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Aether Force Exposing Aether Force and their fraud against the work of Eric Dollard. Techzombie of Aether Force was born Rayam Azab Youssef, changed his name to Ray Savant then changed his name to Mohamed Youssef. This is to address his fraudulent allegations.

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  #1  
Old 08-01-2013, 06:30 PM
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Exclamation David Webster - Tech Zombie - Eric Dollard

David,

You are really turning out to be a low life - working with Techzombie for him to make another video to paint Eric as a meth addict. You are showing your true colors. Please don't start crying or whining about how you're just trying to help - you obviously don't have any common sense whatsoever.

You know damn well his claims against Eric and I are a bunch of BS and YOU are the instigator on this for attacking me after the conference by email. How does it feel to be the one that lit the fuse because you decided to speak for the lab without Eric's knowledge or consent and to attack me with a smart ass email accusing me of doing what YOU actually are guilty of doing.

And when are you going to get it through your thick skull that the last straw for Eric was when he was told that in order to have his other friend in the organization that Ray was going to be put on the board??? That IS hi-jacking his organization and to pretend it is anything other than that just reveals that you have no common sense or you actually are intentionally trying to hurt Eric.

By having Ray on the board, that ensures they will always have a majority vote over Eric even if Eric's other friend was on the board. Therefore, control over Eric's org is guaranteed.

The only thing you are doing by associating with Techzombie is assisting him in hurting Eric. You're obviously too blind to see that. You think your little testimonial does any good? For your information, Eric was completely willing to have you, Polakowski and Wittekind work with him but when it was obvious that you kept associating with Ray Savant when Eric wanted him to have NOTHING to do with him or his work, you screwed yourself. Don't blame Eric - blame yourself.

You are a liar and a fraud.

1. You misrepresented why you wanted to come to my conference - you claimed that it was so Eric could have a friend there. (Trojan Horse)

2. You admit later the others thought it would be a good idea for you to come to the conference to raise money for the lab.

3. You ask for donations for the lab when I told you MULTIPLE times money that is earned for Eric through the conference, book, etc... was for Eric's PERSONAL donations and Eric can decide how he wants to spend it. Do you have any comprehension whatsoever how disrespectful that is to tell me you understand this then to ask for money for the lab? It was expressed to you and Polakowski in no uncertain terms that Eric does not trust Ray's involvement and money can't go to the lab until everything is set right first.

Eric did NOT trust how the organization was being run and with Ray's involvement, it was decided to NOT pay the money to the lab! Again, David, your lights are on but nobody's home. So, don't give me your bleeding-heart story about all you're trying to do is help Eric and the lab and that's what your guilty of? Play me a fricking violin David - can the crap.

4. Three days AFTER the conference, you attack me by email and when I emailed you back to put you in your place that everything you accused me of was actually what YOU were guilty of violating the organization that created the conference - you can't walk into someone's conference and ask the paid attendees for money. The FIRST AND ONLY TIME I ever mentioned that you could have a table at the conference in the vendors room was in the response to your email attack against me. I told you if you wanted the lab represented, you should have asked for permission and I would have given you a free table in the vendors room.

What did you post in the Ray Savant Techzombie Exposed thread? You said you thought it was implied that it would be ok to ask for donations because of the offer to have a table. You are a LIAR! Why? Because it was 3-4 days AFTER the conference was ALREADY OVER when I brought up the idea that if you wanted the lab to have a presence, you could have a table in the vendors room. You never said one word to me about wanting the lab to have representation. Therefore, how can you claim you thought it was implied that it was ok to ask for money for the lab by the offer to have the table?

Let's listen to what happened at the end of the conference:

YouTube

@ALL - LISTEN TO THAT EVERYONE, ME ASKING PEOPLE TO GIVE CASH DIRECTLY TO ERIC RESULTED IN AN EMAIL ATTACK AGAINST ME BY DAVID WEBSTER...DETAILS BELOW.

At the actual conference, I only caught the tail-end of you mentioning something about being able to take cards on your phone. I thought you were talking about Eric's personal donations account because that was the only thing that was acceptable to Eric and I had made it clear that no money is to go to the lab. If the lab needs money, Eric can decide to give it to the lab.

Aaron - "OR if you have cash you can just give it to Eric if you want."

David - "That works too!"

If that works too, David, you liar and manipulator, why would you send this to me 2 days later - did Ray put you up to that? What kind of idiot is going to speak on behalf of Eric's organization attacking someone that has a business relationship with Eric without discussing anything with Eric or the other board member?


-------- Original Message -------- Subject: Stunt at ConferenceDate: Tue, 2 Jul 2013 19:21:44 -0500From: DavidWebster511 . <>CC: TecZ anon <techzombie432@gmail.com>, David Wittekind <>

Hello Aaron,

I want to express my disappointment in the statement that you made after Eric's presentation where I made the announcement that I was taking donations for EPD Laboratories. EPD Labs is a nonprofit organization that has monthly operating expenses, equipment purchases yet to be made, payroll for hired labor, etc. That was very uncool of you to come behind me and tell the crowd that you could just give cash to Eric rather than donating to EPD Labs. While I understand that Eric is the star of the show, there is a great need for EPD Labs to have any influx of funds at this point in time. When the money dries up, it seems that it will fall in David's lap to continue to pay rent on the building. This is not fair considering the huge debt that he has accumulated already from acquiring the lab in the first place.


