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zogo
08-29-2012, 06:01 PM
Hi folks.

I have tried to create a Bedini schoolgirl motor, like on this page http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/365-bedini-schoolgirl.html, with no success.

I am sure that I have connected all components correctly, as the pushing coil generates some voltage, but not enough to push away the magnets as the rotor spins.

Therefore I would like to ask a kind soul to measure his/hers Bedini motor with a voltmeter and post the numbers here.

1. What battery size do you use? i have 2x9v batteries in series.
2. How much voltage does the trigger coil generate when the motor starts spinning?
3. How many volts does the pushing coil receive?
4. How many ohms do the coils have?

As far as I have measured on my circuit, the trigger coil can create 0.5v ac when my rotor spins fast. This gives my pushing coil about 1v dc max. This is without a resistance in the circuit. With resistance, it is much much lower.

Please help anyone.

citfta
08-29-2012, 07:40 PM
Hi Zogo,

You already have started one thread about your problems with the Bedini SSG. You didn't need to start another one. Did you follow any of the advice all the people gave you on the other thread? Do you have a single coil with both the trigger and power windings wound together on it? Did you get a much larger wheel so it would be easier to get the separation you need between magnets? Did you change your magnets to ceramic magnets? Did you look at the other thread that was posted that tells all about building the SSG? Did you mount your coils solidly about 1/8 to 1/4 inch from the magnets. If you want it to work you have to follow the advise of those that are trying to help you. Please post a picture of what you now have and maybe someone will be able to help. Hundreds of people have built this circuit and gotten it to work just fine.

Respectfully,
Carroll

zogo
08-30-2012, 05:03 PM
Hello Carroll.

Thanks for your reply. I was under the impression that my previous thread was closed, so I open a new one. :wall:

Anyway. I have followed most of the advices. I'm now using larger powersource (2x9v batteries). I've soldered most of the wires, and connected the rest using those white connector thingy's with screws.

I've not tried the cheramic magnets. I've seen this video on youtube Build Your Own Bedini North Pole Motor [HD]- YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xeP3If7ODxY) and this one Bedini pulse motor, build and diagram video 3 of 3. (TheDaftMan) - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0U20V7Kh_kc&list=UUij-JAz4TWEr_qCgrZ4NVOA&index=27&feature=plcp), where they all use neo magnets, so it must be able to work with the ones I got. But why is the timing difficult when using neos?

I am posting 3 pictures of my current work with comments on them.
http://www.zogo.dk/Bedini/1.jpg
http://www.zogo.dk/Bedini/2.jpg
http://www.zogo.dk/Bedini/3.jpg

I have used a different size rotor for comparisson, and this was even worse then the one I currently am using.
Basically I know that the Bedini motor must have the resistors and the bulb to protect the transistor, but honostly, I have soooo low voltage in my system, that I can barely light a small LED.

So my concern at the moment is the low voltage that is sent to the pushing coil. The voltage is perpetual to the speed in which the rotor spins. This can only mean that the circuit is working, but the voltage is so low, that the pushing coil cannot push the magnet away because the iron core's field is much stronger. (I have tried to reverse wires, trust me).

Can someone just tell me what DC voltage they measure across the transistors collector and the battery/powersource plus? (The voltage that the pushing coil receives). If this voltage is higher then 0.10v (which I have) then something must be wrong in my trigger coil, my pushing coil or the rotor.

Wow now my fingers hurt from all the writing :rolleyes:

zogo
08-30-2012, 05:20 PM
I forgot to mention that I hold the coil close to the rotor by hand, so I am able to adjust the position. And I am sorry that the pictures are so large and the quality of them.

citfta
08-30-2012, 06:31 PM
Hi Zogo,

Ok let's start from the beginning about how this is supposed to work. And then we'll look at how to find your problem. When you spin the rotor the magnet passing the trigger coil will generate about 2 to 3 volts. The pot which you don't have will let you control the current to the transistor base so we don't burn out the base of the transistor. When the voltage on the base reaches about .6 to .7 volts current will start flowing into the base of the transistor and will turn the transistor on and allow the 18 volts or so to flow through the power winding of the coil and this will kick the magnet away from the coil. At the same time the current going through the power winding will induce a reverse current flow in the trigger winding which will cause the transistor to turn off more quickly. If you have a digital meter connected to the trigger winding when you spin the transistor the meter will not react fast enough to give you a true reading of the voltage you are actually getting from the trigger winding. And an analogue meter will only show a small kick of the needle also. You cannot measure the short pulse of voltage you will get with a meter and get an accurate measurement. You said you could light a small Led with the trigger winding. That is good. It means the trigger winding is working.

