Oz Nitro Cell

[Slovenia]

I got my start into the alternate fuel arena back about 6.5 years ago with the Oz Nitro Cell. I ran into a fellow who was helping a hydrogen cell inventor by the name of Frank Roberts from Kansas City. My contact, who was the helper, had heard of the Oz Nitro Cell out of Australia but there was not that much information available on the cell. He said I should look into that cell and try to get more information about the cell and how it works from the Australians. I started researching the cell and made several contacts with guys who said it was a well known and useful cell down under. They said it was illegal to run your car with the device on it and that many fellows were having the devices confiscated off their cars during routine checks. While doing my research I finally made contact with a bloke who said he could put me in touch with some very interesting chaps who had made and sold the cells. I collected a lot of information on the cells and gave it to Patrick Kelly who later named it the D18 Cell and wrote a booklet on it in pdf format. Anyway, the cell became very popular indeed since it was easy to make and so there were many groups trying to get such a cell going. As far as I know, none of the group members I knew of were able to get the cell to work properly. According to my many contacts in Australia the cell was a viable cell with many folks using it over there. I was told by numerous fellows that threats had been made to guys who knew how to make the cells work and that they would not come forward and help us because of the fear factor. A story was told of one Mercedes dealership who converted several of their new Mercedes to run on the Oz Nitro Cell as part of a publicity stunt. Anyway, the stunt worked well. They got a lot of attention because the converted Mercedes got much better mileage. The owner of the dealership was paid a visit and told to remove the cells from the cars right away. A few days later the owner of the dealership disappeared and was never seen again. It was a small town and everyone knew everyone pretty well and nobody could figure out what happened to him. He hadn't been planning to go anywhere according to his friends and family. Anyway, stories like this were really exciting to me and so I decided I was going to figure out how to get these cells to go and start making them myself. I talked to many guys and learned many different things but was never able to get the cell performing properly. It's my belief that some very important information was left out of the details we were given on how to build the device.

Anyway, I have all the information I was ever given on the cell and would still like to get it going. If you have interest in the cell and/or know how to make one run properly, please either pm me or post on this thread. If you are afraid, use a fake name and pm me. I'd sure appreciate any information you would be willing to share if you know how to get this cell running properly.

If there is interest in this cell, I'll share all the information I was given on this cell.

[tutanka]

I got my start into the alternate fuel arena back about 6.5 years ago with the Oz Nitro Cell. I ran into a fellow who was helping a hydrogen cell inventor by the name of Frank Roberts from Kansas City. My contact, who was the helper, had heard of the Oz Nitro Cell out of Australia but there was not that much information available on the cell. He said I should look into that cell and try to get more information about the cell and how it works from the Australians. I started researching the cell and made several contacts with guys who said it was a well known and useful cell down under. They said it was illegal to run your car with the device on it and that many fellows were having the devices confiscated off their cars during routine checks. While doing my research I finally made contact with a bloke who said he could put me in touch with some very interesting chaps who had made and sold the cells. I collected a lot of information on the cells and gave it to Patrick Kelly who later named it the D18 Cell and wrote a booklet on it in pdf format. Anyway, the cell became very popular indeed since it was easy to make and so there were many groups trying to get such a cell going. As far as I know, none of the group members I knew of were able to get the cell to work properly. According to my many contacts in Australia the cell was a viable cell with many folks using it over there. I was told by numerous fellows that threats had been made to guys who knew how to make the cells work and that they would not come forward and help us because of the fear factor. A story was told of one Mercedes dealership who converted several of their new Mercedes to run on the Oz Nitro Cell as part of a publicity stunt. Anyway, the stunt worked well. They got a lot of attention because the converted Mercedes got much better mileage. The owner of the dealership was paid a visit and told to remove the cells from the cars right away. A few days later the owner of the dealership disappeared and was never seen again. It was a small town and everyone knew everyone pretty well and nobody could figure out what happened to him. He hadn't been planning to go anywhere according to his friends and family. Anyway, stories like this were really exciting to me and so I decided I was going to figure out how to get these cells to go and start making them myself. I talked to many guys and learned many different things but was never able to get the cell performing properly. It's my belief that some very important information was left out of the details we were given on how to build the device.