There was an original stated goal within EPD Labs which needs operating capitol to achieve. Reaching that goal will take the financial burden off of David Wittekind and allow this operation to really get the traction that it needs to move forward. Eric has his own idea of what is a priority, and it doesn't take into account the bank account of our prime benefactor, Mr. Wittekind. In all fairness to David, we need to consider the financial situation of the organization. With that being said, I hope you will respect the operating decisions being made by organizations that you do not belong to and keep your suggestions to yourself should the situation ever arise again.


Thanks,


Dave

-----------------------------------

1. You are the one that pulled a stunt at the conference. When I saw your email and realized for the first time you actually did ask for money for the lab - you went against Eric's wishes and my wishes that money was ONLY to go to Eric's personal donations account because Eric did NOT trust the organization and what was happening.

2. You make false allegations that I'm trying to get people to give Eric money instead of the lab? You say RATHER THAN - you are a LIAR. Listen to the video, you are completely twisting what I said. I said OR if anyone has cash, they can give it directly to Eric. Look up OR in the dictionary, David, because you have very poor comprehension of the English language. I said OR meaning CASH to Eric because if you're taking credit cards - that is obviously something Eric or I were not set up for and I thought it was to take credit cards for the PERSONAL DONATIONS ACCOUNT. And you spin this into a false allegation accusing me of sabotaging your fund raising efforts.

3. Your last statement in the email is a condescending statement that reeks of stupidity. You are accusing me of doing something that YOU are guilty of - disrespecting the operating decisions of the conference, disrespecting my wishes that money only go to the personal account, etc... and you accuse me of disrespecting the organization's decisions? What decisions, to infiltrate the conference and ask for money without permission in opposition to our wishes that money does NOT go to the lab at this time?

The very first attack against anyone was initiated by YOU to me! This is a documented indisputable fact. When I emailed you back to set things straight because you were completely out of line, Ray Savant writes back attacking me accusing me of being a liar, etc... He is nothing but a lying snake and so are you! Ray makes the video painting Eric as a meth fiend and labeling me as some suppression agent and here you are giving Ray a video testimonial that he is using to further paint Eric as being in the wrong here. You are a basket case.

Go ahead and post your own email response here. YOU are the one that has contributed to all of this and all I did was try to get some money in Eric's hands and you wrongfully attack me for it. You epitomize the very concept of cognitive dissonance. There are many logical incongruities with what you say, how you act and what you claim. You're trying to help Eric? All you do every time you open your mouth is hurt him!

Imagine if I was some wealthy angel funder and was giving $5k/month to the organization and you pop off at the mouth in an email like you did, your mouth would have cost the organization a lot of financial support. You have NO common sense.

Although I'm not an angel funder, I do have the ability to help the lab, JUST LIKE I DID BEFORE with the Indegogo campaign and with thousands of pounds of lab equipment that I put in Eric's hands while he was up here. And by you sending me that letter, you could have jeopardized Eric's situation by me withdrawing my support. The reason I am supporting Eric is because I can see that Ray is a psychopath for supporting your letter, which was completely out of line, and then attacking me as someone that is trying to sabotage the lab and calling me a liar??!

And 4 days AFTER you and Ray attack me by email, I did the interview with Eric and still spoke highly of both YOU and Polakowski and towards the end, I even promote Ray's website! Why? Because, despite the stupidity of you and Ray's actions against me, I'm still committed to supporting Eric and the lab!

Listen to it yourself:
Eric Dollard Interview July 6, 2013 - YouTube audio with pics
or
Eric Dollard Video Interview - YouTube video

There is nothing but a trail of proof that shows the only thing I have done is to support Eric and the lab. The only trail of proof (concrete documentation) regarding you and Ray over the last 5 weeks is that you people are a bunch of wackos who are working against Eric. YOU have been brainwashed by Ray because you are so gullible and naive. The email you sent me says that you still believe Techzombie's intentions are good. Really? And he shows those good intentions quite well in the video slam against Eric and I. You are like the rocket scientist that can't balance their checkbook. You might be a talented engineer, but you have absolutely no common sense whatsoever - not even the slightest.

You guys are low lifes for doing this to Eric and I. Congratulations David, you will go down in history as the one of the primary characters that wound up screwing Eric right along with Ray Savant. Good job man! We all thank you for your contributions.
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Sincerely,
Aaron Murakami

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  #2  
Old 08-01-2013, 08:32 PM
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The following response is to this post. Aaron closed the thread before I could respond.



Aaron said:

Quote:
So you now calling Eric a liar. You told Eric that Ray was using the money to pay for a camera man. Why would you lie to Eric about that if you actually were receiving the money? Never discussed using the money so you can continue your experiments? Eric seemed to be very clear about the fact that he stressed to you the importance of WHY you need to be the one to keep the money. That is what Eric wanted you to do with the money, seems obvious. For you to give it to the lab is completely disrespecting Eric's wishes. The experiments that were being posted here are VERY important to Eric but you take it upon yourself to do what you want. Good job helping Eric there! Just like you forcing Eric to give you half of the donations collected at the end of the conference. That was pretty low of you.
Eric knew I got some money from the book sales as I told him. I received an undisclosed sum of cash from the book sales. I told TechZ that I didn't really care about any residual income from the book sales and that I would like it to go towards helping Eric further his lab. TechZ then asked if he could pay the camera man that went out to the lab with some of the funds that came from the book sales. I had no idea that the filming was done on a volunteer basis (I wasn't there for that trip out to the lab) so I agreed that we needed to pay the man for taking time out of his life to go to the lab and capture video footage.