Now let's try and get the power winding working correctly. You need to disconnect the wire going from the coil to the collector of the transistor. Leave the other wire connected to the positive side of your batteries. Now hold the coil close to one of the magnets and then tap the end of the coil that is loose to the negative of your batteries. If the power winding is good and your batteries are good then the magnet should jump away. If the coil is pulled to the magnet then you need to swap the coil wires and then try again. When you can get the coil to kick the magnet away then leave the positive connected to your batteries and connect the other end to the transistor collector. Now LEAVE them that way. There is no reason to ever change them again because you now have them correctly phased.

Now be SURE and connect the neon bulb between the collector and emitter or connect your battery you are trying to charge with the diode from the collector. If you don't then you WILL kill your transistor if the trigger winding is working. I am afraid you may have already killed your transistor because I do not see a neon bulb from the collector to the emitter in your pictures.

Now holding the coil close to the rotor give the rotor a spin and see what happens. If the motor does not start then you have a problem with the trigger winding or a bad transistor, or the trigger winding may be connected backwards. If it doesn't start then swap the wires coming from the trigger coil and try again. If it starts you need to stop it very quickly and install the pot so you can adjust the current to the transistor or you WILL burn it out. If it does not start then remove the diode from the base to the emitter and try again. You may have damaged the diode. If that does not help then you may have a bad transistor and will need to replace it and try again.

Another serious problem I see is the magnets. What is holding them to the rotor? If you get that little rotor to work it will be spinning at several hundred to maybe a thousand rpm or so. Those magnets are going to go flying off that rotor like bullets and someone or something is going to get seriously hurt. You need to wrap fiberglass packing tape or something equally as strong around those magnets to keep them from flying off.

In the picture your coil windings look like plain bare copper wire. Does your wire have an enamel coating on it? If it has the coating did you clean all the coating off very carefully before you soldered it?

That is all I can think of for now. Good luck.

Carroll

zogo
08-30-2012, 07:25 PM
Oh my God, Carroll. It works. :notworthy:

It actually spins by itself, slowly but it actually works. I did have the pushing coil reversed, so 1.000.000 thanks for that tip. Oh my God, you deserve a big applaus for taking your time to write me and for being so patient with me.

I used just a single 9v battery instead of 2 and this somehow did the job along with the swithing polarity.

So I have a new set of questions, now that I am in the club of Bedinians :)

Is it true that you can charge any battery, also non-re-chargable ones?
And how hard can this overunity thing really be? (ironically meant) Cant someone just connect the charging battery wires to the power battery and recharge the battery as it spins? (i guess this is called unity)

Again Carroll, a million thanks for your help. I know that I wont sleep tonight because of this. You wouldnt believe how many hours Ive spent on this.

citfta
08-30-2012, 08:06 PM
Good for you Zogo.

I'll try to answer your questions. First the fact you have it running but it is only going slowly says means there are still some problems but you can work on them to get things better. At least now you have it working so you can see what happens when you make an improvement. I suspect it is running slowly because of the neos. There is a good reason why everyone that really knows anything about this circuit says to use regular ceramic magnets. The magnets are only used to create the trigger pulse. They do not help the charging in any way at all. And they actually hurt the charging because as you realized they create a lot of drag. Also it takes a lot of current through the power coil to reverse the magnetic field and kick the magnet away. Another way to get a lot more efficiency from the SSG is to use a large wheel like a bicycle wheel. The larger mass and smoother running help to increase the efficiency. A small grain of wheat bulb in series with your adjusting potentiometer helps to keep the SSG in tune. Then several hours of learning how to properly tune it will go a long way towards getting the most efficiency from your machine.

Yes you can charge other kinds of batteries with the SSG. However you have to be careful with small batteries as they can be overheated and then they will leak. A single coil machine will not charge an automotive size battery very well. It will take several days to charge one of them with a single coil SSG. Also to get more efficiency when charging batteries you will need some larger batteries than the little 9 volt ones you have been using.

No you can't connect the output back to the input as this will create a dead short across the coil and will stop the whole system.

