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cdsalmons
02-25-2008, 08:55 PM
I first posted this in the "Electric Motor Secrets" since I was basing my modified electric motor on Peter's design. I am strting a new thread for like minded people that might be interested in area. Here is my original post:

"Hi everyone,
I have been reading the board for a while now, but was unable to post. Aaron fixed it for me. Anyway, here is my question:

I have been interested in building/converting an electric car for several years now. I have been designing a system that consists of a 100hp DC motor, 255Ahr 2volt batteries, and some ultracapacitors.

Can you help me convert such a large system? My aim is not OU, but high efficency. With my current design, I can range 120-180 miles per charge, which is gret as far as EV's go. But if that could be doubled or better, you can immagine the possibilities. Thank you for any response, Dustin"

cdsalmons
02-25-2008, 09:21 PM
Here is an over simplified version of what I have in mind:

Motor: 30HP - 100HP peek DC motor modified to No Back EMF
Batteries: 72 2volt 255Ahr SLA for a total of 144 volt 16,200 Ahr
Capacitors: 125 volt 3000 Farad Ultracapacitor module
Recovery: Bedini type circut on wheels/ or drivetrain

I hope this helps a litle, Dustin

elias
02-26-2008, 06:16 AM
Hi Dustin,

We all would like to know more about your system, my next project is maybe mounting a motor on my road bike to make it go faster, perhaps up to 100km/h! So it is pretty interesting for me to know more about your system.

What I think that may be a real benefit to you would be learning more about magnets. Take a look at http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/2magpup.htm
You may be able to increase the power output of your motor by coupling magnets in certain configurations. Also you may like to read http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1616-secret-extracting-mechanical-energy-out-ssg.html
much carefully, as I have explained how one can increase the mechanical energy output without putting much drag on the motor by using magnets. If you learn the principles, you can make those powerful NdFeB magnet do work for you and double the power of you motor. You can even make your motor do more work by using more magnets and wheels. I am also willing to build an over-unity magnetic mechanical amplifier by using the principles outlined on the links above. But not at the moment which I am on my military training.

Good Luck,

Elias

cdsalmons
02-26-2008, 08:33 AM
Thanks for the tips. I have read your other posts. I am glad you are interested. I hope that we can help each other on this one. I am still trying to figure out the best way to go. The more that I learn about the Muller generator, the more I am leaning towards that. Even if you lost half af your HP, if you get a 100-150HP to start with, you would have more than enought power. Energize that one that is powered by a smaller 20HP motor, and back it up with ultracaps for initial cranking amps. There is several directions this project could go. I want to keep it as simple as possiable, but at the same time it must be a viable gas replacement. So what do you suggest?

elias
02-26-2008, 11:43 AM
Hi,

Well, what I think that is really useful for all of us, is talking about the easiest and most affordable way to convert a car which runs on gasoline to run on electricity. Electric cars are not available everywhere. Electric motors are safe and cool especially when we capture energy back from the motor (Like Peter's motor) and make the motor cool down. So they are perfect alternatives, maybe even to Hydrogen. I have an e-book about designing electric vehicles, which I have to find it from my hard drive.

One can buy a cheap second hand car, and take the motor and any other junk out of it, including the fuel tank, and put an electric motor powerful enough to drive it with good set of batteries. This seems a bit sophisticated but, it is one of my hobbies.

Even I think about taking the gearbox out of it and replacing it with over-unity magnetic gears, which can deliver more power at higher speeds. This may require higher engineering skills.

Any insights on how to do this is welcome.

Elias

cdsalmons
02-26-2008, 09:50 PM
You both have valid trains of thought. I am not strict in what direction you all would like to explore, but I am focused on pure electric and I will explain why.

For one, many different companies are working on hybrids (directly or indirectly) that have millions of dollars behind them. In those areas, they will be more effective than we would be able to be on limited budgets.

2. Greed. Everything that comes out of the mouths of oil companies, or "Free Energy" pioneers, have alterior motives. Media is a means to control the masses to condense opinion to single thought. To hear an oil company tell it, we are running out of oil next year, so we must allow them to waist billions of dollars and vast natural resources, so we can continue to fill up our Hummers. Their main focus is their own bottom line, not what is best for our great grand kids. (NOTE: I am NOT refering to John or Peter, or anyone else that make real contributions. I am talking about the "If you just invest $10,000 we will be a billion dollar company next year" kind of pitches

3. With all electric, reliance on other countries will not deturmine the cost of my trip. By eliminating the greedy factors, we can get on the road that we need to be on. Cars can be converted from gas to batt packs, or made from the ground up.