Anyway, I have all the information I was ever given on the cell and would still like to get it going. If you have interest in the cell and/or know how to make one run properly, please either pm me or post on this thread. If you are afraid, use a fake name and pm me. I'd sure appreciate any information you would be willing to share if you know how to get this cell running properly.

If there is interest in this cell, I'll share all the information I was given on this cell.

Hello,
Maybe if you know how work that cell you can write here.. reactions started inside, if nitrogen is used, etc..

[Slovenia]

Thank You

Hello,
Maybe if you know how work that cell you can write here.. reactions started inside, if nitrogen is used, etc..

Tutanka,

Thanks for your interest in this system. The guy in Oz who was my primary contact was very careful about what he told me. I would ask him 25 questions and he would only address one of the 25 questions and not really answer it but talk around the question. He did tell me that nitrogen was the most important aspect of the cell. He didn't tell me why and I was unable to ever get him to explain what was actually happening inside the cell. He did say the following which might be of use to some of the rest of you who are engineers.

1) Water to be used was pure spring water. The cell was a horizontal cell, so we were supposed to fill it approximately 1.5 inches from the top of the cell.

2) The cell was supposed to be operated under vacuum at all times.

3) The cells was supposed to be provided with an inlet valve that could be varied as necessary. The air inlet valve was supposed to remain in the closed position during the two week break in period. The break in period was 24/7 for two weeks.

4) A pinch of rock salt was supposed to be added to the spring water and mixed in thoroughly.

5) 316L or better stainless steel was supposed to be used for both the inner tube and the outer tube, (i.e.: cathode & anode).

6) He referred to the cell as a nitrogen hydroxide cell on several occasions.

7) For the cell to operate properly it needed to be approximately 24 inches long and 4 inches wide. Gas production was the reason for the dimensions given.

8) After the 2 week break in period, the air inlet valve was to be opened about 1/4 of a turn so as to still allow for a strong vacuum to be pulled on the cell but to also allow nitrogen to be sucked inside and react with the hydrogen and oxygen creating some sort of highly explosive fuel gas. He never identified the name of the fuel gas but said it was extremely explosive.

The primary test car was using the cell in conjunction with petrol in a car with carburetor. Some were getting 225 miles per gallon.

This cell has supposedly been used in Australia since about 1942 or thereabouts with great success.

Best Regards,
Slovenia

[Slovenia]

NaCl + H2O electrolyzed to H2 + O2 + N2 = (NH3?) + (NO2?)

For whatever reason, the strong vacuum within the cell at all times was supposed to be of paramount importance.

[Jetijs]

Sounds a bit like joecell concept. I guess Joe left some very important things out. Thank you for the info, every little bit helps. Hope we can put all the needed things together correctly soon for the good of humanity.

[Slovenia]

Jetijs,

Good to hear from you.

Best Regards,
Slovenia

[Slovenia]

I got contacted. According to the contact, these cells are being produced and used as we speak. They are not sold on the open market because you are not supposed to own them.

[adam_mizer]

Do you think it would make a difference where the (air) nitrogen would enter the cell and mix?
Also does the air have to be preheated?
Wondering whether the air should be positioned in maybe, a tube under or entering inbetween the cell electrodes?
Maybe the air runs through an ionizer first?
Just trying to byte away at this.
Lots of questions.

[adam_mizer]

Was just thinking a little more about why maybe its under a vacuum.
If air was mixed in and hydroxly was being made and a ionizer being used the gases would not ignite in a vacuum situation crossing a corona discharge maybe and creating the higher volatility.
Just guessing away at this trying to get some further thoughts.
This sounds pretty dangerous if not done correctly, and vacuum would be very important.

