Energetic Forum

Energetic Forum (http://www.energeticforum.com/)
-   Agriculture (http://www.energeticforum.com/agriculture/)
-   -   The Ciba-geigy-effect (http://www.energeticforum.com/agriculture/5892-ciba-geigy-effect.html)

Savvypro 03-02-2011 09:25 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Patent attached...

Vortex 03-09-2011 12:00 AM

well seems easy enough to follow up on
 
Der Urzeit Code - Die ökologische Alternative zur umstrittenen Gen-Technologie
Video @ 8:11 shows red lead/wire on the top plate and
black lead/wire on bottom plate ... but Jetijs said:
"You need the negative electrode on the top and the positive on the bottom."

Now the question becomes: Is the result they are seeing and speaking about
come from reversing the normal potential or from increasing
the normal potential between sky and earth?

$4.5 gets ya a 120 AC input, Output: 7.5 KV 60 Hz
Negative Ion Air Purification Systems
High voltage electrostatic power supply: negative ion generator as HV source

High Voltage Power Supply Kit --> Construction Manual 470KB PDF file.

Vortex 03-13-2011 02:32 AM

what's the official reason to monitor lighting strikes?
 
why are lighting strikes so important that millions are detected and logged every year?
Have they known that the electrostatic field is important in relationship with DNA and life on earth?

sucahyo 03-14-2011 02:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vortex (Post 133566)
$4.5 gets ya a 120 AC input, Output: 7.5 KV 60 Hz

Robert A.Nelson: Hemp Husbandry ~ Electro-Culture (Ch 5)
Quote:

When using AC, great care must be taken to prevent electrocution of oneself and the plants. AC generally tends to retard plant growth except within certain narrow parameters of voltage and amperage. Dicotyledon plants increase in weight at 10 KV and 100 KV, but decrease in weight (as much as 45%) between 20 to 60 KV. Current must be very low, or plant growth will be retarded.
The link also contain other information regarding the use of magnet, electricity, electrostatic, etc for plants growth, link shared by Mr Dawson.

grizzle 05-31-2011 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dave_cahoon (Post 100032)
http://blog.hasslberger.com/docs/CIB...TECHNOLOGY.pdf

Anyone with an Adjustable Hi-Voltage DC power supply, should be able to replicate this effect...

I am interested in trying this. As in, on myself. The power supply used in the patent was 12,500 V (12.5 kV) at 1 mA. These are the specs for the setup shown in the videos also. Perhaps a higher voltage at 10 mA would be required to produce the desired effects in such a large plate capacitor.
I am not fluent in electronics or HV, but I have designed and built many different kinds of machines designed to act on the nervous system.
I see from the patent an other writings that the key parameter is V/cm (volts/centimeter). The specifics of how to achieve that is outside my knowledge. However, perhaps some parallels can be drawn from those experiments and those who have recreated them. I do have a high voltage meter formerly used in television repair. It goes up to 40 kV.
I know that science has had a hard time modeling the human body as a dielectric, or in any electromagnetic terms.
Any advice would be appreciated. I was thinking perhaps one of the HV DC supplies from Information Unlimited would suffice, or perhaps I could build my own high-frequency DC supply using a flyback transformer.
I am also interested in doing this with crop seeds.
I also think that modulation of the field would be an interesting experiment.
edit: Oh, yes, I forgot to add, I know there will be many whose advice will be "DON'T!!!!", but I've heard it all my life already. Thanks.

sucahyo 06-01-2011 03:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grizzle (Post 142507)
I am interested in trying this. As in, on myself. The power supply used in the patent was 12,500 V (12.5 kV) at 1 mA. These are the specs for the setup shown in the videos also. Perhaps a higher voltage at 10 mA would be required to produce the desired effects in such a large plate capacitor.
I am not fluent in electronics or HV, but I have designed and built many different kinds of machines designed to act on the nervous system.
I see from the patent an other writings that the key parameter is V/cm (volts/centimeter). The specifics of how to achieve that is outside my knowledge. However, perhaps some parallels can be drawn from those experiments and those who have recreated them. I do have a high voltage meter formerly used in television repair. It goes up to 40 kV.
I know that science has had a hard time modeling the human body as a dielectric, or in any electromagnetic terms.
Any advice would be appreciated. I was thinking perhaps one of the HV DC supplies from Information Unlimited would suffice, or perhaps I could build my own high-frequency DC supply using a flyback transformer.
I am also interested in doing this with crop seeds.
I also think that modulation of the field would be an interesting experiment.
edit: Oh, yes, I forgot to add, I know there will be many whose advice will be "DON'T!!!!", but I've heard it all my life already. Thanks.