No, it was never explicitly stated that the purpose of the money from the book sales was to further my experiments which the results were to be published online. Eric and I never had a conversation about this. This may have been what Eric wanted to have me do with the money, but he didn't vocalize it. From the conversations that we had, it only sounded like he wanted me to have some extra cash in my pocket so that I wouldn't feel like I was helping strictly on a volunteer basis.

Quote:
Asking Eric for the money was a slimeball thing to do. Techzombie is supposed to be the master fund raiser and if that is the case, why are guys broke, coming to my conference to leech off of what I setup for Eric? It's hard to raise any funds when you keep giving his life's work out like free peanuts at the bar. Many things are obviously supposed to be free, but much of Eric's work has a value and people can respect that. If Techzombie didn't mismanage all of Eric's work, the whole lab would be paid off by now with proper campaigning for the lab.
I am sorry for being a slimeball, Eric. I was just trying to help you get a lab back together. After all, that is where the money would have been spent...

Before you start saying that we 'mismanaged' Eric's material, you might want to ask Eric who's idea it was to post the material for free. It was Eric's idea. Everytime some new, potentially lucrative material would surface, I would ask Eric what he thought about putting it up for sale on the EricDollard.com site, and he would always say 'It really needs to get out to the public unimpeded'. Since Eric wanted to give it out for free, the only thing we could do was to request donations on the same page that we were posting links to the material. Trust me, Aaron, we thought about selling the videos but were met with opposition from Mr. Dollard himself.

Quote:
Eric was promised from the very beginning that all that rent would be taken care of. How do you think that kind of contradiction makes him feel?
From my understanding, Mr. Wittekind never intended to straight up pay for the bills for the lab. The idea was to get something built that would allow EPD Laboratories to apply for a government grant. The original stated goal was to build a Cosmic Induction Generator for this purpose as well as other reasons. Initially, David Wittekind spent so much of his own money because he was trying to get EPD Labs into a position to be able to apply for a grant. This means that we needed a building, renovation funds, equipment, etc. Once the government grant was awarded, all of Mr. Wittekind's financial responsibility would have been relieved and the lab would continue to move forward on the taxpayers' bill. Never was David meant to continue to pay for the lab's expenses.

Quote:
Obviously the lab needs money. But you guys working with Ray Savant Techzombie were supposed to have some master plan at raising funds, etc... but instead, you come to the conference and without permission, you solicit the paid attendees for donations to the lab. You were completely out of line. You disrespected the conference's organizational leadership. I never had an agreement with the lab, only with Eric personally. My word to Eric was that money from the conference would be his own money and not the labs. You "helped" him so much that you take away his dignity when you do those things.

You told me you wanted to come as Eric's guest so Eric could have a familiar person there and that was it - and that is why I gave you a guest pass. You didn't mention one single thing about representing the lab. You were a trojan horse for the lab. You show your true intent by stating elsewhere that Ray and others thought it would be good for you to come to get donations. That is one deception that is already revealed. What you told me was completely opposite from what you were actually doing.
Yes, Aaron, I am so deceiving for coming to the conference and asking for donations to help further Eric's lab. I know that I should have come to you and said something about taking donations for EPD Labs, but I just flat out didn't. Guilty, this guy... Does it at least count that all donations received would have actually gone to help Eric get a working lab? Hiding behind the 'rules and regulations' of your conference serves to distort the original intent. I was a trojan horse to help Eric!
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Old 08-01-2013, 08:32 PM
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Quote:
I also made it very clear to you on the phone (by voice), etc... that no money from the conference was to go to the lab and was only to go to Eric. Do you remember that? And why was that? Because Eric ALREADY did NOT trust Ray or the rest. When Eric expressed that distrust to me, that is when I decided to make sure all the money goes directly to Eric. So what do you do besides having a different agenda than what you told me for coming to the conference? You ask for donations for the lab. You have absolutely no honor or integrity in what you say.
Yes, I remember that. Eric isn't the one that has to pay for the bills in the lab when the money dries up so I asked for donations for EPD Labs. Sorry, just thinking logically. Call me a slimeball if you must.

Quote:
Eric coming out against those that are helping him? Threatening to put Ray on the board, when it is obvious that Eric wants him out of his life is helping him? If Ray had the slightest true intent to actually be of help to Eric, Ray would have backed off from any attempt to get on the board of directors and would be helping Eric quietly behind the scenes doing promotions without his name attached.
Funny thing about that Ray guy... It seems that Eric would always talk trash behind this guy's back but never called him directly to tell him to get out of his life. In fact, I can count with one hand the number of times that Eric called Ray on the phone, very little communication. It seemed that right after Eric would finish hating on Ray, he would ask "So what is going on with the next fundraiser?" It is not my place to tell Ray that Eric doesn't want him involved if it seems like Eric still wants to have Ray put together fundraising campaigns. This what I was hearing from Eric until he met up with you, Aaron.

