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  #811 (permalink)  
Old 01-03-2012, 10:52 PM
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Old 01-03-2012, 10:58 PM
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Tesla's Diagram of overground vs underground waves Hetzian/Telluric

Tesla's Diagram of overground vs underground waves Hetzian/Telluric

Note Telluric velocity, a function of angle around the earth, it is a cosecant, infinity at the poles, luminal at the equator. Pi over two is the integral "velocity"


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Old 01-03-2012, 11:20 PM
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Hi Eric, I'm fascinated by the hollow Earth theory.

I would be interested in how you came to your conclusion on the hollow Earth? Was it from your work in Telluric waves?

Thanks for all your work, I'm intently listening to you and respect your hard gained insights. It's rare to hear the truth these days and when it's heard, it rings a bell within those similar souls while scaring those opposed to truth.

The coyote roars and who will listen?



Quote:
Originally Posted by T-rex View Post
How deep should you go? To the center of the earth- but what are you gonna do? (the earth is hollow).
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Old 01-04-2012, 12:35 AM
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These pictures are from a Cosmic Induction Generator, that Eric Dollard built. Everything you see in the pictures was built by Eric's hand, and his assistants: Donald Lockwood of the Integraton and Michael Knotts. It was so named the "Cosmic Induction Generator" because it created "galaxies" through electric induction. (That's why the Farnsworth family adopted Eric)

It was a balanced field generator using Tesla Transformers. A burned out, incandescent light bulb was held in between the dielectric field of the out of phase extra coils. On page 15 of "Condensed Intro to Tesla Transformers" it is labeled the "area of concentrated flux." The out of phase extra coils create the central plane of superimposition from which the galaxies emerge. Everything is golden ratio, five phase fractal.

Comment from Eric accompanies the pictures.


The first picture is a schematic of the setup. It is from page 15 of "Condensed Intro to Tesla Transformers"



This is a blueprint of the coils, all arranged in a line. In the pictures the extra coils are separated, sitting on stands. The diagram is an exact blueprint for the number of turns. The primary details are not easy to see. Only the outside winding of the primary is visible. It was probably 2 or 3 turns, can't remember.



Primary and Secondary Coils:



Power Supply: 10 kw vaccum tube high frequency power supply. 10,000 volts 1 ampere 2500 kilocycles



High Frequency Power supply, tubes missing from their sockets, tubes were 4 Eimac 304-TL pulse triodes from WWII radars EImac 304 TL and 304 TH power triodes represent a most effective device for producing high frequency pulses of extraordinary power



End view of primary and secondary. Note internal spiral windings are the primary. Experimental coil lays on the table



Extra coils are on legs, the primary and secondary coils are in the background. The bulb is held in between the two extra coils.



Note zone of cosmic superimposition, the orange "flamey" region this is where the creation begins. Note directly below it a comet is moving from left to right. Directly below that a streamer changing from violet to red in another cosmic superimposition . Hence a plane of cosmic superimposition passes through the center of the bulb. Here is where the galaxies are born.



Note the fractal pattern on the glass - no one else's Tesla coil does this!



Fractal, golden ratio discharge into counterspace from extra coil. Golly Mr. Wizard why does it look just like Colorado Springs?



The red spot of Jupiter in a burned out incandescent light bulb. The light bulbs were from the L.A. Departent of Water and Power.



All the equipment in the photographs were embezzled by George Flores in Los Angeles California. He was someone else that showed up to "help" Eric Dollard. Everyone wants to help "themselves" to Eric. Like the martians in the movie "Mars Attacks" -the aliens were announcing "We are your friends" as they start exterminating the humans.

Borderlands embezzled all the funds for the safe place to move the equipemt to. The funds were sent by Josh reynolds. Eric was told "We need the money more than you do".
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Old 01-04-2012, 12:50 AM
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The Cosmic Induction Generator is truly fascinating. It really seems to show the fractal nature of reality. Planets and comets appearing...I wonder what else it would show. I am curious as to what the original purpose was in constructing it? Is that pure dielectric energy forming inside the bulb?
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Old 01-04-2012, 12:50 AM
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Eric asked me to include this here. Is is from the Charge Conserving Capacitive Spring Thread. It is of a Marx Generator:

Here are some photos of capacitors charged in parallel, discharged in series. A distributed dielectric gradient automatically operates the spark gaps.






And the following from Steinmetz, "Theory and Calculation of Transient Electric Phenomena and Oscillations".






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Old 01-04-2012, 01:23 AM
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I was wondering if I could get some clarification of the text below from this patent. What does it mean ?

Patent US1119732 - ELECTRICAL ENERGY - Google Patents



Uploaded with ImageShack.us

Nice arc and plasma displays by the way.

Cheers
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Old 01-04-2012, 02:49 AM
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That's what I'm talking about , the Cosmic Induction Generator post was awesome with all the original photos.

Blows out of the water all the Tesla Coil wannabe builders and them some!

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Old 01-04-2012, 06:51 AM
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Eric, another couple questions. The use of coax cable and inter turn capacitance.
Basically given the feature of interturn capacitance of the flat wire Tesla used in the primary, if using coax cable; being sheathed in teflon and thus a good dielectric it's increasing the capacitance over air, how does this effect the LC of the coil? also since coax cable suppresses inductance is this by design as needed to enhance the longitudinal wave? Then also wouldn't that mean that the secondary is not mutually inductive but reactive via capacitance?

Is there a similar phenomenon to current voltage lead/lag phase occurring in the inter turn capacitance?

This is also why the mass of the conductor is critical to being matched right? is there more of a correlation to the material? copper vs silver etc.. Do you think there is a correlation to the materials affected by transmitted vs reflected rays and if a material that is more affected by transmitted rays being more conductive to transmitting longitudinal waves
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Old 01-04-2012, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T-rex View Post
From "Electric Waves, Discharges, and Impulses", C.P Steinmetz, p67

Relation of Magnetic and Dielectric Energy Transient


@Eric

When building a TMT where should we place the nodes and how many are optimum for proper operation? The phase angles for each of the coils?

I presume that could easily be accomplished by measuring the reflected voltage for each coil or even using an swr meter between them to zero in?