Try with 10 to 15KV. And use the polarity first. Positive at the top, negative at bottom of the plants.

Put the other polarity on an isolated water if you intend to use only one polarity.

grizzle 06-01-2011 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sucahyo (Post 142584)
Try with 10 to 15KV. And use the polarity first. Positive at the top, negative at bottom of the plants.

Put the other polarity on an isolated water if you intend to use only one polarity.

I don't understand enough about electronics to understand that last statement, using only one polarity. As far as HV DC supplies, is there some difference in design that produces, say, "negative ions" as opposed to the supply used in the patent? I suppose this is analogous to why I don't understand house wiring either.
I thought all HV DC supplies were basically equivalent, classical DC current flow being from positive to negative. I did, however, once witness a debate between an EE and a physicist about which direction current flowed in a battery circuit (pos to neg vs. electron hole flow). I just want to emulate the patent.
Thanks for your time.

sucahyo 06-22-2011 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grizzle (Post 142655)
I don't understand enough about electronics to understand that last statement, using only one polarity. As far as HV DC supplies, is there some difference in design that produces, say, "negative ions" as opposed to the supply used in the patent? I suppose this is analogous to why I don't understand house wiring either.
I thought all HV DC supplies were basically equivalent, classical DC current flow being from positive to negative. I did, however, once witness a debate between an EE and a physicist about which direction current flowed in a battery circuit (pos to neg vs. electron hole flow). I just want to emulate the patent.
Thanks for your time.

Sorry for late reply, I just notice question. This has nothing to do with electronics knowledge. Nothing to do with electron flow. This relate more to Robert beck finding that each polarity will produce different effect to living being. Just like on electroculture where different use of polarity produce different reaction.

Water absorp energy. By using water, you get floating polarity better. This can not be detected with meter.

SilverToGold 06-22-2011 04:04 PM

An interesting little file I found on this effect.

http://blog.hasslberger.com/docs/BAC..._EVOLUTION.pdf

SilverToGold 06-22-2011 04:10 PM

Just a thought I wanted to give here.

It seems that this effect has strong influence (or at least most noticeable influence) on cells undergoing mitosis. I say this because that is what most cells in new life are undergoing as they strive become specialized cells.

I wonder what long term exposure to living bodies do these high fields produce. Every cell in your body is replaced in 7 years. So every cell in your body within 7 years will undergo mitosis. If each of these cells are reverted to a more primitive state, does this effect the aging part of your DNA?

Also, cancer cells undergo mitosis like crazy. If this effect changes these cells, can they not possibly is correctly selected, stop cancer in these cells?

Just some questions on the bigger implication of this amazing effect.

Dasystem 12-05-2011 09:49 PM

Easy does it
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by grizzle (Post 142655)
I don't understand enough about electronics to understand that last statement, using only one polarity. As far as HV DC supplies, is there some difference in design that produces, say, "negative ions" as opposed to the supply used in the patent? I suppose this is analogous to why I don't understand house wiring either.
I thought all HV DC supplies were basically equivalent, classical DC current flow being from positive to negative. I did, however, once witness a debate between an EE and a physicist about which direction current flowed in a battery circuit (pos to neg vs. electron hole flow). I just want to emulate the patent.
Thanks for your time.

I know exactly what you mean, we just want to know, Step 1. What resources do I need to build this device (for seeds or fish). Step 2. How do I build this device or set it up properly. Step 3. Have a working device I can use for my own personal needs.

This is all I want to know, I'm sure I'm speaking for lots of people as well. Thanks for your time, Love and Light!

Jmgies1976 05-03-2012 04:07 PM

Very ineresting
 
Well now... I hop on to a new site to look up info on alternative energy stuff and low and behold I find all kinds of new information about one of my main obsessions....:)

I dont have much time to post right now but will throw a few things out there just to get this conversation going again. It might be a couple of days before I can come back and post links to everything. In the mean time you can google everything.