Quote:
And with you knowing that Eric does not want anything to do with Ray, you and Polakowski continued to support and side with Ray instead of Eric. And you wonder why Eric isn't happy with you guys? I didn't have anything to do with that - that was all amongst you guys and Eric's other buddy who he wanted on the board of directors, who was being counter opposed by Ray.
I have been working with Wittekind, Ray, Polakowski, and Eric Dollard for long enough to figure out everybody's intent. I never witnessed anything from Ray that made me believe that he was doing anything other than genuinely trying to help. I am not Eric and am entitled to my own opinions. I still stand up for Ray and say that he is a good person with good intentions. If Eric wanted Ray out, he should have called Ray on the telephone and made it official by telling him so instead of still trying to use him for fundraising.

Quote:
That is what this is really about. The tug a war with Eric's organization and that made him sick and is why he said his organization is being hijacked. Nothing behind the scenes worked, none of Eric's concerns were met with any kind of compassion or remedy. So Eric demanded that it be made public. It was his idea and I agreed to back him because he himself was backed into a corner with nowhere to turn. If it wasn't brought public, Ray would still be trying to force his way into Eric's organization unwelcome and there would still be no progress with the lab and Eric would have headed for the hills already.
If Eric would have been more specific about kicking Ray out instead of also trying to keep him around for fundraising efforts, we might have met his requests with compassion or remedy. I was never clear if Eric wanted Ray to leave or to bring in more funds. Therefore, I kept my mouth shut. I am not out to do Eric's dirty work. That is his responsibility and nobody else's.

Make sure that Eric knows that the reason that I polarized with David and Ray is because he decided to make this public. This should have been brought into a conference call setting with the members of EPD Labs. No such request for a meeting of the minds was made by Eric.

Quote:
You have slipped multiple times and this is yet another: " the very people that have worked very hard to try to help the them. "

EXACTLY! The very people that worked hard to help THEM. Like I said originally, help themselves to Eric. That was NOT a typo, it is a Freudian slip, there are actually TWO words - we can see the root idea that was in your subconscious mind when you typed this. Thank you for revealing just a bit more about yourself.
And you get on to others for trying to manipulate words and cause distortion... How about a simple typo because I had just woken up and still hadn't had any coffee?

Quote:
You are either delusional or you really are intentionally lying: "flamethrowers started firing up in the public eye and that was about the time that I opted out. If you can't defend all of your flame throwing yourself, you may need to reconsider you actions next time you decide to 'help out'. "

Really? Kind of interesting how you just conveniently left out all of Eric's very serious concerns about Ray needing to be booted from Eric's life from not just Eric but Eric's other EE buddy in the bush and the glommeister's concerns that Ray needs to be GONE. And ALL of that was before anything was ever brought public. I can clearly see how you are manipulating this and I hope I'm not the only one.
Again, Eric still wanted to use Ray for a fundraising effort... What am I supposed to do?

Quote:
One question to finish up - was it you or Polakowski that posted Eric's T-Rex post against Farmhand (sheep reference)???
I don't know what you are referring to. Please elaborate.



I really want to see this die down. I was in this for nothing more than to help Eric Dollard. There is no point to continue to make this a public argument. I am no longer in the organization. I will answer your question about the T-Rex post against Farmhand, but that is it. I am going to disappear after that to do things with my life that are more constructive than this blame game.

Good Luck Eric.



Dave
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Old 08-01-2013, 08:42 PM
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You have an eloquent way of calling everybody stupid. You are a real 'spiritual' man.

You attacked Ray publicly as being a nefarious element. I don't see it the same way. Call me stupid again, please. I made a short video trying to give a different perspective of the 'nefarious elements'. Sue me and call me an *******.

I never had anything to do with saying that Eric was on meth and you know this. I still publicly state that I don't believe Eric was on meth at all after Landers. TechZombie was slandered by you and Eric and I don't blame him for fighting back.

One more thing, I don't care about any of this anymore. I am not going to go round and round with you in these silly arguments that keep anybody from doing anything useful with their lives.

And yes, I was only trying to help Eric. There is one key difference between you and I, Mr. Murakami. YOU ARE PROFITING OFF OF ERIC, AND I WORKED FOR FREE. True colors are shining bright, my friend.

Good luck, Aaron.

Dave
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Old 08-02-2013, 08:37 AM
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David Webster web000x

First of all, you are dodging the points I brought up about you in my post. Anyway, you gave Ray the book to sell without ever asking for permission from Eric although you knew that Eric did not want Ray in his life.

Ray, who is not even a board member of the organization receives video footage paid for by Eric's book and Eric winds up with zero copies of any of the footage and the footage is used against Eric. Essentially, Ray is in possession of film footage that belongs to Eric and the lab - that is stolen property.

You claim you're a volunteer and do everything for free, yet you admit taking an undisclosed sum of money for the book and want the rest to go to the lab, yet you think it is right for sales from the book to compensate another volunteer. So you are telling all the readers that Ray is trying to use the money to pay a cameraman, with your agreement, yet his father in law posts in the Ray Savant thread that his son never received a dime. Starting to look more like you and Ray are actually pocketing the money.