[Slovenia]

My Gut Feeling

Do you think it would make a difference where the (air) nitrogen would enter the cell and mix?
Also does the air have to be preheated?
Wondering whether the air should be positioned in maybe, a tube under or entering inbetween the cell electrodes?
Maybe the air runs through an ionizer first?
Just trying to byte away at this.
Lots of questions.

This contact said that the cell should not be provided with an air inlet at all.

Prior to his response, I summarized what we had been told to try regarding the cell. He said it was no wonder it didn't work because we were doing it all wrong. He didn't elaborate on this at all.

He did say however that the cell needed to be activated on the engine it was to be run on and only that engine because the cell had a memory like a battery. He asked what we were using as a power source for the cell, alternator, power converter, etc.. I told him only the 12 volt battery. He asked if we were using a catalyst to get the cell going. I told him we were just using a pinch of rock salt. He responded back that enough salt had to be added to the water to properly calibrate the cell. He didn't elaborate on what he meant by this. He did say in passing that it was no wonder the cell wasn't working properly because we were doing everything wrong with it.

I got a couple impressions from his response whether right or wrong.
(My Gut Feeling Only)
1) Higher voltage say 120 volts plus would be a good idea as it came directly off the alternator.
2) A lot more salt was necessary for instance maybe the same amount found in typical sea water.
3) I got the impression that incoming air was a bad idea for whatever reason, but it would be impossible to completely prevent air from entering the cell I would think.

Anyway, he was careful to not give any specific information and/or suggestions other than maybe I didn't add enough salt; the amount of electricity was wrong; and an air inlet was a bad idea. He did say WT_ was the air inlet all about?

[Slovenia]

Vacuum

Was just thinking a little more about why maybe its under a vacuum.
If air was mixed in and hydroxly was being made and a ionizer being used the gases would not ignite in a vacuum situation crossing a corona discharge maybe and creating the higher volatility.
Just guessing away at this trying to get some further thoughts.
This sounds pretty dangerous if not done correctly, and vacuum would be very important.

This contact didn't mention vacuum, but all my contact in the past said that vacuum was of paramount importance.

[adam_mizer]

Well what bothers me are the salts.
I think they relate to hydrogenchlorides and chlorite and corrosive acids.
Also remind me of chlorine or chlorination, and I don't know what the by product for the environment is.
Now being something that shouldn't be used or sold in Australia and people were told to stop using them maybe the final product is a contaminent to the environment.
Does anybody know the chemical breakdown of combusted sea-salts with hydroxyl. I'm sure this was covered at one time.
What comes out the tail pipe in the end of the reaction?

[ewizard]

NaCl + H2O electrolyzed to H2 + O2 + N2 = (NH3?) + (NO2?)

For whatever reason, the strong vacuum within the cell at all times was supposed to be of paramount importance.

I'm thinking it might be more likely N2O (nitrous oxide) which is used in racing cars or for temporary large increases in horsepower. Using a lot of N2O can be rather damaging to an ICE but used in small amounts I'm guessing it might increase mileage.

[Slovenia]

Big Oil

Well what bothers me are the salts.
I think they relate to hydrogenchlorides and chlorite and corrosive acids.
Also remind me of chlorine or chlorination, and I don't know what the by product for the environment is.
Now being something that shouldn't be used or sold in Australia and people were told to stop using them maybe the final product is a contaminent to the environment.
Does anybody know the chemical breakdown of combusted sea-salts with hydroxyl. I'm sure this was covered at one time.
What comes out the tail pipe in the end of the reaction?

I got the impression from a previous contact that Big Oil was the only reason for the suppression issue of this device. Very high gas mileage has been reported and that's not acceptable to the blokes who own the oil refineries and control us.

If we had these devices available to us we would be much more energy independent.

[Aaron]

pH important!

Slovenia,

On one page, it was pointed out - the only bolded line on the
whole page discussed that the pH must be 7 or below.

Sodium chloride in water makes pH 7 I think.

But perhaps with some nitrogen compounds in water the water
may become a bit more acidic?