Okay DC voltage can trigger tissue regeneration in animals, up to and including new limbs. i.e. salamanders. If I remember right these experiments were done in the late seventies early eighties by a doctor Robert O. Becker of "the body electric" fame. He has a few patents and I ran across some photos of a human finger regenerating because of an "electrical device" of his.
Dr Robert O. Becker: Silver Iontophoresis (Regeneration by Silver Ions)

http://rifeenergymedicine.com/FEDCPART1.pdf
http://rifeenergymedicine.com/FEDCPART2.pdf



Scientists at tufts university, by changing the voltage of cell membranes were able to grow an eyeball on a frogs posterior..... also they were able to cause a tadpole to regrow its tail in the same way.
Building The Body Electric - Science News

Heads or tails: Cells' electricity decides what to regenerate



The electrical field inside cells was measured at 15 million volts per square meter. I am not certain what the exact significance of this is because I lack both the specifics and the background, but it does strike me as being extremely high... advertised as five time a lightening bolts.


on the morphogenic field:
The Face of a Frog: Time-lapse Video Reveals Never-Before-Seen Bioelectric Pattern | Tufts Now
Its interesting that the field forms first and THEN the cells begin to differentiate.



here is a nice abstract:

Abstract
The mechanisms whereby electromagnetic (EM) fields stimulate changes in biosynthesis in cells are not known. It has generally been assumed that EM fields first interact with cell membranes, but this pathway may not be the only one. Interactions with membranes are well documented, but recent studies of EM signal transduction in the membrane Na,K-ATPase are best explained by direct interaction of electric and magnetic fields with mobile charges within the enzyme. Interaction with moving charges may be a mechanism that is operative in other biopolymers. Recent studies on DNA have shown that large electron flows are possible within the stacked base pairs of the double helix. Therefore, gene activation by magnetic fields could be due to direct interaction with moving electrons within DNA. Electric fields as well as magnetic fields stimulate transcription, and both fields could interact with DNA directly. The mechanism of EM field-stimulated transcription may be related to the process in striated muscles, where endogenous electrical activity induces the synthesis of new proteins. Bioelectromagnetics 18:111–115, 1997. © 1997 Wiley-Liss, Inc.




I also remember reading about an experiment were a genetically modified type of plant, I believe it was a cress but am not sure, was designed to have two copies of a recessive gene for flowering called the "hot head" gene. It fused some part of the flower head ,darn my spotty memory. anyway I believe something like ten percent of the plants reverted to a more primitive, i.e. original form even though they all had defective chromosomes. A form that the DNA no longer "coded" for.......

Anyway I will come back and post more stuff when I get the chance.


Also, pardon my bad manners, Hello!

lolcat123 08-01-2012 09:04 PM

neon sign transformer
 
for the high voltage low current dc. could a neon sign transformer work connected to some aluminium plates?
Neon Transformers

would this work? and how would you connect it up?

SilverToGold 09-23-2012 08:15 PM

You could use high voltage diodes as a bridge rectifier... BUT I would stay away from this. These sign transformers can use lethal power levels and is really overkill for this purpose.

You only need low power to charge some plates.

I would go here to get something more appropriate. The "Lower Cost Completely Manually-Operated Charger" would be a good safe choice.

High Voltage DC Power Supplies

I would probably also stay away from using aluminum and use steel or better yet, stainless steel instead. William Reich said charged aluminum plates were not good for biological systems.

I would also insulate the metal plates to make them not lose their charge. Maybe paint them with a thick layer of varnish or some insulating material.

Quote:

Originally Posted by lolcat123 (Post 204389)
for the high voltage low current dc. could a neon sign transformer work connected to some aluminium plates?
Neon Transformers

would this work? and how would you connect it up?


Aaron 11-19-2016 09:49 PM

Primeval Code - Ebner Effect
 
I only found this thread today... been looking into this and the research led me back to here. lol

Primeval Code - A & P Electronic Media

If you are not a fan of GMO food, then you’re going to love this!
Here’s an all-natural method to increase the size and quantity of fish and produce utilizing nothing more than high voltage – and the results beat anything that GMO engineering can accomplish.

Read this, “In laboratory experiments the researchers there Dr. Guido Ebner and Heinz Schürch exposed cereal seeds and fish eggs to an “electrostatic field” – in other words, to a high voltage field, in which no current flows.