Well, David, I can't claim he did tell you explicitly that he wanted you to use the money for the experiments but that was certainly his desire. In any case, you have a long track record of making assumptions which winds up biting you in the end. I was the recipient of it TWO times from you alone so can speak from experience what your perception of what things "sound like" to you can turn into.

David, please spare me the bleeding-heart "poor me" manipulation. You made many very serious mistakes and playing a violin will only last so long because when the music ends, people are no longer distracted and they can see what is actually going on. Sometimes, it is best to own it like a man instead of turning it around and making excuses. You wrongly gave Ray Savant Eric's book to sell and it was used in a way that wound up empowering Ray with film footage that is being used against Eric. You have been evading this indisputable fact because you refuse to allow yourself to admit that you screwed up. You made some serious mistakes and you can't admit it. Look at you "Oooh, I'm sorry I'm a slimeball for helping you, etc..." You are an excuse factory.

To say you mismanaged Eric's material would be an understatement. I defended you over and over as having good intentions but are not savvy with organizational decisions, etc... but after a while, ignorance is no longer an excuse and when you know better, that is stupidity and you have made many stupid decisions. First and foremost is your decision to align yourself with "Muhamed" Ray Savant. You admitted multiple times that you are not a business person, so why use your opinion about how business could be conducted on Eric's behalf as a defense?

How were you giving away Eric's book for free that you helped compile for when you were supposed to originally sell it and split the money with Eric? And if that is the case, how is Eric opposing the sell of that book when he wanted you to personally earn money from it? He can't have a desire for you to earn money from a book that is being given away for free. You are starting to become the very embodiment of contradiction.

With David Wittekind, I'll just state the facts. First of all, I'll support whatever campaign is going on to get money to pay off the bldg, etc... so David gets his money back. Nobody wants to see David lose out by winding up with any debt.

But I'll also point out that it has constantly been stated: "David Wittekind has been the principal Angel Investor behind Eric Dollard." And it has been stated constantly that David Wittekind is a BENEFACTOR (one who confers a benefit, charity or gift).

First of all, "Angel Investor" is an oxymoron. You are either an Angel Funder or an Investor, but you cannot be both. A Benefactor is someone who is donating something or giving a gift. There are no strings attached to a benefactor's gift or an angel investor's money. They do NOT get to call the shots at all in anything going on.

If someone is an investor, that is a different story and anyone that is making an investment has a financial interest in making money off of an investment. An investment is: "The action or process of investing money for profit or material result." If someone is an investor in this, there is nothing wrong with that, but the truth to the situation has to simply be stated!

So, while you and Ray keep claiming I'm all about trying to profit off of Eric, which isn't even close to being true, here you guys are stating two diametrically opposed ideas.

Angel Funder vs Investor

If Wittekind is an investor, that means he is literally putting money in so that he can profit from it.

If Wittekind is an angel funder, that means money and resources are given as a gift with no strings attached.

I have personally received money from angels to fund projects, which I wound up open sourcing to the whole world. When I received the money, I had full control over how it was spent with nobody interfering in my decision making process. So, I'm qualified to speak on this subject.

So, you have to decide what story you are going to tell - was the building and everything purchased as an investment or was it provided with no strings attached - and no strings attached would mean that Eric will not be put into a situation where he has to worry about paying rent.

If you can't properly define what the real situation is in any honest way, then you're simply confused as to what the whole situation really is or what the motives are behind all the decisions that have been made in the organization thus far.

The original goal for for the lab by spending 10's of thousands of dollars on a building is to build a cosmic induction generator? Really? Serving the local municipality had no priority in any of this that? The Indegogo campaign was for the CIG, but was it disclosed in an itemized format to be transparent that so much of that money was to be used to fix the building, etc...? Everything but the CIG? Nice one. What was your big fantastic plan - go back to the public and ask for more money to actually build the CIG and tell everyone, sorry folks, we had to use the money to repair the building first and none of it actually went into building the CIG, now we're really ready to build it so $30k more please!!! Don't give any garbage about the building getting repaired is part of the process in building the CIG because that won't fly for anyone but an food. You have to represent properly what each campaign is actually for with a long term goal and a budget or people will keep asking until the end of time - where is the CIG that I helped pay for???

The entire campaign was misrepresented, Ray is telling people for $100 they'll get a handwritten letter from Eric (without Eric's knowledge - Eric just found out Ray was making that claim on the Indegogo campaign 2 days ago!!!!) and Eric already writes letters for free to people that write him at the Lone Pine address, yet, Ray is the "good guy" you're supporting that has misrepresented one thing after another and another and another. You are supporting someone that is making one lie after another - no integrity whatsoever and that is what you align yourself with and you wonder why Eric isn't too happy.

"Yes, Aaron, I am so deceiving for coming to the conference and asking for donations to help further Eric's lab. I know that I should have come to you and said something about taking donations for EPD Labs, but I just flat out didn't. Guilty, this guy..." - that is the poor me whiny crap that nobody needs. Yes, you are deceiving and have no integrity in how you have conducted yourself. Again -

1. You misrepresented why you wanted to come to my conference - you claimed that it was so Eric could have a friend there. (Trojan Horse)

2. You admit later the others thought it would be a good idea for you to come to the conference to raise money for the lab.

