwards they deliver a South Pole...therefore K=2 is a Two Pole, K=3 is a Four Pole and K=3 a Six Pole...therefore according to the rotor structure and the dispositions of your coils it should work if arranged according to Stators arrangement...

                Regards


                Ufopolitics
                Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                Comment


                • Still confused...

                  Originally posted by norman6538 View Post
                  Bob did you put more turns on the generator coils than on the motor coils? You need more
                  volts out than in so that the battery can be charged.

                  Any idea what the watts in/out are?

                  Norman

                  Hello Norman,

                  It seems (by your question to Bob) that you are not understanding this Machines yet...

                  Bob did you put more turns on the generator coils than on the motor coils?
                  There are NOT SPECIFIC "Motor Coils" or "Generator Coils" in NONE of this Machines.

                  They ALL SWING/SWAP from Motor to Generator and from Generator to Motor...at all times during performance.

                  Therefore, your question is NOT right as you still do not understand this fact. It is "Impossible" to "Put more turns on one or the other"...since they must have all, the same exact turns per Pairs-Coils.

                  What I was asking Bob, is about compensating the "Y" Pattern, where the bottom Coil of Pair MUST be equal in length of wire than the other at top of "Y", however, they are Both Motor-Generator Coils.

                  Any idea what the watts in/out are?
                  According to My Arrangement, Output Wattage should NOT get that much difference (affected) from Input Wattage, when Coils are getting energized at Input Gate, rotate for nano seconds and Deliver at Output Gates...almost no loss there, the fact that Inductor is rotating within a magnetic field, assist to store the currents, delaying the field collapse to zero for that very minimal range of time.
                  When Machine is under a mechanical load the "Time" of rotation before delivering to Out Gates expands since RPM's decrease...this fact is in benefit of the "Time Off" stage, since it delays storage of charges which get magnified by Induction from the magnetic field of Stators.


                  Regards


                  Ufopolitics
                  Last edited by Ufopolitics; 09-04-2012, 03:33 PM.
                  Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                  Comment


                  • Ok, I must be doing something wrong. My RS dual pentagon motor runs like a champ but with 8.3 volts in I am only getting 6.5 volts on the generator side (still impressive in my book). I took it back apart to check everything and make sure it didn't have any shorts. Everything is good and my Fluke measures 1.8 Ohms per coil pair. I am just using a linear feed at this moment as I still need to build a PMW. It does get a little warm on extended runs but I think that is due to friction. What am I doing wrong or is everything as it should be?

                    Comment


                    • It should be more Output Zardox...

                      Originally posted by Zardox View Post
                      Ok, I must be doing something wrong. My RS dual pentagon motor runs like a champ but with 8.3 volts in I am only getting 6.5 volts on the generator side (still impressive in my book). I took it back apart to check everything and make sure it didn't have any shorts. Everything is good and my Fluke measures 1.8 Ohms per coil pair. I am just using a linear feed at this moment as I still need to build a PMW. It does get a little warm on extended runs but I think that is due to friction. What am I doing wrong or is everything as it should be?

                      Hello Zardox,

                      I am very glad you've got it running great!

                      Now,

                      Ok, I must be doing something wrong. My RS dual pentagon motor runs like a champ but with 8.3 volts in I am only getting 6.5 volts on the generator side (still impressive in my book).
                      Ok question 1: Are You setting brushes as Motor have it from factory?...If answer is Yes...then you are fine.
                      2: Did you balance windings between smaller coils and bigger upper "Y" Coils, meaning having same length of wire? if yes then you are fine.
                      3: Try moving upper-lower brushes a bit...I am pretty sure that a better alignment will increase output. Now to do that you will have to "shave" the plastic tabs from brush casing...in order to rotate them freely...and move them equally towards same direction...however...after getting a better output reading, then move just one side a bit more...and watch it...

                      You should be closer to 8V at output...like 7.0 to 7.5V...(More impressive in your book... )


                      Regards


                      Ufopolitics
                      Last edited by Ufopolitics; 09-04-2012, 01:52 PM.
                      Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                      Comment


                      • Repeating My Post...

                        Originally posted by Ufopolitics View Post
                        Hello to All,

                        Here I wanted to share an specific Adaptor that will fit most Digital Multimeter, it is called a Direct Voltage Adaptor, and is typically used for:



                        [IMG][/IMG]

                        However, the uses go beyond that, and for those familiar with Outboard Engines, basically their Generators Systems, this tool could read the coils output spikes before getting to the Voltage Regulator, in order to diagnose any faulty coil.
                        Marine Outboard Engines have a Bell Housing mounted to the Crankshaft, on the upper section, this bell contains several permanent magnets mounted on its vertical outer wall (Number of Coils-Magnets depending on engine CC Displacement/HP) that rotate facing several respective coils attached to a fixed contouring ring housing...this is the "Generator or Alternator Assembly Fields", from here all coils are connected to the Voltage Regulator Box...So, this Adaptor measures the Coils Raw Output in their "Non Filtered State". It has an Electronic Processor that very accurately measures the True Average Direct Voltage Output.