Unexpectedly primeval organisms grew out of these seeds and eggs: a fern that no botanist was able to identify; primeval corn with up to twelve ears per stalk; wheat that was ready to be harvested in just four to six weeks. And giant trout, extinct in Europe for 130 years, with so-called salmon hooks. It was as if these organisms accessed their own genetic memories on command in the electric field…

https://www.psiram.com/ge/images/thu...250px-Uzc1.jpg

And guess what? It’s safe, effective and was proven out by a large Swiss pharmaceutical company, Ciba, that was eventually owned by what is now one of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world, Novartis.

In the early 1990’s, this was actually patented and in 1992, all research stopped because it was highly disruptive as the process didn’t need fertilizers, pesticides, or any other chemicals, which was at odds with the goals of a chemical company, which is what pharmaceutical companies are.
Coincidentally, the two primary scientists who were working on this method both unexpectedly died in 1991.

Here are the patents – make sure to download these and keep them in a safe place:

US5048458A

NZ229689A

The US patent is quite a bit shorter than the NZ one, which gives much more details.

When this was used on fertilized trout eggs, the results are astounding.
The hatching rate was increased by 100-300% – the fish were more agile with higher survival rates that lasted through their entire life cycle. With the same food available to the fish that were not treated with the high voltage, fish grew much faster (30-40% higher) and reached adulthood significantly earlier and were more resistant to disease. This vitality also transferred to their progeny.

Outside of the patents, results like these were reported for seeds that were treated.

The method is very simple… you take the high voltage positive and negative from your source and put them to two different plates that are coated in a dielectric material (insulating material). These plates are spaced according to the directions in the patent and the voltage is increased to x volts per cm. The electric field is touching the fertilized fish eggs or seeds, but no current will flow.

The entire method is disclosed in the patents linked to above and even if you don’t understand electronics or electricity, read the claims and benefits. Any electronic engineer can understand the patent as it is extremely simple.

I’m ready to use this method to experiment on seeds and hope others will do the same. Online, there are positive reports by others that are doing this for seeds.

Go to the official website here to read the overview in English: http://www.urzeitcode.com/english/

They have a book available in German, which recently disappeared from Amazon and no English version is available.

Make sure to check out Rex Research’s page for more info: http://rexresearch.com/ebner/ebner.htm

UPDATE: 2016-11-19

I found that this was discussed on my forum six years ago – came across this searching in Google! http://www.energeticforum.com/agricu...gy-effect.html

Jetijs did the experiment and the results are a big difference.

http://www.emuprim.lv/jetijs/plog-co...viskas-002.jpg

Untreated are on the left and treated are on the right – when he cut the plants and weighed them to see the difference, the ones on the right were 21% heavier!

Here is a website I found owned by the son of Ebner who offers a box to treat your seeds – a bit expensive, but it is available if you don’t want to make something yourself. The site is in German so you can read the original site: http://www.fios-greenbox.net/

Or you can use this Google Translate link to read it in English: https://translate.google.com/transla...s-greenbox.net

Here are three videos in German that discuss this project. I post these because they do have the audio. Many videos I’m finding have the video cut out. There is some redundant material in the videos, but is important to simply have it available. If someone could download these and add English subtitles, that would be awesome!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPOFyYvjWU8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTTu1-1BODU

Aaron 11-19-2016 10:04 PM

Hcn 14-12500
 
Just to document it, this is the power supply they used for the patent:

http://www.helmut-singer.de/imgg/fug...2500hvplug.jpg

Available here: Helmut Singer Elektronik - Gebrauchte und geprüfte Mess- und Kommunikationstechnik

Datasheet not in English: http://www.helmut-singer.de/pdf/fughcn.pdf

It's about $500, you can obviously do this low budget, but just for reference...

Dingus 11-19-2016 11:33 PM

This effect raises an interesting question; would living in a faraday cage be detrimental to your health?

spacecase0 11-21-2016 04:46 AM

ever try asking your plants to grow seeds that do what you are looking for ?
you can out breed universities doing that
I bet this is less about the electrostatic fields and more about your intentions

Dingus 11-21-2016 09:44 PM

I think that's one of the dumbest things I've ever heard.


All times are GMT. The time now is 03:50 PM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO v1.4.0 (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Shoutbox provided by vBShout v6.2.8 (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
2007-2015 Copyright - Energetic Forum - All Rights Reserved