Later,
Carroll

zogo
08-31-2012, 10:57 AM
Can I use something else other then the neon bulb. On my previous post http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/12147-bedini-ssg-problems.html I noticed that everyone told me to use a neon bulb between the emitter and collector, and tachyoncatcher also mentioned that a capacitor can be used (at least a capacitor).
The case is that I live in Denmark, and we can't find much 110v equipment here, only 220v.

Also, can someone explain why overunity is so hard to achieve and what the problem is? I know that some law of nature prohibits more output energy then input energy, but I can't understand why.
I mean, if you take a Bedini, put it on a shaft, and on that shaft you also add another rotor, that generates electricity, can't you take that electricity, run it through a bridge rectifier and pump it through a series of capacitors which then acts as the powersource for the Bedini? :thinking:

citfta
08-31-2012, 11:15 AM
Hi Zogo,

The Bedini SSG is a battery charger/rejuvenater. It is not a motor. It is not designed to produce a lot of power. If you want a very efficient motor then you would have to build the Bedini window motor. It has some real torque and can drive a small load. You would have to build a large one if you wanted to drive a reasonable load with it.

If you put a cap across the transistor you will absorb all the spike you are trying to generate for charging your battery. A neon is the best way to protect your transistor. The part number of the neon you want is a "NE-2". You should be able to order some of them from any electronics supply place. They are also very cheap. Usually less than 1 US dollar for each one. The neon bulb will only fire when the voltage gets too high. You will normally not see it light up unless you have forgotten to connect the battery you are trying to charge.

Later,
Carroll

Peculian
09-02-2012, 08:56 PM
Can I use something else other then the neon bulb. On my previous post http://www.energeticforum.com/renewable-energy/12147-bedini-ssg-problems.html I noticed that everyone told me to use a neon bulb between the emitter and collector, and tachyoncatcher also mentioned that a capacitor can be used (at least a capacitor).
The case is that I live in Denmark, and we can't find much 110v equipment here, only 220v.

Also, can someone explain why overunity is so hard to achieve and what the problem is?

Hi Zogo.
You can simply use 220V neon bulb.
Me too I live in Europe and I use 220V for my Bedini Energizer.
Overunity is not hard to achieve but it depends on how one perceives overunity.
For some people it is just another myth in history, and for others a big reality.
My suggestion therefore to you is to study about this stuff in forums like this one, and books/e-books wich try to explain the energy effects.
So, better study the matter yourself so you can make up your mind on the subject.
The biggest problem working against overunity is how humankind uses and "treat" & teach electricity.
Established science purposedly ignores some effects and go to the point to classify these electricity effects as "undesired".
Along your journey in search for energy independence you will learn a lot of things,
and I can guarantee you , that some of the things you will learn will dissapoint you so much that probably you will stop trying to search for it.
What others say in this forum ? Most guys will tell you: Do not ever stop your research and experiments !
Others will say: Duh... take a "life" buddy, don`t waste your time and money !

I personally am in the "go for it" group, and not the "stop searchin" group.
Would you stop your favorite hobby of fishing just because you didn`t catch something the last 2 months ? ;)

Take your time to make the right conclusions.
Best Regards.

Farmhand
09-03-2012, 07:51 PM
Hi Zogo, I agree with Peculian that it depends on your perspective of what
over unity is. It is a term tat can be used to describe many different
situations.

Personally my view is similar to what we see from a solar panel, as in after the
device has been used for a period of time I would expect to have more stored
potential energy than I did when I started.

With batteries it can be misleading because when a battery is first loaded the
voltage drops, then after a time if the battery can sustain the load, as the
chemical action catches up to the loading the battery voltage can then rise
again before dropping constantly. Also if a battery is a bit sulfated when it is
pulse drained or loaded fairly well the batteries capacity can increase and in
my opinion can sometimes "open up" a battery and make the battery able to
produce more power for no other reason than the battery condition has improved.

I've had a battery with a standing voltage of 12.8 volts but when loaded it
would produce almost no power for a little while but I waited and it produced
more and more under a 21 watt bulb load until eventually it was lighting the
load as normal, then next time I went to use it the same happened.

We are all free to have our own thoughts on what we see as over unity. What
would you be satisfied with as evidence of over unity ? The definition some
people have would mean we all see over unity regularly.

Cheers