From what I gather it sounds like odd number 1/4 lamda, 3/4. 5/4 and so forth for the total? I believe the patent stated the whole thing should be 1/4 and I presume swr = 1 at the ground side.

I would think that 1/4 lambda for the whole thing would present some interesting tuning hurdles for self resonant coils. not sure if I am making sense here.
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Old 01-04-2012, 07:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T-rex View Post
Crystal Sets Gone Wild

For the diagram shown the coil dimensions are missing, number of turns, etc. A good ground is essential for these kinds of devices. 16 Ground rods in a 10 to 20 foot radius circle, connected to a single ground rod at the center(17th rod), this connection being 10 gauge wire. Dry sand or rock will not ground, so this requires 80, each 14 gauge wires in a 30 foot diameter circle in a star radial configuration, to a center terminal. Without these groundings a Tesla Transformer cannot properly operate, but some "HI-Z" sets may.

The objective here is to scale the "Crystal Set", a step at a time, into a Tesla Transformer for the reception of medium wave band, 300 - 3000 kilocycle A.M. broadcasts. No license is required for this and the broadcast station provides the power.

And this objective cooperates with the primary objective. That is; Who will be the first ham to disprove Einstein's theory? An International contest, but who will sponsor it, Iran maybe?

We have the good fortune in the "Crystal Set Initiative" that, in theory at least, a quarter wave A.M. broadcast tower, and its 120 quarter wave ground radials, must emit a pair of waves as shown by Tesla in his basic diagrams.



Hence it can be seen that a pair of waves are engendered by this transmission system. (Tower and Star Radials). One wave, Hertzian, is the over ground wave, the other wave, Telluric, is the under ground wave. These two waves arrive at the point of reception in their own distinct time frames, giving rise to a difference in phase. Hence, multiple rings of interference patterns are produced. Since the Hertzian portion, over ground, time frame is based upon the velocity of light, then the Telluric portion, under ground, time frame gives the Telluric velocity. Two crystal sets, one over ground, one under ground, and a basic oscilloscope , that simple. I have done this at Landers.

Concluding, a Tesla Magnification Transformer, properly proportioned can, in theory, actually draw power from a local 50 kW station. Several hundred watts of power reception is likely. This would prove Tesla once and for all. No antenna, just a good ground, and a nice and bright 100 watt light bulb.

This would overturn physics more than any billion dollar C.E.R.N. project. A ham radio operator overturns Einstein for 100 bucks. What a concept.
Read,
Tesla, "The True Wireless"
Tesla, "System of Concatenated Tuned Circuits"
Dollard, "System for the Transmission and Reception of Telluric Electric Waves"
A.R.R.L. "Radio Amatuers Handbook". Chapter "H.F. Transmitters, & Tank Circuits"
73 DE N6 KPH
@Eric
my first thought is tune up to 60 cycles! ha! Which if course is illegal but a fun thought none the less! LOL

So the 10pf provides a feedback loop? Do you have a pic by chance of the physical configuration required for that?

Also I meant to ask you, that in your sbarc talk you mentioned that between the 2 transmitter and receiver capacitive inductors (spheres) it forms an extremely tight DC beam. Could you elaborate on how that occurs? Does it try to form a channel like lightning would before and actual arc jumped? I am very interested in the mechanics behind that phenomena.
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Old 01-04-2012, 08:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T-rex View Post
Thirty turns are about right on the extra coil.Any teflon covered co-axial cable is fine, but remember the copper weight of the primary, secondary, and extra coil MUST all be equal, this is important. Metal lost to the "skin effect" must be taken into consideration. Rule:
2 inch thick 60 cycle, .2 inch thick 6000 cycle, thickness inverse to the square root of the frequency (flat stock is best)
Thank you for all this info Eric. Is there anything you can tell us about the relation of the secondary to the extra coil, like particular size, number of turns or wire length ratios? In the Colorado Springs Notes page 190-191 Tesla shows six diagrams, Fig. 4 being of most interest to me, stating that a 1/4 wavelength secondary and 1/2 wavelength extra coil produce the greatest pressure on the ball in this configuration. So I suppose the question is, is that all there is to it?

Also would it be a big disadvantage to use single strand copper wire rather than teflon covered co-axial cable?

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Old 01-04-2012, 01:46 PM
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Tesla transformer at bottom of shaft in Wardenclyffe?

I am just thinking about Tesla's Wardenclyffe tower, after printing the so-called Anderson drawing:

Wardenclyffe Tunnels Investigation


(high res version here: http://www.tuks.nl/img/Anderson%20Drawing.jpg )

This drawing appears to be based on Tesla's statements in the 1923 Foreclosure Proceedings, while it is a mystery where the idea of those "radial tunnels" comes from:

Quote:
Nikola Tesla for Defendant---Direct.

A. Yes. You see the underground work is one of the most expensive parts of the tower. In this system that I have invented it is necessary for the machine to get a grip of the earth, otherwise it cannot shake the earth. It has to have a grip on the earth so that the whole of this globe can quiver, and to do that it is necessary to carry out a very expensive construction. I had in fact invented special machines. But I want to say this underground work belongs to the tower.

By Mr. Hawkins:

Q. Anything that was there, tell us about.

A. There was, as your Honor states, a big shaft about ten by twelve feet goes down about one hundred and twenty feet and this was first covered with timber and the inside with steel and in the center of this there was a winding stairs going down and in the center of the stairs there was a big shaft again through which the current was to pass, and this shaft was so figured in order to tell exactly where the nodal point is, so that I could calculate every point of distance. For instance I could calculate exactly the size of the earth or the diameter of the earth and measure it exactly within four feet with that machine.

Q. And that was a necessary appurtenance to your tower?

A. Absolutely necessary. And then the real expensive work was to connect that central part with the earth, and there I had special machines rigged up which would push the iron pipe, one length after another, and I pushed these iron pipes, I think sixteen of them, three hundred feet, and then the current through these pipes takes hold of the earth. Now that was a very expensive part of the work, but it does not show on the tower, but it belongs to the tower.
So, Tesla does not say anything about radial pipes. He talks about pushing the iron pipe, one length after the other.

So, could it be that these 300 feet are supposed to be an additional 300 feet, so you would end up at 120 + 300 = 420 feet depth eventually?