3. You ask for donations for the lab when I told you MULTIPLE times money that is earned for Eric through the conference, book, etc... was for Eric's PERSONAL donations and Eric can decide how he wants to spend it. Do you have any comprehension whatsoever how disrespectful that is to tell me you understand this then to ask for money for the lab? It was expressed to you and Polakowski in no uncertain terms that Eric does not trust Ray's involvement and money can't go to the lab until everything is set right first.

Eric did NOT trust how the organization was being run and with Ray's involvement, it was decided to NOT pay the money to the lab! Again, David, your lights are on but nobody's home. So, don't give me your bleeding-heart story about all you're trying to do is help Eric and the lab and that's what your guilty of? Play me a fricking violin David - can the crap.

4. Three days AFTER the conference, you attack me by email and when I emailed you back to put you in your place that everything you accused me of was actually what YOU were guilty of violating the organization that created the conference - you can't walk into someone's conference and ask the paid attendees for money. The FIRST AND ONLY TIME I ever mentioned that you could have a table at the conference in the vendors room was in the response to your email attack against me. I told you if you wanted the lab represented, you should have asked for permission and I would have given you a free table in the vendors room.

"Does it at least count that all donations received would have actually gone to help Eric get a working lab? Hiding behind the 'rules and regulations' of your conference serves to distort the original intent. I was a trojan horse to help Eric!" -

Hiding behind regulations? That is the kind of snake tongue garbage that you are well versed in - maybe getting tips from Ray? You completely lied to me by agreeing that money from Eric's involvement with the conference will go to the personal donations account and you show up and secretly were there to actually get money for the lab, which is what I told you MUST NOT HAPPEN. I'm all for supporting the lab, but it has to be when the organization has the people in it that Eric wants in it and NOT BEFORE.

You are a snake - you accuse me of doing what you do and here you are acting like you are completely altruistic in doing so. And if you guys even had a plan and knew what the hell you all were doing, you would not have to be at the conference making Eric give you half of his donations to pay rent - do you know how degrading and disrespectful that is? You have your own fund raising activities. Don't blame it on Eric not being at the lab for a while because you had AMPLE material in video footage, etc... to use to raise funds to at least put in the 3-phase and put electric in the building.

And none of this is justifiable on your part anyway, Eric was promised everything would be taken care of in the spirit of an angel funder who is there to help so every bit of your argument has no foundation to begin with.

And PLEASE stop the "poor me" sob stories, its ridiculous. You are a manipulator, you whine about it and then spin it around to take the focus off the fact that you have screwed up with not just me but many people.

You conveniently ignored the entire email situation where you attack me unjustifiably. You are the one that has shown your true colors.

Two times, your little ego gets bruised and you willfully express something in a way that will sabotage Eric's supporters. That is a whole other story, but although you have helped Eric and I never denied that, on multiple occasions, you have gone out of your way to make it known that you are willing to sabotage him because you put your ego ahead of what is best for Eric and the non-profit. Most people only see one side of you, but I have experienced both.
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  #6  
Old 08-02-2013, 09:27 AM
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David Webster

AMAZING!!!

Quote by Aaron:
"I also made it very clear to you on the phone (by voice), etc... that no money from the conference was to go to the lab and was only to go to Eric. Do you remember that? And why was that? Because Eric ALREADY did NOT trust Ray or the rest. When Eric expressed that distrust to me, that is when I decided to make sure all the money goes directly to Eric. So what do you do besides having a different agenda than what you told me for coming to the conference? You ask for donations for the lab. You have absolutely no honor or integrity in what you say.

Quote by David:
Yes, I remember that. Eric isn't the one that has to pay for the bills in the lab when the money dries up so I asked for donations for EPD Labs. Sorry, just thinking logically. Call me a slimeball if you must.
"


Ok - here you are admitting that you were very clear that no money from the conference was to go to the lab. And here you are saying you're just thinking logically that you need to come to the conference to ask for money for the lab.

David, you just admitted to the entire world that it is logical (to you) to go against your word and disrespect our agreement because something else makes more sense to you and in your last post you mock the "regulations" of the conference on top of it. And, you have the audacity to attack me by email with false allegations claiming that I'm sabotaging your efforts to raise funds for the lab at the conference - which you just admitted you remember giving your word that you understood that money from the conference was not to go to the lab but into Eric's personal donations account.

:supr ise:

Furthermore, admitting that you remember also shows that you are admitting that Ray's claims that I am the one the put Eric against Ray is FALSE.

For anyone with common sense, they can see that you are in fact denouncing Ray indirectly without even intending to do so.

Eric obviously doesn't want Ray in his life so why would he call him? He never knew his phone number or even his last name. And, you're saying it isn't your place to tell Ray Eric doesn't want him around - YET, it is your place to take it upon yourself to attack me by email and accuse me of doing something that you are actually guilty of???!!! And, you don't even run your decision by the other board member or even Eric. It was your place to attack me, a conference organizer who simply invited Eric to give a talk?

" I never witnessed anything from Ray that made me believe that he was doing anything other than genuinely trying to help." WOW - really? And that is why Ray has some video of Eric that was taken without Eric's knowledge or consent? Much of the video he took was without Eric knowing it. Real helpful David!