I think that we sould focus on CONVERTING a car to prove our technology and develop a working platform. I will explain some of my ideas when I get home. I have been studying EC's for several years now. I am so fed up with currupt corporations, that I want to make a difference.

If you have not heard what car companies have done in the past, a good place to search is on the GM EV-1. They proved the technology was there, leased approx 550 cars, then reposesed all but a few, (That were decommissioned) and CRUSHED them! Same thing with the Toyota EV-Rav 4. I can go more in detail later, but I think it is of most importance to do something to make a difference instead of standing by and be brain-washed. Even with technologies now, we can get over 100 miles per charge. 5 minute charge times (with supercapacitors), and be emmision free. (The main limitations that car companies said must be overcome before going public) I don't want to reinvent the wheel, I just want to reapply new technics, and show people that there is a better way.

Thanks for taking the time. I will elp out as much as I can. Most people on the board have more hands-on experience so your imput is greately apperciated. Thanks again, Dustin

gmeat
02-27-2008, 12:40 AM
Hi Guys,


I couldnt help but chime in on this.Has anyone heard anything about EESTor super capacitors? :D .It seems that the company is for real bacause they just signed a contrct with Lockeed Martin and I dont think that they would waste thier time with super capacitor technology if it is in fact BS.I wish someone could tell me more about this company because the way I see it this is where the EV could literally take off.An EV company out of Canada called ZENN has invested in EESTor also.This EESTor has to be sitting on something big but will we ever see it?.Here are some links for anyone interested.(dam sure wish I could get some stock in this company :wall: ).

EEstor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EEstor)
ZENN Motor Company (http://www.zenncars.com/)


-gmeat

Aaron
02-27-2008, 03:17 AM
Dustin,

Whatever method you use, you can always incorporate aerodynamics to increase the efficiency of electric or other fuel:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1546-aerocivic-95-mpg.html#post1470

Ewhaz
02-27-2008, 08:08 AM
I'd always had plans from the beginning to incorporate all this information into an electric car. It's just a matter of how.


For one thing, if using Peters motor designs you have to incorporate some sort of directional bias. Mostly this would be a starter motor of some sort, or some design that allowed the motor to turn in the desired direction from the get go. Second off, with Bedini's principles, you could easily draw energy off each pulse to the coils, use them to recharge the batteries or send it to the front of the system to help negate the overall power consumption.

Since the batteries cannot be charged while they are in use, you may have to have two sets of batteries, charging and power, to use in these systems. Depending on the performance of the motor etc, this will decide if this is feasible, otherwise you may have to incorporate a charging method such as charging it when not in use with a bedini system that uses a few batteries to charge a lot more. really no one is going to know anything until you get down to it and actually build one. Since this would be such a large expensive initial build, maybe a few who are interested in this should get together and join forces/money/ideas?

elias
02-27-2008, 08:53 AM
Since the batteries cannot be charged while they are in use, you may have to have two sets of batteries, charging and power, to use in these systems. Depending on the performance of the motor etc, this will decide if this is feasible, otherwise you may have to incorporate a charging method such as charging it when not in use with a bedini system that uses a few batteries to charge a lot more. really no one is going to know anything until you get down to it and actually build one. Since this would be such a large expensive initial build, maybe a few who are interested in this should get together and join forces/money/ideas?

Ewhaz,

I am still not sure why batteries cannot be charged while they are in use. If Jim Watson's machine worked, then what kind of batteries were they? I suppose experimentation is needed before any claims. I think that Peter's motor can easily be made to dump the output capacitor to the input battery, by using a relay to make the system work like Rick's self-runner. Or why the original school girl motor back in 2000 was able to run a whole week on a small 9v battery? No SSG can do that!

Using two sets of batteries may be too heavy, for a car, which may make it take more energy for acceleration. I still think that we must increase the output torque of the motor, by using magnets to make it use less energy.

My first attempt would be building a system to convert my road bike into a hybrid, man-powered, electric vehicle. This is much more feasible as it requires less time, money. If we can do this on small scale like a bicycle for example, we can scale this up! For a bicycle, four 12v7Ah batteries (or a custom battery pack) + a capacitor bank + a Lindemann motor + a 30:1 gearbox, would suffice I suppose, to build a unit which can operate hours. This would even be real fun as the bicycle would be hybrid and one can have a push button on it for fast acceleration!