Then we would get a total length of the main pipe of about 600 feet, which is incidentally also what he calculated with in earlier designs, designs that would become way to large (hight) to actually build:

Tuks DrippingPedia : Tesla Rare Notes On Wardenclyffe

Quote:
In annexed sketch [See Fig. 4.] a terminal C in form of a roof is supported on conducting supports L1L1. Terminal C1 is adjustable and in contact with structure of roof, or terminal C1. A resonating system C2ℓSE discharges with C1 and produces oscillations in system CL1L1E1E1.This arrangement obviates necessity to support roof or terminal C on insulated supports.

Now in a sketch or scheme the difficulty will be probably to get the oscillations of the free system CL1L1E1E1 slow enough to be very effective in transmission through earth as in my system. The length of conductors in the free system should be λ/4, and the length of the discharging current should be 3/4 λ or n/4 λ eventually, n being uneven number.

[...]

Calculated it would appear that the supports L would have to be about 600 feet. The arrangement would be OK with quick oscillation. The self-induction of a straight conductor is L' = 2l'[loge (2l'/r) - 0.75]. Now, take /'= 300 ft = 9000 cm. If we want to use iron pipes 4" diam. r = 5 cm. Then 2l'/r = 3600 and from this I find L' = 134,000 cm. Again taking the length 600 ft we would get inductance probably 268,000 cm. To get lower frequencies, evidently in above scheme self-induction must be increased.
An interesting detail on this Anderson drawing is that the mains power is fed to the bottom of the shaft, suggesting that the transmitter transformer must have been positioned at the bottom of the 120 feet deeo shaft, a shaft that has been plated with iron.

This suggests that the shaft may have functioned similar to a sleeve / bazooka balun as I use in my longitudinal dipole antenna:
Who performs the first longitudinal Moon-Bounce in history?

Such a balun is essentially a short-circuited transmission line:

Antenna Theory - Bazooka Baluns

Quote:
The green sleeve in Figures 1 and 2 acts as a transmission line, that is short circuited at the end. From Gauss's law, it is (basically) true that the current on the inside of the outer arm of the bazooka (green line) must be the opposite of that flowing on the outside of the coax (grey line). Hence, the current IC actually sees a short-circuited transmission line. If the length L of the sleeve is chosen to be a quarter-wavelength (at the desired frequency of operation), then the impedance that the current IC sees is infinite (this is the principle of a short-circuited quarter-wave transmission line - see the impedance page for a brief introduction to transmission line theory).
So, if you think away the coax core, then you would essentially have a structure that keeps the current (== magnetic component) above the bottom of the shaft in Tesla's case and therefore the only component that can propagate along the 300 feet 1/2 lambda iron "earth grip" starting at the bottom of the shaft would be a longitudinal dielectric wave....

So, we would then have 4 sections:

1. A capacitive load / wave reflector on top, a) to have a reference potential to push against and b) to have a wave reflector preventing longidudinal radiation along the length of the antenna/resonator away into space;

2. 1/4 lambda whip antenna above ground;

3. another 1/4 lambda section, with a sleeve balun, below ground;

4. a 1/2 lambda longitudinal transmitter antenna going deeply into the earth.

@Eric: what do you think??


Update: This balun / short circuited transmission line thing may also connect to what Edwin Gray was doing:

Gray Tube Replication

Last edited by lamare : 01-05-2012 at 12:58 PM.
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  #824 (permalink)  
Old 01-04-2012, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by dR-Green View Post
Thank you for all this info Eric. Is there anything you can tell us about the relation of the secondary to the extra coil, like particular size, number of turns or wire length ratios? In the Colorado Springs Notes page 190-191 Tesla shows six diagrams, Fig. 4 being of most interest to me, stating that a 1/4 wavelength secondary and 1/2 wavelength extra coil produce the greatest pressure on the ball in this configuration. So I suppose the question is, is that all there is to it?

Also would it be a big disadvantage to use single strand copper wire rather than teflon covered co-axial cable?

@Eric
those notes are a bit confusing.

If he wants high voltage on top you would think that the secondary would be 1/2 wave and the extra would be 1/4 wave. Exactly reversed? At least from my version of obvious LOL

I do not see that working properly the way it is written. It seems there should be a voltage node, (ie swr = 1:1), on the top and bottom of the secondary and on the bottom of the extra coil for proper function?

so it would seem the secondary should be 1/2 lmbda
and the extra coil 1/4 lambda

that is presuming they are in series with each other

If I am screwed up in my understanding so be it, maybe Eric can shed some light on this.

Last edited by Kokomoj0 : 01-04-2012 at 10:06 PM.
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  #825 (permalink)  
Old 01-04-2012, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by madhatter View Post
Eric, another couple questions. The use of coax cable and inter turn capacitance.
Basically given the feature of interturn capacitance of the flat wire Tesla used in the primary, if using coax cable; being sheathed in teflon and thus a good dielectric it's increasing the capacitance over air, how does this effect the LC of the coil? also since coax cable suppresses inductance is this by design as needed to enhance the longitudinal wave? Then also wouldn't that mean that the secondary is not mutually inductive but reactive via capacitance?

Is there a similar phenomenon to current voltage lead/lag phase occurring in the inter turn capacitance?

This is also why the mass of the conductor is critical to being matched right? is there more of a correlation to the material? copper vs silver etc.. Do you think there is a correlation to the materials affected by transmitted vs reflected rays and if a material that is more affected by transmitted rays being more conductive to transmitting longitudinal waves
I'll just re-quote myself to edit the last bit here. Not mass but surface area.

Also, in one of Tesla's lectures he makes specific mention of the need to reduce capacitance in the coil windings by the use of certain wire insulation but at the same time is very explicit in the use of oil for the insulating dielectric and heavy insulation, which seems counter productive as that would in fact increase the capacitance and the tension of Psi, an effect he was after correct? If there is a specific reason for the difference in capacitance location its not fully explained. The use of the coil also being completely enclosed in a sealed zinc box to increase the capacitance as well is interesting and not touched on in his notes significantly.