"I still stand up for Ray and say that he is a good person with good intentions." - Ok, you are a slimeball for sure. Over a week with Ray's video with false allegations against us both and he is a "good person" with "good intentions". I think you need a crowbar to pry your head out of you know what because you are a sick an twisted individual if you can make that statement after what Ray has done. You truly will go down in the history books as someone who stabbed Eric in the back and the documentation will speak or itself. I really think you started off with good intentions and then Ray worked his "magic" on you - perhaps you are the one that he has hooked on meth and is brainwashing you because your statements are completely irrational in the worst way.

"I am not out to do Eric's dirty work." - No, you're out to do Ray's dirty work and you appear to be too stupid to see how you are being used.

Again, you are the walking contradiction: "Make sure that Eric knows that the reason that I polarized with David and Ray is because he decided to make this public. This should have been brought into a conference call setting with the members of EPD Labs. No such request for a meeting of the minds was made by Eric. "

You really are on meth or something else. You guys were playing tug a war with the organization threatening to put Ray on the board of directors if Eric's buddy was going to get on the board. You only deepen the evidence that you truly are a manipulator when you act like you didn't know Eric wanted Ray out of his life - it's completely shameful. You're right, it should have been brought into the conference call - when these issues were known (and this is all documented by the way), why didn't the leadership lead this the right way and do a meeting?

Eric is the actual secretary of the organization, legally, and you guys have never provided him with the articles of incorporation, bylaws, etc... he doesn't even know how anything is set up. You all make decisions behind his back and keep him in the dark. You speak for the organization, which is named after him, and say things that are actually damaging or detrimental to him. He has never been invited to one single official meeting for the non profit with any minutes kept, etc... so don't pull your "we should have had a meeting" garbage when that is NOT how you have ever operated to begin with!

"" the very people that have worked very hard to try to help the them. "" - don't blame that on not having coffee, it is a very classical slip - you slipped at the mouth, own it.

The question is simple:

"One question to finish up - was it you or Polakowski that posted Eric's T-Rex post against Farmhand (sheep reference)??? "

WAS IT YOU OR JOHN THAT POSTED ERIC'S POST ABOUT FARMHAND BEING A SODOMIZER OF SHEEP? IT IS A VERY SIMPLE QUESTION AND WOULD OBVIOUSLY BE VERY MEMORABLE.

"I am going to disappear after that to do things with my life that are more constructive than this blame game." - This will haunt you for a long time David. You can't crap on someone's floor, run off like a poodle an stick your nose under someone's bed to get away from it all. You launched an attack on me by emailing me after the conference and even with that, I still spoke highly of you and John in the interview I did with Eric and even promoted the Aether Force site (AFTER RAY ATTACKED ME ALSO). My intentions are obvious. And playing a role in hi-jacking Eric's organization by even thinking that it is ok to get Ray on the board is completely inexcusable.

I call you stupid for good reason. Ignorance is forgiveable up to a point, but when you know better, it is no longer ignorance, it is stupidity. You have made mutliple contradictions in the logic you posted, you evade many facts and you make excuses for everything instead of owning up to anything. Ray puts out his video with fake allegations and you gave the audacity to say he has good intentions.

"TechZombie was slandered by you and Eric and I don't blame him for fighting back. " More evidence form your own mouth that you are a snake. "fighting back"??? Lying about me and lying about Eric, a man who you claim to have so much respect for and just want to help and you defend Ray as "fighting back"? You have no sense of integrity whatsoever. You already admit that when you think something is logical you do it even if it means that you violate your agreements with people, etc... You are either a real conspirator in all of this or you are simply just that blind.

Spirituality does not mean sitting back holding hands singing Kum Ba Yah hoping a UFO will land to take you away to heaven. It means speaking out for what is right and being vigilant in such matters and not being intimidated by greedy, selfish people who take advantage of others. You guys attacked me and I did nothing, but when I saw how you had Eric backed up against a wall with his own organization, I made a choice to stick up for him since you and everyone else were too cowardly to speak out for Eric. I know what the truth is and so do plenty of others.

You owe it to everyone who donated money to Eric to answer the questions I asked without excuses, whining, beating around the bush, or manipulation.
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Aaron Murakami


Last edited by Aaron; 08-02-2013 at 09:30 AM.
  #7  
Old 08-02-2013, 09:34 AM
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@Ramset

RAMSET - I deleted your post.

I started this thread so David Webster can have his say since he accuses me of not letting him post. I closed the Ray Savant thread to preserve it and to keep out the clutter. It is documenting FACTS.

I also supported David and thought he was a hell of a guy - then when he got associated with Ray Savant Techzombie, he started to change.

There is more I want to post about David but will reserve that for a later time if needed. For now, he needs to have his say about what was discussed and he owes it to everyone that has donated money to address the statements I'm making about him.
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  #8  
Old 08-02-2013, 09:36 AM
Farmhand Farmhand is offline
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Posts: 3,389
Hi Folks, I've heard my name was mentioned again, and I would just like to make a simple statement.

I take no sides, I don't hold grudges and I bear no ill will toward any man.
As it turns out I cannot prove any PM's sent to me, they are private anyway
really. I retract any statement I cannot prove and so the only things I can
stand by is what was said in the actual thread I started, and elsewhere in public.