Maybe it would be better to start a new thread for bicycle conversion.

Elias

gtadmin
02-27-2008, 10:12 AM
You may want to look at these websites:

Rod Muller's Electric Car (http://solarquip.com.au/chisholm/electric_car.html)

and Electric Echo - Journal (http://www.electric-echo.com/journal.htm)

cdsalmons
02-28-2008, 12:29 AM
I have been waiting to hear from them for over two years now. Most of the information that is going around about them are from other people, not the company themselves. They are trying to keep everything a close secret. They did sign a contact with LM, but I am sure that even if the technology comes available, the government is not going to let it out, atleast for a while. It has been said that their capacitors have been proven, but they are trying to get everything sorted out with production. All I know is that for over two years, very little has been said. I hope this changes soon, Dustin



Hi Guys,


I couldnt help but chime in on this.Has anyone heard anything about EESTor super capacitors? :D .It seems that the company is for real bacause they just signed a contrct with Lockeed Martin and I dont think that they would waste thier time with super capacitor technology if it is in fact BS.I wish someone could tell me more about this company because the way I see it this is where the EV could literally take off.An EV company out of Canada called ZENN has invested in EESTor also.This EESTor has to be sitting on something big but will we ever see it?.Here are some links for anyone interested.(dam sure wish I could get some stock in this company :wall: ).

EEstor - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EEstor)
ZENN Motor Company (http://www.zenncars.com/)


-gmeat

cdsalmons
02-28-2008, 12:33 AM
Aaron,
There are many things that will need to be worked out. I think the easiest way is to look at racing products. For my first car, I am just going to add a body-kit. Later on, I will look into carbon fibor, and other light products. Thanks for your imput, Dustin

Dustin,

Whatever method you use, you can always incorporate aerodynamics to increase the efficiency of electric or other fuel:
http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1546-aerocivic-95-mpg.html#post1470

cdsalmons
02-28-2008, 12:45 AM
I was looking through EV conversion kits (VERY EXPENSIVE!) and noticed a common trend. For example a Chevy S-10 will go 40 miles per charge with a 144 volt 5500 Ahr pack. Most people use 6v batteries, but I think the best way is 2v 255 Ahr. The overall weight is less with 3x more power.

So what would be the problem with having two banks of 20-30 batteries each with a dc-dc converter to get the specs needed. A Bendini circut can be connected to each of the wheels to charge bank 1, while running on bank two. Once the bank is charged up, switch. A converter would be less efficient, but would allow two banks for the space of one. Also, I m thinking a ultracapacitor for cranking amps and peak loads.

Thanks, Dustin

cdsalmons
02-28-2008, 01:02 AM
By any chance, does anyone know how to grid-tie an AC generator? I have seen DC-AC grid tie inverters for solar-wind, but not one that could be used to push energy back to the grid via a genset. I am thinking this would be a good area to workout incase we need to plug in our cars at home. With grid tie, the power company becomes your battery bank. So besides your car, you would get free energy at home too through the grid. Most states will carry over your credits to the next month, so it will save a ton of money.
Thanks, Dustin

cdsalmons
02-28-2008, 03:37 AM
I found a few PDF's that you all might be interested in. The first is a Bedini system. Take note of the Tesla Switch on the last page.
http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter6.pdf

This one is for Self-Powered Engines (http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter8.pdf)

And this one has ALOT of information on Vehicle Systems
(http://www.panaceauniversity.org/Chapter10.pdf)

I hope this helps a bit, Dustin

jimmydean
03-05-2008, 09:39 PM
Here is a site I've been watching for awhile.

EV Photo Album: Our Electric Cars on the Web (http://www.evalbum.com/)

Quite a few first hand examples.

Chip Shorter
03-06-2008, 01:55 AM
I remember as a kid in the late seventies a car that would drive down the street by my school. The car sounded real wierd. Not quiet like a golf cart or loud like a gas car but sounded like ball bearings rolling on sheet metal as it drove by. It got to be a regular occurance.