It would seem then the nature of the turn capacitance is to overcome the self induction of the coil. which brings up again the nature of mutual capacitance and not induction.
A primary coil of coax or braided wire would increase the skin effect via surface area and the capacitance would be the mutual link to the secondary coil of one with specific inter-turn capacitance and suppressed self induction. it would seem then that the goal is an oscillating Psi field of extreme frequency to raise potential while avoiding the magnetic field that would reduce the effect. a self induced capacitor with negligible resistance and FTL transmission.
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Old 01-04-2012, 09:46 PM
garrettm4 garrettm4 is offline
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Capacity C, Elastance K, Enductance M & Inductance L

Quote:
Originally Posted by madhatter View Post
A primary coil of coax or braided wire would increase the skin effect via surface area and the capacitance would be the mutual link to the secondary coil of one with specific inter-turn capacitance and suppressed self induction. it would seem then that the goal is an oscillating Psi field of extreme frequency to raise potential while avoiding the magnetic field that would reduce the effect. a self induced capacitor with negligible resistance and FTL transmission.
I believe the secondary is made up of maximal inter-turn MUTUAL-capacity K not self-capacity C, hence why you get two resonant frequencies, LC and MK, when doing a frequency sweep of the coil. With special reference to Borderland Science - Transverse & Longitudinal Electric Waves [1988] (Specifically, about 7 minuets into the video)

I might be wrong but, you could look at the secondary coil's individual loops as isolated metallic rings in which there is a mutual capacity K between all of them where the lines of dielectric induction are cut buy the individual "rings"(essentially a giant "elastor") frequency is in "per radians" as opposed to radians, next all the winding can be looked at as a single wire and their lines of dielectric induction interacting with the "ground" as a capacitance C, frequency in radians.

Its EASY to CONFUSE the two because you can look at an elastor as a capacitor when viewed from coil end-to-end. The understanding of self-induction and mutual-induction is the guiding light that clears this up.

Now there is the self-inductance L which is distributed along the coil's length, seen as a single long wire, next there is a mutual-inductance M between the individual windings, seen as a group of separate shorter windings. The magnetic induction of the self-inductance, L, is 90 degrees spatially out of phase of the magnetic induction of mutual-inductance, M. The LOOPS of magnetic induction for L are only along the wire's surface the LINES of magnetic induction M cut, or terminate on, each separate loop, the frequency of L is in radians whereas M is in "per radians". That takes winding a "coil" to the "next level", quite interesting if you ask me.

M & K are aligned in the same axis of propagation, both cut, or terminate on, separate "repetitive metallic structures" of the coil (other loops), L & C are 90 degrees spatially out of phase with M & K, and being in the form of self-induction as opposed to mutual induction the whole length of the wire is considered in their calculation as opposed to the individual structures of the coil. Quite complex if you ask me.

A helpful reference to the above description is:
E. P. Dollard - Condensed Intro to Tesla Transformers [1986] (With specific reference to "Analysis", Figures 6, 7 & 9 and pages 16-31)

Now we come to the quadra-polar view of "Voltage and Current" e & I and E & i. Note that Voltage is not the dielectric and current is not the magnetic. EACH TAKE BOTH FORM. The geometry of the space surrounding the ENERGY of DIELECTRIC or MAGNETIC determines whether they are seen as Volts or Amps. Confusing I know, possibly enlightening when fully digested.

Some more "food for thought" is looking at things as SERIES or PARALLEL (shunt) ENTITIES. Example; resistance, r, series element, inductance, L, series element, elastance, K, series element, conductance, g, parallel element, capacity, C, parallel element, enductance, M, parallel element. While you can "convert" a parallel element into a series element, such as an elastance into a capacitance, (by using its reciprocal) it doesn't change how the lines of induction are propagated in the element so the conversions are "mental gymnastics" that confuse the mind into thinking they are equivalent. Numerically they are equivalent, Spatially, in terms of axis of propagation, they are not equivalent.

In conclusion, an MK wave is different from an LC wave and theoretically you can have MC & LK waves as well. This probably predicts why you can have Transverse-Magnetic TM waves (with Longitudinal-Dielectric LD wave byproduct), Transverse-Electric TE waves (with Longitudinal-Magneto LM wave byproduct) and pure Transverse-Electro-Magnetic TEM waves. As for pure Longitudinal-Magneto-Dielectric LMD propagation, pure MK, little is known and even less is openly available on this subject, aside from Mr. Dollards work.

Hope this wasn't off the mark (I'm just a High School dropout so don't take my word for it), hopefully Mr. Dollard will point out any errors in my understanding (or misunderstanding).

Garrett M

Last edited by garrettm4 : 01-10-2012 at 02:29 AM.
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  #827 (permalink)  
Old 01-04-2012, 10:21 PM
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Kokomoj0 Kokomoj0 is offline
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Originally Posted by garrettm4 View Post
M & K are aligned in the same axis of propagation, both cut, or terminate on, separate "repetitive metallic structures" of the coil (other loops), L & C are 90 degrees spatially out of phase with M & K, and being in the form of self-induction as a posed to mutual induction the whole length of the wire is considered in their calculation as possessed to the individual structures of the coil. Quite complex if you ask me.

Garrett M

so are you implying that M,K and L,C should be designed to operate at the same frequency?
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  #828 (permalink)  
Old 01-04-2012, 11:21 PM
garrettm4 garrettm4 is offline
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Not What I Intended to "Get" Across

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Originally Posted by Kokomoj0 View Post
so are you implying that M,K and L,C should be designed to operate at the same frequency?
If that is what you got out of what I wrote... then I feel as though I have completely failed in my "explanation"!

Note: I don't think it is possible to get LC and MK at the same frequency in the same coil, LC in Radians, MK in per Radians, one being TEM the other LMD. As for the intermingling of the two, if I am not mistaken, Heavyside's Telegraph Equation and the "wave factor", gamma, explains the situation quite well. This topic is treated for the alternating current case (uses a subset of the telegraph equation) in Mr. Dollard's book Symbolic Representation of Alternating Electric Waves, specifically pages 15-18.

LC = Transverse-Electro-Magnetic TEM

MK = Longitudinal-Magneto-Dielectric LMD

LK = TM & LD

MC = TE & LM

This may be wrong but, Ideally you would want ZERO L & C and only M & K for the propagation of a pure Longitudinal-Magneto-Dielectric Wave. Now that from an engineering prospective seems impossible so we will always have some L & C and thus Transverse Wave "residue" and the possible mixture of the two or LK & MC, both of which may or may not be desirable.