                        This is a very valuable Tool to measure our Machines Real DC Generating side, since their output is based on Non Linear DC Pulses.

                        The next best Tool to do this accurate measurement would be an Oscilloscope...however, Tool sells for 31.99 USD

                        They will fit most DVM Brands Input for Common and Voltage Terminals Pattern-Distance, without the need of a secondary extension cable. Connection is simple, plug in adaptor to Meter and connect your Probes to the Adaptor output...and read.

                        Some cheaper Digital Multimeter will go "crazy" with My Asymmetric Machines output, and they will keep flashing different range values, at very high-low levels...while other more expensive DVM's will render wrong measurements, since they have built in processor-analyzers-executors, to protect electronic circuitry from high Pulsed DC variable wavelength signals...then we will not obtain a True Reading Value.


                        Any questions, please ask Me, however, I will be downloading soon a video where that tool is shown at Lab work...and compared to my DSO (Digital Storage Oscilloscope) for Tool Accuracy in reading values.


                        Next: A very cheap but very accurate method to measure RPM's...BUT ONLY in My Asymmetrical Machines...


                        Regards to All


                        Ufopolitics

                        Hello to All,

                        I know this tool could be a bit expensive ($32.00 USD) BUT trust me...is worth it...and much cheaper than an Oscilloscope...

                        My Machines (even at linear feed) Output a Pulsed DC Signal...This is a FACT..Now Digital Meters are designed to just show linear DC...NOT Pulsed...so the more expensive a meter is...the better it will cut Pulsed Peaks and render the closest to Linear DC Pattern...and cheaper meters will jump all over...give it a try to verify what am writing is completely true.

                        Now for those with a Scope, set reading at V Top (Flat Upper Wave Reading, not considering spike over flat upper line, which is "V Peak" mode)...and will see what I mean...

                        This Output signal, in order to be used-read properly, it must be processed through a square wave-no loss- electronic compensator that takes wave peaks/pulsed DC. That tool contains that processor.

                        A Condenser (AC Capacitor) parallel to output, will also clean the spikes and rectify-filter to an average which will be OVER INPUT VALUE...However, DVM's still will read below, a bit higher, but still below input...Scope will note that "filtering" in the wave pattern very clear and still read above Input Value.

                        One simple test you all could do...

                        Observe your Meter when you FIRST Connect it...and see it displays for a flash a value above Input..Example: if 12V IN it will flash 15V OUT...and very fast it will "balance out"...every time you do that (switch on-off Meter Connection) it will read the highest peak value first then balance out to a LOWER Value.


                        Another test to PROVE My Machines Output Pulsed Signals...
                        Set the Meter to display Hz/Duty Cycle...to Output and run Machine...it will be displaying in the KHz range, depending on Input...and changing...flashing through different values but VERY CLOSE one from the other.


                        Regards


                        Ufopolitics
                        Last edited by Ufopolitics; 09-04-2012, 03:31 PM.
                        Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                        Comment


                        • thanks

                          Hello UFO
                          Thank you for your kind answer, detailed & precise as always.
                          I know it was not as brilliant for a debut, but youve got to know that Im reading &studying this thread from the begining, and saving every page in a portable storage hard disc. If I do not replicate those big motors, (which Id like) is for budget extreme limitations.

                          The motors Im working with, have perm magnets. (not universal) and came with an AC cap and bridge rectif. soldered at the back. Attached a couple pics.
                          Cheers
                          Alvaro
                          Attached Files

                          Comment


                          • Brilliant...Yes it was

                            Originally posted by interdesign21 View Post
                            Hello UFO
                            Thank you for your kind answer, detailed & precise as always.
                            I know it was not as brilliant for a debut, but youve got to know that Im reading &studying this thread from the begining, and saving every page in a portable storage hard disc. If I do not replicate those big motors, (which Id like) is for budget extreme limitations.

                            The motors Im working with, have perm magnets. (not universal) and came with an AC cap and bridge rectif. soldered at the back. Attached a couple pics.
                            Cheers
                            Alvaro
                            Hello Alvaro

                            Hablas Espaol?

                            Well I never said your Debut was "Not Brilliant"...and as a matter of fact it was brilliant...I just said..."lots of questions", but excellent ones!...

                            I saw your motors and your winding and work look great!...those motors look almost exactly to the Radio Shack ones...the 256 body type.

                            Now, I see you have modified the brushes positioning...and just reminding you that for the Dual Pentagons they go the way they came from factory...or like (- -)...


                            Regards


                            Ufopolitics
                            Principles for the Development of a Complete Mind: Study the science of art. Study the art of science. Develop your senses- especially learn how to see. Realize that everything connects to everything else.― Leonardo da Vinci

                            Comment


                            • sorry, in the pic I showed the stator before assembly, just put both pieces together to show the size.
                              regards

                              Comment


                              • By the way, soy espaol, and I wish my english was better.

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