A number of years later I was talking to a guy at Hamfest and a story came up about a local inventor that had an electric car that ran forever without fuel or charge. I described the car and the sound it made. He said he had known the guy but he had died. I guess legend has it that motor made like 400 horsepower. When he went to market it he ran into road blocks. Something like the state of Illinois wouldn't let him incorporate or something like that. So he moved his operations out of state. I know it wasn't Ed Gray. And I'm sure wasn't urban legend due to the fact I saw the car myself. In fact looking for info on that guy like who he was and how his setup worked is how I became interested in renewable energy.

Peter Lindemann
03-06-2008, 04:45 PM
I remember as a kid in the late seventies a car that would drive down the street by my school. The car sounded real wierd. Not quiet like a golf cart or loud like a gas car but sounded like ball bearings rolling on sheet metal as it drove by. It got to be a regular occurance.

A number of years later I was talking to a guy at Hamfest and a story came up about a local inventor that had an electric car that ran forever without fuel or charge. I described the car and the sound it made. He said he had known the guy but he had died. I guess legend has it that motor made like 400 horsepower. When he went to market it he ran into road blocks. Something like the state of Illinois wouldn't let him incorporate or something like that. So he moved his operations out of state. I know it wasn't Ed Gray. And I'm sure wasn't urban legend due to the fact I saw the car myself. In fact looking for info on that guy like who he was and how his setup worked is how I became interested in renewable energy.

Chip,

This sounds like it might have been Rory Johnson. The time frame is right, and the self running 400 hp electric motor sounds about right. See if that helps you track it down.

Rory Johnson: Magnatron engine (http://www.rexresearch.com/magntron/magntron.htm)

Peter

Chip Shorter
03-07-2008, 03:40 AM
Thats the guy. I remembered he had an uncommon first name. I would like to continue learning about his invention and his story. I was looking for that for 3-4 years now but couldn't for the life of me remember his name.

About renewable energy I have been working on things off and on for about ten years now. I first made a machine in early 1999 that is very similar to a Kromrey convertor.

I think the ultimate goal for me is a pollution free car. Notice I use the term pollution free. A lot of people have electric cars now but if the coal power plant is charging your batteries for you is it really pollution free?

Once again thanks Peter for the Rory Johnson link.

cdsalmons
03-08-2008, 03:13 AM
I don't think their is a way for 100% pollution free. But I think the more we offset, the better this planet will be. As long as BIG OIL has a stake in it, I think it will be a long time before our way of thinking hits mainstream.

I am working on an electric car design that is "I project" 90%+ I still have much to learn, but even after I learn it, I will be scared to share it. It is a sad reality but just look at the last person that wanted to put a "100mpg" car on the road mass scale.

What is said, and what is done are two completely different things. The technology is already here, but the masses will not see it as long as "other people" have a vested interest in other areas. Thanks, Dustin

sykavy
03-12-2008, 12:13 AM
Here is a practical way you guys might want to look into

Car pushes past 100 mpg
almost completely electric car
Mr. Dabrowski is referred to as the “Insight guru” for a system he has developed that can get as much as 100 miles per gallon from the Honda Insight, a hybrid electric automobile the company stopped making in 2006. The car had an EPA rating of 57 mpg. The Manual Integrated Motor Assist system allows the driver to control the automobile’s gas-to-electric ratio to boost gasoline mileage an average 10 percent to 20 percent on Insights. He said about 60 Insights in the United States, England and Australia use the $750 system, and that there is a waiting list. Mr. Dabrowski also developed a fifth wheel — an electric wheel — that drops down from the car’s trunk to generate electricity to run the car. That invention, which he does not sell, allows his car to run almost purely on electricity and can get 180 miles per gallon or more at slow speeds on flat roads, he said. Mr. Dabrowski said he began modifying his Honda Insight in 2003 because the driver could do a better job of controlling the gasoline-electric ratio that was controlled automatically by the car’s computer system. After all, he reasoned, the computer can’t see the hills or traffic conditions up ahead. Mr. Dabrowski said he doesn’t expect the automobile industry to embrace total electric cars because of the financial impact of retooling an entire industry and the impact on the repair and maintenance business (electric cars need less) and all the related industries that electric cars don’t need. “I’ve posted a lot of stuff online (his Web site is www.99mpg.com), and I’m just as likely to get a call from someone in India or England as from the next town about it,” he said. /
KeelyNet 2008 - Free Energy / Gravity Control / Electronic Health / Alternative Science - 01/01/08 (http://www.keelynet.com/)