As for a Tesla transformer there are three separate coils, a terminal capacity and a ground connection that each focus on one of those four possibilities, (LC, MK, LK or MC) with a design emphasis on one form of induction (L, M, C, or K) per afore mentioned system element. In this case the LC configuration is not used, as far as I am aware, although the terminal capacity would be that of C (with reference to the ground) and the extra coil appears to favor L. Basically, each coil is designed to get rid of one form of induction in favor of another to reach its desired goal as a COMPLETE SYSTEM with the terminal capacity and ground connection. As of yet, I haven't devoted enough time to the consideration of EACH coil to give my opinion as to what coil favors what form of induction and their specific goal as a SYSTEM.

I don't claim to be the "master and commander" of the Tesla transformer, I've never built one (I do plan on doing so soon). When in doubt, refer back to the two amazing works by Mr. Dollard, Condensed Intro to Tesla Transformers [1986] & Oscillating Current Transformer [1986]. These references fill in most of the missing design details.

If you listen to what Mr. Dollard says, you will start to see where I am coming from in what I wrote. Mr. Dollard says two big things, at least they seem quite important to me:

(1) There is a Quadra-Polar nature of VOLTAGE and CURRENT.

(2) MUTUAL-INDUCTION and SELF-INDUCTION are not the same thing.

Thus the dielectric is not voltage, the magnetic is not current, BOTH are SEEN as EACH, being dependent upon TIME and SPACE (geometry) of the METALLIC-DIELECTRIC boundary condition. The propagation of the differing "inductions" of the dielectric or magnetic are not on the same AXIS. Similar to the imaginary axis and the real axis, they coexist simultaneously but don't lie in the same direction, they intersect at 90 degrees. This doesn't mean that M K L & C have to all be in different directions only that the propagation of the two inductions of one form (Dielectric or Magnetic) are in different directions. So that is why I say that M & K lie in the same axis of propagation, whereas M & L do not (at least in the case of a Tesla Transformer Secondary). With reference to Figures 6 & 7 and especially Figure 9 in Mr. Dollard's Condensed Intro to Tesla Transformers.

I hope that someone else who is more "in tune" with these concepts will "chime in" and give their opinion on what I have said so that we can contrast what I have gotten from the T-rex writings with what they understand so we can clear up anything that is incorrect. Which is what collaboration is all about.

Garrett M

Last edited by garrettm4 : 01-13-2012 at 06:52 AM.
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  #829 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2012, 01:07 AM
garrettm4 garrettm4 is offline
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Question On Plank, Q with Respect to an Impulse Discharge of L or C into r

I don't believe this has been addressed yet, what is the relation of Plank, Q, during an impulse discharge of only one field energy i.e. DIELECTRIC or MAGNETIC? Where stored energy of a capacitor or inductor is discharged into an ohmic resistance.

Example for the Dielectric (with capacitor of "fixed" capacity):

Differential Voltage of Source via Law of Dielectric Proportion


Differential Current of Discharge from Source via Law of Dielectric Induction


Differential Current through Load resistance r via Ohms Law


"Time" found by setting both "currents" equal


When simplified


Time Constant, Tau


Tau Defined:

Its understood that the wave shape, of an Impulse Discharge, is that of an Asymptote, never reaching zero during discharge and never reaching 100% during charge. The TIME CONSTANT found in the above equation (rC) only relates to a graticule (one division) of time of this waveform, it does not represent the whole time, just a piece of time. It is considered that 5 of these pieces of time is the "practical" length of the discharge. Thus "time constant" tau equals rC and 5tau is the approximate length of the discharge in time, or 5 pieces of time (rC) is equivalent to the length of the discharge.

Union of Phi & Psi:

With the shape of the wave and the constants (r, C & tau) and variables (t, psi, e & I) considered, you will find that the field of MAGNETIC INDUCTION (phi) is nowhere to be seen. Thus Plank Q the unit of ELECTRIC Induction, or total electrification (union of psi and phi), is a perplexing quantity. Meanwhile, we still have Power P in watts and even energy in joules (if time is considered), all of which the plank is measured in.

So on to my question, am I a fool who can't see whats going on correctly or is an Impulse Discharge a "special" event where there is still Q in planks but in another form? Also, would I be wrong in calling this type of Impulse Discharge (C into r or g) a Transverse-Electric Impulse-Wave? If true, this would predict the existence of a Transverse-Magnetic Impulse-Wave (L into r or g).

Two Measurements of Power:

Usage of time with respect to power (shows the plot of the impulse discharge)
(eq1)

When expanded to show all terms
(eq1a)

Average Power (with respect to the whole discharge period, or 5Tau)
(eq1.1)

Where via the Law of Dielectric Induction with respect to the Time Constant, tau and Ohms Law
(eq1.1a) and (eq1.1b)

No time with respect to power
(eq2)

My next question comes from the second equation for power (no usage of time) which most people are familiar with, is this the sum of all stored power (with time taken into account) or is it the peak magnitude of stored power? I don't seem to get the same answers for both equations, maybe because we are dealing with asymptotes where we arbitrarily cut its length short due to it being infinitely long (in theory).

I hope I'm not crazy in asking these questions and hopefully Mr. Dollard or someone else smarter than me, may make some of these perplexities clear.

Garrett M

Last edited by garrettm4 : 01-10-2012 at 02:11 AM.
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  #830 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2012, 02:13 AM
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Originally Posted by garrettm4 View Post
I believe the secondary is made up of maximal inter-turn MUTUAL-capacity K not self-capacity C, hence why you get two resonant frequencies, LC and MK, when doing a frequency sweep of the coil.

I might be wrong but, you could look at the secondary coil's individual loops as isolated metallic rings in which there is a mutual capacity K between all of them where the lines of dielectric induction are cut buy the individual "rings"(essentially a giant "elastor") frequency is in "per radians" as opposed to radians, next all the winding can be looked at as a single wire and their lines of dielectric induction interacting with the "ground" as a capacitance C, frequency in radians.

Its EASY to CONFUSE the two because you can look at an elastor as a capacitor when viewed from coil end-to-end. The understanding of self-induction and mutual-induction is the guiding light that clears this up.