Although I wish to remain a neutral entity in my own right. If I must take any
sides as far as how I feel emotionally about this situation and as far as I can
tell by the facts I will stand by the two Davids and Jon Polakowski and
whatever that means as far as a group goes.

I don't want any further part in "he said - she said" stuff. As far as what was
said to me (insults or whatever) all is water under the bridge as long as it
discontinues. And that goes for all. I refuse to hold grudges. Period.

I just want it to be clear there is no animosity towards anyone about anything
said to me previously. I actually wish now I hadn't mentioned anything
because I just wanted an answer from whomever knew it, and for no other
reason than to see who or if anyone would "fess up" as to how Eric first came
to find out about My thread.

I think in reality only Eric can say. I don't expect to get an answer. I do feel
Eric somehow got the incorrect impression of me which is hurtful.

It pains me because I agree with Eric on many things and I am sure if I met
Eric with no previous background between us I could actually get along with
him, my life has not been pretty. I do not Judge Eric.

Misunderstandings in this type of written medium are easy to make and at
time difficult to resolve due to different reasons concerning the Internetwork.

This is for who ever needs it most.

Cheers
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  #9  
Old 08-02-2013, 10:00 AM
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Snake reveals itself to Farmhand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmhand View Post
While Myself and dR Green were collaborating in the thread I made, I was told
by one of Eric's "then" associates that he didn't really think I was doing
anything wrong himself, however he claimed Eric was pressuring him to
denounce me as a disinfo agent and so forth. I think I can find the PM's, I
usually keep the good ones.

Then I was told by another of his "then" associates that he didn't agree with
Eric's abuses of me, but kind of implied it would be good to just ignore the
abuse so "we can get as much as we can out of him" was close to the rhetoric.

I'm withholding names for now, If Eric was behind it he will know their names,
if he wasn't he should be able to deduce who it was. The two are in the
debacle now. Mr TechZombie was not one of them as far as I can tell, unless
he used a different handle starting with J or D.
A "plant" is in the midst who wants to get what they can from Eric and you don't need a message to prove it, everything is known. As I said from the beginning, Eric is surrounded by nefarious elements who are acting like they are helping him when in reality, they are helping themselves to Eric.

At first, that was intended for Ray and I alluded to others but didn't even have to name names and it is interesting that it has become so prophetically accurate.

Farmhand, none of this will ever go away. Many laws are being broken right now against Eric and I and we have received threats. Everyone involved with be held fully accountable for every single thing they contributed - nobody is immune to prosecution and nobody is anonymous except for anonymous.

You personally instigate crap on more than one occasion around here and out the other side of your mouth, you pretend you're not.

Do not play games with me.

Your pathetic post complimenting danielpoet was nothing but pure trash and was a passive attack against me. That kid is making death threats, writes poetry about death, is disrupting the forum and you pull that. I think it is wise that you back off immediately and let David answer - you are NOT fooling anyone with your disingenuous facade to please can it. You have contributed to many issues around here and you can't just sweep it under the carpet.
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Aaron Murakami

  #10  
Old 08-02-2013, 08:36 PM
Farmhand Farmhand is offline
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I won't be baited. I'm a human.

Personally I need not remain anonymous. I choose to for what it's worth.

I fear no lawsuit, and no one has my permission to reveal my real name but me.

However if my name is revealed it could be a good thing for me so I won't fret about it.

But I do not give that permission to anybody.

I know you can see Names and IP "regions" and so forth. I fear nothing.

" Modern words are like the rain drops of the age, some bring acid, some bring nurture".

Farmhand.
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Last edited by Farmhand; 08-02-2013 at 08:56 PM.
  #11  
Old 08-02-2013, 09:15 PM
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@Farmhand

Quote:
Originally Posted by Farmhand View Post
I won't be baited. I'm a human.

Personally I need not remain anonymous. I choose to for what it's worth.

I fear no lawsuit, and no one has my permission to reveal my real name but me.

However if my name is revealed it could be a good thing for me so I won't fret about it.

But I do not give that permission to anybody.

I know you can see Names and IP "regions" and so forth. I fear nothing.

" Modern words are like the rain drops of the age, some bring acid, some bring nurture".

Farmhand.
Stop the drama - this thread is for David Webster to answer questions that have been asked of him. He needs to be accountable to the public, period. If you're name is not David Webster or you are not in support of Eric Dollard, butt out.

The reason you got bit by T-Rex was because you were bad-mouthing Vassilatos and was showing complete disregard for the technology you were learning.
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Aaron Murakami

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  #12  
Old 08-02-2013, 10:12 PM
Farmhand Farmhand is offline
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Posts: 3,389
My name was mentioned. It seems that I have something to do with things, logic
tells me if it had nothing to do with me, my name would not be mentioned.

Yes I did say some things about Vassilatos or whatever his name is, but that
was in response to people suggesting I study his stuff or some such event, I
simply gave reason why I don't, or my opinion, I don't recall exactly.

Regardless I abandoned the thread as I had no need or want to try to compete
with Eric or anyone else for that matter. I was seeking to effect "drama reduction".

As I said I'm not upset about what was said or by whom, I was just curious as
to how Eric first became aware of the Thread I started. I still do not know.
But !

'C'est la vie' Or as Ned Kelly put it "Such is Life".

..
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