Worcester Telegram & Gazette News (http://www.telegram.com/article/20080303/NEWS/803030568/1116/NEWSREWIND)
Fith weel works to generate electricity

http://www.keelynet.com/carinsight.jpg

cdsalmons
03-20-2008, 04:59 AM
Great info man, thanks. I am looking to build a 100% electric car, but this is a great step in the right direction. Thanks again, Dustin


Here is a practical way you guys might want to look into

Car pushes past 100 mpg
almost completely electric car
Mr. Dabrowski is referred to as the “Insight guru” for a system he has developed that can get as much as 100 miles per gallon from the Honda Insight, a hybrid electric automobile the company stopped making in 2006. The car had an EPA rating of 57 mpg. The Manual Integrated Motor Assist system allows the driver to control the automobile’s gas-to-electric ratio to boost gasoline mileage an average 10 percent to 20 percent on Insights. He said about 60 Insights in the United States, England and Australia use the $750 system, and that there is a waiting list. Mr. Dabrowski also developed a fifth wheel — an electric wheel — that drops down from the car’s trunk to generate electricity to run the car. That invention, which he does not sell, allows his car to run almost purely on electricity and can get 180 miles per gallon or more at slow speeds on flat roads, he said. Mr. Dabrowski said he began modifying his Honda Insight in 2003 because the driver could do a better job of controlling the gasoline-electric ratio that was controlled automatically by the car’s computer system. After all, he reasoned, the computer can’t see the hills or traffic conditions up ahead. Mr. Dabrowski said he doesn’t expect the automobile industry to embrace total electric cars because of the financial impact of retooling an entire industry and the impact on the repair and maintenance business (electric cars need less) and all the related industries that electric cars don’t need. “I’ve posted a lot of stuff online (his Web site is www.99mpg.com), and I’m just as likely to get a call from someone in India or England as from the next town about it,” he said. /
KeelyNet 2008 - Free Energy / Gravity Control / Electronic Health / Alternative Science - 01/01/08 (http://www.keelynet.com/)



Worcester Telegram & Gazette News (http://www.telegram.com/article/20080303/NEWS/803030568/1116/NEWSREWIND)
Fith weel works to generate electricity

http://www.keelynet.com/carinsight.jpg

ganon2234
03-25-2008, 01:02 AM
Hi Dustin,

We all would like to know more about your system, my next project is maybe mounting a motor on my road bike to make it go faster, perhaps up to 100km/h! So it is pretty interesting for me to know more about your system.

What I think that may be a real benefit to you would be learning more about magnets. Take a look at http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/2magpup.htm
You may be able to increase the power output of your motor by coupling magnets in certain configurations. Also you may like to read http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/1616-secret-extracting-mechanical-energy-out-ssg.html
much carefully, as I have explained how one can increase the mechanical energy output without putting much drag on the motor by using magnets. If you learn the principles, you can make those powerful NdFeB magnet do work for you and double the power of you motor. You can even make your motor do more work by using more magnets and wheels. I am also willing to build an over-unity magnetic mechanical amplifier by using the principles outlined on the links above. But not at the moment which I am on my military training.

Good Luck,

Elias

working on a bike sounds like a really great idea. i dont really know all of the ins and outs of electronics but cant you just make a dynamo to one wheel, and have the wire output going to a motor on the other wheel? i really want to get ideas together for making a fast bike

elias
03-27-2008, 10:26 AM
working on a bike sounds like a really great idea. i dont really know all of the ins and outs of electronics but cant you just make a dynamo to one wheel, and have the wire output going to a motor on the other wheel? i really want to get ideas together for making a fast bike

Not at all!!
A dynamo puts so much drag on the wheel of the bicycle which would make this impossible!!!
The idea is to design a Lindemann motor so that it can be mounted instead of the hub into the front wheel of the bicycle, which recovers energy as it does work. The easier way is to place a motor on the back of the saddle and connect it to the rear wheel by using chains. Also there are battery packs suitable for mounting on the frame of the bicycle.

Elias

sykavy
04-13-2008, 11:29 PM
Interesting video of the 5th wheel guy
YouTube - Mike Dabrowski at Hybrid Fest 2007 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL7JfG8PaFc)

also this hypermilager
YouTube - Hybrid Fest 2007 Hypermiler 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OmPACGHNZGc&mode=related&search=)