Now there is the self-inductance L which is distributed along the coil's length, seen as a single long wire, next there is a mutual-inductance M between the individual windings, seen as a group of separate shorter windings. The magnetic induction of the self-inductance, L, is 90 degrees spatially out of phase of the magnetic induction of mutual-inductance, M. The LOOPS of magnetic induction for L are only along the wire's surface the LINES of magnetic induction M cut, or terminate on, each separate loop, the frequency of L is in radians whereas M is in "per radians". That takes winding a "coil" the "next level", quite interesting if you ask me.

M & K are aligned in the same axis of propagation, both cut, or terminate on, separate "repetitive metallic structures" of the coil (other loops), L & C are 90 degrees spatially out of phase with M & K, and being in the form of self-induction as a posed to mutual induction the whole length of the wire is considered in their calculation as possessed to the individual structures of the coil. Quite complex if you ask me.

Now we come to the quadra-polar view of "Voltage and Current" e & I and E & i. Note that Voltage is not the dielectric and current is not the magnetic. BOTH TAKE EACH FORM. The geometry of the space surrounding the ENERGY of DIELECTRIC or MAGNETIC determines whether they are seen as Volts or Amps. Confusing I know, possibly enlightening when fully digested.

Some more "food for thought" is looking at things as SERIES or PARALLEL (shunt) ENTITIES. Example; resistance, r, series element, inductance, L, series element, elastance, K, series element, conductance, g, parallel element, capacity, C, parallel element, enductance, M, parallel element. While you can "convert" a parallel element into a series element, such as an elastance into a capacitance, (by using its reciprocal) it doesn't change how the lines of induction are propagated in the element so the conversions are "mental gymnastics" that confuse the mind into thinking they are equivalent (numerical they are, in terms of axis of propagation they are not).

In conclusion an MK wave is different from an LC wave and theoretically you can have MC and LK waves as well. This probably predicts why you can have Transverse-Magnetic TM waves (with Longitudinal-Dielectric LD wave byproduct), Transverse-Electric TE waves (with Longitudinal-Magneto LM wave byproduct) and pure Transverse-Electro-Magnetic TEM waves. As for pure Longitudinal-Magneto-Dielectric LMD propagation, pure MK, little is known and even less is openly available on this subject, aside from Mr. Dollards work.

Hope this wasn't off the mark (I'm just a High School dropout so don't take my word for it); hopefully Mr. Dollard will point out any errors in my understanding (or misunderstanding).

Garrett M
Thanks, that's exactly how I understand it as well. You've done a great job of describing it better than I did.
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  #831 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2012, 04:57 AM
garrettm4 garrettm4 is offline
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Question On Plank, Q Continued

Upon further algebraic examination, I have found some fascinating insight into this problem:

When we expand (eq2) (where time isn't used) from my prior post we get
(eq2a)

And when we simplify (eq2a) (this being a more esoteric form of the power equation (eq2), using only the lines of dielectric induction and its geometric confines to define power stored)
(eq2.1)

Now the simplified form of (eq1a) (time considered with respect to power) from my prior post (this showing the lines of dielectric induction, with its geometric confines considered, moving in time to define Power with respect to time)
(eq1b)

As can be seen, the two "simplified" equations look very similar, but yield different results! One being Static, (no time) showing the total stored energy, the other Dynamic, (time moving) showing the release of stored energy. Where the number "1/2" comes from in (eq2) or when rewritten (eq2.1) I have no idea, its quite perplexing to me! If someone could direct me to the proof of equation (eq2) I would be much obliged!

For the case of an Impulse Discharge, we can use Tau to define differential time, dt, in the above differential equation (eq1b) and thus (n denotes the number of units of time in Tau or number of elapsed Time Constants (total time of event). n being defined as greater-than or equal-to zero and equal-to or less-than 5)
(eq1.2)

When we expand the above equation we find some interesting things (here is the Average Power of an Impulse Discharge of a capacitor C into a resistance r or the movement of lines of dielectric induction from its spatial metallic-dielectric housing through a load resistance as a displacement current)
(eq1.2a)

If C is assumed fully charged and of fixed capacity and r a fixed resistance, then n or number of elapsed time constants is the only variable used to define Average Power of the Impulse Discharge (this is the case with a fully charged capacitor and modified for anything less than 100 percent charged). Some interesting phenomena manifest in the case of infinite resistance r and its reciprocal infinite conductance g with a finite capacity C. In the first case you will have ZERO POWER with INFINITE TIME of discharge the other ZERO POWER with ZERO TIME of discharge, this being the case when n is greater-than zero and regardless of the finite value of C. This of course can only be considered if capacity C has zero internal shunt-conductance and zero equivalent-series-resistance. Interestingly, both cases have ZERO POWER, one with no movement of the lines of induction the other with instantaneous movement.

Personal Insight:

Into deeper theoretical considerations, one could think of a "Super Conductor" as a medium in which lines of Dielectric Induction are in infinite circulation unable to dissipate (from infinite conductance, thus ZERO POWER) having a mono-polar diamagnetic field produced from a ZERO TIME Discharge of psi (in a unique form of amperes) which occludes lines of Magnetic Induction from entering. If this idea is looked at from the point of a Transverse-Electric Wave, we would now interpret the ZERO TIME Discharge as an “Instantaneous Movement” of the lines of Dielectric Induction in (or around the surface of) the infinite conductance g (if L is absent, which is the case for a superconductor). This Instantaneous Movement cannot happen in a dielectric medium if the finite velocity of light and its interaction with a dielectric medium are considered. This could explain how you can vary the strength of the diamagnetic field of a superconductor thus the psi per time (amperes) is now possible to calculate, from the finite velocity of c and its speed through a dielectric medium. Also a superconductor can be looked at as a special form of Capacitor in which the lines of dielectric induction are in motion as opposed to being static. This may or may not be an absurd accusation on my part, but, within the considerations shown on (eq1.2a) and conclusions I have developed from them it seem plausible.

With the above exercise, I have come to the conclusion that the measure of an Impulse Discharge's "Power" is an ambiguous quantity! This can be seen by considering the following; the greater the resistance, r, the more "stretched out" time becomes, the greater the conductance, g, the more "compressed" time becomes. All with respect to a finite capacity C and thus a corresponding finite amount of Energy. This "dilation" of time causes the different results for the measured magnitude of power, despite the same amount of lines of dielectric induction used. More simply said, a limited amount of Energy can be "compressed" or "stretched" by the Time Constant of the circuit. This is clearly seen in the form of the Voltage and Current magnitudes with respect to time. Also, I have come to the conclusion that resistance r "preserves" lines of dielectric induction (increasing magnitude of resistance r consumes progressively less psi per time) and conductance g "consumes" lines of dielectric induction (increasing magnitude of conductance g consumes progressively more psi per time). Whereas for the magnetic circuit this is the exact opposite, or resistance r consumes lines of magnetic induction (increasing magnitude of resistance r consumes progressively more phi per time) and conductance g preserves lines of magnetic induction (increasing magnitude of conductance g consumes progressively less phi per time). This is exemplified in the the cases of infinite resistance r for the rC circuit and infinite conductance g for the gL circuit, both have an infinite discharge time despite the finite storage of C or L. This somewhat predicts an LC oscillation, whereby a capacity C appears to be a conductance C/t to an inductance L and an inductance L appears to be a resistance L/t to a capacity C. Here, the lines of induction are not consumed but transformed from one form to the other as a storage and return of energy, whereby the conductance g consumes the energy of the capacity C and the resistance r consumes the energy of the inductance L causing the oscillation to eventually stop.

Generally considered, an Impulse Discharge would be useless and destructive for most situations, but, many interesting phenomena can manifest in their use (Tesla Transformers).

A few good references on this subject:
E. P. Dollard - Introduction to Dielectric & Magnetic Discharges in Electrical Windings [1982]
E. P. Dollard - Introduction to Dielectricity and Capacitance [1990] Mar-Apr JBR pages 10-13
Borderland Science - Free-Energy Research [1987] (Specifically, minuets 7 to 16 of video)

Power Developed Further:

One could take this topic further with consideration of the four different measurements of Power with usage of Heaviside's Telegraph Equation. A big thing to point out, is that TIME measurements and thus a corresponding frequency is based upon the wave-shape engendered by the circuit. Hence why the calculations for an Impulse Discharge are different than that of an AC Wave or even an OC Wave.

Vector Power (Volt-Amperes, Complex Plane Vector Measurement, "the sq root of the sum of the squares" or "Absolute Measurement") Voltmeter reading multiplied by Ammeter reading


Apparent Power (TOTAL Power, Re + Im Axis Measurement) Watt-meter reading plus VAR-meter reading


Active Power (Consumed/Produced Power, Real Axis Measurement) Watt-meter reading


Reactive Power (Stored/Returned Power, Imaginary Axis Measurement) VAR-meter reading


An excellent reference on this subtopic is of course:
E. P. Dollard - Symbolic Representation of Alternating Electric Waves [1985]

Garrett M

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  #832 (permalink)  
Old 01-05-2012, 02:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garrettm4 View Post
I believe the secondary is made up of maximal inter-turn MUTUAL-capacity K not self-capacity C, hence why you get two resonant frequencies, LC and MK, when doing a frequency sweep of the coil.

Garrett M

So which frequency we would choose then to best tune the extra coil?
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Old 01-06-2012, 07:30 PM
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It's gone quiet...
Posted this in the moon bounce thread and figured it would be fitting here as well.

Also I was doing a bit more research and reading through Heaviside the other night I came across an interesting note, "Electrical notes Volume 3 Page 89"

"There are several cautions to be expressed regarding the
above. First the investigation has no reference to ordinary
waves along wires. They do not behave in the above way, even
if all resistance were done away with. The above waves are
forced waves, whether u be less or greater than v, although
only in the latter case is there permanent activity on the
average. If we want to represent waves of this type along
a wire, we require a continuous distribution of impressed
electric force along the wire, or something equivalent. That
is, the wire is to be a source of energy, instead of a sink, as
is usually the case with waves along them, for the loss of
energy by radiation of the heat is a separate matter, which
does not come in question."

in this same volume of papers Heaviside also talks about that induction can be absent when there is an infinite in length in the plane, then there is no way for it to terminate and thus it can not develop. Given how k is transverse to C if the wave of k is moving faster than v then the field would not have a termination point and induction would be absent from the coil.

I'm grossly simplifying here as I need to connect the dots with more formalism. However based on a number of things posted and read I see this,

the geometry of the secondary with it's inter-turn spaced wires is specificaly done to remove coil induction and enhance the k factor so that the transverse longitudinal wave will emerge, the primary coil being of coax could be considered the 'tickler' it's function is to get the secondary coil to be the source of energy and not mutually inductive to the primary, the extra coil is other node point for the wave and this increases the tension needed to keep the secondary as the source.

A good starting point to see further whats going on is from here as well,
Heaviside; Volume 3 page 30:
chapter 9
paragraph 465
The steady Rectilinear Motion in its own line of a Terminated
Electrified Line when u>v, and interpretation of the
Impure Conical Wave following an Electron.

Now if I'm wrong or off in anyway, Eric please point this out.
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Old 01-07-2012, 03:13 AM
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It has gone quiet because we have a monster stack of books and papers to study in addition to building our crystal sets.

Last edited by Geometric_Algebra : 01-16-2012 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 01-07-2012, 04:06 AM
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Cancellation of Eric's Welfare

It has actually gotten quiet because Eric went back to Lone Pine, CA to pick up his welfare check. Unfortunately, his welfare has been cancelled for whatever reason. However, there were some residual funds left over in his bank account from the last donation medium. I assume that the funds will not last him very long since it is not a large sum.

I was trying to wait until I spoke to Eric personally before I made an announcement to the Forum, but Eric not having a cell phone makes it rather difficult to contact him. He tried to call me from a payphone yesterday and had to leave a message because I didn't hear my phone ring. This was when I received the voice message indicating that his welfare had been cancelled. He tried to call me again today, but the payphone went screwy and we got disconnected. I tried to call it back but had no luck getting an answer.

I don't know if you all feel the same way that I do, but I enjoy having Eric on the forum giving insights into the work of Tesla. I started focusing my attention on Eric Dollard rather than trying to decipher the ambiguous "hints" that many other researches are giving as to not fully uncover all of their work. Eric has truly helped accelerate my understanding of science by cutting out a lot of the bull and providing useful, documented references given by the electrical pioneers. This information is priceless.

Eric was planning on going back to Morro Bay, CA (The home where he had access to internet), but since he is extra low on funds, he might end up disappearing for all I know. It doesn't take much to piss him off at this point in life seeing that his life's work has been snatched out from under him on multiple occasions. I am certain that an influx of funds would help spark his interest again since he has been spending hours daily in writing and answering questions for us all. It is easy to lose interest if you get very little in return.

I know that there are probably some of you who have become annoyed with me trying to persuade people to donate to Eric. I am not gaining anything but knowledge by helping Eric. I have spent many hours of my own time calling people for him, typing for him, and trying to convince him to stick around since he is having an impact on our understanding of "things". I know times are hard, but I sure can't keep him around by myself (and jpolakow). If any of you agree with what I'm saying, please find it within yourselves to help Mr. Dollard out by donating to him. It is very important that he doesn't go to the grave with the knowledge contained within himself.

Thank You for your time,

David Webster

P.S. @Sputins, I want to personally thank your for being the only consistent benefactor for Eric.

Last edited by Web000x : 01-07-2012 at 04:10 AM.
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  #836 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2012, 08:12 PM
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Dave,

I fully agree with you, and do not think you have been pushing anything too hard. I really appreciate this thread and the contributors, and especially the work of Eric Dollard.
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  #837 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2012, 09:13 PM
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It is very difficult to do this remotely for all of us but the two of you near Eric. I hate talking in the third person here, but Eric is not around so what else...

I am not saying that we start taking care of Eric because that would absolve him from responsibility, which would be wrong on many levels. A more permanent solution is needed never the less, though one that directly involves, and is embraced by Eric.

The way I see it, Eric is so engulfed into his work that he does not want to deal with anything else (the daily "Earthly" matters) so he's mostly getting-by on a daily basis, probably even starving himself. Being so stubborn, Eric refuses to "budge" to the World and is expecting the World to change instead, which just won't happen.

Although none of us is financially wealthy to be a patron, we do have one common wealth among us all, and that is the head on our shoulders. So how about we brainstorm some ideas?

I'll start with one: a book deal. If a big publisher would sign up Eric to write a book on his own work, or Tesla's work, or whatever, that could provide Eric with a lump sum of funds in advance, and proceeds from the sales after publication.
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  #838 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2012, 09:52 PM
garrettm4 garrettm4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madhatter View Post
It's gone quiet...

Also I was doing a bit more research and reading through Heaviside the other night I came across an interesting note, "Electrical notes Volume 3 Page 89"

"There are several cautions to be expressed regarding the
above. First the investigation has no reference to ordinary
waves along wires. They do not behave in the above way, even
if all resistance were done away with. The above waves are
forced waves, whether u be less or greater than v, although
only in the latter case is there permanent activity on the
average. If we want to represent waves of this type along
a wire, we require a continuous distribution of impressed
electric force along the wire, or something equivalent. That
is, the wire is to be a source of energy, instead of a sink, as
is usually the case with waves along them, for the loss of
energy by radiation of the heat is a separate matter, which
does not come in question."
That's quite a powerful quote if mentally digested. It reminds me of the "cold electricity" shenanigans people talk about. Whereby the load becomes a source and actively takes energy from the environment as opposed to actively giving back, all of which is in the form of infrared photons. One action is seen as heat released and the other as cooling or heat converted into electrical energy. (Or however you want to word it)

I thought I would share my goal for the Tesla Transformer. Personally I don't need power to be transferred across long distances or even super-luninal communication, instead I am looking for an apparatus to convert ordinary currents (read TEM Waves) into Tesla currents (read LMD waves) for use in dissociation of water (H2O) into H H O for various uses like heating my home and therapeutic effects of Browns Gas. With a possible secondary use for Electro-Therapeutics. Nothing fancy, but interesting to me none the less. I may post some of my design details in the future when I feel more confident of its construction.

Last edited by garrettm4 : 01-07-2012 at 09:54 PM.
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  #839 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2012, 10:02 PM
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lamare lamare is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garrettm4 View Post
I am looking for an apparatus to convert ordinary currents (read TEM Waves) into Tesla currents (read LMD waves)
My longitudinal antenna is designed to do just that

I cannot prove yet that it does, but at least it shows a standing wave at a frequency a transverse wave is not supposed to resonate, so I am pretty confident it works:

Who performs the first longitudinal Moon-Bounce in history?

This is only practical at pretty high frequencies, though.

The trick is to get rid of the magnetic component using a sleeve balun. This appears to connect both to the Tesla Tower as well as Gray's device. And I think the principe can likely also be applied using coils instead of antenna:

Joulethief SEC exciter and variants

However, no conclusive evidence yet. It may turn out to be the Rosetta stone, it may turn out to nothing much.
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  #840 (permalink)  
Old 01-07-2012, 10:27 PM
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Gestalt Gestalt is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garrettm4 View Post
I thought I would share my goal for the Tesla Transformer. Personally I don't need power to be transferred across long distances or even super-luninal communication, instead I am looking for an apparatus to convert ordinary currents (read TEM Waves) into Tesla currents (read LMD waves) for use in dissociation of water (H2O) into H H O for various uses like heating my home and therapeutic effects of Browns Gas. With a possible secondary use for Electro-Therapeutics. Nothing fancy, but interesting to me none the less. I may post some of my design details in the future when I feel more confident of its construction.
Thanks for sharing your goals. Your posts are very informative and I would be curious to see what you plan on building in the future. I'm wondering why you wouldn't delve into Lakhovsky MWO instead of the Tesla Transformer for Therapeutic uses? I for one would like to try and replicate the Lahkovsky MWO, and I'm also intrigued by the potential Health Benefits of LMD waves. Karl Palsness reported some minor health benefits from the Tesla Hairpin circuit.(source)

I also am not particularly interested in superluminal communication either. And another thing I always wondered is, if Tesla was able to synthesize & create energy out of the ether, why go to the trouble of transmitting it? Wouldn't it be simpler to build small devices that create energy on location and on demand rather than depending on one centralized source? Is there any way to separate the energy synthesizing part of the Tesla Transformer from the transmission component?
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